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Welcome to Elevate Daily, the podcast for those ready to elevate their life one intentional day at a time. I'm your host, Alexia Usgard, here to give you a permission slip to unapologetically savor the beauty and richness of life. Join me as we explore modern rituals, self leadership, the gene keys, and the art of elevating your health, wealth, love, and leadership. It's time to elevate. Let's dive in. Hello, hello and

Welcome to Elevate Daily. I'm your host, Alexia Uscard, and I am so deeply enthused to share today's conversation with you. All I can say is I already have multiple shifts that have landed in my daily life thanks to the insights, the wisdom, and the practical rituals that Amy shares in this episode. Frankly, in a world where so many powerful women are showing up with strength and

devotion, I'm also witnessing a quiet, aching longing is how I would describe it. A longing to be held and supported, a longing to be real, to let go of the masks and the personas and the compartmentalizing parts of who we are and instead to feel celebrated in our softness, in our beauty, in our truth and in our sweet humanness. This episode is about power.

and it's about intimacy and how as women we get to hold both. I'm joined by the incredible Amy Batusky, who is at the forefront of a global movement helping women reclaim the sisterhood and polarity that makes love thrive. So for over a decade, she's led transformational spaces that help women heal old wounds, build nourishing relationships with other women, soften into their feminine and communicate with men in a way that inspires devotion.

And what makes this conversation especially magical is how deeply Amy mirrors her Genki's, how much her Genki's mirror her mission. She truly walks the talk and is embodying and living out her codes and you know how much that makes my whole body and being smile. If you're new to the Genki's, they are your soul's energetic blueprint, a system that reveals your unique codes for aligned, honest, true purpose.

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prosperity and success that is truly aligned with your design. It's a core part of my work in feminine high performance. And today you'll hear those codes come alive through Amy's lived experience. In this episode, a few things we explore are how vulnerability becomes a leadership superpower, not a liability, the real reason so many women fear being too much and how to reclaim emotional depth as a gift.

how to handle those inevitable vulnerability hangovers that, goodness, we know, when you've shared something deeply real and personal, how to honor polarity and surrender, even when or if you're the breadwinner or feel like you're a potent leader in your life, how to reveal yourself in a way that's discerning, that's devotional, that's true, whether that's in sisterhood, in love, or in the public leadership arena.

So if you've ever asked, can I be powerful and soft? Can I lead and also feel so deeply held and melt in my life? Then this conversation is gonna speak straight to your soul. So without further ado, let's dive in.

Speaker 1 (03:46.734)

Okay, Amy, welcome to Elevate Daily. Thank you. I'm so happy to be here with you in person. Me too. It feels so nice that we get to do this in the in-person space since we do live in other sides of the world. We do. You are based in Austin, Texas, and I'm here in South Africa. So it's so beautiful that we get to have this time together. And I'm just so grateful our dear friend brought us together. Me too. And that we've actually, think a fun fact about us is we actually met a couple years ago. Yes. And then you know how life is when you leave and then we've been brought back together in our divine way. And I'm just so.

and

to first off know you, to honor the gifts that you bring forward and for this juicy conversation, because I'll just say, I feel like a lot of what I have is chats with my girlfriends, with the women in my world, with my clients, is intimacy, is a huge topic. Like how do we as women lead? How do we show up as women who know we have big missions, who know we're here to serve? And also how do we do it in a way where we get to feel like we lean back into feeling provided for?

How do we get to lean back into knowing what it's like to surrender? How do we get to feel like we can trust our sisters and not feel like we're in a competition or that there's only one woman at the top? How do we lean into just this feeling of naming our desires? So those are a couple of the juicy threads we're gonna go into today. So I'm like, that's just the vibe we're gonna go with. But just to like start the conversation before we go into these different aspects, where did this journey start?

Great. Hello.

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for mean, there's many aspects I imagine, but like anything juicy that feels called today to name. Where did you first get into intimacy, polarity, and this?

Experience. Yeah. Well, I started my personal development kind of journey actually as a kid because my parents met in a personal development seminar. Of course. When people like know me, they're like, this makes so much sense. But as an adult, I started doing courses and trainings and things when I was 18. And then, yeah, I was really into it. Just resonated so much with transformation and growth and human development and human potential and like

Love that.

Speaker 2 (05:48.878)

So when I started my coaching business 10 years ago, it was more general life coaching. And actually I remember saying, like, I can coach you on anything except relationships. Like that was how I felt. And everything is relationships. wasn't like there was no inclusion of relationships at all in my coaching, because I was coaching people on their general being. And so, yes, their being affects everything. But I was like, don't ask me for relationship.

So I was very aware of how much I lacked expertise in that area. And actually, interestingly, I think this is important because of where I am and you already know this story. But nine years ago, I met a man in a personal development workshop,

Of course, of course you did.

Because where else do you meet men when you're having the passions that I do? There are, I'm sure, other places, but that was just very apropos. And I just totally fell for him and had an experience with him that was really painful. really touched on wounds and stories within me that I'm not desirable, that I'm not good enough, that I'm not wanted, and brought me to an end to the bottom in my experience of myself and with men that I was willing to start down what I call the path.

And so I'd been doing a lot more masculine kind of energy. It had more masculine energy in the personal growth work I was doing previously. And then I found orgasm meditation, puncture world and the erotic blueprints and all these different things that like completely opened my eyes to what is possible in intimacy, sexuality and relationships. And I never turned back. So that was

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nine years ago and then I started my company Desire on Fire with my business partner Ellie seven years ago. We've been leading courses and retreats together for the last seven years. And yeah, I mean, it's my whole world. It really is. And the thing is, know, I'm sure we'll get into this. I'm so excited for what you're gonna reveal to me about my gene keys. But people ask me even on a date last week, I was on a date and he's like, so what are you passionate about like outside of your work? And I was like, well.

But you're like, what do mean? What's my work? What do you articulate of my work specifically?

It's all the same.

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because my work is so interconnected with my life and it is all about intimacy and human relationships and connection and that is what life is about to me what's the most important thing in life so then what's work what's play certain things I get paid for other things I don't but it all feels like my Dharma and so that's also been a point of pain for me because it's been kind of at times like feel had felt confusing and like enmeshed where I'm like wait what is my work and what is

personal relationship and what is professional relationship and where's the line when I'm in so much intimacy in my relationships with, you know, my business partners or people that I'm, you know, facilitating with or my clients who also are friends. And so it's been, and I had so many learning lessons around that and I'm sure we'll continue to forever. But yeah, it is, I am so passionate about it and it's, it's, it has been the most humbling, painful, beautiful,

you know, ego annihilating the ecstatic journey of my life to learn to connect with myself, my feminine, my own, being intimate with me, and then learning to be more deeply intimate with women in my life, sisterhood, and then men in both romantic, sexual, and platonic connections, how to have right relationship with men.

my gosh, I mean, there's so much of what you shared that I'm like, where do I want to go with this? But I feel like one thing I want to just circle back on is I love the way you named that actually what led you down the path was actually a struggle. Yeah. Right? Like it was that moment. And I think this is just for anyone listening. think because this goes into so much of our topic about leadership is I think where people get confused is like we get this idea and there's this pedestalized notion of what a leader is.

And this is something you and I both care a lot about in terms of just breaking down this old consciousness, this old paradigm. And it's this idea that like, nope, I can't be a leader until I'm at some ideal idea of the top. And it's only until I've made it until then, can I lead anything? Can I help anybody? And it's like, there's this whole new way, which I think is based in intimacy and everything you share about where it's realizing there's an area, there's an area of expertise. You are here to really get to know in this lifetime. And there's areas now where

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You've now been in what it was nine years since that incident happened, where nine years ago, who you've become in this nine year process is so much. And this person on the date, what just last week asking you, this is an area of growth that you are committed to learning and developing in yourself over the next decades of your life. It's not like you're saying, I'm an expert. I'm a leader. This means I know everything. It means like, yes, I know a good amount. There's so much that.

I know more than past Amy did. And I can help you and I can walk this journey with you because I'm going to constantly, humbly, intimately be figuring that out. Would you say, because when I feel in that, this feels like it ties into this energy I was tuning into for today, which is I think a lot of people have this idea that intimacy is a liability in leadership. There's this idea of, can I be powerful and can I be human? I know a lot of women in my world, there's this constant dynamic of, it too much?

if people

see actually a lot of my human side and realize I'm really messy in certain ways. And there's areas of my life I have not figured out, but then will people, will I ruin my reputation if I'm that way? And then I'm thinking about that. So that's already a conversation with this that I want to bring forward. And even looking at what you've done, you've worked with best friends. You've worked intimately with people, which is also the other very classic taboo of don't work with people that you know intimately because otherwise you can't handle the compartmentalized professionalism.

I gave you a couple threads you can go with there, but I'm like, please. Yeah, very curious.

Speaker 2 (11:54.488)

So I would say first of all, like a huge part of my journey and career has been sharing vulnerably and revealing. Like that is what makes me, I think who I am makes me recognizable, that has people wanna work with me. And yeah, it just has me be relatable. It's like if I'm just like up here, I got it. know, like multi-orgasmic queen that like kills it in relationships with men always like.

that like who can relate to that? And yes, people might aspire to that, but then it's immediately putting me on pedestal. And like, I started this journey with like so much shame around my body. Like literally remember with this man, cause it's really powerful to look back on him specifically, you know, nine years ago, I remember our sex and feeling like the one time we had it.

And feeling like, don't even know if I took my bra off. Like, I remember how insecure I felt and like wanting him to like me and am I making weird faces? And do I, he like, what does he think about me? And then he, he wasn't interested in pursuing more of a physical or romantic relationship after that, which is what crushed me. And of course it sent me all into my head of like, am I bad at sex? Does he hate my body? Am I gross? Did I do it wrong? Like all these thoughts that I know so many women are plagued with and insecurities and

And I mean, that's just like reflecting on one incident. I mean, I had all sorts of other thoughts and stories and beliefs and feeling unlovable and undesirable and they still come up, right? They still come up. And as you know, I've been reconnecting as a friend with this man from nine years ago and getting to feel certain aspects of these stories arise again, but mostly not. Like I feel in such a different place and so much security and.

comfort in myself, but I'm getting to optimize some more of these of these bits of story that come up because it's not I haven't made it and and I still am in this humbling journey with men and like and okay. Yeah, many things I want to say but like One one example just from last week is like a man asked me on a date like do you you know our men what how do men feel about your work? You know, what do they think about your work and are they intimidated by your work? And I was like

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the right men for me are not, right? The right men for me, the right man for me is not intimidated by my work and appreciates that this is what I do and that it's my passion. And yeah, I mean, that was my answer. And I'd had men ask me that before and, you know, that's my response. And I said to him, like, I am not sitting here as like an intimacy expert who knows everything. I am actually a shy lover.

I can be slow, I'm super slow to be fully comfortable with a man, like to open sexually with a man. I can be totally have my insecurities come up if I really like a guy. I can totally go into like, my God, does he like me if I genuinely have feelings for someone. Same like, you know, our little crush feelings or like little girl stuff can come up like for any of us and me too. And I think it's so important for leaders to reveal stuff like this. And I also struggle with

revealing as much as I could because I'll be vulnerable to an extent that feels comfortable for me and it might look super vulnerable to the world. And then there's another level of mess that I'm like, no, I don't want to show that. And Ellie actually has been really helpful for me. She's really great at being vulnerable and messy and she's helped me become more so. And same with her husband, He's really stood for me to be messier and more real. And it's an interesting line because

I also deserve privacy. We all do. And I haven't been sharing as much online lately, just in this chapter. And that feels rightful and correct. But where's the balance of like revealing and being real and letting people see the real stuff, which I think is so important for leaders to do of all kind of, you know, areas of industry, right? All kinds of leaders being real, but also

we can be private, can not share with the world our intimate secrets and so an intimate lives. So where's the line? And this comes back to what I mentioned before is like, where is the line with my relationships? Where's the line with my work slash play slash personal? Where's the line with how much to share? How do you revealing in Voldemort and intimate? Because that's my purpose and work, but also how to honor myself, be private when I need to and be able to like hold things secret.

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This is an ongoing discovery, the discovery of my life. You one of the many discoveries of my life and a consistent dance and discovery.

Oh my gosh, there is just again so much I'm like, ooh, which thread. okay. I feel like we've got to talk about the piece here that stands out so much to me, which is this accessibility of your energy and where there's this energy where people, notice there's two different dynamics I watch with women. There's either those who feel like they overshare and they struggle to have the boundaries. And this plays out in their romantic relationships because then they feel like they've gone off and told way too many details to like family members and people where now it's like,

They've added a bunch of other people's perspectives to the sacredness of their partnership, which later becomes harder to navigate. Or you've got the other dynamic of people who feel very private and it's a struggle to actually feel safe to know who can I trust. So I feel like I'm curious with intimacy, because also even with leaders, right, there is a dynamic of there's also containment and spaces with agreements. So you're not sitting here being like, go loud in the world. Everyone deserves your most intimate thoughts and perspectives. It's like, where is that line that you found between containment?

and revealing.

Yeah, and it really requires discernment, right? Because I do share differently online versus in my close sisterhood relationships versus in my romantic or sexual relationships versus in my containers with clients, right, or paid programs. What I share at a free event is different than what I share in a paid program where we have a different level of opt-in and the women that I'm sharing with have a different level of opt-in or people, men too. Like, and I intuit it.

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Like I can just feel based on the space, the container, whether it's a relational container or program container, what is resonant for me to share? And I still will have moments where I'll go in to see her like, oh my God, did I overshare? Of course, of course I'm human. Like, and everyone does. I mean, I hear this, you know, with my business partner and her husband and other people and my close sisters like after recording a podcast or teaching a monster class or leading in a program or sharing a post, it's like.

All the edge voices come up because we're out of growth edge, right? And we may overshare and that's okay. Or we may share with someone that can't fully receive it or handle it or might be out of range for them. And we learn, right? And there's no formula. I mean, there's no like, and here's when you share this, here's when you share that. Like it's intimacy. It is messy. And it's, we're dealing with the unknown and it requires attunement, which is something that I'm always learning.

know how to be most attuned with myself and my own boundaries and the group that I'm with or individual line with. And for sure, oversharing is one of my patterns because I am so good at sharing. I love sharing. I want to share with the world. And it's been a pattern of mine to overshare about myself, also to overshare about others because I get so excited about things happening with other people. And like, because I'm such a community oriented person and intimacy focused person, then I'm like, this is happening with them. And I'm kind of like,

want to keep the community aware and connected. And so it's such good intention, but that's also gotten me in trouble or not quite trouble isn't quite the frequency, but it's also had impact where that certainly wasn't my intention. And so I've had to learn, you know, not to share things about other people or not to overshare about myself or my own internet relationship and to honor the people who are involved. And that's again, an ongoing discovery because

I do love sharing and keeping people aware and connected and alert and tuned into each other. But where is it my responsibility to do that and where is it not? And where am I making it my own when it's other people's to share?

Speaker 1 (20:12.194)

I think that point you just named at the end is such a key part, which is how do we know the difference inside of ourselves when it's this is mine to share versus when there's other people's stories involved or your partner's story involved. And also, mean, something I probably have aired on the other side as you. So I've probably aired on the more, like more of what I've been told is open up more, Alex, open up more.

And it's funny because you can see where there's the gift in both of those other expressions, right? Like there's a gift in someone who can reveal so openly and then there's a gift in someone who has the containment. And so it's cute because even you and I are like each other's poles in a way of the energy because I go, in a way it's also made so a lot of people trust me to open up and a lot of it's like, that's not my story to tell. And like, that's just that. If you want to know that story, I really honor that that person, that's their story to share with you.

And then also there's been an energy though of me also inside of myself honoring that the aspects of me that likes to be private is because I'm going, I don't want all of these different other energies on me in this way. And I love what you named in terms of the layers of accessibility. that's just what's coming through is the language now, but you're not being expected on your public platform to share the same level of information that you then feel more comfortable sharing.

in a retreat space versus like there's these understandings of also who's opted in. And also I think for anyone it's like this balancing act in community of what are the agreements. So I've had to learn as someone who is opening up more. So for anyone maybe listening who's more of the me in this situation where it's harder to open, I've had to learn that it's helpful for me just to feel comfortable to say, hey, can I trust that I can open and share this with you and this won't leave the space? Or just naming like I think it's a really important responsibility to get good on, okay, what

What is it that makes you feel safe or what is it that makes you feel comfortable? Because there's also a line. Maybe you are too afraid to ... There's definitely moments I've gone, okay, Lex, you just need to walk through the vulnerability hangover of maybe just revealing something and maybe imperfectly perfectly sharing this. And maybe some people will get upset with you, which I have had. It's a risk. There is always this risk, but it's also honoring. So have you seen, for those who have the tendency to not share, what have you found helps to open them up to feel like, one, they can honor the

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the gift of the containment, also where they can take the risks.

Yeah, your point, I love your point around asking for the confidence that you need around that they're not going to share it, right? Like, hey, just want to, before I share this, feels vulnerable for me. I just want to make sure that you, you know, are comfortable holding this in confidence and not sharing it with anyone else. Cause that also helps me hearing that from friends that are more private, if they say that I'm like, yes, of course. And it's not to say I was going to go share it with everyone, but because I have more of that kind of

openness around sharing and like community updates, I guess I would call it, then it's helpful and somebody just makes it clear what their boundaries are. And I think it may create safety for them. And I would say for me, like helping others open up in my life, we tend to be bit more private. One of the pillars or tenets in our programs at Desire on Fire and in programs that I hold is bringing an attitude of approval.

And so I said that any women's circle and any retreat and any program is anonymity. So keeping things anonymous, right? Not necessarily confidentiality because I actually invite people to share if they heard something they're inspired by like, my gosh, this woman shared that she and her partner like have sex dates every week. And it's like, yeah, share that. know, like I don't, I

I was inspired by something, but I can't tell you what it was. Like, I want people to be able to share what they're inspired by or what came up for them or what they got activated around that they're working through, but not tie it to a person. So keeping it anonymous means you can share about things that are impacting you or that you were moved by, but it's not about the person. It's about what came up for you or what you were impacted by. So anonymity and then an attitude of approval. So if everyone in a space or just me and a friend have opted into holding

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and attitude of approval, even if we disagree, even if it's not that we share the same desires or the same outlook, but I'm gonna approve of you and whatever you share, it creates such a sense of safety for the other person, because they know they're not gonna be shamed or condemned or gossiped about. They know they're gonna be met with love and approval. And so, I mean, that's just two of these kind of pillars or trends that I bring to any container setting, but I also practice in my, just any relationship, and our relationships with women and sisterhood, and it definitely creates more space and safety for others to share.

my gosh, I would imagine that's also so powerful for partners. Totally. Because I would imagine, right? Because I think what I notice and something I've even practiced, even with Z and I, is there's this energy where you want to share something. But you don't want anything fixed immediately. You don't want anything even acknowledged. You just need the space to know you're listening. So do you find for partners, this is quite, I would imagine, quite an interesting practice or tool they can use.

Totally, absolutely. You can bring this to any relationship. And I've held this kind of energetic, even if I haven't spoken, like this is the agreement with exes. And they are so grateful. mean, my exes have shared things with me that they have never shared with anyone around their patterns or their histories or their sexual desires and things that they're like, why? I can't believe I'm even sharing this with you. On a date last week, a man said to me, I cannot believe I'm sharing all this with you.

And it's totally, and I'm like, can, I mean, but for him it is. I have found that a lot with men where you're like, I feel so comfortable sharing with you. And I know part of that, yes, if I just be my being and my essence and whatever, but part of that is just because I hold an attitude of approval and that creates so much freedom and space for people to be who they are. And I was with one of my close guy friends last night. He's like, I can be.

You're like, what's shocking?

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fully myself with you and every part of me I know is welcome and can be online and present with you and that's such a gift. And I feel that that is partially because I really do practice this attitude of approval and love and permission for people to be who they are. And then I get to work out whatever comes up for me around, you know, if I'm activated or triggered by something, some way of being or something they're doing.

I love the self-responsibility piece, right? Because I think that's why so many people struggle to open is because they're already so nervous of the judgments, the rejections, all the opinions. And even if someone doesn't say, there still can be an energetic feeling, right? And so I love this agreement, whether you vocalize it externally or if you just really set the intention, it's clear in variety of ways of actually being in a space of approval where it's like that person can then step back and honor.

anything.

Speaker 1 (27:00.872)

I think we're going to bring this back in as we talk more about sisterhood because I think that's a really key way that sisterhood actually forms is you have to have this frequency. Otherwise, as we know, there's just so many dynamics and you end up with all these trigger dynamics where no one can just honor, actually, it has nothing to do with this person. It can be very easy to go fixate, blame them, gossip, judge, which is a lot of what we've seen is also the very projected expression of women and why a lot of those dynamics have

dynamics have played out, whereas there really is this energy of like, oh, wow, this woman activated envy in me. This woman activated that there is a thing that she brought up that actually doesn't sit well with me. Why? In me, not her, me. So we're going to double click there. But I just feel like this is such a good lead in as you talk about this date, as you talk about these different pieces. You, as you know, you and I, because of course, to know me is to know I'm going to be like, OK, what's your gene key? And I- Second date. On our second date.

Yeah. On our second.

I just laughed and also just blew up with excitement when I realized that, so I'm gonna share Amy's first gene keys, which guys is wild. So her mission code in her gene keys, what I call your mission code is gene key 59, which no joke goes from the shadow of dishonesty to the gift of intimacy to the city, the highest frequency of transparency. And not only is this your mission code,

This is, I also look in anyone's profile. I look to see if you have a dominant theme. So do you have a gene key that pops up multiple times? Because there's 64. So the chances of even having, there's many people's charts who I see who don't even have a double. You have this gene key twice. And I just went, oh, of course she does. Wow. But I smile so much because I love when I meet someone who I feel is really living out their code. And so I smile because I went, yes.

Speaker 2 (28:44.012)

Wow.

Speaker 1 (28:54.74)

I also have this Genki in my chart too, so I was also like, yes, this is yummy and I can see it in you. And what it is is it goes from the shadow of dishonesty, which is all about wearing masks, the personas, this feeling of, and it's not just with other people. I think what it calls out is where are we masked with ourselves and like really telling ourselves where do we mistrust others? Because we're not being honest with who we truly are. And then as you move into the gift, which we've already started to tap into in this conversation, it's so much about softening.

melting away the barriers. It's a complete sense of, I've loved the way you've used the word revealing, because I think other times people talk about like exposing, but it's more just revealing who you are and what you are without any agendas, because that's the other dynamic is often when we're in the dishonesty shadow frequency, it's when the mind is having some version of an agenda. What do I want this person to respond like? How do I want them to perceive me? The performative energy, whereas like the intimacy frequency is just

This is who I am and my authenticity in all of my multiple shades, in my gorgeous humanness and in my leadership. And then transparency is that genuine awareness in the city of just being completely at one with everyone. There's no, I'm separate. There's no you, there's no othering. Because you just really see everyone as an expression for your own exploration of life. And so first off, can we all just take a moment? I love it because like I said, I celebrate.

I love to name that I can see, because with your mission code, this is what people are going to see you doing and what you become a walking permission slip in your leadership for all of us. So as I share that piece, what lands? Does it resonate with you at all whatsoever? Do you feel like you live this one out at all?

No, all of it. I love I mean, it resonated with so much of it. And I the masks, the the dishonesty because I've always identified with being real and authentic and vulnerable. Yeah. And as I've gotten more vulnerable in my life and learned really being on the feminine path or the kind of more intimacy focused path, I've seen where I have been dishonest first with myself because I did feel authentic because it was that seemed the most authentic to me. And so that's what I shared out in the world.

Speaker 2 (31:08.364)

And then as I become more willing to look at my shadows and my flaws and my mess, then I've been able to reveal more of that, which is really creates intimacy because it really allows me to be seen in who I really am, including all the messiness and imperfection and shame and flaws. And then I feel so seen and the transparency. mean, that is what I get to bring to the world, to my relationships and

Yeah, and I really see where it has cost me, you know, in my life being in dishonesty or

fooling myself, you know, and wearing the masks, but with really good intention. Because I'm like, oh, I'll just like, I just want to look good. And I remember my ex six years ago, who was my most significant relationship to date. And he was so amazing, such an incredible man. And he said to me when we were breaking up, he's like, you are so good at looking good.

And it was, yeah. And it was just such a moment. He's like, cause he just wanted more of me. He's like, I will, I know you're jealous. I know you get angry. I know you get sad. I know there's more in there. I know you have more desires. Like I want it. I want to feel it. I want to feel you. And I was so living in my head then, you know, this was over six years ago that we broke up, you know, over seven years ago that we got together and he, he, he just wanted more of me and actually welcomed it. And I wasn't there yet.

I actually couldn't bring that. I was so more in my head then and in my stories and in my, and so I can just see where there was dishonesty there with myself first. And so that's all that I could reveal. And he desperately wanted the deeper intimacy and transparency. yeah, and I so trust exactly how that went. And I've learned so much that is that relationship is a gift that keeps on giving forever. I'm so grateful for him.

Speaker 2 (33:05.644)

And all of my relationships are like, wow, so much to learn, but I do so much better. My relationships are more fulfilling. I feel more seen and my impact is greater when I am vulnerable and revealing.

transparent. How do you handle the vulnerability hangovers? Because I just know that is such a big one that all the ladies in my world navigate. like, OK, great. I did the revealing. How do I And now I stay open. Yeah, how do I stay open? I just want to contract. how?

Okay, so there's a couple things here. One is that I would say like it is important to reveal within our range. So like not to blow ourselves out. If we blow ourselves out, that creates more of a hangover. It's just like with drinking. If you have a loss of wine, it's fine. But if you go ham and you drink so much and your hangover is going to be terrible, right? And it's the same thing with sharing. It's like if you just share

a bit or like you push your edge, you might have a little hangover. It's like, it's funny that I'm using drinking that I drink, but like it just, it's just an easy comparison, right? It's like, can have a couple of drinks, you can reveal a bit, you might have a little hangover, but you're fine. It doesn't take you out the next day unless you go too far. And so taking it bit by bit, pushing your growth edge, letting yourself reveal in a way that's still in your range and not blowing yourself out is important. And if you do, it's fine. Like also just giving yourself grace, like

Wow, I did share. does feel vulnerable. And just being aware of the stories that come up right after and the next day. Like they can be very convincing. Like, you shared too much. You shouldn't have shared that. They're going to hate you now. I even had that because I shared last night with a man in my life that, yeah, I revealed something to him and it wasn't even I didn't blow myself out. I really was in range. Like I could have shared more. I didn't. It actually felt right sized. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:59.258)

And I still had some stories come up last night and this morning of like, okay, actually, maybe I should have shared more. I share? that what did I reveal in a way that was too vulnerable? Or was I holding back? Did I? Is he gonna pull away now because I revealed what I did? Like I did have some stories and I just gave myself grace and like gave it space. It's so important to pause after an experience like that.

and lean on sisters. So if you are spinning or you are in your head or you are in overthinking or fear, I have done that. Of course, many had to have that feeling many times and just lean on sisters who I trust. And I say, share, send a voice note or call them and just say like, OK, I just need some support and reassurance. Like, can I have reassurance? Or with the person that you shared with. So maybe shared with a sister and that was the vulnerable revealing or with a man. You can also ask the man or woman for reassurance like, hey, that was really vulnerable for me. Can I just have some reassurance that?

that it's okay when I share it or that you love me or you know, that, that, that I didn't share too much and just ask for the reassurance, which can feel so vulnerable. didn't start asking for reassurance until like a year ago or a year and a half ago. I learned this tool and I was like, wait, what? You can do that? yeah, can I have some reassurance and feeling really vulnerable and exposed right now? And people are self happy to give it. and it may be someone involved in it.

who you revealed to or what you revealed about. And it may be sound completely different, but just asking for that from someone you love and trust can be very stabilizing and settling in those moments of vulnerability hangover.

I love it because I'm from a very practical level. It's knowing it's going to happen. yeah. Because at the end of the day, if you're someone who's listening to the podcast who is committed to elevating daily, you are a risk taker. You're someone on the edge of expansion. So you're just going to know vulnerability hangovers are just part of your life. You're going to be misunderstood. There's going to be people who don't like you, who don't get you. There probably will be people who judge you at times for even what you reveal. So I almost feel like going into it knowing one.

Speaker 1 (36:59.192)

There's nothing wrong with you. And two, can we all honor that we're listening to an intimacy expert and she just talked about her vulnerability hangover today. Yeah, exactly. Can we just, know, can we name it? Like, there's nothing wrong with you. I think it's just such a big piece. I think if someone listening is like, okay, I want to honor this reassurance tool in whatever way there is might be they're wanting to write or put themselves out there more. It might be just revealing more in intimate family relationships or a partner. What would you say is like the first question or best way they can start setting themselves up?

with their reassurance ritual. We'll call it their reassurance ritual.

I love that. Yeah, I mean, you can start with just asking some friends in your life that you trust and you can say like, I'm going to be, I really want to practice sharing more, revealing more myself, being more vulnerable or authentic, whatever language is true for you and say to them, like, sometimes it might be, feel really vulnerable for me or I'm, I sometimes have a vulnerability hangover. Can I reach out to you or can I lean on you?

when I feel super exposed or I'm having that vulnerability hangover and will you give me reassurance or remind me who I am or that it's okay and just ask them in advance and people will be so happy even if you don't ask them in advance, you know, you can do this but if you're, if it's not something that's kind of normal in your friend group or with people in your life then it's great to give them a heads up, give them some context that you may be reaching out and people are, most people are so honored, you know, to be asked and to be given that really vulnerable role.

of holding you in that, not so vulnerable for them necessarily, but that's a very sensitive, tender experience to hold you in. then, just in those moments when you need it. And it may not be from revealing a lot, like whatever you're feeling vulnerable about, whatever you did, however you showed up, whatever you didn't do, maybe you set a boundary, maybe you didn't respond to your mom when she was needing your attention and you

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held the boundary and you didn't respond to her for a couple days because you needed to take space, which feels so painful and uncomfortable for you. And it feels like you're physically hurting her to hold that boundary. That you could ask for reassurance around from a friend or a loved one or your partner like, hey, I'm feeling really vulnerable holding this space and some distance with my mom or my loved one and.

I am so afraid of hurting them and I feel so sad and I feel like I'm abandoning them and I feel like I'm going to be rejected and I have all these stories running and I'm feeling scared. Can I have some reassurance?" And yeah, and they'll remind you, yeah, it's okay. Yeah, it's going to feel this way. It is uncomfortable. You you are at a growth edge or whatever language they might have, you know, but they'll give you reassurance, remind you it's all okay. And we need that when we're in the depths of our fear and despair.

I feel this because I feel also in what you've shared, there's two key things that stand out to me. One is with the range piece. Know your range and also know where the edge is and also do it in a loving way. Totally. No one's saying, here, go from 0 to 180 overnight. You've probably witnessed this in yourself and other people who have done it. Then you can do it and you just create a lot more discomfort usually in the process. I think would you say that probably one of the first things you'd recommend is

Whatever your area is, wherever you're desiring to reveal yourself more, to find a space, to think about how to do it maybe a smaller space first, and then to whether it's with a best friend or whether it's joining a sister group, where then you finally start opening up about dreams and desires and then expanding. Because I think a lot of people, let's just say from the public perspective, go, great, I'm going share this on social media. And you're like, or not. Maybe not right now.

Is that what you would say there is like really honor the circle or get clear about like what is your contained space that like lets your range be held as you tap into the next levels of intimacy? Is that how you would say it?

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Absolutely. Find that, find the, the space or relationship that feels right-sized for this thing that you want to experience or reveal that feels like the correct containment that you need. And of course it doesn't have to be perfect, but just like feeling into that first, okay, this feels in range. I feel that I can share with one close friend or a few close friends. And yeah, push that comfort zone edge.

But it might be like, okay, I can share with one friend feels comfortable. Three friends or five friends feels scary. And then posting about it on social media or speaking about it on a podcast feels out of range. Okay, great. Let's start with a few friends, right? And then just practice that, like create a group thread or get some girlfriends together or, you know, have a group call and say, I just want to practice sharing in a way that's uncomfortable for me and being seen by more people. Will you see me in this? And can I share with you? And

Of course, I'm sure they'll say yes. And if they do say no, then that could hurt. It might touch something in you that might feel painful or scary. But then you can honor that and say thank you for your truth or honesty or boundary and then find people that can hold you in that and reveal to them. And then you'll then you'll be able to build it up, you know. And yeah, I love this. A revealing ritual and then a reassurance ritual when you have the vulnerability hangover. Right.

I love some practical grounding. I'm like, okay, so next time you're having this moment, here's how you can set yourself up for success. And then here's how when shit hits the fan, you can be like, this is what I need. Hello, loved ones, I need my reassurance ritual and I'm here for it and I'm owning it. I love this so much because also I'm just imagining with all the incredible spaces you've held. I don't know how to word this other than why is it that I find oftentimes

where people can hold back, this is my thought about intimacy, is because we go look for the celebration, the affirmation, the validation from the one, the two, the three people who can give it to us. Why do we do this? And what do you recommend here?

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Yeah, I think it's, I mean, I don't know. I mean, it's probably different for every person. I can't say for everyone what the root cause is, but I would say it generally is mimicking something from childhood, right? Like seeking it, wanting it from a parent who couldn't give it to us or a friend or a person elder or someone authority figure that we want that attention and validation from who either we didn't get it from in childhood. So then we're still seeking it in the wrong places because it mimics the same kind of pain that also

conflates with love and you know, so creating that or seeking it because we did get it in childhood and then we want to find it again and get the validation and so expecting everyone can give it to us when they can't and so seeking it in the wrong places. And I'm in a 12 step recovery program as you know, it's been life changing for me around healing kind of codependent patterns like this. This would be one of them going to a source that can't give you the love or celebration that you're seeking.

And they say in this Tulsa program that I'm in, they call it going to the hardware store for milk. Right? It's like, you're the one going to the hardware store for milk, right? The hardware store isn't doing anything wrong by not selling milk. It's a hardware store. It's up to me to understand and accept that I can't get milk at the hardware store. So say going to a parent or a friend who I...

really want them to have the milk, right? Really want them to have the milk and they don't and they've shown me that. It's my responsibility to know that, to parent myself in the moment, know, love on my little one, my inner child, and then find someone someplace that sells milk, find someone who can offer the celebration and the love.

that is needed and it may be really painful, you know, over and over again. This is why inner child work, parts work, reparenting work is so important for those who have had traumatic childhoods or experiences where they didn't gain the love or attention that they deserved and should were owed as a child that is healthy and normal for a child. So then reparenting yourself and then go into sources that actually can give you that love and celebration is such an adult, you know, mature practice.

Speaker 1 (45:15.374)

It's so important to name, because I would say, I'm curious if this is what you would say with the women's groups and sisterhood, is also as someone who's led a lot of women specific, especially leaders, women who are powerhouse women groups, I would say that actually the bigger vulnerability for women to feel safe to shine in is not actually their hard stuff. It's their deeply celebratory amazing things, not just...

from like a bragging perspective, but from a genuine embodied, I'm turned on lit up because I brought this creation to life. I find that that's actually where I've watched more of the triggers, more of the rumbles, more of the vulnerability hits. And then to your point, if you name it then, if you think about childhood, if you didn't necessarily have safe spaces where actually going and celebrating with people who society has painted should be your best and safest places to hold your successes. How do you've seen this play out?

And what have you seen actually supports women with feeling safe to bring this part of themselves forward?

Okay, I actually have a lot on this because I led a women's circle here last week, as you know, and both of these dynamics came up and it was great. So, because I had a start with celebrations as just like an easing in, which also could be challenging for some, of course, as you're speaking to. And then I also had them share pain, shame, and things that they're holding shame and guilt around. So I think there's a couple of things here. One is I just want to acknowledge that it...

is what I have experienced and noticed is that it does tend to be easier for women to share maybe the uncomfortable darker stuff when it is in the form of complaining. When it is in the form of actually revealing, actually revealing like pain, shame, guilt, heartache, that gets into more vulnerable territory for most women and feels

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can feel really, really challenging to open and actually show and reveal. Then with celebrations, I think celebrating can feel really hard for women. And it's interesting the dynamics that show up with that, which is, cause one of the tools that I learned from Mama Gino, one of my teachers is bragging. She holds it, you know, that's her kind of like a orientation towards it is bragging, right? It's like, we're not taught that we get to celebrate ourselves and brag. So I love that. That's one, frame for it, right? Is celebrating yourself and

I notice some people are really uncomfortable with it. They don't even want to say brag. Like I brag this. It's like, I don't even want to say that. Or even saying like, I celebrate this, but they'll keep it really vague. You know, they won't be really specific. They don't want to be too boastful. So then they'll minimize it. Or the opposite where someone will be very like their discomfort has them act in a way that when they're sharing or bragging, it's super boastful. Like I'm so amazing. my God, this happened for me because I am so amazing. And it's

actually a way that they're bypassing the tenderness of with celebration, right? And so it's just wild to witness the different kind of frequencies and dynamics that play out in these invitations to reveal. And I just want to say that the way that I hold it and teach it now with celebrations and brags is self-reverence. So actually, what do you hold reverence for yourself?

around in your life, like what do you revere about yourself and how you're showing up or what you're doing or what you're creating or how you're receiving and that you want to celebrate. And so I think that frequency already, that framing already shifts from like a, and sure people might still be triggered by it, but I think it really does eliminate a lot of the triggers in the space because it takes out the like

boastful, better than superior kind of energy that can come through with some women. And instead is like, wow, I'm just, I'm so proud of this. You know, I can, I really hold this in reverence. I am in awe. You know, I am.

Speaker 1 (49:22.113)

I am.

so grateful that I am experiencing this, creating this, doing this, being this in my life. And then it's like, it invokes more inspiration from the people around versus like a pushing away or like the competition. So that's just one thing. And then I would say for other women, for the women receiving, regardless of how it's framed, bragging, celebrating, reverence, practicing an absolute of approval.

celebrating that woman and knowing that her shine, her brad, her celebration does not take away from in any way yours, right? And knowing that you can back her and actually a rising tide lifts all boats. so her, her success, her joy, her love actually gets to expand you and let these women be expanders for you. And that's, that's a big thing that I practice and bring into my

her

Speaker 2 (50:22.894)

programs and containers for sure.

I love that because I love this energy of self-reverence. Because I think that distinction, the term, hits a different energy than... Because some people can also feel performative pressure to be like, well, now I need to talk about my big quotes win, whether it's professionally or whatever it may be. And it immediately makes me think about even in myself, when I've noticed, when I've been in women's gatherings, groups, where I've had to watch the difference in myself, where I had to really sit in self-reverence is...

in groups where let's say multiple women who have shared before me have talked about heartbreak, massive breakups, struggles with dating, those dynamics. And then my truth of actually what I feel honest to share in that moment is being in deep self-reverence for my partnership and feeling like I'm in a really beautiful season with him. And actually in truth, that's what I want to share. But I've watched that little niggle in me at times where I felt like, it too much? Is this unkind? That's the big one. Totally.

That's the story that will come up for me. Is it unkind right now given what everyone else is experiencing to then do this? And then I've really intentionally worked on doing it where again, it's from this very embodied place where I've learned after where I've had people share it with me, thank you so much for sharing that because to your point, then it honors the fullness of the space. It actually honors the fullness of the expression and all the different facets of whatever one's going through. And then likewise, I had women in the same circle where they're sharing something they're self-reverent about. I'm going,

Ooh, like that expands me because there's always areas we're all navigating and growth and areas we're melted into. Like there's just always that energy. But I've watched that niggle was very interesting for me. don't know, niggle, whatever that means. But you know I mean? That little moment you have a go, you go, hmm, I have a choice point here. Am I going to play it, quote, safe and dim myself a bit here? Because I don't know. Again, have you ever noticed it where it's almost like you kind of feel like with women, you'll see if one woman's down.

Speaker 1 (52:20.108)

You can see, it's I think a lot in friendship groups and things where everyone can immediately almost fixate on where the tension needs to go there. That's why I think a lot of the women who, quote, hold it all together often feel like they never get space. What have you seen is important because we can go into the group and they can all, it's easy to say, I go into these friend groups and no one holds space for me. That's a little old school victim consciousness. But in reality, if you're a woman who relates to feeling like you're the one,

who's leading in lot of ways in your life, holding it all together, what would you say is your permission slip to them to say, here's what you need to tap into to also let yourself be.

Yeah. I mean, if you're not feeling seen and held, it's because you're not revealing. Period. That's it. That's it. And I used to be that way. It wasn't even a conscious thing, but I was so good at holding space and being there for others and being helper and being the coach and that it was a way to protect myself. And I remember explicit moments with friends being like, we just shared so much and you've helped us so much and you've us so much reflection.

Do you need anything? Do you need support? And I remember multiple times being like, no, I'm good. Like, and it was genuine again, it was like kind of fooling myself, right? Like I'm good. And at times I was, it's not to say that I always had something I needed support with, but it was often back in the day, really positive updates and all good. it's not to say again, like that we always need to have like negative painful things to reveal, but it's just like we're human. So if we're actually tapped in and tuned in,

there may be something more painful or tender or vulnerable to reveal. And sometimes that the vulnerable thing is a celebration and it is like an ecstatic experience. And I love that you shared that in the circle. And I think it's so important. I also wanted to say that you can feel two things at once that are seemingly contradictory. I say this a lot in my programs and with clients, like when we check in, how are you feeling? I'm like, it is welcome for you to say,

Speaker 2 (54:24.718)

I'm really sad and lonely and really excited. All can be welcome and be held in one. Right. And it's the same thing with like feeling envy and feeling so inspired. Right. Feeling shame that I don't have a partner or that I'm not in love because I heard someone share about her love and feeling hope. Right. Like we can we can hold both. And I think in that

the cultural kind of there, we just have cultural narratives slash don't have education around this of like how to hold our full range of emotion and reveal it. It's like, I can only be like feel bad or feel sad about that. No, like I love hearing about women being in love. I love hearing about relationships that are going well and I'm not in a relationship and I'm not in love and I deeply want to be and I hold so many circles and I'll hear stories of or programs or events or retreats and.

stories of women falling in love, they finally found their man. And I'm like, thank you for sharing this. It so gives me hope. It gives me an imprint. gives me reminders of what's possible, what's coming for me. And yes, I might at times feel sadness or grief or shame or despair even in those moments. But I also feel a deep gratitude for the example and for the reminders and the reassurance that it's possible and it's coming.

And so, yeah, it's not our job to caretake and rescue and protect the people around us. And there is a balance of having attunement, having reverence for the space or what's being brought, but also not dimming our light and holding ourselves back. And it's, again, a discovery and a dance of how to bring ourselves in a way that is honoring to us and honoring to those we're sharing with.

It's such a potent one and it's such an art. It is. At the end of the day, think if there's any permissions that I see for anyone listening, there's nothing wrong with you if you are messily, beautifully, imperfectly, figuring out this thing called intimacy and to know we're all on the journey of consistently figuring out what are my personas, who have I been conditioned to be? mean, this is a big reason I love the Gene Key so much is because of the language to get language on,

Speaker 1 (56:41.742)

I'm like, these are some of the masks or these some of the protective mechanisms you're going to navigate, but we all have them. You're not just someone over here with them. Every single person has their version of them. And I want to actually, I'm going to share your next Jinky, but kind of in the lead in because we're, kind of going into partnership conversation, which we've already kind of nicely tapped into here. A conversation that I know I've heard a lot about, but I actually would love for you to define it. Cause I think it can have a lot of, what does it actually mean is polarity.

And I think it's something that comes up a lot in my community is women who are consistently wanting to find this balancing act between polarity. What is polarity? How do I honor polarity within myself? How do I? And I feel like there's the two women, there's the ones who are calling in who are at this point where they're going, yes, I want to call in my divine partner. Yeah. And I want to be met. Ask who I am, but also surrender and know, like this gentleman said with you earlier, do you ever worry about men and their dynamics with you related to your work, right? A woman who wants to feel like,

They have your response like you did, which was, the aligned partner for me will have no dynamics related to my work. And those who are in relationship, who are in partnership, who in their different chapter and season they're in, they're finding new balance on how they can really honor the polarity. So can we first define what polarity is? Because I'm actually not entirely. Yeah.

Sure. Totally. Well, so polarity is, it speaks to the two opposing different poles, right? Positive and negative like batteries, right? When you, when you put two batteries together and they're the same poles, they are repelled, right? And when you do the opposite poles, they are magnetized, right? Same thing in relationships. And so often when we're talking about polarity and relationships, we're talking about the masculine and feminine or alpha and omega, whatever you want to call it doesn't actually

When we call it masculine and feminine, people get very fixated on like, means gender. And like, that means only feminine is woman and only masculine is man. And it's not the case. We all have, and I believe I'm of the perspective and belief that we all have masculine and feminine energy within us. And I believe that women are meant to be, or generally, I think David Data did like a whole study about this and said like 80 % of women actually do

Speaker 2 (58:58.254)

lean towards the feminine pole and want to, and that's like correct for them, right? Who knows the statistics or what's perfectly accurate, but I think generally women want to and feel more naturally aligned with the more feminine pole, and then men are aligned with the more masculine pole and have a higher percentage of more masculine energy, or that's where they actually feel at home. And so though I believe that women should be or feel it's actually too

for our highest to be out in the feminine energy and bone in essence, we are very much conditioned to be in the masculine in our heads, doing as men do and competing with men and wanting to be like men and being on a 24 hour cycle, which men are, when we're actually on 20 to 30 day cycle. There's so much more to say, but the feminine pole tends to have more feminine qualities like.

softness, receptivity, emotionality, intuition, attunement, nurturing, those types of things, types of qualities. And then the masculine has strength and protection and provision and is penetrating and is outward and goal-focused and is creating and the feminine creates as well. And she can really be the inspiration and the reason.

I've heard it said the feminine is the why and the masculine is the how. And so there's many ways to talk about polarity, but I, in my own practice of learning and practicing and teaching also polarity, I have learned to be more receptive to men and their leadership.

and being helped by men, reassured by men, guided by men, led by men. When I used to be very much like, I want to lead everything and I'm in charge, also in my relationships with men, which didn't work. saying. Learning to allow men to be in their rightful role as the masculine, which of course looks different for every man, but being able to lead me and trust their guidance and their sight and their.

Speaker 1 (01:00:53.944)

Angle.

Speaker 1 (01:00:57.422)

and I'm

Speaker 2 (01:01:10.944)

and to receive their protection and their ways of providing for me, which they love doing. And I love receiving when I actually allow myself to admit that I want it and need it, which I think as women, we really do need and we are the weaker sex. think that's so important to acknowledge for you can, you can say the more vulnerable sex and that's, that's okay. Right. We, we have a, we live in a culture that really wants to like deny that or like, no, we're the same, but actually if we accept that we are a more vulnerable, of course we give birth. are.

smaller bodies, less strong bodies, we give birth, are just naturally, biologically more vulnerable, then we get to the right relationship with proceeding that protection and that love and provision and guidance from men masculine.

It's so beautiful because your meaning code is actually very aligned with this in that I can see where you're actually able to hold the two, where you can honor the masculine polarity and the feminine polarity because you can see where you have this intimacy energy, what you're out here doing. And then it's amazing because your meaning code is who you're here to be and also become also in this lifetime. It's also what fulfills you in many ways.

And yours is actually Gene Key 34, which moves from the shadow of force to the gift of strength to the city of majesty. And why this feels important with your polarity piece is I feel like why you're so able to talk about it is because you also are able to honor what your strength is. It's like, know, when you're biologically where we are weak and where there's an energy of surrender.

And it's also, I would imagine, coming from this place where you understand where your strength lies, right? Like the strength in the creative birthing process, the strength in our creativity, the strength in who we are. And what I love is, so with The Force, you probably have known this intimately, even in aspects of your story you've shared so far, I'm like, yep, okay, I can see where she's met. The Shadow of Force, which is of course the like, keeping it all together, I've got to go against divine timing. I can't trust divine timing. I need to get it. I would imagine you've probably had situations with men and anyone listening, I'm sure, can relate.

Speaker 1 (01:03:14.862)

It's that moment when, let's say, your man, your partner is taking their sweet time to get something done, or they have their different timeline, and you're like, let me just do it. Right? Where we force timelines. That's a lot of that shadow. And then it moves into the strength, which is just this very embodied, contained presence of like, I'm held, I'm contained, I am. And then the majesty is that sovereign being. It's that completely beautiful essence of just, I am here. I am with it. And so as I say this, interesting, because you've probably also seen that the more you've trusted divine timing.

the more you've allowed yourself to lean on trusting your strength and knowing you don't have to like shape shift who you are to be who you are. We also have to force an over effort. How has that helped you to also like really find your sense within your relationships to also honor this part of you too?

so on the journey with this because absolutely my old default was force and I'm good at it. It's like I can get things done. I can create things the way I want it. can when there's a will there's a way. There's always a solution. Totally right. And I have been very effective with pressure or with force. And so it's very tempting to default to that when it isn't actually aligned for me to be in that energy.

Who can relate?

Speaker 2 (01:04:31.282)

And it has been a big part of my path and especially in recent years to really develop my relationship with God, really develop my relationship with whatever you want to call it, the divine higher power. I call it God because it's just easy. Spirit, God, God.

So have 17 different word choices. Higher powered.

So God, but of course anyone listening, in the blank for yourself, but to develop my relationship with God. And now I meditate every morning half for five years and not rigidly, not militantly, but as a practice. And I get on my knees and I pray. And that alone, when I started doing that was like, what? I'm not gonna get on my knees? Like, you know, it's like, I'm not doing that. My ego, right? Didn't like that. And also like to you, you know, what am I even praying to? But it was such an important.

humility practice to get on my knees and hand things over to God. And this has been a practice I've really received from 12 step recovery is having a relationship with a higher power whom I trust and every day handing things over that are out of my control. Handing over relationships, handing over dynamics in my work, handing over instances or experiences of pain or struggle or tension with a sister or a girlfriend or a project that I'm doing.

And every morning I do that. And so I ask for help. I ask for guidance. And I'm not praying like, do this, make this thing happen, make me successful in this way, like six this, because that's again, force and my will. And instead I'm like, I trust you, God. You know, I trust you and I'm for help, which again, another reason that I relate to God as God or masculine energy is just because of my practice of receiving from and getting guidance from and being led by men and masculine. So it's an empowering practice for me.

Speaker 2 (01:06:18.412)

to see God as a masculine energy. And I'm like, God is beyond any gender. It's hilarious that we even give God a gender, but because it's everything in our, you that's how I see it, right? Is all existence and beyond. But I like to relate to God as masculine energy because I am surrendering to the masculine. I'm asking for help and guidance. am trusting a masculine energy essence entity to guide me and see beyond what I can see.

which is such a powerful practice also for my relationships and also for my relationships with men and doing my best to be patient, awaiting the solutions or the guidance. And I'm in that right now with like my love life, right? I hand over every day, my love life, my dating life, my relationships with men every morning, I ask for guidance, know, getting me ready, getting him ready, whatever it looks like, whomever he is, you know, make it obvious to me, let me be ready for him.

help prepare me and also with my business and how things are shifting and transitioning with me and Ellie because she's going to focus more on motherhood and I'm going to be doing things on my own in ways that are new and unknown. and again, I don't know. And I can go into gripping. can go into moments of fear, like I have to figure this out or I have to take more action or I have to find the solution or do it. And then I come back to trust, trusting God, trust in the unfolding, trust in the unknown and

that majesty, is that the energy of majesty, really allowing, really trusting being in that receptive energy and it's an ongoing practice.

High frequency.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59.298)

love this because for someone listening who's not in a relationship and for someone who's in a relationship, it reminds you that, because I think a lot of the dynamic also in partnership, and I'm sure you've seen this so much with couples, is it's easy to look at the sacred mirror of the partner and always assume, they're not meeting me in our polarity. But yet what you're reminding all of us, anyone who's listening, no matter what partnership or configuration you're in, is there's always you in this journey of figuring out your own polarity.

And so for anybody, do you find is like, so do you find it's usually a ritual or a way of just tapping in and going like, okay, how do you see it within yourself, your polarities?

Yeah, would say if you are blaming your partner or anything, if you're not in relationship, an opportunity or exercise that you can do is look at how am I not providing that for myself? How am I not meeting my own needs? How am I not fulfilling my own desires here? Where am I expecting another person to fulfill my needs or meet me in every way? And it's really allowing that masculine within you, your woman, to come online, right, and care for yourself.

hold yourself in your grief or your sadness, maybe your partner's not available to hold you in your feminine storm or your deep tenderness. And how can you hold yourself in that or seek that support elsewhere, for example, and not put all of that attention on them or all that, the onus on them to meet you in every way, meet all of your needs. Cause it's just sort of possible and it's a, yeah, it's a losing game. and so how can you honor yourself, look at how you can meet your own needs, make yourself happy. Cause that is actually not your partner's responsibility.

heard

Speaker 2 (01:09:38.936)

What hard pill for some people to swallow. How can you meet your own needs, make yourself happy and continue to reveal honestly about your feelings or if you're feeling sad or feeling alone or you're feeling anxious or feeling scared to bring that to your partner or to the person in your life that is involved in whatever is going on or a trusted sister so that you can be practicing revealing your hurt and your body, like what's going on within you in your feminine vessel.

while still caring for yourself. Because I know a lot of my resentment has come from like other people not meeting me in the way that I want or responding in the way that I want or meeting my needs in the way that I expect. And our expectations are premeditated resentment. If we have expectations of people that they cannot meet, even if we think they can, even if they have before, having that as an expectation that they should or they have to is going to lead to resentment. And we create that.

And that's really hard and that's one that I'm continuing to work through my own resemblance of how they come up within me from my own actions or inactions or ways I'm not caring for.

I just love that you're naming the integrity starts with yourself. So go back to you. Make sure first and foremost, are you with your own home? Yes. It's very easy to look outside, but are you with your own home or even someone dating, right? It be very easy to go, the dating apps stink. This stinks. This guy's this. It's just easy. Whereas I love that you give this energy of this majestic sovereignty of coming back and going.

Not to diminish, again, the and of the range you named. Sometimes you can also be deeply frustrated with the dating experience and be like, okay, and what is in high of service that I'm being shown right now? Or like, what am I being called to lean into more? And my expression, my needs, my desires. And I would just have to double click on something that I feel like I hear. I think it's really, we've talked about this, actually when we went on our lovely market journey. And I think it's at a very prominent time in society right now, because now with women,

Speaker 1 (01:11:40.322)

having more leadership roles, working more. Many women are breadwinners. Many women are holding up a lot more financially. So then you see how there's a lot of dynamics happening. And I hear it a lot with clients where it's like, how do women honor what men are as providers beyond simply, because it's like so interesting, right? Because the same, this bless, the same woman will have the and, right? There's a feeling of, okay.

I love that I am so revered for what I do. I love working. I hear this all time. I love doing what I do. I wouldn't want to not be doing what I do. I love it so much. I love that they respect that I do what I do. I love that I make money the way that I do. And then I'll also hear them say, and though I have this part of me that feels like they should make more than me or do it in these different ways based on their particular conditioning. Two layers there. One is the dissolving of that whole notion for men. And two is the other piece, is how do we

as women in particular, as we're talking about this type of a relationship, how do we see providership beyond financial? Or how are you seeing it?

Such a big question and such a big topic very much been in my field and Ellie and I have been talking about this a lot because Ellie is in many ways stopping her work. Yes, she has a partner who can provide for her and has been wrestling with this. And I don't think it needs to be all or nothing, but I do think that culturally there is more of a conversation needed for women to actually slow down because there's a message of like, you can have it all. We can have it all and we can, but we can't necessarily have it all at the same time.

And so this is super important because there are times where you might have to stop working or you might have to work way less in order to have the quality time with your kids or your husband or your other hobbies or things that you're passionate about outside of your work, which you might feel very identified with and might feel very passionate about or just get a lot of validation and accolades from. And so this is like a bigger conversation. But what I also want to say is that men can still be the

Speaker 2 (01:13:44.588)

like in charge if you want that, if you want that polarity where the man is leading the household, which can be very hot if you let go of the reins, even if you're the breadwinner, but you have to hand over the finances. And so it means letting him handle the money, trusting him to manage the checkbook, which we don't use anymore, like manage, right? Manage the spreadsheet, manage your investments, have the conversations with your financial advisor or accountant or bookkeeper.

handle the money because then he's in charge of that area of life, which is more masculine. And that can be really scary for women. And so there's there's so much that's here around actually exploring your true desire around who you What that would take if you actually want the man earning more, what would require of you, what you might have to let go of or sacrifice for a certain chapter or season, or if you do want to be making as much as you are or more.

earn money.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43.404)

then what kinds of, how could you inspire him to make more without controlling him? That's a whole other thing. But part of that is giving him more responsibility and actually fully trusting him, like handing over more responsibility, handing over the finances, handing over things that you might be gripping to because it's more comfortable and you might think that you're better at it, but actually it's siphons his ability to grow, to earn more, to be more responsible, to show up as a leader for your relationship or your household.

And that's actually an us thing. That's a woman thing. That is our part in looking at, you know, where we actually cut him off at the knees and how he could be.

my gosh, that is such a juicy topic that I feel like we could talk about in so many different ways. But I think as we start to wrap up our conversation and just really honor this time together, desire is such a big part of your work. And I think you just named it. And I feel like this is really linked to what you just spoke about because I think so often we can have these thoughts or projected ideas of what we want in our polarities, what we want in our partnerships, what we think.

would make it sexier or better. then actually the more a woman really comes into her body, I'm sure you've seen a million times, sometimes it's not what they initially think it is. Or they have all these ideas of if he or she so and so just did blank, then it would all be better. And oftentimes I'd imagine as you bring people into their bodies and tap into desire, sometimes they're focusing over here and it's actually over here that they're needed. What would be, we always love to end with like a very powerful ritual. So I felt like it would be very potent for you in particular to share.

What's a ritual or something you do regularly that helps you connect to your desire and know your authentic soul desires?

Speaker 2 (01:16:23.148)

Yeah, I mean, everyone's different in terms of how you want to mind your desires, whether it's journaling or in a meditation, just slowing down enough to say like, this is my intention to just like allow my mind and my heart to go there. Or it could be in sharing with a friend. You can actually do a minding of desires, exercise with a girlfriend and say, have her ask you, what do you want? And then you say, and then she says, thank you. And then she says, what do you want?

or what do you desire? And then you say another one and she says, thank you. And she asks you again, or with your romantic partner. I'm just saying in sisterhood, but absolutely with your romantic partner. and you can go about mining those desires. So it can be with yourself, just like, I desire, I desire this, I desire this and let it be free flowing and let it just flow through you and see, okay, what of these do I actually want to touch on right now? Or just in meditation. And it could just be sitting with yourself for a few moments or on a walk. Like, what do I desire today?

How can I actually serve myself in my needs and honor myself in my body today and know that you fulfilling those desires that are for your highest, for your body, for your nourishment will serve the realm, will serve your community, will serve your partnership. And they're not like self-centered desires just to be self-centered. They're actually desires. And this is my invitation is to really feel into your desires and allow them to be something that has you spill over.

fills your cup that has you spill over to be more full and vibrant and connected and generous with the people in your life. And yeah, go about minding your desires in any of those ways or another way that you are inspired by, but it's really just taking time, giving yourself permission to want, to wish, to dream up, to allow, and then go about minding them, following the desires you've come up with, even if they're just in small ways. know, like, today I'm gonna...

a matcha with honey instead of coffee, or I'm gonna go out to lunch at my favorite place, or I'm gonna make myself a bath before I go to sleep, or I'm gonna read a book on my lunch break, or whatever that looks like, or I'm gonna share something vulnerable with a sister or my partner, or ask for something new and taboo in the bedroom next time we meet, right? Like little places that you can honor desire and honor your inner voice.

Speaker 2 (01:18:38.986)

over just going with the flow or going with how it should be, how you think it should be, or how others are, you know, designating things to go.

I love it because this is such a practical example of something you can do every day. There's different ways you can do it. You can do it through sisterhood. You can do it through your partner. You can write. You can speak it. You can voice note. You can take it on a walk. You can do it in all sorts of different ways, whatever is your highest aligned way. And I also just have to name as one final little tidbit for you on the gene keys front. It's so aligned because you actually have one of the very, there's a gene key, there's two gene keys that are especially prominent right now and you have actually both of them.

in your blueprint, but the one I was gonna name is 22, which is your magnetism. It's how you're here to magnetize people, which is so much of what your work's all about, which is why it feels key to just wrap with this, is it really is the code, the gift is graciousness. And the city is grace, and it's moving from the shadow of dishonor. And when I think about this practice you have of connecting with your desire, getting so emotionally real, raw, truthful.

and this whole conversation you've had about range. Like this ability to hold the range is such a testament to this gene key, because I would imagine you've seen that the more you are around people that you get to hold in your graciousness, but also who see you in that frequency, the more everything works in your favor, the more the community you're part of works, the more all of it really supports itself, which I think is such a gift for all of us, because desire can be a very edgy thing for many to name.

for many to let themselves see and to claim it. So thank you for being just such a walking permission slip. This conversation, oh my goodness, has had so many threads that I feel like we could have just gone on like a whole separate episode on. But I would love for those of you who have tuned in and listened, I would love for you to share with us any core takeaway, anything you feel called to reveal or share anything, a ritual. There's been many in this.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28.214)

In this episode, you can pick and choose from that you're really choosing to commit to right now or just give yourself more spaciousness to enjoy. And what is the best way, for people to connect with you and stay in touch?

and follow me on Instagram at imipetuski or at desire on fire. And yeah, it's the best way to stay in touch, reach out if you feel called or moved from listening to this episode. yeah, so looking forward to how this impacts people. And so grateful that you had me on and I got to learn more about my gene keys. And I know I have so much more to learn, but thank you so much for sharing all that you did. And this has been so, so enjoyable and pleasurable for me.

Thank you so much for this conversation. feel like I went, you know, I, anyone who can, I hope we're gonna have some video clips you can catch. Both of our eyes, the whole conversation have been so bright-eyed and just enthusiastic in a way. And I think it's such a testament to your work and such a testament to you holding that space to just really go there and explore. So thank you for being you, for sharing your stories and for leading the way by embodying intimacy, which is so much of your gift. So thank you for being you.

Speaker 1 (01:21:39.15)

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