[00:00:00] Eric Goranson: It's around the house.

[00:00:06] Caroline Blazovsky: Usually anything that's designed to kill something or take something out, can have a consequence, any, you know, we try to burn them out. We try to use the propane, um, you know, the tank with our blower system as we go. But that's dangerous too, because look in your neck of the woods, you can't do it.

[00:00:22] Caroline Blazovsky: You'll have a fire within like seconds of using it and I've had it happen to me. So if you have really dry conditions, you can. Yeah.

[00:00:30] Eric Goranson: So the funniest review that I had that I read on this one, I, where you and I were looking at the product was somebody said, does this have agent orange in it? Like Roundup?

[00:00:40] Eric Goranson: And I'm like, wow, no, not have agent orange speech

[00:00:45] Intro: come on. When it

[00:00:47] Eric Goranson: comes to remodeling and renovating your home, there is a lot to know. Got

[00:00:52] Intro: you covered. This is around

[00:00:54] Eric Goranson: the house. Welcome to around the house with Eric G N Carolyn B. Your [00:01:00] sourcer, everything about your home all week long. Thanks for joining us.

[00:01:03] Eric Goranson: Hey Caroline, how are you

[00:01:05] Caroline Blazovsky: today? Low everybody in radio man podcast land. We are

[00:01:10] Eric Goranson: everybody out there.

[00:01:12] Caroline Blazovsky: It's time tone, home improvement, time,

[00:01:16] Eric Goranson: time to talk hard surfaces outside. Now that we're in a post Memorial day weekend, I can scale. I can call it summertime now,

[00:01:26] Caroline Blazovsky: technically. When is the fruit, when it's the first day of summer officially?

[00:01:31] Eric Goranson: Uh, for me, I always say like, for me, I always call it the day after Memorial day weekend. I go, oh, that's summertime for me. You know, weather-wise, it's usually July 5th here in the Pacific Northwest. That's when it usually starts getting warm for us, but I call it, Hey, Memorial day weekends over. It's summertime and I

[00:01:52] Caroline Blazovsky: call it kids, kids out of school.

[00:01:53] Caroline Blazovsky: That's my summertime. When I see like kids are home that's that's officially summer. So [00:02:00] we all have our summertime

[00:02:02] Eric Goranson: or summer date. Well, I wanted to talk about, you know, you brought up a great one here with hard surfaces, you know, from driveways to patios, to walkways. These can be. A great DIY project. For some, they can be a project.

[00:02:20] Eric Goranson: Do you want to bring an expert in, but I wanted to kind of dive into this a little bit too, even if you're going to go out and hire it done, you know what you're looking for? And there's so much

[00:02:30] Caroline Blazovsky: space outside of. That we really need to address, right? I mean, there's obvious obviously deck space, which we all kind of think about or patio space, but then you've got decisions for your driveway, you know, paper, asphalt, cement, whatever.

[00:02:44] Caroline Blazovsky: And then you've got walkways. Sometimes you have retaining walls and decorative, um, that all kind of go under the paver umbrella too. So lots to do. And lots of things. So let's

[00:02:55] Eric Goranson: start talking about here on driveway, walkways, [00:03:00] patios, anything that you're going to be putting a surface on, whether it's concrete, asphalt, pavers, it really comes down to the base.

[00:03:12] Eric Goranson: What's underneath it. It's just like a road. You know, you see them come in and they're putting their they're redoing a road. Maybe that's got. It's really destroyed, you know, like big potholes, that kind of stuff. That pothole is there because the base broke down. Now, many times that bass broke down in the road from heavy trucks, a crack that happened there and the water came through and it compacted or washed it out.

[00:03:39] Eric Goranson: And then once that happens, you know, enough traffic comes over in a bus out the asphalt or concrete, and you have a big.

[00:03:47] Caroline Blazovsky: Um, one more talking about base. Like Eric knows a lot more about this, but I've seen it done and I've had it done in my own home too. You're looking at like 12 inches of stone. And I don't know if it can vary in what you use, but I've seen it done where you have.[00:04:00]

[00:04:00] Caroline Blazovsky: So you have your surface level, whatever that might be your concrete, your paver, but underneath that you have compacted stone. That's compacted down to like 12 inches, which really thick and people don't realize that you have to. There's a whole process that's involved with compacting that. And it really

[00:04:16] Eric Goranson: depends on the soil that's underneath it, you know, and how much you're doing.

[00:04:21] Eric Goranson: So as a minimum, you're going to have about eight inches, you know, that you're going to have to remove off of top soil off that layer and it could easily get down to 12 inches depending on what you have to do to it. So let's talk about pavers to begin with, because this is really the best DIY project.

[00:04:40] Eric Goranson: You know, asphalt's not a DIY project. Concrete, unless you know, what you're doing is not a great DIY project, but the base comes down to, it affects all those three things. So you're going to have to do the same prep work, no matter what surface you put over the top of it. But let's talk about first of [00:05:00] why you see failures in, you know, a, a paver type road, paver roads have been around.

[00:05:09] Eric Goranson: Since, you know, 2,500 BC out there, they have been around for forever. You know, you see Roman roadways that are still in use and in place today in Europe, there were put in out of a cobblestone type road, but it comes down to how you build the base underneath it. So you have different ways of failing. You know, I'm sure you've seen a, a, a patio or a driveway that had pavers in it.

[00:05:41] Eric Goranson: That just didn't go well. Right. '

[00:05:45] Caroline Blazovsky: cause I've got some good descriptions of bad paver jobs, but I'm sure you have, so give one that you've seen of how it looks when a paver job or a con anything goes badly. Yeah.

[00:05:55] Eric Goranson: So you think about it. Um, there's multiple reasons for failure. [00:06:00] A lot of it is like, if you have a vertical failure where it's moving around, it's lifting up almost every time.

[00:06:08] Eric Goranson: That's because you didn't put, you put down too much sand underneath that. So you only want a maximum amount about three quarters of an inch of sand underneath that. Pick a sand is really good. It's non-organic with, there's no rigidity to it, even when it's compacted because it's sand. So what can happen is, is that you can, if you have too much sand, you can have it on a patio where maybe you've got a chair leg or something on it, and that will kind of push and displace the sand and lift the other edge up, start to get wavy.

[00:06:43] Eric Goranson: Yeah. So you get that wavy stuff. You know, the other reason that you can have a vertical failure on a, on a. On a patio like that, is that your base wasn't compacted down below. Well, enough as well, maybe that sub basis compacted. And so the [00:07:00] next one is, is that the next possible failure have, is a horizontal failure.

[00:07:05] Eric Goranson: So it's moving from side to side. Usually that's you didn't put the right edging on the outside to capture that, to clamp it together. You

[00:07:15] Caroline Blazovsky: need your edging to keep it in. So think about it. If you have, usually you have a different type of stone, you know, you've got your paver on your driveway, but then you've got your edging, right.

[00:07:23] Caroline Blazovsky: That's usually made out of like a, I don't know, it's usually made

[00:07:26] Eric Goranson: out of a contract. What metal you don't want to use concrete. You don't want to use asphalt. Those are really bad edging materials. Those are more prone to fail. Then almost every other kind because they crack, they break, they move. So concrete edging on the outside of your paver or asphalt edging is really kind of a poor edging material for a long term.

[00:07:48] Eric Goranson: I'm going to get the most out of this. What you want to see is more than the L-shaped or, or triangle shaped outside edging that you put the long, like eight inch spikes in, [00:08:00] and that you put around the outside edge. That is the best way to do it. And the secret is, is not to use a galvanized or stainless steel spike.

[00:08:09] Eric Goranson: You want a metal unfinished spike to go down in there because when that metal spike goes in, I want it to rust because it'll compact and tighten up better. So I actually want to see some surface rust eventually happen on that spike for durability. It actually makes a stronger grip into the ground. If there's a little bit of rust on that.

[00:08:32] Eric Goranson: Hmm. Now the ones that you, you, you know, you'll see like the little straight edges on the outside, those tend to push out. So you want to have something that's got a big spike in it, you know, you'll see those. Oh, you bury it 3d. It's just a straight edge. Yep. Those might work on a small patio, but on a driveway that's, that's much more likely to fail.

[00:08:52] Eric Goranson: I've

[00:08:52] Caroline Blazovsky: seen also when people do walkways, they'll have like a framing, like a metal framing that kind of frames up. The shape. [00:09:00]

[00:09:00] Eric Goranson: So that's one of the things now, one of the other ones that you see happening is when they get all wonky is that rotational, like the sand got washed away and they start moving around and they start getting wonky that way.

[00:09:12] Eric Goranson: That's another one. And when we come back here after the break, I want to talk about the debate between regular sand and the polymetric sand that goes between there. 'cause that's a big deal as well. And we'll talk about really how to lay this stuff down. We'll do that just as soon as around the house returns

[00:09:46] Intro: should be allowed. Be so hot.[00:10:00]

[00:10:08] Eric Goranson: welcome back to the, around the house show. We've been talking pavers, patios and all that stuff. And we just spent the last segment, Caroline talking really about. Kind of what some of the leading causes of poor installations of paver patios, and about how the, how you do the base can affect that. And I wanted to talk here real quick about the polymeric sand and if you want to use it or not, and a lot of it comes down to where you're at in the country.

[00:10:37] Eric Goranson: If I talk to my buddy, uh, Stanley the dirt monkey, he's a big paver guy out of Minneapolis because of winters that. They don't traditionally use it because that sand with the expansion contraction and frost heaving will push the poly Sam sand up and push it up out of that. And now you've got these little spikes sticking [00:11:00] up and worried.

[00:11:00] Eric Goranson: It's pushed up from in-between those patients.

[00:11:04] Caroline Blazovsky: I find that it dislodges itself. So we call, I guess, I dunno, I call it like a polymer sand. Same, same difference. Yeah. So we call it a polymer sand. And what happens is, as you get that expansion and contraction, it'll push up the sand and you see it dislodges itself quite frequently, or you get a lot of growth.

[00:11:24] Caroline Blazovsky: So you'll start to see your weeds and your grass. And this can happen after a year of having, you know, a paver situation put in. So it starts to sort of grow all kinds of. Interesting creatures and weeds inside of it and pushes it becomes a mess. And they're recommending we do it almost every like year or two to replace that sand, to keep it

[00:11:44] Eric Goranson: close tight.

[00:11:45] Eric Goranson: So with that movement, that's just pushing it out. You might be better off just putting regular sand. And not using that poly sand.

[00:11:54] Caroline Blazovsky: And what does the regular, is it just typical sand? Like where would you get that? And I know

[00:11:57] Eric Goranson: if you go to a paper yeah, just regular, [00:12:00] just regular Mason sand that you're putting in around that.

[00:12:01] Eric Goranson: Now the cool thing with that is, you know, but here's the challenge zone. This is where the sand debate happens. You also have a hill. It's not like you're dealing at that. So if you have a heavy rain could wash that sand down. So you're going to have kind of a, you know, six in one hand, half a dozen. And the other issue that you could have that sand get displaced with water running down.

[00:12:26] Eric Goranson: And I don't

[00:12:27] Caroline Blazovsky: know that honestly, the polymer sand really works any different because it seems to be the same issue. If you have a paver driveway or any kind of walkway, that's got some kind of incline and you get water runoff, it takes it with it. You know, it's just the process of nature. It's going to keep running through those grooves and just wiping away all the sand and the polymer.

[00:12:45] Caroline Blazovsky: At the same problem.

[00:12:48] Eric Goranson: And that is the one maintenance saying that you've got to be really careful with with these driveways is that you need to make sure that you are replacing that sand when you lose it, because. [00:13:00] Block starts moving around. Now you get sliding papers and you got slide and pavers, and now you're resetting Babers and you're doing repairs.

[00:13:08] Eric Goranson: You're driving

[00:13:10] Caroline Blazovsky: your F-150 big truck down your driveway, which puts a lot of tonnage on top of those pavers. And guess what you're going to eventually, if you don't have it, push them on top of each other to the sides.

[00:13:22] Eric Goranson: And so now you're displacing them. So that's a big one there. So you just gotta be careful with the freestyle.

[00:13:27] Eric Goranson: You know, if you're in a freestyle area and it's fairly flat, I probably would just use regular sand in that space. Interesting. Just because that seems to make more sense. That's what I would do now. Let's talk about the base and stuff for setting these in, because here's what happened. You know, this is where shortcuts get taken with homeowners and contractors is it's all about that base.

[00:13:52] Eric Goranson: Most of the time, it is a song got to get in there and, and, and you see people on a little [00:14:00] patios, they'll come in there with a shovel. I mean, maybe you get the excavator or the, or the, or the, uh, Bobcat in there, but you've got to remove probably eight to 10 inches of bay. Um, to make room for that base down there.

[00:14:13] Eric Goranson: And you had that problem with the job that you hired out, didn't you where they just weren't doing the pragmatic bunch of

[00:14:18] Caroline Blazovsky: contractors. I call them the. That liked to come around and they pick a neighborhood and they say, oh, this looks like a nice neighborhood. We're going to ask everyone in the neighborhood if they want their driveway done.

[00:14:28] Caroline Blazovsky: And they'll say, oh, go look at XYZ neighborhood. We did all these wonderful Peever driveways. We'll do yours will be over the moon. They said over the moon with us. And the first thing we noticed, we said, you know, we wanted to do a paper driveway. I'm going like, okay. They were laying the Belgian block with just a thin level of cement.

[00:14:48] Caroline Blazovsky: So that. Your, you know, your corner, your edging was your Belgium block. And they were just putting it down with like a thin layer of cement and then the Belgium block. And that was never going to hold. You needed to have eight inches of base under that Belgium [00:15:00] block to begin with before you even laid your pavers.

[00:15:02] Caroline Blazovsky: So they had to get kicked off the property. They had to go.

[00:15:05] Eric Goranson: Yeah. And here's, here's my rule. Someone is knocking on my door. I generally don't have no,

[00:15:12] Caroline Blazovsky: you, you made the why we did this. Don't ask me why. I think we got sucked in, cause it was a convenience factor, right? They were there. They were doing 12 driveways in the neighborhood.

[00:15:21] Caroline Blazovsky: Everybody you figure, oh, they're not going to do it wrong.

[00:15:24] Eric Goranson: Ron. Yeah, I always, yeah, I do not do the, if you're knocking on my door, you've just about guaranteed that I am not going to be buying anything from you. Uh, just because most of the other good contractors out there that do this stuff or be. And they've got better marketing techniques and to come around and go, Hey, I was in the neighborhood.

[00:15:47] Eric Goranson: I mean, I had to call the police that one time and I had the guy removed off my property, you know, it's, it's crazy. It's crazy. And I it's. Yeah, but here's the thing. So you got to get down there and get that base and then [00:16:00] they. After they dig the base out, then you gotta get the compactor in there and you want that sub based material, which is that Virgin earth to get packed up.

[00:16:09] Caroline Blazovsky: I like the compactor. That's like my favorite, like when they come with the compact, it's called like, is it stamping? They stamp it

[00:16:15] Eric Goranson: now? No, it's, it's, it's just compacting. So it's V it's a vibration compactor. So it's really just vibrating and pushing up down

[00:16:23] Caroline Blazovsky: a big thick base.

[00:16:25] Eric Goranson: So you get that base in and then you're going to come in.

[00:16:29] Eric Goranson: And it's depending on what, what you're using down as the sub-base material, beyond that. So that base now you're going to come in and they call it different things around the country. But what it is is that it's a recycled three-quarter-inch. But it has all the fines and stuff in it as well. That way it can compact.

[00:16:49] Eric Goranson: So I you'll hear it in certain parts of the country. They'll call it level five. You'll hear it called, um, just road base. You know, there's lots of different words for it, [00:17:00] but it is a three quarter kinda minus, but it's got all that stuff in it. That'll compact it, I

[00:17:06] Caroline Blazovsky: call it fine gravel, but you know, I'm

[00:17:08] Eric Goranson: being, yeah.

[00:17:11] Eric Goranson: Yeah, that the key is that, that you need to have that three-quarter in there to give it some strength to it. So with that, you're going to come in and I want to see that done probably twice. So if you're coming in with another, maybe you're putting six inches of that and I want to see him come in, but three inches in compact, it put another three inches in.

[00:17:34] Eric Goranson: Amen. And so then you're going to have, from there on up, you can't really have. More than an inch of space between that and the bottom of the block. That's going to be your paver block that goes in there. So the next thing is, is you're going to see him after that's all compacted, ready to go. Then they're going to slay down probably three quarter inch pipes, because those have about a one inch [00:18:00] side on the outside.

[00:18:01] Eric Goranson: Those are going to be your depth chart for screening. So what they do is a lay those pipes down in the middle of it. They'll come in with the. And then they'll screed that. So they'll take like a two by four or a level or whatever they're using to scrape that off. So you have an even three quarter to one in.

[00:18:21] Eric Goranson: Base that's now that sand base, that's what the block's going to set on. Now we come back, I'm going to tell you about the secrets of land that blocked down from here, because this is where the key is to get this laid out straight. We'll do that just as soon as we're out of the house from

[00:18:52] Intro: Hey guys, you're listening to

[00:18:53] Eric Goranson: around the house with Eric, Jean Caroline, B I'm Zeke sky. And I'm going to show you how to shred it out

[00:18:58] Intro: while you're building it up.[00:19:00]

[00:19:07] Eric Goranson: welcome. Back to the round, the house show we've been talking about doing that paver driveway patio wall. And, uh, we've been trying to go through Caroline and I have been trying to go through and help you with some of those decision-making processes of how this goes. So whether or not you're hiring it or you're going to do it yourself, you've got the right information to make sure that, uh, you've got the right people coming up to do the job, or you've got the right skills to be able to do it.

[00:19:33] Intro: And it looks so

[00:19:33] Caroline Blazovsky: nice. Like there are so many just to talk on the aesthetics a little bit, because we're talking about how to construct it, but it's amazing now the color tone. The different variants and stone, the designing, you know, your pavers used to be so boring back in the day, it was like, The

[00:19:51] Eric Goranson: typical three concrete looking and just, or that bright red, and that was it

[00:19:56] Caroline Blazovsky: like number, I was like sorta, they also had that blue, gray, or then you had that [00:20:00] reddish

[00:20:00] Eric Goranson: and then

[00:20:01] Caroline Blazovsky: yeah.

[00:20:02] Caroline Blazovsky: Now they have like, I mean, I mean, even just. You know, if you're doing steps or you're doing anything, you know, coming up to your porch area, they have the incredible colors. Now we have, like, my driveway happens to be a beige and a tope. And I mean, it's hot looking. It's a sexy driveway you pull in and you see it.

[00:20:18] Caroline Blazovsky: And it's just, it it's really eye-catching. And then it opens up to like ours. Big area where you can have loungers and a sit area. And like, it's, it becomes a place where we actually do a lot of activities, recreation and cornhole. And so it's not just a driveway. It really becomes more than that. So it's incredible what you can do.

[00:20:36] Eric Goranson: That's cool. That's cool. Well, when we left off going into the last break, we were talking about laying the sand in which is that last bit before you start setting blocks and you don't want to have more than an inch on there of, of . And so I talked about putting down the, you know, a couple of pipes down there.

[00:20:55] Eric Goranson: You can use a three-quarter inch pipe in that way. It's got about a one inch outside dimension on [00:21:00] it. So that way that gives you kind of where that is, and you can scream it out. The next secret is after you pull those pipes and kind of fill in where the pipes are. Now, you've got this really flat layer to start laying the blocks.

[00:21:12] Eric Goranson: Now you start laying block. I do not compact the sand. What I do is I wait. To compact after I've got the blocks in to set the blocks. So that way everything sets down and locks in. Now, the one secret to laying block is you don't want to drag it across, right? So you're laying something on a soft surface.

[00:21:38] Eric Goranson: So you don't want to kind of come in and lay them in. You want to kind of click them and drop them. So you're going to take that block, bring it up against the corner of the other blocks from. And release and let it drop into the sand base. Interesting. Because if you bring it over and slide it into it, you're now dragging sand in between them.

[00:21:56] Eric Goranson: And now you've got a wonky surface. Could you disturb the. [00:22:00] Hmm. So the secret, if you watch the good block layers that are quick, you'll hear the click drop could drop, click drop, and it's the click of them hitting the block next to it and dropping it straight down. So it can land evenly on the sand.

[00:22:19] Eric Goranson: That's one of the big secrets to this, and then. What you can do from there is you lay it out and then you have to come back and make all those cuts outside the edge. Now here's one thing. These are concrete. Many of these blocks are so they are silica based product. So do not go get the dry, saw the hot sock, get out there and do it.

[00:22:45] Eric Goranson: You need to be using. A wet saw to do this with, so there needs to be water. So there's no dust. They, they do make very expensive dustless, dry cutters, but, uh, that's [00:23:00] pretty much for the pro. You're not going to see that at a, uh, at a tool rental store, but even if you've got somebody over there cutting, I don't want to see any dust and you better be wearing that, uh, silica dust respirator.

[00:23:16] Eric Goranson: Make sure you're good to go with that water. Not as big a deal. You've got water. It's you've got a slurry. I'm not worried about it there, you know, that's, that's not going to be a dust producing thing cause you're using water.

[00:23:29] Intro: It's

[00:23:29] Caroline Blazovsky: a, it's a dusty project. I mean, even, I think when they are doing it to the best of their ability, there seems to be quite a bit of dust that floats around.

[00:23:38] Caroline Blazovsky: Especially if you're doing a big surface,

[00:23:40] Eric Goranson: like we do. You're not going to see it from the cutting. If you've got a wet sock, cause you're just spraying it. Slurry around that's that, you know, that's, that's the, the wet dust and the water. Cause you've got water coming in. You got the hose coming into the wet side, but it's kind of like cutting tile.

[00:23:56] Eric Goranson: It's not dusty until that stuff [00:24:00] dries up. And then you've got a Dusty's thing to deal with, but that's what you want to deal with cutting those. And then you've got to deal with your edging on the outside to lock that in and to keep it from moving. So you got to get all that stuff done. Now once you've got that locked in from the outside, that's when you come back and sweep in the sand

[00:24:20] Intro: or in

[00:24:20] Eric Goranson: the Palmer then yeah. Whatever. Yeah. That sand polymer. And then you're going to sit there and vibrate it. Now, one thing is if you're using the sand polymer, here's one thing you gotta be careful with. You cannot have any kind of rain before you laid that block down or what. Because here's what happens if you've had like the sprinklers run and it got wet, put the polymer away until the next time, because you are done because as soon as you put that on top of the, of the block, it's dry and right there with the polymer in it.

[00:24:57] Eric Goranson: Now you got a mess. [00:25:00] So you can't have a single drop of water on that. So, and then, then I like to compact at that point and that way that walks everything in and there's a system and that way you're good to go. And then you can worry about activating the polymer, but I like to get that locked in, settled down, and that way you get the perfectly smooth surface, because it'll all compact in and go that direction.

[00:25:26] Caroline Blazovsky: You think just for comparison, do you think doing a driveway with. Is harder than doing a tile job in your shower. You think what's harder

[00:25:36] Eric Goranson: depending on the size? I think there's both have prep, both have complexity. I like working outside better than, than a little shower. Um, I think the, the shower when gone wrong, you can have it look beautiful.

[00:25:52] Eric Goranson: And if you miss certain steps, you've got a big deal there, but both are both are technically different. [00:26:00]

[00:26:00] Intro: Hmm. Interesting.

[00:26:02] Eric Goranson: You know, both are technically difficult. I would say that, you know, if you're off a 16th of an inch on a paver driveway, you don't notice it. But if you're off of 16th of an inch on a piece of tile, it looks like hell.

[00:26:18] Eric Goranson: So that's the difference, right? That's the difference you gotta be careful with is both the attention to detail are big. And once you get a compact and it sat, then the normal maintenance is, is just keeping, making sure that the edges are tight. You've got a good system there and making sure that you don't have any of the weeds and the sand and stuff, moving away from it to keep it built together.

[00:26:42] Caroline Blazovsky: Blow torch meter. That's what I have for my driveway. It's called blue works. Because listen, even if you do a big base and you think that you've got quite a substantial amount of gravel, you're not going to have wheat. They just come up, they start growing in that polymer or the sand, and they may call them there.

[00:26:58] Caroline Blazovsky: And they're just within a year or two, [00:27:00] you're going to have weeds coming up through that

[00:27:01] Eric Goranson: wall. I'll have you still have dirt and dust that gets on there from the cars and from the weather. And then you have all of this that's coming in. That is just. Just the seeds and everything else. It

[00:27:16] Caroline Blazovsky: grows there.

[00:27:17] Caroline Blazovsky: It's crazy. That grows without any soil, but it'll go right in the, in the crevasse.

[00:27:21] Eric Goranson: When you think about it. I mean, if you take how many times, you know, in the hydroponic stuff where they have the seed that goes in the mesh and then the seed pops out, it just grows. It's got sunshine and water. It's good.

[00:27:33] Eric Goranson: That's your walkway? So pretty cool. So, Hey,

[00:27:38] Caroline Blazovsky: talk about, we were talking about different techniques for dealing with weeds. And different products.

[00:27:45] Eric Goranson: Oh, yes. We're going to talk about that. When we come back, let's talk about that. When we come back here, because I found a new product that I didn't know out there when I was working on my house, your last weekend that I was like, oh, it's not rounded.

[00:27:59] Eric Goranson: And come [00:28:00] to find out it's kind of interesting. And, uh, it's something that, uh, seems to be a little healthier, an option than a coming out there. And then I'm also going to talk about that review. That was funny too. I think that's a good one. We'll do that when we come back and then we're going to talk about some retaining wall stuff too.

[00:28:19] Eric Goranson: We'll do that just as soon as around the house returns.[00:29:00]

[00:29:04] Intro: Hi, everybody.

[00:29:05] Eric Goranson: I'm already command from even numbers down. And you're listening to around the house

[00:29:11] Intro: with Eric G and the beautiful Caroline.

[00:29:15] Eric Goranson: Welcome back to the round, the house show, or we've been talking about all those different things you can do with pavers and patios and, and all of that. And you know, when we were going on.

[00:29:27] Eric Goranson: Break here. There's one thing I want to talk about before we get into weed control that I just want to talk about to kind of finalize our little talk about the patio flat services is that, you know, pavers are an expensive option. It looks cheap when you're looking at a little block, but by the time you buy all that stuff, that can be more expensive than, than concrete and asphalt is probably your least expensive option out of that.

[00:29:50] Eric Goranson: Right. You know, when you comes down to it. So I love concrete, but like for instance, I have an asphalt drive. It has done great. You know, it's [00:30:00] was put in in 1977, it looks like it's been there the entire time. But the problem I have is I've got these big tree roots. And so I have a very wavy driveway because I have 200, 300 year old trees that the roots are getting bigger and bigger and bigger pushing the driveway up more and more and more,

[00:30:20] Caroline Blazovsky: or you get cracks.

[00:30:21] Caroline Blazovsky: You know, you may not even get the wave like Eric has, but you know, if you do have trees in the property, eventually get the cracks. And, you know, you do have to seal it. And then every time you seal every year or every other year, then, you know, you just get the same issue that occurs. So I, listen, I had asphalt for years.

[00:30:37] Caroline Blazovsky: I don't even know it was, you know, 17 years. And I decided to go to pavers because I liked the look of it. I thought it would be a little bit more substantial. It was, I mean, costs, it's not cost prohibitive. So if you're looking at pavers are going double, what an asphalt would be by, you know, and then some.

[00:30:56] Eric Goranson: But, and so, you know, mine, um, mine, I have to [00:31:00] do some serious. I have one tree that'll have to come out when I redo my driveway, just because one it's not looking great. I think I got to get an arborist out to take a peek at it, but, uh, that's a process to do that, but it's the major offender in pushing up the driveway and stuff out there.

[00:31:15] Eric Goranson: So it's going to be the battle that we have to go to.

[00:31:18] Caroline Blazovsky: You have some parameters though, like you can't just take down trees. I know, depending on certain areas, you can't just remove a tree and even in certain areas in the Northeast, you know, there's guidelines. So what do you do if it's causing an issue with your driveway?

[00:31:31] Caroline Blazovsky: How do you counteract that? Without it being,

[00:31:34] Eric Goranson: I would almost have to come in here and if I wanted that tree was going to leave is going to stay there and I can't remove it. I would probably have to come in, raise that surface up. Which isn't great because it's all well, and on top of that, it comes down to my house.

[00:31:53] Eric Goranson: So it goes down to that. And so that tree is going to be a problem. But the good news is I think that tree is he's got some [00:32:00] disease issues with it. I think it's got root rot is my. I'll get the arborist out to come write a report. We'll have to do some tests before it comes down, but that's going to be a four or $5,000 tree to take down.

[00:32:12] Eric Goranson: And then I'm going to have to pay the arborist to, to make the argument that it has to come down. And then I have to go talk to the city and say, Hey, it's an emergency. And I mean, it's a process I have to put up. Uh, there'll be notifications that go on the yard that says what treat is. Um, there could be a public hearing on removing the tree.

[00:32:32] Eric Goranson: I'm not kidding. Sounds like a

[00:32:34] Intro: lot of money

[00:32:36] Caroline Blazovsky: check.

[00:32:37] Eric Goranson: Yeah. So anyway, that's just kind of, kind of what it is. So when you and I were talking about, you know, I had to go out and I had some nauseous weeds in the, in the front property of my house and I talked to my garden experts and they're like, well, we really like you to use.

[00:32:57] Eric Goranson: You know, the greener stuff like you do, [00:33:00] but they said you need to go in there and really nuke this stuff because it takes something hardcore. So I went and I didn't buy Roundup for this the way

[00:33:09] Caroline Blazovsky: fussy. What the official name?

[00:33:11] Eric Goranson: Yeah, glyphosate. I went and used a different product, which is Ortho's ground clear, which is their.

[00:33:23] Eric Goranson: Product. It's what I would call the, the alternative there's is a much healthier version to use on your, on your ground, around your house.

[00:33:33] Caroline Blazovsky: Yeah. And we looked it up, we researched it and it seemed to be a less toxic if you will, than some of the alternatives

[00:33:43] Eric Goranson: I liked about it, which was cool as it's, it's rated first off by the OMR I listed for organic use.

[00:33:51] Eric Goranson: Which of course Klyce glycinate is not, Roundup is not organic use. And then [00:34:00] the other thing is, is this is an ammonium nano nut. And I can't even say this word, not an eight, I'm going to butcher it. And I know there's people out there that are chemists going. You can't even say that right. You're right. I can't.

[00:34:14] Eric Goranson: Uh, but anyway, that's the active agreement ingredient in it and it works really well for. You know, going through, I'll let you know here, it wilted the plants here that I, that I had to take down that are, that are nauseous weed. We'll see here in another week or two, if they're dad, but you could see within four or five hours that, oh, I sprayed that area, which was pretty quick in the world of knocking down weeds.

[00:34:39] Eric Goranson: And I've given my

[00:34:39] Caroline Blazovsky: alternative. Right. And if you, if you Google weed killer and you can use a vinegar, a detergent solution with the. Um, and you can Google that up and to try that those solutions that are organic tend to have to be applied when it's sunny out so that you're utilizing the sun to activate the ingredients, to strangle the weed.

[00:34:59] Caroline Blazovsky: [00:35:00] So, you know, there are alternatives, there are greener alternatives, but again, usually anything that's designed to kill something or take something out, can have a consequence, any, any way you look at it. So, but sometimes you have to, I mean, there's no way to, you know, we try to burn them out. We try to use the propane.

[00:35:17] Caroline Blazovsky: You know the tank with like our blower system as we go, but that's dangerous too, because look in your neck of the woods, you can't do it. You'll have a fire within like seconds of using it and I've had it happen to me. So if you have really dry conditions, you cannot use it.

[00:35:32] Eric Goranson: So the funniest review that I had that I read on this one where you and I were looking at the product was somebody said, does this have agent orange in it?

[00:35:43] Eric Goranson: Like Roundup and I'm like, wow, no, not have agent orange in it. Geesh, come on. People. They don't

[00:35:51] Caroline Blazovsky: know they internet toxic, which it is

[00:35:55] Eric Goranson: exactly none of this stuff you should be drinking, but this stuff is, is a much safer [00:36:00] alternative. Well, I wanted to talk before we run out of time, I wanted to talk about block walls and stuff, and it's the same kind of thing.

[00:36:06] Eric Goranson: When you're getting into a, a surface, like a. You know, landscape block wall. These are very complex and they take a lot of work on the base, depending on the block they're using you. Can't just throw it on the ground and stack it up and put earth behind it and expect it to work.

[00:36:28] Caroline Blazovsky: It's and it's gotta be built into your, I have a few landscape walls that are involved with my driveway and then also in the front of the property.

[00:36:36] Caroline Blazovsky: And they have to be built in properly. If you don't, they're going to crumble your retain it. You're going to lose. I have a huge rock garden. So that sort of in the middle of the driveway, and guess what's going to happen is that water passes through it. It's going to slide all that soil out through the retaining wall.

[00:36:51] Caroline Blazovsky: Slide out your. So, if you

[00:36:53] Eric Goranson: think about it, you know, if you get above three feet, too many cases, you need to have engineering done on that. So sometimes if [00:37:00] you get over three feet, four feet, two and a half feet, check your local area to see at what height that you have to get a building permit and engineering on it.

[00:37:08] Eric Goranson: Now, many times you need to have drainage put in behind it. Sometimes you need to have, um, you know, a base like you would put for a paver. Sometimes I've seen them require con. Um, beneath it, uh, do your research and see what that block is designed to do and make sure because there's times that those blocks is not the right solution for what you have, or you need to go to a bigger block or you need to go to a stronger block.

[00:37:34] Eric Goranson: So do your research. I have seen 70 foot blocks, stacked concrete block walls that are holding up. 75 feet. What? Stacked binded, a railroad line. It's going to hold it. It's engineered for it. So it's a strong way to go. You just need to know how to build it. So like carry that stuff. And to be able to hold it up,

[00:37:57] Caroline Blazovsky: you bring up a good point.

[00:37:59] Caroline Blazovsky: Um, and I don't think we [00:38:00] touched on it for drainage. If you're putting in a driveway or a paver system, and you've got dry, you know, your gutter drains coming down, where do those get placed underneath the driveway or the paver or the walkway, wherever your, you know, wherever you're going to utilize it.

[00:38:14] Eric Goranson: And our last minute here, you should never have a gutter draining onto the driveway in any situation. It's a bad idea. It doesn't matter if it's concrete, doesn't matter, especially if it's block or, you know, any kind of a paver or concrete, never have that go in. That gutter system should always go into a storm drain system that goes underground and way out, away from it.

[00:38:38] Eric Goranson: And you should be also planning on how you slope that driveway to make sure that you've got water coming off of it. Whether it's rain, how's the snow going to happen. Are you going to have to plow things? What are you doing in your area to make sure that that's going to pitch correctly and where you're moving water

[00:38:58] Caroline Blazovsky: and when the, when the underground system [00:39:00] gets designed, does that go under the stamp?

[00:39:01] Caroline Blazovsky: Like, so does that get put in first, before you do your, your

[00:39:05] Eric Goranson: base, if you have to put in, if you have to put that in, that needs to go below it, it's also a good time to put some. Some conduit or pipes. So you can go underneath that area. If it's a driveway, I hear that music, Caroline, you know what time it is?

[00:39:20] Eric Goranson: I'm Eric G Caroline. You've been listening to

[00:39:24] Intro: around the house. .