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Welcome to the around the House show, your trusted source for everything about your home.

Thanks for joining us today.

I'm Eric G. John Dudley.

Good to see you, brother.

It's happening, man.

Good to be here.

As always, thanks for joining us for this one.

Glad to be here.

Thanks, Ted.

Great to have you here.

And Ted Spears is the president of the Patch Boys.

And I tell you what, one of the hardest things in home improvement out there is trying to find somebody that can do that job.

That's not the big full job, but it's a small job.

And you don't really want to trust those handymen because sometimes handymen out there aren't the best drywall people.

And I tell you what, like me, don't like doing it, so I'd rather have somebody.

So we thought, let's get Ted in here to talk about the Patch Boys.

Welcome to around the House, Brother.

Thank you.

Thank you, Eric.

Thank you, John.

Pleasure to be here.

And.

And it's always fun talking about drywall because it's something I always say.

It's.

It's art and science, and that's why it's tricky.

Well, that's why you need somebody that knows what they're doing.

Because our best customer are the do it yourselfers that go onto YouTube, try to figure it out.

And then, guess what?

We get a call afterwards and we go, hey, I tried it.

It didn't work.

And we're like, we won't, you know, keep that between us.

We'll come out and take care of it.

Not as easy as it looks.

It is not.

It is not, man.

It is.

It is the truth.

Because so many times, especially with, you know, hey, I had a water leak in the garage or something like that, and it's that kind of inoffensive place to try to get it.

And you might get the drywall up there.

Okay.

But the rest of it is where things go sideways.

Whether it's the taping, the mudding, the texture, trying to get that to match up can be difficult.

That's where the expert level comes in, and that's where we start in my opinion, at least jump from the science into the art.

Yeah, no, it's amazing in terms of.

And 50% or more of our jobs are ceiling work.

50% more.

Which, which is amazing if you're outside the business.

But if you think about it, you have roof leaks, you have bathroom leaks upstairs, you have.

One of the first thing we do is work with our franchisees to get vendor relationships because everything is behind the wall.

So if you're a plumber, if you're an electrician, you know, you're putting in insulation.

If you're, if something goes wrong, you need our help.

And most of the time, like a plumber is an expert at plumbing, they're not an expert at fixing the drywall afterwards.

It's something that we, we work with a number of partners in the marketplace because after they're gone, we come back and make it look right.

Well, especially right, John.

I mean, let's say you're getting a house replumbed and you know, you've got your, you've got holes here and there, you've got a 8 inch tall by 10 foot long hole down the middle of the backside of the kitchen wall in another place, just trying to get something done and all of a sudden you're trying to find somebody the job.

And some of these.

And I'll say most of the drywall contractors, the bigger ones out there, go, no, I'd just rather tear it all out and put a whole new thing in there because they just don't want to mess with it.

Yeah, well, like you said, Eric, that's when, you know, a lot of handymen get called.

And I imagine you guys follow behind a lot of handymen that couldn't quite get the job done correctly either.

I was a contractor for almost 30 years, Ted, so I have tried it all and seen it all and learn to stick what I'm good at, for sure.

But yeah, and honestly, I think a lot of you talk about plumbers not being expert drywallers.

Half of them don't even pick up the scrap they cut out.

But maybe that was just my sub.

I don't know.

A lot of homeowners are surprised by that.

They're like, oh, well, we thought you would fix the wall too.

He's like, no, I'm a plumber, I'm an electrician.

I don't.

Yeah.

They just say, okay.

And that's why, you know, and because the other thing.

And I get out, you know, I go out on the road with my franchisees a lot and we have Coaches that do it.

I'm amazed how many people will have a, you know, a ceiling leak.

And we'll go out there and estimate it and then we ask the obvious question, have you fixed it?

And there is a percentage of people that haven't.

And we have to tell them, John.

Right.

We have to say, all right, here's.

We want relationships in the marketplace.

So we'll say Eric, Eric the plumber is a good partner of ours.

Call him first.

He will fix that.

Then we'll come in because, you know, if we fix it, you know, and then you have a bathtub issue, next time you use the bathtub, you're going to have the same problem and you know, you don't want to do that.

So it's a, it's a two way street for us.

But you're right, the I'm.

I was on Pittsburgh a couple months ago and they had an issue with their water where it's eating through the pipes.

And so in a county, they literally would have to go into homes and replace everything.

And they, they might have had 50 holes they had to go in.

And so we were the ones that would come in afterwards and fix it.

Because you can't have that in your house, right?

Yeah, yeah, we had that here in the Pacific Northwest with the homes that were done with the early CPVC pipe.

Yeah, yeah.

And I tell you what, that stuff, I don't know if they were, you know, there's a bunch of class action lawsuits, so don't get into that.

But basically I had one of those homes that I was renting for a little bit and I would be sitting there in the living room watching television and I would hear in the crawl space down below a boom, you know, and three quarter inch line just came apart on a 60 degree day in the, in the crawl space.

But that also happens in the walls too.

And I can't believe how many times I've seen that happen.

And same kind of thing to fix it, right.

It's all going to come out and it has to get in there.

And there's a significant amount of drywall work as well as.

Man, they are getting funky on drywall textures across the country.

It's not just your knock down an eggshell now.

It's 32 different plaster ways of doing it.

Yeah, and I wrote down a few of them.

But I mean, that's really where that creativity and art comes from because some people do abstract, they kind of create their own.

And if you're coming in afterwards, you can fix the hole but then you have to match the texture.

And so you have to have that creative eye to kind of say, all right, Because a lot of times the person that did it, they're long gone.

Right.

And, you know, the homeowners had the house for 10 years, and they're like, hey, I want to fix it.

So you really have to be talented to be able to mat, you know, not only fix the hole, but then match that texture.

Yeah.

A lot of test pieces, and then the client looking at you, going, why are you using a push broom on our ceiling?

Yeah.

And the other thing, you know, that we.

We get a lot of.

I'm sure you guys like popcorn ceiling.

In terms of removing popcorn ceiling, you know, that's also a, you know, a big thing, because people, you know, they want it out of their house.

And getting that off a ceiling.

I mean, I don't know if you guys have ever done it.

I was down in Charlotte a few weeks ago with our franchisee.

It is a mess.

Oh, my God.

Gosh, it's horrible.

It is.

And so it's.

It's one of those things.

You're right, John, in terms of you talking about the amount of textures that are there, and a lot of it's regional.

Like, you know, I'm up in the Michigan area, and.

And, you know, you know, most of our stuff is flat, but, you know, in different regions across the country, especially south, lots of texture.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We had here in the Pacific Northwest, if it's 60s, 70s, 80s, maybe in the early 90s, that popcorn is up there.

And holy smokes, that is.

I think that's one of the different levels of hell of removing that, in my opinion, because not only do you got to get that stuff off, and I've tried every way.

I've tried drywall sanders.

I've tried misting it.

I've tried all of it.

It doesn't matter.

It's all miserable.

And then you got to go back and patch it.

Because the drywallers had traditionally put it up, especially in the 60s, 70s, they had just basically done a one coat on the drywall, so there's nothing really spanned out on the seams.

And so now when you up there, it's almost like you put new drywall up there, because you still got probably two more coats of drywall just to get enough to put a.

Just a simple eggshell orange peel on it.

Yep, that's the worst.

We used to use the airless sprayer and not really mist, more like soak.

Send the labor in there with a 12 inch blade.

And.

Yeah, well, and for all those reasons, it's not inexpensive.

Right.

And so trying to talk to the customer about the time it takes to do it right.

And you're right, Eric, it's like, hey, when you scrape it off, nine times out of ten you got to fix some things so it just doesn't come off.

You know, like, you know, you're taking whipped cream off of a strawberry or something.

I mean, you know, it's embedded and you got to get it out of there.

And John, one thing that I saw, and you probably ran into this as well, if you put too much moisture up on that drywall, when you go to prime it later on, that primer doesn't adhere to the drywall very well.

So now you got a peeling thing.

So when you hit your PVA primer or whatever on it, because it was never primed before back in the day anyway, at least in my area, it doesn't really want to soak in because that drywall had been so wet from the peel.

So then all of a sudden you're pulling off dinner plate sized pieces of primer that didn't adhere.

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Listening to around the House with Eric.

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now let's rejoin the conversation with Ted Spears from the Patch Boys.

When you hit your PVA primer or whatever on it because it was never primed before back in the day anyway, at least in my area, it doesn't really want to soak in because that drywall had been so wet from the peel.

So then all of a sudden you're pulling off dinner plate sized pieces of primer that didn't adhere and you're doing it over again.

You're making my head hurt just thinking about the past.

Like.

No, I was, I was saying you're both making a case for our business, right?

Because you want experts that know what they're doing, it's not their first time and are going to do it right and stand behind what they do.

Right.

You know, we don't go away after the job is done.

I mean, our numbers at corporate are public and our franchisees and so we stand behind our work and you know, it's something that, you know, we do this all the time.

I'll tell you.

In the Northwest, it's either had smooth wall on a lot of the turn of the century homes, for example, in Tacoma, or you had the, like you say, Eric, 6,070s 80s with popcorn.

Both nightmares.

And I'll tell you, because you try to match a smooth wall, and now you're trying six different roller covers with the paint to try to get that.

Just a little bit of orange peel that's.

That's just as difficult as matching, like, some of the crazy textures, man o man.

And a lot of it was on plaster.

So then you're like, okay, now we're matching plaster with drywall.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Throwing sand in there.

You're like, maybe that'll work.

I should have called you, Ted.

I. I know.

Now you're talking about what I deal with every day now, right?

We deal with that every day.

And.

And, you know, it's.

It's funny, you know, when you.

When you go online, sometimes I go down a rabbit hole.

Just watch.

I'm so impressed with, you know, the people that are good with drywall and know how to do it because they make it look so easy.

You know, they're so talented, and people don't understand how difficult it is to do it.

Yeah, like Bob Vila, he's like, hey, I can't.

My tree doesn't look like that.

It's funny.

It's.

It's like any other art, right?

It's like watching your favorite band play out there, and the guitar players up there just shredding along, they make it look so easy.

Their eyes are closed or playing the guitar behind their head, and you can look at and go, that's simple.

Now they spend 25 years learning that skill.

So, yeah, you're right.

And that's, you know, that's one of those things that I've been here six years now, and by knowing me, I tell people, hey, I can do drywall, and, you know, I can patch.

You just probably wouldn't want to pay me to do it.

That's why we.

That's why we have hired technicians that you have five plus years and that are out there, that are experts.

And our franchisees, you know, rely on that relationship between them and our technicians to make sure we do the job right.

Well, Ted, one of the things, too, that I notice that I see out there is drywall can be so finicky, especially in areas where the house is moving around a little bit, whether you're in the northern states and the day starts out at 60 degrees and it's minus 10 that night, you know, and the house is creaking and cracking and moving.

That's where you see those weird little cracks around windows and doors and stuff where maybe the drywall wasn't done correctly to begin with because they put the seam going the wrong direction.

And yes, you can do that drywall.

People out there that are the amateurs and now you're chasing that crack for decades trying to wonder what happened.

We see that all the time.

I just, I talked to a customer a couple of weeks ago because they don't know, right.

They think their house is falling versus you're right, when it's cold versus hot, you know, the house, you know, expands and contracts.

And if you know the house wasn't built exactly right and that drywall is loose, you're going to see stress crack.

So that's one of our top five things we do is go in and fix the stress crack and then reinforce around the area so that it minimizes.

Yeah, you're never going to get rid of it 100%, you know, with the stress crack.

And we explain that to the customer.

But there are ways to reinforce that area so you minimum minimize it.

But you know, especially, you know, as we're going into now in the Michigan area, you know, it's, it was super cold and then it warms up.

You see a lot more than that.

And, and then, you know, we got it to let the customer know, no, your house is not falling down.

It's a stress crack.

Basically.

You take them through it and then yes, we can fix it.

And, and here are the things we're going to do in addition to just fixing that crap.

Yeah, yeah, that's a ton of that stuff in the desert.

I lived in Arizona for eight years, ton of that stuff in the desert.

Because.

And in newer houses, right, you know, $800,000 million dollar houses 15 years ago, I'm talking about.

And like you say, Ted, they're like, this is like, this is my fancy house.

Why is this crack not going away?

And you fix the crack and it comes back two years later and you're friends with them and you're like, you have to understand, like it's just what you just said, the reinforcement's a big issue to try to keep those from coming back.

And they seem to never really go away.

And it seems like the newer drywalls that now that we've got these light drywalls and they've, they're adding it seems like air to the mix to make these sheets lighter, which for me, when I'm moving around a sheet of 5, 8, 4 by 8, I like that feeling.

But you know something, it seems that it's cracking more often in situations that maybe the older, thicker.

And I mean, it's not.

It's the same dimension, but it was denser.

And it seems seen that was a little more sturdy back in the day.

Yeah, it's amazing, you know, the different options that are there.

You know, we get into.

We.

We do, you know, stuff with soundboard, you know, where somebody wants to, you know, have a soundproof room.

And.

And so it's a combination.

And then you get into moisture.

You mean board when you.

You're trying to minimize any moisture issues.

And so it's.

It's.

I mean, and this is.

This is why you want to deal with somebody that's in the business.

Right.

You know, so they can understand what your problem is, and then we can help you fix it.

Right.

The first time versus getting a call from somebody that might have done it with somebody else and they did it wrong.

And then they come to you and say, hey, can you.

Can you fix it?

Yeah.

I've seen some disasters where homeowners run down to the home improvement store, they buy a couple pieces, it's their first try.

And, you know, I pat them on the back and say, nice work for giving it a shot.

But when they get out the hot mud and start doing.

Throwing on ten times the mud that they probably needed, and it looks more like a art project than it does a smooth wall.

I can imagine you guys coming in going, wow, this stuff's like heavy duty Bondo on here.

It is so hard to sand.

Get the belt sander.

Get the belt sander.

People using fix all people over mud all the time.

I mean, yeah, the intent is, hey, I've got to put enough on it.

And that's why we do three coats.

And it's.

You keep it very thin and you know what you're doing, so you build up to it.

But I've even done it myself when we, you know, the first couple years when, when, you know, we're in, you know, we have a lab and you do it.

You think you have to over mud, but guess what happens when it's finished?

You gotta sand that thing and it's.

It's way too much and you create a mess.

And it's like, you know, that's.

That's why I leave it up to the experts, because you're right.

You need to understand the finished product and what you need and don't need to make sure it's done right.

You'll only do that a couple of times because you have to sand it.

And I speak from experience, obviously, I'll admit I've done it.

And then you will under mud a couple of times and go, yeah.

And then, you know, after a lot of cursing and a lot of headaches, you start to figure it out and you're like, wow, I'm pretty good at this.

And then you go, I don't want to do this.

Where's my drywall sub?

I feel like drywall has to be a close second right behind painting.

As one of those, well, I can do that homeowner things.

You know, like everybody thinks they can paint and do drywall until they try it and they go, man, that's not as like Eric said with the guitarist, you're like, oh, that took him 10,000 hours of practice.

You have a whole new appreciation.

Yeah.

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Welcome back to the around the House show.

If this is the first time catching the show, you can find out more@aroundthehouse online.com now let's rejoin the conversation with Ted Spears from the Patch Boys.

Now, I was going to bring that up, Eric.

Team John.

It's a combination, right?

Because if somebody comes in my house and does a nice job in drywall and then leaves a mess, guess what?

They're getting one star out of five because that's part of the experience to do it.

And so we literally train our franchisees when we bring them in, you know, to training, before they even get out in the field, we take them through how you have to set up and what you have to do from your zip holes and your plastic.

And it's something.

It really does two things.

We also put tarps down on the way in and out.

It does two things.

One, if you do it right up front and sure, it takes a little more time, but then any of the cleanup afterwards is minimal.

Sure.

You know, John, to your point, it's you're still going to have some, and we're going to make sure it gets cleaned up.

But the more you do that.

And also it's a met, we are very concerned about the customer experience, about being on time, making sure we do things the right way.

And it's a.

The message we send to the customer too.

And we talk to them up front when we.

About the estimate, about how we want to make sure we set up your home so that we keep it clean and we do a good job.

And when we, when we're gone, you don't even know we were there because we've.

We've all done it.

Somebody comes in the house, they finish something and then I'm vacuuming and cleaning afterwards.

And it really leaves a bad taste in your mouth.

It's everything.

There's a reason I never ran out of work as a contractor.

And one thing I would really, I mean, because it's amazing what you see out there.

Messes guys will leave and unfinished work, whatever.

But I used to one of my biggest pet peeves with all my guys, I would just iterate and iterate, man.

We leave houses cleaner than we found them.

I don't care if it's dust bunnies from three weeks ago and it was theirs clean, you know, leave it cleaner.

And we found it.

That was always our motto.

And it makes all the difference in the world.

They're going to call you again.

They're going to tell their friend about you.

That it's the experience of it.

Yeah.

And they're not going to be so picky with maybe the spot of texture that's not exactly perfect.

They're like, but damn, the p. Piano's clean.

You're right.

It's about that total experience.

Right.

And it's got to be interesting too, because, you know, we were talking textures earlier, but I can't tell you how many drywalled or plaster ceilings that I've seen that have that circular artwork and the texture.

Or even in this brand new house that I'm in now, they came through here.

It's seven years old.

It's got this.

I forget what they call it, but it's got this new plaster technique where it looks like they peeled off little sections with hard edges out of it.

You know, it's a smooth wall and then it peels out of there.

And I'm looking at that going, I need to do some electrical work in here.

And I'm like, I've been putting it off because I'm just like, I don't want to patch.

Well, you know who to call.

Eric.

Yeah, you do.

And, and you're right.

And I'm serious.

Just from the outside looking in the creative eye, that our technicians have to be able to figure that out.

Right.

Because they've done a ton but some of it was new to them, but they understand the tools that you need to be able to create it.

And then with texture.

You know, the nice thing about it, once, once you get rid of it, you can play with it, right?

You can put it up there and you can look at it and then, hey, you're not, you're not going to use a 5 minute mud on it, right?

You know, you might use 20 and then you wipe it back.

Hey, that doesn't work.

Let's try again.

And, and it's, to me, it's, it's fascinating in terms of that expertise that you need to have to.

Especially with texture.

Yeah, it can actually really be fun when you get to be creative with it like that.

It's fun and cool when it works out, right?

When you're like, yeah, I found this thing laying in the yard, this plastic child's toy, and I used it to poke and scrape and it came out perfect.

Like, then you're excited.

You're a genius, right?

But that happens once out of a hundred times for me.

Oh yeah, Just the other day we, we had training in Ann Arbor when we bring franchisees in and we, and we have kind of a texture class and you know, we, we have a lead tech that's been doing this for 15 years.

And so he, he did all this texture and you guys were kind of talking about, you know, the sand swirl or whatever, which is one of my favorite.

And I'm like, hey, Jake, how long did it take you to do that?

About a minute.

I go, a minute?

That would have taken me like six hours.

And he just, you know, to your guys point, it's like he's been doing it.

You know, he is an artist and he understands the tools that, that it takes.

Like, I've been a hockey player all my life, so I skated when I was 4.

I'm now 64.

And so I was gonna ask you.

That question, Chad, if you were a Red Wing or not.

So if you understand the term a cup of coffee, I, I played mostly in the minor leagues, but I did play four games with the Detroit Red Wings back in the 80s.

So I did get called up and get a chance to play, you know, those four games.

And they were wonderful, but, you know, I think they told me to find a career off the ice.

Hey, you made it that far, man.

If I remember right, center number 11, you.

Hey, you were correct.

I wore my four games with the wings.

I was number 11.

There we go.

I'm a hockey guy, so I pay attention to that stuff.

I'm a big hockey fan.

I played at University of Michigan and they're ranked number one in the country right now in college.

So I'm, I'm optimistic.

As you know, as a hockey fan, Eric, you never know.

Now I was a. I was one of the WHL franchises.

I was their initial year, their inaugural year.

I was working on their broadcast team in the studio.

So I was the in studio guy and then bought season tickets for seven years after that.

So done my time from the other side of it, but I'm happy I didn't go out and play because I'd have gotten hurt.

Well, you and I can probably talk for an hour just about hockey.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

So what brought you over into the world of patching with the Patch Boys as president?

I mean, you've got a pretty wide career out there of really helping companies expand, grow, and be successful.

Yeah, it's a, it's a good question.

You know, when you talk to younger people, you know, it definitely wasn't a straight line career in terms of what I did.

You know, I, I worked, you know, after I got done playing hockey and sales and marketing and business development, I was in franchising with Little Caesar's Pizza back in the day.

And then it's, you know, it's like anything.

My, my cousin Tim Fagan runs three of the businesses for Belfor Franchise Group.

And you know, when I came back from Denver, I worked for the Colorado Avalanche for a while.

And then when I came back, they, the Belfor Franchise Group had just bought the Patch Boys and they were looking for somebody with my background.

And I explained to them I was not an expert drywaller, but here's my background.

They go, okay, let's give you a shot.

You know, like anything, I'm sure you guys are the same way.

You know, you roll up your sleeves, you get to know the people that are doing it.

Then we had about 30 franchisees, and so you talk with them.

You can get out there.

And now, now we're almost at 100, so we've grown a lot, learned a lot.

You know, I like anything I listen to, you know, to the franchisees and the experts in terms of what they need and then develop a team that can support.

Yeah, I'd love to hear that you guys have a training center and stuff, because that's got to be one of the hardest parts of this for your franchisees out there.

And, you know, those are all just all independent businesses running across the country, which are live and local in the neighborhoods.

But it's got to be hard trying to find the help out there with, with the lack of the trades in the schools and stuff like that to really find qualified people.

And it's nice to hear that you guys have some programs to help along with that.

Yeah.

And, and like anything, that's our number one challenge, you know, in terms of finding qualified technicians because we need people that are serious.

You got to have five years or more to work for us.

And so we start right away with our franchisees to, to go into the marketplace and find people.

And we've done it.

You know, we've launched probably 80 franchises over the last five years for the Patch Boys.

And so a lot of experience of where to find them, who to talk to, how to network.

And then we also have 14 other franchise brands underneath the Belfor franchise group.

There's a network of cousin franchises in those marketplaces where we can talk to those people about, hey, you know, where do you, where would you look for this?

Or how can you help me do this?

So it's a, it's a very close knit family that our parent company Belfors put together and we utilize that to help our franchisees grow.

Yeah, that's a super helpful resource as opposed to digging through Craigslist.

That's definitely a leg up.

That's a leg up.

We've all been there, man.

I tell you what.

And that's one of the things here.

And I'm going to throw these guys under the bus.

And I don't throw people under the bus too often.

But you know, there's such an epidemic out there of unlicensed, unbonded people out there that are kind of fly by night, that are on some of these platforms like Nextdoor, Facebook, Marketplace, and they show up, they get the cash up front and you hope it gets done.

And many times I get called in when the horror story comes around of, well, yeah, I paid them.

And somebody said on the group that they were good.

And you start looking around and you jump on their social media and go, well, that was her cousin that was given all the grieving reviews for everybody.

You have been listening to the around the House show.

We will be right back.

Welcome back to the around the House show.

If this is the first time catching the show, you can find out more@aroundthehouseonline.com.

now let's rejoin the conversation with Ted Spears from the Patch Boys.

It's a lot of what we talk about on the show, I mean, for the listeners out there is these cautionary Tales of like, be sure you check this, Be sure you research this.

Be sure you're, you know, if they show up in a 72 Cadillac or an 84 Celica and they say they've been a roofer for 15 years, I don't know, take a look at their license number.

Yeah.

And you're right.

And because, you know, we have, every one of our franchisees has their local website, we have a national website, we're owned by bellfront for.

So any customer you know that calls about it, anything about the patch boys, guess what, I talk to them.

And so if there's a bump along the way, you know, and we know every once in a while something, we fix it, you know, we go out, we apologize, we take care of it.

Because, you know, we're here long term, we're not here short term.

Again, that's how you never run out of business.

Very simple.

Just good manners.

Yeah, no, no, you're right, you're right.

Do it right.

Be kind, be considerate, and you're not going to run out of work.

You know, it's just, no, it, it, it's.

We, we go through, you could come to our training on some of the stuff that we, that's what we, those kind of things.

It's like listening.

Be on time.

If you're going to be late, call in advance and just say, hey, I got a flight tire.

I wanted to apologize or one of the funnest times was when we showed up 10 minutes early to a customer and we called to just say, hey, we're really sorry, John, if you were a customer, we're a little early.

Just want to let you know, we'll wait to 3 o'.

Clock.

But if you wanted to, if you wanted to start earlier early, you know, that'd be great.

This customer ran out of the front door.

I still visualize this.

And we're in a truck.

Gave us a hug.

Thank you so much.

I wanted to get out of here early.

This is great.

Guess what?

That job was ours before we walked through the door.

Yep.

Yeah, I wanted to say too, for.

Some homeowners out there, quality work costs what it costs.

This is labor intensive.

There's not a drywall company that's going to come out there and in two hours, going to get a piece of drywall up, get it up there with the three coats, get it sanded, get it primed, get it textured, get it primed again.

Whatever has to be done to get it to match and have paint on it in a day, let alone you know, these are, a lot of these projects are time consuming and time equals labor.

So just make sure, guys, when you get numbers, labor's labor, it's going to cost what it costs.

It's not going to be a hundred dollar fix.

It's not what this is.

The adage you get what you pay for has stood the test of time, my friends.

It really.

And it's clearer and more evident in the contracting field versus anywhere else almost.

Yeah, no, you're right.

You're right.

We're not the cheapest out there, but we're going to do it right the first time.

We're going to make sure that you're 100% satisfied.

We're going to walk you through the job when we're done, just to make sure that, that, hey, we've gotten everything you need.

And then you're right, John, in terms of referrals, those are key things to, you know, having your business grow, to have a positive experience.

And there's so many ways that people can share now, whether it's reviews, whether it's in your neighborhood, whether it's, hey, can I put a lawn sign in for, you know, a couple days, you know, in your front yard?

Any of those things are all part of long term, you know, a long term business.

Yeah.

I tell you, just being genuine and being a considerate, decent human being and being upfront about that.

And it's exactly what I used to tell people, right?

And I was not to toot my own horn, but I would sell almost every job versus my sales guy who would sell one out of five.

And you know who I'm talking about, Goranson.

Kevin.

Yeah, Kevin.

Kevin.

But I would tell the customer up front, look, we're not the, we're not the cheapest, but we're also not going to.

We're not ripping you off.

We're not the most expensive either.

We're going to charge you what it takes and we're going to get the job done right.

And when we're done, you're going to be dancing in your kitchen, happy with us.

And that I will guarantee you, I'm not here to fight for prices.

I'm not here to outbid or under bid.

We don't do that.

We know what it takes.

We're professionals.

We're good at our jobs.

And this is what it is.

Yeah.

And Ted and John both, that's the one thing I see is the people that are the new contractors out there, whether you're a plumber, electrician, deck builder or whatever.

Else many times they're so new they don't know how to bid the job because they really don't know the steps to take it there.

More often than not, they're the ones that underbid it.

So when you're looking at a job going, okay, I've got two jobs that came in between 900 and $1200, and this one came in at 300.

Awesome.

Most likely they didn't know what they were doing, and that's going to be a really big disaster.

I spent my time working for three bucks an hour until I realized, till you do the math, that first year you're like, oh, I got to change a few things here.

Yeah, I'm old enough to remember 295 an hour, John.

Yeah, well, this is when, you know, this is when I should have been making 25 an hour, but I did.

Like Eric's talking about my first year or so of contracting, right?

You're like, oh, I could get that done for $300.

You're like, that took 300 hours.

Yeah, didn't work.

Ted, I got to ask you, what's the best way for homeowners to deal with you guys?

You know, they're looking at their wall and, and I always say to talk to the professionals first.

Sometimes you'll get the semi handy person that's going to, okay, I'm going to go up and badly hang the drywall and then I'm going to call you guys to come in.

And I'm always in that thing of, by the way, badly hung drywall can cost you more in the long run.

To think that you're trying to save $5.

Sometimes you're saving 5 and costing yourself 20 because now they have to mess around with it versus just quickly cutting a piece and putting it up there with a professional.

No, you're right in two things.

One, we don't charge for estimates.

And so calling your local patch boy franchisee, you know, I'm older, so, you know, John, I'd like to go to the customer's home.

You know, I like to stay see there.

I like to talk to them and about it.

But, you know, we, we also, you know, some of the smaller jobs, you can also do those through pictures too, or at least to give a recommendation to custom the customer.

So I would say anybody listening, reach out to a franchisee and, you know, we'll be honest with you in terms of what's, you know, what's going on, if, you know, if it's something sometimes.

Well, you guys know, they'll run into an issue.

And normally we need to be in a home that there might be a structural thing where, hey, you need to get a contractor in here, you know, because we can fix the drywall.

But there's other issues.

We're gonna, we're gonna try to do what's best for the customer because we, like I talked about, we're, we are a long term business.

Our parent company, Bell4 is a 3 billion worldwide company.

And you know, they, their CEO is very involved in, in all of our business and he's in it long term and so are we.

So we, you know, we will be, you know, your eyes and ears and you know, in terms of, answer any questions you have.

And if you like us do an estimate, of course, we'd love to do it.

And you're right, we're going to do it right.

We're going to make sure we do it right and so that by the time we're done, you know, it's something you don't have to worry about.

Makes sense.

So you guys have a ton of franchisees across the country, so what is the best way for them to search for you?

Is it good just to jump on their favorite browser and go, the Patch Boys near me and see who comes up?

Yep, I just put in the Patch Boys near, near me.

I, it would, it would come up.

You know, we, we have all the search terms that, you know, that tie in, tie into like drywall repair and it's working well those things, you know too, we have that.

But yeah, if you're looking for it and, and, or they need, we're not everywhere.

If a customer calls and needs some help, find somebody.

We, we can do that too.

So to be clear, Ted, I'm a, I'm a web guy now, right?

Web design, whatever, all of that stuff.

Marketing, blah, blah, blah.

Did a search this morning.

I'm using a, based out of Tennessee, gave me three Patch Boys.

I just put in the Patch Boys.

No dot com, no nothing.

Just the Patch Boys.

Three different locations.

You know, want a location near you, blah, blah, blah.

So, yeah, you guys doing a great job with that.

It was easy.

No, thank you.

I always hope when you say that, I'm like, hey, did it.

I mean, that's how it's supposed to work.

No, no, no, no.

If it was bad, I kept my mouth shut, but it worked perfectly.

I was like, oh, there's three of them.

Bing, bing, bing.

Checked all the websites?

No, no.

Yeah.

And those are the, you know, the nice things for our owners Right.

They don't have to worry about that.

Yeah.

We have a team, there's a marketing team that supports all of our brands.

They set that up.

We have an agency that I've trained on drywall repair for four years now.

You know, they take.

They understand the difference between Sheetrock and drywall, you know, and all.

All those different things.

Right.

You know, so they apply that to our business, and that helps our franchisees, you know, grow their business.

Nice, Ted.

They're doing a good job.

Yeah, they are.

They are.

Ted, thanks for taking the time today, man, and coming on here.

It's been great.

It's been great learning what you guys do.

And I really think you guys are filling a need out there, because there's just been, over the decades, this giant hole in the marketplace that wasn't filled.

And it's great to see somebody jumping in and saying, hey, we got this.

The time went by so fast.

It was a lot of fun in talking business.

And I really appreciate you guys connecting with us and really appreciate the both of your expertise.

You as well, man.

Thanks.

Been a great time, Ted.

Super.

Absolutely.

I love his calmness and poise.

That is experience, my friend.

When he's like, yeah, we see that.

And, you know, here's how it goes.

Absolutely.

That's.

That's what, you know, ears of knocking your head against the wall gets you, too.

Exactly.

Ben.

Been through a lot.

You know, like I said, I'm 64.

So Ben and I think the three.

Of us are all getting there to that point where you know each other experience.

Right.

On a daily basis, we look at.

Each other and go, yeah, it's not the.

It's not the.

Rarely do I say it's the first time.

I go, it's not the first time.

You know, let's figure this one out.

But I'll say the first time ones that come around now are memorable.

Right?

You got it.

Absolutely.

Thanks again, Ted.

And for John Dudley, I'm Eric G. And you've been listening to around the House.

Thanks, guys.