I was the guy that thought I lost my identity as a

result of not having the position I.

Inside the pulpit or inside of a denomination.

And

Now I'm able to share my testimony with anybody that I

meet inside the business world.

And I am quick to share what God has done for me because God's been so good to me.

Welcome

everyone to Seek Go Create.

This is the raspy voiced Tim Winders

coming to you.

I'm an executive coach, but right

now I sound like an

a late night FM disc

jockey.

I am just coming out of about 24 hours where I had no voice.

So bear with us here.

We've got a great conversation.

This

is where we redefine success in leadership, business and in

ministry.

Great conversations, and we've got one Today I am gonna be speaking

with and having a conversation with Joshua Brown.

He's the founder of Pressure Washing Pastor, a business

that seeks to inspire and challenge people to start pressure washing

companies in their cities.

And he does that because he believes pressure washing can provide job

opportunities, create disciples, and benefit the community.

I agree with that.

Joshua, welcome to Seek Go

Create.

Hey, thank you, Tim.

Appreciate you having me on your show.

I'm a huge fan.

You've been following you for about a year now, and I'm honored

to be here.

Thanks.

How's my voice coming in?

Is it doing okay for you?

It's sexy.

Sounds like you belong on a Star Wars film.

I'm pretty sure.

All right, Joshua.

Hey, let's get going.

First question right outta the gate gave you a little bit of warning.

We just bump

into each other and I say, Joshua, what do you do?

What

would be something you would typically tell people?

I

think I would say I'm a former vocational pastor

turned

minister in the marketplace and inviting others to do the same.

How's

that work?

That sounds good.

A lot of words

there, but I'm, yeah,

I tried to simplify it.

It's not

easy.

Background in ministry, doing work

in the marketplace, and and you're combining both of

of those Correct.

Yes,

sir.

My identity didn't change when I left the four walls of the church.

I was the same person outside that I was inside.

It took me a while to figure that out once I left vocational

ministry.

So

one of the things that I

like to do here and that is maybe

get

get people's attention right

at the start, and

I know we've got

business people, we've got people in ministry, we've got people

that are faith

people.

But

you shared some numbers

from your business with me when we

had a brief conversation a

while

back.

Yeah.

And to me that, that sort of grabbed me

because a lot of people will talk about doing

business and they can be kinda

limping along and,

Generating a

little bit, but it's hobbyish.

Can you give, just

quickly as we start

the,

I think you said

revenue numbers is

is what you did, just

the

progression of your pressure washing business over the last few

years?

For sure.

Yeah, I started the business after high school, church camp.

I was still full-time as a student pastor, campus pastor and connections

pastor at a church, about 550.

And when I got back from church camp, I played around with pressure Washington.

And then in 2017 I was like, you know what?

know what?

I

think

I can do this.

I stayed in ministry for the next three years, but my first full year 2017, I

did 225,000 inside of pressure washing.

The next year was around four 50 $450,000.

The next year was around 700 and plus thousand, and then the next almost

a million dollars, about 900 or so.

And so within four years, we almost hit a million dollars in pressure

washing, and that was with me working full-time inside of a church.

Oh, so see the reason I

bring that up, And I'm sure you've run across this, and we could be candid as

a lot of people would think something like a pressure washing business.

We use the word

business,

Yeah.

But sometimes it may be considered part-time.

They

do it on the side, which

you were doing it

on the side, but sounds like you had two full-time gigs is what you

really had.

But I'm sure you've run into people that have said I like the

thought of pressure washing, but

how much

can you really make?

Have you heard that?

Yeah I've heard that as well.

And then I hear, since we're super candid I've had folks l see where I'm at now,

pastors, and they say, the reason of your success is because you have so much money,

marketing connections, blah, blah, blah.

And I'm like, I was on a student pastor payroll for 20 years in ministry.

I had at

at

four kids.

My wife was a stay-at-home mom,

And so I didn't

have time, I didn't have money, but I did have framework

And

I feel like if we address the framework we're working with, we

might be able to work with less time, less money and get things done.

Yeah.

I'm not gonna ask you this, you might could

share briefly, but

it would be

interesting to contrast the

financial, the

salary, the reward of

the pressure washing business

versus student pastoring.

I'm sure that

in 2017 the pressure washing business far surpassed

what you were making as a student pastor.

Would that be

a correct statement?

If I

chose to utilize the profits for pay, that would be

very correct, but I had a mindset.

Of Monopoly and I

wanted to

buy every piece of property, every street that

could.

So I reinvested back in the business.

And so because I had another side hustle or a business working at a

a church, I.

the side hustle, I just reinvested back in the business.

But I could have made a very good living at that time if I wanted to

switch over, doing 225, if you, there's just, it only takes about two to

three people to do 225, 200 $50,000.

It's only one truck now.

Every truck we have does two 50.

Sure.

I'm gonna ask one more general question, and

then we're gonna circle back

and

get some testimony and

then I think we're gonna wrap up

with talking about your current

business model and how that's working and what you're doing to I call it

marketplace ministry, how you're getting out in the community doing

business, but also doing ministry.

But in general, big question.

And it's not a trick

You can

answer it however you want to, but

there are many people

that have this thought that you can only do ministry

within the four walls

of a church.

Very confined, very restricted.

And then maybe

there's some

people that also say you

you could also be a missionary and go overseas and, somewhere

in Africa or something like that.

As

have experienced this over the last

handful of years, Do you believe that you are any less of a minister?

because you are out?

I'm trying

not to guide the answer here.

Meeting with the public, interacting with people.

I guess just

contrast the two perceptions about ministry

pressure washing.

You're out,

in the

marketplace, student ministry you're working

with students obviously

in a, within a church setting most of the time.

Talk about the observations of ministry for both

of those.

So I was one of those people, Tim, when we say you were, oh

no, I was actually one of those people and it wasn't something I spoke out

loud, but it was a fundamental belief based on the way I operated ministry.

I was one of those student pastors that gave the kids

hard

time on Wednesday night if they didn't show up on Wednesday night.

I'd give 'em a call

and I'd say, Hey, where are you at?

And I'd talk to their parents.

The grandparents say, Hey, we'd love I know sports are important.

So is, renewing their minds.

So is being a part of a community, I did not understand that if my real job

was to equip them and send them to be inside the marketplace inside of sports.

And the sad truth is that whenever we are institutionalized, we think like

like

the institution

that

we're inten in, institutionalized in.

And it's not until we step outside of the institution that where eyes are like,

wait a minute, there is for me, there is more ministry going on in my life today.

Than ever in the past.

I have, the local schools have picked me up and I go coach the coaches

on creating healthy culture while they're teaching what they know.

And so I teach the four different high schools coaches and about

them coaching their athletes.

I say, Hey, you teach what you know, but you reproduce who you are.

How healthy are you right now?

And then how do we dig into your past, your father wounds, things

that you had, unforgiveness, any stressors that would've never happened.

If I'm at church Wednesday night, I was never set free to run.

And I had people that were trying to speak into my life telling me, Hey

Josh, I think you're meant to run wild.

And I'm like, I didn't even understand what that meant.

And so it took me a year and a half, Tim, of somebody in the secular.

World called the B bbb.

It was the largest gathering of seven figure business owners in the country.

They meet in Nashville and a gentleman wanted to invest in my company and

I said, I don't need an investor.

I need a good salesman.

And he is why don't you come and be a part of the bbb?

I was

is

that the Better Business Bureau?

He's no.

It stands for Bourbon, BS and Business.

And I didn't know a lot about bourbon.

Nazarene background, still don't know a lot about bourbon and

I try not to BS a whole lot.

And, but I do wanna learn about business after six months of being there.

You know what, they ended up calling

me.

You

What's that?

Get the guess.

The pressure was pastor.

And when they called it, I'm like, why are y'all pegging me

as a pressure washing pastor?

I'm not in ministry anymore.

I'm not a pastor.

And so Tim, I was the guy that thought I lost my identity as a

result of not having the position I.

Inside the pulpit or inside of a denomination.

And

Now I'm able to share my testimony with anybody that I

meet inside the business world.

And I am quick to share what God has done for me because God's been so good to me.

And so I never changed who I was, but I didn't know that I

was still very much a shepherd.

That's called to,

guide,

to protect, to lead

So anyway, so I was one of those guys,

Tim I think,

And

I've seen it too, I might have shared this with you.

I've shared it with the audience before

I was saved in a business

setting.

So my paradigm, and

I

am not

sure, God can do all types of things.

He can do anything.

We know that.

But I'd been in and out of churches all my life up

to the age of about 27, 28.

And someone would've asked me

if I was a Christian, I would've said

yes.

But I was one of these chinos, Christian

in name only, I wasn't actually participating

and had

really received that transformation of, what Christ does for us when we're able

to live out the follower of Christ.

But my observation, I've gone

Bible school, I've been around ministry.

I think that with

the religious circles and with

Bible schools, I think they're a, they're training and maybe they do it consciously.

Maybe it's not

consciously.

they're

people to think that

the most worthy thing you could do,

do is work in full-time ministry.

And I'm not saying that's not worthy,

but our conversation

here is all about that

is not the most worthy thing that one can do.

There are plenty of other worthy things in God's kingdom.

Correct.

Yeah.

And if you have any listeners that are landing with that

narrative, I would invite them

To chew on

A couple of conversations.

First, what are the chances that you're utilizing a narrative that benefits

your kingdom versus the kingdom of God?

And there were times in ministry where, I was a drug dealer, pothead

high school dropout, changed by the gospel, asked to be discipled.

The next thing I'm in Bible school.

The next thing you know, I'm a student pastor.

Next thing you know, I'm on a rollercoaster ride.

And I felt like I was running.

And I love the church.

We need the church, but I felt like I spent most of my

time running programs, events.

And trying to encourage giving and different financial programs for the

local church and missing the beauty of what we can do to invite people,

Hey, instead of planning a church, why don't you plant a business?

I wish

we would empower those who give their lives to Jesus to think more creatively

than what's been done on in the past.

And there's a piece of scripture that I feel like God spoke to me about

recently, where Jesus is on the shore.

He sees his disciples fishing with some nets and they're not catching anything.

And he says, Hey guys, throw your nets on the other side of the boat.

And they throw their nets

they pull up

and there's so many fish that they, the nets could barely even hold the gathering.

And it's if you look at what's going on in, in our country,

maybe the most beautiful place that we could exit would be

be

the church and head into the marketplace to be the church.

Because I think we're called to be on mission, not just to be,

Hey, come and come to our church

And

and serve inside of our programs and give to what I would call our kingdom.

Yeah.

That

I

love, as I

read through the gospels and I try.

How to use this.

I'm not sure if I should make, I'm

making more

of it than

it should.

That Jesus

chose his disciples

and

every one

of

them were marketplace

small business

owners for the most part.

There's a

collector and a zealot and a

other things in the mix there.

But

most of them

would've been categorized, I believe, more entrepreneurial marketplace type people

today.

Can I speak to that

for a

second?

Sure.

I went to

Exponential,

put up a booth called Pressure Washington Pastor.

And Exponential is a massive church planning organization.

And I was voted most interesting booth at exponential.

And I had people just staring at it from afar.

And I'm beside, the

Red Letter

Bible, which are phenomenal people.

They write curriculum.

I'm right beside the children's curriculum.

And missionaries started coming up to me and saying, in

our country, this is normal.

It was only inside of our culture where it seems to be

abnormal.

And now that I've been sharing this pressure washing pastor ministry in

the marketplace idea, I'm having other church leaders and pastors come up

to me and say, I've been doing this

over

20 years.

I feel like something's gotta change.

And they're thinking about their kids and their kids are wanting to do,

make a difference and make disciples.

But it's is the church the only place that we can make disciples?

What if it was inside the city?

Yeah.

I love it.

That's what we're really

attempting to get that message out here at Seek Go Create.

Also that to

me is the EIA that we see in the early church where people are,

they're working, they're ministering, they're, bringing themselves together.

They're supporting each other.

They're helping each other.

And I think that's the model that we need to look at.

I think we've tried to segment things too much.

I wanna back up

and I want to hear, because every time I've

talked to you,

you have said, Tim, can I share my testimony?

Tim,

Tim, can I share my testimony?

And I admire

someone, I,

people

ask me mine, but I'm not

because.

It does impact so many things related to my identity.

I'm not as aggressive as you are,

but

I admire it.

So let's back up Joshua,

and I appreciate that you're holding onto the words to

the full name

Joshua, by the way,

cuz our son's name is Joshua.

He's about to turn 30 years old and he's had to

fight his entire life to keep people from calling him Josh.

He says,

I

am Joshua.

I am Joshua.

And I think you've, sounds like you've done that, but back up, share wherever you

want to

start from.

I've got

some questions related to your testimony that I read

through also, but let's go back

and let's talk about I, I

call it affectionately Joshua, the early years and let's see

how you've gotten

to this point.

So what's on your

heart?

What

do you wanna share

about that?

Yeah, I'll try to make it as brief

possible, but my, the reason

I wanna share my testimony is because when I look back, I'm

like, nothing happens without.

What God has done for my life.

And so my mom adopted from Kalamazoo, Michigan down to Nashville, Tennessee

behind Hooters and Waffle House off of what's called Wade Circle.

And some people have a good adoption story and some people not so much.

My mom was not so much her dad would go to

jail

for the things that he was doing to her at 13 and her mom was addicted

to pain, medication and alcohol.

By the time she's 15, she ends up getting pregnant by a 21 year old named Frankie.

Frankie said to my mom, I'll pay for his abortion, but I won't be in his life.

My mom at 15 with nothing, no support, no money broke.

Look at her.

So like nothing, she's got nothing.

She ended up saying, I can't kill him.

And so the reason I like to talk about it is cuz I'm like, it's everything.

And

True to Frankie's words.

He chose to not be in our lives when we grew up homeless and

with different boyfriends.

And my mom had married two or three different times.

We lived in the back of soup kitchens church fellowship halls, cars, and

different cities, different projects, and moved from place to place.

By the time I'm 17, I'm in Winston-Salem, North Carolina.

I'm a drug dealer, pothead high school dropout, which makes sense.

It looks like that was my pathway for where we were at.

I had no dad figure except for Tupac, nwa Snoop Dogg.

Those were the guys that I looked up to, which I know you don't know

anything about any of those individuals,

but you're smiling.

so maybe, and.

At 19 I ended up getting in a really bad heart wreck.

I was following a friend named Pookie.

He had a 3000 GT stealth that was pearl White.

And he ran a red, a yellow light, and I ran a red light and we, and

then there was a truck that ran a red light as well, and we met in the

middle.

From that moment,

God started speaking to me, and you know what he said?

He said, he didn't tell me I

I was going

to hell.

He didn't tell me that I'm an worthless piece of junk.

He said, Joshua, I

I love

you.

That broke me.

It moved me to give the pastor my pot and God, my heart.

And that was at 19 years old.

I'm 46 today and I'm,

tr

I went back to school,

school,

got g e d, pastoral ministry degree, Christian Counseling, and

now a ministry in the marketplace.

So that's a quick snapshot.

Married 25 years, this year of six kids, 21 down to one.

So

there's so many things there, Joshua, and I appreciate

you sharing that

And

One of the things that's interesting,

as someone who

does these interviews, I always look

for

clips that grab people's attention that we sometimes put

at the beginning of the podcast.

I think I might have just gotten that clip, but we talk about

redefining success here and

often people can just make a decision and over

the course of three years,

five years, 10 years, whatever, they could

redefine what success means to them.

It sounds to me

like

there was

what

many would

say is a catalytic

event

that occurred to you at

19, but the question I've got

is were there clues.

You were alive was one of them, but were there other clues in your life between the

time of your mother saying,

I'm not gonna take this life, this living inside of me.

To the time

being 19 where you could say,

God was pursuing

me, he had his hand on me as protection, and I know it was

24 7.

I know that,

but I'm asking

about

awareness.

Are there times that you are fully aware of God's

hand

and presence

from

from that

time of your mother to

the time you were 19?

Yeah, a

hundred

percent.

And I would say the first time I was made aware of it is we were

like escaping from Nashville.

There was a guy that my mom had lived with who was violent and evil.

And I was probably about nine years old.

And

when we were in Alabama, I.

I

was invited to, the preacher was talking about giving God your heart giving Jesus.

And I looked at my mom and said, I need Jesus in my life.

Went down and I felt an experience with God.

And so I don't know theologically what you would say as far as when I saved,

always saved, or did I lose my salvation.

But I know when I was nine years old, I felt like God loved me.

And then as I look through the timeline, there's constant reminders.

And inside of my head or heart, I knew the way that I should be living.

I just wasn't living it.

And it wasn't until that moment of the collision where God started saying,

Joshua, you're wasting your life.

And so it was, there's many evidences.

I gave you a brief testimony, but God's hand of grace, I think

is evident when we take time to pause and just look around us.

Sure.

Y Joshua, I think so many times,

I

think everybody's on

journey, by the way.

And God, I felt like God spoke to me one time

after

some very challenging times

that I had been through, and I felt like he said, Tim, there

is nothing that is from your

past

that we will not use to advance God's

king, my kingdom in the future.

And I

was like going,

oh, cuz I kept thinking

maybe

there was some wasted time, or

I

wasted this away.

Or something like that.

Obviously your life segmented, pre

19 years old, post 19

years old, but instead of, I

think we could go through a lot of the negatives of your pre 19 year old self,

but what are some of

the benefits?

This is asking

to maybe shine a positive light on some rough situations, but

what are some benefits that you

still reap

from your, the pre 19 year

old Joshua Brown?

That's a good question, and it might take me a

long time to process outside of there, when anybody asks me, how are you doing?

I always answer with Dave Ramsey's answer, better than I deserve.

And it, one of

the things

I would say is that the awareness of who I was and God's love for

me

in the midst of those.

Times and behaviors that, that he chose to just love me.

To me, that's

the

overarching awareness is that to those who much are forgiven much is

expected or much love, I feel the weight of his love as a result of the

sin that, that I chose to engage in and those that did it did unto me.

And so if anything I'd say it just makes me appreciate and love him

more for loving someone like me.

Yeah, I do think that, I like that

word awareness.

I

I think sometimes

if people haven't experienced

darkness,

they don't understand light.

If they haven't experienced

hatred, they may not understand love

And that might be a deeper thing than we're trying to

look at here.

Are there

any this is not a counselor question,

but

I've recently interacted with some people.

My wife is one

that

has experienced some

some things

at a younger age.

She has been transformed.

She

is a great

woman of God, but there are some times

that some of

the things

from her past will

Just kinda rear

up.

Cause a

few issues.

Anything

growing up that, and I think this is an important part of

testimony too, by the way, because I know people deal with stuff,

Anything from that pre 19

year old Joshua

that every

once in

a while you have to lay it before the altar again

and

again.

I would say quickly, one, one thing that, that you mentioned is

often as a result of what we experience, we attempt to be the very opposite that

of, and so for me, not having a dad, I went through a Michael Hyatt teaching

years ago, and it had me create a life

plan.

And I wrote down, at the end of my life, I want to be a

godly man, husband, and father.

So that's my purpose statement.

You try to live a godly, as a godly man, husband, and father, and then maybe

let's take man out of it and just go,

husband

and father.

What

I have

recognized is that as a result of father wounds in my past, not having one

being taken advantage

of and then trying to give love both to my wife and my children,

there

there is an unspoken expectation that

I have

that they will love me more.

As a result of me responding outta my father wound.

But that's an incorrect assumption.

It's,

It's super incorrect because it really shows that I wear a mask

Of behaving in a certain way in order to get something back out of

purely loving the person in front of you without any expectation

from the person in front of you.

And so to finish this life of golly, man, husband, and father

means that you love without any expectation of anything in return.

And so I think that is the emotion and when we talk about

emotion,

I don't know if your listeners can resonate or if you can resonate.

I get tore up when I love and that love is not returned.

It's almost I thought you would love me if I loved you, but sometimes you

love and that

that love is not reciprocated.

I think that father's love is the love without anything

in return, and I feel like

that's

The father wound that I've experienced as a child that I tried to mask

myself to be a great husband, man and

father.

But to be great means you love without expecting anything in return.

I think it's difficult for

most of us to grasp

unconditional love that the father

has for us.

My, my wife and

and I had this discussion probably three

months ago because of relationship she has with her father and her mother.

I was praying for her

and I was asking the Lord what

I could

do

for her.

And the Lord

I believe

spoke to me and said

she struggles

More

than most, more than I do

with

understanding and accepting and receiving unconditional love.

And to me that's what I heard when you

just said

that I didn't try to connect dots that don't need to be connected, did I?

Unconditional love is tough for all of us to grasp, but I

think it's even tougher when

when people have had issues with their

earthly

parents.

I.

We can go into a lot of conversations here cuz we can even

get into doctrine and theology and how we're taught a certain way to believe

and think that lends us to a place that might be bigger than whether or not

God loves us while we were at sinner.

Or do you ha can a question I ask sometimes that gets a lot of, gets

me in trouble or gets the a lot of interesting questions is, can

you be a Christian and be wrong?

And then what are you allowed to be wrong about and what are you

not allowed to be wrong about?

And

And unpacking that conversation does a lot of good because it allows us to

expose the fact that we're probably wrong about something, and that wrongness

doesn't equate with God's love and goodness and forgiveness and grace

and Holy

Spirit for our lives.

And so when God went up and

Jesus went up

up

sent

us Holy Spirit down.

He's here with us.

He loves us, and he loves the people you don't know that He loves, just

like he loves you, but you don't always understand that when you're indoctrinated

and inside different denominations.

And so it's a long unpacking, and I'm not even know if I'm okay

to talk about stuff like this.

It is and but what that does is it causes the

conflicts

that occur primarily, they occur within our, what we'll

call our organized church circles.

Because I think as humans we like nice, neat

little answers, but

but that's not the way

things are

structured.

I'm in the middle of reading

the

Bible and

I just finished First

Chronicles.

I'm moving into

Second Chronicles, the life of David.

Just that microcosm of David, goodness gracious.

You

The

one that was after

God's heart.

He had He to me as the

focal point

outside of the pointing to Jesus.

He's

focal point of

the Old Testament.

Let's don't

talk about a lot of

his

issues

because there's a lot to unpack

there.

I want to transition though, because

the pre

19 year old Joshua,

all of a sudden, Event.

And now

we've got a journey that you're

on after you're 19 that led quickly into those circles of organized

religion

training to be in the ministry

and moving into ministry.

What are

you being nudged to tell us about that

period or that time

in your

life?

It's appreciated

and it's valuable.

And so I would definitely not be the person that I am today

without all those experiences.

But one of the things that I would encourage is like, when I went forward

to the pastor I really needed to be

to be

discipled.

I really was asking for someone to show me what it means to be honest.

Stop looking at pornography.

Don't, do things you shouldn't be doing.

How to stop having sex with your girlfriend.

I just needed to know how to read the Bible.

Like maybe just read with me.

me.

And

And that transitioning me to Bible school, I'm thankful for those

experiences, but it is almost the default position inside the church

culture is to send anyone who shows an aptitude to learn God's word that wanted

be discipled.

I just wanted to know what it meant to be discipled.

And what

I would encourage is to say what all avenues can we create inside of ministry

that would produce and make disciples?

Cuz at the end of our lives, all that really matters is being and

making disciples in my opinion.

And then everything else is supposed to help us get

get there.

And so I

think we can create a lot of different

intentional

and organic conversations around

it.

Yeah and the thing that kind of bothers

me

is that

discipling someone is

extremely time consuming,

requires a lot of patience.

It requires just a

lot of interaction

and being around someone.

In many ways,

this is me being a little critical of

the church structure.

I think we're just lazy.

We don't wanna spend the time.

We think if

someone pops in

on a Wednesday night and a Sunday morning, we give

we give 'em a couple verses.

That's good

enough.

It's also one

of the reasons, Joshua, I'd maybe like to know your thoughts on

this, that I've always been

wired to coach.

That's something I've always done and I look around now and I don't

think I'm elevating my profession more than I should but I spend a lot

of time with people

that I coach and work with, leadership teams of

businesses and

organizations, and I have in-depth

communications with them,

kinda like

this on a regular basis as I look over the horizon.

The closest

thing to discipleship that I see now are

are some people that do what

I do, leadership coaching, executive coaching, because my calendar forces

me to spend time with people like you that are running organizations

on a regular basis.

And if my heart's right, then we're discipling.

So

I, I wonder if we're just not creating the

right

structures to disciple

people, what are your thoughts

looking back on it

now?

Yeah,

when I was chatting with coaches at school locally,

I'm like, you guys are shepherds.

I used to be jealous of you.

Y'all have kids for 20 hours

a week and

you play games.

I used to think man, I sure wish we could do something in ministry

versus just have a service.

And there's things to do, but it can't be a conflict with everything

else that's going on in their lives.

And I'm like

the amount of

time that you get when you end up opening a, a business.

And so if discipleship is best life on a life, not from a pulpit to a

pew, then real life discipleship would be you walking alongside

of other

people, inviting them over to the home.

They're, you're confessing your sins, your fault, you're being transparent.

When you get frustrated, they see

how you

frustration and how you confess different situations.

That's discipleship.

And so I feel like creating a business creates opportunity to spend life

on a life and making disciples.

And so that's why I almost would argue that if you really wanted to

make disciples, might as well plan a, a business because then you have

all the opportunity in front of

you.

to have a life on a life discipleship.

Plus now you can pay your volunteers.

You don't have to ask them to give up more time if they're their

week, if that makes any sense.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's

good.

So as you progressed

going the traditional ministry route,

at what

point

did you start

recognizing

the need to be

more aggressive

with

business?

One quite thing.

My guess is

that regardless of what you were doing, if

it was

drugs or

selling God, you were always a pretty

strong work ethic

guy.

Would that be a correct assumption?

I would say the

desire to not be poor always motivated me to

hustle.

And so I always worked two or three different jobs.

I went to college, worked two or three different

jobs while having kids.

So always been a hustler because I always wanted to provide.

And so at

what

point.

in

your, you went to Bible school

starting doing ministry, you had

things going on.

Were you doing pressure washing on the side all along?

I.

No I was doing Uber and Papa John's and Domino's Pizza

and so I was either delivering pizzas, and this is kinda what

moved to a business is I Googled

top five

businesses to open with 5K or less cuz I didn't have a lot of cash.

And taking pictures of Cap was on the list, but also this

thing called pressure washing.

And so I had a friend that had done it and so I went out and visited

him

and he made $800 and four hours is the most legal amount

of money I had ever seen.

I'm like, bro, you're the richest dude.

I know, I think I can open up a pressure washing company.

And so I thought of what can I do to provide more value for my time?

And it was opening a side business and I didn't have all

the disciples stuff figured out.

It was more, I.

Organic discipleship because I, all the evangelism explosion or discipleship

curriculum did not teach, start a business, spend time with people

and be yourself who loves Jesus.

They didn't teach

that.

Sure.

And at what

either year,

timeframe, or whatever did the pressure washing company move

from the side hustle to a mission,

to a business's mission?

Because I know

at some point there was probably a click or

transition or transformation or something.

When was that?

Yeah, that's a good question.

And it's trying to put a date and a term or a definition

on a time, and I don't think.

I knew that we were already ministers in the marketplace.

We were already praying with people.

We were already sharing every property manager.

Every time I spoke at a real estate agent, I said, Hey, I'm gonna share

with you what we do, but before we that, can I tell you a little bit

about who is gonna be working with you?

And then I'd share a little bit of story and that story resonated

and opened up more doors.

My cpa, my lawyer, the different folks, it's like they have someone

in front of them that loves him.

So the date would be in the last six months.

I didn't realize it was a, cuz I had to do work on this thing of pressure washing

pastor

year.

I asked God this question, what do you want me to do for rest of my life?

Do

for

others what I've done

you?

Invite them into the

to make disciples.

And I was like, okay, what do I call it?

He's what do people call you?

I was like, they say that I'm pressure washing pastor.

And then it's am I using that as a marketing tool or am I like

legitimately really a pastor?

So I started reading all these shepherding books.

I'm like, wait a minute.

Shepherding is not a pulpit, that's not shepherding, like that's teaching

and we're called to teach and equip and

she

do different things.

But long story short, it wasn't until the last six months that I

would say we defined it as a stamp of

we are

called to be and make disciples.

We're going to utilize.

But we had already been doing it the whole time.

We just didn't know that's what we were doing.

Does that make any sense?

It does.

I

think it's

almost an awareness.

I believe that you were probably in that role

all along, but

you weren't aware

of it.

Would that be correct?

A hundred percent.

That's

what I'm saying, because I wasn't, I did not have the

framework to connect the dots.

My, my framework was the same framework as a guy at an exponential table who told

me that he believes common day people can start businesses, but not pastors.

And he

was selling Miv degrees.

and

so my framework was still somewhat maybe he's right because he's

educated and knows and he works at this school, if that makes any sense.

Yeah.

So one thing that's funny, I wanna read

this.

Sometimes I'll take someone's

bio.

and I'll pop it in

chat, g p t and say,

I'm about to interview this guy Joshua Brown.

What are 10 questions

I should ask?

And this one

was a funny one.

It relates to what we were talking about.

This is, this question is

sponsored by chat

g p t, by the way, and it shows the the reason why we cannot use AI for everything

it says.

Asking this question, as the pastor of one of the largest pressure washing

companies in Nashville, Tennessee,

How do

you integrate your faith and

work?

How

does this unique role

allow you to serve

God and people?

I think it's

a great

question.

I don't

like the preface of it because it's

really marrying those things we're

talking about.

You are a pastor,

you're a shepherd.

So I guess it's maybe prophetic, but

it sounds weird to ask it.

As the

pastor

of the largest pressure washing

business, how do you

marry your faith in your work?

So I'll, this

is

sponsored by chat, G P T.

Answer

that question from her.

Yeah.

So good.

And I appreciate chat doing that for me, like that's a great question and I'm gonna

start putting that more in it because in my head I'm thinking whoever controls

chat controls the world and so we need to start programming chat as much as we can.

But, so this is my thought there.

Is that when Jesus gave an

example of

of how pastors are supposed to live their lives.

He took out his outer robe, he grabbed a water basin, got on his knees and

started washing his disciples sheet.

He gets up from the table and he looks at him and says, do you

know what I just did for you?

for you?

And he says, if you, if your Lord and master has washed your feet,

you go and wash each other's feet.

And I feel like if you want to be a great pastor, you gotta be a

great lover and servant of people.

And I think of no greater role than the role of a servant leader.

And

And so instead

of saying, Hey, feed me, let me feed you.

And so I love the idea of this ministry in the marketplace.

So I'm taking it back to that terminology.

Be a great example of a confessor and a server.

And so when we talk about employees, we never use that word.

It's called team members.

When we talk about an org chart, I'm at the very bottom.

I'm an old root.

And hopefully I'm giving life and support for the tree and the fruit that

falls to grow and become more fruit.

And a lot of ministries and a lot of businesses, the pastor and the c e

o are at the top of the org chart.

And

And all their slave, all their followers and employees, I was about to say, slaves

trying to be funny, are all below them.

And it's man, we're called to die and serve and

support

all that are connected to us.

And so that's the way that a pastor of the largest per washing company in

the globe should answer that question.

The

reason that's so good.

I shared

before we started recording.

I just finished

up doing.

some episodes

on what I call the

faith-driven leader.

And

in my mind,

someone

who

is driven by

their faith

and they're in a leadership role,

they really do not own anything.

Very similar to Jesus, but they're a steward over those things

they have been gifted with.

with.

And I think you've been gifted with this.

Have you earned a lot of it with your effort?

Yeah, you

have.

But you've

gifted that.

So you're a

steward.

And a steward has one task.

It's to take care

of something and then return it

in a better condition than when they received it.

That's good.

And that's the mindset that I

just heard you say.

So

I'm so excited.

It kind of ties in with some of the teaching we just did.

It says on your site that your core values are culture,

business.

Ministry here at Seek Go Create, we say

that we redefine success in leadership,

business.

And ministry.

So we are really meshing together well.

But

talk about those core values, and

I've always heard it said that you need to be able to preach

a sermon on your core

values, so we don't quite have

time for a sermon

but just give whatever

makes sense of

what comes to

mind when I

bring up your core values, culture, business, and ministry.

I feel like is king.

Culture

is ultimately what other people experience when you're, when they're around you.

And so how does my presence make someone else's presence feel?

In doing great work inside of our own culture

creates the

opportunity To affect the culture around us.

And so for me, culture is at the very top business.

If it's not sustainable, it will die.

And so you have to be smart.

You have to learn from the marketplace.

You gotta be, in my opinion, why not be better than any

other?

Blank

out there, whether it's, selling shoes or pressure washing

services or doing podcasting.

Why

not do it as good as anybody out there on it?

And it's gotta be sustainable through making money and providing

jobs, or you're gonna die.

And then ministry.

The fruit of our businesses, in my opinion, should have some

type of efforts to do for others what they could never do for you.

And so one thing that we do in Nashville is we wash every widow's home.

We are on a mission to wash every widow's home in Nashville for free.

There's a long story there.

Don't know how much time we have, but I originally said there's no way that we

can wash every widow's home for free.

But there was an Andy Stanley quote that said, if you do, you.

Just cuz you can't do it for everybody.

It doesn't mean you can't do it for somebody.

So do for one what you wish you could do for everybody.

And so we've started washing Widow those homes in Nashville and

that's

part of our ministry inside the marketplace.

And there's other behaviors, but that's one that we can

measure.

That's

very good because

because we're commanded

take

care

the widows and the orphans.

And I

kinda love how you're bookending your life where.

in many ways

were adopted, you

were orphan and obviously you've

overcome that.

And then now here

you are in the

position to

minister to and do some taking care of the widows.

Very cool.

Now, at some point, and I think you said it's probably been recent,

you've recognized that this pressure washing pastor

model

can be duplicated.

It may not be just Nashville, Tennessee.

It can be something that can be done in

other places with other people.

Tell me about that.

that.

Tell me about the

progression that's gone on there

to

expand this beyond just Joshua Brown and his business.

Yeah, so in prayer last year, trying to figure out,

we did 1.8 last year and I'm like, okay, what's, what should we do next?

And I felt like the Lord said, do for others what I've done for you.

And that's where we got the pressure washing pastor conversation.

And then I studied what franchising and license and met with lawyers and

started looking at what all systems and what all infrastructure has to

be created to do here, what do in other places, what we're doing here.

And so basically we've created the infrastructure of how

to come alongside of a, in.

Whether it's a pastor, former pastor, or faith-driven entrepreneur, that's

the terminology that I would use.

Someone man, who is a disciple and loves Jesus and is not afraid of connecting

business and discipleship, I believe they need to be married, not divorced.

And there are a lot of businesses that it is divorced, it's not married.

And so we have created

opportunity

for other folks who are interested in opening a home service business to

Hey, come underneath our brand,

come underneath our blueprint and our coaches.

And so we've created the infrastructure to be able to launch

other pressure washing companies in other areas and not be on an island.

And when you look at ministry as a whole, a lot

times you

feel like you're all alone and you have nobody to support you or to

learn from or to keep you accountable.

That's what the branding allows in the coaching and the blueprint of growing

your own pressure washing company.

If that makes sense.

Yeah, no,

that's, that makes

a lot of sense and I

love it.

I love that ability to scale

and minister to more people, minister to more

people, is what I'm hearing.

But you mentioned licensing, franchising from the legal standpoint.

What is the opportunity that people

have?

We

have a licensing agreement that we basically go through.

We

weren't

trying to control, we were trying to gift and create opportunity, but

you have to have a lethal structure in order to not get in trouble.

And so we created a license agreement that basically sets forth the

foundation of what it looks like to be a pressure washing pastor.

You

utilize The branding browns, pressure washing and outta Nashville.

If you just look up Browns pressure washing.com, you'll see that we are

crushing it in the Nashville market.

And in my mind a brand has the ability to

grow.

And brings support when you're doing it on your own or trying

to figure out what's next.

It's like you make so many financial mistakes and it's hard to be able

to create, okay, how do I do this?

What do

I

do here?

How do we hire, how do we soft wash a house, roof wash, and blah, blah blah.

And it's like, why don't we create the whole system where we can

give the playbook, give video structure, we even answer the phones.

Cuz one thing I learned is pastors don't have time to grab their phones.

If they're trying to open a business we send the phone straight to our

headquarters, which creates a lighter payload and then like as far as your

payroll and gives the support to be able to get that pastor at that person's house.

And so that's some of

the things that

we're doing.

So

how

give

yourself a grade.

How's the expansion going?

We just started this year and so we've got five locations and.

We're actually this week we have a Chattanooga Pressure Washington pastor

that's down training with the team.

And we've got a Houston Pressure, Washington pastor coming down,

which we're super excited about.

And we've got Birmingham and we have two locations that I

started that ended up crashing.

And I learned a lot about those two fir two first locations.

And it's like you learn more from your failures than you do successes.

And we learn a lot from that situation.

So three.

Good two, a lot of learning that I went

Give us the quick tip.

What's a learning point?

We got a lot of business people listening in.

in.

What's something that you

learned that

you could share

with us?

Number one, this is

a n

I would say there's three points and then in action.

You gotta have time, money, and framework.

If you don't have time, don't have money, don't have framework.

Very difficult to grow a business.

If you make

a choice

to grow a business, you need to spend money on marketing.

At the end of the day, if you don't invest in whatever lead

generation tool that is for

your business, it is very difficult.

You either have to have phenomenal relationships, boots on the ground

mindset, which requires a lot of time.

Or you have to say, I've got, X amount of dollars to invest in

marketing that can generate it.

And we've learned the two that shut down.

They did not have the money to market.

They just, and without marketing you, you crumble.

But I was trying to be super kind.

I was like, Hey, I'm going to teach you everything we can.

I'm gonna give you our branding our blueprint, our coaches, and.

They did not have the resources that I didn't check and say, Hey, do you have

money to spend on Google Ads or Facebook or Bing or whatever you wanna use?

And they just didn't.

And so if you're out there and you're struggling to grow your business, you

need to figure out what people are doing.

They're growing in your industry and market like they're marketing market.

The thought

that just came on my mind, so many people, especially people of faith,

they'll say

God

will just bring people to me which is

correct.

However, you've gotta have the nets out there, right?

Yeah.

If you have a service to offer, there's people always looking to be served.

And I'm not a big faith-driven prosperity gospel where it's if we

just speak it, it's gonna happen.

I think God ask us to come join with him and we have to work until and plant.

So you mentioned earlier you used the term faith-driven entrepreneur.

We've used the term faith-driven

leader

here and you've talked

you used

term pastor, but

If you were to describe the person, cuz

I, I actually believe that someone might be listening in

right now that

may think I wonder if I'm one that I need to

get in touch

with Joshua.

And I'm not, it's not a

or anything, but I'm just like,

identify your

ideal person so that if someone's sitting there

thinking that they'll know if they are or not.

Yeah.

For me, the reason I started is cuz I wanted to figure out

how to provide for my family.

And so I feel like if

got a

fuel.

That feeds the fire to say when the truck goes down, when the pressure

washer doesn't work, when things don't work out the way that you're

gonna figure out how to make it work.

Which is why one of the reasons I love student pastors is cuz they can

make a lot out of a couple of twigs or a small budget or whatever it is.

They get things done.

And so I feel like the mindset of someone that says I'm going to

make this happen, and then it just, you're gonna figure it out as you go.

And someone that's not willing to quit and give up and be

humble, honest, and hardworking.

That's the characteristics that, that we promote is if you're

humble, if you're honest and you're a hard worker, those are the

key fundamental components.

In order to be the right person to grow a pressure washing company, you

need to be in a city that is growing.

If everyone's moving away from your city, it might not be a good.

A choice to try to open up a business cuz people are gonna

be holding onto their money.

Find the cities that people are moving to and open up a business there.

It'll create more opportunities to provide for other people in

your

family.

That's good.

So how

can people connect with you if they

want more or just

they resonated with your story or background?

How would you like people to connect with

you?

We'll include it in the notes.

We'll include it in the notes by the way.

Yeah.

It's PressureWashingPastor.com.

You can read a little bit there and also you can scan a QR code or click a

button and schedule a meeting with me.

I've got two hopes out of doing these podcasts and that's to do more podcasts

where I can share my story, what God's done for me, and then also see whether

or not you'd be a good partner to launch a pressure washing company inside your

city.

The,

the I love the.

Pressurewashingpastor.com.

Did

you have a challenge getting that

domain or was it wide open?

Yeah,

go to GoDaddy.

I'm like, it's open, let's go.

So anytime you hit one that's available, you get happy.

And so I was very thankful.

And that pressure washing pastor wasn't taken.

So

they weren't sending you to.info

or

anything like that?

That's

really good.

Anything else?

I've got one final question,

but Joshua, anything else

on your heart right now?

I

I know you're a man that's moved by the Holy Spirit and all.

Anything else that

you just feel compelled

to share

before we wrap up with one last question?

I'd

say it's significance.

identity, would be something that's in with a moan heart today, is that you

are perfectly incomplete and lacking nothing where with or without a pressure

washing company or whatever you're doing.

So if your listeners are here today, I believe completion is not required.

I, I feel like to accomplish something doesn't mean now you're

complete and whole based on what God has already done for you.

I feel like if we more, if we walked into the fact that God loves

us based nothing on what we have done, but just the fact of his favor

and his goodness and his kindness and we're not trying to accomplish

anything for him, but just trying to live in light of what he's done for us.

I feel like just walking wholeness be free today.

Significance and values found out

the foot

of cross.

It's a great place to

live.

What a great way to wrap a great conversation.

Thank you, Joshua.

My

final question, we are

seek,

go

create

three words

that

mean a lot to me that

share with the audience.

gonna let you pick one of those

words over the other two

that resonates.

Tell me which word and

why.

That's my last question.

Do you know how hard this question is?

I almost wanna ask you maybe, I don't know.

Yeah, I wanna find out which one your favorite.

But I would say create,

I'd

say create and I love Go.

It was a strong tie between go and create.

But if I could invite your listeners or myself to be thinking, it's like,

how do I create value inside the world?

How do I make a difference?

And so if I were to pick out a word, I'd say go create something glorious

in the name of God and His glory.

And just, man, don't sit on your hands.

Go create

something beautiful

for the glory of

God.

That's

what I

would

say.

That's cool.

Just to

give you a little clue for me,

they are

in the order that the Lord gave them to me

in a very significant time that I was

forced to

seek first.

And then

go and create,

because I had been in

the mode of creating

and anyway.

What's beautiful is that

right now you've got a business

model that you are in the mo in the

mode of creating

and growing.

So I also think that create it makes

total sense that would be what resonates

with you

you more than anything else.

Joshua Brown, thank you so much.

This has been so good.

I knew

that it would

be, I'm gonna

ask a big favor for those listening in.

There's someone.

There's

either a pastor

or someone looking to do

something, looking for the hustle or something.

They meet that criteria that Joshua

mentioned.

There's someone that needs to

hear this message

or

someone that may have been,

had the

upbringing that Joshua

had.

I'm gonna ask you to take a screenshot, or

if you're on

a player

or listening

or watching on YouTube, share it with them right now.

Don't wait.

Share it right now.

This is something that someone needs to hear.

This message will

minister to them and

quite honestly, I believe that you

needed to hear it too.

I know that I did, so I

appreciate it.

Make sure

you're

subscribed and following us on

all the platforms.

Leave reviews if you haven't done that yet.

And until next time, we have new episodes every Monday.

Until next

time, continue