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On this episode of the Dudes and Dads podcast, we talk about caring for your kid that marches

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to a beat of a different drummer.

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You're listening to the Dudes and Dads podcast, a show dedicated to helping men be better

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dudes and dads by building community through meaningful conversation and storytelling.

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And now, here are your hosts, Joel DeMotta and Andy Layton.

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Joel!

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We are not in studio together.

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Andy.

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We are not in studio together today.

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No.

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No.

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And we're recording in the morning, which, you know, that's...

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It's odd.

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It is odd.

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It's really odd.

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But I'm glad to be here.

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And there's nobody that I'd rather start my day with, minus my wife.

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Nobody I'd rather start my day with than you, Andrew, and our lovely...

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Starbucks.

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Queen.

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Hello, listeners.

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And the Starbucks queen.

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Yeah, queen.

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There.

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Yes, you're drinking Starbucks bright and early this morning.

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And we're recording because we...

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We were gonna record and then we realized it's Father's Day and it's probably not good

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if we take the fathers out of Father's Day.

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And so...

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That would be something where it's like, "Happy Father's Day to me.

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I'm leaving to go record."

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Granted, we record in the evening most of the time, so that's probably okay.

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But I didn't want to risk it.

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And I'm getting together with my dad and so I wanted to not feel rushed.

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Not feel rushed.

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So yeah.

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Yeah.

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So yeah.

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But you were like, "Hey, we can do this recording, but I'm gonna be in a random hotel in Toledo."

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And so...

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And that's where I am.

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Yes.

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Yes.

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And I should say when we initially booked this hotel, we just thought...

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Jackie thought it was gonna be...

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And I flew in from... it was at a work conference, so I flew in from Dallas to Indy, then drove

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from Indy up to here.

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And initially when she booked this hotel, she thought it was just gonna be myself, her,

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and Aaron, and Josiah and Molly are also along with us.

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So the hotel accommodations, the room that we got, let's just say we've got people near

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mattresses jammed all over the place.

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When I left the room this morning, it's a miracle I didn't step on anybody.

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I got on there safe and sound, but it was close.

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Gotcha.

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Gotcha.

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But good.

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So glad we could hang out today and have this discussion.

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We'll see how it goes.

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Yeah.

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So we're doing this...

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We've done it one or two other times where we've done this show remotely where you're

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on a work trip or something.

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So this will be interesting.

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But so yeah, here we go.

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But before we get started, I wanted to let you know that support for this episode comes

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from Everence Financial, helping individuals and organizations combine faith and finances

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through retirement planning, banking and other financial services.

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More at Everence.com/michiana.

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Securities offered through Concourse Financial Group Securities Incorporated.

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Member FINRA, SIPC.

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Thank you, Everence.

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Appreciate you all.

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Yes.

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So Joel, beating to your beat, marching to your beat of your own drum.

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What are we talking about here?

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Yeah.

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You know, so Andy, I think anytime that we talk about our kids and we recognize that

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every single one of our kids are, you know, they've got each of them have their own interests.

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They're uniquely different in so many ways.

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They are, to quote a mentor of mine, they are unique, unrepeatable miracles of God in

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their own in their own way.

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And and that's a really beautiful thing.

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If all my kids were the exact same, that'd probably be pretty boring.

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Yes.

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But we recognize that.

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Yeah.

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Right.

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And we don't do boring, Andy.

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We just don't.

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That's not that's not how we roll in our families, for sure.

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But I think about when and this can happen in different stages and probably for different

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kids.

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But I think about maybe the one kid, the kid that we have that has maybe some unique challenges

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in life or it could be a set of unique challenges or it could be a set of unique interests that

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lie outside of what other kids have.

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Or as we said, they just they have you have that sense of they are marching to the beat

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of a different drummer for any number of reasons.

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You know, and then how we how we approach that, how we think about that, how we how

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we care for them and encourage them when when that happens for us in this season of life.

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Our second son, Josiah, who's 13.

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That's sort of been that's sort of been the sense that we have.

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He's just has different interests.

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You know, we're we're open about and, you know, and talking about kind of some of the

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challenges that we've had with with his ADHD and, you know, everything from kind of classroom

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learning and how that's different to how he relates to other kids his age.

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And then also just how kind of in conjunction with that, but also separate from it, like

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what his what his interests are, what he's what he's into.

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And I think that we just continue, especially as an adolescent boy, as a 13 year old.

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I mean, the end, you know, better than I do, like what the realities are today may not

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be the realities next month or or a few months from now.

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I could just in terms of what what the needs are or how to interact with them.

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But you know, there's just not a one size fits all approach.

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And yet I don't know, sometimes I feel like if I'm if I'm honest, I feel like I personally

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in my own experience more immediately relate to how to interact with some some of my kids

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better than than others, not that I love them any less.

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But it's like, sometimes I just go, I don't, I don't know what's helpful right now.

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I don't know what is this feels off the beaten path for me or outside of my area of parental

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experience, you know, whatever, whatever that might be.

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So I think that's just the laying kind of groundwork, like the general the general conversation

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of what do you do with that kid that is just a little bit different and different in a

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really great way, different, really beautiful way.

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But the one that kind of makes you like, scratch your head a little a little bit and it mostly

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because it because they are it could be this, they're either very much like us, this might

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be for some parents, that kid might be so much like us that we're like, we kind of we,

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it causes us to stop and think for a second.

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Or they're, they're, they're so different that it's the other that's the other challenge

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on the other side.

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I think I think just even that that's a challenge.

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I think for me sometimes is like, you're always inevitably going to have somebody that's like

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you that has the same interest and likes and you and that works well, I think because you

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have the same likes, but a lot of times you end up butting heads on on some of the issues.

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Right.

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And that's not necessarily a bad thing.

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But like, I think even in like, in my case, for us, I think Micah and I are a lot of same.

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And then always ends up in fights like for me and him.

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Because because we are a lot the same.

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And and we're, you know, we, we see eye to eye on things, but we're also driving into

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their nuts a lot of times.

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Right.

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I mean, it goes both ways.

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So yeah, it's tough.

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And I would I would imagine like in that case, especially as he is entering into I mean,

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he's, you know, knocking on the door of the young adulthood journey, and he's got a year

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of high school left.

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And then you know, I mean, I'm sure I wonder about this, like, what conversations you and

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I will have a year from now with, you know, right in that next in that next season of

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life, particularly as you said this before, like,

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particularly as the role of your parenting relationship changes, we all hope and this

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will be our hope for everybody that when when your kid is about ready to whether it's college

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or vocational school or or into the workplace, you know, whatever it is after, you know,

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after high school, hopefully, relationships are maturing to more of a I'm there's a friendship

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of your parenting changes.

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Yeah.

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Oh, yeah.

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That's so so let's talk a little bit about about Josiah, or not necessarily Josiah, but

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just children in general that that are, you know, marching to their own drum.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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You had mentioned kind of having to try to do things differently or whatever.

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So what's that look like for you guys, as you and you and Jackie as a family?

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Yeah.

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So like, so we were advocacy for him and not in not in a not in a like, hey, you need to

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treat my kids special sort of way.

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But recognizing that, like his learning style is different.

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If I if I can be really honest with you, like, um, you know, as we have kids in public school,

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like his learning style does not routinely line up with regular class, like regular classroom

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experience.

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Sure.

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Yeah, that's like, that's a that's a thing.

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And yeah, and, and we've tried to, so we've tried to think about identifying areas of

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interest and then thinking about where he can be learning outside of typical classroom

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experience.

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So for us, we've been fortunate.

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My dad, when he retired last year, he opened up a machine shop, a CNC shop that, you know,

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Josiah has always had interest.

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This would just say, and Michael would overlap on this, like, interest in mechanical, like

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in mechanical things.

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And you know, that that sort of thing and, and building and designing and stuff like

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that.

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Josiah has spent way more time than any of my other kids with his grandfather in a machine

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shop.

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And we knew we, I have a specific one specific memory of that, like a few years ago, when

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we were my dad and I were like driving all over the Midwest to go pick up different machinery

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that he was buying at different auctions and stuff like this.

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And we got one, one particular, one particular machine that we got into his, into his shop.

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We were disassembling some of the, some of it needed to be cleaned, like needed to be

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cleaned.

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I mean, this stuff was used and was older and needed to be cleaned.

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And we were having, we were having a heck of a time, like two grown adults, this is

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stumbling this one part of this machine.

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Like like, how does this thing come off of here?

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And how do we get it back on once we have, once we have it off?

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And so we were like, well, we'll get back to this in a little bit.

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Josiah was cleaning some of this stuff up in the shop.

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My dad and I go to get another piece.

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We had to like crane this piece of machinery.

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And so it was like, it was, it was a slow and kind of precarious process.

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And meanwhile, Josiah is in the shop.

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And if we, we literally, we literally come back in an hour later, Josiah has not only

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disassembled, cleaned it out, but has reassembled nice by this time.

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And my dad and I just, I mean, we just stared at each other blankly.

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We're like, I don't know.

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I don't know.

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You know, and Josiah would have been, I mean, he would have been not even 12, maybe at that

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point.

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So, so then we'd be, I mean, that was just kind of another confirmation of like, okay,

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this, this kid sees things different.

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He approaches problems differently.

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He has a problem solver and that, and that sort of way.

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And this might be the kind of environment where he really gets to, to see some success

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that he, he gets to kind of find himself and understand himself a little bit better.

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And, and here's the, here's the part.

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He also gets to make some money at it.

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So you know, so he's, you know, my dad is for, for jobs and tasks that have been there

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at the shop.

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You know, he'll come back home after a few days with a little few more dollars in his

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hand.

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And the, the problem is, is that Josiah now is, is a far more successful businessman than

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any of the rest of my children at this point.

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So his piggy bank has grown.

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So, so I think, you know, we were fortunate, right?

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Like we had someone in family that had some similar interests and so we've kind of, we've

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outsourced it, outsourced it a little bit that, you know, grandpa has become which grandparents

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are great.

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And I hope for everybody, like if you've got a grandparent that is in close proximity I

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don't know for Andy and you and I, like for both of our families, that has been, it's

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a high value, right?

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Like grandparents in the life is, is a big deal.

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We've made even some pretty significant life choices based upon being in proximity to grandparents

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and having those, having those relationships.

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But yeah, we were, we were fortunate, like we had somebody in our, in our family that

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could provide a classroom, a learning opportunity that was non-traditional, non-traditional,

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non-traditional, right.

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And it was different and where you could go now, Josiah this summer has flat out asked

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apart from some, you know, he's got a football camp and there's a few other things with scouts

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00:15:18,660 --> 00:15:19,660
and stuff like that.

240
00:15:19,660 --> 00:15:26,200
But apart from that has asked, can I go spend, can I go live at grandpa and grandma's house

241
00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:28,680
for a week here and a week there?

242
00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:30,680
And it said, okay.

243
00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:33,920
And you know, it's kind of caused Jackie and I to pause a little bit.

244
00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:42,080
Like that's him kind of being away from our family for several days at a time.

245
00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,620
Is that, is that good?

246
00:15:44,620 --> 00:15:45,620
Is that okay?

247
00:15:45,620 --> 00:15:47,320
Like how, how do you do that as parents?

248
00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:48,400
Like, I guess, okay.

249
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,160
So what, what is your decision on that?

250
00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:51,920
Like, have you guys made a decision?

251
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:52,920
Yeah.

252
00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:58,600
So yeah, so he's got some other, he's got like a football camp coming up in a little

253
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:02,920
bit and I think some scout outings and things that we want to do.

254
00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:07,520
But for him to go, I think a couple of days, two, three days away.

255
00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:13,880
I mean, my parents live less than an hour away and go and do that.

256
00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,120
Like cause here's the alternative.

257
00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:23,400
I mean, to some degree we've taken, we've taken away the PS five is not like available

258
00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:28,680
to our kids for especially in the summer where it's like, you need to be right.

259
00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:29,680
And right.

260
00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:30,680
And all that.

261
00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:37,280
But like he will be more, there'll be better opportunities and better experiences for him.

262
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:46,080
To get out of the house and to go and do that and to continue to develop a relationship

263
00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:51,040
with his grandfather, which is, I mean, high priority for us.

264
00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:58,160
And so, you know, we've said, yeah, like that'll, that'll, that'll work.

265
00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:00,560
I think that'll be, that'll be a good thing.

266
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:05,320
Well, it'll also develop him some skills too, because again, like, I mean, as parents, we

267
00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:12,280
can only do so much because I think kids kind of tune us out because they're used to seeing

268
00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:15,040
us as, as parents and as a person to say no.

269
00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:19,040
And like, as long as grandpa and grandma have the same morals and values, I think that that's

270
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:20,040
okay.

271
00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:21,040
Right.

272
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:25,320
I mean, it's one thing if you're, your grandparents are not living like you want them to, but

273
00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:29,520
as long as they, they live the same way as you and have the same morals and values, I

274
00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:31,120
think that that's, that's fine.

275
00:17:31,120 --> 00:17:36,040
And I mean, I think it's, it's probably, I know at least for us, it would be a struggle

276
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:40,640
because even when our kids stay away for a short amount of time, they come home with

277
00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:41,640
what we call a grandma hangover.

278
00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:42,640
Right.

279
00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:46,480
I mean, they're just grumpy and like, you know, they're just, you know, whatever.

280
00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:53,480
So I think that like that is definitely something to consider, but at the same time, like you're

281
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:58,360
gonna, the kids are gonna grow up and grab skills and feel more, more independent.

282
00:17:58,360 --> 00:17:59,360
Right.

283
00:17:59,360 --> 00:18:02,480
And that's hard as parents when we kind of let go of the reins, right?

284
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,920
Like you're not going to be able to parent your son for a little bit because you're not,

285
00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:07,920
you know, you're around.

286
00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:08,920
Right.

287
00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:09,920
Yep.

288
00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:14,640
And I love what you said there, Andy, because this is a, I don't know.

289
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:20,640
I'm I am, I am feeling a little bit of conviction in my life at this point of like, how, how

290
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,080
are we doing at instilling independence in our kids?

291
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:31,960
Because for a kid who, for a kid who marches to the beat of his own or his or her own drummer,

292
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:38,000
they tend to be naturally more independent in and of, in and of themselves.

293
00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:43,160
I'm sure, I'm sure it reminds you on a daily basis that he is seeking to be more and more

294
00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:44,160
independent.

295
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:45,160
Yeah.

296
00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:46,160
Right.

297
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:51,340
And, and so that, but it feels like that desire for independence comes sooner than I thought

298
00:18:51,340 --> 00:18:52,840
it would in the relationship.

299
00:18:52,840 --> 00:19:00,140
Like, cause just as how old now he's 13, he's 13 and his, his older brother, who's a year

300
00:19:00,140 --> 00:19:06,680
and a half, not even a year and a half older than him is not seeking that level, like the

301
00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:10,480
same level of independence, which that has been, that's the weird, I think it's the weird

302
00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:15,560
thing when a younger in our case, like when a younger kid is ahead of the curve on the

303
00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:23,240
independence train, you know is kind of like asking to do things outside of the house more

304
00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:30,120
and to do things away and do things that are where we are not like indirect supervision.

305
00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:31,120
Yeah.

306
00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:36,080
I think, I mean, for, for us, Micah is our oldest and he's been pretty independent all

307
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:37,080
along again.

308
00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:38,080
Right.

309
00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:42,760
And like, I think that didn't really surprise me when, you know, he wanted to go and buy

310
00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:47,000
his own car and buy it, you know, do his own stuff and whatever, whatever.

311
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:52,940
But then my second Eli right now is currently in Germany, like wanting to go for with the

312
00:19:52,940 --> 00:19:55,920
German club for, for school.

313
00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:58,960
They're going to be gone for three weeks, like almost a month.

314
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:04,420
And that was crazy for us at first, I think as parents for, for one, Eli was, it wasn't,

315
00:20:04,420 --> 00:20:05,920
is like the homebody.

316
00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:09,920
He's the person that wanted to be around us all the time and wanted to be home.

317
00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,120
And he's, he's more shy than Micah is.

318
00:20:12,120 --> 00:20:13,880
But when he said, Hey, I would like to do this.

319
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:14,880
We're like, absolutely.

320
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,640
Like you were the one bringing it to us.

321
00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:18,840
Go for it.

322
00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:20,320
And so he's currently over there.

323
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,880
And like, I think as a parent, I was, I was a little bit hesitant because I was like,

324
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:24,880
that's a long way.

325
00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:27,360
That's a long time away from, from us.

326
00:20:27,360 --> 00:20:28,360
Like you're gone.

327
00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:32,800
Like you're, you know, it just kind of surprised me a little bit that he wanted to do it, but

328
00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:36,320
we, yeah, we were glad to have him do it because yeah, he's, he's experiencing some things

329
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:40,280
stuff and from what we're gathering, I think he's going to come home a changed person.

330
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:41,280
Yeah.

331
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:45,960
I mean, I hope Galilee that's a, I would, I mean, I can just imagine like if you and

332
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:51,400
I would at that age would have had, uh, like I didn't, I didn't travel.

333
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:57,320
I didn't travel to another country until I was almost out of college and that was for

334
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,320
a school thing.

335
00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:01,520
Um, so man, he just that's, yeah, that's, that's super cool.

336
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:08,200
I, you said something though that I like when they, when they, when your kid comes to you

337
00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:10,640
about, about something, I don't know.

338
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:15,840
Like I get in the habit and I'll just be honest with you, especially with Josiah sometimes

339
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:22,800
because Josiah always has these ideas, ideas, uh, share with us about what he, what he thinks

340
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:24,560
he should do or whatever.

341
00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:34,360
I remaining open to when your kid comes to you with an idea of something that they want

342
00:21:34,360 --> 00:21:36,480
to do or want to pursue.

343
00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:45,920
Um, if I'm honest, it is super easy to get into a, like a nope, uh, not going to do that.

344
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:54,080
Um, sort of, uh, mentality and, and I've been trying to think recently like, okay, if I

345
00:21:54,080 --> 00:22:05,040
were, if I were Josiah is, is dad the no person or is he, or is he the encourager and the

346
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:06,040
yes person?

347
00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:11,440
It's not that we have to say yes to everything, but like, I don't, I don't think sometimes

348
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:17,760
I even take a moment in general with the business of life and everything, it is super easy to

349
00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:24,600
be like, every request is an, is a, is an invitation to further chaos in our, in our,

350
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:28,360
in our family potentially can feel that way.

351
00:22:28,360 --> 00:22:29,360
What does it look like?

352
00:22:29,360 --> 00:22:33,400
Um, because the kid that, the kid that marches to the beat of their own drummer, like they

353
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:34,900
have a lot of ideas.

354
00:22:34,900 --> 00:22:40,280
They have, they have things that they would like to do or like, would that are likely

355
00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,080
going to include your involvement at some level or your permission at some level or

356
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:45,580
your money at some level?

357
00:22:45,580 --> 00:22:46,580
Yeah.

358
00:22:46,580 --> 00:22:48,960
Let's just, yeah, let's talk about that.

359
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:49,960
Yeah.

360
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:57,920
And, and very easily, I know I find myself into this, um, like, Nope, can't do that.

361
00:22:57,920 --> 00:22:58,920
Can't do that.

362
00:22:58,920 --> 00:22:59,920
You can't do that.

363
00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:04,880
And as opposed to, even if it's something that we're not readily able to do at the moment,

364
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:11,980
um, talking through the, like, what are, what might be alternatives to this or in what way

365
00:23:11,980 --> 00:23:21,620
can we maybe accomplish this differently or, um, because like with Josiah so many times,

366
00:23:21,620 --> 00:23:28,380
the things that he wants to do or the ideas that he has are, there's like, it's like zero

367
00:23:28,380 --> 00:23:35,800
to zero to 90 miles an hour, uh, very, very quickly as opposed to like ramping up to something

368
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:40,240
or doing some like further investigation about something.

369
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:46,360
Um, I'm trying to think of, gosh, I'm not sure this is a general sense that I have.

370
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:50,000
I'm trying to think of it as an example or whatever.

371
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:58,860
Um, well, and like you mentioned, like with Michael getting is, you know, getting, getting

372
00:23:58,860 --> 00:24:01,620
a car and, um, like that's the first big, that's a big responsibility.

373
00:24:01,620 --> 00:24:02,620
It's the first big purpose.

374
00:24:02,620 --> 00:24:04,340
It's like, Oh, like, Oh, we're doing this.

375
00:24:04,340 --> 00:24:05,940
Like we're doing this now.

376
00:24:05,940 --> 00:24:14,820
Um, and, uh, you know, and so I don't want to just be the no person all the time with

377
00:24:14,820 --> 00:24:21,720
him because then I, then I do feel like I am, um, you know, I'm not seen as somebody

378
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:26,960
that he can come to with his, with his, you know, seemingly wild and innovative and outside

379
00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:28,440
the box ideas.

380
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:33,440
Um, cause honestly the stuff that the rest of my kids asked to do or be a part of is

381
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:38,120
like, Hey, I'd like to go to cheerleading camp or Hey, you know, it's like sign, sign

382
00:24:38,120 --> 00:24:43,640
the, sign the form, turn it in, here's your $20 and you know, and then move on.

383
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,020
Um, it's typically not that way with Josiah.

384
00:24:46,020 --> 00:24:50,020
Well, and I think sometimes as, as parents, I think we need to, especially have kids like

385
00:24:50,020 --> 00:24:52,420
that that have lots of ideas and they're creative.

386
00:24:52,420 --> 00:24:55,260
And, and, and honestly, those are the kids that are probably going to be entrepreneurs,

387
00:24:55,260 --> 00:24:56,260
right?

388
00:24:56,260 --> 00:24:57,900
I mean, they're the ones that have lots of ideas.

389
00:24:57,900 --> 00:25:02,460
Cause I mean, entrepreneurs have that serial entrepreneurship thing where it's like start

390
00:25:02,460 --> 00:25:04,500
start a business, start a business, start a business, start a business.

391
00:25:04,500 --> 00:25:10,440
And like, I see that I see that in Micah, I see he's always, he's always trying to come

392
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:11,440
up.

393
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:16,820
I mean, I'm not sure lightly scheme, but he's trying to, but I mean, I'm using it again,

394
00:25:16,820 --> 00:25:17,820
lightly.

395
00:25:17,820 --> 00:25:18,820
He's he's trying to scheme.

396
00:25:18,820 --> 00:25:19,820
Yeah.

397
00:25:19,820 --> 00:25:24,100
He's trying to game the system a little bit, like see where there's, and that's what entrepreneurs

398
00:25:24,100 --> 00:25:30,380
do, like see where there's a gap, like a gap in service provision or like, what is, what's

399
00:25:30,380 --> 00:25:34,180
the thing that people might need that no one else is doing right now?

400
00:25:34,180 --> 00:25:37,420
Like th like, yes, that like the wheels are turning in that area for sure.

401
00:25:37,420 --> 00:25:38,420
Right?

402
00:25:38,420 --> 00:25:39,420
Yeah.

403
00:25:39,420 --> 00:25:44,240
And as parents, we need to, we need to do a good job and I don't do this.

404
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:45,600
So I'm letting you know this right now.

405
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,160
I don't do this.

406
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:53,160
I don't do a good job of, of like you said, listening and being the person that he can

407
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:55,880
bounce those ideas off of a lot of times I am the no person.

408
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,320
And I think part of that is because I get tired of it.

409
00:25:58,320 --> 00:25:59,320
Right.

410
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:00,320
I mean, I mean, I'm just being honest.

411
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:01,320
Yeah.

412
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:02,320
Yeah.

413
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:03,320
Absolutely.

414
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:05,260
There's, there's a barrage of ideas coming in and it's like, well, I'm going to make

415
00:26:05,260 --> 00:26:06,260
money doing this.

416
00:26:06,260 --> 00:26:07,260
I'm going to make money doing this.

417
00:26:07,260 --> 00:26:08,260
I'm going to make, I'm going to do this.

418
00:26:08,260 --> 00:26:09,260
I'm going to do this.

419
00:26:09,260 --> 00:26:15,080
I, as an adult, I think I've lost that sense of adventure and I'm going to sit like that.

420
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:18,960
Like, yeah, I'm, I'm all for adventure and doing fun things, but I think I've lost that

421
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,960
sense of, of yeah, let's try that.

422
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:23,960
Let's do that.

423
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:25,780
Or cause for me, it's like, no, that's not going to work.

424
00:26:25,780 --> 00:26:31,340
And I'm always thinking of a reason that it, that the idea is not going to work.

425
00:26:31,340 --> 00:26:35,780
And I think as parents, we need to go back and step back and say, no, let's, let's okay.

426
00:26:35,780 --> 00:26:36,780
You have this idea.

427
00:26:36,780 --> 00:26:41,340
You have this idea for whatever a car, washing and detailing, oil changing or whatever it

428
00:26:41,340 --> 00:26:45,100
is like, what are, how, how can we make this work?

429
00:26:45,100 --> 00:26:47,380
Like what, what does that look like for you?

430
00:26:47,380 --> 00:26:48,380
Let's sit down.

431
00:26:48,380 --> 00:26:52,220
And I mean, we've had experience, maybe not with starting businesses, but we know about

432
00:26:52,220 --> 00:26:53,220
finances, right?

433
00:26:53,220 --> 00:26:55,500
I mean, we know about different things like that.

434
00:26:55,500 --> 00:27:02,040
And so we can sit down with our kids and say, okay, let's think this out.

435
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,380
How are you going to get the money for this?

436
00:27:03,380 --> 00:27:04,500
Are you going to borrow money?

437
00:27:04,500 --> 00:27:06,060
And if so, then you have to pay it back.

438
00:27:06,060 --> 00:27:07,060
What's that look like?

439
00:27:07,060 --> 00:27:08,060
Is there interest?

440
00:27:08,060 --> 00:27:09,900
How are you going to draw up business?

441
00:27:09,900 --> 00:27:14,020
Like you can kind of work on a business plan with them instead of just saying no.

442
00:27:14,020 --> 00:27:17,940
And I, and again, I'm, I'm coming from that from a place saying, I don't do this.

443
00:27:17,940 --> 00:27:20,620
Like I'm not, I'm not good at this.

444
00:27:20,620 --> 00:27:28,060
So so, so for me, that's something that I need to work on better is, is not necessarily

445
00:27:28,060 --> 00:27:33,020
just saying no, whenever in my case, Micah comes to me and says, Hey, I want to do this,

446
00:27:33,020 --> 00:27:35,500
start a business, whatever.

447
00:27:35,500 --> 00:27:42,340
And how much to how much of it is that we've, we've just got to find people.

448
00:27:42,340 --> 00:27:52,180
This is a theme that we talk about all the time, finding people that can support, encourage

449
00:27:52,180 --> 00:27:58,900
our kids who maybe have, have the ability to say yes.

450
00:27:58,900 --> 00:28:03,700
When when we were not sure if we have the ability to say yes to something.

451
00:28:03,700 --> 00:28:10,380
But we're, but we can connect them with a network of, of supporting people, people down

452
00:28:10,380 --> 00:28:14,660
the, down the road a little bit farther.

453
00:28:14,660 --> 00:28:20,260
That yeah, that can help, that can help them.

454
00:28:20,260 --> 00:28:22,780
And that can be, that can be an encouragement to them.

455
00:28:22,780 --> 00:28:23,780
Right.

456
00:28:23,780 --> 00:28:28,820
And I think we all know somebody, I mean, there may not be, again, I'm thinking through

457
00:28:28,820 --> 00:28:30,780
through our lives and my friendships and things like that.

458
00:28:30,780 --> 00:28:36,300
And there are definitely people that I could hook up Micah with that would be able to point

459
00:28:36,300 --> 00:28:39,020
him in the right direction because I don't know business very well.

460
00:28:39,020 --> 00:28:41,020
Yes, I, yes, we own it.

461
00:28:41,020 --> 00:28:42,020
Yes.

462
00:28:42,020 --> 00:28:44,820
The two of us own an LLC together, me and you, but like we don't own a business.

463
00:28:44,820 --> 00:28:51,300
And so I don't know about the business stuff that, that it would take to do what he's trying

464
00:28:51,300 --> 00:28:52,300
to do.

465
00:28:52,300 --> 00:28:53,300
Yeah.

466
00:28:53,300 --> 00:29:00,300
And, and there, there is a sense in which, you know, without like crushing her kids'

467
00:29:00,300 --> 00:29:10,540
dreams where someone else can give some structure and some expectation and some, some guidelines

468
00:29:10,540 --> 00:29:11,980
to our kids' life.

469
00:29:11,980 --> 00:29:21,020
Cause cause like Josiah expects that like, I'm, I think he probably expects, if I'm honest,

470
00:29:21,020 --> 00:29:29,540
that I'm going to be to some degree, I'm going to be cautionary and I'm going to be like,

471
00:29:29,540 --> 00:29:35,660
yeah, that's an idea, but what about this, this and this and this?

472
00:29:35,660 --> 00:29:38,340
And like, but that's become my role as his parent.

473
00:29:38,340 --> 00:29:45,060
Now if someone else is having that conversation with him in a little bit different context,

474
00:29:45,060 --> 00:29:46,820
the message might land better.

475
00:29:46,820 --> 00:29:49,780
Well, I'm thinking about your dad, right.

476
00:29:49,780 --> 00:29:54,700
In Josiah, like what I was saying is you can, you can parent so far, but a lot of those

477
00:29:54,700 --> 00:30:02,100
lessons that you are going to try and, and, and tell him may land better from, from a

478
00:30:02,100 --> 00:30:04,340
trusted adult, another in your life.

479
00:30:04,340 --> 00:30:09,100
And whether that's grandpa and you, another mentor, some, somebody else, those things

480
00:30:09,100 --> 00:30:12,220
are going to land better when they're not necessarily coming from you.

481
00:30:12,220 --> 00:30:13,220
Yep.

482
00:30:13,220 --> 00:30:14,220
Yep.

483
00:30:14,220 --> 00:30:20,220
And that's, that's a, for all of us parents, that is a little bit of a lesson in humility.

484
00:30:20,220 --> 00:30:24,260
Like you know, I think that's what it comes down to.

485
00:30:24,260 --> 00:30:30,820
Especially when you were interacting with a kid that yeah, like again, marches to the

486
00:30:30,820 --> 00:30:34,860
beat of their own drummer does things a little bit differently.

487
00:30:34,860 --> 00:30:42,980
It might be that another voice is better received than yours and that you need, you need to

488
00:30:42,980 --> 00:30:47,500
recognize that and not experience that as some sort of threat to your authority as a

489
00:30:47,500 --> 00:30:54,980
parent or not experienced that as some sort of a slight to you, but rather as an opportunity

490
00:30:54,980 --> 00:31:06,580
to say in this season, my parenting role with this child is going to be connection, resourcing

491
00:31:06,580 --> 00:31:15,500
and finding someone else that might be smarter than me at this thing that they can, that

492
00:31:15,500 --> 00:31:17,460
they can hear from.

493
00:31:17,460 --> 00:31:24,820
And and you know, like you said, that is in line is in a line with what we as parents

494
00:31:24,820 --> 00:31:27,660
are looking for, what we're, what we desire for them.

495
00:31:27,660 --> 00:31:30,500
Well, and we've said it, we've said it before.

496
00:31:30,500 --> 00:31:32,500
Well, at least we've had this conversation.

497
00:31:32,500 --> 00:31:37,540
I don't know if we've said it on the podcast, but we've talked about the idea of, of having

498
00:31:37,540 --> 00:31:38,540
trusted adults.

499
00:31:38,540 --> 00:31:40,260
And I think you said this when you were in youth ministry, right?

500
00:31:40,260 --> 00:31:44,100
Like to have, what is it like five trusted adults for anywhere?

501
00:31:44,100 --> 00:31:49,540
Yeah, three to three to five in their adolescent years makes a very, very significant difference

502
00:31:49,540 --> 00:31:51,020
in outcomes for sure.

503
00:31:51,020 --> 00:31:56,620
And then those trusted adults can, I mean, take on roles like mentorship, like trying

504
00:31:56,620 --> 00:31:58,780
to connect them with different things.

505
00:31:58,780 --> 00:32:04,120
Because I think, again, it's as parents, we can only do so much, but if you have a trusted

506
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:11,300
adult that aligns with you morally, and you're kind of on the same page and you've talked

507
00:32:11,300 --> 00:32:14,100
about this, that can invest in people's life.

508
00:32:14,100 --> 00:32:16,380
I mean, honestly, Joel, that's what you're doing.

509
00:32:16,380 --> 00:32:18,340
That's what your role and your day job is, right.

510
00:32:18,340 --> 00:32:24,220
Is to connect adults to kids and so that they can have that relationship when they need.

511
00:32:24,220 --> 00:32:25,220
Right.

512
00:32:25,220 --> 00:32:26,220
I mean, so yeah.

513
00:32:26,220 --> 00:32:30,660
And, and just to say broadly, no matter, no matter what kid we're talking about, it, I

514
00:32:30,660 --> 00:32:34,640
mean, Andy, gosh, I just came from a national conference where annually we're reminded,

515
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:40,500
we're given the dashboard and the updates on, you know, youth mental health and what

516
00:32:40,500 --> 00:32:42,740
the needs are out there.

517
00:32:42,740 --> 00:32:50,140
And there are, so right now in, in the United States alone, it is, it's estimated that there

518
00:32:50,140 --> 00:32:57,620
are 10 million children in the U S who do not have a trusted adult in their life.

519
00:32:57,620 --> 00:33:05,180
Like just don't have like, like have your relationship desert, you know, which, you

520
00:33:05,180 --> 00:33:10,160
know, which again is I probably their side of that is a plug to say, do you know a kid

521
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:14,680
that that doesn't have a relationship, you know, outside of parent outside of parenting,

522
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:19,700
do you know, do you know someone, a young person that's in that role or in that spot?

523
00:33:19,700 --> 00:33:25,260
Like that is, that is a challenging, challenging place, a place to be.

524
00:33:25,260 --> 00:33:31,780
And so, yeah, there's, there's the mentoring relationship is I think a unique God given

525
00:33:31,780 --> 00:33:34,420
one to us.

526
00:33:34,420 --> 00:33:41,080
That is that something very special and very unique happens in that context that can just

527
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,080
be an absolute.

528
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:43,680
And I see, I see it, right.

529
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,840
I was reminded just the other day, a young lady who'd, you know, who had an adult mentor

530
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:52,720
toward the end of her high school career, significantly changed the trajectory of her

531
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:53,720
life.

532
00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:57,920
She's, you know, headed off to college now and it's going to be clearly going to be really,

533
00:33:57,920 --> 00:33:59,960
really successful in whatever she does.

534
00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:06,540
But yeah, that, that relationship ignited a, again, a brighter future for her.

535
00:34:06,540 --> 00:34:11,700
And that's absolutely true with our children too.

536
00:34:11,700 --> 00:34:15,100
You know, we're not, we're not, we're not designed Andy.

537
00:34:15,100 --> 00:34:18,940
I mean, we're not designed, it's not our job to do everything right.

538
00:34:18,940 --> 00:34:25,220
Like to be every, cause we can't be like, I can't be just like we can't in our marriages.

539
00:34:25,220 --> 00:34:27,940
Like I can't be everything from wife or whatever.

540
00:34:27,940 --> 00:34:30,180
I can't be everything for my kid.

541
00:34:30,180 --> 00:34:37,900
If you have that expectation on yourself, like, man, call, call the counselor now.

542
00:34:37,900 --> 00:34:39,900
Cause you're going to need them.

543
00:34:39,900 --> 00:34:40,900
Right.

544
00:34:40,900 --> 00:34:49,340
So I think, I think that is, yeah, I mean, a big part of this conversation is, is realizing

545
00:34:49,340 --> 00:34:56,280
our own, our own frailty, our own limits and having some humility around that.

546
00:34:56,280 --> 00:35:00,960
And that might be one of the better gifts that we can give our kid, especially one,

547
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,960
you know, that is approaching life a little bit differently than the rest.

548
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:04,960
Yeah, absolutely.

549
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:09,200
So, so you, so if we're, if I'm kinda, I'm going to recap a little bit here.

550
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:14,200
So you've talked, we've talked a little bit about trying to find special opportunities

551
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:15,200
for learning.

552
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:19,360
Cause a lot of times kids that march to their own drum have a tough time in a classroom

553
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:20,360
setting.

554
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:21,360
Right.

555
00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:26,920
So for, for you and your family, that looks like sending Josiah off to work with your

556
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:30,120
dad where he's learning a hundred life skills.

557
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:31,120
Yeah.

558
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:32,120
Yeah.

559
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:33,120
Right.

560
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:35,040
He's very, very practical, practical skills that he's going to use.

561
00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:38,880
Now I'm not saying that there's not a place for, for the classroom and learning.

562
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:43,120
Like I think that there still is, it just made me look, it just made me working at that

563
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:46,600
differently or finding a different way to, to do that.

564
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:47,600
Yep.

565
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:52,120
So it may, it may mean, it may mean homeschooling for some people.

566
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:57,840
It may mean working at trying to figure out the best way that they learn.

567
00:35:57,840 --> 00:35:59,440
Cause everyone does learn differently, right?

568
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:03,800
I mean, some people are visual learners, some are audible learners, some are read it, reading

569
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:04,800
learners.

570
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:11,640
And so, so that may look different for, for your kids as far as how, how to make the traditional

571
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:13,520
classroom setting look too.

572
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:17,160
Cause obviously Josiah is still going to school.

573
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:18,160
For now.

574
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:19,160
Right.

575
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:20,160
Yes.

576
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:21,160
He's not, he's not not going to school.

577
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:22,160
Right.

578
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:26,680
And so, so that may be looking different, figuring out what that looks like for, for

579
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:27,680
him.

580
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:34,440
And then we talked about finding trusted adults that, that you can, again, this kind of goes

581
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,600
hand in hand with what you were talking about with your, with your dad, but finding trusted

582
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:41,040
adults that can speak into their lives.

583
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:45,320
And so that, cause again, and I think that this, this goes with any, any kid, I mean,

584
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:51,040
whether or not they marched to the beat of their own drum or not, like you need to have

585
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:56,120
those trusted relationships that I think that are going to be able to speak more.

586
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:59,940
And you're, you might have kids that you might have still have kids that, that listen well

587
00:36:59,940 --> 00:37:01,080
to the parents, no matter what.

588
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:06,400
But I think, I think overall in general, like it's good to have those three to five adults

589
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:14,920
that are outside of you and your wife, they can speak into your kid's life and, and teach

590
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:19,840
them the things that, that you want them to, the kids to know too.

591
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:21,560
Yeah, absolutely.

592
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:22,560
Yeah.

593
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:31,160
And you know, and then I think something we, we haven't really touched on much is the ex

594
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:40,720
the understanding or expectation that, that your kids friendships, either the number or

595
00:37:40,720 --> 00:37:46,200
the kind of friendships they have with their peers might also look different too.

596
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,760
So what's that look like for you and Jackie with Josiah?

597
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:55,440
Like how does it look differently?

598
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:57,040
Yeah.

599
00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:05,720
Josiah needs a particular kind of friend and that particular kind of friend.

600
00:38:05,720 --> 00:38:08,560
So it's not a, it's not a, it's not a surprise to me.

601
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:14,240
Like Josiah, even though there's a bit of an age difference, Josiah and Micah, you know,

602
00:38:14,240 --> 00:38:18,280
Josiah wants to spend time with Micah whenever, whenever possible.

603
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:24,080
Like if they, if they can, cause I just imagine I've never really like been a fly on the wall

604
00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:29,560
in that scenario, but I, I feel like, I feel like the, the, the gears of their brains just

605
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:34,520
kind of like, you know, kind of melting, right.

606
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:38,880
And when he has that experience, which I think that experience is probably not very common

607
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,640
for him in a good, in a good portion of his day.

608
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:47,520
I think when he has that, there's at least a, like, Oh, there's someone else out in the

609
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:52,360
world that, that is like me in this, that is like me in this way that has these interests

610
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:53,520
or whatever.

611
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:58,200
So it has, it has meant that, and this, again, this is also personality type.

612
00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:01,280
Josiah doesn't, isn't necessarily the social butterfly.

613
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:06,160
He doesn't have 20 friends that he, you know, these large groups or whatever it is going

614
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:07,160
to go hang out with.

615
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,480
And that's an introversion, extraversion.

616
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:11,480
There's there's definitely that too.

617
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:24,080
But we we've had to really think through our expectations of what friendship communication,

618
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:30,040
friendship connections look like for him, like, and, and, and how that, how that works.

619
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:35,040
And you know, I, for him, it's like, we just, we'd like to see a couple of trusted, trusted

620
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:39,760
friends that are, that are his life and that, and that's, and that's okay.

621
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:48,520
Cause we've also had very much navigate the I think Josiah desires that connection, those

622
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:55,520
friendship connections, the, the challenges in the junior high years is that young, young

623
00:39:55,520 --> 00:40:00,680
kids who are maybe not on the best track in life, have a radar for other kids that are

624
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:09,800
looking for a place to belong and will like invite them in, but, but not under the greatest,

625
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,720
the greatest motives.

626
00:40:11,720 --> 00:40:19,860
And, and that can be super tricky because then you, as a parent are being cautious or

627
00:40:19,860 --> 00:40:22,360
saying like, yeah, I don't think this is a good idea.

628
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:26,680
It's easy for them to hear you don't want me to have friends.

629
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:27,680
Yep.

630
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:28,680
Yep.

631
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:29,680
What does it look like?

632
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:34,400
So, so for a kid that has an ADHD diagnosis, right?

633
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:42,400
So sometimes that can be a lot like it can be overwhelming as far as like the, from a,

634
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:46,760
from a relationship standpoint, like sometimes I'm just trying to choose my words carefully

635
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:52,040
here, but, but that can be a lot as a, as an, especially as an adult trying to, trying

636
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:57,920
to be a mentor or a volunteer or whatever.

637
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:04,160
Like, so, so how do you, do you have any tips and tricks for adults or, or even, even other

638
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:08,720
peers that can help kind of make that relationship?

639
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:14,400
So it's not so overwhelming, especially for those who are not necessarily also way outgoing

640
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:20,600
and what, you know, cause like, I think, I think in Josiah and Micah's case, they, they,

641
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:24,720
they both are a lot, the same personality was like, you'd mentioned, they're both gearheads.

642
00:41:24,720 --> 00:41:28,520
They both like to mechanically figure out things and they're very, very, very smart.

643
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:34,080
And so those relationships work well, but for somebody who's not necessarily on the

644
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:40,640
same page, as far as likes and interests and stuff, but wants to invest in, in the kids

645
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,240
and in their lives, how do you have any tips and tricks on that?

646
00:41:44,240 --> 00:41:47,920
You just gotta be super, the general, you just have to be super open.

647
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:59,800
Like again, in our, let's just think about for a second, like our adult, our adult relationships,

648
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:04,840
like the relationship that you and I have, or our families have, you know, we didn't

649
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:08,920
enter into the relationship with an agenda per se.

650
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:14,800
Like, like, and again, this is so many years, it was so many years ago now, but you know,

651
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:21,160
we entered, we entered into an adult relationship with the hopes of, of just of connection.

652
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:27,120
And there was, there was a low, a low agenda in that.

653
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:34,760
Sometimes when we are entering into relationships with young people or whatever the case might

654
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:39,000
be, there there's an agenda or an expectation.

655
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:45,520
And I just think, you know, if you're gonna, if you're gonna come and be a part of Josiah's

656
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:51,760
life or Micah's life, like you need to do a lot of listening and a very, very small

657
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:55,680
amount of talking especially initially.

658
00:42:55,680 --> 00:43:06,120
Again, it comes back to a certain posture that you need to take to, to hear them and,

659
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:09,600
and listen, and sometimes, like sometimes they're not going to give you much to go on,

660
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:16,680
like at all, like, like, you know, you're, you're going to feel, you know, and I've wondered

661
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:21,180
about that, like with their friendships, like, or, or kids that are like making initial contact

662
00:43:21,180 --> 00:43:22,180
with them.

663
00:43:22,180 --> 00:43:25,120
And yet, and yet sometimes it'll surprise you.

664
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:29,280
Like last, last night, I don't even know, like we were at a, we're at a minor league

665
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:30,640
baseball game.

666
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:36,080
There's another group of boys that are sitting next to Josiah and the few dudes he was with.

667
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:39,240
From, from my son's baseball team.

668
00:43:39,240 --> 00:43:45,600
And he like just struck up a conversation with one of these kids, you know, and like

669
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:53,960
got his number and, you know, and I'm like, like that surprised me that legitimately surprised.

670
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:59,040
But again, there was no like agenda to that, that connection, right?

671
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:02,880
Like they're the same age, they're maybe interested in some of the same stuff.

672
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,000
And they just happen to sit next to each other for a couple hours at a baseball game.

673
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:11,360
I, you know, I, I don't, so sometimes we're talking about like, sometimes as adults, we

674
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:15,280
could take hints from that and maybe maybe better friendships to you.

675
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:16,280
Yeah.

676
00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:17,280
Right.

677
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:18,280
I know.

678
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,680
And, and it's like, you know, my friendships right now is I've been, and I'm, you know,

679
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:27,600
are my, my friendships are largely built around the activities that my kids are in.

680
00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:28,600
Sure.

681
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:29,600
Yeah.

682
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:30,600
That makes sense.

683
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:34,160
These are the people, he's the circle of people that, that you're around a lot that were around

684
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:39,280
regularly and that, you know, and that it's there, it's valuable for us to be, Hey, if

685
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:44,760
we're going to be with each other a lot, a lot, we need to find out, you know, it's really

686
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:48,600
good that we like each other or that we have connection and things like that.

687
00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:57,120
So yeah, you just, you gotta, you gotta always question your motives, always question your

688
00:44:57,120 --> 00:44:58,120
agenda.

689
00:44:58,120 --> 00:44:59,120
Do you have too much of an agenda?

690
00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:06,200
Do you need to be more open and receiving of because here's the other deal, young people

691
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:13,720
experience a sense of love and companionship just by you spending the time like love is

692
00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:20,760
spelled T I M E and that, that in of itself is a, is a great gift.

693
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:25,160
So don't expect, don't expect too much.

694
00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:30,960
Be open-minded approach the relationship openly and, and watch what happens.

695
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:31,960
Awesome.

696
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:36,600
I think, I think this has been a helpful conversation, I think, and I hope for our listeners, it's

697
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:38,640
been, it's been helpful to you.

698
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:44,520
And so if you, if you do want to ever let our own voicemail, give our voicemail call

699
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:48,120
five seven four two one three 87 zero two is our voicemail.

700
00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:52,000
And again, that number is just a voicemail and we would love to hear from you.

701
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:57,320
So if you've got tips or tricks for kids that are marching to their own beat of their own

702
00:45:57,320 --> 00:45:59,440
drum, we would love to hear that.

703
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:05,480
Or also, you know, feedback@dosendadspodcast.com is a great way to get ahold of us too.

704
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:08,200
Joel, any, any final parting thoughts from you?

705
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:11,440
I have, I've enjoyed this conversation, Andy.

706
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:19,080
It's if nothing else, it just helps kind of recenter me into the work that we're doing

707
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,680
as parents and how it's important.

708
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:24,520
And this is, this is a journey.

709
00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:26,520
It is, it is a journey.

710
00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:31,080
We don't always get it right, but I think taking some time, even, even as you and I

711
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:34,600
talk, it's like, I think some things fire off in my own brain around.

712
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:38,760
Like maybe I need to, maybe I need to take a different approach on a few things.

713
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:39,760
So super helpful.

714
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:40,760
Glad to have the conversation.

715
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:42,240
Thanks everybody for tuning in.

716
00:46:42,240 --> 00:46:43,240
Appreciate you all.

717
00:46:43,240 --> 00:46:44,240
Yeah.

718
00:46:44,240 --> 00:46:48,120
And remember we are going to be at the Elkhart County 4-H fair doing a live recording.

719
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:51,200
If you did not see our announcement of that, it's going to be amazing on the Wednesday

720
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:52,280
of the fair.

721
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:53,400
So we'd love to see you out there.

722
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:58,160
If you're in the Elkhart County, Indiana area, look us up because you can hang out with us

723
00:46:58,160 --> 00:46:59,160
as we record.

724
00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:00,160
It'll be fun.

725
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:01,160
Awesome.

726
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:02,160
Thanks everybody for tuning in.

727
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:03,160
Appreciate you.

728
00:47:03,160 --> 00:47:06,240
Make sure you like, subscribe, follow, do all those things.

729
00:47:06,240 --> 00:47:07,240
Always helpful.

730
00:47:07,240 --> 00:47:10,560
And until next time, we wish you grace and peace.

731
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:38,040
Bye.

732
00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:40,380
(whooshing)