1 00:00:01,079 --> 00:00:03,659 Janice Porter: Hi, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode 2 00:00:03,689 --> 00:00:08,249 of relationships rule. I'm very excited to have as a guest 3 00:00:08,249 --> 00:00:14,489 today, Liz Wendling. Liz I met. Wow, I think through some 4 00:00:14,489 --> 00:00:16,889 connection book we were in, or 5 00:00:16,919 --> 00:00:19,499 Liz Wendling: was it a book Summit? It was the summit Mary. 6 00:00:19,559 --> 00:00:20,129 Yeah, that's 7 00:00:20,130 --> 00:00:23,580 Janice Porter: right. Yes. And I make it a point of finding all 8 00:00:23,580 --> 00:00:27,300 those keen people, key people that were part of the event or 9 00:00:27,300 --> 00:00:29,970 the summit or the book or whatever, and connecting with 10 00:00:29,970 --> 00:00:33,720 them. And when I came across the list, I found a goldmine. I was 11 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,590 so excited to meet Liz, and so glad that you're here. Liz, 12 00:00:37,590 --> 00:00:38,850 welcome to the show. 13 00:00:38,939 --> 00:00:42,359 Liz Wendling: Thank you, Janice. Let's do it. Yes, absolutely. 14 00:00:42,450 --> 00:00:45,240 Janice Porter: So Liz, I just want to tell my audience a 15 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,760 little bit, because this is where we're going to dig right 16 00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:50,970 in. Liz is a nationally recognized speaker, a sales 17 00:00:50,970 --> 00:00:55,320 consultant and author of six books. Her two most recent are 18 00:00:55,530 --> 00:00:59,100 the heart of authentic selling, and sell without selling your 19 00:00:59,100 --> 00:01:03,120 soul. That one is specifically for women in business. And we'll 20 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,750 get into that in a little bit. Liz is driven by the mantra, 21 00:01:06,780 --> 00:01:11,160 it's not what you sell. It's how you sell that matters. And I 22 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:16,050 love that because here we all are women, man doesn't matter. 23 00:01:16,050 --> 00:01:19,920 We're entrepreneurs or business owners were even in a career 24 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,130 sales, you know it for corporations. Doesn't matter 25 00:01:23,130 --> 00:01:27,090 what we do we have to sell. But that seems to be the most hated 26 00:01:27,090 --> 00:01:31,620 thing that people want, you know, have to do. So sorry about 27 00:01:31,620 --> 00:01:35,910 that. So tell me, Liz, how do you turn people around? Why is 28 00:01:35,910 --> 00:01:37,890 that the most hated thing? What is it? 29 00:01:38,249 --> 00:01:42,719 Liz Wendling: Well, it's always because someone has a negative 30 00:01:42,719 --> 00:01:46,469 mindset around that no different than someone that says diets 31 00:01:46,469 --> 00:01:50,039 don't work, love, relationships don't work, all men suck all 32 00:01:50,039 --> 00:01:54,629 women suck. It's a mindset. And I most of the time, people will 33 00:01:54,629 --> 00:01:57,929 say to me, I love what I do. But I hate to sell, I love my work, 34 00:01:57,929 --> 00:02:02,159 but I hate to sell. And every time I hear someone say I love 35 00:02:02,159 --> 00:02:05,519 what I do, but I hate to sell I have them say I love what I do, 36 00:02:05,519 --> 00:02:08,999 but I hate to make money. I love what I do, but I hate money. I 37 00:02:08,999 --> 00:02:13,199 love working with clients, but I just hate money. And and it's 38 00:02:13,199 --> 00:02:16,319 not about going out there and selling people something they 39 00:02:16,319 --> 00:02:20,729 don't need your service or products. Product is an 40 00:02:20,729 --> 00:02:26,489 exchange, you're exchanging your expertise for money. That's how 41 00:02:26,519 --> 00:02:30,599 an orthopedic surgeon gets gets paid, right? And there is. So 42 00:02:30,629 --> 00:02:35,489 there's a point where women especially have to stop hiding 43 00:02:35,489 --> 00:02:38,219 behind the fact that they hate to do something they don't know 44 00:02:38,219 --> 00:02:41,729 how to do. And most of the time, they hate it because of what 45 00:02:41,729 --> 00:02:45,569 they think they have to do to get someone to buy from them. So 46 00:02:45,569 --> 00:02:49,919 they think they've got to push and be aggressive and make 47 00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:52,529 people do things they don't want to do when in fact that's not 48 00:02:52,529 --> 00:02:57,779 selling at all that's being a jerk. And so, when ever I hear 49 00:02:57,779 --> 00:03:00,659 women say I don't want to be salesy. I don't want to be self 50 00:03:00,659 --> 00:03:03,899 serving. And I don't want to be pushy, Janice. I'm hoping we 51 00:03:03,899 --> 00:03:06,899 dive into this today because every time a woman says I don't 52 00:03:06,899 --> 00:03:10,739 want to be self serving pushy, aggressive, they're actually 53 00:03:10,769 --> 00:03:14,939 showing up that way. They actually sound self serving 54 00:03:14,969 --> 00:03:19,499 aggressive salesy and pushy because of the language choices, 55 00:03:19,499 --> 00:03:22,829 they're making. The words they're putting in an email, the 56 00:03:22,829 --> 00:03:26,039 messages they're leaving in a voicemail actually makes them 57 00:03:26,039 --> 00:03:30,779 sound as salesy as it gets. So a lot of people will be surprised 58 00:03:30,779 --> 00:03:33,449 with some of the words and language language that people 59 00:03:33,449 --> 00:03:37,079 use that make them sound like an old school salesperson, the very 60 00:03:37,079 --> 00:03:39,869 thing they want to avoid is what they sound like, 61 00:03:39,899 --> 00:03:42,449 Janice Porter: sound like, wow, you know, I'm going to age 62 00:03:42,449 --> 00:03:46,139 myself. But back, back in the day, I used to teach customer 63 00:03:46,139 --> 00:03:51,659 service. And I taught a lot through the I was a trainer at 64 00:03:51,659 --> 00:03:56,699 the local telephone company. And we'd sell big phone systems to 65 00:03:56,849 --> 00:04:01,769 organizations and we would go out and train them on how to use 66 00:04:01,769 --> 00:04:05,729 them. And then the soft skills. I take the receptionist and the 67 00:04:05,759 --> 00:04:09,179 first point of contact in the different departments and I do 68 00:04:09,629 --> 00:04:14,249 phone, conversation, you know, phone courtesy with them. And 69 00:04:14,249 --> 00:04:17,189 back in those days, I used to hear all the time when I 70 00:04:17,189 --> 00:04:20,309 listened to those people answered the phone, they would 71 00:04:20,309 --> 00:04:23,909 say things like, and they were always women, nine, nine out of 72 00:04:23,909 --> 00:04:27,329 10 times say things like I'm sorry, he's not here at the 73 00:04:27,329 --> 00:04:33,269 moment. He's you know, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I missed you 74 00:04:33,269 --> 00:04:36,779 or I sorry, I missed the call or they're always apologizing. Yes. 75 00:04:37,139 --> 00:04:41,039 They were always making excuses. And that was I realized and 76 00:04:41,039 --> 00:04:44,039 showed those people what they were doing is it was more about 77 00:04:44,069 --> 00:04:47,999 again, their belief or lack of belief in their in themselves in 78 00:04:47,999 --> 00:04:52,349 the power that they had to take action. He's out for lunch right 79 00:04:52,349 --> 00:04:57,839 now. May I take a message not sorry, he's out for lunch. Okay, 80 00:04:57,899 --> 00:05:00,629 can you help me that you know, right, right. Yeah. Have lots of 81 00:05:00,629 --> 00:05:06,119 things. It's the same principle I feel. And think about with the 82 00:05:06,119 --> 00:05:11,309 sales piece of languaging around sales, and not apologizing, 83 00:05:11,819 --> 00:05:13,319 which women do all the time. 84 00:05:13,410 --> 00:05:17,520 Liz Wendling: He makes men do it too. And it isn't only I'm so 85 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:21,060 sorry. Think of it this way. I know you're busy. So I won't 86 00:05:21,060 --> 00:05:23,970 take up too much of your time. I know you have a lot on your 87 00:05:23,970 --> 00:05:27,960 plate. So I'll get to the point. I know you have way more going 88 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:31,230 on than I do. I'm just sitting here trying to make a living and 89 00:05:31,230 --> 00:05:35,640 you're busier than me. It isn't. Yes, it's about the words, but 90 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:40,770 it's the energy and how it lands on someone. So when you say to 91 00:05:40,770 --> 00:05:43,470 someone, I know you're busy, I won't take up too much of your 92 00:05:43,470 --> 00:05:47,370 time. That isn't for the other person. That is typically for 93 00:05:47,370 --> 00:05:52,080 the person who's using it. You feel like you have to apologize 94 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:55,410 for doing your job. You feel like you have to say I'm so 95 00:05:55,410 --> 00:05:59,310 sorry, I know you're busy. I'm not because of how you feel 96 00:05:59,310 --> 00:06:00,330 inside you. 97 00:06:00,449 --> 00:06:03,059 Janice Porter: That's your, your mindset and your lack of 98 00:06:03,059 --> 00:06:04,109 confidence. Right? 99 00:06:04,110 --> 00:06:06,330 Liz Wendling: So when someone says I don't want to sound 100 00:06:06,330 --> 00:06:10,170 salesy or self serving, and they say something crappy like that, 101 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:13,050 I know you're busy. And I won't take up too much of your time. 102 00:06:13,230 --> 00:06:16,950 The person who you just said that to is thinking, all right, 103 00:06:16,950 --> 00:06:20,220 well, you just took up too much of my time with that stupid 104 00:06:20,220 --> 00:06:24,990 saying stop and get to the point. So all this time when 105 00:06:24,990 --> 00:06:28,800 someone says I don't want to do this, what they don't realize is 106 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,590 that it's like playing golf and you say I don't want to go in 107 00:06:31,590 --> 00:06:35,670 the sand trap. Well, your brain only hears go in the sand trap. 108 00:06:35,910 --> 00:06:38,700 So when you say I don't want to sound salesy, and you show up 109 00:06:38,700 --> 00:06:42,090 salesy anyway. So you're not doing yourself any favors 110 00:06:42,090 --> 00:06:45,570 declaring what you don't want to be, let's talk about who you do 111 00:06:45,570 --> 00:06:47,580 want to be and how you do want to show up. 112 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:50,970 Janice Porter: Okay, so can you give me a perfect example of 113 00:06:50,970 --> 00:06:55,590 turning that around and showing up the way you in today's world 114 00:06:55,650 --> 00:06:56,850 the way you would do it? 115 00:06:57,269 --> 00:07:00,509 Liz Wendling: Well, I would first say Stop apologizing, stop 116 00:07:00,509 --> 00:07:03,539 minimizing yourself, stop putting yourself in a less than 117 00:07:03,539 --> 00:07:07,589 position by apologizing for you being a strong business person, 118 00:07:07,799 --> 00:07:11,639 stop making you look like you're less than everyone else, by 119 00:07:11,639 --> 00:07:15,479 showing up with the energy of I'm less than you, I'm just 120 00:07:15,479 --> 00:07:19,259 trying to get your attention. My time, your time is more valuable 121 00:07:19,259 --> 00:07:25,619 than mine. So I tell people leave it out. Why do you have to 122 00:07:25,619 --> 00:07:28,319 say I know you're busy, I won't take up your time are you I'm so 123 00:07:28,319 --> 00:07:32,639 sorry to bother you, sorry, to be a pest. We'll take that 124 00:07:32,639 --> 00:07:36,059 language out. It doesn't belong in that conversation and step 125 00:07:36,059 --> 00:07:39,779 into the power that you own versus giving away your power in 126 00:07:39,779 --> 00:07:43,169 the first sentence of a phone call. So it doesn't belong 127 00:07:43,169 --> 00:07:47,489 there. Get to the meat of the message. So I am, if you said 128 00:07:47,489 --> 00:07:50,939 something like, I know you're busy. So I won't take up too 129 00:07:50,939 --> 00:07:53,879 much of your time. What if in your head, you said it didn't 130 00:07:53,879 --> 00:07:57,659 come out of your mouth? What would be the next sentence? You 131 00:07:57,659 --> 00:08:00,659 start with the very next sentence. All right. So if you 132 00:08:00,659 --> 00:08:03,359 don't, if you want to get to the point, sorry, you're busy, I 133 00:08:03,359 --> 00:08:05,549 know you're busy. I'll get to the point, well then get the 134 00:08:05,549 --> 00:08:09,509 hair. So the whole idea is then get into the meat of your 135 00:08:09,509 --> 00:08:12,209 message. I can't tell someone what to say. Because I don't 136 00:08:12,209 --> 00:08:15,239 know what they're calling about. But when you call and say, 137 00:08:15,239 --> 00:08:18,449 Janice, I'm glad I caught you. Or oh, Janice, I'm so glad 138 00:08:18,449 --> 00:08:22,589 you're I got you live reason I'm calling is yes. Very right. I 139 00:08:22,589 --> 00:08:27,119 mean, take the not control. You don't want to be controlling, 140 00:08:27,119 --> 00:08:31,229 but you're taking charge of what you're doing. People are busy, 141 00:08:31,229 --> 00:08:35,189 they don't have five seconds to waste on lame language that puts 142 00:08:35,189 --> 00:08:38,609 you in a bad spot. Okay, add up and own it. 143 00:08:39,210 --> 00:08:41,880 Janice Porter: I think it's would you agree that it's that 144 00:08:41,880 --> 00:08:44,610 it's fine to say hey, I'm glad you're there. Thanks for taking 145 00:08:44,610 --> 00:08:47,130 my call, or thanks for picking up the phone. I always like that 146 00:08:47,130 --> 00:08:50,610 today because nobody does. And those that do. I appreciate 147 00:08:50,610 --> 00:08:55,410 that. That's so lovely. You know, I want to see now I could 148 00:08:55,410 --> 00:08:59,610 stop myself right away, right? Or I'm calling about or want to 149 00:08:59,610 --> 00:09:02,850 share with you or something like that. Just read into it that I 150 00:09:02,850 --> 00:09:05,160 would assume would be okay. But and 151 00:09:05,159 --> 00:09:07,739 Liz Wendling: not to use three or four of them. Oh, I'm so glad 152 00:09:07,739 --> 00:09:09,989 you picked up the phone. It's so nice to talk to you. I'm so 153 00:09:10,019 --> 00:09:12,899 like, okay, just pick one and get to the point. 154 00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:15,900 Janice Porter: Got it. Okay, so language is really important. 155 00:09:16,110 --> 00:09:21,000 And there are, I've heard you, in some of your videos talk 156 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:24,810 about that. So many of those trite phrases that we use, and 157 00:09:24,810 --> 00:09:29,580 that are outdated. And I know one of your phrases is to say 158 00:09:29,580 --> 00:09:32,520 when you change your language, you change your results. And 159 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:39,420 that's a good thing to keep in my head. So. So let's talk about 160 00:09:39,420 --> 00:09:43,380 follow up because now follow up is the same thing. It's whether 161 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:45,990 you write the email or whether you pick up the phone and leave 162 00:09:45,990 --> 00:09:51,990 a voice message, or however you do it. Do you have a rule of 163 00:09:51,990 --> 00:09:56,370 thumb around how to do that effectively? 164 00:09:57,030 --> 00:09:59,970 Liz Wendling: Well, I tell people that follow up is not 165 00:10:00,450 --> 00:10:06,240 activity, it's a process you have to look at follow up as a 166 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:10,650 process in your business. It isn't one activity. Oh, let me 167 00:10:10,650 --> 00:10:15,360 follow up with Jan. No, it's not that. So what I first of all, I 168 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:19,050 call it the F word because it is you might know that's done you 169 00:10:19,050 --> 00:10:21,930 want to type out I'm just following up treat it as if you 170 00:10:21,930 --> 00:10:25,950 use the real F word. But it isn't only follow up. It's 171 00:10:26,130 --> 00:10:30,150 following up touching base reaching out checking in. We're 172 00:10:30,150 --> 00:10:34,110 talking about 40 years ago, we've been using that same 173 00:10:34,110 --> 00:10:38,070 phrase. And sometimes will say Just following up just touching 174 00:10:38,070 --> 00:10:41,220 base just wanted to try you one more time. Thought I would 175 00:10:41,220 --> 00:10:45,120 follow up but I haven't heard from you. I sent you 17 other 176 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:49,230 messages. So I always tell people, first of all, strip out 177 00:10:49,230 --> 00:10:52,530 those words strip out following up touching base reaching out 178 00:10:52,530 --> 00:10:55,740 and checking and they don't belong in our conversations. 179 00:10:55,890 --> 00:10:59,670 First of all, you're already doing the act of follow up. Why 180 00:10:59,700 --> 00:11:03,450 do you have to announce I'm going to take an inhale Now 181 00:11:03,450 --> 00:11:07,980 Janet, at Janice. And now I'm going to exhale, Janice, what 182 00:11:08,010 --> 00:11:10,410 you don't have to announce what you're doing. You're breathing? 183 00:11:10,410 --> 00:11:14,490 Just do it. You're following up, just do it. So it's stripping 184 00:11:14,490 --> 00:11:20,100 that out? And understanding that follow up is a continuation of 185 00:11:20,100 --> 00:11:22,890 what you've already started. Right? Isn't that what the what 186 00:11:22,890 --> 00:11:27,120 it really is. And if people are not getting back to you, it has 187 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:31,890 nothing to do with your message you can send 15 Follow up 188 00:11:31,890 --> 00:11:34,920 messages. If people are avoiding you. What that tells me is that 189 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:37,650 you missed the mark in your sales conversation, it means 190 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:40,710 someone doesn't feel connected and confident to get back to 191 00:11:40,710 --> 00:11:44,670 you. You've you did something in the conversation that caused 192 00:11:44,670 --> 00:11:47,760 them to completely disconnect from you and avoid all your 193 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:51,120 communication. So good. Yeah, I thought 194 00:11:51,570 --> 00:11:53,730 Janice Porter: I did have a thought because I'm in a process 195 00:11:53,730 --> 00:12:00,240 right now with somebody who I had a an initial sales call, I 196 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:06,900 guess. Okay. Yeah. And they they asked lots of questions. They 197 00:12:06,900 --> 00:12:09,720 were looking at, you know, different ways that they could 198 00:12:09,750 --> 00:12:14,640 do this for LinkedIn training. And it's a strange time right 199 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:18,480 now with July, August, they're in a, I don't want to say who's 200 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:23,280 busy what business it was. I was just looking at on their 201 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:26,580 LinkedIn profile their their posts, and they've been busy and 202 00:12:26,580 --> 00:12:29,460 whatever, because I haven't heard back from her. Okay. And I 203 00:12:29,460 --> 00:12:34,410 thought maybe I'll just send a quick message by LinkedIn. And I 204 00:12:34,410 --> 00:12:38,070 don't even know what now what I said. But I would be curious to 205 00:12:38,070 --> 00:12:48,270 know, let's do it. Because maybe I was thinking this, okay. Let's 206 00:12:48,270 --> 00:12:53,130 see if I did. I said, I hope you had a great July 4 celebration, 207 00:12:53,130 --> 00:12:55,560 and that you've survived the crazy weather happening in the 208 00:12:55,560 --> 00:13:00,030 Northeast. And here it is, I thought I'd check back with you 209 00:13:00,330 --> 00:13:03,270 to see if you're still thinking of doing some LinkedIn training 210 00:13:03,300 --> 00:13:04,770 or if you have any questions for me. 211 00:13:05,010 --> 00:13:08,790 Liz Wendling: Okay, that was in. Okay. All right. All right, a 212 00:13:08,790 --> 00:13:11,730 couple of let's just be transparent, because if I'm 213 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:15,120 honest with you, someone will learn from it that's full of a 214 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:21,000 couple of fails inside of that. So okay, I am in unless you 215 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:25,230 really know someone, first of all, if you and I know each 216 00:13:25,230 --> 00:13:29,790 other now, a couple of weeks. Yeah. I still wouldn't even put 217 00:13:29,790 --> 00:13:32,520 in an email. Hey, Janice. I hope you had a great Fourth of July 218 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:36,900 weekend. I wouldn't start there. I would end there. That's so 219 00:13:36,900 --> 00:13:37,260 funny, 220 00:13:37,260 --> 00:13:39,360 Janice Porter: cuz I had it the other way around. And then I 221 00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:41,160 changed it today. 222 00:13:41,339 --> 00:13:43,469 Liz Wendling: Because when you say to someone, hey, I hope 223 00:13:43,469 --> 00:13:46,049 you're doing well. Hope. I hope you had a great weekend. I hope 224 00:13:46,049 --> 00:13:49,709 all as well, I hope this email finds you. Well. The recipient 225 00:13:49,709 --> 00:13:54,509 is thinking No, you freaking don't. You are. Do I really 226 00:13:54,509 --> 00:13:57,449 think you sat there and thought, Oh, I hope Liz had a really 227 00:13:57,449 --> 00:14:01,979 wonderful weekend. No, nobody believes that anymore. So I'm 228 00:14:01,979 --> 00:14:06,269 not suggesting you not be nice, Janice. I'm suggesting there's 229 00:14:06,299 --> 00:14:10,379 there's a way to re engineer an email these days. So I would put 230 00:14:10,379 --> 00:14:13,439 that at the end PS I hope you survived. I saw the crazy 231 00:14:13,439 --> 00:14:17,099 weather in the northeast, something like that. But But 232 00:14:17,339 --> 00:14:22,769 here's where i where i i try to dig in first is how did you end 233 00:14:22,799 --> 00:14:25,799 that meeting with this particular person? How what was 234 00:14:25,799 --> 00:14:29,639 the last communication you had with? Let's call her Mary Smith. 235 00:14:29,669 --> 00:14:31,919 Would you say to Mary at the end of that, 236 00:14:32,130 --> 00:14:36,390 Janice Porter: I was weird because usually what I do is I 237 00:14:36,450 --> 00:14:40,140 try to book a follow up call with them. Because I felt like 238 00:14:40,140 --> 00:14:43,680 she was definitely in control. And she was saying I'm going to 239 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:47,970 review all of this over the next while I do have a project and 240 00:14:47,970 --> 00:14:51,420 doing she said but I'm going to review it and I will get back to 241 00:14:51,420 --> 00:14:54,150 you. You know, the kiss of death. I'll get back to you but 242 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:59,400 that but I didn't think it was over. Okay. And so that's how it 243 00:14:59,400 --> 00:14:59,790 ended. 244 00:15:00,419 --> 00:15:02,879 Liz Wendling: How do you typically end up? Do you 245 00:15:02,879 --> 00:15:05,039 typically try to get a meeting booked? 246 00:15:05,460 --> 00:15:08,580 Janice Porter: Yeah, I typically will say, I don't know what, 247 00:15:08,580 --> 00:15:14,520 what, why I didn't do that, in this particular instance. She 248 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:18,660 wasn't a typical type of client for me. And so there could have 249 00:15:18,660 --> 00:15:24,420 been something there from my side, internally. But, um, but I 250 00:15:24,450 --> 00:15:27,420 normally will say something like, you know, absolutely, 251 00:15:27,450 --> 00:15:30,900 would it be okay, if we set a time on our calendar, we get so 252 00:15:30,900 --> 00:15:33,570 busy, and I'll just, we'll just do a quick follow up call either 253 00:15:33,570 --> 00:15:36,600 way, doesn't matter, like something to take the pressure 254 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:37,980 off, but to book the call, 255 00:15:38,100 --> 00:15:40,920 Liz Wendling: okay. But all the language you just used when you 256 00:15:41,130 --> 00:15:43,830 when you listen to this recording everything you said, 257 00:15:43,860 --> 00:15:46,980 you gave away your power? Would it be okay? Could we get 258 00:15:46,980 --> 00:15:50,760 something on there just to check in just to make sure you stay 259 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:52,140 Janice Porter: connected clients. 260 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:56,580 Liz Wendling: So this is the kind of stuff Janice and I 261 00:15:56,580 --> 00:16:00,060 appreciate you being a model and showing that I know you and I 262 00:16:00,060 --> 00:16:03,810 know you're a kind lady, and I know you're only trying to keep 263 00:16:03,810 --> 00:16:08,730 that momentum going. But here's where that language, we take all 264 00:16:08,730 --> 00:16:11,310 the air out of the tires, and then we think the car is going 265 00:16:11,310 --> 00:16:16,380 to go somewhere. Okay, frame it for me. So it sounded like when 266 00:16:16,380 --> 00:16:19,320 you were describing this person, she was asking all of the 267 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:23,880 questions versus you. Okay, so let, she might have just been 268 00:16:24,090 --> 00:16:27,150 one of those people that had no interest in doing business with 269 00:16:27,150 --> 00:16:30,750 you. Someone who's interested answers questions, because 270 00:16:30,750 --> 00:16:33,270 you're the driver, the you're the person. 271 00:16:33,780 --> 00:16:36,690 Janice Porter: He did ask what? Oh, okay. All right. It was a 272 00:16:36,690 --> 00:16:40,890 back and forth. And she had her social media guy on the call. 273 00:16:41,490 --> 00:16:44,820 Liz Wendling: All right, yeah. So then I personally would have 274 00:16:44,820 --> 00:16:47,490 handled it a little differently. And it's what I teach my clients 275 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:51,660 is at the end of the meeting, asking to book a next meeting is 276 00:16:51,660 --> 00:16:56,250 a little, there's a little pressure in that. That's making 277 00:16:56,340 --> 00:17:01,440 me behave on your timeline. Versus you behaving on mine, the 278 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:06,780 buyer? Yeah. So when so? To me, it sounds that languaging is a 279 00:17:06,780 --> 00:17:09,600 little outdated. Everybody will say, Oh, you got to book that 280 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:12,930 next meeting. Don't leave one call without the next one. All 281 00:17:12,930 --> 00:17:17,370 right, if it was still 9995, I'd say all right, that's perfect. 282 00:17:17,370 --> 00:17:22,530 We're not anymore. Okay. So it is. So remember, follow up is a 283 00:17:22,530 --> 00:17:27,030 process. It's not an event, you treat it like an event. So I 284 00:17:27,030 --> 00:17:31,080 would say, if let's I'm going to channel that woman that you are 285 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:34,290 on the phone with, I might say, Janice, I appreciate your 286 00:17:34,290 --> 00:17:38,550 honesty, and you're going to review everything. And it's you 287 00:17:38,550 --> 00:17:41,100 know, it's nice to know you're looking at some options, and I 288 00:17:41,100 --> 00:17:46,620 appreciate your communication. How would you like us to stay in 289 00:17:46,620 --> 00:17:50,880 communication now? This is you on the phone or a zoom call with 290 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:55,170 someone collaborating around follow up, not you saying, hey, 291 00:17:55,170 --> 00:17:57,960 I want to get you on my calendar, so I can try to sell 292 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:01,470 you a little more. And I know that's not what you said. But 293 00:18:01,470 --> 00:18:02,550 that's what they heard. 294 00:18:02,580 --> 00:18:06,210 Janice Porter: Yes, yes. I love that. Okay, Mike has to move 295 00:18:06,210 --> 00:18:06,660 forward. 296 00:18:06,870 --> 00:18:09,330 Liz Wendling: So if I said to you, hey, Janice, I know you're 297 00:18:09,330 --> 00:18:12,420 gonna get crazy. I'm gonna get crazy. We're in that July August 298 00:18:12,420 --> 00:18:15,810 timeframe where people are on vacation. What what do you want 299 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:21,450 us to do next? What's the next step? Let me tell you versus you 300 00:18:21,450 --> 00:18:25,650 telling me, the buyer is I don't want you to completely give up 301 00:18:25,650 --> 00:18:29,520 the control to the buyer. But I want you to be collaborative. I 302 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:34,410 want everyone to think that this is a we situation, not me trying 303 00:18:34,410 --> 00:18:37,830 to tell you what, here's what I want. I want to talk. Yeah, 304 00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:41,610 that's awesome. And you will, and when the language does get 305 00:18:41,610 --> 00:18:43,920 changed. So when I say change your language, change your 306 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:47,910 results. It is amazing when I get in there, and I work with 307 00:18:47,910 --> 00:18:50,670 someone and we shift all the language and then they'll say to 308 00:18:50,670 --> 00:18:55,410 me, holy crap, plus, I sent one, one message and that person got 309 00:18:55,410 --> 00:18:59,370 right back to me. Or it only took two tries to get ahold of 310 00:18:59,370 --> 00:19:03,360 this person. Or I've emailed this person 10 times and they're 311 00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:06,180 not responding. And then I give them some language to kind of 312 00:19:06,180 --> 00:19:09,390 kick up the dust again. And they're like, Oh, my God, that 313 00:19:09,390 --> 00:19:13,260 person got right back to me. But you sound like everyone else 314 00:19:13,290 --> 00:19:17,010 inside their inbox. Everyone else sounds a lot like the 315 00:19:17,010 --> 00:19:20,160 message you left. Everyone says, just checking in following up 316 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:22,500 touching base. You're ready to get started. I know we talked 317 00:19:22,500 --> 00:19:27,690 about that. It isn't enough to get people to keep the momentum 318 00:19:27,690 --> 00:19:28,170 going. 319 00:19:28,590 --> 00:19:31,830 Janice Porter: Can I can I save her? Can I salvage this? If she 320 00:19:31,830 --> 00:19:32,790 doesn't answer me? 321 00:19:33,150 --> 00:19:35,820 Liz Wendling: Yeah, you might be able to go back and say to her, 322 00:19:36,150 --> 00:19:39,840 said there was no problem in that email, meaning you didn't 323 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,770 say to her, you and I talked about the potential of XY and Z. 324 00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:46,560 You mentioned you were struggling with this or wanted 325 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:50,100 some help around that. I don't know if that's still a priority 326 00:19:50,100 --> 00:19:54,060 or still on your radar. But it lets either to keep the momentum 327 00:19:54,060 --> 00:19:58,230 going or figure out what the next step looks like if there is 328 00:19:58,230 --> 00:20:03,270 a next step. So there's a lot more, there's just more ways to 329 00:20:03,270 --> 00:20:08,880 engage someone than your basic boring, bland, vanilla generic 330 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:12,960 and outdated, same old, lame old language of just following up. 331 00:20:13,380 --> 00:20:15,570 Janice Porter: Perfect. I fell right into your trap. And it's 332 00:20:15,570 --> 00:20:16,020 perfect. 333 00:20:17,250 --> 00:20:20,490 Liz Wendling: Thank you. Thank you for showing everybody that 334 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:25,080 this is not intuitive. This is not this is why people call me 335 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,800 and say I need a makeover. I need your sales clinic, I need 336 00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:32,490 to be in your messaging makeover. And once you do it and 337 00:20:32,490 --> 00:20:36,390 fix it, you never need me again. That's the best part. You 338 00:20:37,980 --> 00:20:40,050 Janice Porter: gonna say? So tell me tell me how you feel 339 00:20:40,050 --> 00:20:46,860 about Do you ever do LinkedIn messaging for working messages 340 00:20:46,860 --> 00:20:48,690 on LinkedIn? That kind of thing? Like a 341 00:20:48,690 --> 00:20:51,480 Liz Wendling: prospecting message? Yes, absolutely. All 342 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:52,440 the time? Yes. 343 00:20:52,530 --> 00:20:56,190 Janice Porter: Okay. So, obviously, none of us want to be 344 00:20:56,190 --> 00:20:59,610 pitched. So we don't want the first message to be a pitch, 345 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,430 right? And it happens all the time. And it happens all the 346 00:21:02,430 --> 00:21:08,460 time, then we've got some people who, okay, it's, it's the the 347 00:21:08,460 --> 00:21:12,270 complete opposite, where it's just that that generic, you 348 00:21:12,270 --> 00:21:16,200 know, let's book you know, nice to meet you. Let's book a call 349 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:19,230 and see how we can help each other on LinkedIn or whatever. 350 00:21:19,830 --> 00:21:24,180 It was expanding my LinkedIn thing, and you know, you came up 351 00:21:24,180 --> 00:21:30,240 and and then I, so do you ever do something like this, and I 352 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,030 haven't done this, but I want to just test the waters with this. 353 00:21:33,030 --> 00:21:38,310 So where you've done a search, you found a group of people that 354 00:21:38,310 --> 00:21:40,920 you would like to try and connect with in terms of their, 355 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:45,600 their job function, or their, their business or their 356 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:48,810 location, whatever the filters are, that you want, and you 357 00:21:48,810 --> 00:21:52,890 found a group of people. Now you start on your outreach, I always 358 00:21:52,890 --> 00:21:56,820 check. Because I teach LinkedIn, I taught I teach people to look 359 00:21:56,820 --> 00:21:59,550 at that person's profile to see number one, if they're active. 360 00:21:59,670 --> 00:22:02,670 Number two, if it feels like it might be a fit, and you want to 361 00:22:03,060 --> 00:22:08,760 pursue it. So now the first message goes out. So would you 362 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:15,510 ever do something like this? Let's say my, my, my audience 363 00:22:15,510 --> 00:22:22,530 are all business consultants. Okay, there. Yeah, so let's say 364 00:22:22,530 --> 00:22:29,640 I've created a an ebook around how business consultants can use 365 00:22:29,670 --> 00:22:33,750 LinkedIn with my tips or something like that. So my first 366 00:22:33,750 --> 00:22:36,990 message now, I would say you have to connect first. 367 00:22:38,610 --> 00:22:41,130 Liz Wendling: Let's assume you're connected. So 368 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,740 Janice Porter: in some format, some form of saying, you know, 369 00:22:46,740 --> 00:22:52,470 would you be interested in in my top 10 tips for using LinkedIn 370 00:22:52,470 --> 00:22:56,100 as a business or growing your business on LinkedIn as a 371 00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:59,640 business consultant? If so, just say, yes, I'd be happy to send 372 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:04,230 it to you, something like that. Does that seem pitchy? A little 373 00:23:04,230 --> 00:23:04,650 bit 374 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:07,260 Liz Wendling: the term would you be interested, 375 00:23:07,470 --> 00:23:08,550 Janice Porter: you know, like that. Right? 376 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:12,450 Liz Wendling: That is that screams. salesy. Yeah. Would you 377 00:23:12,450 --> 00:23:15,960 be interested if I could show you a way to save money on your 378 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,650 car insurance? So without getting into a full blown 379 00:23:19,650 --> 00:23:24,390 training here, that's, that is a way to get in and asking them to 380 00:23:24,390 --> 00:23:27,900 reply back is better than just dropping it in there. And 381 00:23:28,590 --> 00:23:35,130 Janice Porter: I'm looking for a way to to qualify people, right? 382 00:23:35,610 --> 00:23:39,630 They obviously say, yes, they're interested. They're more 383 00:23:39,630 --> 00:23:42,450 interested in that, you know, that at least you can send it to 384 00:23:42,450 --> 00:23:46,230 them. And, but I'm just wondering if that approach is 385 00:23:46,230 --> 00:23:49,440 still salesy. So instead of would you be interested? How 386 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:50,190 would you frame it? 387 00:23:50,759 --> 00:23:53,399 Liz Wendling: Well, it would be a whole rewrite of that email, 388 00:23:53,399 --> 00:23:59,429 because, first of all, why them? What's inside these 10 tips that 389 00:23:59,429 --> 00:24:03,719 I couldn't go google or Go to chat? GPT what is it in your 390 00:24:03,719 --> 00:24:07,649 stuff that's unique or different or insightful? So there's, 391 00:24:08,069 --> 00:24:11,849 there's has to be more meat on the bones is the only way that I 392 00:24:11,849 --> 00:24:12,749 can describe it. 393 00:24:12,990 --> 00:24:17,130 Janice Porter: And yet the reason I'm asking this is 394 00:24:17,130 --> 00:24:19,200 because I was listening to someone talking about this the 395 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,100 other day on a podcast. One of the things that this person was 396 00:24:23,100 --> 00:24:29,910 saying is that he had a really good first email that he had 397 00:24:29,910 --> 00:24:33,930 used for yours and similar to that, but longer so it had a bit 398 00:24:33,930 --> 00:24:37,350 more meat in it. But it wasn't getting a response today and 399 00:24:37,380 --> 00:24:41,310 that's why he changed it to one sentence type of deal. It is 400 00:24:41,370 --> 00:24:45,630 working. So that kind of brings me to the question of like, 401 00:24:45,630 --> 00:24:50,100 what's different today with with the audience then it was you 402 00:24:50,100 --> 00:24:52,530 know, because you keep saying those are outdated, these things 403 00:24:52,530 --> 00:24:56,280 are outdated. So what, how, what's different today about the 404 00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:58,860 audience and more sophisticated or they 405 00:24:58,860 --> 00:25:03,120 Liz Wendling: are within their She's so much more skeptical. 406 00:25:03,150 --> 00:25:07,590 their inboxes are bloated, and they're filled with pitches. 407 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,070 They're filled with messages that sound like, Hey, I hope you 408 00:25:11,070 --> 00:25:13,410 had a good weekend. Yeah, it looks like you're a busy 409 00:25:13,410 --> 00:25:17,340 consultant or Oh, you like the color blue soda? Why isn't that 410 00:25:17,340 --> 00:25:21,840 crazy. And then they pitch someone. So there if your 411 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:27,870 message isn't written, here's the key, written to me, not at 412 00:25:27,870 --> 00:25:33,090 me write a message to me, not at me make it feel like Janice sat 413 00:25:33,090 --> 00:25:38,610 down and wrote it to me, a message that feels like it's 414 00:25:38,610 --> 00:25:43,230 landing in my inbox with intention, not generic, see, 415 00:25:43,230 --> 00:25:47,040 generic just doesn't do it any more. Because of how bloated my 416 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:51,780 inbox, I could spot an email, that is a sales pitch. Sometimes 417 00:25:51,780 --> 00:25:54,450 even before I log on to LinkedIn, I could feel it coming 418 00:25:54,450 --> 00:25:58,200 through my computer. And too many people don't want to put 419 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,920 the time in and the energy and the thought in and what word 420 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:06,420 choices feel good to me. Who am I as a business owner? And how 421 00:26:06,420 --> 00:26:10,740 do I want to show up? What do I want to convey? How what 422 00:26:10,740 --> 00:26:14,190 intention do I want to start with, so that my very first 423 00:26:14,190 --> 00:26:17,160 interaction with someone actually starts to build 424 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:22,680 momentum. So, and I hear this a lot, Oh, I heard on a podcast or 425 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:27,210 one trainer told me this, or oh, I downloaded a template and it 426 00:26:27,210 --> 00:26:30,930 worked. Somebody made $8 million dollars in five minutes on this 427 00:26:30,930 --> 00:26:34,980 thing. Just because something is popular doesn't mean it works. 428 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,070 It just means it's popular. Okay, just because everybody's 429 00:26:38,070 --> 00:26:41,160 doing it doesn't mean it works. And just because it worked for 430 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,780 one person might not work for you. So this is why people are 431 00:26:45,780 --> 00:26:49,560 spinning their wheels. This is why so many people are hitting 432 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:52,470 brick walls, whether it's on LinkedIn, or email or any part 433 00:26:52,470 --> 00:26:55,530 of their business, because they're looking for a tactic. 434 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:59,220 They're looking for that pie in the sky, that one little nugget, 435 00:26:59,220 --> 00:27:02,970 that hack that they could use, versus stepping back far enough 436 00:27:02,970 --> 00:27:06,300 and saying, wait a second, if I'm going to do the work, I'm 437 00:27:06,300 --> 00:27:11,160 going to type out 456 emails to someone. Why don't I first 438 00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,250 figure out what I want to convey? What's the intention? 439 00:27:14,340 --> 00:27:17,580 How do I want to keep the momentum going with them? How do 440 00:27:17,580 --> 00:27:23,160 I even send an email that? And I would never suggest anybody say 441 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,730 this, but just to get the meat here is? How do I stop 442 00:27:26,730 --> 00:27:29,310 connecting with someone? If there's nothing there? How do I 443 00:27:29,310 --> 00:27:33,480 let them know that I'm done? I'm pausing our outreach? How do you 444 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:37,320 talk to someone the way they like to be talked to, versus 445 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,860 sounding like, I'm not trying to sell you anything, when every 446 00:27:40,860 --> 00:27:45,390 word you use makes it sounds like you are. So the 447 00:27:45,540 --> 00:27:49,650 Janice Porter: in order to be authentic. And to be real, I 448 00:27:49,650 --> 00:27:54,600 think involves really two sides to that coin. One is that you 449 00:27:55,140 --> 00:27:58,710 the person writing it sending the message has to come from the 450 00:27:58,710 --> 00:28:03,120 heart, they have to be real. The only way I find that I can be 451 00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:07,140 real with someone I don't know, is by paying attention to like 452 00:28:07,140 --> 00:28:10,020 what's on their profile or, or what I've learned about that 453 00:28:10,020 --> 00:28:16,200 person before I reach out so that if I can include something 454 00:28:17,100 --> 00:28:21,150 in my message that shows that I paid attention. Would that be 455 00:28:21,180 --> 00:28:24,570 like 10 times better? Or is it still not still? 456 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,960 Liz Wendling: Make Janice Think about how many people say, Oh, I 457 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,290 popped on your LinkedIn profile? It looks like again, you were 458 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:34,080 you written two books, or oh, it looks like we went on the scene 459 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:39,510 on knowledge. Yeah, okay. That isn't enough anymore. In fact, I 460 00:28:39,510 --> 00:28:43,680 would rather someone leave that out, then use it. Because it 461 00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:47,910 brings me back from eight years ago, it brings me back to the 462 00:28:47,910 --> 00:28:51,390 LinkedIn training that says, find something on their profile, 463 00:28:51,540 --> 00:28:55,740 and mention it. Like that's going to open me up and fillet 464 00:28:55,740 --> 00:28:58,950 me like a fish. And now I'm going to be the favorite person, 465 00:28:59,010 --> 00:29:02,220 your favorite person in the world. It's not enough people, 466 00:29:02,220 --> 00:29:05,850 our whole art. They're on guard. So when you say something like, 467 00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:09,450 oh, I What a great article you wrote last week. All right. 468 00:29:10,500 --> 00:29:13,500 Okay, but that doesn't make me want to know you and if any more 469 00:29:13,500 --> 00:29:15,360 than I do. So 470 00:29:15,420 --> 00:29:17,850 Janice Porter: this really because there's people that will 471 00:29:17,850 --> 00:29:25,050 respond and say, basically, they'll respond and say, so I'm 472 00:29:25,050 --> 00:29:29,580 very busy. Basically, what? I can help you with that, right? 473 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:30,480 And so 474 00:29:30,510 --> 00:29:33,120 Liz Wendling: those aren't my people. Not only is it not your 475 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:37,290 people, it tells you you missed the target. Yeah, target 476 00:29:37,290 --> 00:29:42,450 completely. So I appreciate people who do the work, who are 477 00:29:42,450 --> 00:29:45,960 getting on LinkedIn, who are sending outreach who are doing 478 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:50,730 podcasts who are doing so much of the good meaty stuff in their 479 00:29:50,730 --> 00:29:55,500 business. But I feel bad when they don't take the time to 480 00:29:55,500 --> 00:29:59,130 close the loop. So they're doing all of the good stuff and they 481 00:29:59,130 --> 00:30:02,880 forget that say Sales is a process sales is a conversation. 482 00:30:03,030 --> 00:30:07,620 Sales is a service piece, following up as a is not an 483 00:30:07,620 --> 00:30:11,640 event, it's a process. And how do you button up all your hard 484 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:14,910 work in the beginning to ensure that somebody even wants to 485 00:30:14,910 --> 00:30:17,640 communicate with you, and then maybe eventually hop on the 486 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,670 phone with you, and then maybe eventually say, hey, Janice, 487 00:30:20,820 --> 00:30:24,780 tell me about your LinkedIn program. And so it's it's 488 00:30:24,810 --> 00:30:29,370 building that momentum. And I know people will say it's all 489 00:30:29,370 --> 00:30:32,130 about relationships, it's all about know, like, and trust, and 490 00:30:32,130 --> 00:30:36,960 I call BS on both. Here's why. It I know a lot of people, I 491 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,720 like a lot of people, and I trust a lot of people. But that 492 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:43,110 doesn't mean you get a penny of my money. Know, like, and trust 493 00:30:43,140 --> 00:30:49,110 only gets you a ticket to the game. Relevance. And value is 494 00:30:49,110 --> 00:30:52,020 where I'm going to start communicating with you if what 495 00:30:52,020 --> 00:30:56,220 you tell me is relevant to my world, and really will help me 496 00:30:56,220 --> 00:30:59,430 in my business, and there's value in that. I'll give you a 497 00:30:59,430 --> 00:31:02,730 sliver of my time. Other than that, you're getting deleted. 498 00:31:02,910 --> 00:31:06,600 That's it. So it's taking the time, all that time, all that 499 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:11,370 energy and money, people invest on programs that do fill up a 500 00:31:11,370 --> 00:31:14,760 pipeline, but then will not invest in the piece that I 501 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:17,400 teach, which is the right language and the right 502 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:21,870 messaging. So it feels like you are in the in the process with 503 00:31:21,870 --> 00:31:26,580 them not trying to sell them something. And it's hard to 504 00:31:26,580 --> 00:31:30,300 watch Janice it really is it's, it's like you watch people in 505 00:31:30,300 --> 00:31:33,150 the gym, they just ran 20 miles on the treadmill. But then you 506 00:31:33,150 --> 00:31:35,850 go see them and they're at the drive thru at McDonald's eating 507 00:31:35,850 --> 00:31:39,990 for Big Macs, you know, that it's something is wrong with 508 00:31:39,990 --> 00:31:43,110 their workout. They'll say I'm not, I'm not losing any weight. 509 00:31:43,140 --> 00:31:46,860 I don't understand. Well, I just saw you at the drive thru. Same 510 00:31:46,860 --> 00:31:49,410 thing with my clients. They'll say, Listen, I'm doing this, I'm 511 00:31:49,410 --> 00:31:52,710 doing that I have all this in place. And then I asked them my 512 00:31:52,710 --> 00:31:55,950 top 10 favorite questions, and then we figure out oh, you're 513 00:31:55,950 --> 00:32:00,720 going to the drive thru at McDonald's now again. So then, 514 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,950 and only then are they willing to close the loop, finish that 515 00:32:04,950 --> 00:32:09,270 last portion, so that everything they do has has value and 516 00:32:09,270 --> 00:32:12,120 meaning and starts to make money, move the momentum? 517 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,980 Janice Porter: So are you then saying though, that it is about 518 00:32:16,980 --> 00:32:22,530 building relationships first or not? No, you're saying not see, 519 00:32:23,100 --> 00:32:26,910 relationships? You're challenging everything I am, 520 00:32:26,970 --> 00:32:29,970 Liz Wendling: I am counter to everything. Because for 50 521 00:32:29,970 --> 00:32:33,510 years, we heard it's all about relationships. Everything's 522 00:32:33,510 --> 00:32:34,590 about a relationship. 523 00:32:35,100 --> 00:32:38,340 Janice Porter: It was more it was more transactional back 524 00:32:38,340 --> 00:32:38,730 then. 525 00:32:38,820 --> 00:32:41,730 Liz Wendling: Right? But when I hear it's all about 526 00:32:41,730 --> 00:32:46,410 relationships, don't sell, just serve. All those little mantras 527 00:32:46,410 --> 00:32:51,330 mean nothing anymore. People are busy. They they, I don't need a 528 00:32:51,330 --> 00:32:54,300 relationship with everybody I do business with, right. I mean, I 529 00:32:54,300 --> 00:32:58,110 have my kitchen and bathrooms done right? totally remodeled. I 530 00:32:58,110 --> 00:33:01,110 don't need a relationship with the guy who did it all I don't, 531 00:33:01,290 --> 00:33:04,620 I just need you to show me that you're the right person for the 532 00:33:04,620 --> 00:33:07,500 job. And that when someone asked me who did my kitchen and 533 00:33:07,500 --> 00:33:10,770 bathrooms, your name comes up. I haven't talked to the guy in 534 00:33:10,770 --> 00:33:15,720 three years. But we have a working relationship, but not 535 00:33:15,750 --> 00:33:19,020 yet we would people think is Oh, you have to build relationships. 536 00:33:19,170 --> 00:33:21,450 I'm not saying they're not important. Where the 537 00:33:21,450 --> 00:33:25,440 relationship becomes important is when you agree to do business 538 00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:29,160 together. And you treat each other like the human beings we 539 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,060 have the capacity to do. And that's where the relationship 540 00:33:33,060 --> 00:33:35,790 gets solidified. I might know you like and trust you to get 541 00:33:35,790 --> 00:33:38,520 you to talk to you. But I'm going to need some relevance and 542 00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,880 some value. That's where the relationship really gets 543 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:46,350 enhanced. So the pieces on the chessboard have moved. So 544 00:33:46,380 --> 00:33:49,380 anytime you want to throw out a mantra that says it's all about 545 00:33:49,380 --> 00:33:53,040 this, or oh sales are about listening, you know what course 546 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:57,030 it is? But is that all? It is? No, it's the whole package. So 547 00:33:57,030 --> 00:34:01,920 it's having me the ability to step far enough back and say, 548 00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:05,820 Where do I plug the holes in a new world? That's so different? 549 00:34:06,150 --> 00:34:09,990 And it's plugging those holes. And I bet you have a decade if 550 00:34:09,990 --> 00:34:12,750 you plug the holes, you probably have a decade of runway to 551 00:34:12,750 --> 00:34:15,180 continue to use those. That process. 552 00:34:15,539 --> 00:34:19,589 Janice Porter: Hmm, interesting. Okay, so the two most recent 553 00:34:19,589 --> 00:34:21,989 books that you've written, which I mentioned earlier, the heart 554 00:34:21,989 --> 00:34:25,979 of authentic selling, sell without selling your soul, which 555 00:34:25,979 --> 00:34:27,569 one's going to help me the most? 556 00:34:27,929 --> 00:34:30,629 Liz Wendling: Well, I because you're a woman, I would say go 557 00:34:30,629 --> 00:34:34,079 to sell without selling your soul because it does go into a 558 00:34:34,079 --> 00:34:37,529 lot of what we talked about today. And even the heart of 559 00:34:37,529 --> 00:34:42,269 authentic selling, it really comes down to being a good human 560 00:34:42,269 --> 00:34:45,689 being is really what it comes down to. Now in both of those 561 00:34:45,689 --> 00:34:49,349 books, there's examples there's ways to build value. There's 562 00:34:49,349 --> 00:34:53,639 ways to show people that I'm not here just for the sale, and 563 00:34:53,699 --> 00:34:59,099 actually mean it and it's felt it's not just you saying I'm 564 00:34:59,099 --> 00:35:02,939 authentic. It's being it's so much that somebody else is the 565 00:35:02,939 --> 00:35:06,869 one who says you're so authentic. Yes, it's having 566 00:35:06,869 --> 00:35:10,739 being such a good human being and so good at asking questions 567 00:35:10,739 --> 00:35:14,729 and helping people see the value in your offering. That's when 568 00:35:14,729 --> 00:35:18,419 they say, Janice, how do we get started? Not. Thank you for your 569 00:35:18,449 --> 00:35:21,119 thank you for your information. I'll get back to you. 570 00:35:21,300 --> 00:35:25,080 Janice Porter: Yes, I know there recently somebody said to me on 571 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:30,510 a first call. Wow, you've given me such value already. Yes. You 572 00:35:30,510 --> 00:35:35,400 know, is now the opening, you know, and I loved that. And so 573 00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,160 it's paying attention to those kinds of things that work, I 574 00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:43,950 think, yes. Well, I have to say, Liz, you, you challenged me in 575 00:35:43,950 --> 00:35:47,190 more ways than one today, I'm glad that I was able to be the 576 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:51,060 guinea pig in a way because I'm always open to learning. And I 577 00:35:51,060 --> 00:35:56,730 know, for me, I didn't come up through sales, even though I 578 00:35:56,730 --> 00:36:02,460 know we're always selling. I was a teacher. And so I was a school 579 00:36:02,460 --> 00:36:05,550 teacher than I was a corporate trainer. I never had to sell 580 00:36:05,550 --> 00:36:08,580 anything. All I had to do was go out and show them how to use it. 581 00:36:08,610 --> 00:36:12,960 Right. Right. So I everything I've learned is self taught and 582 00:36:13,020 --> 00:36:16,440 and there's always room for improvement. So thank you, thank 583 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:22,920 you for sharing your viewpoint and your expertise with us. 584 00:36:23,070 --> 00:36:25,320 Liz Wendling: You're welcome. And thanks for being coachable 585 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:27,990 live for everybody to say. Yeah, 586 00:36:28,049 --> 00:36:31,409 Janice Porter: absolutely. And I would like to just end with with 587 00:36:31,409 --> 00:36:36,059 one question for you to just leave for my audience is, what 588 00:36:36,059 --> 00:36:43,499 would your top tip for sales be for being the best salesperson 589 00:36:43,499 --> 00:36:46,409 you can be? What would be the best thing that you could leave 590 00:36:46,409 --> 00:36:47,429 with my audience? 591 00:36:47,820 --> 00:36:51,180 Liz Wendling: Oh, gosh, I guess I'm gonna stay up there with the 592 00:36:51,180 --> 00:36:54,450 topic that we're on is watch your language. Watch what comes 593 00:36:54,450 --> 00:36:58,230 out of your mouth. Watch what you tell yourself, and then what 594 00:36:58,230 --> 00:37:01,350 leaves your lips. If you say to yourself, oh, I don't want to be 595 00:37:01,350 --> 00:37:03,840 salesy, but then you look at your language and you are 596 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:08,010 salesy. That's a sign right there that you're not congruent 597 00:37:08,370 --> 00:37:11,520 in your language and who you're being and how you're showing up. 598 00:37:11,670 --> 00:37:14,940 And if you don't think your potential clients notice, you're 599 00:37:14,940 --> 00:37:18,300 lying to yourself, they feel it. And when they don't respond to 600 00:37:18,300 --> 00:37:20,880 you, they don't call you back. They don't hire you. They keep 601 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:24,810 saying, Oh, not yet. It's a sign that something isn't lined up 602 00:37:24,810 --> 00:37:29,700 inter externally and internally. And once you get those, like a 603 00:37:29,700 --> 00:37:33,930 piece of velcro stuck together your internal and external way 604 00:37:33,930 --> 00:37:37,080 of being, it's going to be a little challenging in a world 605 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,690 that's getting more and more challenging to sell every single 606 00:37:39,690 --> 00:37:40,050 day. 607 00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:43,680 Janice Porter: Thank you. Thank you for that. Thank you, Janice. 608 00:37:43,950 --> 00:37:47,160 And thank you to my audience as usual for being here and 609 00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:51,120 listening. If you liked what you heard, please leave a review and 610 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:56,010 let us know. 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