Three, two.

Good morning and welcome back to Real Life with Mike and Jason.

We're glad that you're here.

Last week we kicked off season four by opening up and asking the big question, are we in the last days?

And what does that even mean?

So today we're taking on the kind of the next topic in our eight part season four, and that's specifically around Bible prophecy and really defining it.

And it isn't necessarily about predictions, even though kind of God is telling history before it happens, but really it's about preparation and what that looks like.

So I guess let's start off with the definition, which really I just said, what exactly is Bible prophecy and does.

It doesn't matter.

So I think the best way to describe it, and maybe you can kick in on this a little bit, Pastor Gene, is what is prophecy?

And really I think the most simple way to put it is it's just God revealing his plans in advance.

Because it's easy for us because everything we know in this world and in our life has a beginning, a middle and an end.

But that's just not the perspective that God has because he's outside of space and time.

He knows the end well in advance and so really he's in control.

But I guess if you could put a definition on prophecy, maybe a very simple one, what would it be?

I'm trying to be more relational in my studies and just less technical.

And so I would just say that prophecy is God's way of letting us know that he's in charge and that he knows what's going on.

And so if that works for the big picture, it'll work for the small picture of my life as well.

So when I'm reading about what's going to happen to Tyre and Sidon and all these other nations and such, and then I look back and that has happened.

I haven't met any Assyrians in a long time.

Aren't any.

Then I think maybe God will get me through this difficulty at work or this little marriage hiccup that I have or whatever it might be, because he's only doing all that for, in a sense, me.

He's doing it for all mankind and all believers, but he's doing it for me.

And so I just need to rest in them.

So prophecy, I think sometimes you certainly touched on it.

I think it deteriorates into a. I don't even want to say technical, but just people making predictions.

You make predictions based on prophecy and that's not Bible prophecy.

And then everybody says, of course the promise of is coming.

Because all you guys do is talk about this one thing that never happens and you keep giving it new dates.

And that's so true.

And it's, there's this date, it's going to happen.

There's 25 reasons why it's going to happen in 2025.

And then it doesn't.

Then there's 26 reasons.

And we just constantly move the goalpost and.

But it's not something God's calling us to do.

It's something we in our own feeble mind are trying to predict.

And what's interesting is you can't disassociate the Bible from prophecy because what is it, like a quarter or almost 25 to 30% of the Bible is prophecy.

It's maybe 27%.

Yeah.

People say 25.

I don't know.

The thing is I always think of some poor guy going through the Bible kind of, yeah, that was some prophecy right there.

I don't know how they get that number, but I think, what's his name?

Oh, there's a guy, I can't remember his name right now, but in one of his books he, he says There are about 500 prophecies left to be fulfilled.

And so I can easily see that.

Yeah, no, that's a good point.

And that's the two different types of prophecies we look to define it.

You have fulfilled prophecy and then to your point, you have unfulfilled prophecies.

Just so the audience understands, when we talk about prophecy that's been fulfilled just definitionally means stuff that's already happened.

So we think of Jesus's birth, we think of the crucifixion, just Jesus alone fulfilling what we call them the messianic prophecies.

And there's over 300 messianic prophecies in the Old Testament that points to this person who was Jesus and he fulfilled those.

But there's also stuff like you said, that hasn't happened yet and that's stuff that's forward facing.

The unique thing about us in our time is when we read the Bible, we have the privilege really of being alive in a time where much of this stuff is fulfilled.

We can look back and see God's faithfulness, but then we look at books like Revelation that from our perspective, it's still forward looking.

So certainly there's an element of scripture that is on fulfilled.

And I love how you put it.

The point is that God's in control.

Yeah.

And so with that unfulfilled peace, man, we mess up a lot trying to determine and put Bible prophecy in scenarios and news headlines that doesn't God necessarily didn't intend for us to do and it can really be a distraction.

So often I think we just need to step back and let God speak for himself and understand that we don't understand everything and that's okay, but he's in control with that.

Yeah.

So I know things like for example, I know that there's going to be an Ezekiel 38 and 39 battle.

Right.

There's Magog and Magog.

But some of the scholars I read, they should say, look, no one knows when that's going to happen and no one knows exactly who those nations are.

So God gives us the big picture.

And then I've been very meditating lately about what scholars consider they call it contingent prophecy, which is interesting.

It's if this happens, then this will happen.

And it sounds a little weird, but then my example is always John the Baptist because Jesus came and he said who was John the Baptist?

And his disciples gave him various answers and basically he said, hey, John the Baptist would have been Elijah if you had received him.

But now Elijah is still coming.

And that's a mind blowing situation when you think about it.

But we hear, when we think about prophecy as a Christian, if you've studied the Bible for any length of time and you even hear about it now just in mainstream Christianity, but we hear the word Israel, we hear the country Israel, we hear the word, the church, we hear the Gog and Magog.

So we have these bodies or these countries that exist today and maybe not Gog and Magog the way we know it, but we, but Israel certainly.

So I guess why does it, why is there so much of a focus on Israel, on the church, on these nations?

And what does that mean anything for how we should be looking to God's word for the future, the human race.

We just can't get it together.

And there's after the Babylon or the Babel incident, God said, look, I need a nation that I can work through who is going to give testimony of my glory so that all these other nations can come to know me.

And so he chooses Abraham, who's actually a pagan.

Obviously he's not a Jew because there are no Jews.

And he says you're going to be the patriarch of a new nation that never existed before.

And, and then you start with that whole history because God is evangelistic.

He said, look, I created man, man is going to reproduce and I need to solve this problem of sin that they brought up and this is the way I'm going to do it.

I'm gonna.

He said in the garden.

He goes, look, I'm gonna have to come myself and die in your place.

That's really the proto Reader Angelicum, I think they call it the scholars first Gospel.

And then as the Bible unfolds, how he's doing that and when he finally gets to battle, he says, okay, I'm going to do it this way.

I'm going to come as a virgin birth and all that.

So it just builds towards that end.

Prophecy is just him being true to his word, bringing the Savior and wrapping this thing up at the end of the millennium.

So did anything happen?

Because we can look back.

The end times like we talked about last week started really with Jesus when he concluded his ministry on earth.

His death, burial, resurrection, his ascension.

That really kicked off the end times.

We were saying earlier, people have always been saying, oh, it's the end, it's the end, it's the end.

But is there anything unique to my lifetime and your lifetime that's a little bit different than the last 2000 years that leads us to believe that one, there's one nation that really is the center of all this and two, that there's.

That anything has happened in the last 50, 60, 70, 80, 100 years that's unique?

Yeah, I sound like a one track thing sometimes, but I think Israel itself, the existence of Israel, people don't give that enough thinking time and say, hey, how did this happen?

How do these people still exist after 2000 years and having been spread over all the world and everybody trying to kill them, how is this possible?

And then if you really.

Ezekiel's not that difficult.

In fact, that's the thing I'm on right now.

I keep telling people, hey, prophecy is not easy, but it's not that difficult either because in the big picture it's clear that Ezekiel says, hey, here's what's going to happen.

I'm going to bring my God's going to bring them back.

They'll be there in unbelief.

Ezekiel 37.

Yeah, yeah.

And that's exactly what's going on.

But they still won't be saved because that's going to take the great tribulation.

And so if I'm talking to an unbeliever, I want to talk about Israel and not who the Antichrist might be, whose name adds up to 666 or when the rapture is going to take place.

And I think sometimes as Christians we need to remember that, hey, we're prophecy is a tool to us.

It's an encouragement, but it's also a tool to reach the lost.

Can I give you.

I remember as a young Christian, I still remember all these illustrations when Josh McDowell, who one time said the odds of Jesus fulfilling even a few of those 300 prophecies that you mentioned.

He said it would be like a stacking quarters all over the state of Texas.

One feet tall, I think it was.

So.

And you going into that and finding the one that had a red X on it.

And if you really start to be.

If you're honest, you think something's going on here, but we make it too easy for the unbeliever because we talk about that.

Not that anything is really minor, but we talk about things that.

And we participate on them when we really read, hey, we know this is going to happen.

Let's not.

For example, I think what's his name?

Big and Rich.

They're a country group.

Yes.

Yeah.

I think John Rick has been ministering to Joe Rogan.

Joe Rogan is getting hit from a bunch of sides.

Yeah.

Wes Huff.

Yeah, Rich.

Right.

Rick.

I There was.

What's the other big guy?

Tucker Carlson.

Yeah.

Okay.

John Rich was with Tucker Carlson and I tuned into it and he was talking about the Rapture never being church thing until the 17th.

What did the whole Darby thing.

Darby, yeah, yeah.

Darby gets brought up.

And I wanted to jump through the TV and say this guy needs to know the love of Jesus.

He doesn't need to know that we don't.

Whatever you think is going on with Jonathan Darby.

Come on.

I.

Look, it shows about that.

Now he's witnessing to the guy and saying, hey, instead of telling you about Jesus Christ, I'm going to tell you about the controversy and let you know that I think people who believe this are stupid and I just think we're losing it.

You know how many Tucker Feltons, he's an influential guy.

Joe Rogan, he's getting an earful of reformed theology from Canadian Guy.

One thing I've always liked about people like Greg Laurie and Billy Graham and Franklin Graham, let's just give the gospel here and then we can do some doctrinal stuff later on.

But is this guy saved?

I want this guy to be saved.

Not to know that Christians have arguments.

Absolutely.

One thing we hear too is that Israel is.

That's old stuff.

The church has replaced Israel.

Does the church in Israel have distinct roles to play biblically in the end times in the last days?

No.

Yeah.

And I can't give the exact dates, because I haven't looked at it in a while.

But a lot of this stuff happened around the 4th, 5th century with Augustine and some of those guys where they imagine you're the Roman Catholic Church and it's the official religion of the empire and you're rich and no persecution.

I give those guys a pass.

I think, okay, maybe this is the kingdom, then maybe this is what God intended.

We thought it was literal, but it's actually figurative.

But that caught on.

And when the Reformation happened, they didn't care about prophecy.

They only cared about, which is great, the justification by faith.

That was fantastic.

But they let prophecy slide until about the 17, 1800s.

Yeah, yeah.

And then it started to come back to what it is today.

And it is important.

And there's just, gosh, there's just no way to see the church in the Old Testament.

And Paul says, this is enough for me.

He says, it's a mystery, and a mystery of something that has never been revealed before.

So there is no church in the Old Testament, number one.

And then if you start lining up the promises that God has made to Israel, they're completely impossible unless they're all just symbolic.

And then the issue for me, too is that if God could promise Israel and the descendants of Abraham certain things have been reneged on them, then he'll reneg on me too, if I'm not a good.

And there's the beautiful hope in that, as God keeps his promises.

We're studying through Exodus with our youth on Wednesday nights.

And it's just amazing how faithful God is and how unfaithful we are, how easily we get distracted.

I sometimes feel embarrassed when I talk about how merciful and gracious God is.

And it's that whole Paul thing where he said, could sin abound, that grace might abound, God forbid.

But that tells me that somebody in your church should be able to stand up and say, you're saying that grace is too much, rather than you're saying that grace is too little.

And so if I'm getting accused of being too lenient, I would rather that than being too judgmental and strict.

Because God when I started, of course, myself too, but just since Israel's on the table here, nor are those people blowing it all time, all the time.

It's crazy how hundreds and hundreds of years that God is exhorting them and finally says, okay, I'm leaving the temple and I'm going to destroy the temple.

It's crazy.

His mercy and grace.

No, it's.

Yes.

And really, where should that lead us?

It should lead us to a place of humility, reverence, of gratitude, of just humbleness before God and thankfulness.

So with that said, moving on then.

Is there things that we would see?

And I'll talk a little bit about this and you can just jump in.

Is there things that we would see today that we should be watching for today?

And I think the answer is definitely yes.

But we see it.

You just log into X, or you log into Facebook or Instagram or the news, and there's no shortage of headlines.

And it, it's all just showing, I think, the direction of where we're going.

And one of the things that we see a lot of, and it seems like it's getting worse, I know that it's not new.

The things that we struggle with today we struggled with 2,000 years ago, 3,000 years ago.

Sin is sin.

But we certainly see signs ramping up.

We see the Bible talks about birth pangs just in things that we see around, just in nature.

But deception is huge.

And I was just thinking about this.

But AI and video generation and voice generation and things that, where you can just create a reality almost just by text.

To your point about the world being people say, oh, yeah, it's the way it's always been.

But we're definitely as a nation, we are definitely in Romans, chapter one, where we're in a downward file.

I look at people and I think, or people say, how can they believe that?

How can they teach that?

And it's because they've given themselves over to deception.

It says in Romans they didn't want to keep God in their knowledge.

But typically sensational Christians like ourselves, we look at things like we know certain things are going to unfold, some big things.

And then we would look for stage setting.

Is there something in the world that kind of corroborates that?

And so some of the big ones are, of course, the nation of Israel.

We talked about that.

It seems like there's going to be a global government.

I know you're going to talk, we're going to talk about that later on and stuff.

It seems like there's going to be commerce that's global because you won't be able to buy or sell anything without the certain mark on your hand and forehead.

You'll be an explosion of knowledge in the end time.

So there's.

There's seven categories that you can look at and read the news and say, oh, it says here in Daniel, there's going to be an exponential growth in human knowledge.

And so for years I would do vital updates on that and I'd say, oh, now knowledge is increasing.

It doubles every 15 years or every five years.

But now it's just completely blown out.

With AI, that knowledge is beyond.

It is the human intellect in some ways there has never been an explosion of knowledge like there is now.

So what we do is we look at the news.

But I don't want to think, oh, hey, this is happening right now, therefore it is.

They are that nation.

And so God, we expect him to do something anytime because we believe the rapture is imminent.

Right.

It could be another 10 years.

The thing is, I never understood, but in studying, there's no guarantee that the tribulation is going to start after the.

Immediately after that.

No, no, there could be a period of time after.

Yeah, we don't know.

Correct.

But I do know there's going to be the resurrection and rapture of the church.

I know there's going to be the seven year tribulation.

And so I know the big slices of history.

And I can look at things and say, okay, this is a sign because it's so weird, it's just so different.

And really, this is going to sound a little sensational, but I don't mean it that way.

But in my lifetime talking about all of these issues, none of them are a stretch anymore.

You look at all of this stuff is in place.

God could halt it or he could go forward.

But if he did, I tell people, hey, if God was going to go forward today, AI would be what animates their image of the beat.

And it's ready and it's ready to go if he doesn't come soon or from a worldly point of view, because 10 years from now it'll be something else.

But at least I think that's that contingent idea where, hey, I'm going to come now and everything really is in place.

And when you look at it, you think, ha, yeah, now I see it.

Now I see how you were ready for everything.

And so praise the Lord.

Yeah, amen.

Amen.

And I think one good litmus too is just really.

And I encourage the listeners to do this, just search the scripture, find the things that God says is good, is right, is holy, and then look at what the world says about those things.

And it brings into clarity that what the world's going to call good, what God calls evil, and it's across the board and it's latent and it's celebrated, we think of in the days of Noah or we think of Rome, but like you said we're right in the middle of Romans chapter one as a culture.

And unfortunately we're right in the middle of chapter one of Romans.

Sometimes behind the pulpit is what is what churches are saying, hey, actually this is acceptable.

Hey, actually this is brings you closer to God.

And it's sad, but our message has got to be Jesus.

And we get so distracted with the, the sensationalist of prophecy and trying to figure out who the Antichrist is.

But you know what?

We're not going to see the guy.

We're going to be with Jesus.

I'm not looking for him, I'm looking for Christ.

It's got to be a head scatter too.

God always does.

It's oh, that guy, that guy and stuff.

It's going to be, I think it's going to be the opposite or similar to when God chooses Christian leaders.

It's like you're David, like David the shepherd boy really.

And so I think they are.

But you're right, we're not going to be here for that.

But.

And then I, I worry about America.

I love our country and I, I like to think I'm patriotic, but without throwing out anything on anybody, you know, I don't have anything to say about anybody.

But now we're finding out that for decades we have been among the most corrupt nation in the world or maybe of all time, just from what they're saying.

And I was really stunned this year when I went into the voting booth.

I realized it earlier, but this is the first time I can remember voting in my lifetime where there was not a solid pro life candidate that both candidates and even any independent running were pro choice.

And so there's no getting around that.

They just were.

Now the fact that one was more radical than the other, that's significant.

They're having Planned Parenthood right outside the Democratic convention and stuff and doing abortions almost on site.

But because that was a big issue for them.

But American prophecy is a whole nother topic we'll probably get into.

But the church always lags behind.

But we are, and I say this about myself too, we need to repent.

Probably in some areas.

If you look back and say, hey, 10 years ago or 15 years ago or 20 years ago we considered this sin, but now it's no big deal.

Yeah, with television I think we've all become a little bit more desensitized with television.

You know what they sometimes I hate?

It's a PG13.

And I think really you think 13 year old kids are, should be watching this and so it's all going down the drain.

And we need to be more than just a little bit better than a society.

We need to be a lot better.

We need to be different.

The light set on a hill.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

As we move along to our last part here, what does all this mean?

We think about prophecy, we think about what to watch for the world today.

Can you close on what should we do with this?

Obviously a lot of people have said this before, but a lot of people are attacking the idea of a pre tribulation rapture, that Jesus would come at any second, that kind of a thing, and they tie it into the church isn't anything special.

There's only one people of God and why shouldn't we escape and that kind of thing.

But man, if there's no getting around it, the imminent view is the only view that says, hey, you better get up and go do something for God today.

Not because he is going to do something to you, but because people you know and love are going to be left behind and they want let people criticize that all day long.

But if I'm expecting a mid tribulation rapture and then I see the Antichrist come on the scene and say, okay, I know I have three and a.

Half years, I'm gonna get busy.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And you know what?

No Christians are weird like that.

They'll still go on not being busy until three years and four months and stuff.

Same thing with post trip.

So now that's not why this position exists.

It's biblical.

But yeah, I mean it's the only position that has urgency.

And urgency is something that even separate from the end times.

The apostles are always exhorting us to urgently get our walk together and live the Christian life.

And so we need to give people hope that Jesus is coming.

Here's one thing I hate.

I hate it when people, and I do it too.

I hate it when people say it's the end of the world.

I know what they mean by that.

But it's not the end of the world.

It's going to be the beginning of eternity.

It's the end of this period of time when God fulfills his promise.

He said, I'm going to have fellowship with you.

You broke that.

I fixed that.

And now we're at the end of all of that where the only people left are believers who can exercise free will and not sin and live with God in eternity forever and ever.

And yeah, I mean we have a hopeful message.

No one else has that kind of hope.

Yeah.

And prophecy should lead to preparation, not panic.

Because the point is God is in control.

He does know what's coming.

Nothing catches him off guard.

You mentioned this earlier about Adam and Eve.

He knew.

It's not like he was surprised before he ever even formed Adam.

He knew what it would cost, but he still did it.

And so we misunderstand God's love.

I think a lot.

And it is way more than we can comprehend.

I think sometimes we.

This is a personal thing with me, and I hope I. MissPonia but it's.

I'm not saying anything is too hard for God.

Obviously not.

But it is a difficult thing to allow free will and also bring somebody to a point of fellowshipping with God.

It's not easy.

People say, oh, why is it taking a thousand years, 2,000 years, 6,000 years?

Because it is complicated to get through to you without violating your free will.

Yes.

He wants a relationship with you that is like his relationship within the Trinity.

Love and mercy and grace and decision making and things like that.

And a deterministic human race is stupid and stuff.

And so it's just hard for God to bring us to that point.

It's an amazing thing that.

And you see how hard it is at the end of the millennium because multitudes of human beings who see Jesus ruling and reigning and see us in our glorified bodies, they rebel even after.

A thousand years of a perfect rule.

Yeah, it's crazy.

So.

Yeah.

So Bible prophecy is not there to scare you.

It's not there to scare me.

It's there to steady us, to.

To show us that God's in control and he reveals his plans.

Not so we can predict the future.

That's not the point.

It's so we can live with purpose.

We can have confidence and clarity that he's in control.

We just as followers of Jesus, you don't need to panic.

Just prepare, reach people that it encourages to go out and tell people about the gospel, about Jesus, about who he is about.

That's what we're called to do, to be out, to go out in the world.

We see that in second Peter 3:11.

He says, what kind of people ought you be?

You ought to live holy and godly lives.

Pursue God.

So here's my challenge for our listeners this week.

Take some time this week to read through Daniel 7 through 9 or second Thessalonians.

And as you read, just be open to the Lord God, what are you speaking to me?

And then just ask yourself, is your life aligned with what's coming?

And that question should lead you to a place where you want to tell people about Christ.

And that's an awesome thing.

So thanks for listening.

If this episode helped you share it with a friend, share it with someone who's been asking questions about the time that we're living in.

And next week we're going to take time talking about the topic of global unity, the peace movements, the rise of this one world system, which Pastor Gene alluded to a little bit earlier today in asking the question is it already happened?

And just spoiler alert, a lot of these systems, I think, are ready to go and they're in place.

And so how do we recognize the difference between God's peace and a false peace?

Because the world does offer what they call, quote, unquote peace, but it's not.

It's just deception.

So you won't want to miss it.

Thank you guys so much for joining us and we look forward to seeing you next.

There won't be next week.

We're going to take a week off.

We have scheduling conflicts, so it'll be two weeks.

We'll be back here on Thursday.

And we look forward to seeing you.

Thanks so much.

Have a great week.