78. Why You Aren’t Crazy For Going Back & How To Finally Let Go Of Relationships That Hurt With Whitney Walker
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[00:00:00] In this episode, you are going to finally understand why you are not crazy for going back and how to finally let go of relationships that hurt.
Speaker: Welcome to Heartbreak to Wholeness, the podcast helping you heal from the mindfuck of narcissistic relationships and move towards the secure, peaceful woman you want to become. I am your host, Bre Wolta, Relationship Clarity Coach and EFT Certified Practitioner. Let's dive in.
Welcome back to the episode. This is the episode for you. If you have ever been. Bamboozled and trying to understand why a relationship feels addictive, why you keep going back despite knowing that it's not good for you. So in this episode, you are going to discover the real reason that narcissistic relationships feel like an addiction.
You will realize why it's actually okay that you went back and you're gonna understand how to finally let go and start.
Healing Today, I'm talking with Whitney Walker, who is a [00:01:00] therapist, and she is a host of a podcast called Women Waken. She works specifically with clients who are struggling with addiction, eating disorders, trauma, and people who are just looking to find spirituality or get reconnected back to their spiritual and intuitive selves.
So. This topic is super, super important to me because I have experienced addiction in my family firsthand. I'm in recovery from an eating disorder, and I spent the last 10 years, almost a decade in the addiction and mental health world, helping people get connected to treatment programs and really just understanding what.
Addiction means why we feel addicted, what is the driving cause, and how the addiction is actually the solution.
And we're gonna get into all of it today in this episode. And be sure that you're sticking around fully to the end of the episode because Whitney and I are pulling an Oracle card at the end.
And this card offers a message that you can use this week to stay more anchored and conscious in your healing. .
Bre Wolta: [00:02:00] Welcome to the podcast, Whitney.
Whitney Walker: Thank you.
Bre Wolta: I'm really looking forward to this conversation, this idea of relationships, feeling addictive, and when we get out of narcissistic relationships. Specifically and there, and we're like, I didn't wanna be there, but I kept going back and I couldn't stop myself. Like we almost were feeling this compulsion towards the person is so interesting to me.
Talking about narcissistic relationships. Paralleling addiction. It just makes so much sense in my mind. So I'm thrilled that we share this, this viewpoint and this sort of enthusiasm around understanding relationships this way.
Whitney Walker: Yeah, for sure.
Bre Wolta: So tell us, tell us in your, your language, your understanding, your definition. Like why do these relationships feel so addictive?
Whitney Walker: Well, I mean, the nature of any addiction is something that changes the way that you feel in a [00:03:00] conditional form. So when we drink people who have a substance abuse disorder or addiction, we get used to the idea of, okay, I'm tired. I feel like shit. I wanna just go change the way I feel.
We know that we can rely on being able to go to a bar and get a drink and change how we feel.
The problem is that it's conditional in terms of the only reason you feel better is because you took something to change how you feel. So you feel the relief. Then it leaves your system and then you start the cycle.
So anything can replace that, and we know that it does. You can have food, sex, love, drugs, gambling. so many things. You can be addicted to negativity, to self-loathing. It goes on and on. Anything can be addictive.
In terms of using it, and, and here's the other caveat to addiction, is that it's something that ultimately is detrimental to you.
It's not serving you right. The undertone of it is that it's not, I mean, you can be addicted to exercise and that can be unhealthy because you can push [00:04:00] your, your body to limits. But that goes back to the detriment when you are taking something and you know, or using something or seeing somebody and you know that it's not good for you, but you keep doing it anyways.
I
think that's the official definition of addiction is something that you become dependent on that has negative repercussions, yet you keep doing it.
So when we look at relationships, I know many of us have been here. I've been here, I hope not all of us have been here because it's not fun and it's such a mind warp because you would, we think of relationships as a loving, safe place. Unfortunately they can present that way or begin that way. Yet just like any a addiction, if you look at it, every addiction starts good. When
the first time I ever took a drink, I was in like middle school and I remember thinking, why aren't we drunk all the time? Like alcohol's amazing. Why don't we do this every day?
People would get along better. It'd be so great. But then [00:05:00] what happens? You have your first negative experience. Oh, I drank too much and I got sick. Oh, I didn't drink too much and I blacked out.
That was scary. That was weird. Oh, I now, when I drink, I sometimes get sad. I have to drink more. I can't stop my drinking.
But it started good.
The same with maybe a eating disorder where it starts out and you're like, oh, I'll just cut back on a few things to try and get into the weight that I want. But then it becomes. Well, I notice that if I eat too much, I start obsessing. I don't feel at ease. I feel uncomfortable if I lose weight. If the number on the scale is right, then I feel good.
Bre Wolta: Yep.
Whitney Walker: They all start good. So let's look at a relationship specifically one that is toxic or with what we would call a narcissist.
Bre Wolta: Yeah.
Whitney Walker: It appears so wonderful most of the time. Right. Sometimes straight out the gates people can be nasty and you just want their approval. I mean, it goes deep. The [00:06:00] reasons why we seek out and stay in relationships that are unhealthy,
Bre Wolta: Yeah.
Whitney Walker: they say that, um, trauma drives will be the driving force in our life until we address it. And many of us, especially women, have. Father wounds. When the primary male figure in our life was either neglectful, abusive, absent, inconsistent, and we, when we're children, the first few years of our life, we really develop an our strongest understanding of life. Like, oh, I'm not worthy of attention all the time. I'm not worthy. When I try to talk to my parents, they don't listen to me. So. I must, there must be something wrong with me. I'm not what? I'm not good enough. I'm not interesting enough. So we developed this idea and those things become little traumas,
'cause when we're young, we inherently believe that we're gonna be taken care of and adored and loved. So when we're [00:07:00] not, we're kind of deep inside of us, we get this sense of like, oh. I guess I'm not enough.
I guess I need to prove, I guess, that love is conditional. 'cause also when parents are, are inconsistent, we we're trying to figure out the, you know, the rule of like, okay, well if I'm, if I'm docile enough, then I'm lovable if I'm, you know, agreeable enough, if I'm funny enough, if I'm sweet enough, like what is it?
Bre Wolta: Yeah.
Whitney Walker: And that really sticks with us. And for women, it's funny 'cause we can do everything else. So. Uh, like profoundly so well, we can be so determined and we can be the hardest workers, perfectionists. We can feel so self-sufficient. But then a man walks in our life who often clearly is not at our level in a lot of ways in terms of maybe they haven't done their own self work.
Maybe they're not that driven. I'm not saying that's always the case, but it's often the case. But there's something about them, and I would say that something is that it's reminiscent [00:08:00] of our. Relationship with our father or whatever relationship or situation caused that doubt about ourselves.
So the idea that na, that trauma drives our actions is that we literally have this festering wound. And when we meet somebody, I. That reminds us of the person that caused it. I'm gonna use the dad because that's my wound. It's a lot of women's wounds. We almost are saying like, oh, perfect, this guy is indifferent. This guy doesn't seem to impress with me. If I can win him over,
that would be like winning over my dad. And then maybe this pain, this wound can finally go away.
So we almost seek out the exact situations that we know. Are gonna hurt us, hoping that this time will win,
this time will have victory. But the messed up thing, just like any addiction, is that when you get, let yourself get tied up in love, that's literally what you're, you're tied up. And so
you might think like, oh, if they start treating me badly, I'm out. But then when you are addicted to it, when [00:09:00] you're stuck in that cycle. They call it trauma bonding, where let's say you're dating somebody and they're so sweet to you upfront, and they're like, I can't believe I met you. I've never met anyone like you.
You're what I've always been looking for. They shower you with affection. They're consistent with their calls, wanting to date you, and then they shift and suddenly they're like, wait, they, they haven't called me in two days. Like, what, what's going on? Or you hang out with them and they're a little bit more distant and they're less, they're not saying the same affirmations, they're not being as confirming. You're like, did I, is my hair okay? Like, did I do something? What did I do? Just like with our parents or whatever caused that wound. You're like, I don't know what I did. What did I, I must have done something. Right.
Bre Wolta: Yes.
Whitney Walker: And then they know they're smart enough to realize that they can't push you too far away or, or they might lose you. So then right at the turning point. They catch you back with, oh, I'm so sorry. It's just been a long few days and you know, I adore you so much and you're my favorite person. Let me take you on [00:10:00] this amazing date tomorrow night. Let me show you. That's trauma bonding, because when they were being distant, your anxiety is up, your fear is up, you're getting upset, and all you want in the whole world is that same person who is giving you so much love to come back and give that love again.
So when they give it to you again, that becomes your drug.
Your drug is that attention. Your drug is getting that fixed.
Bre Wolta: Yeah, yeah,
Whitney Walker: comes. I mean, people get caught and stuck in these cycles for years.
Bre Wolta: yeah. Because also when they come back, it's with all the promises that everything that was wrong, or any fight that you had, anything that caused the fight was gonna change, right. I'm gonna stop drinking. I'm gonna stop yelling at you. I'm so sorry. I shouldn't have done, it's everything we wanna hear, which of course sucks us back in because we wanna believe that they're not full of shit.
We, we sometimes to a fault will give people a lot of benefit of the doubt, and I'm using we as like the person in the experience of the narcissistic person [00:11:00] because we wouldn't operate that way. Like I would never manipulate. Somebody to come back into a relationship with me by saying all of these wonderful things and then not following through with that.
And so that can be a slippery slope to, to fall into. And it becomes this roller rollercoaster, it's like when we're, when we're up at the top and we're going down, everything's fun and exciting and like the dopamine's flowing, the oxytocin is flowing. And then we kind of hit this bottom where we're like, okay, well this isn't as fun anymore.
And then we start to seek that dopamine again. We come back up, we start to see what we need to change about ourselves, what we need to change about them in order to get the relationship to work better. And then we kind of hit this, this peak point of. Them coming back and saying, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have yelled, I shouldn't have hit you.
I shouldn't have left the house for three days, whatever. And then you're back down the cycle of, oh, everything's amazing and this is gonna feel so good and I'm having fun again. And it's just, the highs are really high and the [00:12:00] lows are really low.
Whitney Walker: Exactly. Yeah. When they come back, it's like heroin. It's like, ugh. Like a wave of relief washes over you.
Like, okay, good. They didn't mean it like they do love me. They're just, okay. Something happened, and just like you said, we wanna believe it because. Our way of being, our understanding is that we don't wanna lie to people and we
wouldn't wanna hurt people.
So they're, we're seeing their soft side. They're being vulnerable with us. They're showing us that they just messed up and, oh, of course, I'll forgive you.
And, but the problem is that that's the whole nature of what's a popular concept now, is the narcissist empath dynamic,
which is that narcissists know that empathic individuals who are in touch with their emotions, who feel emotions genuinely, that they will believe that other people are having that same experience, which is scary because it means that there are people out there that can mimic. Emotions and not actually feel them at all.
So they'll say like, gosh, I just feel, you know, I, I really know how that must have felt for you. And I just, you mean [00:13:00] so much to me that I would never wanna hurt you like that. And we're like, oh, what a sweetheart. Like, they're really in tune, but a lot of the times they're just doing what they know will get the result that they want, which is to have you still right in their hook.
And then when enough they do that long enough and they know that you're back in, then you know they'll put on the the poor behavior and they'll do the same treatment again, and then the whole cycle repeats itself.
Bre Wolta: Yes. One other just fascinating piece that I've tied together in my own experience and, and know from the clients of mine too, is that part of the addiction, like part of the, the needing the other person or needing the alcohol or needing the restriction of food is to alleviate our own anxiety. Like for I, I'm in recovery from an eating disorder.
And when I was in the, in the throes of the cycle, it was like I needed the exercise or I needed the con, the restriction around the food in order to alleviate the anxiety that I was feeling in myself. 'cause I didn't have [00:14:00] any self-regulation tools. And same with the relationship, like when the relationship starts to not feel great anymore.
I know for me it was like this compulsion to fix it, to get rid of the anxiety that I was feeling. I. Instead of sitting with the anxiety that I was feeling and getting curious about like, oh, well, what's happening in this relationship that's causing this, this extreme amount of anxiety and discomfort and walking on eggshells, it was like, I'm just gonna go to him and fix it with him, because that's gonna make the anxiety go away, and it does temporarily.
Right until you wake up hungover the next day or the next week and the cycle is starting again. So it's, it's like those short term solutions. You know, when I was, when I was working in the addiction world, they would always say, you know, drinking wasn't the problem. It was the solution. It was the solution to the trauma.
It was the solution to the. Discomfort that you were feeling internally, and not that the solution [00:15:00] was adaptive and worked well to help you operate in life, but it was, it was, um, the thing that could make the feeling go away temporarily.
Whitney Walker: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's a temporary fix. They all are. That's
what every addiction is. We're very attached to, you know, quick turnovers. We want results where, you know, we just like things to be resolved quickly and. It's just what you're saying. The reason why we have that anxiety is because we have underlying trauma. And dis-ease within ourself. Right? Again, when you go for a drink and you're, you are like fending for it, it's because you're not willing to look at what's going on within you. You're like, I don't wanna look at that. That would be too hard. What's way easier is having a strong margarita and just feeling like everything's fine.
Bre Wolta: Yeah.
Whitney Walker: And, but here's the other part, and you mentioned your experience with an eating disorder and I struggled with one as well. I was, um, bulimic for almost 20 years. It's a nightmare.
Um, if anyone's in that, I, I have a podcast that talks a lot about eating disorders. Um, there's a place [00:16:00] called the EDRC in California.
If you look at it, it's a great resource. You, when we are in an addiction, um, we also are addicted to the chaos and dysfunction of it. So for me, with bulimia, I was working with a client recently who's going through it. I was, we were talking about it. Every addiction is multifaceted. Um, obviously relationships are a bit different because something like an eating disorder is your own personal drama,
right?
That's another thing about eating disorders that are addictive is that it's. You can't control the chaos of life. I mean, I, my eating disorder went hand in hand with my first unhealthy relationship. 'cause it was so, these like, oh my God, does he want me? Does he not? Does he like me? Does he not, like, when will he call me again?
And it was so uncomfortable. That's when I developed binge eating and persing. 'cause it was like, oh, I just need to stuff, I need to do something that I can do limitlessly. I need to be able to just, you know, have no cares and then I can fix the mistake through purging. That's what it felt like. But just like any addiction, there's [00:17:00] such a dark side to it.
But again, like with the relationship, so with bulimia, it's, first of all, there's like this secretness of it. When you're stressed out and you're like, I could go do my thing. My little secret thing where I go to the store, I get all my favorite foods, I go to a secret spot where I know I can binge and a safe place to purge.
And then I clean myself up and I start over and I'm brand new and I'll feel so relieved. The problem though, just like any drug eventually. It wears off and you start to have negative thoughts like, why did I do that? What's wrong with me? Same thing with the relationship. At first. It's like, okay, well that was a bit, a little bit tumultuous and like this. It's just like you said, it's, we wanna go for the quick fix by going back to the person who hurt us, rather than asking the question, why am I drawn to toxicity?
Why do I like this unhealthier? Why am I not trying to say, Hey, this is clearly not healthy. We've been together just a few months and we're already having like drag out fights.
I'm crying. If a guy ever makes you cry, this [00:18:00] is my rule for myself. You've really got a question if he's the one for you,
especially in the first month, if you've cried over him. Yes, we wanna be mindful of our own, you know, thoughts and beliefs, whether we're projecting onto them. But a lot of the times it's an indication that this person is not good on your system.
So we avoid asking ourselves that. So instead we go get this quick fix. But then the problem is, you know, with that cycle, we get addicted to the excitement, we get addicted to the, the chaos and the ups and downs and. When people finally get off that rollercoaster and get into a healthy relationship, they'll admit, they'll say, yeah, I mean, it's not as exciting. Like sometimes it feels even boring, but I got to the point where I, that's all I want.
I'll take boring over toxic any day.
But here's the thing I wanna offer everybody, 'cause this is what I've learned going through many different addictions, is that. And this sounds awful and I'm not encouraging [00:19:00] anybody to like push their limits, but this has just been my experience is that for me, none of those addictive rides were over until they were, until I literally hit rock bottom and not a second sooner.
I. Right. So like with with alcohol, like I was not ready yet to give up like the excitement of like, if I go out on a Friday night, what's gonna happen? Who knows? I'm gonna get wasted. It's gonna be a blast. Like, and I really thought like if I stopped drinking, life would be so boring. And I kept that mentality, even though bad things started to happen. And I felt a lot of shame and I felt a lot of guilt about myself and regret, and it stayed that way until finally. I just didn't want it anymore. I wanted to see if I could learn to love myself, if I could make peace with myself.
And now that life looks terrifying to me. I couldn't. And same with bulimia for me now, I've been sober from bulimia for five years
and now and something, here's the other thing is that when you heal from [00:20:00] addiction. It's not, we can't just do it through our heads. That's why I think because for years I tried to stop having an eating disorder through my head. Like, I'll read the right books and I'll do this. That also for me, took the greatest amount of patience 'cause there's nothing more frustrating. There's something about an eating disorder that's just deeply frustrating. 'cause you have to eat every day.
Bre Wolta: Yeah. Yeah.
Whitney Walker: And you're like, I dunno what to do about this. I don't have a normal relationship with food or eating and I feel insane. And it's so, I mean, it was just exhausting.
It's exhausting to have an eating disorder. It's also exhausting to be in an unhealthy relationship, but you have to hit bottom to finally say, I don't want this for myself.
And I'm what, ready to do whatever it takes to get healthy. And then when you start doing the inner work. You literally, it's alchemy like things you're, things begin to shift within you so that you're at a place where suddenly toxicity doesn't sound good anymore. And
before it did,
Bre Wolta: Yes.
Whitney Walker: right?
Bre Wolta: You have to shift the whole internal system because if you don't work with the [00:21:00] parts of you that are unhealed or are searching or are seeking that, that solution or the validation or whatever is gonna make you feel better. If you're not working with those parts, then everything is temporary.
You'll reach for the food, you'll reach for the drink, you'll reach for the boyfriend, whatever. And it's like, again, that, that temporary fix. And I'm so happy that you, you said that because so many women. Get stuck in the, the like learning information, right? If I listen to all the podcasts, read all the books, then it'll change and then, then we get really frustrated when it's not changing and it's like the seeking of information is good and is a part of our healing, but we have to be in safe space with a practitioner or with people who can witness us and help us to process through the actual.
Feelings around what's happening, the root of what's happening, right? Go back, going back to the, the trauma place of why, why am I looking for this man to confirm that I'm worthy to be [00:22:00] chosen? Where did that come from? So we have to do that deeper work and we're change is hard cha, it's, it's painful and we're not gonna do that until.
The pain gets bigger than the fear of the unknown because we as humans, every part of us is wired for efficiency and for safety. And so when we perceive that changing something and doing something different as unsafe, 'cause I don't know this place, this is a, this is a foreign land that I haven't explored before, we will resist that until the pain of being where we are is too great.
Whitney Walker: Yeah.
Bre Wolta: So for women listening, if you haven't got to that point yet of like maybe conceptually, you know, you need to do the work, but that still feels terrifying. I've been there, Whitney's been there. Like we, that is such a normal part of the process to to be gathering information and just be sitting with the idea of changing until you are.
Until you find the right person that can help guide you [00:23:00] through it. You know, there's so many, like you said, the alchemy internally. I believe when we make that decision, the teacher also appears, the support also appears, and we are in a different energetic frequency to like receive that.
Whitney Walker: Yes, absolutely. And I think, so two things. One is that. We also, they say that life will present you the same lesson over and over until you learn it. And we also have to have patience with ourself to realize that sometimes we're just not done with the lesson.
Um, this particularly has been the case for me with men.
I find it the hardest because unlike other addictions, you know, like, you know, you see it, but with men you can be like, well, maybe this one's different. Like, maybe I should just give a little try. Just a little try. And your intuition is saying no. No, you know what this is, so here's my recommendation.
'cause just like you said, we have to have patience. 'cause it takes time to change if you, if someone comes around, 'cause I've been here where you're like, I'm so healed, I'm [00:24:00] so like, ready for my person forever. And then Mr. Swab comes in and I've, and you're like, oh, I can't say no. You find, and this sounds silly, it's like just say no.
I've been here before where it's like I can't say no. I'm gonna say yes to this man. I know I probably shouldn't. All that saying, you don't have to berate yourself. You don't have to judge yourself. And especially if you're already on your healing journey, this is what I recommend. And I did the same thing with bulimia.
I. You say, okay, I feel powerless, and I'm not ready to say no. So what I will do is observe, take notes and observe and say, what am I feeling? Why am I not able to say no? I'm too excited about the potential of like, what might it feel like? What kind of sex might we have? Might we have what? What might possibly happen between us? I'm not ready to not take that ride. And you have to say to yourself, okay, well then you know you're signing up for potential hurt. And you say yes. You say, okay, well then notice how you feel. that's the only way. That's a, that's a step though. I want anyone hearing this to know that, that you might be like, oh, what's wrong with me?
Or why can't I just say no? Because you're, [00:25:00] you wanna learn a lesson fully, and if you're
still willing to say yes, it means you have a bit more to learn. So you
take that man and you say, okay, I will learn everything I can from this. My experience have been that those rounds aren't as bad.
It's when you're totally kind of blindsided and you're not really even thinking in that regard.
You're just like, yeah, I'll just give this a shot. See what happens when you go with your eyes open. You might be able to gather enough information this time in the lesson just when that, when it's over, you say, alright, I'm good now. But you can't fool yourself. Like that's why it's you. You have to literally get through it to surpass it.
Because once you do your, that same man can come up and you legit, from a place of full authenticity can say I have zero interest in that.
But if you're not
able to say no yet, then again, you roll up your sleeves. You say, okay, then I'm ready to dig into this one and get the growth that I need to finally learn the lesson.
Bre Wolta: Yeah. Go in with your eyes open. That's like, I tell my clients that too. I'm like, well, if you're, if we're going back, if we, if you are going back this time, let's [00:26:00] do it while you're, we're gathering data around what's happening. Let's do it while you're practicing. Also setting boundaries and see how that goes.
It's like. You can make, you can make steps in the healing while going back or while still in the relationship if you're going in with eyes open and observing the observing what's happening. So I'd love, love that piece of advice.
Whitney Walker: And then will literally get us to the place where when that same temptation comes around, we wouldn't even think
we'll be like, no, no, sweetie. I've seen this so many times. I know how this ride ends. I even put the final nail in the coffin. And the other thing I wanna offer is, 'cause I know I felt this way, but I've seen others friends who have gone, I've literally seen friends go from like the most toxic, unhealthy, healthy relationship to two months later meeting the man of their dreams.
So
what you have to remember is you don't. Have to put the weight on your shoulders of like, God, I'd have to do 10 years of work to ever heal enough to have a healthy relationship. It's not true.
You have to realize that it's not about a hundred percent healing. [00:27:00] It's just about, it's almost like the universe knows when you, when the needle moves enough that you're in alignment.
Bre Wolta: And then you begin the, the additional healing that comes from being in a healthy relationship and like healing the, the residual shit that will come up inevitably. That was my story too. I've met my now husband like six months after I've, I like felt like to a place where I could talk about my story without getting super emotional, right?
That was, that was how I kind of was gauging my healing around. That was when I could. Share it without breaking down. And it didn't take long for me to meet John and, and then we started our healing journey together. That's not everybody's journey, but that is a possibility and I love to insert that into people's psyche because it doesn't mean that if you're 35 that you're not gonna meet someone until you're 45 and then you're gonna be past the age of having kids or whatever the fear is, right?
Um, so I love that. I love [00:28:00] having that actionable, like this is in my control. I'm going in with eyes open. What else would you offer listeners if they're in this addictive cycle of like how to, how to step out of it, how to just see it kind of, where else would you lead women there?
Whitney Walker: Again,
I just think that it, you have to be so gentle and kind with yourself
because you're, and also look at it this way is that we've, and I'm gonna get a little bit spiritual 'cause that's what my, you know, perspective is, but I believe that we are living one of millions, infinite lifetimes that our soul is growing. So you have to realize that. Whatever you're experiencing and growing in this lifetime is gonna affect your, the evolution of your soul forever. So it's okay for it to take time, right? It's, we get so defeated, and again, it's, I've been in so many different regards with food with men and relationships with alcohol being like, what the heck is wrong with me?
But another thing I'll say is I think a lot of people at this time. A lot of souls on this [00:29:00] planet are doing like the excavation of these deeper dives. And if you're listening to this podcast, clearly you're in an aware state,
right? So just keep that in mind when again, if you're like me, which I did not even just recently, where I went for another round, just recognize that it's because like you actually really want to get this out of your system so that your soul is evolving to a new state, and you've learned this. You moved on from it and it's 'cause the wound that you're dealing with, yes, it's from situations in this lifetime, but it's also past lifes. It's
many different experiences you've had across many different planes of existence. And if you can actually take the time to resolve it, instead of trying to just pass over it. Because also, I'll say this, I, I think that there are some women who. Just didn't they, they just went to, rather than go back to something unhealthy, they just went to something safe. Not their true love. Not a true, but just like, well, you know, this person, I'm not really into them, [00:30:00] but they're, I can kind of, you know, get what I want with them and they're really good to me, that's not really it either.
I mean, I'm not telling anybody what to do, right? Like, you gotta, maybe that works for you, it makes you happy, but I believe in people reaching their full. Potential experience and love,
and if you just sidestep, you also though it's, it's like not hitting rock bottom. You might find yourself years down the line going back to something unhealthy, where if you let yourself hit rock bottom and you're done, done, you have the rest of your life to enjoy with
beautiful, loving relationships.
Bre Wolta: Yeah. I really, because we're like entering into spraying, this metaphor just popped into my head. It's like the difference of mowing over a weed versus like. Plucking the weed plucking the root of the weed. It's like when you mow over it, it goes away temporarily, like
Whitney Walker: You're like, uh,
is.
Bre Wolta: yeah. And then it rains again and you're fucked.
Right? But like when we get into the root, that's when we can really shift it and, and I can say from experience with absolute certainty that. [00:31:00] It is possible to have somebody who is charismatic and suave and you know, has got that like narcissistic, just like flow about them to have them approach you and to you be like, oh my God, like, stay away from me.
I want nothing to do with you. I can say a hundred percent that that has happened to me and I have so many alarms that go off in my body. Now because I know what that is, I know what that feels like and I'm aware of what that feels like, like I've connected those two things. So you're not gonna be attracted to these men forever.
When you do do the work, you do change your alignment. You do shift energetically and, and what you see in your environment changes too. So it's possible because I know that's a big fear, like a doubt place that women have of. How am I ever gonna not be attracted to these men? They're so convincing. Or how am I gonna not fall for their lies?
It's like you're gonna sniff that shit out. So clearly when you've, when you've [00:32:00] done the rock, when you've hit the bottom, done the real work around that. And to your point, that could take months, that could take years. There's no right amount of time for that to take. It's just you intentionally moving into that space.
Trudging it up, doing it, pulling the roots and that, you know, we get dirty and that's painful and we'll get blisters on our hands. It's just like it's part of it, but when you're so motivated for it to change, you will do it. You'll do whatever it takes to get to that place.
Whitney Walker: Yes, absolutely. And you're totally right that there, there is no timeline. There's no exact timeline. It's different for everybody. And also, I wanna say that there's no exact formula, you know, and even us, we're, we're just, you know, kind of ch chatting and sharing our thoughts and perspectives. But you know, even what you're hearing now doesn't mean able to align perfectly with you and your situation.
And there's no book and there's no, you know, person that can tell you exactly like this is what narcissistic relationships are, and this,
you have to do these steps to heal yourself. Healing is. Completely personal to the individual. And you also have to realize that [00:33:00] when we look back at our life, and when I look back at times, things that I've healed from, sometimes I'm like, gosh, all that time spent with this other thing was pointless.
It did nothing. It didn't, you know, and my eating disorder, it didn't cure my addiction, but everything was like a brush stroke. It's, it's never just one thing. It's a, it's a. Compacted things over time that create change.
And then like we said, that's what suddenly you just realize one day like the magnet that once drew in toxicity is gone.
And you're like, damn, I don't, I don't, what, what was it? And there's no clear answer. It's not like, oh, because I did that course, or, oh, because I meditated for 20 days in a row. Like
there's no exact answer. That's why I call it alchemy. It's just things shifted enough that you're suddenly in a new. Experience. And again, I'll use my, my, you know, bulimia battle as an example is that for so long I felt completely out of control and there's nothing I could, I did everything, everything I would like write contracts to myself and sign it, be like I'll never do it again. 'cause here's the other thing about addictions that are [00:34:00] terrible, is you become afraid of yourself. That's even true about narcissistic relationships because, because we get out of them and we think, God, that was I, I was brutalized and I was miserable for a year. I'll never do that again.
But sometimes we do. So it's a horrible feeling to be afraid of yourself. And so it takes that effort to say, I wanna look deep within and see what's going on, and start to do the work. And again, then you start shifting and. My experience was that something that, you know, felt like it had control over me forever. Suddenly now, like you couldn't pay me enough to engage in that. It looks ter just like we're talking about those men, like binging and purging sounds, godawful. I'm like that. I can't even, I'm
almost a different person.
And that's the thing though, is that you are a different person.
We're always changing who we are. We're, you know, we look, might look similar or whatever, but our emotional bodies changing, our physical as we know, like we shed all our skin ourselves, like we're not even the same body as we were seven years ago.
Just think about
that. So don't get too [00:35:00] discouraged about where you are now. Because it has no bearing on where you can be
a year from now, two years from now, even a month from now, a lot can happen.
Bre Wolta: To your point about like having compassion with yourself too, if you can look at, there's a reason that you're attracted to these types of men. There's a reason why bulimia is the solution right now. Like I. And there's a part of you that just needs you to be curious about them and what they need in order to shift that instead of like you as a whole person is flawed and fucked up and will never change.
It's like, no, I have this part of me that's just needing something and is taking control and finding a solution where she thinks the solution is. And it's my job to get curious about how to suit. Her needs differently so that the man isn't the solution that gives you so much more control over your experience instead of feeling helpless to like this life that you were [00:36:00] dealt.
Thinking about it in that, in that way was really helpful for me and, and the way that I work with clients and sort of. Bringing in compassion. 'cause that is, that has to be number one. And before we start anything, we can't get curious if we're not compassionate. We can't shift things if we're not compassionate.
'cause otherwise it's just the judgmental loop that we're spending in. So I love that. Thank you for, for bringing that, bringing that
Whitney Walker: Yeah, completely. And that's what I always offer my clients. I think it's because I, I didn't feel like anyone ever told me this, but I always remind them whether it's insecurity or addiction. You didn't choose this. It's not like you woke up one your day, one day and you're like, I wanna have a raging eating disorder.
I wanna be an alcoholic. I wanna have horrible relationship with men. It's coming from within you. It's something that was created and that has a life force of its own. And that's what we're doing. We're tending to that life force to shift it from this sort of angry, fiery energy into this loving, watery energy where it's no longer trying [00:37:00] to, you know, exert itself upon us.
We're really kind of like taming this part of ourselves that sort of, you know, just became really wounded and really infected, really is what it is. It's like effect infected wound that you've neglected and you're
like, here, this little serum, you know, this dude he'll, he'll give, but it's a temporary fix
and if you just keep putting, you know, uh, elixir on a wound, it's not gonna resolve it.
It's still
gonna get worse. So. Eventually you will find the thing for you. If you really want it bad enough, that will heal that wound and just extinguish it. And you'll suddenly realize like, whoa, where did that go? Why am I different now?
It's like magic alchemy,
but it's because of your work as a manifester, as a magician,
Bre Wolta: Yes.
Whitney Walker: We're very powerful beings,
Bre Wolta: exactly. So good. Ah, Whitney, to end these or to end these relationships, ah, to end, to end these episodes is the word I'm looking for. Um, I pull a Oracle card for the listeners, [00:38:00] so I would love your help in choosing that if you're open to it. Okay. Okay, so go ahead and close your eyes and you and I are just gonna tune into the energy of the listeners and ask the deck what is the message that the woman listening needs to hear today.
And Whitney, whenever you feel your intuitive pull, let me know when to stop the shuffle.
Okay, we got amoeba, which the card looks like a picture of an amoeba. So let me find this in the book and I will read you what amoeba has to say. Amoeba, the simple survivor has everything she needs. This visitor in her simplicity brings a message of independence, individuality, and longevity. Since the beginning of time, she has existed undefined by shape, able to stretch and flow in her own way.
Amoeba brings a message of autonomy and freedom. You won't be trapped or boxed in. [00:39:00] You have skillfully maneuvered out of confining, rid, rigid situations before, and this time is no different. Trust your history and natural ability to shapeshift. Amoeba reminds you of the flexibility of your very nature, slippery at times, and able to move fluidly through any situation you have all that you need.
Enjoy the self-sufficiency you embody if perhaps you have forgotten your autonomy and stick like a parasite to things that don't serve you. Amoeba is a reminder to be flexible, creative, and to let go. Being too strict goes against your natural essence. Free yourself and simplify.
Whitney Walker: Beautiful.
Bre Wolta: Yeah.
Whitney Walker: I love that. 'cause the strongest message I got from that is that like in amoeba you can move and maneuver and go through anything and it's you're, it doesn't affect you. That's kind of
the nature of the soul. You can go through hell of addiction and toxic relationships, and it has no bearing on you as a perfect divine. Unconditionally.
Bre Wolta: so good. Like the amoeba, [00:40:00] learning from the lessons of the. Uh, well, thank you Whitney. Where can people find you? What do you have going on that you wanna point people towards?
Whitney Walker: so my favorite way to connect with people is for them to find me on Instagram at Women Waken Women. Awaken is the name of my podcast, which Bree will be a guest on soon.
And so that's the name of my Instagram. You can find me on there if you send me a dm. I like to also pull an Oracle or tarot card for people. Um, my website is Women Waken and yeah, you can find my podcast on Spotify, apple, all the platforms.
Bre Wolta: Amazing. Yeah. Check it out. You have, you have such good message that comes through your, all of your episodes.
Whitney Walker: Thanks, Bri.
Thanks for having me.
That's it for today, but before you go, let's just do a quick recap of what we talked about so that you can remember all the good stuff that you learned today.
You've discovered why these relationships feel like an addiction. You now know why it's actually okay that you went back, and how to go back with your eyes wide [00:41:00] open in the future, and. You now better understand how to let go, how to find that compassion for yourself to start healing, to start taking those small steps so that you can kick this addiction for good, so that you can find your true rock bottom.
These relationships don't feel good. No addiction feels good, and I wanna offer you a free guide that I put together that helps you to decipher Love bombing versus healthy love. Because often love bombing is the initial phase of these addictive, unhealthy relationships.
So click through the show notes for that. Three Ways to recognize Love bombing Free Guide, and this will give you all the red flags that you need to know. It's gonna help you prevent future heartbreak and help you just enter into healthy relationships, not getting sucked into that whirlwind, chaotic spiral
that these addictive relationships often start out as and as always, you are not alone, and I will see you next week. [00:42:00]