1 00:00:00,162 --> 00:00:01,292 So you're getting things done. 2 00:00:01,402 --> 00:00:05,932 You're showing up, you're answering texts, you're making dinner, but underneath 3 00:00:05,932 --> 00:00:10,432 all of it, you feel activated, but flat and far away, like you're watching 4 00:00:10,432 --> 00:00:12,752 your own life through a foot of glass. 5 00:00:13,562 --> 00:00:14,802 That's functional freeze. 6 00:00:15,192 --> 00:00:20,382 And today I want to walk you through what it is, why it's there, and some real 7 00:00:20,712 --> 00:00:22,962 small ways to start coming out of it. 8 00:00:23,642 --> 00:00:28,252 I'm Justin Sunseri, a therapist, self-regulation coach, and Polyvagal 9 00:00:28,302 --> 00:00:30,832 Institute editorial board member. 10 00:00:31,702 --> 00:00:33,972 You're listening to Stuck Not Broken. 11 00:00:34,172 --> 00:00:34,622 Welcome. 12 00:00:35,762 --> 00:00:39,342 This is, of course, not personal life advice or therapy and nor 13 00:00:39,342 --> 00:00:40,372 should it replace those things. 14 00:00:40,986 --> 00:00:45,466 Let's start with what freeze is because I, I see it getting mixed up out there. 15 00:00:45,936 --> 00:00:49,776 Um, freeze is not its own separate, distinct autonomic state. 16 00:00:50,476 --> 00:00:52,896 Freeze is a mixed autonomic state. 17 00:00:53,396 --> 00:00:57,296 A mixed state is what you get when two of your primary autonomic 18 00:00:57,306 --> 00:00:59,546 states are running at the same time. 19 00:01:00,226 --> 00:01:01,656 There are three of them. 20 00:01:02,496 --> 00:01:05,176 Play is safety plus mobilization. 21 00:01:05,756 --> 00:01:10,506 Stillness is safety plus shutdown, and freeze is mobilization 22 00:01:10,516 --> 00:01:14,726 plus immobilization, or flight or fight plus shutdown. 23 00:01:14,866 --> 00:01:16,516 They're both active at the same time. 24 00:01:17,186 --> 00:01:20,896 So freeze combines mobility and immobility. 25 00:01:20,896 --> 00:01:24,796 It's like having the gas pedal and the brake pressed at the same time. 26 00:01:25,336 --> 00:01:30,146 There's mobilization running, that's the gas, um, your sympathetic 27 00:01:30,146 --> 00:01:32,456 branch revving you up, ready to act. 28 00:01:33,096 --> 00:01:37,406 And there's the shutdown, uh, running at the same time though, and that's the 29 00:01:37,456 --> 00:01:42,646 brake, your, your dorsal vagal branch pulling you toward immobility and 30 00:01:42,646 --> 00:01:45,036 numbness and disconnection and drained. 31 00:01:45,716 --> 00:01:47,956 Both of those at once, that's what freeze is. 32 00:01:48,846 --> 00:01:50,816 So what does the word functional add? 33 00:01:51,386 --> 00:01:53,846 It describes the severity, not a different state. 34 00:01:54,416 --> 00:01:58,496 Functional just means you can still get through your day while you're in freeze. 35 00:01:59,246 --> 00:02:03,296 A functional freeze can be mild, um, like tension, but manageable. 36 00:02:03,646 --> 00:02:10,086 Or it can be severe with chronic panic, uh, overwhelm, rage, or fear running just 37 00:02:10,086 --> 00:02:11,816 like underneath everything that you do. 38 00:02:12,186 --> 00:02:14,486 So same state, but just a different intensity. 39 00:02:15,216 --> 00:02:20,386 Let me quickly separate functional freeze from a few things it gets confused with 40 00:02:20,386 --> 00:02:25,166 as well because the mix-up can send people toward the wrong kind of help, 41 00:02:25,166 --> 00:02:26,616 and we, we need, we need clarity here. 42 00:02:27,426 --> 00:02:30,716 Functional freeze is different but connected to burnout, 43 00:02:30,906 --> 00:02:32,646 depression, and shutdown. 44 00:02:33,746 --> 00:02:35,146 Burnout is depletion. 45 00:02:35,606 --> 00:02:39,996 It's running on empty, uh, over time, and it might be the result 46 00:02:39,996 --> 00:02:43,226 of a functional freeze, something I hear from my clients pretty often. 47 00:02:43,986 --> 00:02:48,876 You manage and manage and manage the freeze, crash into burnout, and 48 00:02:48,876 --> 00:02:51,896 then you recover just enough, and then you go right back into your 49 00:02:52,346 --> 00:02:54,516 freeze baseline and do it again. 50 00:02:55,496 --> 00:02:58,466 Depression is a clinical diagnosis. 51 00:02:58,826 --> 00:03:03,836 Uh, low mood, low energy, low motivation, uh, most days for weeks, 52 00:03:03,876 --> 00:03:05,956 maybe longer, months and longer. 53 00:03:06,586 --> 00:03:12,056 Uh, through the polyvagal lens, the underlying mechanism is dorsal shutdown. 54 00:03:13,036 --> 00:03:14,356 It's a biological mechanism. 55 00:03:15,443 --> 00:03:17,513 So that's burnout and depression. 56 00:03:18,463 --> 00:03:20,253 The third one is shutdown. 57 00:03:20,593 --> 00:03:23,143 Shutdown and freeze are not the same thing. 58 00:03:23,953 --> 00:03:25,903 Shutdown is collapse. 59 00:03:25,923 --> 00:03:29,543 It's the brake without the gas, the collapse. 60 00:03:29,573 --> 00:03:32,493 It's the numb and disconnected. 61 00:03:33,463 --> 00:03:37,293 Freeze is the brake and the gas together. 62 00:03:37,933 --> 00:03:42,453 People cycle between the two, um, freeze while they're managing and 63 00:03:42,453 --> 00:03:44,233 then shut down when they crash. 64 00:03:44,493 --> 00:03:50,343 But they're different states, or freeze is… Uh, shutdown is a part of freeze, 65 00:03:50,453 --> 00:03:52,403 but shutdown is its own thing as well. 66 00:03:53,403 --> 00:03:57,673 Uh, so they're different states, and that matters because what actually helps them 67 00:03:57,683 --> 00:04:00,163 is slightly different, though overlapping. 68 00:04:01,113 --> 00:04:04,883 I don't think burnout and shutdown are necessarily the same thing, but those 69 00:04:04,883 --> 00:04:06,743 two things might be connected as well. 70 00:04:07,733 --> 00:04:10,343 Here's what it looks like from the inside, though. 71 00:04:10,873 --> 00:04:12,903 Picture, I don't know, a normal Tuesday. 72 00:04:13,653 --> 00:04:15,163 Your inbox is handled. 73 00:04:15,173 --> 00:04:16,063 Good job, by the way. 74 00:04:16,393 --> 00:04:17,513 Your kids are picked up. 75 00:04:17,623 --> 00:04:18,203 That's important. 76 00:04:18,203 --> 00:04:18,573 Good job. 77 00:04:19,463 --> 00:04:22,923 And a quick, you know, "Yeah, how… Good. How you doing?" to your neighbor. 78 00:04:23,533 --> 00:04:27,383 But inside, your experience, you can't taste your food, something 79 00:04:27,903 --> 00:04:31,123 funny, you know, happens in a group chat, and you just stare at it. 80 00:04:31,603 --> 00:04:34,593 You overthink your reply, and then you move on without even replying. 81 00:04:35,373 --> 00:04:41,013 There's this, like, low hum of, "I should be doing more," but that 82 00:04:41,013 --> 00:04:43,293 never actually turns into doing more. 83 00:04:43,933 --> 00:04:47,893 You're smiling maybe on the outside, but, uh, internally 84 00:04:47,893 --> 00:04:50,003 you're, like, wired and far away. 85 00:04:50,863 --> 00:04:51,933 You're not broken. 86 00:04:51,983 --> 00:04:52,823 Hopefully you know that. 87 00:04:53,443 --> 00:04:55,983 Your gas and your brake are both on. 88 00:04:56,113 --> 00:04:59,857 Stuck, not broken These signs tend to cluster. 89 00:05:00,447 --> 00:05:05,897 Wired underneath the flatness, on edge for no clear reason, feeling far 90 00:05:05,897 --> 00:05:08,167 from people, even the ones you love. 91 00:05:08,967 --> 00:05:14,667 Panic or rage or overwhelm or fear just as an undercurrent underneath it all. 92 00:05:15,287 --> 00:05:19,587 Tension that won't dissolve, uh, breath that stays tight 93 00:05:19,627 --> 00:05:21,007 and shallow in your chest. 94 00:05:21,877 --> 00:05:25,317 It's a revolving door of tension and collapse, and it gets hard to start 95 00:05:25,327 --> 00:05:29,867 things, hard to care about things you normally care about or to act on it. 96 00:05:31,007 --> 00:05:32,037 So why does this happen? 97 00:05:32,677 --> 00:05:37,027 Your nervous system has one very old simple job: keep you safe 98 00:05:37,907 --> 00:05:39,527 when… or protected or alive. 99 00:05:40,007 --> 00:05:42,727 When something feels like too much, it shifts into defense. 100 00:05:43,297 --> 00:05:46,587 Fight or flight is the mobilized one, like the gas. 101 00:05:47,337 --> 00:05:51,447 But when fight or flight isn't possible, when you can't run and you 102 00:05:51,447 --> 00:05:56,897 can't fight, the body reaches for an older defense and slams on the brake. 103 00:05:56,917 --> 00:05:58,267 That's the shutdown. 104 00:05:58,937 --> 00:06:04,967 And freeze is what you get when the brake, uh, comes on, the shutdown, but 105 00:06:05,097 --> 00:06:07,367 the flight fight gas is still pressed. 106 00:06:07,827 --> 00:06:09,017 So it's not a malfunction. 107 00:06:09,637 --> 00:06:12,517 It- it's protection doing exactly what it evolved to do. 108 00:06:13,327 --> 00:06:15,757 Freeze evolved to be temporary. 109 00:06:16,287 --> 00:06:21,677 It's like going immobile as a danger passes by or bracing for impact, 110 00:06:22,387 --> 00:06:27,467 coiling up like a spring and then releasing when it's possible to release. 111 00:06:28,267 --> 00:06:31,817 The trouble is that we humans tend to get stuck in it and freeze. 112 00:06:32,607 --> 00:06:33,777 Stuck, not broken. 113 00:06:34,247 --> 00:06:38,357 And that's where the benefit gets lost of freeze and life gets a lot harder. 114 00:06:39,117 --> 00:06:39,977 So what do you do about it? 115 00:06:39,997 --> 00:06:45,727 Well, first, what not to do, because the two obvious options can backfire. 116 00:06:46,397 --> 00:06:47,667 The first is to push through it. 117 00:06:48,677 --> 00:06:52,197 Yeah, you can push, you know, to get through a meeting, uh, but 118 00:06:52,217 --> 00:06:56,477 pushing kinda takes whatever gas you have all the way down to E. 119 00:06:57,337 --> 00:07:00,417 Pushing is maybe needed to deal with life and, and that's fine. 120 00:07:00,977 --> 00:07:05,107 But it doesn't deal with the underlying stuckness freeze problem. 121 00:07:05,887 --> 00:07:10,077 Push long enough and you can tip yourself over into full shutdown. 122 00:07:11,167 --> 00:07:13,487 The second is just to check out and do nothing. 123 00:07:14,177 --> 00:07:18,357 You might call it rest, and rest does matter for freeze. 124 00:07:18,437 --> 00:07:21,897 Genuinely, it's important, very important, but it depends on how. 125 00:07:22,297 --> 00:07:23,687 Not all rest is equal. 126 00:07:24,357 --> 00:07:27,097 Collapsing on the couch and disappearing into a screen for 127 00:07:27,097 --> 00:07:28,637 six hours, that's not actual rest. 128 00:07:28,647 --> 00:07:29,217 That doesn't count. 129 00:07:29,897 --> 00:07:31,987 So we'll call that, uh, faux rest. 130 00:07:32,737 --> 00:07:37,887 And faux rest tends to deepen the problem, setting up a loop where 131 00:07:37,887 --> 00:07:43,807 you faux rest, feel worse, ignore your problems, faux rest some more, 132 00:07:43,807 --> 00:07:45,417 and then feel worse and on and on. 133 00:07:46,377 --> 00:07:52,007 The rest that actually helps is the kind where you're present within it, mindful 134 00:07:52,027 --> 00:07:53,647 of the moment that you're actually in. 135 00:07:54,797 --> 00:07:59,717 So if it's not push harder and it's not check out and faux rest, what is it? 136 00:08:00,717 --> 00:08:04,257 It runs in a specific order, and it depends on how much 137 00:08:04,427 --> 00:08:05,627 access you have to safety. 138 00:08:07,097 --> 00:08:09,227 Safety has to thaw the freeze first. 139 00:08:10,687 --> 00:08:16,917 When your body picks up enough small safety signals, uh, the brake of 140 00:08:16,917 --> 00:08:19,797 shutdown, that immobility can come off. 141 00:08:20,757 --> 00:08:25,697 And once the shutdown immobility lifts, the mobilization that was 142 00:08:25,717 --> 00:08:29,627 frozen underneath can finally start to move instead of just 143 00:08:29,697 --> 00:08:31,507 sitting there stuck or frozen. 144 00:08:32,297 --> 00:08:33,697 Safety thaws the freeze. 145 00:08:34,537 --> 00:08:38,017 The brake releases, and then the stuck, uh, flight-fight 146 00:08:38,017 --> 00:08:41,087 energy can move through and out. 147 00:08:41,927 --> 00:08:45,517 But your safety has to hold while that happens, which means 148 00:08:45,517 --> 00:08:49,707 it has to get stronger, which means this is not a one-time fix. 149 00:08:50,387 --> 00:08:53,787 It happens in small doses over time with patience. 150 00:08:55,027 --> 00:08:57,727 So here's one small way to start today. 151 00:08:58,857 --> 00:09:02,327 It's a quick orienting and small movement exercise. 152 00:09:02,417 --> 00:09:04,777 Don't worry about doing it perfectly, just follow along. 153 00:09:05,617 --> 00:09:09,677 You can start wherever you are a- and however you are. 154 00:09:10,337 --> 00:09:13,927 There's no, you know, right way to, to, to sit or stand. 155 00:09:14,607 --> 00:09:16,477 You can sit, stand, lay down, walk. 156 00:09:16,477 --> 00:09:17,507 It doesn't… You can walk if you want to. 157 00:09:17,517 --> 00:09:18,117 It doesn't matter. 158 00:09:19,257 --> 00:09:21,497 I want you to let your eyes go where they want to go. 159 00:09:21,987 --> 00:09:23,107 Don't direct them. 160 00:09:23,467 --> 00:09:25,727 Just let them drift and follow them. 161 00:09:26,777 --> 00:09:29,097 As they move or not, notice a few things. 162 00:09:29,907 --> 00:09:36,207 Notice something that's moving, like the leaf on a branch or shadows from 163 00:09:36,207 --> 00:09:38,797 the tree outside swaying on the wall. 164 00:09:40,107 --> 00:09:41,937 Notice which colors your eyes are drawn to. 165 00:09:43,087 --> 00:09:44,487 Notice light and dark. 166 00:09:45,517 --> 00:09:48,237 Stay with that for like thirty seconds or longer if you want to. 167 00:09:49,407 --> 00:09:53,877 Then after you do that, take one bigger breath in on purpose and let 168 00:09:53,877 --> 00:09:55,667 it out slowly if it's comfortable. 169 00:09:55,667 --> 00:09:56,407 Don't force it. 170 00:09:57,357 --> 00:10:00,737 And then let your next couple of breaths, uh, happen on their own. 171 00:10:00,947 --> 00:10:01,657 Don't control them. 172 00:10:01,657 --> 00:10:02,387 Just be with them. 173 00:10:03,437 --> 00:10:07,627 And then briefly acknowledge the freeze that you have underneath it all. 174 00:10:08,557 --> 00:10:12,327 If you have the capacity, feel it directly at a very low level 175 00:10:12,327 --> 00:10:14,177 and keep that part pretty short. 176 00:10:15,407 --> 00:10:18,917 And then after you do that, do one small movement. 177 00:10:19,287 --> 00:10:22,457 Wiggle your toes, make a fist and release it. 178 00:10:23,277 --> 00:10:27,667 Roll your wrists or your ankles or your shoulders and then genuinely 179 00:10:27,667 --> 00:10:32,607 tell yourself, "Good job." Let your eyes wander one more time and take 180 00:10:32,627 --> 00:10:36,657 one more intentional breath in and out, uh, to finish everything up. 181 00:10:36,937 --> 00:10:37,487 And that's it. 182 00:10:37,967 --> 00:10:40,537 Really simple little practice and y- something you could totally do 183 00:10:40,537 --> 00:10:42,037 on your own for a minute every day. 184 00:10:42,717 --> 00:10:45,487 Let your eyes lead and be drawn to what they like. 185 00:10:45,657 --> 00:10:46,527 That's a cue of safety. 186 00:10:47,077 --> 00:10:50,197 The small movement is gentle mobilization. 187 00:10:50,937 --> 00:10:52,457 You're not trying to feel amazing. 188 00:10:52,917 --> 00:10:56,387 You're giving the brake permission to come off a couple of millimeters 189 00:10:57,077 --> 00:11:01,377 and then letting a little bit of the stuck energy potentially start to move. 190 00:11:02,877 --> 00:11:06,367 That little practice will not cure your freeze, and I'm not going to 191 00:11:06,367 --> 00:11:10,047 pretend that it will, especially if you're new to these type of practices. 192 00:11:10,817 --> 00:11:14,797 What it does though, in small doses over time, is build the foundation. 193 00:11:15,227 --> 00:11:19,027 A little more safety, a little more presence, and maybe 194 00:11:19,027 --> 00:11:20,127 a little bit less defense. 195 00:11:22,167 --> 00:11:26,857 Over time, with reps like that, you might notice small signs 196 00:11:26,857 --> 00:11:28,507 of your system letting go. 197 00:11:29,387 --> 00:11:33,877 A shiver or a tingle moving through you, a bigger breath 198 00:11:33,887 --> 00:11:35,897 that arrives on its own, a yawn. 199 00:11:36,767 --> 00:11:37,447 Those are good. 200 00:11:37,917 --> 00:11:41,177 That's regulation happening spontaneously, not forced. 201 00:11:42,437 --> 00:11:43,407 One more thing also. 202 00:11:43,817 --> 00:11:47,777 Functional freeze is common and workable, and for a lot of people, 203 00:11:47,777 --> 00:11:53,587 small daily practices plus real mindful rest are enough to start shifting it. 204 00:11:54,237 --> 00:11:56,997 Of course, seek a professional if it's severe. 205 00:11:58,895 --> 00:12:01,955 So here's what I want you to leave this episode with. 206 00:12:02,625 --> 00:12:05,655 The freeze is not a character flaw, and it's not a failure, 207 00:12:06,135 --> 00:12:07,375 and it's not brokenness. 208 00:12:07,545 --> 00:12:12,175 It's your gas and your brake both on at the same time for reasons 209 00:12:12,175 --> 00:12:14,175 that once made complete sense. 210 00:12:15,175 --> 00:12:18,055 You're not broken, you're stuck. 211 00:12:18,065 --> 00:12:19,085 And stuckness can move. 212 00:12:19,415 --> 00:12:20,245 It's not permanent. 213 00:12:21,525 --> 00:12:25,405 If you're not sure which stuck state you're in, don't worry, that is common. 214 00:12:25,925 --> 00:12:27,665 I have a resource just for you. 215 00:12:28,085 --> 00:12:31,145 Head to stucknotbroken.com/stuck. 216 00:12:31,855 --> 00:12:36,065 This, uh, free resource will help you identify your experiences 217 00:12:36,065 --> 00:12:37,575 and give them some language. 218 00:12:38,115 --> 00:12:41,735 It might help you to narrow down your own stuck state, whether 219 00:12:41,735 --> 00:12:43,605 that's freeze or something else. 220 00:12:43,945 --> 00:12:44,515 Stucknotbroken.com/stuck. 221 00:12:47,155 --> 00:12:48,745 Thank you so much for listening.