Good morning.

Thank you for joining season two, episode two of Real Life with Pastor Mike and Pastor Jason.

Mike, how are you?

Great.

Glad to be here with you.

It's been a whole week.

Glad to be with you, too.

And again, we're going to talk more about addiction as we walk down this journey together in four episodes, again, we're going to uncover the.

Or at least talk through the root cause and triggers of addiction.

And so we.

Last week, we kicked off the conversation by defining what addiction is or what it looks like.

We talked about the impact.

We talked about how addiction isn't just a bad habit, but it's also something really that is crippling.

It's gripping.

It takes hold of our.

Our lives, affects our relationships.

And we also discussed that addiction wasn't just about substance like drugs or alcohol, but it actually encompasses a whole wide range of things.

We think about food, we think about gambling, about pornography and social media work, lots of things that fall into that category.

And I think oftentimes that's why we.

It's easy for me to say I'm not addicted.

I don't have an addiction.

I could have four of them.

They may just not be alcohol or drugs.

Right.

But they could be, you know, other things in my life.

Socially acceptable.

Yeah, socially acceptable addictions.

That's a great way of putting it.

And we also discussed that addiction is not in a respecter of person.

It affects all people, all walks.

It doesn't discriminate.

It's anybody.

It can be everybody.

And it's not just physical or psychological, but it's really.

And probably our desires to address this piece of it.

It's a deeply spiritual one as well.

I think of 1 Corinthians 6:12, when Paul says, I'm allowed to do anything, but not everything is good for you.

And even though I'm allowed to do anything, I must not become a slave to anything.

And that can definitely be easily applied to things like we might consider good, in moderation, working, or whatever it is, but can easily become a controlling addiction in our life.

Paul's saying here that he's not going to be in bondage to anything, any person, activity, substance.

So today we're going to look at the next step in our discussion and what is the root cause of addiction or what.

What puts us on that path or what can lead there.

And there's a lot of different things.

And I know you said this last week, and we know we're not psychologists.

This really isn't our.

And we'll spend some time talking about, obviously, some of the psychology of it.

But really our focus is what does God's word say about it?

And we'll address that today.

And I think, really, it's such an important conversation to understand because it's.

We struggle with the addiction, but what led us there.

And I think oftentimes we find that it's.

We don't.

It was never the intention to get wildly addicted to something.

It started somewhere.

We're going to talk about four different aspects, really, the biological factors, which, again, is out of our wheelhouse, but we can talk about it.

Psychological factors.

We're gonna look at social factors, like how environment or relationships, even culture, really can influence addiction.

And then spiritual factors, most importantly, and how sin, brokenness, and separation from God really is at the heart, I think, of addiction.

And so that.

That's where we really want to end with today.

And really at the end of episode four as well.

I talked last week about pooling our audience, and I got some more questions in that really fit in with today's episode.

And so the two questions that I ask, what do you think causes people to turn to addiction instead of maybe healthier options?

And so the three kind of big responses that I got back is, with addiction, at least it's faster to numb.

It was just a quicker fix to a pain that they were experiencing.

Answer two was parents actually, they said that these are the kind of just the tools that they got from their parents.

Like, you're having a stressful day, you drink a beer, or you're having a stressful day, you smoke a joint or whatever it is.

But it was just interesting that that that was the answer that came up, that it's the coping skills I got from my parents, because it's what I saw them do, and I saw that it worked for him.

At least I thought it did.

Or the third kind of response is it makes me feel comfortable.

And then another question that I asked, and I just thought that this answer was, I think you'll find it interesting, too.

I asked, have you ever felt like, addiction fil.

Void in your life?

Did it actually work?

Did it actually fill a void?

And this response, this person, they had a.

An addiction to opioids for a long time.

And their response was, I really thought that the definition of joy is what I felt when I was high with opioids.

So they thought that joy was the high.

I just thought that was an interesting kind of response.

So let's start them with the biological and psychological factors.

Again, I know this isn't our wheelhouse but we can definitely speak to it in some ways way.

Does it impact us biologically?

Does addiction impact us biologically or physiologically?

It's an interesting topic, and like you said, definitely not our wheelhouse.

I always have to come back to the fact that we're Christians, and for you and I were pastors, and we're called to counsel with people, and not just because of the role of a pastor, but just as believers.

Sure, we're called to use the word of God, and ultimately we'll come back to that.

But I had to just research it myself.

And it was interesting, really, the terms and the definitions.

And there was a question that I'd looked up, and it said, what biological factors influence addiction?

And the answer was, it says biology contributes to addiction in ways beyond genes.

It's how the body metabolizes or breaks downs or eliminates foreign substances such as drugs or alcohol in our system.

And then it went on to about, as an example, Japanese culture.

And it said that in the Japanese culture, there's unique variations of certain alcohol metabolizing enzymes that are in the body that aren't present in other populations.

And so for the Japanese people, it becomes a deterrent because what it states in just a.

In a nutshell is it changes the taste of alcohol, and so it becomes something that's unpleasant.

Interesting.

Yeah.

So, uh, there's definitely biological factors there that are in play.

But I always come back to, like, that can be.

For some people, then can be.

That can be a good thing.

Right.

For the Japanese people, they go, hey, if I don't want to struggle with alcoholism, I'm glad that we have this certain enzyme in our system that creates a bad taste for alcohol.

Yeah.

And you go, yeah, but unfortunately, what about the rest of the world?

And people will then go, oh, that.

Then that's my license, like you said.

And you said it, you go, paul, the apostle said, all things are lawful, but not all things are profitable, and I'll be mastered, you know, by nothing.

I think in human nature, we.

We tend to look for excuses for our behavior instead of understanding and then what are the solutions to, you know, the very thing that, like you said, again, looking at joy, you know, the.

What's the world's definition of joy?

And to think that you could find that in a foreign substance.

And yet the Bible talks about true joy that comes, you know, from within, comes from a.

A personal relationship, you know, with God himself.

But I always have to go back to, again, just from a biblical perspective, thinking about, we live in a broken world with other broken people.

And we're surrounded by brokenness.

It's just part of the system.

The Bible says that sin came into the world through Adam and righteousness came and peace came through Jesus Christ.

And we have to peel this thing all the way back and go, if we want to look at biological ego, do we all have a, a common gene, you might say, and there's only one that science will tell us in that regard, and it's a sin gene that the Bible says that for all have sinned.

So we, we have to go to the.

What are the common things that all people share in comm.

Because if you go down this road of looking at in particular little enzymes here and this biologically, I'm pretty sure at some point you can find some biological reason or I, I would say more of an excuse to hold on to any kind of addictive behavior.

For me, the best bet is to what's the simplest form.

And you look at scripture and it says, you know, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

Isaiah tells us, you know, in Isaiah 53, 6, all of us, like sheep, have gone astray and we've left God's paths to follow our own.

And so when I think about genetic makeup and I feel, talk about biology, whatever you want to talk about, like I said as a Christian instead of as a pastor going down that road, I try to appeal it always back to what's the biblical answer?

What's the biblical response for that?

And since we're all in that same category, then we could just like simply put it and go, yeah, there's.

In the true sense, there's a sin gene that exists in all of our lives and that'll lead you down whatever predisposition you have.

Like you said, there's.

You mentioned environmental sin.

That's how I would classify.

You were raised in a home where your parents taught you how to cope with stress.

So you had a beer, like you said, you smoked joint.

And you go, that's not, that's not biological.

That's not a gene per se that you have in your life.

That's environmental influence, is that you were just raised around a certain negative habit and then it became your own.

And then unfortunately, if you got introduced to that an early age, we know this because of the human body.

We think of biology.

Will that one joint, will that satisfy you in a month from now?

You go, probably not.

You probably need two, and then, then three, then four.

And so where addictive behavior comes in from a biological Standpoint, in my understanding, is that we build up immunity, We.

We build up resistance to it.

And so we need more and more.

And the Bible says that sin is an insatiable appetite.

Oh, yeah.

And so to me, maybe that oversimplifies it, like I said, because of the fact that it's not our wheelhouse, per se.

But I just can't let myself go down this road that you just start justifying every type of sinful behavior because blame it on a gene, you blame it on your biological makeup.

Do.

Do I believe that there can be dispositions and rewiring.

There's all kinds of things that we could dig into.

And I go, yeah, I.

I definitely believe in those things, but I think God made it a lot simpler in that is it's coming back to the place that we recognize that when we disobeyed God, sin came into the world.

And sin has touched every single person's life.

And an addiction is part of that.

Yeah.

And not just the taboo addictions, but addiction.

There's a lot of different things.

You mentioned the kind of.

The influences at home.

It reminds me.

Proverbs 22:6 says, Train a child the way you should go, and even when he's old, he'll not depart from it.

And a lot of Christians, if they're really diligent, they teach their children about Jesus.

And, you know, they say the right things.

They really hold hope in that.

But you're gonna.

We teach our children more by how we handle situations and how we act and the things that we do than what we say.

It's easy to say, do what I say and not what I do.

But oftentimes kids will follow the things that their parents do.

And so we think about that with addiction.

And it works both ways.

Right.

We can teach our children to honor God, but we can also teach our children to rely on other things, things other than God, just because that's what we do with our life.

Right.

Whether that's drugs, alcohol, gambling, any kind of compulsory behavior, those behaviors become normalized.

I think when our kids see us do it, because especially I think about my youngest, my toddlers, or my twins.

To me, like I'm the center to them.

I'm just.

I'm safety to them.

I'm the center of their world.

What I say is a hundred percent true until they get a little bit older and start realizing that there's a world out there.

And.

But if I'm showing them by my own actions and behavior how to handle stress and it's something apart from a reliance on God and seeking God in prayer and being in His Word, then they're going to learn that those could be potential ways that they.

They cope.

And it's also not just exposures, I don't think, in the family home to substances, but also emotional things, emotional neglect, abuse, instability or unstableness, where children grow up looking for ways to cope with pain or insecurity.

And it's just so sad talking to the people.

I talk to, some of my kids and youth, and the addictions can seem tempting.

And I don't mean addictions, but just the numbing of the pain.

Right.

Because they just don't know what to do.

And so I think many people often turn to addiction as a way to deal with wounds, sometimes that even begin in childhood.

And this isn't the kind of Sigfried and Roy or whatever it is where you're sitting on the couch and tell me about your father.

But I'm talking about deep wounds that from a very early age where just.

You just want to numb it.

But the good news, obviously, is, to your point, that Christ redeems and restores.

And no matter what kind of family somebody comes from, when we're in Christ, 2nd Corinthians 5 tells us that we're a new creation and the oldest passed away.

So the point that I'm making there, no matter where you grew up, your family upbringing, that.

That we're not bound by, to.

To repeat those mistakes.

We don't have to.

There's another way.

So I also think of one of the big things we see in youth, and I know because you were a youth pastor too, so I know you understand that.

But peer pressure, that's such a big influencer on kids, and not just kids, but adults, too.

Peer pressure is definitely a problem, or it's an important factor at least.

And so when people surround themselves with influence, I think, or behaviors, whether we realize it or not, Paul 1st Corinthians 15, don't be deceived.

Bad company corrupts good morals.

And so who we surround ourselves with, really.

And I think that many addictions.

And I don't know if this is.

You have to maybe chime in on this, but it seems like a lot of times addictions don't necessarily always start in isolation, but in influence, being around the wrong people, or I just think of my own life.

And that's not always the case, obviously, especially if it comes from a place of just deep pain and trauma where you're just trying to numb.

But.

But absolutely being with the wrong People that don't help.

No, definitely think of the.

That phrase.

Some things are caught, other things are taught.

And obviously both of those come through interaction, interpersonal relationship.

So whether that's in the home or out.

And that's exactly why Scripture speaks to that.

Bad company corrupts good morals and.

And especially during the formidable years, because we're talking about how we think and how, you know, our brain is wired and how it can be rewired.

And that's maybe one of the biggest issues that we deal with when we think about addictive behavior.

Yeah, absolutely.

And if I.

Next point I want to talk about is isolation or lack of support system.

So it could be said that if peer pressure and cultural influence can lead someone into addiction, then isolation often is what keeps them there.

And we think of Satan, loves the enemy, loves to isolate people, to make us feel alone, to keep us separated.

And we think about just a cycle of depression.

And I know I've just known this in my own life, is that when I isolate myself, oftentimes that leads to depression.

And then depression leads me to wanting to isolate myself even more, which leads into more depression.

And it's just a vicious cycle.

And oftentimes addiction thrives in isolation, I think.

And you see that played out.

Many people struggling with addiction feel alone, Whether it's for a multitude of reasons, whether it's shame, rejection, broken relationships.

Maybe they feel like they have no one they can turn to.

We talked about that with some of the questions asked to the audience.

And episode one is that they just feel shame.

They feel like they should be able to do it on their own.

They should be stronger.

And all that kind of leads to that isolation mentality where they just want to be alone.

They don't want.

They don't want other people to see them how they really are.

But I think that's why the body of Christ, from what you and I would say, is so essential.

Hebrews tells us that to stir one another up in love and good works, not neglecting to meet together, but to encourage each other.

So community is important, and we'll talk more about that in season two.

But we definitely, I think, see isolation oftentimes go hand in hand with addiction and not always the case because obviously there's many kinds of addiction.

So.

Yeah, and I think, too, again, just bringing it back full circle to a.

A biblical perspective.

The Bible says if we look at light, that truth is light and sin is darkness, and God is light.

And the Bible says that, you know, when Jesus came on the scene, there was an invitation to walk in the light as he himself is in the light.

But it says, but many chose not to walk with him and be in the light.

But they chose darkness.

And it says, and it's interesting because it goes back to the fallen nature of man again is that it said that they loved men, preferred the darkness rather than light because their deeds were evil, lest they be exposed.

So it, it's not that people aren't aware of their addictions, you might say that's because they become painfully aware of their addiction.

And then this is where the spiritual battle comes in.

That the enemy, the Bible says is a thief who comes to steal and to kill and destroy.

And so that in that isolation people, man, they just, they go into hiding because they're afraid that God has rejected them.

They forget, as we started, this whole second season is reminding people that for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whoever would believe in him would not perish but have everlasting life.

And it's understanding that God's not your enemy.

The devil, Satan is your enemy, not Jesus came to set the captives free.

And so people are struggling with addiction.

You know, obviously the natural human tendency is to withdraw, like you said, is to isolate.

And then the beauty of, as we start to grow in our understanding of Christ and fellowship and the reason that God created the church to begin with, all those positive, healthy benefits that help us to overcome addiction.

There, there are, as you quoted the book of Hebrews, you know, not forsaking the gathering of the saints, which is, what does it say?

Which is common to some, yes, but coming together and looking for ways to love each other, to support each other and to stir one another up to love and to good works.

And I think we've all learned this lesson sometimes the hard way that the more we focus on ourselves, the worse things get.

But when we get our eyes off of ourselves and we get them on God and we get em on other people, all of a sudden we find health and wholeness again.

So there's just so many more reasons, like I said, to make this and bring it back to what scripture says versus like I said, the psychological bend to it, which is just to me it's a rabbit trail that has no ending.

Yeah, for sure.

So what would you say then, talking specifically about the spiritual battle of addiction?

How important is understanding the spiritual aspect of it and also the practice, the practical aspect of seeking help with maybe its programs, Maybe it's mental health help through a medication to help mental health through addiction is there.

Can you can both be consistent together?

So what I mean by that, can you understanding that true freedom through addiction is going to be found in Jesus?

Is it also then okay for somebody to struggling with, you know, with addiction, especially in relationship to mental health, to seek help from doctors as well?

Because sometimes people will say, just believe in Jesus, ask for forgiveness and stop doing it.

But.

Right.

You know what I'm saying?

We take that kind of that le.

I don't know if I want to call it a legalistic approach, but do you understand what I'm trying to say?

Yeah.

And it's one of those that, you know, I think we struggle with all the time because, you know, again, we recognize that the human being is spirit, soul and body.

Yeah.

And when you discount any one of those things, you're going to get yourself into trouble.

And so, yes.

Has the church been guilty of making everything only spiritual and not recognizing there is a emotional and a psychological and a biological aspect to our being?

And we go, absolutely.

And so when people don't feel well, they come in and they come in for counseling.

I'll ask them, have you gone to the doctor?

Have you had blood work done?

Have you found that maybe your hormones are off?

Or there's all kinds of things that are just physiological and certain things are just obvious right from the get go.

And the most important question to me as a pastor is where is this person at spiritually?

And because that's gonna have a tremendous impact on everything else, and doctors will tell you this as well.

You can, you can not be suffering physiologically from any kind of ailment.

And yet you're dying because you're broken emotionally, you're broken spiritually.

Why do they say stress is the number one silent killer?

It's not a physical thing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I again, just coming back to what I.

When you said that, the first thing that came to my mind was, you know, just Romans 12:1 and 2 again.

And.

Yeah.

From the NLT says, and so, dear brothers and sisters, I plead with you to give your bodies to God.

It's an amazing thing.

You know, the first and foremost he says, give your body, give your life, give your whole life, give your being to God because of what he's done for you.

And it says, and let your body be a living and holy sacrifice, the kind that God will find acceptable.

Does this is truly the way to worship him.

Don't copy the behavior, the customs of this world, but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way that you think?

And so obviously, the way that we think about life and about God and about addiction and about trauma and about brokenness, about relationships, if you just trace the issue that a person has, you know, in my.

You're not going to be able to convince me otherwise.

In my mind, my heart, Jesus is going to be the answer for that.

And will he lead us to doctors?

At times?

Yeah, absolutely.

But he's still the answer.

Yeah.

You know, he says, Philippians 4, 6, and 7, don't worry about anything, but instead pray about everything and tell God what you need.

You know, what if we brought people, they go to a doctor.

And sometimes people feel terrible, you know, emotionally and, and, and psychologically, and they go to the doctor and the doctor does a blood test, right?

And he goes, everything's fine.

And they walk out of there as happy as can be.

There.

Everything changed because someone told them something, right?

It was just simply in.

Was the doctor even right?

I don't know.

But.

But he said, hey, everything's fine.

And you believe the doctor.

And the next thing you know, you walk out of there and.

And you feel great.

And you go, is that physical or is that emotional or is that psychological?

You go, I.

I think it has more to do with our psyche and emotions than anything else.

And so here's the Bible calling us to cast all of our cares upon God.

God knows what we need and to thank him and to be a thankful people.

We could go all day long, we could do a whole series on gratitude and thankfulness and how when we become unthankful and ungrateful, the talk about addiction, the things that, that come from that, as we turn away from God and we.

Because what are we looking for?

It says, and I love that in Philippians 6, it says, then you'll experience God's peace.

Because I think most of us say that, hey, what we want more than anything is we just want peace.

I want to.

Want to be at peace.

And then.

But it says that God will give you a peace that exceeds everything and anything that we can understand.

His peace will guard your hearts and your minds as you live in Christ Jesus.

And again, it just keeps pulling us back to this understanding that the solutions that we have for addictive behavior, first and foremost is going to be found in Christ.

And yes, at times that'll lead us to a physician.

And there might be other things, but even with medication, it'll never take the place of God.

It's just.

It's impossible for it to do that.

Amen.

And that's really what we're going to talk about in episode three next week is finding freedom from addiction.

And yes, so again, God's going to.

God can use anything that he wants to use, whether it's doctors and communities.

But at the end of the day, like you said, he is 100% the answer.

And if there's anybody listening to this podcast today that's struggling with addiction, my encouragement for you is don't do it alone.

If you're battling it, don't fight it alone.

Seek help, contact with somebody, get ahold of somebody.

There's so many different organizations and resources.

I just think for our veteran community, there's those resources.

You can always reach out to us@reallifecbakershield.com and even if you're not from the area we're in, we would love to try and help connect you with somebody around you so you're not alone.

Amen.

So go ahead.

A couple passages here, as you said, that, you know, again, we go back to how God uses the body of Christ.

You know, we have a ministry here at Calvary Chapel called 180.

We meet on Friday nights and 6:30 over in the cafe.

And goes back to that passage on Hebrews 10 that you were sharing.

As we come together and we look for opportunity to help each other, I think that's one of the downfalls of society that we saw because of COVID and the isolation of people.

And many people just haven't.

They haven't come out of that.

They got into addictive behavior during COVID while they were isolated and that addiction took over their life.

And we saw where churches, you know, shut down momentarily, then started right back up because they saw, you know, that man, this can't work.

People need people.

That was God's solution.

Talked about marriage.

It's not good for man to be alone.

I'll make a helper, someone who's suitable for him, someone who's comparable to us.

And so again, the solution isn't going to be finding other people that are in addiction, as in the sense of bad company corrupts good morals, but finding people who found freedom from addiction.

And that's that freedom that comes in Christ.

And there's ways that we do that.

And again, I said it and just reminded me of this passage.

And really the last thing I wanted to share today was Romans 12, 15 and 16.

It says, Be happy with those who are happy and weep with those that are who weep.

Live in harmony with each other.

And again, I just want to encourage people that if they're going through addiction, the worst thing that you can do is go it alone, is to remain isolated.

God's desire is that he would draw you out and into a relationship with himself first and foremost, where you can talk to God.

David in the 23rd Psalm, he said that though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I'll fear no evil, for you are with me.

And that first and foremost, just by coming into relationship with Jesus, he's with you.

And Jesus really does change everything.

And then as he brings you then into the local church, find a church where you can find people who will love you and care for you and that you can talk about the problems that you have.

Like I said, we're, we're all broken people living in a broken world with other broken people.

The Bible says in James, confess our faults one to another, confessing our struggles, confessing our sin, the things that, that messed us up in life.

And what you're going to find is that you're not alone.

That again for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

We're, we're all dealing with something.

We're all.

I love that expression, says we're all fighting an uphill battle.

And it really is true in many ways in life.

And just to, to remind those that that might be listening today is that God's not your enemy.

God's for you.

And Jesus does change everything.

As you look to him, open your heart to Him.

Find a local church.

Find a church to plug in that you know can listen to you and pray with you and counsel with you according to, you know, the Word of God.

And faith comes by hearing, comes by the Word of God, you know, just can't stress it enough moving forward from here and just pray that you find the help that you need and to know that Jesus is the help.

Amen.

If this episode encouraged you, share it with someone who needs hope, subscribe so you don't miss what's next and leave a review.

It helps us.

It really does help us reach more people with a message of hope that only Jesus can bring.

Listening to Real Life with Mike and Jason.

See you next time.

And remember, freedom is found solely in Christ.

We'll see you next time.

Thank you for joining us for this.

Episode of Real Life.

Real Life is a ministry of Calvary Chapel, Bakersfield, and we hope these discussions have inspired and encouraged you to live.

Out your faith in everyday life.

New episodes release every Thursday at 4pm, so be sure to tune in for more real conversations about real issues.

If you have any questions or topics you'd like us to cover, then send them to realifecbakersfield.com we'd love to hear from you.

If you've been blessed by this podcast and would like to support us, you can make a tax deductible donation by visiting ccbakersfield.com give and select the Real Life Podcast option.

Thanks again for listening and we'll see you in the next episode.