Jordan from Lakeland, Florida. No, I did not swim here. I'm Cuban and Arabic. And anytime I tell somebody that, they ask me if I'm a terrorist or if I swam here, especially since I live in Florida. We'll discuss race and how it plays a factor and how we didn't even talk about this topic, because we were afraid.

A black executive perspective,

welcome to a black executive perspective podcast, a safe space where we discuss all matters related to race, especially race in corporate America. I'm your host, Tony tidbit. So today I am at, as you can see, W N H U. 88. 7 on the Richter dial at the University of New Haven. So again, I want to thank the University of New Haven for allowing a Black Executive Perspective podcast to come in and promote our message in their studio. So I'm here with our favorite producer, JJ. Hey,

hey, hey. What's

up, buddy? How you doing?

Doing great. It's been,

go ahead. What are you going to say?

I'm just saying, I'm excited that you're back. I'm excited that we're Back together.

Ah, have

a

lovely conversation today.

I love it. I love it. And we're definitely gonna have a lovely conversation. So number two, I wanna, you know, give a shout out. Make sure you check out our partners Code M Magazine. All right. Their website is uh, code m magazine.com. Again, their mission is saving the Black family, by first saving the black man. So they have a lot of great content. I'm pretty sure you're going to enjoy it. So check them out. And then today is a, is a, uh, special day. I got to play, pay homage to my wife, uh, my wife for Easter. Believe it or not. I usually do you get gifts on Easter?

Ah, when I was like a kid, like I'd have like a little basket that my parents would do, but I do see sometimes my parents will get each other things on Easter. It's just a nice little, like, here's a day that, that we can use to like show a bit of love.

Look, anytime somebody's going to give me a gift on any day, I don't care what day it could be, you know, Ash Wednesday. All right. I'll take it. I just never, you know, but whatever. I always got bunnies and chocolate, but my wife gave me this book, uh, Our Hidden Conversation. What we say about race by Michele Norris and you know, I was captivated number one I said, thank you number two as I was going through this. It just blew me away So I wanted to you know, come on and talk about some of the things That I've learned by reading this book, and I'm pretty sure you're going to Enjoy it as well. So like I said today We're gonna be sharing examining Selected passages from Michele Norris's Our Hidden Conversations. Her book explores the intricate and frequently unvoiced discussions about race in America through a blend of personal stories and sharp analysis. Michele reveals the complex details and significant forces behind racial conversations in our daily lives. The book urges readers to ponder. They're personal encounters and promote transparent, sincere dialogues on race, identity, and comprehension. A little bit about Michele. Some of you may know she's on NPR's All Things Considered. Before NPR, she worked at NBC, ABC News, and also contributed to top publications like the Washington Post and Los Angeles Times. She was honored as Journalist of the Year by the National Association of Black Journalists in 2009, and she received an Emmy and a Peabody Award, and also was recognized by Essence and Ebony, uh, for her influential presence in media. And you might've seen her on certain shows like Meet The Press. So look, why don't we jump into this and get an understanding a little bit more about Michele and why she started this book,

Michele Norris. It's called our hidden conversations. What Americans really think about race and identity, which is over a decade in the making. How did this start?

It started with postcards. I wrote a book about my family's very complex racial legacy. I was going out on a 35 city book tour. And I thought no one wanted to talk about race. I thought people would rather eat their toenails than talk about race.

And you know what? That is true, right? We, we have never talked about race at all, um, from the beginning. So I can definitely see why she thought that I'm going to provide a little bit more detail. So I have her book here. Uh, and, and this is what she said, she said, "more than a decade ago, I set out to write a book about how Americans talk and think about race. The rise of Barack Obama's political fortunes at the time was the beginning to shift how the nation saw itself. The changes were both intense and highly nuanced. Tea party followers in the Uncle Sam costumes began taking to the streets and screaming, I want my country back. Latino voters met anger with anticipation, marching for immigration reform with signs in the air and hope in their hearts. Black voters quite literally wore pride on their shoulders. Barack to the future t shirts were on back order. America's demographics were shifting. A nation built on a foundation of white supremacy was heading towards a majority minority status. In popular media, this was heralded as progress, but in private spaces and quiet conversations, this shift was also met with dread and anxiety. After all, if you paid any attention to how minorities have been treated in this country over centuries, you might reasonably be concerned about becoming one too. And demographic change was just a jolt and amid a ripple of seismic shocks because it was happening alongside so many other cultural shifts. Economic turmoil, technology upheaval. Global conflict, the normalization of gay marriage and the widening and embrace and celebration of LGBTQ plus life. The centering of Latino language and culture, a warming climate, unapologetic white nationalism, growing diversity in advertising and entertainment. And of course, the constant stream of videos captured the killing of black Americans by police and would be vigilantes. All this was amplified, exaggerated, or ingested through social media platforms that seemed to fertilize the most fetid of human emotions, anger, umbridge, Envy, Shame, or Fear, all of it added to Vertigo. I wanted to chronicle the visible changes in the United States, but more than that, I wanted to somehow capture the subtle, subterranean, shifts.". So there's a lot going on, right? And think about all the things that she talked about was going on that timeframe and why she wanted to find out more about what people thought about race. So let's see how she got this off the ground.

And so I thought I need an invitation for people to enter this conversation, but I went to the local print shop in my neighborhood and I printed up 200 cards and I started leaving them everywhere I went.

Like, just like, you would leave it at a coffee shop, or you would Leave it at

the sugar station, at the Starbucks. Yeah. Leave it in a Bible at a hotel. Leave it in the little, little pocket in back of an airline. Leave it in the kiosk at a restaurant. Leave it on a seat.

And what would it say?

They, postcards all said, Race, your thoughts, six words, please send. Pretty early, people were already starting to pack a lot into just six words. Saying things like I'm only Asian when it's convenient, white, not allowed to be proud.

How many ultimately did you end up getting?

We have archived more than 500, 000 and, and we are getting more that come. And most of them, I should say, most of them come in digitally now through the website.

So think about that, right? Sending out, just taking postcards and just leaving them all over the place. And then just saying, give me six words on your thoughts about race. And all of a sudden you end up getting 500, 000 responses from people all over the country. Right. Where in beginning she thought that nobody would ever want to talk about race. So let's do this. JJ, why don't you and I, cause I, and look, I'm going to tell you flat out, um, this is a book you should get. And just to be clear here, we, we don't have no association. We're not getting any commission or anything like that. But I think it's very powerful. To be able to see people from all over the country, able to leave their thoughts when it comes to race. And when I was like, um, what's the word I want to use? I won't say shocked, but I was fascinated by reading all the different thoughts from all different people. And you know what? As I was going through it, I was learning a lot as well. Because, you know, a lot of times we talk about our own situations and we don't think about, you know, The other points of view or perspectives from other individuals as well. So JJ, are you good for that, man? Yeah,

I'm great for that.

Okay. So why don't we go back and forth? You start with one, then I'll start with one. Okay.

All right. So I have Melanie from Las Vegas, Nevada, who says, yes, I have my green card.

Okay. Michele Taylor from Nashville, Tennessee says, pay no attention to attention to my packaging.

Uh, an anonymous person from Spokane, Washington says, I'm a redneck, not a racist.

Uh, somebody from Gingerville, Michigan says You are unique like everyone

else. Uh, Talia from Boulder, Colorado says, Indo Pak American. Sounds like camping gear.

Uh, Brandy from Chicago, Illinois. I constantly was asked, what are you? Or are you mix? Nope. I'm black and albino. It's a fascinating existence.

Uh, Nathan from Tempe, Arizona. I don't know if that's pronounced right. I don't know. Uh, says, why can't they pick normal names? Yes.

Um, uh, Brad from Downington, PA. We won't make it like this.

Amber from, uh, Shemokin, Pennsylvania says, Separate only your laundry by color.

Uh, James McRae from Hemet, California. I'm not a criminal, statistic, or failure. And then he reads, he wrote this. I am not what society has labeled me. I am not a criminal because I am so called African American. I am not a statistic because I grew up in a single parent household. Studies suggest that when a young black boy grows up without a father in the home, chances are he will get in trouble with the law at an early age, drop out of school, and be defiant towards his mother. By the way, I did not do any of these. I am not a failure.

Uh, Jeff from Glendale, California says there will always be a quote they.

Robert Franklin from Denver, Colorado. No, no relation. My world told me I'm black.

Uh, Eve from Hollandale, Minnesota says should be Black Lives Matter too.

Bob from San Diego, San Jose, California. When will race not matter anymore?

A mandolin from Oakland, California says. Bullies grow up, black boys die. I'm mixed, I'm, I'm mixed, black and white, and I often feel like I don't belong. Both sides have shown me beauty and ugliness.

Brandon from Portsmouth, Virginia. Be twice as good as everyone. Sometimes as an African American, I feel as I have to work twice as hard to top white people in order to achieve success.

Ryan from Kowota, oklahoma says, anti racist is a code for anti white.

Uh, Paul from Houston, Texas says, sag your pants, lose your chance. Whether right or wrong, the impressions we make on others play a big part in how others treat us.

Bobby from Baltimore, Maryland says, pro black doesn't mean anti white. Uh,

JB, no, GB from Charlottesville, Virginia, there is some truth in stereotypes.

Uh, Deb from Tucson, Arizona. Says need a fork can't use chopsticks. Yes. I am quote from somewhere born in Korea adopted as an infant Three weeks old to be exact. Yes. Most of my family is white Yes, I grew up on a farm in Iowa and have driven a tractor and a combine. Yes, I'm adopted. Yeah, I like Asian food, Mexican food too. No, I don't remember anything about Korea. Um No, I don't speak Korean. No, I don't know who my biological parents are. No, I'm not really curious about it. And no, I can't use chopsticks. So give me a fork and don't make any assumptions about who you think I am. Or how you think I should act or be.

Uh, Shanna Blackwell from Chicago says, Who decides when you're over it? Who decides when people who have experienced inequality should get over those experiences? Are

they yours? Are you sure? Adam Connor from Washington, D. C. said. My sister and I are both adopted from South Korea. Our parents are white. One of my memories from childhood is being at a grocery store and constantly having people ask my mom, Are they yours? As they would, uh, to my sister and me. I remember one time, someone then adding, Are you sure? As if my mom was going to look over and realize, Whoa, these kids are Asian. Thank you stranger in a grocery store for pointing that out to me.

Oh man, uh, um, Michele Welch, uh, in Maryland. I'm relieved my son looks white. I'm a biracial white, I'm biracial white and Pakistani. I look Pakistani, my husband is white. You My son is big, blonde, fair skinned, blue eyed toddler. We live in an affluent, largely white town. I'm grateful he will never be asked about his nationality, be the diversity hire, or live with an identity crisis. Is that wrong? To want life to be easier for your children, even if it seems like it's a step backward?

Uh, someone from Brooklyn, New York said, Adopted. How much did she cost? White mom and Chinese daughter said right in my face with my five year old daughter in my lap. She clutched me, buried her face in my chest, and sobbed. I put my arms around her and said, don't be disrespectful, and walked out of the shop.

Randy, Gilbert, Arizona. White guy, black church, met wife. At the end of a failed marriage, I explained my love of gospel music. My first record purchase was Bobby Blue Bland when I was 7 years old. To our marriage counselor, he made me go to a black church as part of my recovery. That led me to be open to the possibility of dating a black woman. I met Rose on Match. com and we have been gloriously married for 12 years.

Shelly says, Two black lesbian daughters say what? Uh, after the initial shock of their coming out, I realized that they are, uh, the long search for the fruits of my 1960s labor and radicalization. So, when I see the economic travesties in our community, after I pledged on campus 40 years ago to give 10, 000 it all the help, uh, to give it all the, all, sorry, after I pledged on campus 40 years ago to give it, to give my all to help to end my people's suffering and we will suffer still. I think of my daughters and realize their courage is that long awaited fruit no matter how small, the piece out of the whole pie.

Alice from Milwaukee, Wisconsin. I'm lucky I don't look Jewish. Now that I'm incognito as a Jew, having the last name Swenson, when people do find out they do say this from time to time. It bums me out every time. What does a Jew look like? Like me? This is such a backhanded compliment. I never know what to say. Thank you. How dare you?

Uh, David from New York says, Gay, but at least I'm white. Someone once told me in, in conversation that even though I was gay, at least I'm white. As if I wasn't allowed to feel oppression and struggle because white trumped gay. There's another side to it, I know. In some ways, it can be harder to be gay and black. But I'd rather not bring the race card into the gay community.

Frank from Knoxville, Tennessee. If you are black, you'll know. I have a good fishing buddy friend. I'm white and he's black. One day I was driving on the interstate through the center of town and he said to me, The speed limit on this stretch of the interstate is 55 miles per hour. I was driving 65 miles per hour and was completely surprised. I said that I had lived here all my life and did not know that. He said, if you were black, you will know.

Emery from Milwaukee says, I don't fit. Don't look closely. My whiteness is always sidelined when people learn about my lesbian moms. Don't look closely, and I have all the privilege. But then it disappears. There's no box for my diversity.

Michael in New York, New York. My aunt boiled the girl's utensils. Just want to make sure that you understand the girl was how many people in the 1950s and 60s referred to their maid.

Um, an anonymous person in the U. S. said, Would Martin Luther King support gay rights?

Saw, this is from Ed in, uh, California, saw the hurt in his eyes. When I was in fourth grade, a new family moved into our lower middle class apartment complex. They were African American. I was out riding my bicycle with a friend when the six year old of that family rode his bike up to us and asked if he could ride with us. We said no, and I saw the look of hurt in his eyes before we rode away. Later, I thought about it and wondered if he thought it was because he was black. It wasn't. My best friend in school named Bobby was black. It was because we thought he was too young and wouldn't be able to keep up. I never saw the young boy again. But 55 years later, at the age of 65, I still remember his face and regret we didn't let him join us.

Uh, Michael from Dallas says Rocky wore a hoodie. Kill him.

Uh, Phyllis from Fort Worth, Texas. Leave identity issues to other people. I'm a 60 year old woman who has lived through segregation, integration, colored, negro, black, African American, segregation, marches, integration, and Pan Africanism, opulent consumption, financial catastrophe, and now I'm just me.

Uh, Kathy from Philadelphia says, I thought I was being funny. I saw a student I work with wearing a baseball cap and a hoodie tied tightly around her face and I said, You're rockin your perpetrator look today. I didn't realize I'd upset her until another staff member told me. I was mortified.

Sherry from Montgomery, Alabama says, Lady. I don't want your purse. If I only had one dollar for every time I shouted this in my head to a white woman in the movie theater or restaurant or grocery store that grabs her purse from wherever she has it sitting and pulls it to her side when she sees me approaching, pushing, pushing my shopping cart full of kale and tofu or whatever. As I watch white, white people pass her without provoking any concern for the safety of her hand bag..

Uh, Jack from San Bernardino, California says, Their age, not race, scares me. Many teens act like they are 10 feet tall, can live forever. I don't know what happened, um, in, uh, in Trayvon's case, but I'm 6'5 and 300 pounds, and feel uncomfortable when confronted by young adults, no matter what color they are. Standing with their hands in their pockets, And they have a hoodie on is scary because I don't know what to expect.

Douglas, from Florida. White privilege, enjoy it, earn it. I am not apologizing for something I have no control over. Every major contribution to mankind was done by people of my race. Society owes white people a debt of gratitude, not scorn.

Uh, Rob from Lakeland, Florida says, I don't always wear a suit. I'm a leader in the industry and in the community, and I'm well respected. Most days I wear a suit to work, but I wear a hoodie when I run, and gym shorts when I go shopping. I should not have to worry about being followed, having the police called on me, or being shot.

Jordan, from Lakeland, Florida. No, I did not swim here. I'm Cuban and Arabic, and any time I tell somebody that, they ask me if I'm a terrorist, or if I swam here, especially since I live in Florida.

Uh, Nathaniel from England says, I want to wear a hoodie. Nice and simple.

Well, as you can see, there, there are, uh, a lot of different perspectives around the country, um, from individuals when it comes to race. Uh, some of these stories. You know, um, are heartbreaking. Um, but people have all different perspectives. So I really think it's important that you pick this book up because, you know, it's going to, at least for me, it enlightened me. All right. Especially the one I just read, right. And I didn't read this yet. I'm Cuban and Arabic, and every time I go somewhere they ask me if I'm a terrorist, okay, or you know, you don't look Jewish, or, you know, or

Yeah, one of the ones that stood out to me was one of the ones you read actually, which was, um, the one saying that all, that everything influential and important in society was made by white people, and In my mind, I was like, I never thought that there were people who thought like that. Cause, cause when you think about America, not even, not even just white people around the world, just America, America's most important, most influential global export is music and specifically jazz and rock and roll, both of which created by black folks. America as a country hasn't produced much unique and significantly beneficial to the world as a greater whole. Really other than that and those were both pioneered created from the ground up through the trauma and like Bonding of black people and it's just it's very interesting to me that some people in their mind are like now everything important It's all from white people.

Yeah, I mean well and to be well number one I at least appreciate them, or whoever it was, right? They wrote it on a postcard, this is what they believe, right? And this is what they

And they were honest about it.

And they were honest about it, right? And, and this is the thing. We can pick all this apart, right? We can pick anyone, we can do that all day. I, for me, and I would recommend if you pick up this book, Our Hidden Conversations by Michele Norris, what we talk about and Race. For me, as I read this, I read it not to, Um, be appalled or shocked or I can't believe he or she said this, what do they mean, blah, blah, blah. I read it to try to understand how other people think, right? And as you go through this, it'll give you a certain level of perspective. That we definitely need, we have a lot of work to do. We have to really break down these barriers. We have to, you know, really communicate with one another because at the end of the day, that's the only thing that's going to help bridge the gap. And obviously, you know, if somebody doesn't want to communicate and this is the way they want to, You know, live their life and you need nothing you can do about that, right? But at the end of the day, I just think it's very important that we talk about these issues and and listen to each person's perspective regardless if we disagree with it or not, right? Because for whatever reason they've come to that conclusion that thought process and it'll be good You know, in a conversation to try to understand why do they think that way? What experience did they go through that I haven't that made them feel that way? So this is awesome. Number one, I thank you for, for, for going through some of those JJ. So let me ask you this real quick. What did I, what, based on what you read, what, what did you glean out of this of anything?

Uh, a big thing for me is. A lot of people are curious. Genuinely. Like, I'm looking on this one page, there was the person who was asking, Would Martin Luther King support gay rights? And, see, and I don't know from what perspective this person is asking that question, because I've heard some people genuinely want to have that conversation. I've heard some people Use it as a, um, use it as a way to lessen his impact and importance. Like I've, I've heard it as just a genuine curious conversation. I've heard people try to use it as a way to be like, ha, gotcha. You don't actually support Dr. King and what he was and his message he was spreading. So I just think it's, I. I like that that one doesn't have anything else because like some of them had like the the the six words and then a blurb I like that that was just that yeah because it is interesting to think about that um but at the end of the day as as someone who is a member of the LGTBQ plus community it's in my mind that doesn't that wasn't what he was standing on he I don't I think he he wanted to do You know, equal rights and no segregation for, for everyone. So, would he support gay rights? I don't know. But all I know is what he wanted wasn't excluding them. Right, right. So I think that's interesting to think about. Um, definitely a lot of the, um, the page with the three things about, uh, the kids who are adopted. That always just, you know, it hits. It's, it's tough. It's a scary world out there. I, some of my best friends growing up, you know, didn't know their, their biological parents. They were born in either Korea or Japan or China and adopted by a white family. And that's just a very interesting part of their identity. It's something that they had to navigate for themselves growing up. And especially the first one, where is the person saying, Uh, that they need a fork and that they can't use chopsticks and really just like hearing what they had to say and the whole thing. Yes, I am from somewhere. Yes, they were born somewhere, but they don't have much connection to it because for them it's their cultural background. That's more important than the fact that they grew up on a farm in that lifestyle and not in like a, an Asian American community. But that doesn't, by any means, lessen how Korean they are. Right, right. Or lessen how, how American they are. Right, right. So I think it's, it's very interesting to hear that, how some people have different perspectives on that. And this person. They, they're like, I'm me.

Yeah, I, I, so, and again, I think that, like I said, we could go through this and be like, I can't believe this, and this, and this, and that, who knows, right? I think it's more about just learning overall. Yeah. Right? You know, race is, is complex. Right. It's not when I grew up, I thought it was just black and white. It's not just black. It's just what you just got finished talking about. There's so many other nuances is religion. It's, you know, uh, sexuality. I mean, there's a million things that like economic status as well. All those things, right? All those things. So, and these are things that people wrote that they felt. Okay. And here's the thing. I learned this a long time ago. Um, and I think it was Maya Angelou, one of her favorite quotes is that at the end of the day, It's, you can't talk about or you can't say somebody shouldn't feel that way. If this is how you feel, this is how you feel. Regardless if we think it's right or wrong, or how dare you, or whatever the case may be. This is how people feel, right? And everybody has a different perspective. As much as we want people to move, move them over to our perspectives, and we think it's common sense, and this is one of the things I always do, it's common sense, right? But at the end of the day, it's not, it's not common sense for them. It's common sense for them in terms of their thought process based on their experiences, based on their feelings. Right? And so at the end of the day, it's really about learning from these different perspectives. And, and more importantly, enlightening ourselves that there's a whole, she got 500, 000 responses. This wasn't just 20.

No.

Okay. So And, and we just read a few, okay, and there's a lot, there's a ton, a lot more. So at the day, let's learn from them and let's learn how we can bridge that gap and, more importantly, be willing to listen to other individuals, hear their points of view, not to defend, not to fight back, but to understand, okay? We don't have a agree. But at least understand, if we could start with just that, I, you know, I, I just think we, we, we can definitely bring, uh, like I said, definitely bring people together. So that's the thought.

Something that for me, after reading through all these, gives me a lot of hope is that a lot of this, I haven't been hearing much from people in my generation, my age range. I'm not hearing people say. That they see anti racist as a code for anti white. Because, you know, for someone growing up in a predominantly white community, and then they see all this stuff about anti racism, it doesn't surprise me that that's where their head goes. Because, like, on the pure surface level, it seems like it's all about lifting up others that aren't them. So, and I get why that, that alarm goes off in their head. But, I think so many younger people now don't see it that way. Which is just like, fills me with a lot of hope.

Yeah, I mean, and that's the key, right? We want every generation to become better, right? Yeah. So one of the things I would recommend, again, we don't get commission, you know, we, we haven't, you know, but if I was you, I would definitely, you can pick this book up on Amazon, pick it up, buy it as a gift, if you don't even want it, buy it as a gift as a friend, right? Um, but I just think all of us listening and hearing what other people are saying across the country can only bet that it could be only beneficial for all of us. So. I really appreciate JJ. Thanks a lot, my friend. Thank you for having me for allowing us to come in the studio to talk about, um, Michele Norris's book, our hidden conversations. And then again, I think it's now time for the weekly spotlight from The Burton Wire hosted by Dr. Nsenga Burton, Dr. Burton. What do you have for us this week?

Good afternoon. Thank you for joining me for "Need to Know" with Nsenga. Today I'm going to be talking to you about, um, dominant ideologies and that's ways of thinking or belief systems around gender, specifically, um, Mr. Harrison Butker's, um, comments from the Kansas City Chiefs, um, about women's, uh, about women's roles in society and where they should be, um, and how His comments, not only are archaic and out of touch and out of date with what is happening in today's world, but also dangerous, particularly in the context in which they were shared, which is at a. a college graduation, um, where people have spent a lot of time and a lot of money to try and rise above, uh, those types of limited, uh, definitions, perceptions, ideas about women's Women and our role in society. Mr. Butker basically said that, um, he just wanted to go back to the good old day where women knew their role, which was to be at home and to have babies and to, you know, basically take care of their man. Um, and that's nice coming from a super bowl champion, uh, who makes more than $4 million a year. Most people, even in the NFL are not making $4 million a year. The average salary for someone in the NFL is between $480,000 and $600,000 a year. Typically they're only going to work for three years before they're cut, move on. The likelihood of you being able to have someone stay at home, uh, full time, particularly in the economy and the culture in which we live is slim to none. This idea that somehow people can afford in this society, um, in this day and age to have someone stay home. I mean, even with the cost of childcare as a mother, uh, literally. A third of my actually is more than a third of my take home pay goes to childcare period. Um, my daughter's adopted. Um, so I am an only parent. I'm not a single parent. I'm an only parent. So I'm not sharing custody with anybody. There's not another set of grandparents. I also don't live near my parents or most of my close family members. So, um, I have to pay someone to take care of her and it is very expensive, especially if you want someone in a safe. nurturing and uplifting environment. All right. So, which leads me back to Butker. Butker's comments are dangerous because women are more than just sperm depositories for men. Women have contributed more to society than just babies, uh, and taking care of men and families. We're more than just objects of affection for men and their, uh, desires. Um, and we're more than just care takers, unfortunately, in our society, because many. Uh, women have actually been trained often by men and other women, uh, to believe that that is their ultimate role in society as, uh, defined by many, uh, I would say spiritual scriptures. Um, you know, many women are doing both, they're working 40 hours to 60 hours a week and doing all of the caretaking and nurturing and guiding of the children, um, even in, in married households. So this idea that, you know, somehow there's this kind of split. Between this is what the women do and this is what the man does. I mean, it's just so out of touch with what all the studies, all of the interviews, all you have to do is look on message boards, mom message boards, and you will see just, you know, the number of women who are saying, I'm exhausted. I can't take it anymore. I have to work 60 hours a week and I'm paying half, if not all of the bills and I have to take care of the kids and I have to take care of my parents and I'm taking care of his parents, you know, all of the things, right. Butker is just really out of line. But what makes him a jackass is that he did it at a college graduation. And a college graduation where people have paid good money to get an education and to be uplifted and not to be demeaned or demoralized by someone who's like, yeah, I'm at a college graduation, but you really need to stay home. You girls need to be at home having babies before you, man. And, and you guys, you need to go out there and be providers and, and, and don't worry about all of the things that fully human people need from everybody, including men. Perhaps he should look at those studies of what goes on with women who grow up without fathers in their life. So, when I think about Butker, you know, not only demeaning and demoralizing these students who had worked really hard to get to this day and wanted to and needed to be uplifted. Um, and to be celebrated for, for, for staying the course through COVID and staying the course through this tumultuous times and, and the school shootings, all the things that they have survived, the trauma really, that they have survived, um, these kinds of like very wealthy, empowered people who have, um, microphones to large groups of people, right? This dude was invited. To share his wisdom with graduating seniors, people who are going to the next phase of their lives. When you think about the interconnectedness between the statements that he's making and the rights that are being eroded for women. Um, we have to take these statements very seriously, you know, uh, Roe versus Wade is, is, you know, all for all intents and purposes gone. Right. So now it's the state issue. My point is all of these things are connected. There's a woman named Patricia Hill Collins. She wrote a book. Fantastic book called Black Feminist Thought. Um, and I encourage everyone to read it. I call it an oldie but a goodie, but she talks about intersectionality and the ways in which these dominant systems intersect to maintain power for the status quo and the ways in which Butker's messaging, which is misogynistic. If you're not a man, you don't matter. Your life is, is, has no value unless a man says it has value. Right. Um, and so all of those things are interconnected when we think about issues of race, when we think about issues of gender, when we think about issues of sexual identity. This is why his comments hit across so many different categories. Right, because he knows that people who are in power knows know that these type of issues are interconnected. They work together. You know, if you look at all the rights, voting rights are being eroded, LGBTQ rights are being eroded 1st amendment rights are being eroded gender rights are being eroded. These are all civil rights, by the way, are being eroded. And so what's what's next? Who's next? So, if you haven't gotten a memo now, or, or, or before, you should get it. Because if we don't start standing up for ourselves, if we don't start standing up for women, um, if we don't push back when people make, I mean, just really, really sad, um, and abusive statements, um, like, um, then, you know, our future is bleak and we don't want that. We want a future that is bright and that is. Available to everyone. Thanks a lot. And the Nsenga, Dr. Burton, that was awesome. Look forward to chatting with you again and hearing your points of view next week. So we want to thank you for tuning in to another episode of a black executive perspective podcast, I think is now time for Tony's Tidbit is time for Tony's Tidbit, right? And based on. Michele Norris's book, Our Hidden Conversations, What Americans Really Think About Race and Identity. Our tidbit today is by James Baldwin. And James Baldwin, what he says is not everything that is face can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it's face. Right? And I think that's apropos based on the book she put together. And, and this is the first step of facing these things. So I hope you enjoyed this episode, Public Views on Race: Analysis and Discussion. Um. Please, our motto, a Black Executive Perspective motto, we use the acronym LESS, L E S S. We're looking to decrease racism, any sexism, right? So we're asking that everybody incorporate LESS. And what is LESS? Number one, you want to learn, right? You want to educate yourself about other racial groups and cultures, right? And then once you learn, E stands for empathy. You should be more empathetic. empathetic to your fellow human being and colleague. Then after that, S stands for share. Now you want to share what you learned to all your friends and family so they can be enlightened as well. And then the other S is stop. You want to actively work to stop discrimination and foster inclusivity. So what does that mean? You had the Thanksgiving table and grandma says something, you say, no grandma, we can't say that, right? You stop it, right? So if everyone does this, we'll have a Build a better and a more understanding world. So incorporate this call to action L E less L E S S less. And let's do it every day. And guess what? We'll see the change that we want to see. So don't miss our next exact next episode on a black executive perspective. You're going to love it and go, uh, please give us a rating. Go to wherever you're listening to, uh, our show, whatever podcast platform on YouTube. Give us a rating. Give us your thoughts on today's episode public views on race Analysis and discussion you can follow a black executive perspective podcast On wherever you get your podcast and you can follow us on our socials on linkedin x youtube tiktok and instagram at ablackexec for the university of new haven For allowing a black executive perspective to be here You Our, our, uh, producer, JJ, want to thank you a lot, JJ.

Thank you so much for having me. This is a great time.

Appreciate it. I want to thank you again for joining. We're out. We love you. And we just talked about

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