00:00:06 Nazish: Sometimes healing begins with a breakthrough. Sometimes it begins with moments so raw, so humbling that all you can do is hold on and let that truth surface. Many people spend years appearing fine on the outside, raising families, building careers, showing up for everyone else while quietly carrying pain that never had a place on land. Today's conversation is about what happens when the silence finally breaks, and what it takes to rebuild life after decades of carrying what was never yours to carry.

00:00:43 Nazish: Welcome to Healing Horizon, a space where we explore the many paths people took toward healing, resilience, and rediscovering themselves. I am Nazish and today we are joined by Katie Baker, a writer and the author of the memoir, When the Universe Holds Your Hair Back. Katie is deeply honest. In her memoir, she reflects on her own lifetime shaped by childhood trauma, addiction and the long journey towards confronting the past and choosing healing even when it arrives later in her life. Today, we talk about breaking cycles facing the part of our stories we have hidden for years, and rediscovering that healing is still possible even when it feels like you are starting over. Katie, it is really meaningful to have you here today with us.

00:01:37 Katie Baker: Thank you so much for having me. I'm really looking forward to the conversation.

00:01:41 Nazish: Wonderful. So, Katie, before we dive deeper into your memoir, the story, sorry, the journey behind it. I am curious about something simple but powerful. You know, when you think about women, you were before everything began to unravel what was. And the woman you are today. What feels the most different?

00:02:06 Katie Baker: There's a lot of things that are different. Um, but it did take me a little bit to get here. So I think in, in, in the past, what I was sort of known for is accomplishing and getting things done. And, um, you know, sort of managing the household, the kids, um, I was doing a successful job with my work as well outside of the home. And I was priding myself on how much I could accomplish or get things done and, um, not really feeling through my day. I was, uh, running sort of disconnected from life itself. I was getting things done and accomplishing things, but wasn't really in connection with my body, my mind, my spirit, none of that. Um, and so today it's been a practice of relearning how to navigate life when you're actually engaging with it as opposed to just doing life, you know?

00:03:05 Nazish: thank you so much for sharing that with us today. You know, one thing people often believe is that healing follows a clean timeline that you process trauma in your twenties and 30s, and then you move on with your life. But your story challenges that idea from your perspective. What's the biggest misconception people have about when and how healing is supposed to happen?

00:03:32 Katie Baker: Well, number one, I think it can happen really at any age and that we should allow ourselves to have that happen at any age because hopefully we see better days. And I think that with healing in particular and focusing on that, that allows us an opportunity to look at life very differently than we have, um, for so many years. Because I think with trauma in particular, or any hard experiences, when those shape and mold the person and the being we are, we actually kind of have to break that mold and just look at ourselves and at life differently and how we engage with the world. So for me in particular, I feel like that healing is a birthright and that it can come and should come at any age that that we're willing to take that experience on. Um, because it allows us to see, you know, brighter days and, um, move forward in a different direction. But also, um, I think that if you can get it done in your twenties and thirties, I think that's phenomenal. But for me in particular, I wasn't quite there yet. I didn't understand, um, what it took or that I was even in the sort of trauma responses, I was living my life. So I didn't engage with the world like that because it just wasn't in my periphery. I wasn't aware of what it looked like to heal and that, you know, maybe all these things that I'm doing where I'm trying to accomplish so much is maybe a fierce trauma response, maybe trying to seek perfection of all the things that we can be searching for. Um, and that, that we are so elusive and that we never find because we put this mountain above us. These higher, higher steps that we need to accomplish. And, um, it's sort of the road to nowhere besides maybe not taking care of ourselves or, or healing. So yeah.

00:05:27 Nazish: that sounds amazing. You know, and that is such an important reminder that healing doesn't follow society's schedule.

00:05:37 Katie Baker: Yeah. Yeah. And in the book, I wrote a chapter on my mom who is in her seventies. And so after I embarked on this journey, I brought my mom in about a year later and, um, her, it gave her an opportunity to heal. So she, I, it's been really incredible to see her transformation. So I'm now in my fifties. She is in her seventies, and really being around a lot of people that were trying to navigate this path and this, this healing work and seeing that it's all shapes and sizes, all different kinds of backgrounds, all different kinds of experiences, every type of age that you could ever imagine. And I think the magic is just watching that person transform and not putting limitations on how and when it should happen, just that the hope that it will happen.

00:06:27 Nazish: Absolutely. That is so true. And you know, that really brings such a beautiful perspective to the show as well, because sometimes the body or the mind simply waits until we finally have the capacity to face what we once had to survive. And that realization can be both terrifying and strangely freeing as well. many people carry deep trauma and becomes incredibly good at functioning. They build their careers, they raise families and appear strong to the outside world. You know, something that I have seen personally in my life and so many others live as well. But beneath that strength, there is often a lot that hasn't been spoken. Looking back now, what were the signs that the pain you had carried for so long was finally asking to be acknowledged?

00:07:21 Katie Baker: Well, I think for me, I hit what I feel like was a rock bottom. Um, I tell the story in the book about how my son had kind of know what I was doing. Was drinking a lot at night. Um, not to get drunk per se, but just having drinks. That was a, a numbing that I did. Um, overworking. Overeating. Um, really just like I mentioned. I think I hid in the process of doing so. How much could I accomplish in one day? And I just wore myself out every single day. And I noticed that when I would, um, have a drink at night was when I actually had to sit down and had to sit with my body and think about my life and all the things I, it was almost as if I could not do it. I was unwilling and unable at that point. And, um, what I recognized is that when I wrote the book in particular, a lot of my friends had said, I had no idea that your childhood was like that. And I think that oftentimes when people are doing these habits that maybe aren't good for them, or you see them priding themselves on how much work they can accomplish or, um, external validation, the list goes on. Oftentimes it can be hiding some sort of need or craving within the person or the individual. And, um, so I think that through the process of my year, it was like turning every stone over and taking a look at everything that really I had been doing, which was, this was tough work. It's not, it's not for the faint of heart, but it's really important to be able to move forward in a healthy way. And, um, it's really, you know, now after writing the book, it's been three years now. And, um, I think that like, for example, for me, um, I didn't really think about the body in particular. The first year I focused pretty solely on the mind and, and how I could heal thinking it all resided up in here. But what I recognized is I was going through this process is that it actually that pain, that trauma, the stuff that we don't address lives in the body. Um, and that could be like my heightened fear or, um, flight response, you know, where I would start really quickly or really easily when, you know, some someone even walked around a corner and I was like, why can't I stop just, you know, jumping out of my skin every time that happens. And I think that it lives also in the body. So it's really a two part system between the mind and the body when we're going through these healing practices.

00:10:03 Nazish: Absolutely. I couldn't agree more with you. And it is so powerful that survival teaches us to keep moving, keep performing, and keep holding everything together. But eventually, part of us that were ignored begin to begin asking to be seen. And that really changes the perspective for us. And the in that moment can be beginning of something deeply transformative.

00:10:31 Katie Baker: Yes, yes, absolutely. And I think that when when I went through this year, I. And even still today, what I recognized is, um, probably at a very early age, just in terms of survival. I unplugged all, all those emotional outlets from, you know, any sort of wall unit that was residing within me. So I unplugged everything. So I definitely wasn't, um, you know, very involved. Mom was always there for my family and my kids sort of did all of the things. But what I recognized is that, um, I was running on autopilot. And so when I really started to look at this and decided that I want to actually, um, not let my experiences as a child define me any longer, it was plugging back in all those systems that I had unplugged. Um, and which meant that I could cry and laugh and even sometimes joy was an emotion, for example, that I was like, it was so unfamiliar to me. Um, and so that was really interesting to feel all those emotions again and allow that process to unfold to where they felt normal again. And sometimes still I'll catch myself. And, you know, even yesterday where I was like, okay, this is happiness and joy and I can actually trust this. It's not scary. So just let it come. So.

00:12:03 Nazish: Absolutely. That sounds so true. And you know, one thing your memoir touches is how trauma doesn't live in memories. It shows up in behaviors, relationships, and even the way we see ourselves. For you personally, how did the unresolved parts of your past start showing up in your life before you began actively healing?

00:12:29 Katie Baker: Um, the unresolved parts of myself that showed up. It was, um. I think seeking approval, uh, validation, um, perfectionism, um, seeking, just trying to do everything, um, as successfully as I could. And for me in particular, I really, I work with a lot of, um, agriculture folks in agriculture and building community. So it was like, how can I build up this community? It was like I was trying to fill the void within myself, um, through my work, uh, which was really amazing and incredible work. But what I recognized is that I would be on vacation with my family, for example, and be working the entire time. Um, and it was like this push and pull between trying to be everything for my family and then for, for my work or whatever other external thing that I was working on. And so, um, kind of what I recognized through this process is like, how do I show up for myself? And for example, even just recently, I was really getting the call to slow down. Um, it came kind of in a more physical way, like, you know, some health, minor health things that I was working through. And I was, I had never really slowed down even writing the book or afterwards. And it was hard for me to relearn like, what brings, what do I want to do today? And I think that was such a hard question for me to answer because I sort of forced myself to take like a month and a half to not, um, overcommit myself. And, uh, it's really interesting when it's part of that recognition of like, who am I when I show up today and what do I actually want to do? And that can be a really scary process. I think oftentimes that shadow side can show up in particular when we're facing those things. For me in particular, just staying super busy and being hyper productive. And then when I slowed down all of a sudden, um, why do I have this anxiety? What is this about? Why am I having a hard time slowing down? What makes me. It was as if I didn't feel like I had worth. If I wasn't accomplishing things that was really hard to look at.

00:14:55 Nazish: Absolutely. It sounds so brave. And, you know, this really shifts from shame to curiosity. And it is so powerful because when we stop asking what's wrong with me and start asking what happened to me, the entire conversation with ourselves begins to change.

00:15:15 Katie Baker: Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's like we have to go from, um, to me, it was like I was spending a lot of time judging myself for, for, for how I performed in the game of life. And I was my own harshest critic. And to go from the harshest critic to actually an observer and just be aware of like, okay, actually, what is this about? If I take that? Um, you know, sort of view of the eagle and look from the sky above, what is really happening here? So that, that helped me quite a bit, but it's really hard to navigate that, you know, that inner critic will oftentimes come in and let you know, oh, you really should be doing this better. You could be doing this instead. So.

00:15:59 Nazish: Absolutely. That is so true. And you know, your healing journey involved deep personal work and at times exploring unconventional path included guiding psychedelic experiences without getting into anything perspective. Like I want to know about the broader lesson here. What did those experiences teach you about confronting pain in ways that traditional approaches sometimes struggles to reach?

00:16:30 Katie Baker: Well, I think in particular I had done therapy in the past. Um, it intermittently I had done therapy and um, different types of techniques. And I think that what I had been highly trained at was telling myself that I was okay even when I wasn't okay, even when I was at my worst, I was telling myself, I'm okay, I can get through this. And so I think, for example, the, um. When I was in deep seated denial that I actually wasn't okay, I needed some help and I needed to figure this out. And, and part of that was my kids leaving home. They were going off to college in school. And so I, that's when my life, it became very apparent, like, okay, these habits, this life, this childhood, I've never dealt with it because I always had something to do. And then all of a sudden it was, it was time for me to work on on myself. And so I think that, uh, therapeutic psychedelics in particular were something that I was really fearful of initially. And I thought, I don't know if I want to do this. Um, even though if, let's say I would drink, you know, at night, uh, I thought they were scary, that I might potentially lose my mind, all of the things. But what I recognized pretty early on was that they allowed me to an opportunity to turn off my default mode network. The thing that was always constantly humming in the background and be able to view from a perspective of an outsider, which was also something that was not one of my strengths. And so it was just really important, um, to unlock those gates and open those doors that I was really, like I said, unwilling and unable to open myself. And I think also too, that it's really hard to navigate this path and you don't know quite where to start. And if you have these habitual patterns going on, it, therapeutic psychedelics in particular, kind of stop those patterns mid track and allow you to at least view it so that you become aware. And I think awareness is key in, um, helping solve the mystery of the healing process.

00:18:49 Nazish: Absolutely. That is so true. It really helps to solve a lot of things. And I am pretty sure that a lot of my listeners are going to resonate with it because it is such an important grounding point that healing does not have to start with something dramatic. It often begins with small moments of honesty, where we allow ourselves to finally acknowledge what we have been carrying.

00:19:12 Katie Baker: Yeah, yeah.

00:19:14 Nazish: So anyone who has walked a healing path knows that it isn't linear. There are breakthroughs, but also moments when old patterns and emotions and fears come rushing back. During this journey, what helped you keep going when things felt messy and uncertain again?

00:19:36 Katie Baker: Well, I think that. Um, at times I, I, it was like I believed I was a good person and sometimes I didn't believe I was a good person. Like I felt the shame that comes from abuse and, and that life still stuck with me. It was like, at my core, sort of like this rotten core. But then I knew I'm like, I try to do, I try to really be a good person. So that kept me motivated knowing that like the way I live my life and the way I engage with people is I really want to be a good human and be of service. And most importantly, was really my family who supported me, my husband, my kids, my mom. Um, really? I had a friend group that, uh, really was there for me. At first, I didn't want I didn't really want to be honest with a lot of folks. Well, number one, because I was worried that they would judge me. And, um, I was good enough at doing that myself. I didn't need that. And, but what I recognized is that people were really, um, supportive because I think that everybody wants to see a success story. They want to see the hero's journey turn out for, for the individual that they make it through all these obstacles and challenges. And so I had, um, a really wonderful support network throughout this process where I was able to kind of talk through what I was experiencing.

00:21:08 Nazish: That sounds so beautiful. And I am so glad that it happened for you. And it is such a compassionate perspective that healing isn't about becoming a completely different person. It is about learning how to hold your story more honestly and with more awareness and more kindness that you once could.

00:21:32 Katie Baker: Yeah, yeah. Because I think that everybody is striving to be their true self as best as they can, but oftentimes we need those tools and resources to help us figure out how do you do this? Because there's no real there's tons of self-help advice, but it's so unique to the individual about what works for them and what they need. And I think it's the trick is just really being supportive of people in the process of their trying to better their lives.

00:22:04 Nazish: Absolutely. So, Katie, for our listeners who resonate with your story and want to explore your memoir, where the universe holds your hair back and follow your work, where's the best place for them to connect with you.

00:22:19 Katie Baker: Yeah. So I have a website piece and fire healing. So that's p p e a c e piece and fire healing dot com. And then when the universe holds your hair back is on Amazon. And I also did an audio book, so it's Spotify and audible. So yeah, we'd love to connect and hear people's thoughts if they have an opportunity to read the book.

00:22:44 Nazish: Wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing that with us. I hope I will include to I will make sure to include all these details into the show notes so that a lot of people will can reach out to you. Thank you so much for joining us today on The Healing Horizon.

00:22:59 Katie Baker: Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

00:23:03 Nazish: Yeah. So if this conversations and dear listeners, if this conversation spoke to you, take a moment to sit with it. Healing often begins with reflection, the quiet courage to look inward and say, maybe there's more possible for me. And if you value conversation like this real and honest discussion about healing and growth. Make sure to follow healing horizons so you don't miss future episodes. Until next time, be gentle with yourself. Healing isn't about rushing forward. It is about learning to walk with your story one step at a time.