But as a black male myself, I've been the token I've been in spaces where literally I walked in the office and I saw people's faces clam up it because they were afraid they saw me and they were like, Oh my God, who is this? Does he belong here?

We'll discuss race and how it plays a factor and how we didn't even talk about this topic because we were afraid.

A Black Executive Perspective.

Welcome to a Black Executive Perspective, podcasts, a safe space where we discuss all matters related to race. Especially race in corporate America. I'm your host, Tony Tidbit. And again, we're live at WNHU 88. 7 on the Richter dial, the University of New Haven podcast studio. We want to give them mad love for hosting a Black Executive Perspective podcast. Hoping everybody continues to enjoy their summer. Go Chargers. And obviously, as we always do, we want to pay homage to our partners at CODE M Magazine. Please check them out. Their mission is help saving the black family by first saving the black man. So please go check them out at CodeMMagazine. com. So today is a really, really special day. I'm very excited about our guests. Um, who's on a good friend of mine. Um, and I'm pretty sure you're going to get a lot out of him, but what we're going to do today, we're going to dive into the particulars of organizational leadership and diversity. We'll discuss the specific challenges that CEOs, Chief Human Capital Officers, and Chief Diversity Officers face in creating high performing, diverse, and inclusive teams. Joining us is Alex Tremble, founder and CEO of GPS Leadership Solutions. Alex will shed light on the common frustrations and hurdles in implementing effective DEI strategies across different organizations. We will also examine the crucial differences between leadership development and leadership advancement. Let me tell you a little bit about my friend Alex. Alex D. Tremble, founder and CEO of GPS Leadership Solutions, is a best selling author, Executive coach and keynote speaker. He started his career in executive leadership development at the U. S. Department of the Interior. And later served as chief of staff within the U. S. National Park Service. Alex's mission is to empower ambitious leaders to achieve their personal and professional goals by fostering. Clarity, intentionality, and leveraging strategic relationships across all facets of life and business. He has authored three best selling books, the most recent Relationships That Work, Simple Steps to Building Intentional Connections in Business and in Life. He's also been recognized by the Aspen Institute and the Leadership Center for Excellence. Alex hosts an internationally known top 10 percent ranked podcast called the Executive Appeal. Alex Tremble, welcome to a Black Executive Perspective Podcast, my brother.

Hey, what's going on, my brother? Thank you so much for having me here with you.

Buddy, I am so excited that you're here. You know, and look at y'all dolled up. All right. Looking like a million and 2.

Anytime I can spend time with you is a time well spent and I got to look spiffy for it.

Oh, well, you know what, buddy, I really appreciate that. But more importantly, importantly, I appreciate that you're here. To share with our audience, right? Because you have a very, uh, very accomplished background. Um, you've done a lot of great things. You started your own business, um, and you really help leaders, which we're going to chat about today in terms of helping them take their games to the next level. So I know our audience is going to get a lot out of you today, but before we get into the heavy stuff, why don't you give us a little bit about, you know, where you're currently living, what you're currently doing, and tell us a little bit about your family, my friend.

Okay, so, um, I'm a Libra. I like long walks on the beach. Um, funny enough, I was talking to someone the other day, they're like, oh, you like the beach? I'm like, no, I don't like the beach. I'm more of a mountain guy, actually. I love the green and the water. Like, in the, like, you know, Waterfalls, stuff like that. Um, but yeah, Alex Tremble, um, I am out here in DMV area, DC, uh, Virginia, Maryland area. Um, I'm blessed to have a little boy. He's turning one years old tomorrow. So never y'all listen to this episode. Just know the day after that, my boy turned one, one years old and he swears he's grown already. I see it. I don't know what this guy's trying to do,

but you know what? He's growing. That's what he's doing.

There's a difference between growing and being grown and he, he think he can order us around.

Well, that's awesome. Tell us about your lovely wife, my friend.

Well, my wife is again, lovely, wonderful, beautiful, intelligent, all the things her and I actually met via Facebook back in the day. Um, she is from Myanmar, the country, um, uh, Southeast Asia. Okay. And we met via when I was. going to college and undergrad in Iowa. And she was an undergrad college in Massachusetts. And she doesn't like that. I say this, but this is what actually happened. Um, I came across her profile because you know, we had a mutual friend. I thought she was cute. So I shot, I had to shoot my shoot, my shot. And it worked. We've been together for 17 years now, married for the last 10.

Well, congratulations, my friend. You know, one thing we can always say, college definitely paid off, not just from a business standpoint, but also from a family standpoint. So that's awesome. So listen, my friend, tell us, you know, look, like I said, you're very accomplished. You got a lot going on. You got a thriving business. You travel all over the world, helping executives in terms of their business and really helping them from a personal standpoint. Why did you want to come on a Black Executive Perspective podcast to talk about this topic?

Well, first. To be with you, actually, just to hang out with you, that has to be the number one answer. Um, second is, is exactly what you talked about just a second ago. You said helping people in their work and in their personal life and see again, this is Sometimes a very unpopular statement, um, to make in the wrong rooms. And I'm going to say this right here. I think we're in a safe space. Um, executive leaders are an underserved group. And people like always, like I was talking to someone really close about this just this past week. And I was like, I said that they were like, what are you talking about? They got all the money, they got all the power, they got all the influence. And I'm like, yeah, see, that's the problem. Everyone thinks just because it got some more money, got some more power, got some more influence that their lives are perfect. And all of us know who are in those roles and work people in those roles. That is not the case. Um, they have family issues just like everyone. They have budget issues. They have, um, they have what was called, um, like, Where they don't think they're good enough. Um, they have challenges navigating the workplace versus their family life. There's so many challenges that they deal with. This is why I love working with them because also just from a practical standpoint, when they're not living their best life, when they're not functioning at the high level, they can and should be functioning at who ultimately pays the price, right? It's the, the stakeholders, the, the stockholders, the, the, the, um, the organizations they work with, the organization, the employees, right? This is really important.

Got it. My brother. Well, listen, it seems like you already chopping at the bit. So you ready to talk about it, my friend?

Yes, sir. Let's go.

All right, let's talk about it. So before we get in there, I want our audience, because obviously you just said a lot. And, you know, um, you know, people listening to this, uh, based on you, you know, the description you just, you just talked about in terms of people thinking that they're perfect and, um, they're underserved, um, from an executive standpoint, right? And they need help, right? So talk to us a little bit, let's back up a little bit and let's learn a little bit more from Alex about, you know, who is this guy, Alex Tremble. So talk to us a little bit about where you grew up. Life and the influence, you know, what influence did you have in your life as you grew up that helped you shaped you to where you got to where you are today?

Wow. You know, what's funny is I very rarely am asked these questions, right? So you got me thinking. Um, so I'm initially from Victorville, California. Um, so SoCal boy myself, and. If I think about the first thing I can remember that helped shape who I am today, um, it is my biological father leaving when I was just two or three days old. Um, that is. That is the thing that I think has driven me the vast majority of my life and everything that I've been able to accomplish. Um, you know, it was funny because, you know, going through school, I was a good, good student, not straight A's, nothing like that, but a good student. Um, but I, I, I was in the football team. Um, I got my senior year, all area, all CIF, all LA times, all, all the good stuff. I was a wrestler. I was in the track and field team. Definitely the field part. And I had this drive to be successful, to do well. And I still remember, and I, and let me, please stop me from going off track. Anyway, I still remember. My, my auntie, my, one of my favorite aunties, one of my favorite people, um, she was getting baptized and I saw, it was like this high school, I saw this as an opportunity to meet my biological father. I knew he was going to be there. And so I brought this, this photo album of me and my friends and me playing football and things like that. And I was so ready to show him and he didn't even want to take the time to look at it. And I remember being devastated it. But it didn't stop me. I still kept working, striving to do as well as I can. And I talk about this in my book briefly, the relationships at work that drove me so hard to accomplish so much stuff, just because I had a desire that maybe if I was, if I got, if I was good enough, if I achieved enough, he would want to be part of my life. And just a few years ago, me and my auntie were talking. She was like, Alex, look, real talk. You got to stop.

He

doesn't care about you. He doesn't want to be in your life. No matter what you do, he's not going to be that guy. And that was one of those times I needed that straight talk. Um, because again, I, even as an adult, I still was putting it out there. Even though I talked to myself and say I wasn't, um, I still was, but ultimately I'll tell everyone this is like, and I do believe this a hundred percent. All of those things that we look back on our life and say how dark, how hard, how trying, how all those places in your life that you just weren't sure you were going to make it, those things, they, they, they seem bad in the moment. But if you look at them in retrospect. Everything that you've accomplished is in part due to those things. As I look at my dad, yeah, my biological father left me. And that put me in a very difficult psychological situation for a long time. Still, let's be real, it's still with me, right? But if he hadn't left, I wouldn't have my, my five siblings, right? Because I would have been in a different family. If he hadn't left, then I wouldn't have met my wife because I would have probably been overseas with him because he was in the military. If he hadn't left, the list goes on and on and on and on. Maybe I wouldn't have had that same drive that allowed me to get my first job as an adult was to create and manage the executive leadership development program for U.S. Federal agency and managed three government wide executive leaders, develop programs when I was 23. So maybe if he would have been around, I wouldn't have worked as hard. That would have set me up for those situations. And so I encourage everyone that even when you're. When times are good, look back at their life and just look back at your life and see those, those, those, those hard times and make that connection to say, wow, I am where I am because this did this, which did this, which did this. And so if you do that, if you can be honest with yourself about how those negative and those hurtful moments in your life contributed to your positive situation, then when you're in a dark and trying time, it's easier to say, you know what? I'm going to get through this and I'm going to be looking back on this in a few years and saying how it helped me grow that next level of my life.

Yeah. I love you for number one. Thanks for sharing my friend. And you know, I listened, you left, you threw a lot of nuggets, um, in your story, um, that people could take away from, right. And, and one of the things you just talked about that. Um, you know, this happened, you know, like you said, he left when you were two, three, two, two or three days old, right? And then you, you were able to hopefully, um, build a relationship with him at your, at your game. And he didn't even want to spend time with you. Right. Um, but one of the major lessons is that you just got from the saying a couple of years ago. And if I make sure I'm clear that you had a talk with your auntie and she said, let it go. Okay. So you still carried that even though Oh yeah. You knew you were helping other people Mm-Hmm. They had their own stories or had their own missing pieces in their life. You were providing them advice. They were like, thank you, Alex. Oh my God, blah, blah, blah. And you must have it all together because you are able to help me. But there was a piece still missing with you. So, Net, Net, we don't, um, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. We don't become instantly cured in situations. We learn how to deal with them, right? And, but at some point we got to learn to let it go. So what's your thoughts on that? Because look, you are helping people. But why you were hurting at the, and yeah, you use it as motivation. Yeah. You were able you, you know, you wouldn't have met your wife. Yeah. I mean, all those things are true. But at the end of the day, you're still human as well. Oh,

absolutely. And, and, uh, well, I'm a, I'm a, I want to make a quick amendment to that story just so everyone understands the very important part. So yes, my auntie told me that a few years ago, um, but when I was in college, my mom figured out the reason why I was working so hard. And she was, she told me, hey, Alex, do this for you, not for him. Um, and then my auntie's boyfriend, because I actually, uh, we're at a wedding, uh, we're preparing for a wedding and he, uh, my biological father and his new wife went to the house and they were in the same space, same time. And I was, Man, Tony, you wouldn't recognize me. I was so cold. I was so, they tried to say hi. I wouldn't talk to him. Didn't talk to nobody. I had this, this mean mug on my face the entire time. Cause I wanted him to know that I was not happy with him. And you know, my auntie's boyfriend pulled me aside and say, Alex, don't, don't do that. You are allowing him to change who you are. You are a funny, kind, helpful person. And the person you're being right now is not that. And he was like, doing that is not going to allow you to release your emotions. You have, cause you, in order to be like, in order to be upset and angry, you have to Harbor those relationships, that emotion. And so that next day, after he pulled me aside, Completely different person, you know, just laughing, joking. But I, even again, that I'm still working through that. So the point being that I think that we should be mindful that yes, we are all, I think everyone is going through something at some point. And just because you're going through something at some point doesn't mean you can't help someone out, someone else out with their situation. And I think it actually probably helps you when you're helping other people, you know, just go through those emotional, those difficult life challenges, you know?

Buddy, preach, preach. You mind if I tell you a story? And, you know, it's interesting. You know, when I met you, you know, actually I was a guest on your podcast and we, we, we hit it off. We just had instant chemistry and I knew nothing of the story that you just shared, right? Let me share something with you because I always think kindred, you know, you, you talk about kindred spirits, um, you know, I believe that there's, um, there's no coincidences. You meet people, thru your life as you walk the earth, and, um, it's not based on luck. It's reason, season, lifetime, and, and we can get into that another time. But the reason I bring this up, because I didn't know your story, but let me tell you mine. I remember when I, when I, uh, turned 13 years old on my birthday, my mother came to me and told me that, um, who my real father was. And I knew that, um, You know, my stepfather wasn't my father because I didn't look like the rest of my siblings, okay? So I knew that, right? But then she dropped that on me, and it was heavy. I didn't even know how to process it, okay? Like you, very, I, you know, I, I just wanted to be something, I, just very ambitious, and look, I didn't get to the, to the levels that Alex Tremble did, which is awesome, okay? But here's the thing. Uh, when in my 30s, all of a sudden I was sitting with my girlfriend, now wife, watching a movie and I saw Antoine Fisher and a movie about a kid who was in the Navy having hard times and he didn't know his family and Denzel Washington told him, you know, go and find your family. Right. And at the end of the movie, he found his family. And I started crying uncontrollably. And my wife was looking at me. And she was like, What's wrong with you? I mean, not tears strolling. Mm-Hmm. crying. Uncontrolled because I, that hurt that I was, I was carrying all of a sudden came out. Mm-Hmm, Okay. It came out and so and so, and I didn't, she didn't know what to do. I'm talking five, 10 minutes just, and then I knew I had to go find my father. Okay. So I went on that journey. Okay. And I was able to find them. And my father was a successful businessman in Detroit, Michigan, own more, just successful. And I get, and this is the thing. This is where I got my entrepreneurial spirit. This is where I got my, uh, ambition and stuff to that nature, even though he wasn't in my life. And I pulled up into his, in the parking lot of his business, sat outside for like 20 minutes. Afraid to go in and then I walked in and as soon as I walked in, it was a family owned business and they looked at me double looked like, you know, because I've supposedly looked a lot like my father and I asked for him to come out and they said, have a seat and I waited 10 minutes and he didn't come out. Okay, and you know what? I said, thank you. I walked out and guess what? He became dead to me. Right? Because I fulfilled my mission. I went to look for him. I didn't care what happened. I wasn't looking for money. All I wanted to do was see somebody that looked like me. Okay? And I carried this hurt for years. But he didn't want to have that relationship. So guess what? It was done, and I've never looked back since, okay? So, I thank you for sharing your story, because those are not easy stories to share, okay? And this is, and to your point about becoming so successful based on that, and also the positive outlook, I can definitely relate, my brother. So, one of the things I want to ask you, You GPS leadership. Tell us a little bit. How did you start that man? Because you've been helping people for, I don't know how long. Right. So talk to us a little bit about that.

So, you know, it's funny actually. Um, so the, the reason GPS actually came about was because, um, I literally, I was on a Metro, uh, train, you know, heading out of side of DC, um, an organization had asked me to come and speak. And I'm like, yeah, sure, sure. But I didn't have like, I didn't have a name. Like I didn't have an organization's name. And so look, this is literally back when I was like 20. 25 years old or something. I'm on the Metro and I'm talking to one of my mentors and she's like, what do you want to talk about? I said, well, you know, in order to be successful, um, you gotta make sure you have, you know, your, your, your goals, you know, you gotta have goals. She said, okay, okay. And she said, what else? I said, well, once you have your goal, then you can develop a plan, right? You know, a plan and she said, okay, cool plan. And then, and then, you know what? You gotta have the plan, but you also gotta have like. The strategies, like how do you build those connections with the right people? Because for me, I, it's always been about connections. I've always, my, my entire life's journey has always been just being blessed that people wanted to help me. And there was something I did to make people want to help me. And I think that that's what we teach through our programs and our training and our coaching and things like that. Like, how do you build those very intentional and meaningful connections? Because that's where if you're at the executive level, that's what it's about. Right. It's about how do you navigate, um, difficult situations via people. Um, and so she said, Oh, okay. So you're talking about is GPS. And I was like, goals, plans, strategy. Oh my God. This is, this is okay. Now, over the years, we actually, you know, transitioned the language from goals. Um, from GPS being goals, plan and strategy to goals, plan and stamina because the plan is kind of like a strategy, but you know what, when you're going to reach a goal, especially, you know, again, these higher levels, super high level, super exclusive clubs that you're in when you get those levels, you're going to need some stamina. Things are going to get hard. They're gonna be challenging. You're gonna have to work some long hours. At some point, you're gonna make some tough decisions, right? So you got to have that stamina, especially if you're getting a person of color as a black male myself, I've been the token. I've been in spaces where literally I walked in the office and I saw people's faces claim it because they were afraid. They saw me and they were like, Oh my God, who is this? Does he belong here? And I have some fun. Not funny from entry. You laugh at them in the, you know, in retrospect, but some situations has happened just because of my face and how I look. And so I think you have to have that stamina if you plan to not only reach those levels, but sustain yourself at those levels.

So buddy, tell us specifically, like, what do you do? How do you help? Tell us a little bit about your programs and stuff to that nature.

Yes, sir. So, you know, I tend to, or I say, I, we, I have a phenomenal team. I get to work with, um, work, tend to work with, uh, chief. Diversity officers, chief HR officers, um, and CEOs. You said that in the beginning, um, generally because those individuals who have, um, domain over the entire organization when it comes to developing leadership, uh, leadership programs and whatnot. Um, at the same time, we do a lot of leadership coaching. Um, we had this phenomenal woman, um, uh, SVP at this fortune 500 company, um, her and her VP team. We coached for them for about a year and just, just the results are amazing. They were going through a merger and how do you navigate through a merger? Again, you all know at those levels, it's the people at the top, whether the greatest chance of, um, of being exited. Right. And so how do we navigate and keep all these of these executives inspired, engaged as you're moving through this process? So let me take a step back, though, to answer your question directly. Um, You talked about, you mentioned what, what I'm really passionate about, um, leadership development versus leadership advancement. So here's the reality. Um, many of these organizations, especially a lot of, um, organizations who, who say they're about inclusiveness and they say they're about, um, increasing diversity within their organization. As your last guest actually spoke about a couple of weeks ago now, um, um, Every single time you look at the executive ranks, you look at the board ranks, or even the senior leader ranks. At some points, there's no diversity. There's always diversity at the low end, right? People who can sweep the sweep, the floors or, you know, file some documents for everyone's well, great diversity,

50 percent of the company.

But when it comes, but when it comes to decision makers, when it comes to people making the big bucks and having those influence, the diversity, this tends to dissipate somewhere. So, but why? The question is why we have these great, great leadership development programs. We're developing these phenomenal leaders. But here's the, here's the rub is there's a difference between. Developing a leader, which is, you know, conflict management, you know, budgeting, project management, account, whatever they, you got those leadership skills. Great. Hooray. We're done. Okay, less leadership development. There are so many people who have been developed as leaders who have not advanced.

Right, right, right, right.

There's a difference between leadership development and leadership advancement. Say another word for it is what is your intentional succession planning? Right? And so when we go into organizations, it's not only, you know, making sure that yes, these people are developed and they're prepared to move into the senior executive level ranks, but it's. How'd they build the right relationships with the right people. So when the opportunities arise, they are the ones who are thought of because at that level, it is about who, you know, who, you know, who trusts you. They know that you're loyal and so on and so forth. And you know, 80%, 80 percent of opportunities are actually given via relationships, not resumes,

not

because all that person, you know, they're such a hard worker. No, no, no. There's a lot of people who work hard. You and I know a lot of people right now who work really hard and they're not what they want to be. So it's not about hard work. It's not about leadership skills because black and brown people. Have leadership skills. It's not like they don't have the skills is they don't have the connections to the influencers required to be in those rooms and have a seat at the table. So we build programs, policies, and initiatives that not only develop those leadership skills, but also intentionally connecting with those people who are going to ultimately be this decision maker when they need people to move into those roles.

So thanks buddy. Let me ask you this, because you know, number one, you hit it on the head. There's a lot of programs to develop people. Um, I, I, I went to, um, you know, a program, um, at the University of Virginia, Darden School of Business. All right. And, uh, it was 50 of us there from all across the country. All right. And again, I don't know how many people actually moved up. Okay. That's the thing, right? So you're 100 percent right. So how do you though, You know, you say you develop programs to teach them to network and meet the right people in the right room and talk a little bit more about how does that work because at the end of the day, you're and I don't want to skip because you said you said a lot of great stuff. I just want to make sure everybody heard 80%. Mm. Of those advancements is based on relationships. Mm-Hmm. Let's just be clear here. Okay? Mm-Hmm. Everybody. You know, when I was in business school, they said that to, they were like, Tony, at your level. And that wasn't talking to me. It was talking to everybody in the room. At you guys' level. We already know you qualified. Okay? Mm-Hmm. That's just automatic. You, we didn't, we're not, when you are interviewing, they're not asking you questions about can you, do they know that already? Just based on what you've done. It now becomes more about a people thing, a culture thing. Do you fit in, you know, and the only way you're going to answer those questions is about having those connections with people. Plus all those, plus you got to have people that's going to sponsor you and speak on your behalf. Right. When you're not in the room, that's already saying we got to have this guy because he's got this, this, or she's awesome, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You ain't got that. You can be so look. Go into it. Tell us how your program helps in that capacity.

So in the beginning, there is heaven and earth. Um, So is that fun? Um, so look, here's the thing. One, it needs to be, the first thing is it needs to be elongated. Right? Um, this is not a, we're going to send someone to a day, a week long course. Now it's all done. That doesn't happen. Um, so there's a few factors that need to take in place. First is that, uh, we've got the four C connection model. This is what we base all of our stuff on four C's. Um, the first is mindset change, then internal clarity, external clarity, then behavior choice. Um, the first thing is mindset change. First is mindset change, because if you don't change someone's mindset, Nothing else. We can teach you all the skills. In the world, but you'll never do it right because you don't, you don't agree with it. You don't understand it.

So the Alex real quick, when you say change somebody's mindset, give an example, like what type of mindset change. Okay.

Yes. So the, there's many different levels of this. There's the first is the mindset of the individual. Um, because I can't tell you how many individuals who get to these levels who say, I don't want to rely on my network. I don't want to rely on who I, who I know, because I want to show everyone that I can do it, that I'm smart enough, that I can just push it all by myself. No, oh, there are so many leaders at this level who is called imposter syndrome, right? They don't believe enough in themselves. They feel like they have to do it themselves still at that level. And so they, they want to show, especially in black and Brown people, they want to show that, Hey, I'm smart enough. I'm not just here because I'm a number. I'm not just here because I know somebody, but the reality is that. Everyone else is there because they know somebody and it's nothing wrong with that. So it's changing the participant's mindset on this. And then second is change the organization's mindset or those decision makers specifically to say, Hey, look Putting people in a leadership program is not going to make change Just look at your data. If putting people in a leadership program made the change, then you would have different data, but your data is showing that you still lack diversity. So then we need to do something different. It was the saying, if you want something to change, then you have to change, right? Could this change how we go about this? So first is mindset change. And this is the whole big thing. Um, second is internal clarity. Again, internal clarity for the person is different for the organization. Internal clarity for the person is understanding for that person. What are my goals? What are my desires? Where do I want to be? Um, why do I want it? Um, understanding everything you can about yourself. Um, why? Because when people think about relationship, they only think about the other person. Oh, I got to meet that person. I got to meet that person. I mean, I got to meet Tony, but here's the problem. Maybe Tony's not the right person for you to connect with right now. Maybe that person over there is not the right person. You need to understand where you're headed so that you know who can help get you there. You need to understand what resources you have access to so you can know who to help, what you don't have access to, who can help you get there. You need to understand where you feel most comfortable because here's the reality. When you feel comfortable, you look confident when you look confident, you are trusted and you can establish those relationships much easier. Right? But that's all that internal work that internal clarity. Once you have external clarity. So sorry, the same thing for the organization. Organization has to make a decision for themselves. Where do we want to go? Do we want inclusivity and diversity at these levels? Are we willing to put in the energy and the effort to make this happen? Sorry, let me take it back. Take a step back. Not just the energy and effort, the money, right? We can say we care about things all day, but we all know. Your priorities are dictated by your budget. So you look at your budget, you can see what the priorities are. So are you willing to actually invest in these people, making sure they have the time and space and the resources to actually advance into these positions? Um, then after internal clarity is external clarity for the individual. Now that you understand where you want to go and what you're missing and what you need and so on and so forth, who can help you get there? Where are they at? Who are their friends? Who are their enemies? How can you help them? What are their needs? What are their desires? Right? That's the external clarity for the organization. You've made a decision that you want to move forward in this direction. Who can help get you there? Obviously, this is where GPS leadership comes in and we help again, create these programs and manage them, coaching and all the things like that. Then finally is behavior choice. Behavior choice is what everyone loves to talk about when it comes to relationship building. Oh, I should shake this person's hand. Oh, I should, um, I should look them in the eye, whatever it may be. Those are behaviors. Here's the reality. It doesn't matter what behaviors, you know, if you don't have the right mindset. Because you're not going to do anything doesn't matter what behaviors, you know, if you don't have internal clarity, because you don't know where you're headed, you don't matter what behaviors, you know, if you don't have extra clarity, you may be talking to the wrong person. So this is why all those things need to happen in order, um, And then we'll talk about this new idea. I've just been working on. Um, I'm really excited about it. But the long story short is we take them through this four C connection model as an organization, as an individual. Again, elongated program is generally what works best. Um, you know, at least nine months to 12 months because you need the time to, um, to, to allow them to actually build relationships with those decision makers, which Within the organization, um, it can't be again, it's not a weak thing. It's not a two week thing has to be over and over and over because not only do they need to understand that these things are important, but many of them are still lacking the skill when it comes to building intentional relationships. Now, again, we have all not, we have all many of us have reached this, this, these, these roles by chance. By just working hard by pure force, right? Just doing whatever you got to do, but there's easier ways, right? You don't always got to beat your head up against the wall. There are easier ways. So that's what we teach them specific skills. Some that we go over a minute that we go over in the book relationships that work, but we teach them these very specific skills tied, tied, connected to their specific unique needs and goals.

So tell us a little, little bit about like, based on everything that you've done, tell us, give us some, some examples of how you, or some major accomplishments you were, you were able to be, some wins that you were able to do from an organizational standpoint. Obviously, You're helping individuals. So I, that part, I think is a no brainer. Tell me a little bit about some of the organizations you are able to change their mindset, get them to network, right? Because it's not as much Tony Franklin going to meet with everybody, right? It's about. The senior leadership, all right, the C suite coming and meeting Tony Franklin and spending time with me and then say, Oh, you know, we got one. All right. So tell me a little bit about that.

One of my favorite ones that come to mind actually is the, um, the work we did at the department, the U S department, the interior.

Okay.

Um, So here's the reality. Again, as you pro as in the private sector, as in the federal government, there there's a severe lack of diversity at those senior level positions. So the question was beginning, okay, how do we increase the number of individuals in those senior executive level roles? It's like, cool. And they want to do it via mentoring program, which I am a huge proponent of. I, I love mentoring programs. We, we craft create launch mini and entering program for organizations. Um, and so for this one, um, I'll tell you, I am not a, I don't believe in like, there's one shot. What, what, one shot, one kill. I, I, the snipers are great at it. And that is their job. That's their job.

I'm teasing, bro. Go ahead. You got a shotgun. You can

blast a lot of people.

Okay.

But look, but look. Right, shotgun. Right. Right. I believe in a shotgun approach, but a controlled shotgun. Right. So, instead of saying we have 1 program, that's going to help 1, 1 person. Right. Or because that's the problem with most mentoring programs by design. Most member mentoring programs. Other a lot of people, right? You can only have so many people in a mentoring program. If you can only have 30 people, 40 people, what about the rest of everyone else who may be a great position or great shot for the next, the next opportunity, they get nothing. Right, right, right. And so I think you have to have multiple levels of this. So what we did with interior is actually create a few different levels of mentoring opportunities as well as a mentoring program. So we had, yes, the mentoring program that was focused on. Just connecting those senior level executives with those people who are just about moving. So we have about 40 people in that program. Very specific, very intense, very, um, I don't think control, but monitored for an extended period of time. Yes. We also then had a number of mentoring events consistently happening. So we had, um. Speed mentoring events, right? So those things happen, uh, consistently throughout the year to allow anyone who wanted to access these individuals and our other leaders and mentoring opportunities to access that. So we would have, um, it was actually really cool. Sometimes we did days for for women, um, women in leadership, um, executives, um, uh, project managers, I. T. Professionals, whatever, uh, We did obviously the, uh, the assessments first to figure out who was looking for mentorship. What did the ranks look like? What were the positions that need to be filled in the next few years? Um, what are the skills required? So once we did all that work, it was really easy to identify what were those big buckets that we could keep holding, uh, hosting mentoring events for, um, again, Alex,

can I, can I just jump in real fast? Just want to make sure I'm clear, right? So if I'm hearing when you say the speed mentoring program, that was a, uh, program where senior leadership. Could come down and meet with people who were interested in a mentor program so they could help develop and more importantly, see their pipeline of individuals. And then when opportunities they could pull because they're building relationships. Is that what I'm hearing?

Exactly.

Okay.

Yeah. Okay,

buddy.

So again, that was on tonight. You have two levels. You have, you have the, the, the program that's for 40 people. You have the, the mentoring events, the speed mentoring, uh, opportunities and whatnot that are happening for, uh, You know, a few hundred people. I don't think that's enough. I still think there's opportunity out there. So with the government, government's massive, right? So we had one department. Let's say, how can, how about we work with other departments as well? And then we started having events with OPM. All the acronyms. Sorry. Um, the Office of Personnel Management, U. S. Department of Interior, U. S. D. A. Um, the F. B. I. All the other organizations. I started coordinating with them and we have bigger events for everyone there because now you're cross pollinating across different departments and you're exposing people because the reality is, is that That one department only has so many slots. So now you're exposing them to other opportunities and the same thing can actually go with an organization, especially the bigger organizations that we work with, but they have thousands and thousands and thousands of employees. You can do something at your department level, then also do something at the organizational level. And then if you're actually, if you're feeling, if you're feeling good about yourself, do something industry wide, right? There's so much fear about, there's so much fear. In losing great employees, which I understand, you know, great employees are always going to be sought after, but if you can create a culture and a brand of you wanting people to come in and see what you do and you allowing them to see what other people do, one, they're going to learn some new stuff that they're going to bring back to your organization. And two, if they leave, there's probably someone else who out there who attended your event, who says, you know what? I'm interested in this organization. So it keeps the new blood as well. You know, new blood coming in.

So, net net, were you, based on working with the Department of Interior, uh, on the programs you put together, and then cross pollinating with the other departments, did you see, not just from a development standpoint, but did you see from an advancement standpoint?

Yeah. Yeah. The number of, so what they have in the federal government is called, um, SCS CDPs, um, like senior executive candidate development programs. So basically, um, a department will host one or potentially two of those each year and not all departments even have those, but in order to become an executive, there's two ways. There's the hard way. And there's the SCS. And I'll look at the diversity within that, the S. C. S. C. D. P. within the next couple of years just skyrocketed in the cool part about it was it was the individuals who had participated in the mentoring programs. Who actually got into those programs. And I'll say this, and this is the quiet part out loud. Most people, unfortunately, in the federal government, look at those programs. And we work in both federal and private, but this is specifically for the, the government, but I think the same thing happened in the private. Most people believe that in order to get to that executive position, they got to write a, have a really great experience and they got to write really great resumes. But I, I've been behind the curtains. I've, I've, I've worked behind the curtains. It's, it's, it's, it's horse trading. I want this person in. Okay. If you want this person and I'll, then I got to have this person in and they're picking people's names off of who they know, who they support, who they trust to do, to do the job. Well, that's how it happens in the government as well in the private sector. You just, like you said, at certain level, they know you're qualified. Right. It's about who do I know? Who do I trust to come in here and do a good job?

And that's in every, I mean, if you were, you got hired as a manager of a baseball team and they already have coaches there, right? Well, you want to do, you want to bring your own people in. All right. You want to bring in people that you trust that, you know, right. And so that's in court. I've not been at a place where that has not happened. Okay. So. Let's, let's shift a little bit, buddy. I want to ask you a couple pointed questions here. Um, and I want to get your, your, your, and I, you know, you've always been a very authentic individual as you are right here on the show. Why is it that companies struggle advancing people of color at leadership positions? You've worked with, you know, hundreds of thousands, hundreds or thousands of people of color, um, that are very qualified. That, you know, are smart, um, they, they have all the tools, they go through these programs, they do this and that, but then they, and, and I appreciate the, the, the, the case study that you gave with the government, but at the end of the day, most is still nil in terms of the people that actually end up moving up. So what, and you work with these companies.

So there's a few things, um, the first, and here's my perspective on life just really quickly. I do believe that the vast majority of people are good people. Yep. I agree with that. And I think they're doing the best they know how to do. I don't know about that out there. Well, no, I guess they know how to do. Okay. Okay. But go ahead. Go ahead. You, I want to hear your thoughts. I'm sorry, buddy. And no, that's gets to my first point is that it's the best they know how to do. That means many of these organizations just don't have the expertise. Um, they, they think they know what they know. They think they got it right. I can't tell. I was, I was working with an organization just. A year and a half ago, and they were having challenges with their diversity. And I said, okay, great. The first thing we're going to do is we're going to develop, um, uh, standardized interview questions. And everybody, cause they don't have no standardized interview questions. They didn't have interview process, none of that stuff. And the CEO took me aside real quick. Well, you know, I just, I just don't think this will work for, you know, our, our senior level positions, because, you know, I'm really good at hiring. I have a really good gut on who, who should be in these roles. And, but, but if you look at who's in these roles,

but what was his so, so, but to be fair, His, his take is a take that a lot of CEOs or people in on senior level would say, right? So what was his fear? What was their fear?

Um, the, the, the, the, the fear is the fear is loss of control and not being able to make the decision they want to make. And I understand that, but here's the reality is that we all have unconscious bias. And this is a reality. All of us have bias. Bias is not a good thing. It's not a bad thing. It is a thing that we all have.

And so

the reality is that we are, we like people who are like us.

And

so even when you think you are being fair, if I say, I think people are, they want to do the best. So even when they think they're being fair, Hey, you know, that person with the same school as me, Hey, you know, that person, um, they, they kind of look like me. Oh, they have a kid just like me there. You have a dog just like me. Oh my like, this is what happens all the time. And this is why it's extremely important to have standardized interview questions, to have a, a, a process in place when it comes to, you know, evaluating, what do you, what do you say is successful or not? Right. Because you're just calling it by your gut. Your gut. It's likely wrong just in regards to biases. Right. And so, but I'm going to talk off the other side of my mouth. Okay. So here's the deal. Um, even as I, when I work, when we work with organizations, we do our best to help them understand and identify the biases they may have in their system so that we can correct for. That is what we do in organizations. When we work with individuals is telling them. Hey, look, there are biases out there that are probably working against you. This is being real. This is be real. So the question becomes, how do you create biases in their mind that work for you?

So give me an example of that, buddy. Oh,

but you and I know we, you, we do this all the time. Um, Hey Tony. Hey, so, Hey, do you have, um, you have kids, you have kids. Yeah. How many kids you have? Okay. I got three. Oh, boys, girls. Yeah. Three girls. Oh, that's crazy. So I, I, I have, I'm a boy. My boy just turns one tomorrow, you know? Um, I don't have any daughters. What was it like having daughters?

It's, it's different than having boys.

So

you're basically, is this like, so are you just saying in terms of how to build a relationship with somebody or stuff to that nature? Yeah.

All it's about creating an in group again, in groups are biases in groups are just that it means that you and I have things in common. So how do I ask the right questions to find places and spaces that were you and I have in common? So when you look at me and you look at someone else, you say, Oh, shoot. Yeah. Alex has that little boy. That's all I need. God, many of those, and what you're doing is it's a percentage game. If you can try a probability game, if you can make enough connections one, yes, you should be good at what you do, but if you can make enough connections, you slowly increase the probability that person's going to go with you just simply because. Unconsciously, they like you more and the reality is that most of us want to work with some we like

and that's just the bottom line, right? And I just want to back up one thing because I just want to make sure clear because we have this this climate today. That thinks that anybody who's, you know, uh, black or a woman of color, they're getting promotions based, they're not qualified. Okay. And they're getting promotions based on a lack of merit. All right. And we know that's not true. Okay. But we, and we, I don't want to, I want to stay where you're going, but I just want to make sure. At the audience knows because when we say you, it's about who, you know, right? We're not saying that you can be a bum or you, you've not qualified and you can still get a job because you, you best friends with the CEO that no, that's not going to happen. You, that's a minimum,

not for us though.

Exactly. That's the, I've seen it happen, but not for us. The minimum is you're qualified. Right. And they know that, right. The key is to your point and what you help people do is to be able to build those relationships. And you just talked about how, you know, with the in group example that you just shared with us, right. Those things matter because at the end of the day. People are going to hire people that they like. And there's a negative to that too. Okay. If you mind me saying, right, because I remember we did this exercise at a company I worked at. This was probably 10, 12 years ago. And we had a guy come in and analyze, you know, everyone's team. And I met with him and he went through my personality, blah, blah, blah. And then he met with everybody on my team. Okay. Then he came back to me and he said, listen, you know, Tony, you're this way, this way, this way, this way, which is great. Blah, blah, blah. But do you know that everybody's on your team is this way, this day, this way, they're just like you, right? And that's why you get along with them. But the two, a couple of people that you told me that you struggle with, that you hired, they're not like you, okay? And that's why you struggle with them. And it, and one of the things that he taught us is that you don't want to hire people that are That's just like you, because you're going to get the same output. You can get the same stuff. And when I, when I have the people that were very detailed and very methodical and this, I struggle with them because I'm like, bro, come on, what's up? You can't be, but that's not how they process. And those individuals was just as good. And some even better than the people just like me. And they were given a different perspective that helped the whole team. So that's one of the other reasons why you don't want to hire people just like you.

I 100 percent agree with you. And again, this is why we have to talk out of both sides of our mouth. Correct? Because from an organizational standpoint, this is how we advise because this is the best way to do it, right? You don't want everyone like you do. You don't want to be utilizing biases and so on and so on and so forth. But from an individual standpoint. I'm gonna be, I gotta be real biases coming to play. So I'm going to, I told people, I don't want to, I want every opportunity to get the, the offer and we, when we work with our, with our executive clients, we, the, the, the, the point is to get them as many offers as possible and they can make a choice. That that that's what we want. We want three, four office on the table so they can say, you know what, I'm gonna pick this one. And so again, those are, but those are due to different clients. Right. Um, and there's, there's something I want to talk to you about today that I, I, I, no, we can go right to it,

buddy. I want to go into your, your, your relationship model that you're, you're launching and stuff, because that dovetails right into what we're talking about.

So, so, so, so I'm so excited. So, um, I have a new workbook, you know, so the, the, the feedback that I received about the last book, um, relationships that work, um, is that Alex, this is so great. It's so wonderful. I, it's amazing. I had, um, literally SVPs VPs contacting me on LinkedIn saying, Hey, you just helped me connect with a billionaire. You helped me go to met with a multimillionaire. I just got this new job. But you know, it would be really great if there was a workbook, something to help me on a weekly basis, make sure I'm making progress. I say, you know, you're right. Okay. So I'm going to create a workbook, but there's a story behind why I ended up doing this. So a few months ago, I was hanging out with some people, really good people, wonderful people, great people. Um, and we were wrapping up, we're about to leave. And then as two of those people, my friends of mine, um, we were We're, we're, we're talking on the side and someone offered another person a job and he said, Hey, um, you know, you want a job that someone, you know, they work at a big organization. They said, look, we'd love to have you on me again. I'm completely joking. I'm my own business. I have no interest in working for someone right now. Um, I said, what about me? What if I want a job? And they laughed and then they kept it walking. And I was like, wow. Okay. So I thought about this as I was driving home and I thought my best friend was there with me and we were listening to talk about it. I said, yo, man, there's something I want to share with you. I haven't, I haven't said this out loud yet. I've been thinking about the last few months. It's probably going to be raw. I hope you don't think bad of me. He said, no, I want to say, I said, man, I think I need a new group of friends. He says, what do you mean? I said, well, you know, All the executives I work with all the, the ones who've been super successful earning their own companies and so on and so forth, they always talk about how they have a good group of friends who they're just building each other. You hire me, I hire you, you introduce me to this person, like everyone is winning and I said. You know, in this particular group, I've invested a lot in them over the years. I've gotten them contract opportunities. I've gotten them introductions to awesome people, but they've never actually helped me. And he was like, wow, he actually said this thing. I really love. He said, you know, Alex, you know, when we were younger, time was abundant, but money was scarce. So we just did whatever. Right. But now that we're older, time is scarce and money is more abundant. And so we have to be very intentional with our time. And we hang out with, I'll say, you know, that's, that's, that's a great idea. So I started socializing this idea when a number of my clients. Each and every one of them, CEOs, SVPs, VPs, so on and so forth said, Alex, this is how I feel. I feel like I'm doing this alone. Like no one is helping me. So over a few conversations, a few weeks of conversation, I developed this three, this model. I haven't come up with a great name for it just yet, but it didn't come. So, um, there's, there's certainly three types of relationships. First type of relationship are detractors. Um, detractors are people who, um, intentionally or unintentionally, um, hurt you. Harm you detract from you, reading, reaching your goals, those, they may be specifically talking bad about you, but they may just be every time you want to do something, they say, ah, you can't do that's too hard. Don't worry about, you know, people who are detracting from your goals. Those are attractors. And unfortunately, way too many people hang out with attractors and that's because, you know, they've known him for too long. They've been my friend for this or my family member, right? Detractors. I don't like those. Okay. Next one is supporters. Supporters are great. They're wonderful. They're nice. They're fun. They're your friends. They, you go out to drinks with, you go on trips with, they're there for you emotionally. They're wonderful. Oh my goodness. I love me a supporter. But they don't help you. They stop short. They'll give you all the advice in the world, but they stop short of helping you. And again, actually many mentors actually fall into the group of supporters. And again, we have a lot. We tend to have a lot of supporters around us. Why? Because it's easy. They're fun. They're wonderful people. Um, and then you had people who advocate for you. Those people are intentionally working to help you be successful. They are introducing you to people. They're, they're, they're buying your services. They're telling their friends to hire you to do, to do work for them and so on and so forth. Those are advocates. And those are just wonderful people. Um, but here's the reality. There are only so many advocates, right? There are so many, there are many more people who'd rather just be a supporter. The navigator word is easy, right? I'm going to say, Hey, great job, Tony. I think you should do X, Y and Z. Tony. I don't got to put my name on line. I don't got to help you do nothing. I don't got to connect make connection. It's easy to be a supporter. Okay, so if we think about those three groups, okay, got it. Obviously detractors not great. Okay, so let's put them off to the side. Let's talk about supporters then and I'll wrap up. I know we're only have so much time. Um, Supporters. Well, why are people supporters? Well, one, the first reason is because maybe we didn't ask them. We didn't ask them to be an advocate for us. We didn't ask them for something. And many times if you're listening to this, this podcast right now, you're probably one of those people who people say, oh, you're that guy. You're that girl. You're that, that guy. You're that you're the ish, right? So people already think you're doing so well. They don't even need, you wouldn't need help from me. So maybe they're in a supporter role because you've never asked them for help. And so when we have to be, when we go into one, understand what we want to go, where we want to go, the internal clarity and ask people for help, um, to, um, they may be a supporter because, uh, they see you for who you were, not who you are. See, unfortunately, when we know someone for a long period of time, they, they, they, they're. Their connection to us is anchored and where we, where they met us, whether we were an intern at the time, or we are director at the time, or we're the CEO of a smaller organization at the time, but now we've advanced so far up, but they don't see us there. So, because they don't see us there, they don't see you as. Tony, the executive, they say, Tony, I'll ask Tony that my, my cool friend, we used to hang out to intern together and so don't think of opportunities to connect you with that. When you ask them to connect with someone, they don't think that you're even qualified to do something like that because they don't see you in that role. That space really quickly. I'll share an interesting story. Oh, when am I someone I knew? Ask me, Hey, can you do Miss solid? I need you to come on the line with one of my, my, my boss, my boss, the executive, I just need you to talk to him about some products. I'm like, yeah, sure. I used to work from the jump line. Um, have a great conversation, talk about change management, communication, internal, external, all the things, human resource that, uh, get off the phone, person picks up, calls me back immediately. Oh my God. That was, that was really good. You you're really good at this. And I said, Yeah, that's that's my job. That's what I do. Of course, because that person did not see me as such. Right. Right. So they saw me for who I was not for who I am. Then the finally the last piece on the supporter piece is that. You know, maybe they weren't an advocate at one point, you know, maybe they were, and the, but then they transitioned to supporter and then they transitioned to detractor. Why? Because they were happy to help you when they were superior and you were trying to move your way up. But once you became where they were, Oh Lord help you. If you try to pass them up, that don't look right. Right. So now they've, they've moved from an advocate to a supporter now to a detractor. And here's the problem is that we see some people that we think are supporters who are actually detractors because if they have the means to help us out and they don't, and they don't tell us why they didn't help us out. The question becomes, what do they think about us? What do they truly think about? And what are they saying about us when we're not in the room? Right. And so this is a big, big thing I'm talking about. We can go on talking about this for a long time. Again, if you'd love to hear more, please reach out gpsleadership. com or. org. Um, bring this, bring us in. I'd love to talk to you about this, but here's the point. If you are at these executive ranks, um, and you want to navigate, you want life to be just that much easier. If you want to be at a, at a Make movements and, and, and, and, and progress on your projects that much faster. Because again, time is important at this level. It comes down to having the right relationships, having more advocates around you. I'm going to say one last thing. I'm going to shut up. Um, here's the problem. Um, when I share this, it's idea is so crazy. This is so interesting. Actually, when I share this concept with people who are at the executive ranks, or at least the bare minimum, the senior leadership ranks, they say, wow. This is really helpful. Okay. I know I need to be much more intentional. My time. Okay. I got this. Okay. Um, but when I share this concept with people who are earlier on their career or in lower level positions, the first thing they say is, uh, this doesn't feel right. No, no, no, no. So you pretend to those people are more, those people aren't important. You're saying those, uh, no, I couldn't imagine, you know, prioritizing my time with, with this person versus that person as a whole. First of all, there's nothing wrong with prioritizing your time. My wife and I have been together for 17 years. We would not have been together for 17 years if I did not prioritize spending time with her versus the barista at the Starbucks. Okay. So prioritizing your time is always going to be important. The problem, I think, and please, Tony, weigh in on this. I think the reason why many people at the lower levels don't get this is because. The more success you have, the more your time has to become valuable because you have more people asking you for stuff. So we maybe don't have enough people in their life asking them. And like, just for me, like the last few years, I had so many people reaching out to me. Even I have to prioritize. I can't call everybody back. I can't do every project with everyone because I have other clients.

Right, right, right. But here's the thing though, bro. You know, one of the things, and we are running out of time, but I want to get back to one thing I want to get, I want to say something about everything you just got from saying, it's very important. Uh, I can see why you're very successful. Um, this is not a job for you. This is something that you're passionate about. You believe in, you provide your whole soul to it. And I can see why that any executive or, or organization that has worked with you. Um, That they got everything out of you because at the end of the day, Alex Tremble, CEO of GPS leadership solutions. Is going to do everything in his power and then the company's power to help you become successful. So one of the things we want to hear more and I want you to give us more. We're going to put your information on the website, but I want to when you finish, we figure out the name. I want to get no more about your relationship model because to be fair and we wasn't running out of time. We that is an area that people struggle. Okay. I've struggled in that area before, right? Because it's trying to understand who you're dealing with, who's an advocate, who's a supporter. The detractors, I think most people can get it. They, you know, but you still, sometimes you think people are supporters and they're detractors, right? So, but more importantly, I want to thank you for podcast and sharing your love, your passion. Right? Educating us on this topic, and we're going to have you come back, and I want, uh, more importantly, to get your information on your books, so we can put that up, um, especially the four C's, I believe it was, uh, uh, am I correct? Um, so we can share it to people, so then they can become more enlightened as well.

Yes, sir.

Alex. Thanks a lot, buddy. And look, stick around because Alex is going to help us close out with our call to action. But now I think it's time for Tony's Tidbit. Okay. And the tidbit today is always a quote based on what our guest is talking about. So the tidbit today is leadership advancement means building not just a ladder, but a lattice of opportunity. The That anyone can climb. Okay. And you heard a lot of that today. That was one of, uh, uh, Alex's pet peeves. It's not just about the development. It's about the advancement opportunities as well. So don't forget to check out this Thursday, our need to know segment by Dr. Nsenga uh, uh, uh, Burton. She's coming on A Black Executive Perspective every Thursday going into the crucial topics that shape our community and world. You do not want to miss it this Thursday. I've already seen what she put together. So definitely check it out. And now it's time for our, our call to action. And I'm blessed that our fabulous guest, Alex Tremble is going to help us with the call to action. And if you are, this is your first time listening to a Black Executive Perspective. Our goal, our mission is to decrease. All forms of discrimination. So our call to action is an acronym called less L E S S. And we're going to go through exactly what less is, because this is something that every human being can incorporate. And by incorporating less, we're going to make some change. So Alex,

you want to kick us off, buddy? Yes, sir. Let's start with L. L stands for learn. That is educate yourself on racial and cultural nuances. And what I just recommend everyone understand your, your ignorance, understand that you don't know everything. And so look to walk through the world with an open mind, ready to learn and consume and just appreciate. Thank you. Exactly. And then E,

uh, after you learn E stands for empathy, right? Since you've now become more enlightened because you've learned more about other people and cultures and racial nuances, now you should be more empathetic towards your new, your friends and family.

Yes, sir. And S stands for share, share your insights to enlighten others. You know, look, when others want to know more about us, we shouldn't expect them to be at a mind read. Like we gotta be able to open our mouths and actual share our authentic experiences. And hopefully they'll, they'll accept it and they can grow as well.

Exactly. And then the final S. is stop. You want to stop all forms of discrimination that walk in your path. So if grandma or grandpa or uncle Joe or auntie Carol is at the dinner table and they say something inappropriate, you say grandma, grandpa, uncle, auntie, we don't believe in that. We don't say that. And you stop it in your tracks. So if everyone can incorporate less L E S S will build a more understanding. World, and more importantly, we'll all be able to see the change that we want to see. So again, tune in to the next episode of a Black Executive Perspective podcast, wherever you get your podcast and you can follow us on all of our socials. Of LinkedIn X, YouTube, Instagram, and Facebook at a black exact for our fabulous guests, Alex, the tremble CEO of GPS leadership solutions for my man behind the glass police, who's making all this happen. I'm Tony tidbit. We talked about it. I love you. And we're out

A Black Executive Perspective.