Was Andrew the one that helped you.

Get the podcast back up?

Yeah, he did get the podcast.

Didn't help me.

He did it.

Don't you think you owe him a dinner for that?

Oh, no, he didn't.

Got him.

This is Apologetics Live to answer your questions.

Your host from Striving for Eternity Ministries, Andrew Rapaport.

Foreign.

We are live, Apologetics Live here to answer your most challenging questions you have about God and the Bible.

Any question you have, we can answer.

And if you doubt that, just go to Apologetics Live, scroll down to the little duck icon and join us now.

I will give a footnote here.

For today's show, we are trying out a new software we might be switching from Streamyard to EV Max.

And so that is something we're.

We're trying out.

So we'll see how this works.

Let me bring Drew in.

Howy.

Howdy.

So we're, we are, we are literally testing this just before the show.

First time.

First time for it.

So, so we're going to ask for, folks, I, I now the one thing I can't really see, at least I don't, don't know yet if I could see where, where the.

Oh, good.

Matt is testing the private chat.

Cool.

Thanks, Matt.

We're, like, trying this out, so we're thinking of switching to something a little bit less expensive.

Let me bring Matt Slick, the president of carm.org welcome, Matt.

Welcome.

Let's see if we do that.

Oh, we can do that, huh?

That's an interesting one.

I like that.

That one's better.

So I'm bigger than Matt.

I like that.

All right.

They obviously don't have a good ugly filter in this.

Yeah.

So if folks could.

Oh, good.

I wanted to see someone drop a comment so we can see how that works.

So, so Kathy Demings is saying greetings sfe and watching from Pennsylvania.

That's good.

That one's like, a little more professional.

Yeah, this is the comments show up and everything.

Yeah, that is looking good.

And so we are trying this out because, well, Stream Yard just jacked up their pray.

They, they doubled their price last year and they doubled it again this year and so trying out a tool called EVMux.

So folks in the chat, let us know how you like it.

If there's things you see working, not working, let us know.

I think it's the tariffs.

That's why, that's why the price went up.

Yeah, maybe not, but it was a good try.

So.

So what I want to talk about tonight is a couple different things.

I want to discuss, want to talk about.

I, I said I would address the, the Epstein files and I didn't tell Matt or Drew.

Well, Drew, I told you just before we went live, we're going to talk about a question we got about Israel and that came in.

And then the primary part of the show, what we have Matt on, is to talk about his very depressing view of end times.

Now we are, we're in doing a series this month on different end times views.

Last week we had the, the king of amillennialism, Keith Fosky, he had more of an optimistic view of end times.

Matt has a depressedatology view, as he calls it.

That's what I call depressatology.

That's right.

And so, but I think, you know, I want to try and get more than just one person on each view.

So we're trying to do that.

I do find this funny because we said last week that we're gonna, we should do amillennialism again because poor Tom was traveling and couldn't be here to talk about his favorite subject.

And, and yet he had to go to jail.

So, okay, he's just visiting the jail, doing ministry.

He's not.

I'm always, I've always amazed that like, you know, Matt used to do prison ministry and I was always amazed they'd let him back out.

I'm just saying, like, I figured they did.

He'd be like, they'd look at him and go, oh, we thought you just belonged here, you know, how did you get out?

A long time.

You know, he learned how to climb walls pretty quickly.

Yeah, the southern border, they, they learned that too.

Yeah.

All right, so that's the, that's the agenda we're going to have today.

We may have some folks come in.

I'm gonna ask, and I'll, I'll ask throughout, like folks, if, if there's anyone watching on YouTube.

I don't usually ask for folks to give us a super chat, but try, if you don't mind, even if it's just a dollar or two, just so we could see how those, how those pop up.

And so let's see.

So Kathy is saying, why are there purple crowns and numbers by names in the YouTube chat?

I don't know.

See, I don't, I don't see it.

I'm, I'm pulled up in the YouTube chat, but I don't see it.

But I do see that there's like a 10 second delay between our feed and YouTube.

Okay.

Now I do.

I, I, the, There are different colors or icons for some people who are members.

I do know that.

Oh, we have Tom's wife, Debbie, is saying he.

He's in there now.

So, you know, Debbie, I. I just got one thing to say to you.

The fact that they let your husband out of the jail every week.

You know, I'm just saying you should be grateful.

Every week he comes home, just that they let him out.

You know, they might go, hey, he.

He.

Matty looks like he belongs here.

All right, so let me.

Let me address.

And I. I purposely didn't talk to either one of you guys about the Epstein files because there's been a lot of discussion, and I want to present a different view than what everyone's been discussing with the Epstein files.

And I think Matt's going to have a view that will be different, and I'm going to see if I can convince both him and Drew that I'm right.

So that.

That'll be the challenge.

Okay, so here's the thing, right?

Everyone is.

Now that they've said, okay, there's nothing out there.

There's no.

There's no client list.

There's.

You know, there was nothing but child pornography.

The only one that was.

And I'm trying to keep this family friendly.

The only.

The only person who was doing anything with these young girls was Epstein.

And.

And his.

Whatever The.

The girl he was with that's in prison right now.

I want to say Maxine, but I forget her name.

The one that used to get him.

Get the girls.

So here's the thing that I want us to think about.

Everyone's now saying, okay, Cash Patel.

Dan Bongino said there is no list.

There are no videos.

There's no blackmail information.

There's nothing there.

And everyone's now starting to question whether Dan Bongino and Cash Patel are.

Are now part of the deep state.

Okay?

There's been a lot of conspiracies whether Jeffrey Epstein had this client list.

He had blackmail information on.

On different world leaders.

He was.

Had people to his island and on his plane, and then he'd get them with young girls and take videos and then use it to blackmail them.

They.

Then there was a thought that he was actually a CIA agent, And.

And so he.

He was part of the state, and that's why they won't release any of this.

And so.

So, yeah, so those are the different conspiracies.

So let's take a step back and let me ask you a question.

Epstein had been there, okay?

So we can.

I personally believe that the truth is usually Achman's razor.

The.

The simplest solution.

Okay.

And so with that thought, let's go back in time and think what.

When Epstein became big news, I mean, Epstein was, was kind of out there doing stuff, but he wasn't a known name.

Right?

People didn't know his name until one event.

And the idea of the client list, where did it start?

It started with the media.

If you think back, it started with the media.

And who was the client that they said was in this supposed client list?

His name is Donald Trump.

They had a picture of Trump with Jeffrey Epstein, and they were using that to say that Trump was, was on this client list that they supposedly had of Epstein's and he was a client and he had gone to the island and was on the plane until Trump was able to prove he was never on the island and was never on the plane.

He did meet Epstein, which wouldn't have been that big of a surprise that they were in the same circles.

But I wonder, could it be that what ended up happening was that they, in their desperation to try to get Trump any way they can, and if you don't think they've been trying to get him any way they can, just look at his court cases where judge, judges, judges decide that they're going to reevaluate real estate.

They're better expert on real estate values than people who do real estate evaluation for a living.

Right?

They just make up charges against him.

And so they, I think they were desperate.

And I think what you had was, I think in that desperation, they thought that they would have something that they can smear Trump with.

And it backfired because it was more liberals like Bill Clinton that had been there to the island and on the plane, and then it made them look bad.

And they backed away from it then because they couldn't stick it to Trump.

But it was starting to stick to others like Bill Gates and Donald and, and Bill Clinton and Prince Andrew and others.

Right.

And I think it backfired on them.

And that's why on the Democrat side, they just wanted Epstein to go away.

And so could it be that he actually killed himself and that this was just something that ended up being, you know, his, his earlier cases were just incompetence, or could it be, I mean, simple solution?

You got a guy who has a lot of money.

Could he be paying people off?

I mean, I think this is a simple.

A simple solution to it, to what we're.

We're seeing.

And, and I think that if we go back, I think every.

All the conspiracies rest upon one thing, a client list.

The assumption there had to be a client list.

And could it be that it was the media creating the narrative of a client list to try to get Trump?

So I will open it to you guys.

What do you, what do you think about my proposal?

Possible?

I don't know.

I don't know either.

But I do have like, like I just have questions, right?

Like wasn't Jeffrey Epstein before he died supposed to be testifying about some of these things?

Wasn't Max Maxwell, the, the lady wasn't part of her turning herself in was she was supposed to be testifying about this client list, which is why she turned herself in.

There's just, I have a lot of questions about that.

And then you have, when, when the idea of the client list came out and Trump came, his whole thing was we're going to expose, we're going to release the client list.

We have people going through it now and they're going through the client list and they came out with all these binders that supposedly had the client, right.

And then all of a sudden it doesn't exist.

So like why all that, why was all that going on?

Right.

I just have more questions.

So I will say that Trump's handling of it with Pam Bondi seemed interesting because like Trump just seemed to add, it was like he cuts, if you heard the clip where he cuts off the reporter and he's like, why are we talking about Epstein?

That's all we got so many other things, good things.

And to talk about, you know, Pam Bondi handling of it is interesting but, but when you look at Maxwell, she was never charged with the client list.

There was discussion aware in the media.

She was charged with, well, human trafficking of bringing girls to Epstein.

Right.

In, in, in both Epstein's.

Well, we never, he never went to trial.

But in what they were charging him with was him with underage girls.

With Maxwell, it was her trafficking girls.

He now for Epstein's part because he was, they were underage and going across state lines.

Those were some of the issues.

Right?

Yeah, I know the, I know the charges but I think their agreement to testify was based on that there were more higher ranking people involved in what they were doing like Bill Clinton or.

Now that's the assumption.

Now I do, I will admit it is kind of interesting because, you know, I would love to know what went on.

I mean I, it is interesting that Bill Gates's name comes out as having been to the island and then his wife divorces him.

So I, you know, I don't know.

Is there something there?

Now, first off, let me be clear.

Do I.

Did I expect that the Trump administration.

That's back.

I'll bring him in.

Do I expect that the Trump administration would find any documents when they came in?

Of course not.

Nor would I expect them to find anything on.

On f. On the, the shooting of jfk, if the government had anything to do with it.

If you think the government, like, hey, let's document our crimes, like, no, they're not going to do something like that.

Right.

Which tells you they did it.

Right.

Well, no, it's.

It, it means that if there's no evidence, it doesn't mean that they did it.

It doesn't mean they didn't.

Right.

In that sense.

Because they're not going to jfk.

Yeah.

In.

In jfk.

It's, it's.

They're not going to document and leave record.

Okay, now we do have the issue.

Pam Bondi came out and said some things, you know, I mean, she made statements that made it sound like there was something there.

Yep.

And.

And it was interesting that Trump praised Cash Patel and Dan Bongino and not Pam Bondi with this stuff.

I almost wonder if Bondi.

And if I, I watched an interview with her and where she was saying some of this stuff and she looked nervous, like she was trying to figure out how to answer things.

I wonder if she just wasn't as quick thinking on her feet and said some things that were, you know, like maybe it wasn't the case.

And she misspelled like, I wonder if she's on her way outs in the administration.

I don't know.

Matt, you have any thoughts?

No, I have hardly followed any of that stuff because I.

Without enough information, I can't make judgments.

Yeah.

And so there's just too much, too much he said, she said kind of stuff.

I don't know.

So I've not been able to make a decision.

See, that's why I have judgments.

I don't, I just don't voice them.

So I ask questions about them.

Yeah.

And this is why I, you know, I haven't really spoken about this, but I, you know, I'm watching everyone just go, oh, there's got to be something there.

Like they're.

Everyone's covering it up.

And, and a lot of people are saying, look, they trust Dan Bongino to, to tell the truth.

People who know him, people who, you know.

And so I kind of sit back and wonder, could it be that they got in there thinking, as everyone Else did.

Media gas led everyone to believe there was something there, and they found out there was no client list.

But the only way, the only place I've heard about the client list was from the media.

Now we have a couple of girls who did sue or, you know, or, or try to make a claim and, and try to sue, like Bill Clinton and Prince Andrew.

The interesting thing with the Prince Andrew is the, the one who claimed that, you know, said that he was all sweaty all over her, and he's able, he's been able to prove medically that he can't sweat.

So she changed her story.

The same was with Clinton.

That girl came out and said that she made it up.

Now, is it on you.

Would it be unusual for a, you know, somebody to.

A woman to claim something about a guy so that she could, you know, who has a lot of money and is famous to get money?

I mean, especially Prince Andrew.

I mean, he kind of has a reputation for being one who goes after the ladies anyway.

So.

Yeah, so it may not be that Jeffrey Epstein was trafficking the girls to this, to Prince Andrew, but Prince Andrew hitting on a young girl, because maybe he does that.

So humble.

Clay says if, if Trump was in the client list, there's no way the Biden administration would not have used it.

And that's, that's one thing, that's the one thing I would say is that if there is a client list, Trump's not in it just because of that.

Now, here's probably the most important comment, Matt, that I see backstage, that I see in the comment list is from Ed Romine, and he says Andrew is better looking than Matt.

Ed is a very intelligent man.

He's got his doctorate degree, so he must be right.

I like Ed.

It's not saying much for you, though.

Good point.

So, you know, actually I, I meant to open and explain that opening, Ma.

You know, we had.

I, I have company from our, you know, church members over at our house.

They're actually watching the show downstairs.

And, and I told the, the story that it, you know, you, you.

It took you nine years to buy me a meal.

This has become well known that it took you a long time.

And that opening was when you were.

There was a.

You were on someone else's podcast and they busted on you for not buying me a meal.

But I have to be fair and announce you got me an epic fashion on our 100th episode of apologetics Live.

So if you go back and see that Matt delivered food to my house during a live show.

So that was Epic.

Really good.

And you waited.

So there you go.

I did.

You.

You.

You got me.

And so I said, all right.

And everyone got to see it.

Jason Lyle.

Yeah.

Who else was there?

I think Daryl Harrison might have been there.

A lot of people.

There are a lot of.

Everyone was there.

Now Melissa has a comment and she says Drew looks better than both of them.

That's right.

You do know Melissa has glasses, right?

No, I don't think she does.

All right, so let's.

Let me.

And this is going to be an interesting.

I. I think I know where.

I know Matt well enough that I think I know where he might land on this.

I think Drew from a previous show we did on Israel, that I think I know where you would land on this.

But I think this will be a good discussion to have before we get into millennialism.

And this is on dealing with Israel that a lot of people are, well, let's just say challenged with.

There's people coming out with books that Israel, you know, the church is the true Israel and we shouldn't be supporting the current state of Israel.

It's not Israel.

So.

And I explained that this would be kind of hard to give a short answer via email, so I told this individual Marilyn, that we'd answer it here.

So she says, Dear Andrew, first off, I wanted to say that I first saw you being interviewed by dorian virtue on YouTube and wow, you are amazing.

I learned a lot.

See, Matt, some people do think they can learn something from me.

Just because you don't think so.

Wait a minute.

That's probably a fabricated email.

Nice.

She's.

You get probably just being nice.

You're right.

Okay.

She says, I am a new Christian.

God led me back to him about two years ago.

And every day God is creating new ways for me to seek and draw more and more near him.

I love learning more and more who my father is.

I'm writing to you today because I have a question that I thought you would be most equipped to answer.

Is the current state of Israel, the one established in the 40s by the UN is that the same Israel that I'm reading about every day in the Bible?

Since I'm still very new to God, I don't know what to think about the current ongoing conflict in the Middle East.

If you don't mind, what is your opinion of all of this?

And lastly, what does God say about all of this?

So we got a bunch of things there.

I think some of this is going to lead into the discussion tonight on Amillennialism, which this is A view of the future events.

And it'd be good to see last week's show where we had a, a different view than Matt's on amillennialism.

And Matt's going to explain his view soon.

So let me give the the answer I gave her.

In short, the short answer I gave was, in short, it is not the same Israel.

I said it.

It is, and it is not the same Israel as a nation.

It is different from the Israel from the Bible is different from the current Israel.

It's not a kingdom, but ethnically it's the same.

So it's made up of the same tribes of people, in a sense, the current state of Israel, the one from 1940s, from 48 when it was established.

But when we get into asking the question, and this is really, I think, theologically where we have the conundrum is how we view Israel today, whether it's the same Israel from the Bible.

And some in the covenant theology camp have gone so far as to deny that there's actually a state of Israel today.

I don't think Matt's going to be willing to do that.

I think Matt, excited, acknowledges there's a state of Israel today.

Israel exists, or the descendants of the true Israel to some degree you can't validate genetically, but God has promised to bring his people back.

They did.

May 14, 1948.

The nation was Saul.

So the house of Israel, the covenant, God's done with Israel yet to what extent that is there and how much are those people in Israel, the actual Israelites?

I think there's a lot of them who actually are.

And, you know, some of it's up for grabs.

Yeah, and there are.

I was on a podcast that I'll put on my Rap Report this week and next week I was on two different podcasts talking about Israel.

So if you want more, go follow the Rap Report podcast.

Rap with two Ps R a P P Report.

There you'll hear me get into more detail of this than we're going to get on this show.

But there, there's, there are some who claim that they're the Israel that we see today were Europeans that moved into the land, claiming to be Jewish, claiming to be from, from Abraham's tribe.

We know all true Israelites are black.

Yes, you and I have run into those.

But you know, one of the things.

Is in America, no, that's only the.

Tribe of Judah and America.

If you don't, if folks don't know what Matt's referring to is there's a group called black Hebrew Israel.

That claim that they were.

That the, the tribes of Israel had come to basically the.

They.

It was the African slave trade that brought them in.

And they're oh, the tribe of Judah is in America.

I think it's the tribe of Dan that's in Jamaica.

It's like the slavers were really worried about the tribal lines, you know, you.

Know, just hear a little there, a little, you know, that's right.

That's how they interpret.

So what we end up seeing though is you do you can actually follow how people move around the world by their languages.

Okay.

This is one of the arguments I have talking current state of Israel.

When we talk about Palestinians.

There is no, there is no language of Palestinians.

There's no Palestinian language, there's no Palestinian culture.

But there has always been a Hebrew language and a Jewish culture that you end up seeing that has carried through some traditions that have, have been carried no matter where Jewish people go around the world, that they, they have some of these same cultures.

You see that when Chinese people come to America, they, there's certain cultures that they're going to keep.

Right.

And so you can see movements with language, with culture.

So in that sense we can sit here and say, well, there is a Israeli culture that carries into the Israel that's there today.

I think the big thing is what is the future for Israel?

And that is where we'll get into in a moment.

Now, Matt, I, I believe you do believe that there's a future for Israel and God's plan.

Plan.

But you're amillennial, is that correct?

Yeah, I'm not a replacement theologian.

Completely and totally Israel.

There's been a partial hardening.

Romans 11, 25, 26.

Excuse me.

Until the time the Gentiles has come in and then all Israel will be saved.

As a prophecy.

The time of the Gentiles not ended.

So God's not done with Israel yet.

Now we can go into.

If you want, we can go into Revelation 17, I think it is 1617, where it talks about 144,000 people from the 12 tribes of Israel, 12,000 each.

And they go out into the world and preach and teach.

So personally, in my amillennial view, I think the.

The covenant break because they rejected the Messiah that we Gentiles are then grafted in that when that time that God has ordained is fulfilled, then he's going to return his attention back to Israel and use them mightily.

And that's, that's just what I believe.

Okay.

How that will.

Will work out you know, and you.

Are a Covenant theologian.

Correction.

Absolutely.

So I'm saying that because, you know, on one of the shows I was interviewed on, I argued that a Covenant theologian does not have to.

Just because you believe in Covenant theology, you do not have to say there is, that God can't be doing something with Israel.

Okay.

I have unusual views anyway.

I'm a pessimist, a millennialist, as, you know, depressed eschatology.

I believe the continuation of the charismatic gift.

And I believe the first one.

I believe in the Rapture, and the first one is taken at Christ's return of the wicked.

And so, you know, and you're oppressed.

You're away from me.

You're a Presbyterian with a degree from a Lutheran seminary that goes to a Calvary Chapel.

No, a Lutheran college Presbyterian seminary.

That's right.

Yeah.

I was baptized by Chuck Smith, the founder of Calvary Chapel.

Wow.

Yeah.

And I believe in the charismatic gifts, too.

So, you know, I'm a mishmash, so it's easy to.

For anybody to find one particular tenant that I hold to and throw the baby out with a bathwater because of it, because I'm obviously heretical in something.

But the, the point that I want to point out for folks is the fact that, you know, you and I both see a future for Israel.

But I want, you know, I was on, you know, Keith Foskey posted something about Israel.

A lot of people were giving a hard time, some people calling him anti Semitic.

And I went onto a page and said, listen, I'm.

I'm both an Israelite being from the.

The tribe of Levi.

I am dispensational in my theology.

And so.

But I, I will, you know, and the question is, is the Israel today God's chosen people?

And I, I would say this.

The Israel today is under God's judgment.

That's.

That's what they're.

How they're serving God today because the.

God has.

Is working through Gentiles as a judgment on Israel.

And I think that's something that.

Whether Covenant theology, dispensational theology, we can all agree.

I. I do think that there's a future plan for Israel where God will be bringing them back into focus.

It would be different maybe than the way Matt would.

And so I, As I look at it, it's.

It's, you know, for.

For Marilyn, it's.

It's hard to answer.

Depends on, because it depends how people have their view of Israel in the church.

There's many different views on it, and I think that different people Approach this differently.

Where I would caution anyone is when you get so hard, hard lined, as I dealt with this week on, on Facebook, with somebody who outright said we should not be do like, we shouldn't be defending Israel in any way as a nation or as a people.

And it's like, well, that I, you know, if, if Russia attacks Ukraine and we defend Ukraine because we think Russia's acting unjustly, that's not immoral.

But somehow if you defend Israel, it's immoral because of their theological positions that I think's going too far in that.

You get because you see people on Twitter doing the same thing.

Some of the hard nose theonomists, Christian nationalist guys, not going to name any names about them, but I think one of the things they're, that they're seeing is you see some of these dispensationalists that I would say are probably like the left behind type dispenser.

They follow the Tim La Hayes.

There's almost an idolatry, almost of Israel and they're kind of trying to combat that.

The problem is in trying to combat that, they're losing focus that Israel is an ally and we should defend our allies.

Yeah.

And I think where this has got real heated up was Tucker Carlson's interview with Ted Cruz.

And there's points where I agree with both of them and I disagree with both of them.

But Ted Cruz, I think he, he answered the way you just said, Drew, that Israel is a great ally.

Israel has provided us with some of the best intel.

I mean, if you doubt the intelligence of the Israeli Mossad, just think about the fact that they were able to take out like all their enemies shooting missiles through their bedrooms all within an hour.

They knew where these guys were sleeping.

Yeah.

They're one of the greatest fighting forces on earth.

I mean, we'd be foolish not to be allies with them.

I mean, if you're, if you are an Israeli.

Right.

Part of what you have to do is you have to serve time in the idf.

Yeah.

And so I have a friend, she was born here.

She's, she's half Jewish, half American.

And when she got done with UGA, her degree at UGA, she went over and she joined the IDF.

I mean, and she's like 5ft, 5ft 1 and she became a captain in the IDF.

Right.

Now that's one person I would not want to mess with because I know she could whoop my tail.

That's not saying much either.

That's good stuff.

But you know, the idea that we see though, is that as politically, I think, grew with Ted Cruz.

When Ted Cruz said that we have a.

A mandate, a command from God to bless Israel, I couldn't find that verse.

That they were talking about, Genesis 12, 3.

And you, he who blesses you, shall.

But.

But see, that's not a.

That's not a command, though.

But it's also out of context, too.

It's talking about specifically Abraham.

And he's the federal head, and that's an important thing.

He's the representation, and he's the federal head.

And the sign of this, the covenant was circumcision, which was for his, he and his descendants.

And that is called the Gospel by Paul in Galatians 3.

8.

So we could make the.

We could connect some dots, maybe not with a straight line, but with a kind of a dashed line that there's something there.

Yeah.

I mean, there may be some there, but I don't see it as a command.

That's where I would disagree with Ted Cruz.

Right.

Well, let me ask you guys a question.

Even for some, you just recently draft all of us, right?

And they say you can go fight Russia.

I'd go, okay.

And go fight, you know, Syria.

Okay.

And go fight Israel.

No, no.

No.

Why.

Why would you not do that, Matt?

Because it's God's people, and I'm just not going to fight against God's people.

That's all.

Now, I'm not saying every single Jew there is God's people.

I'm not saying everything Israel does is perfect.

But covenantally, God works with a nation.

You know, Jesus was.

He said in Matthew 15:24, I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

House of Israel means the nation group, the people group.

Now, God knows who they are.

And even as there were just a few righteous inside of Gomorrah who got let out before the destruction, they represented just enough of righteousness there.

Abraham, I mean, lots and stuff.

And so even if there's just a few Jews who are legitimately authentic Jews in the nation of Israel, gathered back, that's enough.

I'm not going to mess with them.

I just wouldn't.

Interesting.

Okay, so you.

Wait.

I just want, for the record.

So you wouldn't fight with the Jew?

With Jews.

Jewish people against Jews against Jewish people.

I fight with them.

I'm just.

I'm just a moral reason.

No, I'm just.

Drew, I just.

You could be my witness, because I think I. I have.

I have video evidence of him fighting with me over paying him for a meal in, in a Chinese restaurant.

A McDonald's.

He wasn't fighting you.

He was arguing with you.

That's right.

Oh, no, no, no, no.

We, we were categories.

There was a lot of pushing and shoving.

Some pushing and shoving.

And Andrew, wait.

I, I believe I heard a story about you dealing in deception because he gave his card to the hostess and you came back and took his.

Yeah.

Theft, too.

Deception.

No, theft and not deception.

Not deception.

I, I, I took his.

It was definitely theft, though.

He took my credit card.

Yeah.

Kidnapped, basically.

Yeah.

There was the time where the, the, you know, Matt went in, like, true story.

Matt goes into this Chinese restaurant.

He gets there early, like half an hour early or something, so that he could talk to the manager and be like, look, I have to get the bill.

Make sure I get the bill.

And so the, the manager did that.

He, he purpose, he hand walked the bill over to Matt.

The problem is Matt didn't talk to the cashier like I did, and the cashier is the one that takes the money.

So I paid the cashier and mat.

But she just figured out what the bill was charged.

Mel was like, but I got the bill.

Yeah, there's been some stuff.

Yep.

We need a show that just goes over every single time Matt has tried to pay and Andrew has snuck in.

Yeah.

Quite a few.

Okay, I will, I will say the, the funniest one was in Chick fil a because Matt did not know what Apple Pay was.

Oh, yeah.

And so we're sitting there.

Just picture the scene, Drew.

We're sitting there.

Matt was determined he was going to, so he makes me promise.

He's like, don't take your wallet out.

I said, I won't.

He goes, you promise?

I said, I promise I will not take my wallet out.

I won't put my hands in my pocket at all.

I had my phone in my hand.

And he's like, good.

So we get the bill.

He's all, he's all ready.

He's taking his credit card out.

I just lean over with my phone and he hear the and, and she goes, all done.

And he goes, wait, I didn't pay yet.

He goes, she goes, he did.

And he looks at me.

He goes, he just screams, what?

So loud that everybody in the Chick fil a like looks at him and he's like, how did you do that?

And I'm just waving my my phone.

And he's like, what is that?

And I go, it's Apple pay.

And he's like, what's Apple Pay?

I thought I would get him the next time because I figured I'd use my watch.

But he obviously did the research, knew that you could use the watch too.

He's like, don't take your phone out, don't take your wallet out.

But all right, so with all that behind us now, let me, let me at least give a plug for one of our sponsors then I want Matt to describe, to get into explaining his view of end times.

And so with that, you know, one thing I do know, when Matt and I travel, we've traveled together, spoken at conferences and all shared rooms.

I know that both of us travel with the same type of pillow, which is a my pillow because we both enjoy a good sleep.

I think Matt usually hits me with his pillow while I'm sleeping.

I'm just saying.

But I do travel with a my pillow because I, I, they, it does help improve my sleep.

But they have more than just pillows.

They got slippers, they got mattress toppers, which I love.

My mattress topper.

They, they have blankets, towels, you name it, they probably have it.

But go to mypillow.com use the promo code SFE stands for Striving for Eternity.

That gets you some great discounts and it also lets them know you heard about them from us.

So they keep supporting us.

So go to mypillow.com use the promo code sfe the other thing you could do is use some Bible software that both Matt and I use and love very much, which is Lagos Bible Software.

And if you go to lagos.com, that's L O G O S.com SFE not only can you get some good discounts, but there again, using that code, they'll know that you found them through us and they continue to support us.

So Lagos is some of the, what I personally think is some of the best Bible software out there.

I love it.

It's very, a very, very powerful tool.

The nice thing is the way they've done it.

Now, unlike the way Matt and I have done it, where we've paid for our libraries, where it cost a lot of money, they now do subscriptions.

And if you, if you're to do it two year pay for two years in advance, you're basically paying $7 a month and you can get yourself a basic library.

So for, for what might be just a cup of coffee at Starbucks for one week, you know, one cup of coffee at Starbucks can buy you a month of Lagos.

Just think of it that way.

And so if you want to get yourself some great Bible software, just go to lagos.comsfe all right, so as we.

Get in, I want to say something about logos.

Well, I want to say something about my pillow.

I take it to Europe with me and I use it.

I have a topper.

I use that too.

I love it.

Seriously, it really does help.

I'm just saying it.

But logos, I, I take my notes from apologetics and I put them in my verses so that if someone's, for example, you know, talking about baptism and they bring up a verse, I got so much research in there, my notes, I'll go to that verse, I'll see a little folder, I click on it and window opens up with my notes on that specific verse.

So it's a very, very great tool.

I use it all the time.

Yeah, it really is.

Yeah.

The mattress topper.

I will tell you this, Matt, I had a guest on my rapper for podcast, a pastor who said that they basically were making the decision whether to buy a brand new bed and they, they felt they, they really couldn't afford a new bed, but their bed was like 30 years old.

And so what he did was he went and he ended up just buying a mattress topper from my pillow and he said it felt like he got a brand new bed.

Hey, I, I should mention it's.

It's really good and I'm not getting anything for this.

And he didn't ask me to say it, but I use it and I glad.

And, and you didn't ask me to say this, but Joanne did.

So let's mention this is you can also support carm.org it's a great ministry.

If you haven't been to carmen.org but if you want to support them, go to carm.org you can support there.

And Matt, that is the ministry Matt has been doing for.

Oh, come.

Should be coming out close to 30 years now, right?

October, 30 years.

I'm thinking about doing something, a 30 year gathering, like maybe in Denver area.

Just meet at a hotel if anybody wants to go.

Yeah, I like that idea.

We did, we did one for.

Was it 20 or 25?

I forget when we did that.

20Th year.

And that was awesome.

Yeah, awesome.

It was so good.

We also did some for your birthday, which was in winter.

And when I decided I'm not coming to your birthday, I'm never gonna go to Idaho for winter.

So.

So just Drew, if you haven't heard that story, we had, we hit Black ice and we had people staying at my house.

You were staying?

Yeah, Dave was paying, Luke was staying.

And we come back from my birthday party.

Okay.

A Lot of black ice, a lot of traffic stopped.

And I'm the one who slid and hit two cars out of all the hundreds that are on the freeways stopped.

And the two cars were the guys who were staying with me.

No, it was three.

It was three.

So, so Matt, 22 car accident.

Okay, 22 cars had an accident on this black ice.

Matt managed to hit only the three cars that were staying at his house.

He bounced off of us.

Bounced it.

He hit us first.

He bounced into someone else and then bounced it.

And, and so the police officer had so many people they had to take a reports from.

And he, we said, hey, can we go?

He's like, no, no, you got to stay.

And so after a while, Matt goes, hey, look, can we just get going?

Because like everybody that I hit is staying at my house.

And he goes, what?

And Matt's like, well, yeah, it was my birthday and like I, the only cars I hit were people that are staying in my house.

And, and, and all of us were sitting there.

And he's like, wait, he hit all of you guys?

Yeah, and your friends.

And he's like, he's like.

But it was just go, get out of here.

It was just a bunch, like five, ten miles an hour kind of thing anyway.

Yeah, yeah.

So.

So let's talk about amillennialism.

Your, Your view.

You have a view of the, you know, this age and the age to come now.

Two age model.

Yeah.

So as we go through this, you know, for folks who were here last week to hear what Keith had, you're going to hear a different view of almost millennialism here where Keith was more optimistic and Drew had came out and finally admitted he's not post millennialism, but went to the dark side and is, you know, now amillennialism.

But he's a, he's an optimistic on millennialism.

We'll see if he's going to now go.

Look, I'm, I'm the modern post mill, which is just optimistic on mill.

That's what I consider post millennials Optimist.

Amillennialism.

Yeah.

Yeah, I can share my screen.

Is that okay?

Yeah, that'll be good.

We haven't, we haven't figured out how to do that with this new software, so.

Well, let's see.

There's a share screen.

I'm going to go to that and it should work.

Let's see.

All right, so I can add that to screen and I do.

Let's see if we do.

Can I play.

Just drag it, Mouse.

Drag it up to the top.

Let's see what happens.

Ah, there we go.

Hey, you were right.

Yeah, I'm just big, you know.

In fact, let me get in here and make that a bit bigger.

So let me find it.

I'll go through quickly.

I hold to a two age model.

This is what was taught by Jesus and Paul the apostle.

And I just don't hear anybody talk about it.

And it was taught to me by Kim Riddlebarger from Whitehorse Inn back in Southern California, back 40, 50 years ago, I don't know, 40 years ago.

And never forgot the model.

I've researched it.

What I can say, I don't say improved, but added and you know, and anyway, there's two ages and you can see this stuff right here.

I'll go through it very quickly.

This age and the age to come.

And if you just model everything at this age and the age to come, that's what Jesus says.

Blasphemy is not forgiven in this age or the age to come.

Eternal life in the age to come.

Marriage given in marriage in this age, but not in the age to come.

Anyway, it goes on and on and you can see the difference characteristics.

And we have a lot in this age, you know, the present evil age, present age, rulers of this age, etc.

There's definitely two ages.

Okay.

And those who want to do this, you go to my website, just look this up and you can do it.

What I've done and I'll get to the depressed ology stuff here pretty quickly.

I'm not trying to take a long time, but what I've done is I've taught this many times in churches and where we have a chalkboard behind us, for example, I'll draw a vertical line, say this age and the age to come.

And everybody, you tell me where to put stuff, you just tell me and we go through verses.

And so I've developed it out of that.

And this age the wicked are gathered, you can put a, you know, just as the tares are gathered and burned at the fire social, it'd be at the end of the age.

Well then the end of the age is when the wicked are gathered.

So you take your line like this, this age and the age to come.

When are the wicked gathered?

At the end of the age.

When the judgment of the wicked occur at the end of the age.

When the elect that are gathered at the end of the age.

When's the harvest at the end of the age.

Jesus return is at the end of the age.

It says these things.

And the judgment of the wicked on the last day.

But the judgment of the wicked is also the end of the age.

So the end of the age and the last day are very similar, if not identical.

The judgment of the goods on the day of the Lord and the judgment of the wicked is on the day of the Lord.

So they're all basically the same day.

And the resurrection occurs and the Jesus return.

It's the day of the Lord.

And this is also called the end at the end of the age.

So that's what this is here, is just doing this.

And it's just a different way of putting stuff together.

And I say to people, go through and look up the phrase day of the Lord, just see what it says and just see.

And so I can go in, I can go into quite a bit.

But having said that, the reason I hold to what's called a pessimistic amillennial view, I think I can do is stop this now.

It's not a big deal.

Is based out of scripture.

And so the wages in his death, Romans 6:23, Jesus or the preincarnate Christ in the garden of Adam.

Genesis 2:17.

God said, the day that you eat of the fruit, you will die.

Now in First Corinthians 15:22, it says in Adam all die.

So it's called federal headship.

The representation of your descendants bought by the male and in Adam all die.

The day Adam that you eat the fruit, you're going to die.

And in the dying you will die.

The process of death of all it's what it is, is now beginning in Adam and his descendants.

And when you go to.

And I'll read it to you, I mean there's always room for discussion on stuff.

But I'll just read it to you when you go to Matthew 24 and it says Jesus came out of the temple and he said the stones would be thrown down.

The last time I was in Jerusalem, I got to see those stones thrown down.

It was interesting.

But they said in verse three, tell us, will be the.

The when will these things happen?

Won't be the sign of becoming and the end of the age.

So they asked Jesus, when's the end of the age?

See, there's two ages in this age, this age and the age to come.

Well, the age to come and eternal life, it's forever.

So the only one that can have the end of the age is this age.

Simple logic.

So he says, what are the sign of your coming and the end of the age?

And he goes on, you guys have heard this, you know Famines and earthquakes and false prophets, lawlessness, etc.

All that stuff.

But here's the verse that got me, and this is verse 22.

Unless those days be cut short, no life would have been saved.

No flesh.

What it says in there is sarx and it means flesh.

And I was looking at that one day and I was thinking, all right, this is my position, that sin entered the world through Adam.

In Adam all die.

The wages of sin is death.

Romans 6:23 and the end of the age will culminate with the days being cut short.

Because he says, if the days are not cut short, no flesh should be left, no life will be saved.

So I believe that mankind is manifesting its sinful rebellion against God and the prophetic nature of Genesis 2:17.

The day that you eat, that you will die, in the dying you will die, is for all of mankind that the wages of sin is going to bring us to self destruction.

And unless those days be cut short, no life would be saved.

But for the sake of the elect, those days will be cut short.

I believe that mankind is going to be gathered to Armageddon.

And two men are in the field.

One is taking, one is left.

Luke 17:26, following Matthew 25, 20:36, and following, I think it is, the wicked are the ones who are taken.

Two men in the field, one is taken, one is left.

That's the wicked.

And I can show that from Scripture and prove it.

And so when you go to Matthew 13, roughly 30 through 40 range the parable, the wheat and the tares.

He says, the first ones gathered are the wicked.

That's what he says.

Let's go together till the end of the age.

I'll say to the reapers, first gather the tares, and gather them and to be burned.

And then in 10 verses later, in verse 40, 41, 42, he says, and this is at the end of the age is this occurs.

I'm going quickly, but here's a summation.

Adam sinned, sin entered the world through him.

Romans 5:12, he represented all people.

First Corinthians 15:22 Sin is going to bring itself, bring death.

Romans 6:23 and all mankind will bring itself to destruction.

But those days have to cut short so that the flesh will be saved.

Matthew 24:22 and that the wicked are going to be the ones that may be transported to Armageddon.

That's another topic.

Two men, the field, one is taken, one is left.

And they ask, where are they taken?

He said, to where the body is.

A vulture's gas you're taken to a place of death.

That's the end of Luke 17.

And I think that death is the natural outcome of humanity that is without God and it will kill itself and that God will stop at the last minute to prevent it.

And that's my view.

That's the short version of my view, pessimistic all millennialism, or as I call it, depressed etology.

Because it's depressing.

It's depressing.

And I haven't even gotten into the signs of the end times which are concomitant with this.

But I could get into.

But you know, so one of the questions that as we go through a series with looking at amillennials and post millennialism, historic premillennialism, dispensational premillennialism, that's how.

What we're going to cover in over the next couple weeks, one of the questions I want to ask each person is what do you.

When we look at all the end times, we see that each of them have certain strengths and weaknesses.

And this is where people are convinced one way or another because, because they study it out and they say, well, this, this, as you said, you had a verse that it was like, okay, this is what convinced you?

Yeah, two verses.

Yeah.

So what I want, what I want to ask you is can you provide for us what do you see as the strengths of amillennialism and then what is the weaknesses of the argument?

The strengths are.

It takes things literally.

I think premillennialism to some degree takes things figuratively.

Now that's not to say that, you know, my view doesn't take some things figuratively as well, but the plain, in my opinion, this is my opinion, you know, is that the plain reading of scripture necessitates all millennialism, particularly when you go to 1st Thessalonians 4, 2nd Peter 3.

I can get into that if you guys are interested.

I just don't see premill as being a legitimate option.

And I think postmen is an option, but because of the, the prophecies of Christ that to me negates the idea of things getting better, but things are only get worse.

So anyway, I forgot what your question was, but that's.

So the question was what are the strengths and weaknesses of, of your position?

Well, the strengths I think are that it incorporates the two age model and this is a humongous strength for it.

If it wasn't for the two age model, I could be convinced other things, in my opinion, the two age model settles it.

I have presented it Numerous times in Bible studies.

And I can honestly say not a single person's ever refuted it.

It's not to say they have.

And I ignore them.

I've said, what do you guys think?

Anybody have a reputation and a couple hands, a couple of questions?

But I've had everybody just say I have never seen this before.

They've even heard of it before.

And so this has been consistent throughout the studies that I've given it in.

And I don't present it as you have to believe it this way.

I say, you guys, tell me where these verses go.

Where do they say, let's just take a look at them, hoping that maybe I can get out of this.

But I've not been able to.

So that's the strengths of it.

Now.

The weaknesses of it is, you know, there's some stuff in Isaiah that aren't.

Don't quite fit as well as I'd like it to.

And some other issues.

New Heavensworth, kind of a chronology issue I haven't quite figured out yet.

But, you know, that's that.

And then there's a.

What some would call the spiritualizing of the millennium.

I don't think it's a spiritualization.

I think it's a.

It's a spiritual.

Look, truthfully, that may sound like double talk, but I think the real issue is that the spiritual issue, the millennium, where Christ is reigning right now and he says he's reigning right now, he's the king.

And it says in Matthew 13 that when Jesus returns, he'll take out of his kingdom the stumbling blocks.

And there's only one return of Christ.

And the return is at the end of the age.

So you see these kind of things.

I'm forced into my position.

I'm forced into depressed eschatology.

I don't want depressed eschatology.

I want to be wrong.

I don't want to go through the tribulation.

I believe we're going to go through it.

I believe the rapture's after it, concomitant with the new heavens and new Earth.

I can get into that.

I think we're going to be suffering.

And I relate it to the second Aliens movie, which I have seen literally 79.

79.

I can quit anytime I want.

But it's.

The plot is basically scream, run, hide.

Scream, work.

Run, hide.

Scream, run, hide.

And that's what I see.

Depressed etology coming to when the Antichrist is alive and well and running in concert with the Democrats.

He just slips that in.

That's right.

That's.

That's sort of scream run, hide.

That's, that's sort of what I do when I, I see you in person.

You know what, usually with you it's run, hide.

And later you scream screen.

But yeah, it doesn't really matter.

So, so let me ask, because you mentioned something and I know, Drew, you're going to have some questions, but yeah, you said that you feel amillennialism is more literal.

Now most people would, would look at that, at least from dispensational perspective.

Right.

People would look at that and say, well, dispensationals would be more literal, you know, because they, they see for example, the big one that comes up, up the.

The thousand years in Revelation 20.

They would take that literally, that there's a literal thousand years where you would take that spiritually.

So, you know, and, and folks are, that are watching.

I should have said at the beginning you're not going to see, even though Matt and I would disagree.

This show, what we're doing in these is letting people voice their, their different views.

Even when we get to the view that I hold, I'm going to let the guests express their views.

That's what we do.

I have.

There you go, Andrew.

Open air theology says I'm out of.

Yeah, that.

So Tom may actually get in here.

Good.

And I should also say that if, if anybody wants to join in, ask any questions, you can do it in the chat, but another way you could do it, best way to do it is to go to apologexlive.com just scroll down to where the duck icon is and join us there.

That's the best way.

And I'm going to say again, if Anyone is on YouTube and wants to drop us a super chat, so we could not.

We don't mind the money.

But the reason I'm saying that is just so that we can see how that shows up in this new software so that we, as we're, we're playing with it.

So Tom will come in shortly.

He'll have lots of things to say about amillennialism, I'm sure.

Sure.

So.

So Matt, what.

Let's, let's take the example of the thousand years in Revelation 20.

Right.

I, I would see that dispensationalists or premillennialists would take that as a literal thousand years.

So when you say that amillennial is more literal, what do you mean by that?

And then you can apply it to Revelation 20, but maybe apply it to other things as well.

Yeah.

Revelation 20, you know, it's in Book of Revelation, which is very symbolic to begin with.

That's not to excuse it and dismiss it, you know.

Know.

But when it says in Revelation 20, verse one that I saw an angel come down from heaven, I think that's a literal vision he had holding the key of the abyss.

I don't think it was a literal key.

You know, you put your on a chain and a great chain in his hand.

I don't believe it was an actual chain, but laid hold of the dragon, that's figurative.

Also the serpent of old, that's literal.

Who's a devil and Satan literal.

So we have literal and figurative usages here.

And this is bounding for the years.

Is it literal or figurative?

That's just the question, you know, someone wants to say, oh, it's literal.

Well, maybe it is, but can you prove it from the text?

That's all I say is just demonstrate it's literal.

You know, in Psalm 50, verse 10, every beast of the forest is mine.

A cattle on a thousand hills.

There's a term thousand.

Again, it's a figurative usage.

In Deuteronomy 7, 9, the faithful God who keep his covenant and his faithfulness to a thousand generations, or second Peter 3, 8, with the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like a day.

And Psalm 484, 10 for a day in your courtyards is better than a thousand elsewhere.

Song of Solomon.

Go on.

And the thing is that the term thousand just by itself is often used in a very figurative context.

That doesn't mean though we transfer that figurative usage from one place over to Here in Revelation 20 always you want to look at immediate context and, and the angel from heaven, literal.

Holding a key, great chain, figurative.

They told the dragon, figurative serpent of old and the devil literal.

I'm just saying you can't just say it's literal.

I mean, you can say it, but you can't really prove it.

And so I can't prove it's not.

You know, I just think it's not the best place to go.

And he said threw him into the abyss and sealed it over him, for wouldn't deceive the nations any longer.

It doesn't say that he Satan can't do any bad stuff, particularly when you go to Matthew, I've got so much to say.

I could but to Matthew 12, Matthew 12, 22, 32.

And in there is, is where the, the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is talked about.

And in order for Jesus to cast out demons, he says, he said, I'm looking for the exact verse.

Yeah.

Verse 29.

Can anyone enter the strong man's house and carry off his property?

That means casting out demons.

Unless he first binds the strong man, he'll plunder his house.

The strong man is referenced as Satan.

You read the context in order to.

It's called if A goes B and B goes C. The naked C. It's the law of proper inference.

So if he says, you can't bind, you can't cast them out.

Unless Satan's bound and they're being cast out, then Satan's bound.

And it's right there in Matthew 12, 22, 32.

So you can see, you know, that's literal.

And then I get some other stuff, too, if you want out of first Thessalonians 4 and second Peter 3, which I think just.

Just, in my opinion, destroys the millennium, so.

But, you know, I could be wrong, so.

Drew.

What?

I want to give you a chance to ask some questions.

Oh, we got.

We got Tom coming in.

He's in his car.

Tom, welcome.

Finally.

Tom, I'm going to try and listen to you.

I'm on my phone.

I'm sorry.

Yeah, that's right.

Tom, this is Matt Slick.

I don't know you guys have ever met before.

I. I think we've.

Yes, I met him on.

On a call with Jeff Rice and.

Capps Addison and Braden Patterson once before.

Oh, yes.

Okay, good.

All right, nice.

And, Tom, I'm just going to mute you since you're in the car and unmute yourself if you.

You have any questions just because the.

The road noise.

So go ahead, Drew.

Yeah, I mean, trying to think of some questions.

I mean, there were.

I mean, there was a lot of things he said in there that I would agree with.

Right.

Like, especially once you get in to the book of Revelation and you start talking about literal.

Well, you know, the genre of Revelation is it's prophecy, but it's.

It's a book of signs.

And so everything John is seeing and writing is a sign.

So it's.

It's.

It's mostly coming out figurative.

And, you know, this is, you know, Matthew 24.

I would view Matthew 24 as the destruction of the temple, at least up to the part where he talks about one taken, one left.

Right.

Because he brings in the reference of Noah in the last his, where he talks about, my word will by no means pass away.

And then he says, but in that day, one will be taken, one will be left.

Right?

And so I would agree that the wicked are the ones that are taken.

Away, the righteous are the ones left behind who inherit the earth.

But I would.

I would ask, when you're looking at age, the term age, are you looking at age like in its semantic domain, or are you looking at a specific definition of age?

Yeah, semantic domain is one thing.

Then we don't want to commit what's called illegitimate totality transfer.

So what semantic domain means for ladies and gentlemen, is that a word, a single word has a range of meaning, different contexts.

And we don't want.

And he's not doing this.

He's not committing the error of taking a meaning in one place and transferring it to another.

Catholics do it so all the time.

So I just look at it as.

In this immediate context first, what's it saying?

And then later, you know, I don't know.

I can't.

I really can't figure it out from here, here.

And so then I go to other places and stuff and look, just.

I'm almost trying to talk myself out of this.

I don't want anyone else to believe this.

All right.

I mean, here's.

Here's one thing we can do.

We can.

We can believe the promises of God that the righteous will inherit the earth.

Yep.

So that, I mean, that's.

That's pretty optimistic right there, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So end of the age, when the new age is made and stuff.

Yeah, Yeah.

I mean, personally, I don't think.

I don't think we'll be alive to see all the destruction or anything.

I think I. I believe we're still in the early church days.

Our time would be looked at to see as the Earl.

Still, the early church.

Could be.

Could be.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

I want your view.

I don't want mine.

You can ask people, have you had on?

Go, please do it.

I don't.

I don't want to believe it.

So, you know, just for folks to.

You mentioned thousand being a figurative throughout scripture.

More specifically, it often is often ways.

Yeah.

Not always.

So for folks to realize the thousand years, those two words appears ten times in Scripture, six of which are in the passage we referenced, Revelation 20.

So it only appears outside of Revelation 20 in three verses, Psalm 90, Ecclesiastes 6, 6, and twice in second Peter 3, 8.

So I would, I would, I would agree in Ecclesiastes 6, 6, where it says, even if the other man lives a thousand years twice and does not enjoy good things, do not all go to one place that could be figurative.

But in Psalm 90, verse 4 and 2nd Peter, I, I would actually argue that.

That it's.

It's being used in an illustration.

But for the illustration to work, it has to be taking taken in in a literal comparison.

Because what's doing Psalm 90 says for a thousand years in your sight are like yesterday.

So it's comparing a thousand years to a day, which is exactly what Second Peter does when it says but, but do not let this one fact escape your your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years is like one day.

So I, I agree with Matt that in Psalm 90 and 2nd Peter 3 you have it in an illustration.

But where I think Matt and I might disagree is I would say that that illustration is requiring a literal comparison of a thousand years to a day.

It's not saying it's a literal thousand years in a day, a literal day, but the comparison of the two, which is the focus of it is comparing a literal thousand years to a literal day, meaning a really long time to a short time.

So I don't think that gives an argument one way or another of how to interpret Revelation 20 because I think it's, it's a different style of.

Right.

A different style literature.

Right.

Which Matt already addressed that it's more prophetic.

But in Revelation 20, Matt, we talked about this with Keith, so I'd be curious to get your take on this is in Revelation 20 where it talks about the binding of Satan as an amillennialist.

So you believe reiterate this from last week.

So for some it'll be, you know, repetitive.

But for those who are new here this week, the you have the different views all millennial.

So pre millennialism would be the idea that Christ is going to return before a millennial kingdom, which would end up being a thousand years post millennialism is going to be.

There's, there's this, you know, new age of, of Christ on earth where he's going to, to there's going to be a kingdom and then he comes in era, the golden era and Christ comes at the end of that.

And a socialist utopian.

I watched too much news, you know, leftists.

And then, then the, the amillennial position would be one that is the idea that we're in the millennial kingdom, but it's not exactly a thousand years.

It's.

It's a long period of time.

And so with that there's this idea that we see in Revelation 20 where it talks about the thousand year kingdom with a binding of Satan and then Satan is loosed at the end.

So from your perspective, Matt, what how is.

Well first Off.

Let me ask you this way.

Do you believe Satan is bound today?

I suspect he's not.

And you get it.

When you hear me talk, you're going to see a lot of all males really defending their position.

I have a lot of ambiguity with a lot of stuff.

The reason I'm on male is because of the two age model and two particular set of verses which forces me into it.

But so I'm like, well, I think that Satan's been released because this is not to see the nations anymore.

Well, is it legitimate to say the nations have been deceived now?

You know, nation against nation, world war and things like that?

Whoa.

Are you saying that nations could be deceived?

Let's talk Covid.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Nations can be deceived, that's for sure.

So, yeah, so they can.

And here's the problem is the problem I have with my own position is, and I think any eschatological position is how many things are we going to take literally, how many we take figuratively, and how do we.

What do we do to kind of blend them in?

I could probably argue your position and say, well, this is this.

Well, it's a biblical position.

So, yeah, you could.

I hope you're right.

I want to go.

I don't want to go through it.

I don't want my position to be right.

I'm forced into it.

That's my opinion.

You know, it's like, no.

And, you know, for regulars of Apologetics Live, you probably heard me tell this story, but I want you to listen to what Matt's saying, because there's a right where what we do in Apologetics Live is not just do apologize.

We teach apologetics.

A key thing in doing apologetics is what you're hearing Matt say.

And it.

You.

I don't want you to just pass by this.

He is, he.

He's fencing in what he believes and what he is going, well, I can't be sure about this.

This is a big problem we have especially with online theologians who, you know, they are keyboard warriors that are so definitive in all their theology that they don't know what they don't know.

I know a lot.

I know a lot about this.

I.

Their weaknesses in the Amel position, as I read Scripture, their weaknesses.

And in the pre mill, there's weaknesses in post mill, they're just weak.

And you know, Romans 14:1 12 says, you know, basically, don't pass judgment on your brother's.

Your brother's opinions.

You know, and so I don't, I just Say, look, here's my reason.

You believe it.

If you want.

You want to get depressed, come over here to the dark side.

You know, if you want to have a good time, go talk to Drill.

You know, There you go.

You know, I think something Matt says is pretty important, right?

Is.

And something you just touched on, too, Andrew, is when we look at all the different online theologians will say and their different eschatological positions there, it's almost as dogmatic as if you were to tell them, hey, defend the sovereignty of God, right?

But they wouldn't be on it, right?

So, like myself, right?

I would be like, you know, I could be wrong.

I don't think I am, but I could be.

But if you asked me to go, if you asked me the question or if I asked Matt the question or Andrew the question, I go, hey, is God sovereign?

Right.

I'm gonna get a pretty definitive answer, because I think that's spelled out a lot more clearly throughout Scripture in terms of the nature and character of God.

Whereas some of these other things, we don't necessarily need to be so dogmatic.

They're not all clear.

Well, let me, Let me say I remember Matt and I were having a.

So we're doing an apologetics cruise.

Matt and I were the two keynotes.

I think he spoke 10 times in one week, and I spoke nine.

It was like, boy, did they work.

Us and supposed to be a vacation.

Yeah, it didn't feel like a vacation.

But what, you know, one of the things that Matt and I did was we did a debate on covenant theology versus dispensationalism.

And throughout the debate, I, I, I didn't notice it.

I don't know if Matt picked up that he was doing this, but I kept making arguments.

I kept making the points about where dispensationalists make bad arguments against covenant theology.

And I was addressing people from my own side with bad arguments they make about the other side.

And Matt was doing the same thing.

And one woman, when it came to Q and A, had a question, and she asked why both of us were doing that.

Now, Matt answered first, but I always end on Matt's answer because it was it.

His answer is the reason I'm telling the story because it was so much better.

My answer was basically that I do that because I think that.

But I don't want people making bad arguments.

And I think people that are dispensationalists will hear it better coming from me saying this is a bad argument to make against covenant theology than if Matt makes that argument.

But Matt had the better answer.

Matt's answer was this.

He said, Andrew and I are both wrong in our theology.

We don't know where, because if we knew where, we would change.

But we know when we sit at the feet of Christ, he will correct both of us.

And I've always told that story because that is so true of what, you know, how we should be doing apologetics.

We have to do it with humility.

We can't think we're, we are so right that, you know, I mean, there are certain things like Drew said that, I mean, Jesus is God.

Yep.

We're, we're gonna, we're gonna die for that.

We're gonna fight for that one.

But these, these views of end times, we could be wrong and we have to recognize that we might be wrong in it.

And good men like R.C.

sproul have changed his opinion many times.

James White, really smart guy, changed his.

I think he's held to all three.

Started off premill on mill, now post mill.

Right.

So the, the thing is really smart people can be changing as they study their positions.

We have to recognize that we could be wrong.

Matt's point on that cruise, that we are wrong in our theology.

All of us are.

We don't know where.

Right.

And, and so I think that's a.

Really important point where you are.

But I don't know about where I am.

Yeah, well, you know, where do you, where do you begin, Matt?

That's the real question.

So, so, okay, so the binding of Satan, do you see him as bound?

You know, today, then?

And then what is this binding?

And what will be the loosing at the end of the age?

Do you think that's the right question?

What's the binding mean?

Does, can you bind someone?

They can still do bad stuff.

It says Satan's, but it doesn't say the demonic realm is bound.

Just Satan's bound.

He can't see the nations anymore.

Okay, does that mean he can deceive other people?

You know, I'm a little bit different.

A lot of Christians and I try and think as logically as possible.

I'm not saying I got all of them, but it doesn't say this.

It doesn't necessitate that it might mean this.

And that's how I operate.

And so it doesn't say, you know, he's bound for a thousand years, let's say, whatever that means.

It doesn't say he can't do anything at all.

He's bound.

Apparently it's so that his house can be robbed.

The demonic realm, the possession and people can be removed.

But in Revelation 20, he's balanced, so he won't deceive the nations anymore.

Here's another question.

Is that binding in Revelation 20 the same one of Matthew 20, Matthew 12?

I don't have an honest.

I don't have a good answer because I can't say it is.

I can't say it isn't because he's bound in both senses.

Is it two different senses?

If it's only one sense?

Well, then we could drive some conclusions out of it.

If it's two senses, we could drive different conclusions.

And that's why I say constantly, heck, I don't know.

But I. I'm on mill.

Not because of all of that.

I'm on mill because of.

Of two verses which we can get to if you guys want, and the.

The two age model.

And that's what did it for me.

I'm like, oh, crap.

And so I had to believe that.

Now I'm trying to fill the rest of it in.

And then when I went on to depress etology, it just made everything worse.

So it did.

Matt, why don't you go into the.

The verses that, that you really focus.

Focused you in and convinced you.

Yeah, I actually remember where I was.

I was in El Cajon, California, and a friend of mine came over and he goes, matt, I want you to read something.

I says, okay, what?

He goes, out of the Bible, Just read something.

I said, okay, what's it about?

Not telling you this is exactly how it went.

And I said, okay, well, what is it?

And he says, I'm glad that I'm.

Not the only friend that gives you a hard time.

Yeah, actually it seems to be a trend with all your friends, actually.

Why is that?

But I still remember it.

This was back 45 years ago.

You know, I'm 68.

You know, I'm old.

And I said, well, what's it about?

He goes, I'm telling you.

Well, what do you want me to do?

I don't want to do anything.

I just want you to read them.

He was completely nothing.

I said, okay.

He says, you know, there's no chapter breaks in the.

In the Greek.

And I said, yeah.

He goes, okay, so first, Thessalonians 4, 16, 2.

For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God.

And dead in Christ will rise first.

Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds.

Meet the Lord in the air, and so we'll always be with the Lord.

That's the Rapture.

No problem.

Therefore, comfort one another with these words.

I'm comforted by that.

Now, as to the times and the epics, brethren, when this is going to happen, you have no need of anything to be written to you.

For you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord took a thief in the night.

Well, the Rapture, the return of Christ, they're the same thing.

Come like a day and a thief like a day in the night.

I go, okay, now what he said, now read this.

And it was second Peter 3, 10.

But the day of the Lord come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat and the earth and its work to be burned up.

I looked at it, I looked at him and I said, there's no millennium.

I was converted right there.

Now that doesn't mean others don't have a better answer.

But for me, the phrase the day of the Lord comes like a thief in Thessalonians in the night.

But in Second Peter doesn't say in the night.

I think it's because the earth is round, the lights on one side.

But the phraseology, a day of the Lord comes like a thief and it says the day, not a bunch of days, one day of the Lord.

And there's a specific event that occurs on the day of the Lord, that's the Rapture and the return of Christ when the new heavens and new earth are made boom.

And I have not looked back to premillennialism since I can't get around those.

And then with a two age model where everything happens at the end of this age, I, I'm, it's just now I'm cemented in and then when I was reading Jesus Matthew 12, 24, 22, let's say those days be not cut short, no flesh should be left.

I went to depress eschatology.

That's a downward spiral, that's all.

But rescue me.

Come on.

Well, you'll have to keep listening to the rest of the month so you can, can you can hear the different views because I'm not going to try to, I, I, I'm purposely not trying to argue against folks for this month in these views because I want people to be able to, to, to share their position.

So but let me ask you a question I want to ask each, each week of each of the speakers is so as we look at your end times, you okay, how then does this affect your daily Christian life, well, it.

Tells me this is just, you know, and everything's subjective.

You know, I'm 68.

When am I going to die?

And I pray regularly, Lord, use me.

I pray that my mind is sharp.

I'm still sharp for my age.

I pray, Lord, use me.

In spite of myself, please direct my typing, my words, my thinking, my actions, then I would bring glory to you.

I don't put all my eggs in a five point.

I'm a Calvinist.

Don't put all my eggs in a five point basket.

Or the pessimistic all millennial view I hold.

I believe I could be wrong about things and my eye is on him.

Not pre mill, not amel, not post mill, not pre trib rapture, not five points.

My eyes are on my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, who, who I'm sure will correct me when I get to heaven.

And so that's why in these areas, I'm not going to be dogmatic unless I'll defend Calvinism.

But you know, when they say, when they attack it and cause division in the body, then I get dogmatic.

But if they just don't agree, okay, it's fine.

But with the essentials which I can talk about, I will die on that hill.

But these I just don't know.

And because I don't know means I could be wrong.

And if I could be wrong, I need to keep my eyes on Jesus.

And I better live for glorifying him.

I better live for preaching his gospel, do all my apologetics to break down barriers so God by his condescending grace might use this broken vessel of a fool to bring others into the kingdom that he's ordained.

And that's it.

And that's why if people don't agree with me, that's okay, I don't care.

Maybe I'm wrong.

And let's move forward.

And getting the gospel of Jesus Christ out.

That's my attitude.

That's why I'm so casual about it.

It's like, whatever, you know, maybe I'm wrong.

I want to be wrong wrong, you know, that's why, that's how it affects life.

My ignorance is a source of comfort because I don't know what I know is absolutely true.

Therefore I turn to the one I know is true and trust his judgment, not mine, his wisdom, not mine.

You are wrong in many areas, but absolutely, and, and folks may not.

There's another example.

You, you and I have debated one another more than I think we've debated anyone else because we've, we've done many debates and we've done lots of different topics.

We've debated charismatic gifts, covenant theology versus dispensationalism, baptism.

You preach your rapture.

I would be.

I think I.

That's really where I'm.

Eileen, gosh, you know, okay, whatever, loser.

I've only say that in contrast everything else I just said because I know I can tease them.

I hope you're right.

Yeah.

Okay, so, you know, I've often.

I've often thought about this.

And folks, Matt has a radio show.

He does.

So if you go to carm.org you can see a link where you can listen live.

Yeah, I. I often wanted to, like, just call in his radio show so he would have to do this on the air.

But to.

To like, just say, matt, I'm.

I'm feeling depressed so that Mac.

Mac could show people how he.

When I.

When I'm not.

When I'm in, down and out, Matt, I give you a call and what do you do?

Insult you.

And.

And when do you stop insulting me?

When we hang up.

What a great counselor.

I'm going to insult you until you see you feel better.

And I'm gonna keep insulting you until you feel better.

That's right.

But it's a loving insult, you know, and sometimes you'll call me up and I'll go, what?

And you start laughing right away.

So.

Well, I was telling.

As I said, we got someone from our church that's at the house, and.

I. Oh, it is open.

Go ahead.

Sorry.

And.

And I. I said that I. I called up your radio show once, and before I even got to ask a question or say anything, you just went, you're a jerk.

And I said, you want to explain why I'm a jerk?

And you had to explain that I bought you a new grill because we're.

We're in Home Depot.

And.

And it was over.

We were fighting over.

Yes, fighting.

There's a lot of pushing and shoving over who.

And in that case, Drew.

I didn't take his credit card.

I did.

No deception.

I just pushed him far enough away that he couldn't even reach, giving the lady his.

His credit card.

And so my credit card was there, so.

Yeah, remember the one in McDonald's?

A short version of this.

As I got ahead of where you weren't feeling really well, so I actually, he wouldn't let me.

Wouldn't order, so I couldn't order.

Pay for your food, so at least I could pay for my own.

And then I. I pay and I walk over to the the soda machine.

And you're up there, you know, ordering your stuff.

And the no lie of all things, the link behind the counter goes, hey, mister, you know, whatever.

I go, yeah.

She goes, goes, your car didn't go through.

I went, no.

I ran over and.

I think I saw that video.

That one's, that one's got a video, isn't it?

Yes, there's a video to that where I'm holding up the, I'm holding up the receipt all.

I wasn't feeling good, but I was so happy to have that receipt.

Yeah.

I was like, oh, you jerk.

Yeah, it was, it was, it was Nathan, who is.

You were at the soda machine and I'm waiting for my food and Nathan is going, matt, your car didn't go through.

And you just looked.

And as I heard it, I was closer and I just quickly reached over with my phone to do Apple Pay.

And the look on your face was horror.

Like, because you were bragging if you ever wanted proof.

The, the Bible verse pride comes before the fall.

Matt was going like, he, he goes to pay.

And he walks past me going, haha, I paid.

Paid for my own meal.

You didn't do it.

And he goes to get a soda and.

And then that happened.

No, I, I do have to admit.

Matt, do you remember what the, the lady behind the counter said?

No.

Something insulting.

See, Matt and I both love the lady behind the counter.

After this, she just looks like because she saw this, the antics going and she, when Matt walks up, she goes, you're a loser.

You're.

You're such a loser that if there was a contest for losers, you'd come in last.

Really nice.

I see.

Jumped on that one like a monkey in a cupcake.

That was great.

So, so for, for folks that you know, are looking at amillennialism, right.

What would we, we see a lot of people that hold to the view.

It's it.

I would say people, A lot of people think it's the most historic view.

I mean there is.

We, we see the early church fathers, you know, Augustine or Augustine, however you want to pronounce it, both pre millennialism and amillennialism.

See that Actually, I think all of them, every, every view of millennialism finds their roots in, in Augustine.

Right?

Because he, he did believe Augustine.

Augustine.

He believed, he believed in a literal thousand years, but he believed he was in it.

So pre millennialists can look and say, oh, see, but it was, he believed it was literal, but when you look at the way he words things, he clearly thought he was in that kingdom.

And, and that was the view pretty much held until, you know, I think it was Pope Innocence II.

I think in like 10, 10 when, when.

When all of a sudden they said, oh, well, the thousand years is figure.

But I think up till then most people thought that the thousand years was literal.

They were just in it.

Yeah, that makes sense.

And they were wrong.

And that's why I think a lot of us could be just wrong.

I think we're all gonna.

We're probably all surprised.

You know, I think we might be more surprised when we get to heaven with who.

Who we don't see there and who we do.

Well, when you get there, you won't recognize me.

And the reason is, is because you won't recognize me without sin.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I like what John MacArthur says, is that he hopes that we'll be able to.

To, you know, that.

That.

I forget how he words it, but essentially that we.

The Lord does enough sanctifying of us so that we could recognize each other in.

In heaven, you know, that the glorified state date isn't so big of a difference.

But I do think that it'll be big for all of us.

It's gonna be a shock for me.

But you know what's gonna be like to actually not have pride and selfishness and foolishness and, and evil thoughts and.

And it's gonna be different.

And the best is just going to be being with the Lord Jesus.

That's gonna be the best.

Just being able to be with Him.

And that's what I want the most.

That's it.

That's like David said, one thing I've asked of the Lord that might dwell in the house of the Lord forever.

That's.

That's it.

And, and so let's.

Let's zoom in a little bit more on that because that really is.

And I know, you know, personally from knowing you, right, the.

That is your view.

That is what motivates your view of end times, your.

Your understanding of theology.

So let's dig into that a bit because we see so much debate, especially with what's going on with Israel right now.

There's so many people who are pushing back against dispensationalists in their view of Israel.

And dispensationals are pushing back on Covenant theologians and their view of the church.

And so as there's so much infighting within Christianity.

Matt, what should be our view with.

I mean, how tightly should we hold these things?

Things and how, you know, how should we live?

Essentially, the problem with ourselves is that we identify ourselves with a certain ideology, a tame a politics, a nation, and then we get intertwined with the self, value, worth, et cetera, of that identification.

And it all can be ultimately a form of idolatry.

The only place on the throne of our heart is for the Lord Jesus Christ.

And so if we recognize that, in my opinion, if we recognize that he is the Lord God, that he is the sovereign king, that he's going to correct all of us when we get to heaven, and that he is condescending to use us in our foolishness and our sinfulness.

I know myself, you know, I have a sermon I preach every now and then who's the biggest sinner you know.

And the goal is you point at yourself because you know your own heart.

You don't know know the other hearts, but you know your own.

And you should know your own heart well enough to know that it's in great need of improvement, even as a Christian after all these years.

And so, you know, like you and Drew and others, if there's a post male in here, a premill, I don't care.

I hope that you guys are better, right?

And if we can learn to fellowship with one another because the Bible says that, you know, the world will know you're, you're my disciple, but I love you have one another.

John 13.

We are to show that.

And if we're to start saying, no, I'm right and you're just wrong because you're stupid, not smart like me, that causes division, it's sinful, it's not glorifying the Lord Jesus Christ.

And that, that's my view, is let's glorify him.

And we need to stop our divisions and start working to evangelize.

Like you and I, we have different views on lots of things.

We've stood side by side, open air preaching in more than one place and do it again.

Because all those things, they don't matter.

What matters is the preaching of the gospel to the people who need to hear that truth.

That's what matters.

I spent a year trying to convince someone of my pessimistic amillennialism.

But are they saved?

I don't want an idol that I'm going to raise up before God and before people in my own heart to say, this is what you ought to believe, except you need to trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, that he's God in flesh.

He died on the cross, he bore us in his body on the cross.

And without Jesus Christ, without him, without your trust and your faith in what he did.

And in him alone.

Not your faith in your baptism, not faith in communion, not faith in your, don't go to this movie or that movie, not your faith in your Bible reading your good works or whatever, but faith in him alone.

Without him alone, you're going to go to hell.

You need Jesus Christ because eternity is a long time to be wrong.

You need Jesus Christ.

And all the rest of this are the dressings around the door.

Jesus getting to the place of eternal redemption.

And we need to be careful how we adorn that door and the knowledge of the truth around him.

We need to be doing it with humility.

We need to be doing it with consistency and a love for one another because that's what we're entitled.

We're supposed to do.

If Jesus is living in us.

And we can tell.

I'm almost done here, my little preaching.

What we can tell when the idols in our hearts are being attacked or tipped over.

When we start getting defensive about an ideology, now that's not Jesus.

We get defensive about Jesus.

We're all three going to unite and jump on that like all male pre mill.

Okay, whatever Charismatic gifts, okay, I believe in infinite baptism.

You don't.

All right, let's talk about the Lord.

Let's defend the faith.

Let's knock down barriers.

Let's elevate the Lord Jesus Christ.

Bring glory to his holy and perfect and pure name.

That's what I say.

And that's actually why I think we've gone to conferences where people will invite you and I to conferences to do a debate is because both of us have that same similar view that we, we can do a debate, we can be good friends, we could have different views, but we can respect one another's views and, and not hold it against one another.

And I, I think more people need to do that, especially in areas of.

End times, especially and, and even in Calvinism, in a very strong Calvinist.

And I can defend it very well, very easily.

Been doing it for like 35 years.

I've all kind of memorized stuff.

But I don't care if you're not a Calvinist.

I didn't even know we met.

My wife had been married 38 years and I think 15 years ago I asked her, you Calvin?

And she said yeah, no, you are.

She goes, yeah.

I go, okay.

And that's one thing I've been seeing like with some of the people I've been interacting with on Tick Tock, right, is they're so anti Calvinists.

And, and, and I've told them I've said, look, I don't care if you're anti Calvinist.

I don't care if you're against it.

Just represent the position correctly.

I could care less if you don't agree with it.

Just actually teach what we believe.

I'm amazed how many, how many people.

I'm always amazed how many people I debate on Calvinism that are Calvinists.

And if folks want an example of it, just go back, back.

Oh, this would have been like 20, 21, I think.

We did a debate on the channel with a guy, R.A. fuentes, and he.

It.

It was.

I don't think you.

You saw that debate, Matt.

Probably not.

But what I did in the cross, we had two rounds of cross examination.

So in the first round of cross examination, I, I asked him, basically, I asked him what he believed and I gave all five points of Calvinism without using the labels, just using definitions, and he agreed to all five points.

And I mean, it's funny, you're seeing in the chat people like, boom, Checkmate.

Gotcha.

You know, and at the end, at the fifth point, I just said, well, congratulations, you're a Calvinist.

He's like, I am not a second round.

What I did was I asked him, can you, can you define total depravity?

Could you define irresistible grace?

Can you do.

And.

And he had a wrong definition for all of them.

And, and that's what I often find is people have a wrong definition, definition for what they're fighting against.

And so, yeah, like, don't mind if you disagree.

Just represent it.

Right.

That's right.

Represent it.

So Humble Clay says, if I can bring this up, he says, tell Matt I said, hey.

So Matt.

Humble Clay says, hey, yeah, he's in.

The chat when I do my rare show because those who don't know, I've been doing radio for 20 years, five days a week.

And he'll.

He's been for a year, two or three, I guess.

And he, he's good.

He's funny.

He says funny things.

And I gotta not read what he says sometimes because it cracks me up right before the break.

Yeah, I gotta get on the radio.

Yeah.

So let's see some of the comments that I starred.

And Kathy Deming, when I mentioned about Carm.org she goes, that is all.

That is incredible.

All the information on Carm.

And it is a lot of years that Matt has been putting stuff out on Carm.

Full disclosure, I. I used to be a board member@carm.org so yes, I fully support them very much.

Long Time.

Yeah.

Ethan says bring Matt back as a co host.

We, we should, we actually for folks that don't know we started this show was Matt and I, I was the host and Matt was the host, the, the resident apologist, although we're both apologists, but Matt was.

And, and I didn't start this one, but Tanner had said Matt brings out a lot of people.

We used to, we, you know, Matt, there's something about your personality which different than mine, where you just get under people's skin and they, they want to fight you, they want to debate you.

And so we used to get all kinds of people in here.

My wife has an express it and I've learned to imitate it.

Yeah.

And for folks in the audio, Matt just, just made a fa, a face and, and rubbed his, for his forehead like, like ouch, this hurts.

Kathy had said this.

She said, I appreciate the Bible Sojourner, Professor Gaiman and, and his going, uh, I, I, I'm not sure what she was saying.

His going this and what he had Matt Weimer on the Thousand Years.

So not exactly sure what she's referring to.

But so Bible Sojourner is one of the podcasts.

Like this one is on the Christian podcast community.

And I did reach out to Professor Gamon and so he will be coming on the 31st to talk about dispensational premillennialism.

And so that is the view he holds.

And it happens to also be the one I hold.

And so we will, that, that will be the, the last of the month.

And while I'm mentioning it, I'll just mention next week we have a guy named Josh Howard who will talk about Post Mill, the view Drew used to hold to and, and fight for, but gave it all up.

Then we have Michael Schultz who is going to come in and present historical pre millennialism on the 24th, and Peter Gaiman, Professor Peter Gaiman on the 31st on dispensational pre millennialism.

So that's, that's the next couple of shows.

Hopefully it won't take us a thousand years to do.

That was like a joke, Matt.

I thought for sure you'd laugh at that one, man.

Looks like a day.

So you'd probably do it in a day.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

See, Drew just kind of, Yeah, I saw that expression.

He's like.

But it was good.

It was good.

You're killing me.

So some things to, to mention.

I should actually.

Let's see if I could find the slide.

Let's see my, my monitor over here keeps like flashing.

So I don't know if I keep cutting out or not because you guys freeze on me.

Screen does tend to freeze every now and again.

Yeah, I don't know what's going on with the.

This second monitor, but what I want to do is if I can find.

It, check your GPU temperature sometimes.

I used to be computer tech.

Sometimes you can have an HDMI cable that the contacts build up a little bit of resistance.

You.

You just take the cable out, put it back in, and sometimes that'll solve it.

If that doesn't work, you get a new cable.

Make sure you get one that exceeds the flow, and that's it.

Pay a little extra and then take your GPU and blow out your.

Your computer fans, particularly in the.

The gpu, that's the graphics processing unit for those people.

Don't know.

All right.

Gotta spray water into it and see what happens.

Yeah.

Oh, so, yeah, so I saw a video today.

You got to wonder if some of the times these things are real, but someone was, you know, had a video of, you know, his.

His wife was washing the car and she's got the door open as she's spraying the water into the car, and you're just like, please tell me that this is just someone, you know, like, doing it for.

Like she's opening the trunk and like spraying.

It's like, oh, no, please, no.

Yeah.

So.

So let me mention a couple of conferences.

First off, striving fraternity is going to be having a.

A conference.

Let's see.

Can I share?

There we go.

Let me add that to stage and make that.

I wonder if I could make that every.

Oh, you know how I could do.

I could do it like this.

There we go.

So at most my home church.

So if you are in the Levittown, Pennsylvania area that is just north of Philadelphia, one of our speakers, who is Aaron Brewster, he is regularly seen here on Thursday nights.

Comes in late.

He's been busy past couple weeks, but with.

With counseling and things.

But he is going to be doing a weekend seminar at my home church, Oxford Valley Chapel.

So that is going be to.

To be on September 12th to the 14th.

The.

The.

The title of it is what really Matters.

Living with purpose in a Broken world.

He is going to be covering topics of let's see if I can shrink this if it shows up better.

No, it still cuts off the bottom.

But he's going to talk about God and is.

Is there a purpose beyond ourselves?

He's going to talk.

Talk about the church and does community still matter?

Talk about the world and can one life really make a difference?

And then talk about the family.

How do we strengthen our relationships that matter most?

They'll be followed with a Q A.

And one of the nice things about that is he will be afterwards, after Q and A, he's going to make himself available for folks that want, since he is an ACBC counselor, he's going to make himself available for any discussion that people might need in that area.

Did we lose Drew?

Let's add Drew back in.

Oh, you're muted.

I had to, I had to get the baby monitor.

My wife slid it over my office.

How old's your baby?

This one is nine months.

Oh, so we've got a five year old, a three year old and a nine month old.

Yeah, don't.

Yeah, no.

Yeah, the five.

Well, the three year old is the one that's.

He's full throttle all the time.

Yep.

So let me also mention that same weekend, September 12th to the 14th, if you're not going to be in the Philadelphia area, if you're going to be in the Tullahoma, Tennessee area, is the.

The Roadmap to Revival.

Myself, James White, Keith Foskey, Jeffrey Rice, Michael Schultz, several others will be speaking at that conference and really going through.

I will be dealing with the issue of addressing the.

The what it is to the.

For faithfulness in ministers of the gospel.

So if you can make it out there, just go do a search for.

If you want to know about the conference, it's at my church.

Feel free to reach out to us@restriving fraternity.org or contact Oxford Valley Chapel.

If you want to find out about Roadmap to Revival.

Just do a search on Roadmap for Revival.

I'm sure you're going to find the conference at Jeffrey Rice's church that same weekend.

Matt, I think you got something coming up in North Carolina.

Yeah, Months from now I'm supposed to be in North Carolina.

Carolina that my wife's health holds to be able to go out there and speak at a conference on Islam.

August 15th, 16th, 17th.

It'll be north of Raleigh and Kannapolis and so Potato Peak Friday and, and Saturday and then a.

Guys, I got to arrange stuff but preach Sunday and then maybe preach Sunday and, and do something else Monday and go drive up to Winston Salem.

I'll see the radio station that I've been on on the network for a while and I'll check it out.

So.

Yep.

All right.

So with that next week we'll, like I said, we'll be talking post millennialism.

We'll see if Drew flips back to post millennialism after that one.

Yeah, probably not.

It's just copy pills for post mill.

It's just so funny because, you know, I told Josh that at least one of my co hosts would be happy, happy that he's, that he's going to come on and present post Mill and, and then I find out that you decided to flip.

You know, I've, I've never changed my end time view.

I'm still pro millennial.

If there's a millennium, I'm all for it.

Yeah, that's cute.

All right.

So Matt, thanks for coming in.

Always, always good to have you in.

Always good to, to glean from your wisdom and how you depress us with your view of end times.

So we, we didn't get to see Tom.

Maybe one of these times Tom will come in and, and stay in.

He just came in for a little.

Bit there, but he was there and he was gone.

And then he was gone.

So folks, let us know how the, the, how you, from a viewing perspective, how did this new tool work?

Because we're thinking of switching from Streamyard to EV Mux.

And if this worked well, then I think we're going to try to make that switch starting next week.

So do let us know and we would appreciate that.

Check out carm.org check out striving for eternity.org and remember to strive to make today an eternal day for the glory of God.

And we'll see you next week.

See you.