Hannah: [00:00:00] Hi and welcome back to the awfully quiet podcast. Today you're in for a conversation that honestly feels like catching up with an old friend. Even though it was actually the first time I met Julia Arndt. Julia is a TEDx speaker, corporate wellbeing expert and founder of the Peak performance method, a science spec program that helps professionals conquer burnout and achieve sustainable productivity.

She's a former Google project manager with nearly a decade of experience has coached over 10, 000 individuals from fortune 500 companies like Google, Meta, and Amazon. She also mentors female entrepreneurs. And what shines through her work is the sentiment of growing and scaling sustainably. What I love most about her work is this refreshing balance of pushing for big ambitious dreams while keeping our health mindset and bodies front and center [00:01:00] with an Instagram community of over 90, 000 followers.

Julia shares actionable insights to inspire high achievers to create balance and thrive. I felt an instant connection with Julia. Maybe it's our shared German roots or the fact that we've both built international careers. She's now living the dream in Lake Tahoe after stints in Silicon Valley, Ireland, and well, She's been all over the place.

Her journey is super inspiring, but it's also come with its challenges. So in this episode, we dive deep into the topic of burnout, why it hits high achievers so hard, why hard work won't unlock the next level in our careers and how to protect ourselves from burning out on work. We genuinely. Love. If this conversation resonates with you, it would mean the world if you shared it with a friend who might need it too.

And if you're [00:02:00] feeling extra generous, a quick five star rating on Spotify would be amazing. Just tap those three little dots in the top right corner of the podcast page. It takes a second. It really helps more people find those conversations. Now, without further ado, let's get into the interview with Julia Arndt. All right. Well, Julia, thank you so much for joining me today and welcome to the Awfully Quiet Podcast.

Julia: Thank you. I'm so excited to be here.

Hannah: Well, I'm so excited to have you. Um, where I want to start is with a question that I ask every guest on the podcast and it is about what is a quiet strength that has helped you thrive or that has helped you in your career that is a little bit unexpected or that people just wouldn't expect.

Julia: Yeah. Um, you know, you shared that question with me before jumping on the podcast today. So I did think a little bit about that. And it was funny because I came up with an answer. And then I was like, I feel like it would be really interesting to ask someone else. I also asked my [00:03:00] sister and we came up with two completely different answers.

I want to kind of share both one from my perspective and one from her perspective. So, um, I think the quiet strength, um, That that I that kind of came up for me was perseverance. Um, I think, you know, especially when you're building a business, you just need to kind of keep going. And I think one of my strengths is, is that I never really give up.

I think every time. Um, you know, it's not going the way I wanted to go. I just use it as a redirect to, uh, figure out something new or see it as an opportunity to, to learn something else or to, uh, to test out something else. Um, and I think that's a, that's been a really important, uh, characteristic for me over the last six years, since I started the business, because.

You know, building a business is not easy and there's a million things that you learn along the way and I think perseverance is one of my strengths that behind the scenes I just kind of keep on going and like I'm kind of relentless, you know, like I [00:04:00] want to figure this out and I have this dream and I want to have this impact in the world.

And, um, so perseverance is what I came up with. Um, and then I asked my sister this morning. And, um, she was like, I don't know if you want to share this on the podcast. But the thing that I thought about was that you're kind of, um, and I couldn't really find a perfect word in English for it. There's actually a really good word in German for it.

But the English word is kind of this like, spitefulness, or I looked it up, or just like defiance. So kind of this idea of, well, if this doesn't work, I'm going to do it anyway, or I'm actually going to do it even like, especially because of this. And she kind of brought up, you know, some of the relationships I've had over the course of my life and how they always, you know, when they failed or when it didn't work out the way I wanted to, it kind of made me.

made me push myself to this like next level. So, um, you know, a couple of examples that she gave [00:05:00] was like, this is why you spent six months in Australia. And, you know, because you were like, well, because this didn't work out, I'm gonna do it anyway. And I'm gonna do it especially because of that. And that's why that's kind of how I came to the US.

And that's how I kind of came to Tahoe. And that's how I learned to drive a boat a couple of years ago, just like, kind of funny things. And I was like, this is kind of an interesting perspective, you know, from somebody else. But, um, in the grand scheme of things, I actually think it kind of goes in line with the perseverance a little bit because it's kind of like, you know, I, I don't take failure as, as a reason to, uh, to feel defeated.

Um, I just kind of keep going anyway.

Hannah: Yeah. You're almost fueled by it. It sounds

Julia: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, definitely.

Hannah: No, I love perseverance and I love that you do things in spite of them being hard. Um, which I think is a quiet strength because it is not sexy is not something that, you know, um, yeah, would be like an overt, you know, quality to begin with, [00:06:00] but it's so important, whether you're in corporate or building your own business, I think, perseverance, resilience, um, you know, being able to go through things that are tough and hard and where you don't really get the recognition right away.

is something that is extremely powerful and something that you'll likely draw on your entire career and in your personal life too.

Julia: Totally. Yeah, for sure.

Hannah: love that. Well, Julia, there is this current trend, um, all across Instagram and TikTok about I met my younger self for coffee. I'm sure you will have seen it. And, um, when I look at your career trajectory, I know that my younger self would definitely be jealous as fuck of your, you know, um, being an expat in the U S having worked for Google, you've lived in Silicon Valley.

You now still live in the U S you've built your own business. So I know that my younger self, like my ambitious younger self would definitely be in awe. And I want to know from today's perspective, what would you have [00:07:00] told your younger self, like your self that has worked at Google? Living as an expat in the U.

S., um, is there anything that you know now that you wish you'd have known earlier and that, or that you wish you would have told that version of yourself?

Julia: Oh, what a powerful question makes me emotional. Um, I haven't really thought about I have seen the reals. Um, but I haven't really, uh, sat down and really thought about it. But it's a great question for a podcast. And like I said, it kind of makes me really emotional because I think we all go through these like younger selves of, you know, being hard on ourselves and, um, not really knowing where the kind of the next path leads us.

And, um, I think for me, it always brings me back to kind of my lowest point in my career, when I experienced burnout in 2018 at Google. I'm surprised that it makes me so emotional, but, um, you know, I think at the time I was in such a low. low point where I was like, you know, what, what am I doing? I feel so lonely [00:08:00] and alone.

And, um, I, um, I don't know how to like what to do next, you know, and I think if I would meet my younger self for coffee today, I would tell her everything is going to work out and you are way more powerful, you know, than you think. Um, at that point, you kind of, you think you are and yeah, You're going to have a dream life, you know, um, even more so than the one that I had when I was at Google that was kind of more on paper of a dream life than kind of the behind the scenes.

And, you know, sometimes, you know, I stopped myself and now living in Lake Tahoe and, um, just always thinking this was my dream. Like, I wanted to be here so badly, um, and I didn't know how to figure it out, um, for a long time. And that kind of brought me to burnout as well. And then, um, now here I am, you know, six years later and I have this amazing company and it fulfills me, you know, so, so [00:09:00] deeply.

And um, Yeah, I think I would have said just be patient and trust yourself and keep going and keep exploring and trust that everything is really happening for you.

Hannah: No, I love that. And I, I can resonate a lot with it because I think especially as somebody who is ambitious, who is high achieving, I can imagine that that version of yourself had a lot of the things or had achieved a lot of the things that your, you know, even younger version. Dreamed off or things that you have always worked towards.

I mean, obviously working for Google in the US as somebody from Germany, it's like a super cool thing to achieve. And it's probably hard to let go of that version of yourself because you worked so hard for that. And then to admit to yourself, you know what, this is actually. You know, cool that I achieved it, but now I know so much more than I knew back then.

And, um, you know, making a decision based on that. And I always feel like this trust in [00:10:00] ourselves and in our own abilities can be really tough in these moments. It's like, you know, what has taken you there, the same abilities are going to take you further, but it can so easily feel like, no, this is it now.

Now, you know, I failed at this

Julia: Yeah,

Hannah: and I'm just going to stay stuck forever.

Julia: totally. You know, and it's, it's really powerful to get kind of this reflection from you as well, right from the outside. It's like, wow, you know, she's traveled around the world and she's worked for this company and she is in Silicon Valley. And I think. You know, you brought up a really important point, which is, you know, it was really hard to leave, you know, like, my family in Germany, you know, they were like, why would you leave Google, like, the best thing you've that ever happened to you and you have such a, you know, safe job, you have great insurance, and especially in the States, you know, you have all these benefits, like, why, why would you even think about leaving, right, especially also, I guess, with our, um, Our parents generation, it's still like, you [00:11:00] know, you do it, you take a job and you do it for 30, 40, 50 years, you know, and you don't really kind of question if there's anything else that you can do.

Um, and, uh, yeah, I, uh, that took me a very long time, you know, internally to make that decision. decision and to, to bring up the courage to be like, okay, I'm, I'm just going to try it out. And that's kind of how, how it happened, right? Like, I, I actually experienced the burnout. And I think for me, it was kind of the wake up call to be like, Hey, it's starting to really impact my mental health as well.

Um, and I'm really not feeling happy anymore, and I'm just gonna test this out and I can always go back. I can always go back to the corporate world, you know, but I need to just see if there's something else out there for me. That's bringing me more joy or creates a different kind of fulfillment in my life.

Hannah: I get that and like, it's such an interesting combination for you because you are so, um, you know, persistent and you have that resilience and at the same time you [00:12:00] were able to spot burnout and were able to like, say to yourself, look, this is, I can't do this anymore. How did you spot those signs of burnout?

Because for somebody who is like, so I can. very much resonate with that situation. And as somebody who is used, used to push through and who has pushed through in the past to get, you know, where you were at that point in time, what were some of the signs that you spotted in yourself where you said, look, this is not just being resilient anymore.

This is not healthy. And I'm not at the right place.

Julia: Yeah. Yeah. Um, you know, it's so subtle at the beginning and it's so, you're, it's so, you know, you're in such a kind of unconscious space a little bit because I didn't know anything about burnout in 2018. You know, it was like now in hindsight, I can identify and tell you exactly, and I will in a moment, like I can tell you exactly kind of what happened.

Um, But in, in, during that time in [00:13:00] 2018, um, I just didn't really know, but I think the biggest, the biggest signal for me at some point, it kind of like really made me wake up and be like, I just need to, uh, I just need to go to the doctor and get a medical leave was that I didn't feel like myself anymore.

Um, I constantly had super negative thoughts. Um, you know, I was driving between Silicon Valley and Lake Tahoe. Um, every week, um, I did, I commuted for like four hours in each direction every three to four days. So that was a lot kind of on just kind of my, um, my focus, right? Because I would usually travel at night because the Bay Area and like rush hour is a real thing.

Um, and so I would, you know, drive from eight o'clock in the evening to midnight after like a full day of work, um, and then work the next morning and things like that. Um, but yeah, I was, I had very negative thoughts. Like I literally got to a point where I was kind of like thinking, I wish I would have an accident.

Um, so I don't have to drive anymore and that's scary. Weird thoughts, you know, um, [00:14:00] and, um, I constantly got in fight with my partner, um, and I, I was just not in a good space, you know, and I feel like I, I kind of projected that onto him. Um, and then the other big thing that's kind of more in hindsight, um, that I experienced was I had like constantly digestive issues, like my stomach was constantly hurting and I would have diarrhea.

I also drink a lot of coffee at the time. And, you know, just like stuff like that. Um, and then there was one other thing that I was just thinking of. Um, I had super high anxiety. And again, I actually didn't know I had anxiety until I went to the doctor and she gave me these like questionnaires that I had to fill out and I sat with her in the, in the room afterwards.

And she looked at the results and she basically said to me, she's like, you have really high anxiety. And I was like, Oh, like, that's what it is. You know, like, I just constantly felt. super, it's kind of this like a nervous feeling of something, something is going to happen, you know, like you need to speak in front of 150 people or [00:15:00] like you just kind of this like constant underlying nervousness that That was anxiety, which I didn't know that it was.

And so it was really, um, I would say those, those five things for me. And I always say for each person, it's a little different, um, you know, for, for each person stress shows up in different ways, both physically and mentally. But for me, those, those are definitely the signs that I'm super aware of today. Um, And that when I spot them kind of early on, um, I kind of know, okay, I need to slow it down and, um, invest in myself and prioritize myself again.

Hannah: yeah, when it comes to burnout, I know you've worked with, you know, a lot of clients on like, you know, their personal situations. How much of it do you think is the actual job? And how much of it is how we deal with it, like, the systems that we have in place, the way we take care of ourselves and of our bodies, because I appreciate that any [00:16:00] career puts a strain on us and it's, you know, whether it be a corporate career or.

Building a business, it always takes so much out of us, so much energy. And I know for my introverted audience, especially myself, you know, coming onto a call takes energy. So, um, it's, it's, it's just in terms of like, just kind of putting into perspective, how much do you think it's the actual job and how much do you think it is something that we can influence on the job?

Julia: Yeah, it's a great question. And I think a lot about that. You know, I've had a lot of clients that would come to me that had experienced multiple burnouts and multiple different jobs, which, you know, was very clearly. At the end of the day, probably not the job, but kind of the, the habits that they had, um, that they developed over the course of time, um, that were not supporting their well being.

Um, and so today I really say, um, [00:17:00] I actually believe, and I've never really put a percentage on it, but I actually believe it's probably 80 percent you. Maybe. And like 20 percent the job. I think there's a very big percentage. That's you, um, on how you're reacting to it. And, you know, there, and there's a lot of neuroscience.

That's like, really, really fascinating. Um, that when you are in high stress, you're constantly in this like fight or flight. Um, you know, and your brain just takes everything as, um, Yeah. You know, danger and as a threat. And so when you have a lot of high stress in your job, everything all of a sudden seems like it's, it's, it's a danger to you.

And it's a threat to you. Um, even though by managing yourself and by being aware of that, I think there's actually. a pretty high percentage that you can eliminate. And from, you know, I've, I've supported over thousands and thousands of people in the last six years, both in like corporate settings and one on one coaching.

And, um, you know, [00:18:00] I've had a lot of one on one coaching clients that, um, that would actually leave their job while they were working with me in order to start like in a new role or on, um, in a new company. And the habits were exactly the same. You know, and so they would still work until late at night because that's what they were used to.

They still didn't have any boundaries in place. They still didn't manage their time properly. They still didn't prioritize themselves and their well being. Um, and, you know, and that leads to burnout again. And, you know, I also want to say, you know, a lot of people sometimes look at me and are like, oh, you left your corporate job and you started your own business, you know, to escape burnout.

And. I actually talk about that in my TEDx talk as well. Um, but, you know, if you've ever started your own business, you know that that's a million times more stressful than a corporate job because all of a sudden you are responsible for bringing in money and for taking care of yourself on a financial level.

And that's way more [00:19:00] stressful. And so I, I actually think, you know, I burned out in 2018. I took a three months medical leave. There were a few things that I started to, um, you know, implement in my own life to take care of myself. But when I started the business. I feel like it's just like constant learning for me as well.

Like I, I always say I teach people how to not burn out because I need it the most in my own life. Maybe because of my own perseverance as well. Right. And my stubbornness to like, keep pushing and keep doing. But, um, I it's, it's, um, you know, I think it's a tendency that I have, um, because I'm so fascinated and so excited about what I do.

Um, and I know we want to talk a little bit about that as well, but I do really believe, um, if you're listening to this and, you know, you might have made, um, a toxic environment responsible for how you're feeling. There's definitely right. I have seen it many times for my clients. There are toxic environments that are good to remove yourself from and.[00:20:00]

It still doesn't mean that you just shift to another role or a different company and you're healed. I think there is still a very high percentage that you need to look at your own habits to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Hannah: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Um, you talk specifically to high achievers and you work with a lot of high achievers. Um, what, what is it about high achievers that makes them prone to burnout? Because it feels like high achievers and high performing, you know, talents are usually the ones who kind of really love their jobs and who kind of really lean into more responsibility and, you know, really moving the needle, really making an impact.

What is it about this group of people specifically that is prone to burn out?

Julia: Yeah, I think one part is kind of this like external validation that that we crave. Um, I, uh, I will, it's interesting, right? Like, it's when you start a business or when you when [00:21:00] you get more aware of your own story, you're like, Oh, maybe it's just me, you know, but then you start to work with all these other people.

And you're like, Oh, like, they actually have kind of a similar story. And, um, one of the biggest like eyeopening moments I had was when I talked to a friend. About kind of my own journey. And I said to her, you know, um, school never came easy to me. So, um, you know, I, I kind of pushed, um, and I sat down, um, after work after, um, the school day and I, um, would like copy my notes again and practice everything.

And, um, my dad was really proud of me for that. Um, and my, and my sister was like, so different, you know, she just like kind of like was highly intelligent and just like soaked everything up. Um, And she said to me, she's like, that was exactly the same way for me, too. And she's a high achiever. She works at Google at a very important job.

And, um, and I said, Oh, that's interesting. And so I think that was kind of this first insight of like, Oh, okay. I think we all have a little bit of a story and similar background, maybe of maybe work didn't actually come easy to us at first. But we have maybe [00:22:00] a little bit of that brain, you know, this like brain, uh, neurological pathway of.

Um, I'm gonna like do it and I like hard work. I'm gonna work hard in order to, um, to be good at what I do. And then I think with this like external reward and recognition and validation, that is kind of this like motivation for us to keep on going. And I see that in a lot of high achievers. Um, and then you brought up another interesting point, which is kind of this idea of, um, you know, high achievers actually really love what they do.

So why do they burn out? Um, And it's something really interesting, um, that Again, you know, I feel like I learned so much over the course of my own career, um, because I, I do think, you know, towards the end at Google, I didn't really love my job anymore. And I do think that it had an impact on how I, um, how I burned out and over the last six months, um, the business kind of, I feel like my business has kind of taken this like next level step and I've been loving what I do.

Um, and at the same time. I've [00:23:00] been getting very clear signals from my body and mind that it's too much and you know, that I need to take these breaks and that I need to do all the things that I teach all of my clients. And it was really this like eye opening moment, um, where I was like, it really isn't just, you know, it's not, people don't just burn out because they don't like their job, which is I think a big misconception.

It's really also people that do really like their jobs because they. Keep pushing and they just tell themselves, well, but it's really fun right now. And I'm just going to finish this, this project. And then I'm going to, you know, and then I'm going to take a break or something like that. But that break just never comes because there's always something else that wants your attention.

And I think, um, you know, talking about myself, I, like, I'm really, really passionate about what I do. And I really thrive from engaging with my audience and creating new programs and things like that. And, um, You know, sometimes I stop myself and I think it doesn't all have to happen in this exact one week.

You know, like, I think [00:24:00] we just, um, really love it. And so, yeah, I think there's something to be said about kind of just like high achiever, both like from an external recognition, validation perspective that we thrive through that kind of almost more like external cycle, but then also just like internal, um, just motivation and inspiration, um, to keep going.

And, um, You know, I, I really believe that we need a lot more education around burnout and, um, you know, uh, helping people understand that you can have both, you know, you can have like the great, the great life that you are, that you want to have. And you can have a really amazing, successful career. That doesn't have to be one or the other, which I think is still a big misconception for a lot of people.

Hannah: I'm sure it is. I'm sure it is. Um, what really resonated with me is what you said about studying and how you kind of willed your way through because that is exactly how I did it.

Julia: That's so

Hannah: I was also not, you know, things didn't come to me as naturally, but I was always willing to work extra hard to [00:25:00] get good grades.

And I feel like, um, that sustained me for a really long time. That worked for me for a really, like, I would say into the first five, maybe 10 years of my corporate experience

Julia: Mm-hmm

Hannah: And I feel like this is almost a rite of passage for high achievers. It's that. Hard work equals recognition, and it works for a really long time.

It certainly works like that in school, where we get recognized for hard work. Like if we put our heads down, if we do really great, if we, you know, engage in class, it always gets you a gold star of some sort, doesn't it?

Julia: Totally. Yeah.

Hannah: into a corporate experience or early into a career. You tend to get a lot of recognition for what you do.

Like it'll be the easiest thing. Uh, great job. Well done. And obviously that's something that, that tends to happen in corporate more so than when you build your own business. But I just felt at some point there was a ceiling to that. There was like a point that I reached where hard work didn't equal[00:26:00]

Julia: Mm-hmm . The external reward or,

Hannah: It wasn't, it wasn't like hard work was going to unlock that next promotion. It wasn't going to unlock more visibility or, you know, more interesting projects. It was just like this turning point where I felt like I needed to be smarter. I needed to lean more into, you know, self leadership and, um, coming across more of like, an authority rather than somebody who pleases everyone and does it all because you can easily stay in that rut and in that position of like being the person who does it all who says yes to everything who takes on every project and then that kind of puts you into that corner of like oh yeah you know you don't really stand for anything you're just kind of like the person who does it all and that can easily burn you out.

I feel like that is something that where I was kind of like at the brink of Oh, this isn't really happening for me anymore. Like, I can't will myself through that next level. Then you just have to become smarter about it. [00:27:00] And I kind of felt You know, signs of, you know, burning out in terms of like, I was so easily irritable with everyone.

I was like, the smallest thing would like tick me off. Like what he said about, you know, how you, you know, then spoke with your husband and so on. I was like, Oh yeah, that is, I can relate to that. So it's almost like it could send early signs, but then the high achiever or like the. High achieving kind of nature with inside of me was like, no, no, no, I'm going to outsmart the burnout.

Julia: Mm-hmm

Hannah: be smarter. I'm going to, you know, focus on my sleep, on my healthy habits. I'm going to get some extra workout classes in and kind of like put more and more and more on my agenda to, you know, make it work somehow, but you can't outwork yourself. And that was my biggest, you know, my biggest realization of like, no, you know, hard work isn't going to get you through that either.

So, um, talk to me [00:28:00] about some of the things that you can actively do to like really avoid burnout or like really, you know, put yourself in a position where you. Can sustain a career, you know, can you sustain the cool, great high profile projects and everything that you want to be doing and achieving from a career perspective?

But also stay grounded and, you know, build the right habits and do the right things to not go down that rabbit hole and burn out in the process.

Julia: Yeah. Well, thank you so much for sharing also your own kind of insight. It's so interesting, you know, and I love that we can share that, you know, with your community because I do think there's actually a lot of parallels, you know, um, and one thing that came up for me before I answer the next question is kind of this like identity as well.

I think we are proud of being high achievers. You know, I do think there's this pride that comes with it because we worked kind of hard to get to that point, you know, so I think, um, There's something [00:29:00] to be said about kind of this like identity of a high achiever, bringing us into this kind of burnout state.

And then the other thing that I wanted to say that really resonated with me as you shared it is this like, when we were in school, you know, our hard work was very clearly paid off by getting A's, right? And everyone could get A's. There wasn't, you know, five people could get an A and the other rest would get a B and C, right?

Because in the corporate world, and I don't know if that's your experience in the, in your corporate job, but at Google, there was a bell curve. So not, you know, like, there was like, And a certain number of people could get the outstanding, you know, performance evaluation, um, or the exceed expectations. Um, but only a handful of people.

So you were compared to your peers. And as you can imagine, I know, you know, Google has the reputation for hiring high achievers and very smart people. Smart people. I was one of many, many, like I was definitely not the high achiever, high achiever at Google. You know, like [00:30:00] I, I remember starting in Dublin in 2011 and at the time, you know, I had lived in three or four countries and I spoke three languages fluently.

And you know, there were a lot of things that I was very proud of. And then you get there and you're like, you meet people that speak seven languages, like just crazy, you know, like they speak seven languages and they, they've already worked. at consulting at like the craziest consulting companies at the age of 21, you know, and just like you just like, it's just like really,

Hannah: Bar raises.

Julia: really the bar raises and you're like, damn, you know, like now you're one of many, because I think also, you know, as a high achiever, maybe in high school and college, you're, you're the top of the top.

That's why, you know, probably Companies like Google hire you, but then you get put into this pool of, now you're just one of many. So there's a lot of imposter syndrome happening, um, but also, um, I, I actually experienced that from the very beginning, you know, that, um, the, the, the, [00:31:00] the work that we put in wasn't as rewarded because there was only a certain number of people that could get promoted, you know, and you were measured against all these other incredible people.

So then it felt really quickly like. Like I'm working so hard, but it doesn't really show, you know, I don't really get the reward that I got in the past. So you worked even harder and you created even unhealthier habits, right? Like you would stay late in the office and you work during the weekends and all these different kind of crazy things in order to, uh, Produce even more work, so it just kind of created this, like, really inflated, unhealthy environment of people that were just, you know, pushing themselves super hard. Um, and, um, and then the last thing that I wanted to say that I thought was really interesting that you brought up was, um. Let me think. What was it? Um, you were saying, you know, corporate world. I don't know. It will come back to me, but I'll, I'll answer your question, um, around kind of, okay, what can I do to actually, um, overcome burnout?

Can I prevent it or can I fix it or, um, heal [00:32:00] from it? You absolutely can. I think I wouldn't do this work if I wouldn't think, you know, it's something that you can change. Um, I think it takes time. Um, a little bit, it's a little bit of a process and it's a little, uh, it's this kind of like constant, um, process of testing out and experimenting and iterating and kind of really finding what works for you.

Um, and, you know, for me, the work that I do is kind of summarized and what I call the peak performance method approach. Um, so I actually identified nine different areas, um, that I think are extremely important to kind of. Um, get a hold of your life, um, so you can be even more successful. So it's actually a mix of stress management and mindfulness practices, productivity systems, and also leadership.

Um, and kind of this like personal insight of diving deeper into your limiting beliefs and your mindset. Like, you know, why do you believe that only hard work? Pays off like that's something that that I've been breaking through over and over again over the last, um, few years because [00:33:00] that's like very much ingrained in my brain, you know, that I that I have believed for since I'm 10 years old that only when I work hard will I be successful, you know, and so I, um, I do this work with clients because I think that that's actually the biggest needle mover that when I let go kind of of this idea, um, And that's the other thing that I, that I wanted to say.

I just came back. You were saying, you know, I did even more workout classes and put even more things on my schedule. And I can really relate to this too. Like, I built two different companies while I was at Google towards the end.

Hannah: Yeah.

Julia: You know, I was like, I'm going to do this and I'm going to do that and I'm going to not sleep at all anymore, you know, because maybe that's gonna, I don't know, gonna make me feel better.

Um, and, um, so. You need to be really aware of it first, right? Awareness is the first step of just recognizing. Okay. Um, you know, maybe the symptoms and signals that we just shared that there is something there. Like, maybe you're experiencing it as well. So create some awareness around. Okay. Yeah, I have negative thoughts, or [00:34:00] I am, I'm constantly blaming my external environment for how I'm feeling.

I constantly feel angry with my manager or my team or the responsibilities that I'm getting or even, you know, my family members or whatever it is. Um, so create that awareness, um, and then, uh, you know, I think the biggest needle movers, um, for my clients are time management. Um, so really, you know, I think you, you were saying this as well, Hannah, like you were saying, uh, you know, I said yes to everything and, um, I, I was just constantly busy, but I didn't actually really, um, specialize or I didn't really stand up for like something specific.

I just said yes to everything. And, um, so being aware of that is very good. Um, and so then, you know, you can start. taking action to making that better. So I do think it's a process of, you know, managing your time and calendar. And, and, you know, that goes into this like mindset as well of, um, believing that that will actually take you further [00:35:00] than saying yes to everything or believing that you actually do have control over your time.

Like, I know those are like a few limiting beliefs, you know, that people have, um, That keep them from actually taking action because they're almost like this defeated, like, Oh, I can't, you know, I don't have control over my calendar. I've heard that many times before. This is just like the way the job is and I always really, really question that.

Like, is that really, really true? Um, and then, you know, with time and calendar management, hand in hand goes kind of this like idea of setting boundaries, which I think is something. that we were never taught. I think we were never really taught how to manage time and calendars, but we were also never taught on how to say no and like that it is okay to say no.

So, um, I think that's a really important one. And then, of course, the last piece is around creating space for yourself of, you know, taking these breaks, understanding, even from a neuroscience perspective, because I do believe as high achievers, we like to understand [00:36:00] things on this, like, Brainy level, you know, on this like analytical level to be like, Oh, like, that's why I'm doing this, right?

Like my, my prefrontal cortex that's thinking all day long has very limited bandwidth. Um, and so once that goes offline, it's, it's the threat center, you know, it's the amygdala that's basically just sending the signal of we are in threat and everything is kind of like in this fight or flight state and, and managing and regulating our nervous system and managing stress.

Helps us helps actually the prefrontal cortex to take a break, um, and to rejuvenate and then go again, you know, and I think, um, really having these like routines and healthy practices in place are super, super important in order to create a healthier lifestyle, um, that then actually supports this, like, you know, growth, um, and supports this career aspirations that you have.

Hannah: Yeah. And I like that you, um, coined it peak performance rather than, you know, calling it out as like [00:37:00] burnout, um, prevention because all too easily I think people only ever start looking into some of this. When they have gone through a burnout or when they have gone through a severe situation in the workplace or in their careers.

And to me, it feels like this is, you know, great for everyone who, you know, is, you know, who identifies as a little bit of a high achiever who wants more out of their career. Who, you know, wants to take on the big fancy projects and the business endeavors, but at the same time wants to stay true to themselves.

And it feels like that could really very much resonate with my audience to it. It absolutely does with me. Um, and I do like that. You started belief system and what are some of the things that we. have learned to believe over time. I think for me, some of this is also based on what are like the common, um, principles or ideals at the organization that I'm at.

You know, what do I see my boss [00:38:00] do? My boss's boss do? What are some of their habits? And, you know, do they say yes to every meeting? Do they say yes to everything that comes on top? And so I think this is how very easily those beliefs. kind of form. And I have often perceived some of those people who say yes to everything and who do accommodate every additional ad hoc request and task are often praised for it.

I have often kind of perceived like, you know, the gold star is given out for the, for those people who have, you know, put in a lot of work and extra time. And I feel like that often gets praise where he's when somebody. doesn't do it or like sets a boundary, it doesn't get as much praise. So it feels like for anyone who is looking into incorporating some of these habits and some of these practices, it does still feel like a little bit of an uphill battle, especially when leadership that around us doesn't do it yet.

And it, it just feels like it's, it might be our generation who is [00:39:00] now starting to look into this more. Um, yeah, more overtly than ever before,

Julia: Totally. Yeah, I couldn't agree more.

Hannah: specifically to time management. I want to touch on time management because, um, I've seen some of that, um, in your content. I was super intrigued around, you know, how to put in, how to structure your day. And I've recently thought about, well, if I, you know, didn't have to do anything during the day, if I didn't have my corporate job.

If I were just completely free to structure my day, however I wanted to, um, you know, I would, I would go about my day entirely differently. Like, um, just kind of thinking about, you know, it's almost like a holiday, but I would end up.

Julia: Mm

Hannah: Doing a lot of work because I am never somebody who like does nothing the entire day.

I will always find a project, a creative task, something that just occupies my mind. So that's where I naturally gravitate towards, but not in the order that I currently do in my corporate job. And some [00:40:00] of, obviously, some of the timings and the schedule is dictated by. You know, what, you know, when meetings happen and so on, but it's certainly not back to back calls or anything like that.

So I'm wondering, how do you go about, um, you know, teaching people about their schedules and how to potentially bring in some more focus time, some more, you know, time to think, think through to, you know, get out of the back to back meeting craze and so on. What are some of the simple things that everybody could look into incorporating?

Julia: Yeah, you know, uh, I'm sitting here smiling because I'm like, we're like the same people, Hannah. Um, I, I, I've just thought about, I thought about the, I think a lot about time management, right? I think about a lot of the work that I do. And, um, we just had a President's Day weekend and, uh, in America, which is like, you have like Monday, it's basically like this long weekend, Monday is off.

Um, and I'm kind of like you where I'm like, uh. You know, I do is actually structured these like weekend days differently, and I still probably do something probably [00:41:00] work related because I'm just really excited about what I do. And I, you know, there's always ideas and creative projects that I work on, but I structure my day differently where maybe, you know, on Sunday, I like woke up.

I talked to my family in Germany for a couple of hours. I go for like a two hour workout, you know, and then I come home and I still get. maybe two or three hours if I want to. It's not that it happens every single weekend. This weekend, I actually took a nap, but sometimes I would come home, you know, and like work for an hour or two.

And I would feel so accomplished, um, which I think is a really interesting insight because we didn't have an expectation of how much we would actually get done that day. So anything that we do get done is actually a bonus, right? And so, um, in our really busy, distracted world, um, one of the things and one of the big Kind of mistakes I see people make is we're very reactive.

The first thing we do when we wake up in the morning is check our emails and we're immediately in this like go mode. You know, where our head is immediately like, here's all [00:42:00] the things I need to do today. Here's all the 500 messages that I need to respond to. Um, and so, you know, for me, time management is actually a combination of, um.

managing your time first before you're managing your work time. So one of the things that I talk a lot about is creating a morning routine that actually does not involve any kind of work and I don't actually check my phone the first 30 to 60 minutes in the morning because it's me time and it's me like really nourishing myself with water and food and all the things like maybe a walk or whatever I need that morning to really show up as my best self and to not immediately jump into this reactive mode, which actually Um, really, uh, and reinforced my anxiety, um, into, like, up to the point of 2018.

Um, and then, uh, the way of how I like to teach time management is to think about the top three priorities that you have. for the day before you jump into anything. So before you're even opening your, your email, and I have different clients, you know, some clients say, well, I'm in a very reactive, supporting [00:43:00] role.

I have to check my emails first before I maybe even do this exercise, because I need to understand what's actually the priority of the day, what has come in overnight from our US partners. For example, I have a client that's in Italy. Um, and, and then I basically sit down and I write those 3 to 5 tasks.

Um, and it sounds super simple. I think as high achievers, we always would, we want to have the fancy things and the, you know, the absolutely new ideas of. Of how to, for example, manage time, but it's actually the simple things that make the biggest impact. And I've taught this approach to so many people and I have had so many people come back to me.

We actually just had the conversation this morning in my group coaching where they were like, I just did the 3 things every morning and it's completely changed my day, you know, and I'm always like, yes, this makes me so happy because it's really doesn't have to be that complex. So, so basically the three.

Um, the three pieces are, what are the top three priorities for the day? Write these down, then think about, um, how much time does each of these tasks take? [00:44:00] So let's say, you know, number one takes an hour. Number two takes 20 minutes. Number three takes 30 minutes. Or sometimes I have people that are like, this takes 36 hours.

And I'm like, okay, well, I'm like, you gotta break this down. Like you, you know, that's already the first mistake, which is why it's good to bring awareness to that because, um, If you are already setting yourself up for failure before the beginning of the day, of course, at the end of the day, you feel unaccomplished.

You feel like you need to work until late into the evening, and it's just kind of this like vicious circle. Um, so there, there's a lot of really important insight and feedback that you're actually getting from this very simple exercise. And then the third step is to go into your calendar and actually manage your day according to your priorities.

And you can do this exercise. on a daily basis. You can do this exercise on a weekly basis. So on a Sunday night or a Monday morning, you can do this for the whole week as well to get into a better rhythm of managing your time and creating different time blocks on your calendar. I talk a lot about your chronotype as well, which is kind of this, like, the [00:45:00] peak performance hours that you have based on, you know, kind of the energy type that you are.

Um, so, you know, I'm throwing out a lot of things, but, um, it really goes back to this actually kind of simple exercise of three things, you know. Write down 3 things you do when are you going to do it? Put that on your calendar and protect that time. Um, and sometimes you might do this exercise and realize, well, I have these 3 things to do, but I have.

Eight meetings on my calendar for the day. Right? So again, then it's either you have to manage your own expectation of what you can get done for your own strategic projects, or it's an interesting input to say, which of the meetings do I actually need to attend? And which meetings can I delegate? Can I postpone?

Can I cancel? so it's a really Powerful exercise because it's simple and yet super profound, and it has this like trickle effect on your whole, on your whole like calendar. Mm-hmm

Hannah: What I like about is like, [00:46:00] in terms of the top three, and writing them down because I always felt like I would restrict myself too much if I were to, you know, put even more stuff on my calendar, but I think it's not just putting in focus time and then for whatever the focus needs to be, no, it's dedicated time for what is already a priority according to.

You know, what you have thought about. So I really, really like that in terms of, you know, setting some more guardrails and then at the end of the day, you may even finish those top three tasks in the morning. And then you are, you know, just more easier going in the afternoon with like some of the calls that you have to attend and make use of.

Um, I also, um, I think I noticed that you're wearing an aura ring too,

Julia: Yeah. I know. I saw your

Hannah: nerding out about this. And I've talked about this on the podcast before, because I also track like my daily stress levels through my aura ring and, um, the yearly report that I got back just kind of gave me a spike [00:47:00] every Wednesday at a certain time. And every Wednesday at that time, I have a certain kind of meeting that is just like it always, it puts me into like fight or flight. It feels like I'm being chased by a bear for some reason. It's not a bear, but it feels like that. So it was so interesting for me to see, wow, this meeting puts me under so much stress and like, what can I do to, you know, lighten the load a little bit?

Because. By all means, it is not like a super high stakes meeting, um, and it's just something that I can be more mindful of in terms of like, I'm going to take a walk afterwards. I'm always go out with the dog for lunch anyway, so I'll make sure that I always have that time so that I can, you know, relax, calm down, or I'll literally do some breathing exercises before going into the meeting, almost preparing myself a little bit, but I found this such an incredible tool to understand why do we feel like that throughout the day?

And what are the kinds of things that make [00:48:00] me go into overdrive? Sometimes it's presenting, it's certainly, you know, podcasting like that. This also puts me under stress, but you know, it's all worth it. Um, it's not to say that I'm, you know, trying to avoid these meetings altogether, but it's just like you say, becoming more mindful of.

What requires energy from us during the day.

Julia: Yeah. I love that mindfulness and I do love the data too. I think data is really powerful and sometimes, right, just like you were saying, writing down the three things, it's sometimes this like visual feedback of, um, you know, opening your aura app and seeing, um, like for me, the most interesting thing has actually been the sleep data.

Um, because I think a lot of high achievers can relate to that. I think a lot of. Um, high achievers sometimes have sleep issues as well, and they, or they don't sleep enough, or they don't get enough deep sleep because, you know, they have so much cortisol in their body that they, they can't really shut down.

Um, and also for me, sometimes the sleep data has been like, um. Sometimes you wake up in the morning, you're like, Oh, I feel super [00:49:00] tired. And my, my sleep score is probably like super bad. And then sometimes I look at it and sometimes it is. And sometimes it's not at all, you know. And it's funny how that, how, what it does to your brain.

Because I feel like when I see my sleep data and it actually says, Um, you know, it's, it says I'm fine and I got like my REM sleep and I got my, my deep sleep and all that kind of stuff. I'm like, Oh, I'm actually fine. And it's almost like this like click in your brain that you're like, okay, I can let go of that because in the past, you know, maybe then I would have told my story the whole day of like, Oh, I'm super tired.

for bad, you know, it's, it's kind of crazy. Um, I've, I have a lot of conversations with my husband about this because he doesn't really believe in gadgets like that. Um, and so at the beginning, when I started using the ring and I've had it now for like a year and a half, um, he would be like, before you look at your data, he's like, how did you actually sleep?

You know, Did you sleep well? Did you not sleep well? Because I now make it so dependent on what kind of the data shows me. Um, but most of the time, I think it's actually [00:50:00] positive. Like, most of the time, I actually get really good sleep and I have, like, really good quality sleep. And, um, you know, for the listener as well, sometimes I don't have good sleep.

Um, And it's actually really helpful, you know, because they also show you kind of this like readiness score to say, well, today, instead of doing a 60 minute, like, 100 degree hot yoga class, maybe I'm gonna take a nap instead, you know, like, I think it's really helpful to use that data for those kind of actions as well.

Hannah: Yeah. Just because it has become so hard to listen to our own body. I mean, I totally get what your husband is saying, it can be extremely tough. And I mean, we need to be careful as like, you know, you can, you know, high achieve your aura ring as well and like try to,

Julia: totally, totally.

Hannah: to the, I felt pressure for like, From a data perspective there too, but, um, yeah, I think in general, if you use it like a normal person, um, you should be fine.

And I'm just looking at the time, Julia, and I really want to ask one final [00:51:00] question to wrap things up. Um, and it's because. This is the angle that I love so much about the work that you do and how you again, coin it as peak performance and getting people to actually, you know, be successful and build sustainable growth in their career and achieve sustainable growth.

Because at the end of the day, I think this is what we all want. We don't really want to slow down, do we? We don't really want to like, let everything go and do yoga for the rest of our lives. We want to have it all. Like we want to have a killer career. We want to, you know, be on, you know, high profile projects and, and everything that we want to achieve.

But at the same time, we want to stay sane and we want to be mindful of ourselves. We want to enjoy our lives. I feel like that is exactly the work that you do and this concept you talk about in terms of sustainable growth. So, what do you want to leave the audience with in terms of, like, making that happen?

And maybe a belief that has helped you or one of your clients. A little switch [00:52:00] that could potentially help from feeling like you can either have a great career. Or you can be balanced, mindful, and sane, um, to, you know, thinking that we can have it both and we, you know, have it in our hands to make that happen.

Julia: Yeah. Um, I have something that's coming to my mind. Um, and it is this idea of, you know, you are a high achiever. So you have all the traits necessary to also create that balance in your life. You know, like the, um, the drive and the motivation and the, the ambition. Um, you have all of that. So apply that in your own life, you know, apply that to, to build the balance because it doesn't mean that you have to sacrifice the success.

It actually means that you're even more successful while feeling a hundred times better. Um, And I talk a lot about that in the TEDx talk. So if, um, if your listeners are curious, I would highly encourage them to, to watch it because that's kind of the, the [00:53:00] whole idea of the TEDx talk is just like, you, you already have everything you need, you know, you just need to apply it in your, for yourself versus kind of for your company or these external things.

And then the last thing I would love to leave the listeners with is with this question of, okay, what's You listen to this information, but what is one action that you're actually taking? Because I think in this world of, you know, content and information, we learn a lot of things. But what is actually the action that you take to actually make a difference?

Because I have a lot of people that come to me and say, oh, that was such a nice reminder. And I'm like, OK, that's great. And also, like, what, what are you taking to actually, like, change something now in your life? Right? Because we can know, like, there, there's this really powerful saying that I love, which is the greatest gap in life is between knowing things and doing things.

And so I would encourage the listener today to take, to take one thing that may be resonated with them and start [00:54:00] trying to implement it in their lives.

Hannah: I love that. It often feels like we've heard this before, or, you know, we listen to all the content, to all the podcasts. We've heard about things before, and we've certainly, you know, talked about burnout and I really, really like that. It's like take away one action, one thing that you can easily implement and make a little bit of a difference. Julia, thank you so much for joining me today. I feel like I could have gone on and on and on. Um, please let my audience know where they can find you, reach out to you, potentially work with you. And, um, yeah, we'll drop some links in the show notes too.

Julia: Sounds great. Yeah. Um, well, the best way to connect is on my Instagram account at peak performance with Julia and from there they will find all the other resources and ways how to work with me.

Hannah: Thank you so much, Julia. I'm going to have you on the next second time. We'll definitely make it work.

Julia: My pleasure. I would love to.

Hannah: um,