Tips For Picking The Perfect Pooch with Heather Mishefske

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John Salak: Pets. Americans just love them. In fact, about 70 percent of U. [00:00:36] S. households have at least one pet and about a third of homes have more than one furry or feathered friend. Okay, so what's the most popular pet? Come on, you probably already know. It's dogs, whether they are purebred, engineered, think doodles, or the common mutt.

An astounding 65 million homes have at least one pooch, which means that close to every other home you see has a doggie of some type. We get dogs for all sorts of reasons. Tradition, company, protection, status. Maybe it's good for the kids, or because dogs are so damn cute. And when people bring a dog into their home, virtually all of them [00:01:12] tend to view their pooch as a member of the family.

And a cherished one at that, according to the Pew Research Center. But love, as many of us know, comes at a cost. Last year alone, Americans spent more than 135 billion on their pets, which was up more than 10 percent over the previous year. More specifically, vet expenses on average run about 300 annually for a healthy dog.

But that amount can spiral into the thousands if your pooch needs a surgery or advanced treatments. But what do we actually get from our pooch pets besides a lot of doggy smooches? Well, dogs can fetch a lot [00:01:48] of emotional, psychological, and physical benefits, provided, of course, we get the right pooch for our lifestyle and families.

That can be more difficult than it seems at first, especially for inexperienced dog owners. The challenge is that every person and every dog is unique. Too often, dogs are picked on their looks alone, or perhaps because it's a trendy selection. Well, there's nothing wrong with connecting to a dog because of its looks, but a deep seated pooch person relationship has to be built on more.

There are all sorts of factors involved, and just like people, dogs have different personalities and needs [00:02:24] based on their age, upbringing, and breed or genetic makeup. It doesn't matter whether a dog is selected from a breeder, rescue group, or shelter. Perspective owners first have to come to grips with their own needs, resources, and environment before choosing a furry friend.

And they also have to do some homework to understand what dog is best for them. Thankfully, our upcoming guest is going to lay out exactly what a furry friend can do for your life and how to ID the perfect pooch for you.

We'd like to welcome everybody to what we think is the best part of our, podcasts is when we interview an expert, an authority, someone with [00:03:00] great insights on a particular issue. And obviously, since we're talking about pets, and particularly dogs, we are going to introduce, Heather Mischewski.

Heather is incredibly qualified and experienced when it comes to dogs. She's a certified dog trainer. She is also the owner of Embark, which is a dog training school.

And she also has several other qualifications on the dog field, and I'm sure in a personal people field as well. But I want to welcome Heather and have her describe a little bit of her background. So Heather, welcome to our podcast.

Heather Mishefske: Thank you so much.

I could talk about dogs all day. So, I hope that everyone gleans the information that we're going to talk about today. This is [00:03:36] fantastic. I am a certified professional dog trainer. I'm also a certified behavior consultant. And I mentioned those things because our field currently has no...

Licensing requirements. And so anyone can kind of call themselves a dog trainer and so , I think it's important to seek out someone that's credentialed just because there's a lot of information out there and sometimes it's hard to kind of wade through what the internet tells you and so I think seeking out someone who is credentialed and has a certification of some sort behind their name is going to be really important when you're seeking out a dog trainer.[00:04:12]

The other thing that brings me here is I am one of the directors of the association of professional dog trainers, which is our trade organization in our profession and the association of professional dog trainers. We seek to educate dog trainers that are out there, bring them together. We are the trade organization.

We have a big conference every year. We provide education to dog trainers. Our big passion project right now is just, as I spoke about bringing. Legislation into our field so that there's some kind of core competency when you hire a dog trainer so that you know that the person that's coming to help you with your dog, [00:04:48] or you're seeking them out to do a group class is qualified has the chops behind them.

And so, I'm also here representing the APDT as well.

John Salak: I want to get into some of the dog training issues a little later. And we definitely are. Where is Embark located? And just for background, where's the association located?

Heather Mishefske: So Embark is my own dog training school.

So I have a facility in Eau Claire, Wisconsin. We're about an hour and a half east of Minneapolis, St. Paul. And I have been. in business since 2005 started professionally training in 98, but actually, if you really want to go back in [00:05:24] time I started training when I was about 10 years old. I got my first dog when I was 10 and kind of dove into the dog world then.

So that was a really long time ago. And then the association is located in Kentucky. We have about 4, 000 members that are in the APDT. And so, we kind of span the United States really, because it is our trade organization for dog training.

John Salak: I grew up with dogs and my daughter loves dogs. She's, gotten several rescue dogs. We've gotten both rescue dogs and bought from breeders over the years.

When someone comes into our house, we kind of recognize somebody as a dog person or not right away. And can someone be a dog person? And if so, [00:06:00] what does that mean?

Heather Mishefske: Gosh, that's interesting question because we actually have had staff that have come in with no dog experience, which kind of blows my mind and they're just a natural with dogs. So I always credit myself to my genetics because both of my grandmothers who have since been passed away, but they are both huge animal lovers.

And I think, if your family had dogs it's something that you've had in the home, you're comfortable with, it's something that you find, they have a lot of benefits that we're going to talk about today. And so I think there are people that are just natural born dog people, but on the flip side of that, I do think that there are people [00:06:36] that maybe.

have never had a dog and then maybe cautiously bring one into their lives and then kind of become dog people. I mean, we've had a lot of people in classes that are, retired and they've maybe said, gosh, I've never had a dog, but I feel like now is the time I can really commit. to the training and the walking and all of those pieces.

And so they bring a dog into their home and then they think, I've had a lot of people say, holy cow, I can't believe I've never done this before. It's so fantastic to share your life with a creature. So that's hard to say. I do think there are some people that are just not animal people in general.

Maybe there's a [00:07:12] lot of things that come with caring for an animal and not all of them are pleasant. Cleaning up after them and house potty training a puppy, perhaps, if you get a puppy. So I think that sometimes people will shy away from the more of the husbandry aspect, but I do think people are born dog people or not.

John Salak: Certainly there's been a lot written about the benefit of pets in general.

What are the benefits in sort of either on a physical or emotional level?

And we're talking about not necessarily therapy pets, although dogs. Could be a therapy dog without meaning to.

Heather Mishefske: Yeah, we always say that all of our dogs have a side job as our [00:07:48] own therapy dogs, right? Even if they're not certified. Yeah, I think the... List is kind of endless oftentimes on the benefits that they can provide and we know, I mean, literature has told us that there are physical benefits from having animals in your house or dogs in particular.

There are emotional benefits. There are physical benefits. there's just a host of things that kind of go for caring for an animal. And so, the dogs get you out, they get you moving. They, oftentimes have to go for walks during the day, whether it's for exercise or for enrichment or just for a potty break [00:08:24] which.

For some people kind of forces them to get up in the morning where they have an animal in their house and they have to go outside. So I think that's one that I think a lot of people look at. And then I think you kind of hit on the second piece of that the emotional piece of it. Years ago, I saw some kind of meme.

Like if you took your significant other and your dog and. , put them in your trunk and then when you open the door, who would be happy to see you? Well, I guarantee you it's probably not your significant other

John Salak: Right. Exactly. Exactly

Heather Mishefske: But your dog's gonna be really excited to see you and what a happy thing to come home to. You've You've a hard [00:09:00] day at work all day or you just had like a tough meeting or a friend you had lunch with that was emotional and you come home and seeing This creature that's, practically out of their body being happy to see you.

And that's something we don't get from our friends or our children. Oftentimes, maybe we get a quick hug and like, Hey, welcome home. But not, 10 minutes of just, , exuberant happiness that you were missing for a full hour and you've just returned to the house. And I think,

what a fantastic cascade of all those feel good hormones. And we know that, right? The literature tells us that you get the dopamine hits and the oxytocin and all the feel good,[00:09:36] neurotransmitters when we interact with something that loves us that much. So I think The big pieces that I think people often pick out of dog ownership are really that emotional connection, that physical connection, and I think the emotional piece is one that, I mean, we could spend, probably hours talking about that that, , we take our dogs out for a walk.

Well, we know that exercise is a good stress reducer. So. That ties into we're walking our dogs. We've had a stressful day Maybe our walk out in nature is a way for us to reduce stress. It's helping our dog which Decreases our anxiety depression and loneliness [00:10:12] just kind of overall health really So I think there's so many pieces that just having a dog is Good for your health in general .

John Salak: You have probably dealt with a range of animals in your lifetime.

I mean, from dairy cows to other horses and do you think dogs are more emotional than other animals or it's just that we perceive them to be more emotional because you're not going to come home over the door and a cow is going to be in your dining room.

Heather Mishefske: Yeah. I mean, that would be a problem, but it would

John Salak: be a problem.

Yes. It would be a very big problem. I

Heather Mishefske: mean, when we talk about the tasks of cleaning up after them, that's

John Salak: exactly, I didn't want, I didn't want to go [00:10:48] there with that. Yeah.

Heather Mishefske: All right. That's an interesting question. I do think that, there's a lot of really cool research coming out in a lot of the big universities have canine cognition labs.

And we're really kind of, I think just at the cusp of diving into the emotional lives of animals and what they really feel. And I think like any of us that have had an animal anecdotally know that, they do have really intense feelings and that emotions are so at play when they interact with us.

And I would say that my horse friends and my cat friends as well, would say, well, our animals have intense emotion as well. And I think we knew this, for those of us that [00:11:24] interact a lot with animals, I think now we finally have, pieces that we're finding out via the research, of course.

So, I think that it's one of those things where animals kind of will mimic our emotions a lot of the times, too. And I think that is how we build relationships with any creature. And so having that where they're kind of coming back and supporting our emotions, I guess is something. And some interesting research that's coming out in that world too.

And I think it's anecdotally things that we've already known, but now we're seeing it. Which is. Quite fantastic.

John Salak: And with this, [00:12:00] before I forget, because I have this discussion with my wife all the time, who didn't grow up with dogs, but is now a dog lover. And has transformed into a big dog person. When a dog licks your face, what is it saying?

Yeah. Because we've done research on this and it's everything from, well, it's a nervous tick to it's affection to know it's not affection. So what do you think that means? Cause some dogs are big lickers.

Heather Mishefske: Yeah. I think you're right with all those things. I mean, the hard part about body language is that we look at the bigger picture, so maybe they're licking, but then what's going on with the rest of their body.

So what is their tail doing? Are they stiff when they're doing it? Is their body wiggly? So we look at all those [00:12:36] pieces of what else is going on in their body, essentially. So I think licking, one of the things that we look at when we look at that face, especially faces for dogs, is it's often an appeasement signal.

So They're trying to appease you in some sort whether they're worried about something or they're happy, I guess that would depend oftentimes on what the rest of their body is doing. Okay. And some of the dogs will do it as like a self soothing behavior, so they will lick part of you, like legs or feet, a lot of dogs do that, as like an appeasing kind of a gesture for dogs.

John Salak: Okay, we have that on [00:13:12] the record now, I'm gonna go back to my wife with that. We talked about the benefits of dogs on an emotional level, on a physical level. Does this change with age, either the dog's age or the person's age or both?

Heather Mishefske: Gosh, I think so. I think, we get pets for a multitude of reasons throughout our lifetime. So, we have anything from , a lot of people are, maybe they're in their 20s, they're moving out of home, this is their first pet they're going to get, and maybe they're getting a pet so they can hike, and they can go to the brewery, and they can hang, and they can have someone to walk, or, a lot of...

Single women will get a dog just to have something in their house and have something that they can walk with at night. [00:13:48] And so maybe their parameters for what they're looking for could be different than maybe someone who's retired, who's looking for a dog to take a walk with the dog, to like be at home with them when maybe they were in a very social setting, , with a career that they had.

So I think the reasons for getting them can probably vary quite a bit. And what goes with that is the age as well. I mean, we know that, younger dogs, especially those first three years, because dogs aren't really fully developed physically, emotionally, until they're about three years old.

Those first couple of years are a lot higher requirements. I guess I would say in terms of. Exercise [00:14:24] and needs being met and training, like all of that is kind of compressed in those first couple of years. So I think when people look at dogs, they might look at younger dogs needing more time, more resources, perhaps.

And then maybe an older set of dogs, maybe resources in terms of time isn't maybe as important, perhaps, because they're sleeping more. They don't have maybe the exercise requirements that a young dog might. So I think those are all pieces to really consider. And there's always the dog outside of the curve, right?

There's always the dog that is 10 and they still require quite a bit of exercise and [00:15:00] have behaviors that are more like a younger dog. So I think finding something that is a good mesh with your lifestyle, your resources, your needs always just so important to really kind of facilitating the best relationship you can have with them.

John Salak: I want to get into now, like picking dogs or choosing a dog or sometimes a dog chooses you to if someone isn't super familiar with a dog, but they recognize the benefits, maybe they're older, or maybe it could be a young woman or young man who really is in an apartment or a flat by themselves and they want it for company or whatever.

Seeming protection or alertness or [00:15:36] something. How do they go about choosing a dog if they're not familiar? I mean, what are the steps they need to think about because it's easy to go either to a breeder or a shelter And say that's a dog I want but you can wind up getting the wrong dog or the wrong dog for you.

Heather Mishefske: I do behavior consulting all day, every day, and oftentimes the reason that I'm sought out is because there is some particular behavior that's going on within that family that they need help with problem solving.

So whether it is this dog came into this family, it doesn't like men, it doesn't like children, it doesn't like other dogs, it's a lot of anxiety. [00:16:12] And so I think. This is hard because I believe the reason people will pick a dog's coat color and cuteness.

So what kind of coat does it have? How cute is it? And , what color is it? That's soothing, I guess, visually but I think it's so important to consider the dog's history, to consider the dog's breed if you're looking at dog in a shelter I think breeders that know their dogs well, I mean, you can tell a lot of characteristics from birth. I mean, I look at my own dogs and I can tell you that the characteristics they had at three weeks old, four [00:16:48] weeks old, five weeks old are still consistent now that they're five. And so, I think one important part That we have really looked at in the dog training world and behavior consulting world is, And this I think is something that everyone really needs to consider because we used to kind of say well a dog is a dog Like breed isn't really that important, but holy cow Do we know that breed is really important to who what your choice is and the reason for that is because Any breed that you have comes to you looking a certain way because they have a certain set of genetics.

And, the breed looks that certain way because they [00:17:24] carry these genetics to do the job that they were bred to do. So, the example I always like to use as a healer, because we see a lot of healers That come through our shelter system that end up in families that maybe sometimes struggle with some of the behaviors that these dogs are doing and not all of them.

My God, there's amazing healers out there but let's

John Salak: Can you define a healer? You mean a hunting dog or is that a healer? Like I'm fixing you dog.

Heather Mishefske: Oh, gosh, that's true. Healer. H E L E R. So it would be an Australian cattle dog.

So you see the dogs were keen cattle. They can move a 2000 pound animal with just kind of a look. [00:18:00] And so if we take an Australian cattle and a lot of the herding dogs, right, we as humans have genetically selected herding breeds. To do a very particular job. And so one of the foundations of their genetics is that we have bred herding dogs to be really hypervigilant about motion.

And so they're really good at spotting motion in the environment and. I think if we look at a dog and we know that's what they were bred to do, we have to look at what environment is that dog going to be in because let's say that you acquire a herding dog because they're really cute and they're at the shelter perhaps [00:18:36] and you live on a corner by a grade school and you have really big windows in the front of your house.

That dog most likely, and not all of them, right? We always have the dogs that land on the outside of the curve, but those dogs are going to be hypervigilant about motion. They oftentimes, what we see in herding breeds is they have a little bit of micromanagement. So that motion out that front window, you could see maladaptive behaviors come out in their behavioral repertoire, which means they could be barking at the window because things are moving past and they need to let someone know because things should not be moving because what were they bred to do?

They were bred to do that as a [00:19:12] job. And so I think that is so important when you look at. breeds. And sometimes we don't always know, right? There's a lot of rescue dogs that we're not really sure. I mean, gosh, they could be, Chihuahua, Chow, Chesapeake Bay Retriever, Great Pyrenees. I mean, there's a lot of things in there, but I think it is very worthy to look at the breed that dog is and look at what was it bred to do so that when you see these behaviors come out, You kind of have expected it because you know that they've been bred to do that.

So I have retrievers for an example. And so Ridge tries to take my shoes out the door every single [00:19:48] morning that I let them out to go potty. I don't get mad at him because he is a retriever. We have genetically selected to be really good at retrieving and putting things in their mouth and carrying them for hundreds of years.

And so we simply just trade at the door for like a squeaky toy or something, and he can take that outside. And so I think that's such a good point of looking at what was the breed bred to do and what could you see come out in their repertoire Based on what they were bred to do that maybe you might not appreciate so we look at the guardian type dogs, right?

We look at not only livestock guard dogs like great [00:20:24] Pyrenees and aliens, but we can look at Rottweilers, and we can look at boxers, and we can look at , Dobermans, dogs that were more guardian type breeds. And then some of those dogs will exhibit those behaviors, and people get really upset about it.

But if you think about it, we humans have genetically selected for them to be really good at that. Now, in the day and age we live in, we don't need a lot of those jobs. Most people don't have border collies to move livestock. Most people don't have, Rottweilers to guard, a certain section of their property.

They just like them because they're adorable. But I think it's worthy [00:21:00] to look at the genetics behind the breed that you are looking at and think to yourself, what were they bred to do? And What piece of that maybe won't be, , amiable in my household, maybe your granddaughter is living with you and she has a guinea pig.

Well, maybe a terrier isn't the best choice, because terriers, they have been really bred well to kill vermin. And so I think a lot of those pieces are really important to consider. And I think sometimes we don't, we just think they're cute. And of course we do because. Dogs are cute and, we like how they look.

John Salak: I knew someone who a while ago, well this is a good 10 [00:21:36] years ago, and I just knew this person, this sort of at arm's length, but, the person who was living in Manhattan, young man, and he got a Norwegian elk hound. Oh, goodness. And it's like, yeah, they're beautiful dogs. But , they're supposed to run what, four or five miles a day. And like, how are you going to do that? Even if you're a runner, cause you're going to keep the dog in an apartment when you're not there. And it's like, it just wasn't a good fit and person got it from a breeder.

And then to me, the breeder should have said, this is really not a good thing . So this begs another question. Do shelters understand sort of the breed and help? I mean, they're looking to move dogs, especially after [00:22:12] the pandemic. So many people got dogs and then they said, my God, what are we doing with this dog?

And they brought it to a shelter. But if you go to a shelter, our shelters. Equipped to help you select the right dog, or to say that may not be the right dog for you. And again, in shelters, you're going to find generally mixed breeds. Sure. Yeah. But you see certainly dominant traits within some of those dogs.

So are shelters, equipped generally to handle some questions or really provide guidance?

Heather Mishefske: It depends. There are some shelters like that I work with that have really behavior savvy staff that can really see behaviors that might be [00:22:48] maladaptive for a certain family.

And maybe they're really looking at making sure that the needs of the dog are met and the needs of the family. And that meshing is a hard task. There are some shelters that aren't equipped. They might not have someone who's got, the behavior chops to be able to say, gosh, if you have a lot of grandkids coming over, this might not be a good fit.

Or if you live in like a really. busy urban setting, this dog might not be a good fit.

I think asking the right questions, I guess, might be the best way to kind of go into a scenario like that.

Have you seen this dog around, when kids walk by it's the shelter setting.[00:23:24] They often test them with cats. They'll often based on the dog's history, say they're good with kids, but , that's a hard one because a dog that is fed a piece of chicken from a child's hand is very different than a dog who is living with a family asleep on the couch and the toddler comes and falls over on the top of them.

Like those scenarios are very different. Dogs that are scared, those dogs need a lot of help, just a lot of health encouragement and a lot of behavioral modification when they get into a home because dogs that are scared when they're pushed, I mean, they're, that's when dogs get defensive, right?

So, if you're taking on a dog that's scared, [00:24:00] find qualified help to help you because that dog could, like, have a fantastic life if we can help them understand that the world isn't scary. So I think asking the right questions of how, and really kind of considering what your life is going to be like.

So let's say, for example, you're someone who through the winter are going to RV and they're going to travel all winter. Okay, well you're going to be in a lot of new spaces. How is this dog going to be, number one, traveling, distances, being in new places every week, meeting a lot of new people possibly encountering dogs off leash.

That might be different versus the person that lives pretty rural and. The dog doesn't [00:24:36] really meet a lot of people. Maybe your grandkids don't come over, your friends don't come over a lot. Maybe you don't have, wildlife around. So those are all really good questions. If you really consider the life that this dog is going to live in and ask questions surrounding what that lifestyle looks like, I think that will help people kind of proceed with kind of the dog that will be the best fit .

John Salak: And talking a little bit about breed or breed history, whether it's a mixed breed or pure breed what's the best way for people to get a handle on that?

Because if you go to a shelter and you say, Oh, that's a beautiful dog or. I'm just thinking it could be a Pitbull. It could be a German Shepherd. It could be a Chessie. [00:25:12] It could be a million different. And it's a beautiful dog. Or, they may not, have a full understanding of that.

And obviously I would recommend, I'm pretty sure you would as well. And a lot more that people really do their homework before they, they do. So what are some really good sources for home? I mean, certainly the American Kennel Club puts out a lot of information.

Heather Mishefske: Seeking out a certain breed

John Salak: or just I want a dog that does this. Should I have a, should I have a Chessie? But what are some other ways that people can understand about breeds or feel like they get a handle on what they may be looking for?

Heather Mishefske: Usually for breeds, usually there is an apparent breed club, [00:25:48] as we say. So like, so with Chessies, let's say for example so the Chesapeake Bay Retriever Society of America has, if you go to their website. Let's say you're looking for a Chessie. If you go to their parent breed club there's always a rescue tab and it will tell you here's some more local rescue groups that are specifically just for Chessies. And one of my staff actually has gotten two Chessies through Chessie Rescue.

In that exact way. And so that will tell you, Hey, here's someone who's your local rescue coordinator. They're going to be able to give you a lot of information about the breed, a lot of information about this particular dog a lot of information on the isms and the quirks and the great parts about this [00:26:24] certain breed.

That's a really good place to start. And let me tell you, those of us that are involved in rescue for the breed that we have are so passionate about it. I mean, I look at my own breed and I've taken in two rescues through our national breed club but holy cow, I mean, I drove to Atlanta to get, like, an 11 year old dog with cancer after Christmas one year.

I was like, oh my gosh, she's coming home to me! And so that's a good spot to start. And there are some rescues out there that will specialize in, for example, herding breeds. It will be a very specific herding breed rescue or a livestock guard dog breed [00:27:00] rescue, or it will be terrier.

And so that's a really good place to start if you kind of look and seek out the parent clubs because those people are so involved in their breed. And they know the breed well, they know the family, , environment that they fit into best. Are they typically good with kids? Are they more aloof?

Are they good around wildlife and other animals and cats? And they have a lot of really good information. Sure. And they have the background of having had multiples of that breed. Sure, yeah. And so they're pretty good at being able to... Taylor information to give you.

There's a lot of fantastic breed specific rescues out there and some of the mixes, now that we have a lot of [00:27:36] doodles, there's a lot of, Aussie doodle rescue or, labradoodle or Goldendoodle. There's a lot of those popping up for people that are passionate about that particular mix, too.

John Salak: What do you think about a designer dogs, that are like a Golden doodle. I mean, they're incredibly popular now, and it's like purposeful breeding. Is it healthy for the dogs? Is it not healthy? I mean, you see chess doodles, you see Yeah. Anyone, you see any type of doodle actually now, but, so, I know it's designed for allergies, it's designed for shedding, but yeah.

You know, is that a healthy approach?

Heather Mishefske: I feel like if you're breeding, your goal in breeding a [00:28:12] litter should be to improve the health, longevity of whatever you're breeding. So, it should be to create dogs that are better than their parents and they're more socially stable and they're more orthopedically sound.

And so I think there are a lot of people that are mass producing doodles for money because people will pay for, those kinds of mixes. But there's another half to that too. There are people that are doing it ethically and they're clearancing health and they're checking, they're doing cardiac clearances and hip clearances to make sure there's no orthopedic disease or the eye issues that you see in a lot of dogs.

John Salak: okay, let's [00:28:48] get into training because I don't want to run this too long and we could talk about dogs forever. A training covers so much. When you start as an owner, whether it's a puppy or a young dog or a mature dog, what are the things you really need to at least begin to think about in terms of training?

Heather Mishefske: So if we look at puppies, there's been a, I guess I'll say myth that puppies are like a blank slate, but they're not right. We just talked about how genetics are very strong. So your puppy is coming to you preloaded with some kind of genetics. And so there's a couple of developmental periods that will kind of fade [00:29:24] when a puppy becomes a teenager.

And we say puppies are puppies until they're about five or six months of age. And then they're teenagers from like five to six months of age until they're about. Two and a half to three. Larger dogs are going to be maturing slower, which I know feels very overwhelming. But I think that's something to consider when you're looking at a dog that, they're going to be in the teenage phase from like five to six months of age until like Two, two and a half, three for the bigger dogs.

And what does that mean? It means that the teenage brain is still developing that prefrontal cortex. That is rational logical thinking is not going to be developed until they're older. So I think that's something to consider because [00:30:00] we think a year old dog is like grown, but it is not, they often go right to their amygdala where the house is on fire when they make decisions, which is.

Which and that's cross species. So, if you look at puppies, we kind of have this developmental period that kind of starts to come to an end ish around the teenage months.

And so, there's a lot of things we want to kind of smush into that puppy experience before they become a teenager. And we focus so much on training, like sit down and come when called and stay put. But, Experiences and building confidence as a puppy are so much more [00:30:36] important than teaching them hard skills.

So teaching them how to cope with stress, teaching them a problem and how do they solve it, teaching them different, surfaces and experiences and things to feel and things to walk on and different people to meet. That is going to build a puppy that is confident so that when you get into the teenage months, you can really focus more on the skill-building.

Now we know the teenage puppy brain kind of ebbs and flows through the teenage months. So some days you get A brilliant dog, and then the next day you get maybe not so brilliant of a dog.

John Salak: Kind of like teenagers in general. Exactly!

Heather Mishefske: And everyone that I know that works with the teenage [00:31:12] population will say, Holy cow, I can identify with that.

Okay. So with puppies, it's so important to find either a really well run puppy class that isn't focused on obedience. It's important that we still teach skills, but we start the foundation for them. So for puppies, it's really important to find someone who is credentialed, qualified so that they understand the neurological development of puppies and developmental stages in puppies so that they're catering and they're tailoring, the training to that learner that's a young puppy.

[00:31:48] And then, the training part, of course, I'm a dog trainer, so of course I think training is crucial. And I think it's crucial because it allows us to live. in this life safely. So, your dog doesn't have to know 5 billion tricks but come when called Holy cow, is that important? I mean, cause that's going to save their life someday.

So putting lots and lots of effort into really reinforcing the heck out of a fantastic recall. And again we do that by, finding trainers that understand how to capture that behavior and how to kind of build it under more distracting environments and work through that skill. But of course I think training is important for everyone because, we...

Look at our [00:32:24] dogs, and we want to take them places, right? Like, we get dogs because we want to go hiking, and we want to walk them in the neighborhood, and we want to go to the brewery, and we want to go camping, or like sit at the park and have lunch. So having, some crucial skills under their belt where they can... Do those behaviors under highly distracting environments is going to be so important. I like a little stationing behavior, like a little settle on a mat where you can kind of park the dog when you don't need them to be doing anything.

John Salak: You mentioned confidence?

So is that a matter of socialization?

Heather Mishefske: It depends so it depends yes but socialization [00:33:00] doesn't always mean and I think this is an interesting parameter because I think sometimes the general public that's not in this field will think socialization means your dogs need to meet all the people and meet all of the things.

And, what our goal is to, that the dog doesn't need to meet all the people and all the things, right? Because, when, You and your wife, John, are sitting at a brewery and you just want to, like, try a new flight of the beer that came out for the fall. The dog doesn't need to meet all the people and all the things.

The you and enjoy your company. And so, and it kind of goes back to genetics, too. Like, a lot of people want their dog to be like the golden [00:33:36] retriever who loves everything 24 7. But that's not normal for a German Shepherd. Like they're bred to be more aloof. The Golden Retriever will meet, someone who is a fierce criminal and be like, come in the house, you're fantastic.

The German Shepherd meets anyone and they will say and they need like three references and I will call you. Because they're a different breed. And so, when we look at socialization, the experience for each dog might be different, but confidence building And socialization, might look like, can you put your body up on this thing?

Can you walk on bubble wrap? Can you walk on a metal surface? Because some puppies will set [00:34:12] foot on that and go, Oh my gosh, I can't walk on that piece of metal. I might die right now. And then they think, Oh, maybe I can. And then they try it. And then they're successful. And then they get rewarded for it.

And then they try it again. So, we build confidence in learners by having them problem solve. And again, this is cross species in the literature, right? Okay. Interesting. Yeah. And so, , experiences where you are giving them choice and consent is probably the best way we can build confidence in puppies.

John Salak: What's the biggest mistake that people make when they think about training?

Heather Mishefske: Well, that, that kind of ties back to, I think a lot of people [00:34:48] push really fast.

We think about our dogs and I always say, the three year old dog is finally mentally... Physically mature, like their brain, the neural pathways are finally kind of solidifying in their brain. And we have an expectation that our one year old dog should know all these things, but , our one year old dog is like an eight year old. I think the biggest mistake that we make is we have too many expectations without putting the work in. And I think that we fail our dogs a lot of the times because we have expectations that now that they can come when called off leash in the fenced backyard that we can take them to the cabin on 40 acres and they're going to [00:35:24] come back to us.

We're. each step of that process is going to be a little training scenario that you're going to set up. So I think we often have big expectations without actually putting the work in and doing our due diligence to kind of get there. So I think that's a big piece. I mean, the other misconception in dog training, and there's a lot of good articles on the APDT website about this as well is we still struggle in the dog training world with the dominance theory kind of being a thing.

And we have really great science behind how learners learn. And that still seems to kind of be the stagnant piece of old [00:36:00] information that just doesn't die.

John Salak: What is the dominance piece?

Heather Mishefske: A lot of people think that in order to be a good leader and to raise a dog that is, socially appropriate that they need to be this very dominant figure in their life and control all of the resources and control all the things in their life.

And oftentimes that leads to more physical training methods and punishment, and we know that. It's easy to train dogs without that, you know, dominant persona over them. I mean, if you look at any relationship in your own life, we get really good relationships [00:36:36] because we have good communication. We are respectful of that learning style, and the learner.

We know that if the... The learner and this could be human, this could be dog, this could be alpaca, it doesn't matter that if that creature or that learner doesn't understand, we back up and we kind of go back to the basics. And I think oftentimes behavior problems in dogs, there is a lot of misinformation that can be cured by being more dominant over your dog.

So controlling more resources, controlling where they sleep, controlling how physical you are with them. And that's just not true.

John Salak: Interesting. Interesting. I've often heard it said that one of the keys for a good trainer is to train the [00:37:12] owner.

Yeah. As much as a dog. and you're talking about that interaction, whatever that may be. That the owner's consistent.

Heather Mishefske: Part of that is body language. Like my consult caseload, we just talk a lot about body language and being able to read them. Sometimes in and of itself solves a lot of what they came to me for when they see their dog is uncomfortable when they put them in a scenario.

John Salak: Let me just ask you a couple more questions. Is it easier having more than one dog? And it sounds like you have about 27 flat coated retrievers.

Heather Mishefske: Some dogs do really well with another dog, and they, or multiples, and some people will try or have [00:37:48] maybe the idea that behavior problems might be solved if they add another dog, but it doesn't always go that way.

Sometimes those behaviors get worse with another dog. Sometimes they get better. If you have a good mesh of the dogs that are in your home and they do well together, then oh my gosh, absolutely. Because dogs are social. Most dogs enjoy the company of another dog, whether that is, the neighbor dog or the housemate dog or whatever it might be.

But there are a lot of dogs that don't enjoy other dogs. And yeah, I think there's also a misconception that Dogs that don't have dog friends don't have a great life and I disagree with that. I think dogs can have fantastic [00:38:24] relationships with just You know if you're meeting their needs and being their kind of social support in that way There's a lot of dogs that don't enjoy the company of other dogs that can live fantastic lives with just their person and not really having interactions with other dogs. Some dogs have social needs, but some just don't.

John Salak: I can't help but ask you this last question. Can you teach an old dog new tricks? Oh,

Heather Mishefske: gosh, yes. Yes. , learning is learning.

The process in which learning occurs is the same across species. And so, holy cow. Yeah, we've had, gosh, I want to say the oldest dog we've had in our kind of like basic manners class was [00:39:00] 11 years old. Oh, wow. Rescued from a fantastic rescue we have here in town that kind of specializes in older dogs and it was so great.

It was a little herding dog and they just came to class because they just wanted to learn more about one another and teach some skills. It always depends on their learning history and their reinforcement history around certain contexts. But, you know, for all of us, we can unravel that. Some things are more work, but it can always be done. All right. Yeah. That's great.

John Salak: That's great. Heather, I wanted to thank you for your time. I wanted to mention that I absolutely know you're from Wisconsin. Because not only by your accent, but [00:39:36] because you mentioned going to a brewery four times in the interview.

Heather Mischewski is again, a certified trainer among many other things, and also the owner of Embark, which is a dog training school, correct? Correct. Okay. If someone wanted to get in touch with you, how would they do it? Yeah.

Heather Mishefske: They can go to my website, which is embarkdog. com is my website.

We're on Instagram and on Facebook as well, or email me heather at embarkdog. com. I also encourage you to look at the association of professional dog trainer website. It's just apdt. org. And we've got some great articles just on general training behavior [00:40:12] up on that site as well.

John Salak: Okay. All right.

Well, thank you. We will definitely follow this up at some time in the future. Thanks a lot, Heather.

Heather Mishefske: Yes. Oh, thanks so much, John. This was so much fun.

John Salak: Before we dish out some health hacks, we want to remind everyone that members of our WellWellBeing community can enjoy hundreds of exclusive discounts on health and wellness products and services from our affiliates. These deals cover everything from supplements and fitness equipment to organic foods, household goods, and yes, even pet care products for our furry friends.

Now, joining our WellWellBeing community is easy and it's free. Just visit us at WellWellUSA. [00:40:48] com, go to Milton's Discounts on the pull down menu, and you'll see the sign up sheet. Signing up takes seconds, but the benefits can last for years. Enjoy. Okay, so you're going to get a dog. That's great. But hooking up with a dog is a serious commitment.

Owners need to realize this and choose wisely. Here's a short list of health hacks, or perhaps better said, pooch picking tips to keep in mind. One, assess your own situation. Do you live in an urban apartment, suburbs, or the country? Do you live alone or have a family? Are young kids or other pets [00:41:24] around?

Do you have experience with big or small dogs of any kind? What about time? Do you have enough time, either alone or as part of a family, to take care of a dog? Give it exercise and companionship. Training is another issue for any new dog. It takes time and attention. Puppies in particular require a lot of both.

Don't have enough of either? A dog, especially a young one, may not be a wise idea. Dogs are costly. Food, supplies, annual shots, and possibly extensive medical treatments can add up. Make sure you can cover the costs. Don't [00:42:00] pick a dog just on its looks or because a certain type is trendy. There are more important considerations.

Besides, there's no shortage of good looking pooches around, whether they come from a breeder, shelter, or a rescue group. Ultimately, pick the dog that's right for you. Do this and you and your new furry friend are in for a beautiful and rewarding relationship. That's it for this episode of What the Health. I'd like to again thank Heather Meshefsky for her time and insights. Not only is Heather head of EmbarkDog. com, she's also on the board of directors of the Association of Professional Dog Trainers.[00:42:36]

which offers a wealth of information on training and building great pooch person relationships. You can visit the association site to learn more at APDT. com, that's APDT. com. Okay, thanks again for tuning in. We hope you'll join us for our upcoming episodes.

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