This is More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self worth

is made up of more than your job title.

Each week, I'll talk to a guest about how they discovered that for themselves.

You'll hear about what they did, what they're doing and who they are.

I'm your host, Rabiah.

I work in IT, perform standup comedy, write, volunteer, and of course podcast.

Thank you for listening.

Hey everyone, this episode's a quick one, actually it's about 30 minutes

long other than whatever I do right now, which could add time to it of course.

And I don't know if people know, but I do have the podcast on YouTube and

the very front, this part, is recorded with video so if you ever want to see

my facial expressions, you can do that.

Um, this episode's really fun.

I I've said many, many times that service is a really important part of my life

and it's something I want to do more of.

And it's why I'm in a grad certificate program right now.

And so this guest actually worked in government, worked in the

Obama administration for a little while as an intern and on a

fellowship, which is just so cool.

And I found out, uh, during the podcast that he had this initiative

around tech, which I didn't know.

Which just, I don't know.

It's, it's amazing.

And so I am just really excited about that and was really excited to, um, learn more

about what had been going on during that time, you know, during the administration.

And I'm looking up actually the name right now, Beth Noveck is

someone that was part of that.

And then she founded, um, another organization, The Gov Lab.

And so she's not who I'm interviewing but she comes up in this and I got

really excited learning about her.

So my guests founded a basically tech company that also has a social purpose.

I'm very intrigued by companies that do align themselves with a social purpose.

And I've talked to some people this season already and will

continue to, who are doing that.

This is the start of Earth Month, or this month is April.

So one reason I put this episode on this week is to kick our Earth Month

off because this company is doing things that will benefit the environment.

I'm trying really hard not to say everything about my guests and

what they do and their name and everything before we get into episode.

So I'm being a little bit vague here, but the reason this episode is now

is because of Earth month and I'll have a couple more guests that have

eco-friendly kind of ideas or themes with them as well throughout this month.

And, uh, thanks everyone who listened to the Women's History Month episodes.

That was really fun to be able to do some things around things.

If you have guests ideas, of course, let me know.

And I'd love to hear from you.

I'd also love to hear what people think.

I don't ever hear back really, except for a few friends but if

anyone who doesn't know me wants to reach out to me, that'd be amazing.

I'd love to hear from you.

This week, I mean, there's another thing to be mad about this.

Louis CK winning the Grammy.

I don't know.

I just, I think I can't talk too much about it on here just cause my podcast

doesn't really get into vulgarity and really everything about him is

just incredibly vulgar at this point.

And he's someone, I was a really big fan of and I still love some of his bits.

I still love some of his comedy, but I know that he talks in the special

he won for, as far as I understand, he talks about the assaults he did.

And I know some people don't think what he did was assault, but I don't

know, put yourself in that situation.

You wouldn't feel super great.

You would feel pretty much like you'd been insulted.

Um, well, I, it sounded like you said, insulted it'd be assaulted or insulted,

but anyway, I just think that, you know, as a woman who has been in situations

that are very scary before and as a female comic who's also been in situations,

they don't happen to us on the stage.

They don't happen to us in the view of everyone.

They happen in messages.

They happen in Zoom chats.

A few of us doing Zoom comedy had people say really interesting and wild things to

us that were pretty scary in Zoom chats.

They happen on Twitter in DMs and they happen on walks home.

And so I just, I don't know.

I just don't understand how everyone was so loud about Chris Rock.

And now they're so quiet about Louie CK.

And it just shows me that still there's a lot of work to be done.

That work won't be done on this episode of the podcast, but I just had to

say something because I don't have many platforms by which to speak.

And so I hope people don't mind this.

And I hope if you do, you skipped it, but listen to my guest.

Welcome to Earth Month.

Have a great week.

Everyone stay safe and stay healthy.

And here we go.

So you guys, this week, my guest is Manik Suri.

He's the founder and CEO of Therma, and we're going to learn what

Therma is and also how he got there.

So thanks for being a guest

Rabiah, it's great to be on.

Thanks for having me.

And where am I talking to you from, right now?

Yeah, I'm c alling in from sunny San Francisco which is

home for me and for our company.

Nice.

Nice.

And so it's sunny there today.

It is.

We joke, it's LA weather today.

It's one of those rare sunny days, but we're loving it uh after,

you know, a lot of fog and we'll take every sunny day we can get.

Yeah, I'm sure I'm in London, I've mentioned to you

and we had two days of sun this weekend and so I totally get.

it.

I spent a little bit of time in London.

I did a Master's in Cambridge and I remember, well.

Many things that I loved about it, one of the best years ever.

But, but the joke is always about the weather.

yeah.

Oh yeah.

And Cambridge is, I think even ranier than here.

So, yeah.

So let's actually, we can start there too.

Let's just talk about what you studied and where you went to school and kind of how

you started out cause you didn't start out in kind of the area that you're in now.

Absolutely.

You know, the life is a kind of a twisting and turning path.

The journey takes you in lots of directions that are hard to anticipate.

In college and grad school, I was studying political science

and international relations.

So I went to Harvard for undergrad and did a master's at Cambridge.

I studied government political science and undergrad, and then

international relations in m y master's program and ended up going

to law school thinking I was going to go into government and policy.

That was you know, that was the original plan.

And ended up now a kind of recovering attorney working in

tech, building climate solutions.

Yeah, And did you do any training in tech itself, like as

far as formal education or that was all more the policy kind of stuff?

Yeah, I had never trained in engineering or engineering sciences.

I, I studied political theory and finance is how I kind of started my career.

So I went from uh school to a big investment firm called DE Shaw where

I kind of learned finance on the job.

And then went back to law school, did a brief stint in government doing an

internship and then fellowship as a junior person on the economic policy

team in the first Obama administration.

And then ended up in tech.

I met someone who was a former lawyer, herself and the deputy CTO of the

U S and she had gone to Harvard 10 years before me and was working at the

intersection of tech, law, and government and convinced me that there were

opportunities to build tech for good.

And that's how I ended up moving into a the tech.

That's awesome.

And I, I like how you were able to identify what you kind of didn't

want to do, I guess, and just kind of find something that you did.

So when you go from the investment firm and then did you go into government

after that just thinking that that's kind of where you want it to be

ultimately, like when you're working for the Obama administration or did

you just kind of fall into that?

Like how does someone go into that kind of job?

Yeah, well, so I decided to go to law school

after deferring for many years.

I'd applied to law school while I was in college.

And I'd differed year after year because I'd gotten this this gig at DE Shaw and

I was enjoying myself and learning a lot.

But I decided to go back to law school because I really wanted to get

closer to policy and and politics.

And I applied for an internship while in law school, on the economic policy team

at the first Obama administration's NEC, and that's how I ended up getting the

opportunity was through an internship.

And then they extended it to a term time fellowship.

I got to work doing regulatory and economic policy.

And I almost went back to a, to a full-time role.

I had originally thought after law school, I would apply for a policy

job, but life had other plans.

I met his colleague Beth Noveck, in 2011 and she was writing and talking

about themes around civic technology, bringing data science and network

tools to, to bear on problems that affect all of us beyond what technology

was doing, which is largely around social life and commercial life.

And so she had this thesis that, Hey, we can build and deploy these

technologies for improving government and law, two of the largest and most

important sectors of the economy that are kind of still run like it's 1950.

So I got really inspired by her and said, Hey, that makes a lot of sense.

Why don't I join you Beth and we started a center together at NYU where

she teaches called The Governance Lab.

And I helped her get the center off the ground and then left to

start a company in the space.

And that's how I became a tech entrepreneur

. Rabiah (Host): Oh, amazing.

Yeah.

So that, that is really cool because I think even, I mean, if you just kind of

fast forward to the last year or so, and look at the role technology has played

in government, just most recently, I'd say that I'm aware of in the States

is the whole distribution of the COVID home test, the rapid home tests, right?

And how different that looked say then if you look at 10 or so years

before, I guess when people were trying to sign up for Obamacare, right?

And the site crashes and everything, and just like the technology difference in how

maybe the acumen of the government is now.

What have you seen change in the tech slash government

space along along those lines?

Yeah.

I mean, I think there's a lot to unpack and it's a space I spent a number of

years in so I care a lot about bringing better tools into the public sector and

helping folks in the public sector do more with, with modern technology stacks.

I think one of the challenges has historically been that

without the opportunity for massive growth and massive scale,

a lot of entrepreneurs, a lot of venture capital investors won't

consider deploying or building solutions for the public sector.

And without seeing that hockey stick potential they tend to focus

on problems where they can generate that kind of return or believe that

that kind of scale is possible.

I do think that's changing.

I think governments are getting more thoughtful about and

more effective at procurement.

Buying technology and deploying it at scale.

I think they're getting better at structuring the process of innovation

using a combination of public-private partnerships, offices, and teams dedicated

to bringing innovators into government to understand the problems and the

workflow so they can build better tools.

Those innovations and those improvements are making it easier to scale

technology in the public sector.

And I think that is making it more appealing for an entrepreneur or an

investor to think about investing in the space or spending time

building for the public sector?

Still a very challenging environment because government

is not a monolithic entity.

There's federal government, state governments, local and municipal entities.

And then of course you know, the ways in which technology gets built

and scaled across those different you know, types of government agencies,

it can be really challenging.

But I I'm very excited whenever I see a gov tech or civic

tech company get started.

And I have a lot of friends in that space so I think it's, it's definitely

moving in the right direction.

That's that's just really cool.

So can you talk a little bit about The Governance Lab that you guys

founded and kind of, was there any project that excited you most when

you were there or one of the first things you worked on thinking back?

Absolutely.

I mean, many things about The Gov Lab were inspiring and exciting.

Lots of really interesting problems and ways of thinking about those problems.

I think one of the early examples of a project that we got invited to

help with was the, the UN development program UNDP was helping the government

of, and the civil society in Libya,

rewrite their constitution and figure out ways to improve and make

the constitutional drafting and amending process more inclusive.

And so we were asked to help the the UNDP team design a crowd sourced constitutional

amendment drafting platform.

A way to generate inputs, notice and comment remarks, feedback

on various legislative changes.

Super interesting and super compelling problem.

One of those multifaceted political theory meets technology meets

inclusion and social transformation.

This was in the wake of the fall of the Gadaffi government as they

were trying to rebuild Libyan civil society and make it more responsive.

So that was that was an example of a project I found really intellectually

fascinating and, and gratifying.

That's great.

And yeah, you wouldn't even think about that rewriting constitution

could have a technology element with it.

That's where I think a lot of technology can be an enabling

force in these you know, many different areas of workflow that need help

or that need to be overhauled it.

Technology can kind of operate in the background and make things

more inclusive, more effective.

So.

now you're at Therma which is a company you co-founded.

How did you decide to go from public sector and service to private sector?

Yeah, it was very intentional.

I felt this kind of competing impulse between staying in the public

sector and working on policy and moving back into the private sector.

I think what what really inspired me to get started as an entrepreneur and

to really dive in was the possibility of combining building a company and

scaling solutions and products while also creating positive social value.

And I felt after working at The Gov Lab with Beth and her team, that it

would be very hard to scale technology products and technology solutions

in the public sector alone or in the nonprofit sector as we were in.

Without incentives, without the ability to create a lot of scale and impact.

It's very hard to recruit the best talent.

So we had to get engineers and designers and product leaders

to work on these problems.

And so we felt that if we could start a company and create.

The structure that would enable a scaling and high growth model, but

we can make sure that the products and solutions we built and worked on had a

pro-social element to them, and really had that impact that that was a way to,

to build, you know a organization that could scale, could attract the best

talent while also doing something good.

And so it was very intentional when we left The Gov Lab to start uh CoInspect.

CoInspect was the precursor to Therma and it was it is a product that's focused

on compliance and safety improvement.

We started CoInspect very intentionally as a for-profit solution to try

and improve broken workflow around regulation and compliance, you know,

public public sector and private sector workflows that we thought we

could build better technology for.

We happened to end up in the food supply chain, just because of the timing.

Chipotle had a food safety crisis and a bunch of restaurant businesses and food

manufacturers were looking for better tools around safety and compliance.

And so we started scaling CoInspect in the food supply chain between 2016 and 2019.

Got to about 5,000 locations using the tool and that's when

we discovered this even bigger opportunity around refrigeration.

And that's how Thermo was born and happy to go into that, you know,

you know, go deeper around that.

Yeah.

. So do you consider yourself, I've had people on who talk about conscious

capitalism, but I've learned that the definition of that was a little

bit different than it sounded.

So do you consider yourself in that realm or in a different kind of realm of

social responsibility with your company?

Yeah.

I mean, I I've never used the phrase conscious capitalism

though I do think we're trying to build a high-impact company and

a positive social impact company.

I've used the phrase and thought about the phrase, social

entrepreneurship, a lot more Rabiah.

And so I think that we're trying to build a for-profit business that has

a lot of scaling potential, but the goal is that the technology and the

products that we build need to and must have a positive social impact.

And I think the space we're in, which is sustainability.

And taking on the climate crisis by trying to improve efficiency in

the built environment, I think that has the potential to have

high social impact if it scales.

That's what I love about the space we work in.

I think it is one of those areas of the world where you can

improve profitability and advance sustainability at the same time.

Cool.

Yeah.

And so let's talk about what Therma does and how it's related

to the environmental impact.

Absolutely.

We're, we're very excited about the space we work in, which is refrigeration.

We're building a smart refrigeration platform or a clean cooling company,

trying to take a waste out of the refrigeration supply chain

or the cold chain as it's called.

Now, most people think about refrigeration.

They think, well, it's been around forever.

It works.

Why do I have to worry about it?

And it turns out that there's a lot of refrigeration in the world, but it's

actually very inefficient and has not just a lot of waste and, and, and spoilage

and, and over-consumption of resources, but also causes a lot of emmissions.

And that's really what we're trying to work on, which is using technology

in particular, IOT, sensors, data analytics, and a better workflow to

reduce food waste, energy waste, and refrigerant leakage, all three of

which are big drivers of warming.

And we're doing that in ways that try and improve the cold chain to help humans out.

Cold chain is important for humans because it provides access to fruits

and vegetables and proteins and dairy and more and more fresh and local

ingredients, but it also allows access to drugs and vaccines and blood and plasma.

And so we need a lot of refrigeration and it's growing because a lot of

the developing world wants more refrigeration, but we have to build

that and scale that in ways that don't cause the kind of emissions

that the current cold chain does.

Well, yeah, in speaking of the vaccines, I mean, we were still

in this COVID-19 pandemic and we learned a lot about vaccines and the fact that

like the mRNA ones, I think, have to be at cold, cold temperatures and have to be

really monitored or regulated and stuff.

And I've worked in pharmaceuticals before too, and there's a lot of different

products or drugs that need to be kept at different temperatures that

people probably aren't even aware of.

And so can you talk about maybe a workflow or something that could illustrate, how

Therma is playing a role in, in that?

Yeah, absolutely.

So our, our product and our platform consists of sensors that can be dropped

into and placed into refrigeration.

And these sensors are wireless and continuously sending signal around the

temperature and humidity inside the environment that allows us to reliably

ensure that the products are being kept within safe and high quality zones.

And so that's really the core offering, which is continuous monitoring, alert

and alarm platform that lets you ensure no product gets spoiled or wasted.

In addition to the sensors, we have a workflow app, a mobile application

that you can use to create and manage set points to ensure alarms

and alerts are set up correctly.

The right team members get notified at the right time and then a dashboard where

you can see reporting and ensure that all of your locations and all of your assets

are kept safe and track any issues from a compliance standpoint that might occur.

And so we, we have deployed this across you know, at this point I

think over a thousand customers.

So we're growing the business and, and have, you know, close to 10,000

sensors in the world doing a whole bunch of quality and safety improvement.

And we work across the supply chain primarily in food, but we do have

some deployments in healthcare.

So we have uh, customers, warehouses and distribution centers to supermarkets

and convenience stores, restaurants, cafeterias, hotels, amusement parks.

You name it.

There's there's perishable product everywhere.

And we, we often talk about how there are 90 million

refrigerators in the business world.

Not even counting the 1.4 billion in the residential world, just 90 million

business refrigerators, almost none of which are monitored today or optimized.

So we're working on that 90 million today.

That's amazing.

And did you guys develop both the hardware and the software, or how did you guys come

to like pulling your products together?

Yeah, we, we started working on Therma in the fall of 2019.

We were watching users using our CoInspect product, the first product

we built and they were checking all these things in their locations

around compliance and safety, many different end points had to be checked.

And what we noticed when we were watching users closely was that

they kept checking temperatures.

That was a big part of compliance and safety.

And my colleague, Andrew Hager.

Who's now our CTO looked up at me at one point and Andrew said, you

know, I don't know if a mobile app is the best way to solve this.

A mobile app still requires people to put the temperatures in manually, even

though you know, it's better than a paper clipboard it still ultimately

requires a lot of manual workflow.

And so, he and I discussed that problem and said, well,

what if we could automate it?

What if we use automation instead of a mobile workflow?

And we ended up looking into and discovering that there was a new way to

get signal for refrigeration reliably using long range radio, which is much more

reliable than the previous technologies, which are wifi and Bluetooth based.

And that's really how Therma was born.

Therma is short for temperature, humidity, energy, remote, monitoring, application.

And so we started using LoRa long range radios uh, sensor.

We develop the software and the platform that integrates hardware and software.

So we started by originally building hardware and software, and now we focus

on software and analytics where we think there's a lot more value longterm.

And we use uh, partners on the hardware side to scale.

Cool.

That's awesome.

And just to figure out the new technology and also just I think.

well, I mean, depends on who's listening, but there's at least probably one other

business process person that's interested in that aspect of things, but really

about creating efficiencies where there aren't, because a lot of times in a lot

of businesses they're just inefficiencies

and so it's exciting to hear about your product and just, the problem

it's trying to solve is one that's really going to continue to be one.

, well done on that, identifying that kind of problem.

Cause that's hard to do.

Um, So as far as the humidity, cause you've mentioned that a couple

of times, does the humidity help indicate when there's leakage in the

refrigeration or what's the humidity measure do just out of curiosity?

Yeah, well, a lot of products have a humidity sensitivity to them.

So certain products like chocolates and cheeses require humidity

monitoring in addition to temperature monitoring, to ensure safety

and quality doesn't have issues.

And so we have uh, we also use the humidity to sometimes

track equipment issues.

So it can be valuable from a direct standpoint in terms of the products

that are stored and also indirectly to help us with our equipment

downtime prevention approach.

And we, we also focus on that, trying to make sure that refrigeration assets

don't go down and prevent last minute, last mile failures and, and loss.

Yeah.

Okay.

So for you, are you enjoying the entrepreneurship now and, and owning

a company and, product in this way versus what you were doing, where you

were really I think working for other people on their their needs and ideas?

Absolutely.

I'm loving it.

It's, it's a, it's a blast to be an entrepreneur.

It's definitely hard.

I've never had a, a role that was as emotionally challenging or you know, or,

or kind of volatile, I guess, you know, the, the kind of fluctuations in the

highs and lows can be really significant.

You have days where you think, oh, my gosh, I'm on top of the world

where everything is working great.

And then other days where it feels like everything is breaking,

what am I doing with my life?

And everything in between.

So it's, it's very much a a rollercoaster as many

people have called startups.

But I do love the freedom to build and to scale in directions that.

Like they resonate with my values and my goals.

And I love that a Therma has brought together a team

we're close to 70 people now.

I love that we brought together a team that is very mission

driven and very impact oriented.

I think that's one of the themes in our team.

You'll see people really care about the future of food and the

future of the planet about improving health and improving access to high

quality product, but also doing it in ways that protect the planet.

Awesome.

And do you guys have a way that you've found that you really anchor

yourself in that mission or in your values that's worked well?

I mean, you're still a really new company, so it's like critical time, but a good

time to establish stuff versus if you went into another company and did that.

So is there anything that has worked for you that you want to share?

I think it's a really hard thing to do, Rabiah, especially

in a remote first environment.

It's hard enough to build culture in a pre COVID era where people were seeing each

other every day and talking regularly.

And we've been taking a more and more of a kind of intentional active

approach as we've gotten bigger.

You know, when you're three people or five people, it's easier to set culture

and to maintain alignment because everyone's talking every day continuously.

I think you know, now we're in, in, in kind of a slightly new

phase, both growing the team, but also working primarily remote.

So we've done things recently around quarterly offsite onsites

where we bring the team together.

We go through a series of workshops.

Those workshops cover different topics that are generated by the team.

And, in the process of doing that kind of bottoms up workshopping we've unpacked

themes around recruiting and talent acquisition, around sustainability

and walking the walk, and around vision and creating transparency

and ensuring everyone understands.

Some of those I think ideas that have come from workshops have really

improved from a leadership standpoint, how we maintain alignment, what we do.

It's changed our policies.

It's changed our approach to sharing information internally, how we hire.

Lots of things have been affected by that in a good way.

And I think that that creating the space where the team feels they can

share feedback and make suggestions has really helped with building the culture.

I also think it's just great to get people together in person every

so often, if you can safely, and there's no substitute for that.

I agree and I I've been remote myself for five years and the

company I work for has always been remote, but we would gather once a year.

And of course we can do that last two years.

And so now it's, it's definitely been felt, you know what I mean?

And, and we're going to get together this year, we think,

but you're absolutely right,

it's hard to maintain those things and you do have to be intentional.

So that's great that you guys kind of, you guys have figured that out.

You were first in public policy in the public space, which I know

it can be hard on people because you're doing such important work.

It's hard to separate yourself for it.

And now you're doing your company, but similar situation now you're responsible

for a lot of these employees and stuff.

So how, what do you do outside of that to kind of maintain balance for yourself?

Well, I mean, I, I definitely feel that tension as an entrepreneur.

I think it's really hard when you're building something from the

ground up to not feel like there's always more work than there is time.

So that feeling of "oh my gosh, there's so much to do," has always been hard.

I think you know, for me in, in my past work as working in policy and finance,

but also as an entrepreneur, as a different kind of personal significance

that said I've been thrilled this past year to start spending a lot more time at

home because I have an eight month old.

So that's been one of

the things that's consuming more and more of my time on nights

and weekends and early mornings.

I would say before our daughter Aria was born, my wife and I, we've been together

for a long time for over 20 years.

We met in college as freshmen so we've been really fortunate

to kind of grow up together.

And so we, we always I think enjoyed similar activities.

Pre pandemic.

We would do a lot of travel.

We really enjoyed meeting up with friends and, and kind of visiting them

in different parts of the country.

More recently it's been local hikes and walks and we, we have a dog we got in

early 2020, that's been keeping us active.

Espresso.

So I think it's really the small stuff these days, Rabiah.

it's the, it's the morning mat time with the baby or the evening walk

in the park, but definitely keeps it safe and a good excuse to turn off.

Nice.

Well, congratulations.

I mean a little late, but yeah, that's, that's awesome.

Yeah.

So like new puppy then new kid, I guess you could try kitten next if

you want another baby around, but.

I think we're . we're hold off on any more dependent creatures

for a little while, thank you.

That's a good idea.

All right.

So do you have any advice or mantra that you like to share or just something that

was bestowed upon you that you think is just generally good for people to kind

of think about in their day-to-day?

My dad always said, and still says to me you know,

always believe in yourself.

I admire that simplicity and the kind of the wisdom that, that encapsulates.

It's not easy to do.

And I've struggled many times with the fear of failure or with the thought that

it's not working out and a desire to quit or to, to abandon what I'm doing.

I really admire that advice.

And I look up to my dad a lot so that's one thing that stayed with me, kind of

just, you know, truly believe in yourself.

Whatever it is that you think.

The world needs or that you want to do to show up really

have confidence have conviction.

And, and that's something I'm trying to do every single day.

And I think as a daily, it's a daily mantra for that reason.

Nice.

That's good.

And that's nice dad advice too.

I mean that you got it from him.

The next set of questions is just called the Fun Five and it's just

kind of some things I like to, I think are interesting to know about people.

So we'll start with what's the oldest t-shirt you have and still wear?

I have a a t-shirt that I got in india when I had gone in 2005 with

some friends after college for a visit.

It was in a small hill station in the mountains called Dharamsala and it

was a t-shirt with The, the Hindu God Ganesha on it, which I really love.

It's one of those kinds of spawn t-shirts that, you know, simple but powerful.

Ganesha is the remover of obstacles in, in kind of shorthand.

That's what he's known for.

And, if you're off the Hindu faith, we look up to him as someone who helps

enable and make possible our dreams.

And so I, I love that shirt.

It's also super comfy and reminds me of a great time in my life.

But yeah, that's probably the oldest shirt I still have.

Oh, that's really cool.

All right.

And It felt like it was Groundhog's Day for awhile, like in the

movie cause we'd just get up and did the same thing every day.

If it really was Groundhog's Day, what song would you have play on

your alarm clock every morning?

I found this song just another Manic Monday had come out when I was a

kid and it became a joke because people would sometimes pronounce my name "manic",

but you know, because it's "mon-ic" and that song had come out, it was

just, it kind of took over for a while.

Uh, But I, I'm a kind of high energy person.

I love the start of the week and getting going.

So I think I liked that it's kind of got a peppy, like, let's go,

let's go just another Manic Monday.

And sometimes I feel like that, you know, living and working

from home amidst a pandemic.

It's like, what day of the week is it, you know?

Hard to remember.

I know I've gotten more than one text from friends just saying.

Like have a good weekend.

And I'm like, okay.

But we saw Friday and they're like, oh, come man.

The disappointment, even through texts, you can tell is there.

So I know

Yes.

that.

All right.

Coffee or tea or neither?

Absolutely coffee.

I I kind of joked that I'm addicted, but having a newborn will

definitely increase that addiction.

If you're not already.

I love any coffee.

Love to make it in many different ways.

I think we've got a French press and a pour over and a

traditional machine in the house.

So, I'm very much coffee drinker.

Well and you named your dog Espresso so that just,

That's a pretty much tell everyone

yeah.

itself.

Yeah, tipped me off.

Cool.

All right.

So can you think of something that just makes you laugh so hard you

cry or just crack up when you think of it or something that happened

recently that, that did that?

I was on, yeah, I was watching my daughter try out this

new You know, kind of toy slash piece of equipment called the

Jolly Jumper which my wife found.

My wife has a habit of finding these like amazing baby products going down

various websites and they show up at the house at an Amazon package.

And we're like, what is this thing?

But this product has been around for apparently like close to a

hundred years since like the 1930s.

And it's still the same way.

It's like, stand and you can put an infant in it and strap them in and they

can kind of get the feeling of jumping up and down, but they're well-protected

and they can kind of stand on their tippy toes and she's turned eight months today

and she started using it on Saturday.

And was.

I've never seen a jollier look on her face.

And I was just laughing to myself.

Like she is literally jumping up and down with a jolly expression.

This is like the best named product.

Probably the best product I've seen for what it does.

It's like, no wonder they're out for a hundred years.

It was great.

I was cracking up.

Yeah.

Yeah, I know it's when you're talking about.

It's so simple.

so simple.

just, yeah, they just, I mean, actually, probably

be fun for adults too really,

I think so.

I think so if only I were that nimble.

Yeah,

Exactly.

Yeah oh, cool.

And who inspires you right now?

it's a really hard you know, it's hard to name just one person.

There's so many people I look up to in the world.

I I definitely feel inspired by, I think I said it earlier, but

I feel inspired by my dad a lot.

There's a quote or a saying, "the older I get the wiser, my dad becomes."

Which is kind of like a, you know, there's a certain time when lessons

and insights make more and more sense.

And I think he used to say a lot of stuff to me when I was a kid

that I would just roll my eyes at and as I've become a dad myself.

And it was our first baby.

And as I kind of think about many of his encouragements and advice I, I reflect

on how grounded and how thoughtful and how caring he was and has been.

So yeah, I'd say he's someone who inspires me every day tries to, you know,

it makes me want to be a better dad.

Awesome.

Yeah, so that's, that's great.

All right.

Well, Manik, thanks so much.

I really appreciate you doing this.

So, if people want to find you or learn more about Therma, where should they go?

Absolutely.

We'd love to connect.

If you're interested in learning more about the company getting involved or

exploring partnerships, our website is hello therma dot com (hellotherma.com).

That's hello therma dot com (hellotherma.com).

Or you can reach out to me directly.

It's Manik, M A N I K at hello therma dot com (manik @ hellotherma (dot).

And we're also on social on LinkedIn and Twitter at hello therma (@hellotherma).

We'd love to hear from you.

We have a dozen open roles.

They're largely remote and we're also raising capital and building partnerships.

So please reach out.

Amazing.

Well, that'll all be in the show notes and I really appreciate your time

and it's been great to talk to you.

Pleasure.

This was fun!

Thanks for listening.

You can learn more about the guests and what was talked about in the show notes.

Joe Maffia created the music you're listening to.

You can find him on Spotify at Joe M A F F I A.

Rob Metke does all the design for which we are so grateful.

You can find him online by searching Rob M E T K E.

Please leave review if you'd like to show and get in touch if you

have feedback or guest ideas.

The pod is on all the social channels at at more than work pod

(@morethanworkpod) or at Rabiah Comedy (@rabiahcomedy) on TikTok.

And the website is more than work pod dot com (morethanworkpod.com).

While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to yourself.