Welcome to the What your Next podcast today is. Our guest is Amy. We're talking all things cozy mysteries. We've been chatting this on the group chat. Well on our. One-on-one chat for some time. So listeners, we do have a chat. We talk pretty much every day. So this is all we're gonna about. Cozy mysteries, which 'cause I started Zy Mysteries in 2024 and Amy was in 2025. And we both have been immersed as newbie readers trying to read all things cozy. So Amy, tell us what you have been up to.

Hey, thanks for having me. Exploring cozy mysteries. Definitely. I think probably in the fall was when I started really diving into 'em, and I've read a couple on and off over the years, here and there, I would randomly read one, but they didn't really stick or anything or enough to make me like into the genre. I know Finley Donovan, I read and some of those more popular ones, but for whatever reason I've gotten that cozy kind of mood and I was like, Laura, help. Because I knew, like you said, you had been reading them for a while and so I've had the best time just like sampling them and kind of figuring out which ones I like. 'cause it's formulaic. 'cause they are right. They're just as formulaic as like romance books. I would say for the most part it's whatever, they have a cute little hobby or set somewhere fun or whatever. And anyways, they're so much fun, but there's still difference differences within the genre, so I'm, it's been really fun figuring out like which ones I like. And of course I like the foodie ones the best so far. Like those are my favorite, like bakeries and cooking and all that kind of fun stuff is like the best.

Yes. Cozy Mystery tend to, similar to Romans, to have conventions of Romans seem too bad thereafter and needs to have some Romans beats. Cozy Mystery, it has certain beats, it has a sleuth, an amateur sleuth who's trying to figure out maybe a cast, some characters who are helping her figure out the investigation. There's older murder or there might not be a murder, but for the most part, 90% there a murder, and the murder is off screen. So we don't see the specifics. We may see a little bit of blood, but we don't see the goriness of a whore, so there's no

Right. They usually stumble upon the body and it's like already the damage is done.

And they're just trying to figure out what to do. And then, the first book tends to be the person who is accused is either the, or someone close to your family. So that's why they're solving the first

Yeah. Like their dad or someone. Yeah. Right.

And then most of the stuff is about the relationship, like the town, maybe a little bit about the mystery about who sold the murder, but it's not like the central point. And then at the end you don't figure, you likely won't figure out who the killer is because there's no red herring, there's no like clues. It's just like something randomly Hey, it's tied up together. He's the murderer. I just fast. And then you're

basically everyone's a suspect, right? Like everyone that comes on the page is a suspect at one point or another. So they're, like you said, there's no real red herrings. They all are a suspect at some point. And then usually in most that I've read, there's a little side romance plot and a lot of 'em seem to have a love triangle. A long in some of the series, it seems like a long running love triangle, which normally in a romance would really irritate me with a cozy. I'm just like, whatever. 'cause that's not the point. I'm like, okay, you can have your little side romance thing. But I do like that there is a romance angle. It keeps it fun and interesting and stuff. But I was like thinking the other day, and I'm sure they exist, I need to look up. I was like, what about the ones where the chick's like happily married? I like, I know Lucy Stone series is one,

Yeah, we have a

but I was like. I need to find more of those where it's like maybe the love interest is there already together.

Yes. Or they're early on together and then they're just gonna be together for the rest of the series. There's no so the sometimes just the police, the cop, and they're like, basically like they're together and stuff and they're just have a relationship with like law enforcement to

See, I do like that. I like the amateur sleuth is like annoying to the sheriff or whatever, and like it's under his skin. I like that. That creates like that fun like romance novel type, like banter and stuff. Sometimes if in a good cozy, you know what I mean? That's that's fun. It's like you can see he's exasperated with. The whole book or whatever, like she's meddling in my investigation again and whatever. So that is, is cute. But I do like that they're formulaic like that and they kind of follow the same formula and everything is just punny. I love all the puns and cozy mysteries from the titles to the stuff that And they're not afraid to be like over the top and the murders are sometimes crazy where it's like he was in a I think one of the. I read the Christmas Tree Farm Mystery series over Christmas with Jacqueline Frost, and one of 'em, the guy who died, was like in a huge vat of gingerbread cookie dough or something. They're not afraid to do like silly deaths and things like that. And it's fun to see what they come up with. I'm like, okay, then why not? I don't always need to read a thriller where the person was dismembered or something, this is fun.

Little bit of poison. I love asking close your mystery authors. What's your better, what's your favorite way to kill a character, because that's part of their job. Like some people like poison. They learn all about the poisons. Other people like the murder, like Asha and like stabbing and because they have to keep, it's you know how Romans author have to keep sex scenes like, exciting. They have to keep murder exciting too. 20, 40 book series. They need to keep the murder something

Oh my gosh, I don't know how they do it. And I've only finished one long running series, which we'll get to. But keeping it fresh has gotta be really hard. 'cause like you said, there has to be a murder every time. The poison angle is fun. I do like that. That's interesting because that's not something that I've read a lot about in a standard thriller. So that's new for me. And sometimes that's surprising. Sometimes even, like you said, the manner of death can be surprising

yeah. So

it comes down to it.

yeah, and I think it's like a fun little series, like they're low. Little angsty in many ways. I love the hobbies and I love the creative jobs. Like I've never thought about some of these creative jobs that they do, and they're so specific, like beekeeping from knitting, from rent renovations, like all types of creative places. And then also locations. We got the Christmas ones, we have

Mm-hmm.

paranormal ones. We have the we have the ones in the set in the beach and others set in the mountain. It's like

you can find anything I've discovered over 'cause you know me, we're the same a lot of ways with this, with making tbrs and list and like all that, curating things like that. And I've been doing that for months now and always am still. But it's been so fun because I. Can find anything. If I'm like, oh, I wanna read about a cozy mystery where she owns a salon. I guarantee you can find at least one series, possibly more that's set like that. Like they, they're very niche, but like you said, interesting hobbies, fun stuff, things that I never would've thought would be interesting. But when you said beekeeping, I'm like, that sounds kind of fun. Maybe I'll try to find that one.

I'll send it over to you. I'll put in the show

Okay.

There's only two or three books in that series then It was delightful. She's like a beekeeper and it's all

That sounds so fun. That sounds so fun. I know I read one random one that I read years ago. She was like a wedding planner. I feel like that's a popular one. That was super cute and fun and yeah, I think there really is a little something for every mood you're in. When you want a cozy, you can find. Whether it's a long series, like you said, a three book series. And that's the other thing I've noticed. It seems like the series are either, and correct me if I'm wrong, 'cause I'm still so new series are either like super long or they're like three books.

Yeah.

It does. It's, I haven't seen a lot of middle ground.

I it because I think what it is they need the first re, they usually give a through book deal to see if it works, sell. And if it doesn't sell, then they don't renew it. 'cause usually the renewal on three, three deal installments or it'll turn on installments and it just depends on how much they're selling, the books are selling and stuff.

Gotcha. That makes sense. That makes sense. But it's nice because I have started a couple three book series and been like, okay, well I can finish this. And it's like low stakes. I don't have to commit to a 22 book series like I did with Big Shop,

yeah,

So that is nice.

Yeah. Some interesting ones that I share with you is the mafia one, the, or there's a mafia I feel like. So people who are in the mob bus, you're actually cozy. These trees, which is delightful. It's a five month series set in New York. There's actually a bakery that does can like marijuana like. The stuff baking and stuff like that, and it's medicinal and they're doing all this, they're building the Baker Bake shop with it, and it has all this stuff with

I love that.

Dispensary. There's also I've seen a couple h Hamptons, a lot of home renovation and a lot of like

I have.

The Martha Stewart one.

Yes, I think I have Kate Carlisle has a fixer upper one. I have a few of her books on my series. I've heard good things about those. But yeah, that was one that caught my eye. I've been to the used bookstore a couple times and just browsed to see like what cozy come eye. But that was one that I was like, Ooh, I never would've thought. That sounds fun. Like home fixer upper DIY stuff. Like why

Yeah. Cheese is a popular tr if you like, cheese, there's like probably four or five series that's all about cheeses, like cheese.

I did grab that one. I think you told me that was like something Guta the first

Yes. Up to NoDa, I think. Yeah, pizza is another one. So you

the, I saw that. I think you read that pizza one, that Mindy something.

Deep dish murder or something like that.

Yeah, it was deep dish something. But it's just fun to even just look at these covers honestly. 'cause like I was saying, the titles, the covers they're

they always have a dog, like they always have a dog or a Cat. They always have a.

Yep. Yep. Oh yeah. Some kind of animal on the cover. Definitely. And or helping along with the murder. I just finished Darcy Hannah's series the Beacon Bake Shop, and the dog plays a big role

yes. I love that Is he's not a tiny dog. It's like huge dog.

huge. He's huge. Yes.

coming from New York and I was talking to Darcy about this 'cause I actually had a former friend in New York who had a new fee and lived in New York and it was like this ridiculous, like huge dog and like New York didn't, no space for the dog. So I was like telling her, I was like the best thing that what's her name did was to move him to Michigan so they have space.

He had some space to run around. Oh my gosh. Yeah.

Because New York was not a good place. So yeah, so that's like basically cozy mysteries. Also a lot of cozy mysteries are based on holidays. So we have Christmas, winter, Valentine's. So if you are looking for holiday, like seasonal reading, there's so many, like you can

And that's. Yes. And that's why I don't know why I didn't find these sooner. 'cause I love seasonal reading. I make seasonal reading guides all the time. I'm like, why didn't I go down the cozy rabbit hole before this? Because you can get really specific. They, like you said, St. Patty's Day, Easter Spring. Like literally you can find a book for any kind of holiday themed. Event mood. I mean, I have not looked for a holiday and not been able to find a book. Let's just put it that way. They have something for everyone and it's, and a lot of 'em are in the middle of a series or whatever, but a lot of these I series, I feel like if you wanted to, you could pop in and out and read, because not much changes. I. If there's a love triangle, there might be a love triangle in Book one, and there might still be the Love Triangle in book 15. So if you wanna read book 12 along the way, because it's a St. Patty's day one and it's March, I don't think it's that huge of a deal. You're not gonna be like ruining too much.

Now, so we gotta talk about the three series that we read.

Yes.

read, we started, we decided, once Amy join me in the dark side of Cozy Mysteries, I was like, we gotta read some of the popular ones. And I have read Fluke, which is Hannah Swanson's, one of the most popular cozy mysteries out there. Like probably they have the show and stuff. And then Lucy Stone, which is Leslie Meyers long running series again, they're both in the nineties and two thousands. They're early, kind of are the bodice rippers of the cozy mysteries.

yes.

And then we ended up finishing the Bakeshop Mystery, which is a later in 20, I think they came in 20 15, 20 16 era.

you're right. Yeah. About 10 years ago, I think she started

And it's still pretty popular series. It's 20 something books deep. So we talk about this stuff, but we gotta talk about, first, let's talk about Lucy Stone first, because we like

Okay. Okay. I did.

first.

Lucy was great. I only read the first book and it happened to be a Christmas, same one, and it was around the holiday time and I was doing my holiday reading guide and I was like, this is perfect. And there's no real reason I haven't gone back to this series yet. 'Cause I was delightful. I thought it was so fun. And even though it was like 1991 or whatever, it held up pretty well. There was a few little things that were. Problematic. But for the most part, I was impressed by how well it held up and I loved her as a character and I can see why. I don't know. How many books does she have in that series? 40? Who knows?

the daughters get married, so we meet the daughter as like kids, like little

They're like little kids. Yes.

And I think by the end of the series the daughters are married or she's getting, they're getting married. There's like a wedding one about.

I love that. I love that. I'm definitely going to save that series and binge it. Just like I did big shop though. 'cause I feel like staying in the series and doing it all at once is just so rewarding and knowing there's so many books. So that's on my list for some time this year to get back to. But yeah, the first book I thought was. So fun and so easy, and also I love the fact that cozies are short. They are so easy to get through so quickly. Like they're usually under 300 pages, maybe under two 50 sometimes,

yeah. I think maybe we keep lucy stone for next December. 'Cause December tends to be like a bleak month of like new releases and just basically we just venture it out. We're like, we're just gonna spend a

would be great. Because that's what I pretty much did with Bake Shop. I started more in the end of December, but it went into January and it was like such a good way to start the year. So yeah, maybe we do that next

We'll do That

sounds

So we got Lucy Stone. Then we gotta talk about Swanson,

Oh man,

we have thought, okay. I personally tried to read the first one and I was like, oh this is not working. And then I was like, Amy was like, oh, let's just try the second one to see if it would change. And I do not. I think Amy, gimme your first impressions and then I'll give my impressions of Hannah because I have strong feelings about Hannah

You can tell that it's old, that they're old

And, but here's the thing is 10 years older and she's not as problematic as

not as problematic. She's way more likable.

Yes.

a way just funner character. I think overall Hannah is obnoxious. Honestly, I don't know what else to say it. She's obnoxious and I'm is she so popular? Just because there's been fans reading since whatever year that she started this series and they just have forgotten? Or I am, I'm not really sure. I think I only read the first three. The first three books in that series I think is as far as I got. I don't know that I'll go back to it, especially knowing now that there's no ending to the series, she's not writing anymore or whatever we found out. But yeah, she's she's obnoxious, very problematic. Lots of bad talk about weight and eating and food stuff very bad. If you have any triggers around that, do not. Yeah, do not read that series because it is awful. It reminded me of the Sweet Valley High Books when it's like the Wakefield twins are a perfect size six and all they talked about was their weight. It's like very much along that vein of like just problematic and not good. But yeah, and I feel I can't remember details now, but I feel like there was some racism in one of the

Is, well, she complains about the, she, it's early, woke early and she, okay. So I think this is my conspiracy. I think Hannah is maga. I believe she's truly maga. And because she was complaining about some sort of like Native American name that was shipped over. And she's oh, this like political correctness. And I was like, oh, this is like early woke conversation. I would not I was like, oh, she really is in it. She like invested and she doesn't like change. She's obnoxious. She's not nice. She's not a nice person. Like I, I don't wanna, but I guess. Like in my mind, Hannah has a Bible verse in her Instagram account, like decent whatever. And then she's gonna be trolling on the other people saying you hurt girl. You are hateful, you're old. Fuck.

And then you all, they always troll and then the influencers or whatever call them out and say, oh look, they have a Bible verse in there. Yeah. Oh. She's weight shaming. She's weight shaming. But I am somewhat curious. Now, I don't know if I'm curious enough to go back to the series, but I'm somewhat curious to see if how Hannah evolves as a character over the years. Did they give her a better arc?

Sarah, our friend, read a later book and she said that she was still the same. so I we maybe we'll,

worthwhile.

Maybe we'll try the last book of the series. The last book is,

We could do that. We could jump. We could jump just to the end and just see

but down to the end. How is she? We know that there's a love triangle. The left triangle doesn't get resolved or may get resolved at some point, but it wasn't ever

I wanna say, someone said that she gets married and picks someone finally, but I think it was like one of the very, very later, later books.

We'll pick it up and listeners, we'll do a quick video and talk about our thoughts, Mohan, but yeah,

Yeah. Is it worth continuing on or not? But I don't know. And if people wanna read about an obnoxious, problematic character, they have that right to,

Yes,

not really my vibe right

we don't wanna, Y.

there's too many cozy, yeah, there's too many cozy out there that I am excited about reading and too many great series and authors that I found that I don't know if I wanna waste time on 38 books of Hannah s Swensen.

Yeah, I it's basically different values or different point of view, different what we wanna have. There's things that work again, Hannah Swanson would have worked perfectly in 2016, in 22,000. That would have been fine, but I think. Now our values, our worldview has changed, has shifted, and so we're looking for something different. And so in, in the space of looking for something different, we found Jules Capshaw in the Bake Shop Mystery in Ashland, Oregon. And

Oh my gosh. Obsessed. Obsessed. She's like the anti Hannahs one. I will say real quick before we leave Hannah, in the past, the recipes in the book do look good, and I know Sarah's made a couple, so maybe I have the Hannah S ones and Cookbook, by the way.

Maybe we should Doon meals.

Maybe we'll make a dessert or something, because I think the recipes are probably fantastic, and Hannah's probably a great fictional baker. She's just not our friend now. Jules could be our bestie.

yes. So maybe we'll do some recipe. Maybe we'll do a taste test. I'll do a jus recipe and

Oh, that would be fun. I think Jules will win, but yeah I think her stuff just

I learned how to cook with jus. Jules used to give us tips about like how to do certain things, like techniques and everything. I was like, I'm learning how to cook with her.

No, literally, because as much as it's a bake shop, she's cooking too and making great meals. And same I will say that Darcy Hannah series the Lindsay Bakewell, she's cooking and baking and doing it all too, very similar vibes, I thought. And I'm like, Ooh.

yeah, and they sneak in like techniques are like, I did This way. It's kinda like a cookie show. I did

it's

the thing, you should do that this way. You should have this at room temperature. Don't try to do this. I'm like, I'm

right. Or absolutely. Or like a brief history of oh, this is the French term for blah, but it doesn't feel like you're like being like taught in school. It's just like interesting. You're just like, oh, I never knew that. Yes, it's been educational as well. Let's say

Yeah. So Ashland, Oregon is a real town in Oregon. It's where the Shakespeare Theater happens. A lot of the buildings are real, a lot of the food things are

which is so cool.

which is so cool 'cause I'm like, I just wanna go to Ashland,

I literally wanna go to her mystery festival that she does every year. Like it's in the fall. It looks absolutely perfect. What's her name? Spencer. I think that you told me to follow goes and her stories were like my favorite thing. That whole time. I was like, this looks

And like I love it. It's not set in a convention center, 'cause a lot of book events are set in a hotel. Like these are actual places in Ashland, like in the community aspect of it. Like you're not setting in a hotel, like talking to other readers. You're like, Hey, I'm actually in Ashland solving a murder mystery. And

at we're going to this restaurant to meet for tea or whatever. Yes. No, it looked like the best time ever. But she does such a good job in the books too, of describing it and really the sense of place is so strong in that series. Like you really feel I mean obviously we can look up Ashlyn, Oregon and all that, but I'm saying even without that, you really feel like you can envision it. At least I thought she, you could. You're like, okay, I can see you can picture her walking down to the festival or walking to what's the Mary Winsor with Richard Lord Richards

I feel like it's should not be, like, I know she doesn't like him and, but he should not be. It's part of the experience of.

You need a nemesis. That might be one of the things we missed when we were talking about formulaic. The formulaic cozy mysteries is a lot of times they have a nemesis. But yeah, Richard Lore can't go anywhere. No. That would be like devastating if he died. He needs to be there to be like obnoxious and for us to all kind of make fun of him. Right, because now we're in on the joke and it's yes, you obnoxious ass and we're laughing at him. Yes, definitely.

Yeah, so the big ministry takes place when Jules grew up in Ashland. Her mom has a bake shop. She actually leaves Ashland to go to school because her boyfriend broke up with her. She goes to culinary school, then she goes to a cruise, meets a guy, the guy is the other chuff, and they get married. And then he forgot to tell her that he has a kid. So she decided, I.

Carlos. Carlos. Carlos,

gonna leave the cruise ship and I'm gonna go back home to Ashland and then realize that her mom almost got on a bad deal with Richard. She was gonna lose the big shop, and Jules was like, oh, we gotta solve this thing and there's a murderer. And so she decided, you know what? I'm gonna solve the murder. Gonna solve my mom's issue. And then over the course of 20 some, 22 books, we only read 20 because we're listening to the books. We see Jewels go from this little tour shop that is little big shop to an empire with an

Yeah, definitely.

with vineyard, Uber one they got the pizza stuff downstairs. They actually, the two floor.

expanded, they've saved the business. She helped her mom save the business because her father passed away. So it's just her and her mom. But yeah, she helped save the family business and it's like very sentimental to her 'cause she grew up going there obviously, 'cause her parents owned it. And it's a piece of her dad and. It. That part was really well done too, I thought. Like the family connections and showing why it was so important for her to say this. Not only 'cause it was her mom's, but it's well, her dad's gone, so that was really special or whatever. But yeah, and it's been such a good evolution of the shop, her character, her relationship with Carlos, on and off, up and down, all that. It has been so interesting to see over the 20 books that we've read. And yes, we're gonna read them next too, but we wait on audio usually. I might not, though I'm kind of itching to get back to Ashlyn, so I might read the next two. Like I'm kind of, because I'm like, they're not long, so maybe I will, if I was like gonna be snowed in this week and half the country is, that's probably what I would do. I'm not going to be, which is kind of unfortunate. Honestly, I wouldn't mind it.

Have sun.

No. Arizona and Florida girls are not going to be snowed in.

No, but I think we should definitely read, like just get it over with and just read that. I know this year is gonna end sometime soon. It's, I think there's rumblings about it. I have to talk to Ellie about coming on the show and she, I invited, she said, yes. We just have to figure out scheduling and I'm,

You gotta get her on the show so you can ask for all of our burning questions because that would be amazing. I'd love, she is the sweetest person too.

Yeah, but I'll, I love like in the way that you build this like little bite size of a story and over a course of 20 books, you build side characters. You kept a fresh, there's multiple weddings, there's multiple murders, there's multiple retreats, there's multiple ways to keep it fresh and like you're just not always you're, you might be in the ski resort. She took the math backline and basically just did like little parts and pieces and sometimes the dad was a sleuth. It's my least favorite one, but the dad was actually turned out to be the sleuth and the actual the professor who is actually the law enforcement, she has like a couple law

Mm-hmm.

person. It's her stepdad, but he also was best friend with the dad and mom and stuff like that. We see that. evolution with it, like

absolutely.

to her.

That's been great. And her side characters, I'm obsessed with all of 'em. Like the guys that work there, she hired them as young college kids and Stephanie and I forget all of their names 'cause

Sterling

and Sef. And then Andy, love Andy, the coffee barista. And that was fun. There was one that was about the coffee competition that was super fun. I think my favorite so far has been the one where they were opening scoops. I don't know why that one works so well for me, but I was obsessed with that one. That was the only one I think I gave five stars to. I was so obsessed with that one. They're all good. Don't get me wrong, like I haven't hated one. There's been ones that I like more than the others, but I think that one was a chilled to the cone. Again, cutest titles ever chilled to the cone, and then she's opening an ice cream. Store like Little Cart thing hello, how cute is that? Cutest. But no, her side characters, her mom, the professor, Carlos's son, there are a ton and it kind of probably sounds overwhelming, but it works so beautifully and they're all, like you said, slowly over 20 books developed. But you get to know them and what they wanna do and I don't want the series to end. I'm so sad. What's gonna be really sad when I don't, I guess we could reread. I don't reread though. Do you reread books? Not really. I have a couple times in my life, but I'm always like, why would I do that? I have so many books I wanna read.

I only reread on the off-campus series like three or four times by

Okay. I could get behind that because that series was damn

But that is like the gold standard. But at the same time, I'm kind of scared about the TV show just as a tangent. 'cause I'm like, what if they mess it up?

I know.

They did a great job with heated rivalry so I don't know,

they did heated rivalry. Good. So I've heard, I haven't watched it yet. I'm watching the Pit. I don't know if you've watched that. It's really great.

yeah. I think you should watch heater on the

That's on my, That's on my list next, I think after this, after I get done with the pit, because everyone just keeps saying the little snippets we've seen for the off-campus series though looks good. The casting's great.. I, my thing is with that one, because it's so near and dear to me, I, because most of the time when I do have adaptations, I'm not that married to it, but like we obviously both love that series, so it's like you better not fuck it up. But if they do mess it up, I just will quit watching and we'll pretend like it didn't happen. We'll just, we'll pretend like they never adapted.

yes. Yeah so more to come with that. But

We'll have to see. I is that out this fall,

I no, I think it's gonna be coming soon.

Is it soon? Oh my gosh, Laura. Oh, I'm so nervous.

It's soon. It's soon. I guess they're trying to get especially with the heated Ry,

yeah, that's true. The Romance Watchers readers, everyone. Well adaptations are hot right now.

yeah, they saw, I saw like a picture of the golden globes So the off-campus kits and heida RY kits like do together. So I guess they're doing some sort of

they're doing some cross promo, press something together.

So I'm assuming that my Duke Cross, because both were film in Canada off campus, I was in Canada and Victoria. So I don't know I foresee this to be, and it's the same format of like unknowns, like not people, like well-known people and stuff.

right, I like that. And it, like you said, it works for heated rivalry. I'm gonna pray that it works.

Pretty, you watched the summer turn pretty, so it was done by Amazon, so it likely they might have better adaptation than if it was Netflix or even HBO 'cause was created by Canada, not by

I haven't watched a ton of adaptations personally. So I don't really know. But I do hear a lot of whispering when they're not good. You obviously, we hear about it that people are like disappointed in 'em or things like that. The one I need to go back to that everyone keeps telling me I need to try again, is tell me lies. They keep saying that after season one it gets better.

Season two, I am doing, I that like it's so toxic. It's like millennial, like we're older than they are, so our are super far superior than they were, but they're like, the music, the makeup, the low rising jeans the phone, iPhone and stuff like

See, and I love the book. I just couldn't get past like the first couple

No, the first,

one and I was just like, bored.

I was told to skip season one. You get a recap in season two, and then season two is much better. It's a much more engaging. There's like a, there's a really good

I just hate that though when it's oh, the first three books are shit, but then read the next, or like the first season, shit, it's like it's hard for me to get on the drain with it. You're like, okay, whatever. Does it really get better? But you are like the 10th person that's told me like, season two's better and then three gets even better and whatever. So I need to try that. I was just thinking one show I did watch that I liked the first season and then it went off the rails. Was you, did you watch you?

No, I did not actually.

The first season was good and I think it went on four or five, but then I started watching the second season and I was like, oh no. We have taken Joe to a place I don't need to go. Like it's just was too much for me. And I loved those books. I read all of the books. They were fantastic. The audio books were incredible, but like the first season of that show was great, but you just stop. You don't need to watch anymore. Like it's fine. Just, sometimes they just need to let it go and we don't need to make seven, eight seasons of stuff,

no, we

Not necessary. We got off on a tangent there from Ashland, Oregon to tell me lies. Toxic college relationships.

Yeah, we went from Lance, who is a fatherless gay best friend who's rich. I love Lance, by the way. He's

Oh, Lance is the best.

He's so rich and he's so he gave Stephanie like money and they were like shocked it's a lot of money. And there, and Jules was like, don't worry about it. He's not gonna

She's let him do it. He has the money to do it. No, I adore him,

He doesn't care like he's

and I like how they didn't tell you he's rich until pretty far into the series. They're like, oh, by the way, he's, his family's loaded. And you're like, oh, like you knew he was well off, but like you didn't realize He's loaded, loaded, serious money.

Because we were like, at the beginning, I think he had a retreat on book three that he has like a stuff. And he's catering is money's not a money's No object. Whatever you

Whatever you wanna do, Jules. And that's when they're like first maybe Lance has deep pockets, like

Because I was like thinking like, how is the Oregon Shakespeare Theater pay that much like it's theater, like

Right, because like theater, you would think it's like a pittance that they're making. Like you never hear that people make a lot of money in theater,

Yeah, But

But then it all makes sense. His

it almost, and I love his storyline of love when he comes back and visit his family and then

Family. That's a good one. I forget which book that is, but that's the fun one.

revisit his family and stuff, and then the boyfriend, he to like certain things and then he realize, I was like, oh, you're not gonna pretend anymore. I'm not. I'm just gonna be my child. And I was like, Yes, please. be yourself.

please. 'cause yourself is great. No, he's so funny. I love him. And Jules's relationship too. I love how he's always like on her about putting makeup on and getting herself together and, their banter and everything is wonderful. Like I, I love that she came home and then found a good friend in him for sure. And then even the the lady cop that they brought in

yes. Harry. She was like,

Carrie, Ann, what's his name? What's the guy? Thomas, Carrie and Thomas, like I love their little storyline. That's really been a cute part of the series too. And like I wasn't sure about her at first. She was kind of standoffish and like stern and everything, but like getting to know her has been really fun. And yeah, she's done really good with the characters now that I think about it. There's a lot and we like all of 'em. And even the ones we don't like, we love to hate Richard Lord, so who

We do. I think, what's the only thing that's a pothole missing? It's I think it was a book about the cabaret where Jules meets her long lost best friend from elementary school, but we don't see her. It was

Oh, what happened to her?

dunno. But we didn't see her afterwards and I was

I forgot about that because that was cute because her and Thomas were talking about oh, it's so great that she's back in town and yada.

But we didn't see her and so that's the only pothole. They were like, we wanted to see her.

good in a 20 bucks series to only have that pothole. I would say though, because maybe Ellie just forgot about her. I don't know.

I dunno. I think it's hard. I feel like writing a long series is hard 'cause you actually need

Oh, it's gotta be

and to keep

right.

together because readers, not us, we're nice, but other readers are very mean and they go to the author and like, why did you do so and so this? So why you're missing this. But they have

Or you had a plot hole here, whatever it may be. Yeah. They feel entitled to put them down like they could do any better. I wonder, and you've talked to so many authors, I wonder how many of them have to go back and reread parts of their own books to find out what was they do see, 'cause I feel like it, I would be the same way. Like I wrote this, but

no.

knows? I, especially in the long running series, that was 10 years ago, started how. The hell, would you remember you? I think a smart thing would be to do is like you said, make a series Bible as you're writing it, like with all the little like notes and stuff, but who is to know that they're gonna have 22 books in a series when they're writing book one?

it's not because I've talked to authors who have long, running scenarios and a lot of series are bought in 3, 8, 3 installments or six installments depending on what it is. And so they have to build it. And so usually it's not the author building, the author, the Sears Bible, it's someone is an assistant or someone who is like a, like an editor who that's their whole job.

Yes. That's their job.

to have, and some of

I get that job?

you could, you can look

Can I make your serious Bible? That would

Yeah, actually there's,

job, like

that is a job.

on your books.

That is a job like a lot of people need to have. And so you may have this in both in romance and in Cozy Mr. And Long Ron Senior. So you need to have it. I think family too. I'm assuming they have the same thing. 'cause they need to keep

think any long running series, right, you would have to have the continuity and all that kind of matchup, right? Yeah.

So I think I'm assuming, and this one's, because some authors, if you notice, they're long run used, they're not, there's not a lot of details. It's very high level. They do it on purpose because they don't wanna for, they don't wanna miss the pothole. They don't wanna get the reader saying you, this person has his hair color, like Jewels supposed hair color is lawn. But you said that she had redhead color here and. Stuff like that. So they're very light on the details and the specifics and others who are really good details is probably have a serious bubble. And they probably have a, like a beta reader, like who's actually just

Someone who's on top of that. Yeah. I feel like maybe the details are in the the setting and the food and that kind of stuff, because that's easy. Who cares? You know what I mean? Like they're, and I know most of them have a map of their towns fictional or not. Like they do map it out so they know, like when I say that she went down the street and she took a left to go to the Mary Windsor, I can't say she took a right next book. 'cause someone like you said, some asshole is gonna be like, that's not what you said in book one.

Yes. There's a lot of assholes in this space. Just we love you.

feel like they need to tell the author. I gotta tell you that you messed up here. Yeah. As if they already don't probably know, but it's too late. The book is out there. It's done. What do you want them to do? They can change the digital version and update the things, but are they gonna reprint? No, of course not. That's silly. What can they do now?

Yeah. So those are our conversation about cozy mysteries. Thank you Amy for talking all things cozy and going on a tangent about TV adaptations. Keep me posted on, tell me Lies and hopefully.

I will, and I love tangents. I'm always going off on them.

Yes. And obviously we'll be waiting for off-campus series and we'll let you know if you like it and we continue with it, or if we just hated it and we just ignore that it never

Yeah, we might have to do an episode on that TBD, I guess we'll see how it goes.

Amy, tell us, we're gonna find that line.

You can find me@novelgossip.com or on Instagram at novel gossip.

Awesome. Amy, thank you for being under show.

Thank you so much for having me.

Thanks for listening to the What three next. For more book lists, cozy reads and library tips, visit the what three Next block.com. Your next great read might be waiting there.