I, I still understand what you're saying. What am I, what is he lying about? That he killed his dog? No, no,

no, no, no. So, so Kev, you know, Trump, so Trump doesn't lie.

No, he doesn't. All of them lie. Biden lies. Obama lies. Everybody lies. I mean, come on, everybody embellishes. Come on, you've been in politics. Come on, put up with the bullshit. You've been in politics. Are you telling me I've been in politics all my damn life? They lie.

The award winning a black executive perspective podcast presents pull up speak up more meaningful conversations drive progress and every voice makes a difference. So what's on the table for discussion today?

It's time to show up, speak up and get real. Welcome to pull up, speak up a new series by a black executive perspective podcast. You save space for raw unfiltered and honest discussions on the tough issues. Many shy away from. I'm your host, Tony Tidbit,

and I'm your co host, Chris P. Reed. We'd like to start off by giving a shout out to our partners at CODE M Magazine CODE M Magazine where their mission is saving the black family by first saving the black man. That is CODE M Magazine, two M's dot com. Check them out.

Definitely check them out. And today our round table is going to weigh on a surprising shift of black and Hispanic voters backing Donald Trump in 2024 and how they're feeling now or feeling the heat, I should say from Elon Musk's, department of government efficiency layoffs, did these voters gamble on Trump's promises? Only to find themselves caught up in Musk's government shake up while our round table is going to provide their perspectives today.

Let me give a little bit of background insight introduce our round table. So today we have some posthumous guests with us First we'd like to start with the multi hyphenated award winning dr Nsenga Burton near and dear to my heart and uh the renowned the renowned media scholar journalist and cultural critic. Dr Burton Welcome to pull up speak up.

Thank you.

Next we have Louis Rivera, author and publisher, and his latest book is After Dallas. Louis. Welcome to pull up speak up. Thank you. All right. And then rounding out the panel is Mr. Kevin Jenkins of counsel at right turn strategies. Kevin, welcome to pull up speak up.

Well, listen, guys, I'm excited to talk about these topics and obviously, you know, Dr Nsenga Burton has been on before, but Kevin and Louis, this is your 1st time you guys and look based on what you guys got going on in the world. You very busy. Oh, nine yards. I want to ask you guys a question. I'll start with you, Kevin first. And then same question to you, Louis, you know, based on your busy schedule, why did you want to join the pull up speak up round table to talk about these topics?

Well, I've been having conversations for the last several years with groups like this, and I've seen a lot of great things happen. A lot of people come together. We have difference of opinion, but we all feel that one thing that we need to do is get our group together and move towards the future. So anytime I have an opportunity to talk to great people like yourself, I'm in because I'm always learning something as I'm speaking. I'm learning something from them too. So it's a great thing.

Awesome, my friend. Louis?

I think like Kevin, um, I've been discussing these issues for, for quite some time. Um, and I think now more than ever, it's important to, um, to just dive in and get into these kinds of dialogues. One, to learn things, but also to sort of check our own Uh, perspective, uh, out on, on what's happening and things are, are, are disruptive. There's a lot of disinformation out, uh, uh, in media and it's good to be able to, again, check, check your perspective and perhaps learn some new things along the way.

Awesome, buddy. Thanks for that.

So we have an enlightened and passionate group of folks here on the panel, and we'd like to remind these folks and the audience of some of the ground rules that we have to create that type of dialogue. You guys just spoke up and I'll go through the rules. 1 through 10 here real quick for everyone. Number 1 respect all voices. Number two, listen actively number three. No personal attacks. We want to keep it civil as much as possible. Number four, avoid number four, avoid interrupting people cook when they get a chance. Number five. Stay open minded. Number six, speak from your own experience. The worst thing we could do here is say you heard a story from some third hand, fourth party individual that hasn't been validated that you don't have any actual information on because like Louis just said, a lot of misinformation is about Number, uh, seven, stay on topic. We got a short amount of time to get a lot of things out there. So we got to make sure that this flows tightly. Uh, number eight, follow the time limits to reinforce number seven, number nine, challenge ideas and not people. We're not going to devolve this into personal attacks and turn this into a, uh, joint chief of staffs meeting. Number 10, no, but whenever, whenever you interject the button to something, someone just said, it tends to devalue a bit of what they provided. So if we could help it, no butts. And if we follow those rules, we'll have a very safe and pleasant conversation.

All right, guys. Can I get a thumbs up from everyone? All right, this is a safe space, so pull up, speak up, let's dive into it. It's a group of voters that was the focus of

both presidential campaigns.

I love the black population of this country, I've done so much for the black population of this country.

From visits to black churches to specific policy proposals, President elect Donald Trump and Vice President Kamala Harris repeatedly made direct appeals to African Americans. Across the country on Election Day, Harris received almost the same amount of support from black voters as President Biden did in 2020. But NBC News exit polls show that Trump made some inroads, gaining ground among black voters in North Carolina and more than doubling his support from black voters in Wisconsin.

So To kick this off, I'm going to go to you first, Kevin, with this question. And obviously one of the main focal points of the campaign was economic priorities in the economy and things like that nature. But obviously we have some actual tangible history with this, with Donald Trump, right? We we've been there before we've seen this movie. So in the idea of what became more prevalent in the mind of the voters. What do you believe outweigh the concerns of his racist, racial rhetoric or racist behavior or however, uh, you saw that in his first term, uh, to actually align with people who were concerned about the economy?

I believe people were concerned about themselves. I mean. Supporting the democratic party and or the Republican party. It was about them. It was not about the party agenda. It was not about their personal agenda. I think people are sick and tired of being sick and tired and they're looking for alternatives. The democratic party has not been a friend to black Americans since its inception, so we have to deal with that reality and what Trump has been saying all along, listen, I can negotiate with you. We, you might get a better return on your investment if you come over and talk to us, but we've given 98. 9 percent of our power to a group that's been anti us. And I think people are sick and tired of it and they're looking for alternatives. And I think in the near future is only going to get worse because people want to hear about what you're going to do for them. So I think there's going to be a seismic shift in the next year that like we've never seen before. So just look for

what would you go ahead, Tony? Go ahead. Go ahead. Chris. I was just gonna ask Dr Burton. What would you say to that? Because your eyebrow went up when he's when he made that statement. And I want to, I want to, I

do agree with Kevin. I think that voters are getting younger. We're aging out and that they are looking for. There are need to be spoken to directly in a way that people who are in our generation and above our generation are able to understand how policies impact more than just 1 group. I disagree with the statement that Democrats haven't done anything for black since their inception. That is not. Uh, true. But what I do think Kevin is saying, and I'm not trying to, uh, woman's blame you. But what I do think that he's saying, um, what I do think that he's saying is that Democrats appeal to lots of different types of groups. And when you are not the central focus of the group. Um, and people aren't speaking to you directly, then, then you may feel that, you know, something, you know, the policies are not going to impact you. But if you have, uh, the majority of an aging population has diabetes in your group, and it has been capped at 35, that is, in fact, helping black people, if you have a policy that's going to stop price gouging at grocery stores. And that is going to impact black people. It's going to help everyone, but that will impact and help black people as well at the grocery store. So, um, I do agree with Kevin in the sense that people want to be, you know, people are curating their own experiences. Now, we're just communicating differently. We're living differently. We're living and increasingly mediated. Uh, society, and I think that people are more easily influenced by misinformation and disinformation and that unless you say, listen, Kevin, I'm doing this for Kevin Jenkins, a lot of people don't get it. They don't understand how policies impact more than 1 group, and that you will be a beneficiary of it. Even if they don't call your name.

Let me ask this before we move on from that. And this again, I want to stay with you. Um, it sounds like you believe that the next generation or, or who's up now needs to be coddled and is politics a place where people can be coddled.

Oh, no, I don't think they should be coddled. I'm actually it's the opposite. I'm disgusted. Um, yeah, because I don't think you need to be coddled. I think that you should be able to make your own decisions and you should be able to make those deductions based on critical thinking and information. But because we have been anti intellectual for a long time. So I agree with Kevin. I hope Kevin agrees with me on that for a long time, particularly as it relates to African Americans, but being anti intellectual and we have done so much damage to the public school public education. I'm here in the United States where we're just no longer competitive and the Cuts that they keep talking about are going to make us even less competitive. Um, I think it's really hard for people to think critically and engage critically and to understand, uh, what they need to understand, which is they may not call your name, but if you understand the platform and the policy, you can see where. You fall in and where you will get help and where you will get hurt. And that's why we have people right now, um, who are like, Oh my God, I voted for Trump and I lost my job because they don't think critically, they didn't pay attention, they didn't read the ink at the bottom and they didn't think he was going to follow through and they didn't follow what he was actually saying. And see what he was actually doing in 2016. So had they done that and read his platform, then they would have known, but they didn't because they wanted to believe their own curated experiences. And he's talking directly to me and he was not even talking about them or Tuesday.

Yeah. You know, so both of you guys, thank you for that. The one of the things though, it wasn't just the black population. that Trump saw an increase in his numbers. Okay,

while a majority of black and Latino voters turned out for Vice President Kamala Harris in this election, President elect Donald Trump made significant inroads with both groups, especially Latinos, to help him secure the White House. Voter surveys from the Associated Press. Show that the president elect won 43 percent of the overall Latino vote. That's an 8 point increase from 2020. And this year, 48 percent of Latino men voted for Minister Trump.

So, Louis, you know, one of the things is, and, and, you know, it's kind of interesting, you know, when we're just talking about black voters, when we look at the percentage, Trump really, overall, nationwide, increased his, uh, uh, percentage from 2020 to 2024 by 1%. When it came to black voter. Okay. However, when it came to Hispanic voter, it went up substantially 46 percent where I believe in 2020 was 36%. Okay. And then even with Asians, it went up substantially. So, let's hear from your point of view. Why do you think? That is increased. I believe if I looked at the numbers, it was 13 percent that Hispanics increased voting for Trump in 2024 versus 2020.

I have no idea. I'm just here to listen to you guys. Uh, I'm just kidding. A couple of things I'd say. First of all, when we're referring to Hispanic voters, I think it's important to understand that they're not a homogenous group. And I think that that's increasingly true of black voters. Also, um, people vote according to their own experience as there's more upward mobility in all these communities, their priorities change. So that's, yeah. That's 1 point that I think is important to keep in mind when we're talking about hispanic voters. The other thing I wanted to address is just strategically where the democratic party is they, um, if your brand is to advocate for marginalized people, um, by definition, um, you're going to be focusing on. Um, marginal, uh, issues or or smaller segments of the population, uh, whether it's an LGBTQ, uh, rights issue, um, whether it's extreme poverty, so those. Those issues are, are aimed at, or that advocacy is aimed at a very specific segment of the population that not might not translate across, uh, across a broader numbers, um, or might not resonate with, with, with, with, with larger groups. The 1 thing that I'll say about the Hispanic population is that, um, they are disproportionately, uh, religious, uh, identify with, um. With that, uh, with that Christian message and, and, and as a result, um, things like abortion, um, become a very powerful, uh, wedge issue. On the West Coast, you have a disproportionate number of, uh, uh, of Mexicans that are involved in the oil, uh, industry in, in, um. Uh, in Texas, California, New Mexico. Um, so those issues that, you know, uh, the, the, this information that, that branded Biden as someone who's going to be anti oil industry and trying to put the oil industry out of business is going to resonate with that particular pocket of voters and on the East Coast, you have Venezuelans and Cubans, um, Nicaraguans, um, that have had, uh, horrible experiences or relatives who have had Horrible experiences with, uh, with, uh, leftist or communist movements, uh, in, in, uh, in their countries. Uh, so that labeling of Kamala Harris as a communist is going to resonate with that particular group. So I don't think that there's necessarily one, uh, uh, one answer. And by the way, those wedge issues cut across all demographics and all, uh, all races. But, you know, and, and that's just, I think one of many, um, Uh, ways that, that the Republicans have been, uh, effective and the Democrats have had trouble getting, uh, traction applying older, outdated formulas.

Yeah, so here's the thing, though. I, number 1, Kevin, I hear you. Nsenga, I hear you. And, and, and Louie, thanks for that, bro, because you just broke it down, because obviously, like you just said, Hispanics is across many different type of ethnicities. My challenge, though, where I want to come back to you on this, Kevin. So I hear that. Hey, you know, it's about me. Um, you know, Democrats haven't done anything for me. And, you know, it's about us. Now we got to take this to the next level. And I hear about, uh, uh, Louis about, hey, you know, out in the West Coast. Uh, they tried to paint Biden as, uh, he wasn't, he wasn't about fracking and he was going to get rid of drilling and on the East coast, you know, they painted, you know, uh, Kamala as a socialist, right? So the Hispanics on that side thought that, Hey, we, you know, we came from communist countries, we don't want to have that. I get all that. I even get the economy part. Eggs prices are too high. All those things, all that makes sense where my challenge is. Okay. Is they voted for Trump? Okay. You just got finished talking about, uh, this, uh, Hispanics being religious and they voted for him. All right. Based on all his baggage based on all his racial rhetoric. Okay. And and then I also think that there's a lack of really history of where. Blacks and people of color have come through and all the different type of, uh, um, you know, systemic issues that they've dealt with for centuries, right? And then you have somebody that's out in the open and then use the media. See, here's the thing he said on that clip. I've been the best friend for black people, but when he wants to be able to rile his base up. He then uses racial overtones, all right, to tie into their emotions to get them to vote a certain way. So in other words, he'll use race to divide people, but then he wants people to vote for him. So that's where I'm struggling a little bit. So Kevin. Did they just submit all this? All that doesn't matter now. It's just about, you know, hey, I want somebody to look after me. And I'm not saying that the Democrats were the, you know, they had their arms. I mean, they were, you know, God and waiting. But when you have somebody that's so, uh, um, what's the word I want to use? That's, that's basically you see what you got. He's being who he is. He really, in my opinion, Is very racial, homophobic, uh, uh, uh, uh, xenophobia, anything that you can name, okay, to be fair. And he's put these things out himself, but that didn't sway people of color for voting for him. Let me hear your thoughts on that.

That's a lot to unpack, but I gotta tell you, I gotta tell you this, listen, guys, we, we're in, we're in the middle of the 21st century and people are not guided by the old forms of why we elect someone as opposed to being left or opposed to being right, or are they more racist than the other? Is one group more racist than the other? I can unpack all of that on the Democratic side. I don't, I can unpack it on the Republican side.

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What people are looking for are results. Right. So if you have after 16 years, after 16 years, 12 of those years, we've had a democratic president and none of those things was addressed at all at the racial level, at the social level, at the cultural level, economic level at all. No seismic discussion. Just stay in place. Everything will get better. And you know, by the way. When I leave, I hope and pray that something successful happens because the next guy after me is not going to do anything for you either. So for all those years, black Americans have been giving their votes and saying, Hey, listen, listen to us. We need these things to get better, to move forward. Now, snapshot with Trump in 2016. What did Trump do? Trump didn't do anything or pass any policies that affected us in a negative way. But if that was the case, Obama, if that was a case Biden, if that was a case, all of those other people prior to him, we would have got, we would have been able to get access to the power and influence that we need. So now we are in this time. They're saying we're not going back. We're not voting anymore for those guys. We're not getting any best bang for our buck. That's where they are right now. That's how they're looking at it. That's their alternative. Do we have an alternative for them? No, we don't. What's the alternative? So here's the thing. What's the alternative to go back and get the same crumbs that we've been getting for the last 50 years? So I can evaluate that public policy for days and it has not been beneficial for us at all.

So, so here's the thing though. So I hear you. Okay. And I'm not disagree. Like I said, I didn't disagree with what you were saying in the beginning. Right? My thing is, is that he voted for Trump. Okay. So let's be clear here. I've been, uh, um, and it really doesn't matter, but I've been a Republican since 1990. Okay. So just to be clear here. Okay. I voted for Bush, the father. Okay, I voted for Bush, the son. Okay. I didn't see none of this. Oh, what about me? Okay, where did that? This is my point here. I didn't see none of that then. Okay. So, so to be fair, and to you, and you made up, you made a point. I want to ask Dr. Nsenga Burton on this point because you said, hey, when he was here in 2016, none of his policies affected people of color, right? Dr. Burton, Go ahead. Go ahead. Let him finish. I just want to make sure I got it right. Go ahead, Kev.

I wanted to add one thing. I've been a Republican just as long. I didn't even vote for him in 2016. I didn't even vote for him in 2016. I really didn't, but to the point that you were getting ready to make, I just think that black Americans around the country, around this country anyway, is saying, let's have a bigger dialogue. Let's not, you know, let's not listen to that chat over here. If we have a bigger dialogue, we might come up with some principled things that might benefit our group. I think that's fair. And I think they're saying we're walking away from you. You've walked away from us and we're walking away from you. And that's what I think is happening. I think you're going to see a lot more of that.

Go ahead, Dr. Burton.

So I was gonna say, I think we're, um, you know, I said this to Tony, why are we spending so much time talking about such a small group of people? Um, because so many other, and I'm talking about African Americans, not Latino or Asian, um, because so many people did not vote Republican, but, um, uh, there were some very harmful policies. Um, you know, the first one I thought of was stopping the daily press briefings from the CDC. Um, the. In 2016, which, of course, contributed to us not having enough information about the spread of Covid and why over a million people died. And people now are living with the consequences of that. Of course, it also goes with his unwillingness. And this is 45 at the time, a willingness to read for comprehension, the data that was coming out of the and the CDC, which he's already, in terms of now, if we talk about DOGE, and I know we're gonna talk about DOGE soon. The same thing is primed to be happening because we're not getting the information that we need. They're not getting the resources that they need. And all of these things are being done to give a tax cut to billionaires. So there was information in 2016. Here's my problem, Tony, with why people voted for 47 now and this year. Because, you know, sometimes when presidents come in, you don't have any prior information about them. They might have been a senator for a couple of years or somewhere in the Congress, or they might have been a local politician or maybe even a governor. But you don't know a lot about that state. We had all the information about this candidate and his tenure from 2016 to 2020 was awful. It was horrible. We were literally trapped in our houses, wiping our ass with dish rags because this man would not adhere to health and public health guidelines that were being, uh, communicated by every reputable health care agency in the world. You know, COVID didn't start here. It doesn't have to get here. Um, and if we had done what needed to be done, we could have prevented it and we could have prevented all of the people who lost their jobs. We could have prevented all the businesses, especially the small businesses, Kevin, that went out of business, uh, 2020 during the COVID era, we could have. Um, salvage a lot of things, including our lives and lives of our family members and so forth and so on. Um, so, you know, we could go on to the central park five. We could go on, um, to him calling Haiti, you know, a shithole or whatever. Uh, we could go on to him, um, throwing paper towels at people and making jokes when they just lost their homes in Puerto Rico, um, during a hurricane. We, I mean, I could keep going. I'm just going to stop because I don't want to spend that much time talking about him, but what I will say about the voters. Um, is I think that when you are very strategic and Republicans win every time on communication, I'll give you that Kevin and the Democrats are horrible on communication. I'll give you that too. Horrible. Horrible. They are talking to 80 year old white men. Every single time. So I give it to you. So if you are someone where you like, listen, Hey, it's me. I want you to talk to me and you're not hearing your name called, or you're not part of that, you know, uh, jargon, which speaks to this very specific group, then you are going to be like, where am I, what am I getting? Again, if you're not a critical thinker. And again, I want to add to this conversation that it wasn't only because of these shifts, uh, but it's also because sexism. And misogyny and anti black racism is pervasive throughout the world. So all of these folks who are voting, not all of them, of course, but many of these folks who are voting, particularly those who, um, have the right to vote are not going to vote for a woman anyway, they don't believe in women as leaders. They don't believe in women, especially the religious, uh, right, as you say, Louis. They don't believe that women should be in charge. And then you got a whole bunch of people who are anti Black in this country. In this country. That's the foundation of this nation. Um, and who are coming from other countries, bringing that anti Black racism with them and thinking about that as they go to the polls. That's the only reason that you could be, uh, voting for someone who is telling you. You know that there's a black job, you know, they're taking your black jobs. What jobs are those the service jobs? Oh, okay. So that's what we're supposed to be doing. We're supposed to be digging Gravel and and dirt and stuff like that. Okay. Got it. We're supposed to be a great agrarian still. Okay We're not supposed to be in the c suite. We're not supposed to be president of the United States. We're not supposed to be we're Where many people are or not enough, but enough, some people are, you know, one black person. If you look statistically at the data, one black person in the C suite every 10 years at your job is one black person too many. Oh my God. We got to get rid of diversity efforts. Because I've seen two black people in 20 years in my C suite. Oh my God, they're going, they're gaining too much. All right, so that is my point. Trump is not good for black people. Trump is not good for anybody. Let's keep that real. I understand why you didn't vote for him in 2016, because if you knew anything about him prior to that, you would not vote for Trump. But to vote for him now, knowing everything that we knew in 2016, is Unacceptable. Let

me ask a question. Let me ask a question before we go too far. I don't want to separate. I want to separate the message from the messenger. And I want to ask you this question, Louis, because I believe you brought this up and it was a while ago because we've had a lot of voices, but the idea of the Democratic Party being cast as the supporters or the. Voice of the marginalized population. Where's the Venn diagram that shows marginalized? Because I have a uncomfortable feeling with terms that seem black and brown. When, if you look at the base definition of them, they're not just black and brown. So who are the non marginalized? Is that the Christian heterosexual white male? Is that the only person that's non marginalized? But when you say it's a party for the marginalized, explain that a little further.

Okay, so I did want to address something Kevin said, but, uh, respectfully, let me just try and, uh, address your question. Um, you know, the Democratic Party is a big tent party. Uh, so you have by definition, a lot of special special interest. And I use LGBTQ as an example, only because as a percentage of the population, it got a disproportionate amount of, of energy and, and, and discussion, I believe that the LGBT community deserves, um, uh, to be protected and, and, um, and their rights to be respected and every individual should, should feel safe. I think, I think. Uh, the Democrats have a communication problem in that they were unable to address that issue, um, in a way that resonated with everyone. Um, so, so that's just one example. But Kevin, I just have to challenge on on on one thing. You said, you know, for 16 years, the Democrats haven't done anything for for black people. They elected a black president. Um, and imagine Um, and I, you don't have to imagine this, but I'm putting my myself in, uh, in, in, in the place of a young black kid who gets to see, uh, the president of the United States as a black guy and realizing that I'm capable of, of, of uh, Rising to that ultimate, uh, uh, position, not that they haven't done other things, but that in and of itself, that's a generational, um, a generational impact. And by the way, that guy also passed a health care plan that lifted a ton of people, uh, out of out of poverty and, and, and, um, uh. And save, you know, tens of thousands of lives black and and white. So, to say that that we haven't, um, the Democratic Party has not done anything for black people over, uh, over 16 years is, is, uh, is somewhat reductive. The other thing I just introduced this idea and I don't. Um, I don't have science to back it up, but I did ask chat about mass mass delusion. Um, and can you give me examples of mass delusion that impacted, um, um, uh, you know, entire societies and it's. Spit out a list of, you know, 10 different examples. Um, you know, one of the ones that comes comes to mind is is during the Vietnam War. There was this the domino theory. Uh, the idea that if if 1 country in Southeast Asia fell, you know, the entire region would become would become a communist. And that costs 40, 000 American lives during the 50s. You had McCarthyism and for a while he wielded, uh, you know, Unbelievable power over people's careers and, and, um, livelihood of a ton of people. And it turned out to be all nonsense. None of it based on, uh, on evidence. I think what's happening in this country. There's no 1 answer, but there's a good piece of of that, that, um, that can be sort of fall into that bucket. 1 other point that I'd make, um, there, um, there's a documentary on. Amazon called a bad faith, and it talks about the Christian nationalists and how well organized they've been over the course of 40 years, um, in mobilizing, uh, a disproportionate impact on our political process and how. While abortion was a galvanizing force for them, what, what they really wanted to do, um, was bring back some of the, um, antebellum, um, uh, You know, basically white supremacy that it that that there is a significant portion of the, the Christian nationalists that is a white supremacist, uh, movement. Um, so a lot of different factors, uh, come into play. And by the way. I'm just going back to Obama. I think Obama helped galvanize that, that, uh, that movement. Imagine if you're, you know, you know, and let's use a spectrum, you know, on the one hand, you're a hardcore white supremacist, you keep a sheet in your closet and then, you know, you're, you know, you're that, you know, that closet racist, you know, uh, you know, people call it, you know, your, your, your racist uncle or grandfather, that entire spectrum of people were, I'll Blow it away by by Obama's, um, uh, election. And I think that that that that galvanize them and turned them into a powerful political force.

Right? Right. I'd like to say this before we move forward. Tony. I would like to discount what Louis said as far as Obama being the shining star or the epitome for the young black male who seeing him as the archetype of what could be done. only because that would mean this president is the same for the young racist buffoon out there that's up and coming and thinking he too without any, uh, coups or any, um, style or any presence could be the president of the United States. So if we use one, we have to use the other as example. And I don't want that to be, uh, empowering to, uh, the younger generation in that regard.

Well, I think you look at the House of Representatives, um,

as,

you know, as sort of your exhibit, you know, your exhibit A, B, C, D and E, you know, in what, in what normal world with Marjorie Taylor Greene, you know, be considered a, uh, uh, you know, a legitimate Representative of anyone,

and I live in Georgia and people know her and they are shocked. My Republican friends know her and like, where did this come from? How did this happen? Right?

Right. But here's the thing though. I want my brother to get a chance to jump in because obviously you had a thought you wanted to jump in before we went to Louis. But go ahead, my man.

Well, I'm not here to litigate all of those things. I mean, right, those in silos and we can talk about them all day. I mean, I have a different position when it comes to, um, Corona, the Corona virus. I understand it deeply. I've traveled over 800 and some 1000 miles fighting exactly against that. But not only that, though, I've traveled this world. I've worked in Africa. I've worked in 10. I've worked all over this planet. And I'm telling you, there's a seismic shift about what people are feeling. Even in with all of those bad things that are constructed to get people to feel one way as opposed to another way. People now are looking at themselves completely differently because now we are moving from our twenties to our sixties and we're saying, okay, here's what this investment has gotten us and it's boiled is boiling down to that. What do I need to survive? What do I need to take care of my Children? How do I move my group or my family forward? Now I can go back and break down all of the education stuff that says that we're disqualifying ourselves the way we've been educating our Children. We can go and have that discussion every day. I could come in here and talk about charter schools, choice. I could do it all day, but people are saying, what in the hell is going to happen to us? And I think when these last four years have passed us by, people were homes trapped in their, at home, trapped in their houses saying, this is what life could be for us if we don't get our stuff together. And I think young people, older people are baselining it right there. No more intellectual jab. No more. Um, I call maximum sophisticated confusion. Nobody wants to hear it. Nobody wants to hear from the right. Nobody wants to hear from the left. And everybody's saying, what in the hell is going to happen to us?

So do you

see more of that in the next year, two years, you're going to see the more of that.

So that was my next question. Is that so you see this as being a trend that is only going to grow bigger and larger versus being an anomaly? Um, you know, because to be fair, a lot of people were talking about, they voted this way because of the economy.

Well, the economy is everything. The economy is the economy is everything. And what the Democrats culturally do is keep us in these cultural wars, right? Somebody asked me a question. How did Donald Trump win? I said, it's real simple. They said, well, what do you mean? He listened to his voters. Now you say, who is voters? 77. 3 million people. 77. 3 million people. That was not about black people, white people, green people. The whole country said, I'm against that.

That's not the whole country, Kevin.

But, but see,

but I'm saying your language. See, that's what you all do. That language where you, because that's not factual. That is not the whole

country. But Dr. Burt, let him finish and then I'll hear your thought. Go ahead, buddy.

77. 3, you can go and qualify all you want, 77. 3 million people voted for him. If you look at the map, right? If you look at the whole total map, they voted for him. That's a mandate. You can't manufacture that this way. It's the truth. So now, what does that say to you? They're saying that it's not a split. People are saying we're pushing back against that narrative. We don't want that narrative. That doesn't represent our narrative. We really want somebody to take care of us. We're gonna, you need to put us first. Now that's what came out of that.

So, so, well, Dr. Burton, go ahead and respond because I, I jumped in.

What I'm saying is, you can call it culture wars or whatever you want to call it, but the fact is that we live in an increasingly anti Black, Anti woman, misogynist. But you keep saying that, though. You keep saying that. How is that

possible? I live with a woman that's an elected official for almost 20 years. I don't even hear her talk like that. When she walks in those boardrooms. I'm not that woman, though. That's what

I'm talking about. You don't have time. You don't have time to

do that when you're trying to build something for your group. So, Kev, Kev, Kev, let her finish, let her finish. I listened to this for almost a half, I didn't say a word, I didn't say anything. I listened to

you and it stopped. You're cutting me off.

Because I'm trying to

listen to you, but you are not, what you're doing is Listen, listen,

you, I, look, you, you, you can't outsmart me on this one. I know you have no value for education, I

know you have no value for education or intellectualism, I know that. I'm a PhD. I have no value. I know how communication works. How do you write

policy for a fucking education? What are you talking about?

What are you talking, you don't see, you don't even know. I am an educator.

That is the problem. That's what I'm talking about.

So let me talk to you, talk about what he asked me to talk about. No, no, you can't speak for me. Which you are doing.

No, you need to start speaking for me. Absolutely not. No, not never. I'll do this

for another hour or whatever. I'm never going to stop talking because you told me to stop talking. I am a feminist womanist and you are not going to reduce me the way you have reduced everything for people who don't vote like you have done. I

don't

care how you voted. What you are saying is dangerous because you're spewing information that is incorrect. And what I was saying is before you reduced me to just being a woman, just like the other woman you live with, who would never be me, I am saying to you that what you are saying is not correct as it relates to certain populations. Now you can pretend. And laugh and give her all you want to running me down because I don't have anything else to speak the other night, 70 percent of America

agree with them. The only movement is a white supremacist movement that's going to lap

your black ass up too.

So here's the thing though.

job. Hold on to your job. Keep doing what you're doing. Keep tap dancing. That's what I'm saying.

So here's the thing though. Here's the thing. So Kev, just going back to what you, your last point you said 70% of the pop, we can't say the population. Yeah. Wins the

popular vote by a significant margin. Thank you. Yeah.

So 70% of the people who, yeah, so, so 70% of the people that saw the State of the Union, Kev, you say agree with the president that, is that correct?

Yes.

Okay.

And then you agree with the 70 percent agree with the president.

Okay. Now, but we know that's not 70 percent of the population. That's 70 percent of people watch

70%. If you know anything about polling, they have a universe that they poll, right? 70 percent of Americans agree with what he was saying, guys. You got, this is from CBS. That is not true. This is from your

station. It's not factual. It's not factual. It's

not true. It's absolutely not. I'm telling you. Listen. You saw it on CBS. I saw it too. You don't understand how polling works. I'll send it to you. No, no, no, no. Can

I help Kevin out here for a second? Go ahead, Louis. Go ahead. Let Louis jump in. Go ahead. So, Kevin, I get that you're, uh, quoting numbers. Oh, my

God. No, no, let

me just help you out here.

Oh,

what? I guess it was in relation. Hold on. Lou. Hang on. Real relation.

He, he, he, well, one thing he is right, because I watched CBS, they did say, yes, so, so, so when you

speak in absolutes, it's easy to challenge. It's 70 percent of the people surveyed who watched the, who watched the, uh,

it's the same guys, you know, because

some people opted out. because of indignation. There was Republicans, Democrats that didn't even exactly. I'm a political junkie.

I didn't watch and people in my circles made it a point of boycotting the speech, but that's okay. It didn't make anything that he said any, any closer to the truth, but here's the thing because 70% Of people like that didn't really make it. So here's the thing.

What Kevin is saying, no regard, forget the numbers, forget, forget, forget what he's saying is that the country is moving in this direction. This is not an anomaly. Okay, that this is a trend that's going to continue to go on. Is that forget the numbers on air? Is that what you're saying?

And that's exactly what I'm saying.

Okay. Okay.

Exactly. I, I think he's saying, I, I, I agree

with, with Kevin, by the way, and I, I guess the, the, the things that, that we might differ on is why I, I think the disinformation machine, um, yes. Has, has, uh, is penetrated, uh, our society in a way that has made. Uh, factual information, almost irrelevant. And no one delivers a hawk or a line like like Trump. He is an effective communicator and repeating lies. He does not back down. And that absolutely has an impact on the electorate.

So hold on 1 2nd, Louis, because I got to jump in because you said something right. And I got it. I got to throw this in here. So, Kev, just real quick.

Yeah,

that we know is that factual what Louis just said about Trump about him lying and just repeating stuff. That's no, that's not true. Pushing stuff out there. Continue being part of the disinformation and this is do you agree with that?

Well, listen, I'm not here. I don't follow every word that he says.

Okay.

But from a policy perspective, the things that I'm interested in for my group, my people, he's going to do a great, great job. And he's been doing, can you give me an example of any of those things? Has he lied about any of those things to you and your, I mean, your perspective.

But,

but Kev, what if they're an example? You actually, listen, yeah.

Two, two policy, two policy initiatives.

You asked a question about what did I think about what he was doing. I said, listen, I can't speak to everything he talks about all the time, but on his tax policies, no taxes on tips, no taxes on social security. Those kinds of policies are going to be great for Americans. When we move forward, his tax policy, listen, it was his tax policies that he signed that was going to Phoenix out. And if it would have, we'd have been even in worse condition. No, no, no, no, no.

I get that part. I get that. No, I was asking about him lying though. That my question was about him lying.

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Lying about what? I, I still understand what you're saying. Like, what am I, what is he lying about that? He killed his dog or what? No, no,

no, no, no. So, so Kev, you know, Trump, so Trump doesn't lie.

No, he doesn't. All

of them

lie. Biden lies, Obama lies, everybody lies. I mean, come on, everybody embellishes. Come on. Have you been in politics? Come on, put up with the bullshit. Have you been in politics? Are you telling me I've been in politics all my damn life? They lie. You, Kevin, you never worked in government before.

I worked in government, so they lied. We we know. So listen buddy. So guys kidding me, your hat on that? No. So I mean, so I'm you right, y'all,

y'all really, if y'all believe that y'all do have a brain process,

KEF, kef, kef. So just to be fair though, right? So every person lies, we know that, right? But let me, let me give you an example. Okay, let me give you one example, specifically when he was saying that the, that the, uh, the Haitians were eating the dogs in, in Ohio, which was not true. Okay. Which was not true, right? Flat out. Even the city commissioner, the chief of police, the mayor was like, that's not true. Right. Those are the things that we're talking about.

Endangered that community. It's not just that that it was a lie or hyperbole is that Haitians in that community began not being able to show up for work. I mean, they were fearful for for their for their lives. Uh, and by the way, that that city welcomed Haitians. They actually. Um, it was an initiative, a city sponsored, uh, initiative. That's just 1 of, uh, and these have been thoroughly documented. If you choose to ignore it, there's nothing that I'm going to say. It's all these things are provably false available, uh, for anyone to to, uh. To, to evaluate and discern and the damage that, that these things do that his lies, uh, have done and, and to individuals and, and, and to the country is immeasurable. But you could choose to ignore that, but, but it doesn't change it.

And the Washington worker, the Washington Post, go ahead. Go ahead. The Washington Post some data. The Washington Post, um, had an article today, um, and that is his boy Jeff Bezos publication, the Washington Post, um, stated that he lied. 26 times about 26 different policies in his State of the Union speech, and they outlined it what he said versus what the reality was. So I would encourage people to go and check that out so that they can make that determination as well.

Well, here's the thing, though. I agree with Kevin on

one more thing. Hurry up, buddy. The Social Security, uh, um, uh, tax forgiveness, um, or eliminating that tax was a brilliant, uh, brilliant move. It was Reagan who actually, uh, put that tax in. But, uh, I'm surprised that the Democrats didn't, uh, come up with something comparable. I don't think it's going to make it into the final, uh, budget bill.

So, but here's the thing, though, right? Right now What we're having in the government. So look, at the end of the day, Trump won. He's the president on nine yards. Um, but a lot of people didn't expect that doge would be doing what it was doing. Even the people that voted for him to be fair now that even the people that voted for him, they didn't have an idea or a sense that this would cut so deep and so hard.

We've covered musk and we've covered the tech industry for a long time. We've covered startups. We understand. The Musk playbook when he goes into a company, what he does, what we know about startups and what we know about the tech industry is that this move fast, break things model that is often applied in that industry and often applied by Musk often does break things. The United States government is not a startup. If we treat it like a startup, there is a high probability and a high risk in our view that it will break. Are there changes, are there efficiencies within the federal bureaucracy that we could find, right? Is there cost to cut there? I have no doubt. I'm sure there is, right? It's a very large bureaucracy. It is not a startup. It is not a tech company. It's the federal government.

So Kev, just based on what's going on right now, right? Um, obviously, let's be fair here, right? There is a lot of waste and stuff in the government. This is nothing new, and it makes sense to be able to cut. And, and trim and, and, and find fraud in the whole nine yards. Right. However, the way that Musk is going about it and look, we're not even 60 days based on president Trump taken over. And I believe, what did the numbers say so far? It's been 63, 000 people that have been laid off of fired by the U S government. By Musk, I should say over 17 different agencies. Right? And so let me your point of view. Is he doing the right thing? Is this something that he should do? Not just should he do it in terms of trying to create efficiencies in the government, but his tactics in terms of going out and the way that he's currently executing. I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Well, Bill Clinton did the same thing. He did. 377, 000 people lost their jobs, didn't lose their jobs, but were relieved of their jobs, however you want to put it. Um, Obama did the same thing, exactly the same thing, and actually created a division that DOJ is sitting in now to do exactly What Elon Musk is doing at this present moment, and I think all of us should be happy about that. So it's been talked about through all of these presidents, and he's actually doing it. So, um, and look what he's finding. So everybody should be happy about that. Those NGOs are nothing but, uh, I think PSY operations to pull coups around the country. I think the money that they've been spending, that's how they're building their wealth. They're building their wealth on the government, you know, so at the end of the day, I think he's doing the right thing. And I think everybody should be happy about it.

Let me ask you this, Kevin, I'm gonna stick with you just for a moment. Is there any danger in running a government, uh, that is, that is comprised of a society of individuals, like you would a corporation or a company that has barriers of interest or a startup because any employment has backgrounds and education criteria and prerequisites and things of that nature? A society does not. And so to treat it like it's a company may not be as advantageous for those who didn't sign up for this.

Well, listen, running it like a company or not running it like a company, it doesn't really matter. It's he's the executive. He's the executive leader of the country. He's saying this is what my process is. This is who I'm choosing because I have the right to do that, to go and seek out all of this waste and report it back to me. I can do that as a CEO. I can do it as a executive director. I could do it as a president of the United States of America. He has that authority. Like the Senate has the authority it has and the Congress has the authority that it has. But do you like the haphazard

way in which is being conducted? I guess is my question. Do you believe it to be? Efficient in the way it's being gone about.

We can't define that. If he's saying here's the outcomes to all of that, that, that works.

Do you believe that's dynamite fishing? Well,

it's been done over and over again.

So it was done. Clinton reduced the government by 12%, right? But he didn't his, the way he did it. Wasn't this way. Okay. To be fair, right? Now, Dr. Burton, let me ask you this question. A lot of people believe that he's doing this is to be able to find money, um, to be able to extend his tax cuts. Okay. So basically, they're out trying to Cut and we totally get it. Right. But at the end of the day, they're never going to be able to cut enough. I believe it's a trillion dollars that they need to get to so that he can be able to extend his tax cuts and the only there's 2 pieces, big pieces. So no matter how, how much he goes through Elon Musk, the numbers ain't gonna add up. Unless he attacks Medicaid or social security. Okay. So do you believe based on, um, well, every, based on this is just the right thing to do in terms of being able to find waste and save the tax day, uh, taxpayers money. Or do you believe there's a bigger issue to this more about the tax cuts versus finding efficiencies?

I think the smash and grab approach, um, to downsizing your government. Is not appropriate. Um, you are correct. Other presidents have downsized the government, but they had a different approach and his approach is not. I think that he's motivated by getting rid of regulatory agencies that will have some type of oversight. Um, you know, whether it's on my and I'm talking about he, um, Musk when I say he, um, on musks, um, and he has billions of dollars of contracts with the federal government. I mean, you can stop funding yourself. If that's what, if that's the case, you want to find money for the tax cuts, but he's not doing that. He's getting the people out of the way, um, who regulate. Not only SpaceX, but also Tesla. Um, and then he's actually, you know, you're firing people, but then you enter in a new multi billion dollar contract to have your cyber trucks, uh, bought or purchased by the U S government. So you can't, you know, talk out of both sides of your neck. You got to decide, um, what you're, what you're doing. And I think that they don't care about the American people. Um, I think that they don't care how many people or how fast they can fire them as long as they're able to say, hey, we were able to take, uh, give you a tax cut. Uh, see, see here, they want us to remember that little bit of money that we get just like people, you know, we're like, well, I'm going to vote for him because you say he's going to give me 1200 or whatever the number was, um, that he said that he was going to give and then buskers turn around talking about, oh, we can maybe we can give them 5000 just throwing out these numbers when we know that that would. You know, the not would not be great for the government or for the American people. So, uh, the point I'm raising is, I think it's beyond even what you're saying it is. It's not about the economy. It's about, um, protecting himself. That would be Elon Musk. It's about having power that he normally would not have, and damn sure would not have in South Africa, even from the Nationalist Party. Um, and it's about being able to position himself and his company, um, which are failing by the way, um, in ways that will help that would help save them. And he is not above, uh, firing people because there's no consequences for him. There's no consequence. The consequences are going to be for Trump. They're not going to be looking for Elon. They're going to be looking for Trump. So

the issue I have here is you guys collectively have cast the, uh, American citizen as only concerned with their own self interest. And in a society, in a society, we can't operate in that way and we need some type of governance and government oversight. And so my question to you, Louis is, are we selling the United States? Oh, go ahead. Go ahead. Just real quick. I was saying

we were talking about why people voted for. Trump,

right? That's

what the response was. I don't think at least for me, I wasn't talking about everybody. I was talking about the people who voted for Trump. I'm not talking about everybody.

Got you. Okay. Okay. But when you talk about the 5, 000 and I got you, that's what, okay, I'm getting you. But in the idea of a foreign national in the white house, making business decisions on behalf of the American public or that are, that is at least impacting the American public. Are we selling and we're talking about selling citizenship or whatever the cards or whatever the case may be. Are we selling away the country in your perspective,

uh, Louis, can you clarify that question? Do I think that, that, uh, Trump is looking to profit from, from his position or when you say we, that's a misnomer.

Uh, no, I mean, are we, are we putting the United States up for sale, citizenship access, access to government, you know, access to government offices and, and secrets and data and all that seems to be up for grabs based on the highest bidder.

Yeah, allow me to touch on the, on the data piece. The other stuff is, is not a question of my opinion. He's already said, you know, you could pay 5M dollars to meet with him in Mar a Lago. But let me just touch on the data piece. Um, I don't believe it. This has anything to do with efficiency. And I think it would be kind to say that it only has to do with a public relations, uh, stunt. If you. Um, If you wanted to audit an organization for efficiency, you would have forensic accountants going in there who specialize in in government, um, contracts to be able to really sort out what what's going on. He went in there with coders, accountants audit. Coder's hack. Um, they now have data on, uh, millions and millions of americans. One thing that I was really surprised that didn't get a lot of attention other than the ridiculousness of the of the message was that he gave himself the ability to email every single federal worker on on on the payroll that speaks to, um, uh, a level of access that, uh, you know, That there's all sorts of laws and regulations that that, um, that regulate how any employee, including the federal government would have access to that information. And 1 thing that make a nice bridge between the disinformation conversation and doge, uh, today, um. Uh, Breitbart ran a headline saying Doge announces the cancellation of NIH grants for transgender experiments on animals, which, of course, Trump said they found a line item that the NIH was sponsoring Um, transgender surgery on, on, uh, on animals, uh, a statement that is so ridiculous that on the face of it should be dismissed, but Doge has now doubled down and said, Oh, we found that line item and what that is, it's not transgender, uh, uh, animals. Surgery on, on, on animals. Um, it's transgenetic research and I'm, this is right off the NIH website. Transgenetic research is considered a major technical advancement in the fields of developmental biology and genetics. The technology now referred to as Transgenetic Mouse technology has revolution revolutionized virtually all fields of biology and provided new genetic approaches. to model human diseases. So not only did they Get that wrong. Try to turn it into a wedge issue, but they've actually cancelled research. That's helping save lives. So this has nothing to do with efficiency

to their credit. They've often say, oops, my bad a lot. I bet. Yeah. Oops, my bad. So, well,

here's the thing though. So right right now we're, we're in it. Right? So my final question and then I got a bigger question. I want to ask everybody, but my final question, Kevin, I'm gonna come to you. Okay. Is that at the end of the day, um, the, the tax cuts. Okay. So, uh, Dr. Burton was saying, and, you know, somebody's gonna get 1200 bucks. I was gonna get a 5000, but really the tax cuts is for the 1%. Okay. To be fair. All right, for the corporations is for the billionaires. They're the ones is going to benefit the most out of these tax cuts. And while to Louie and Chris's point in terms of the efficient, this is not being efficient. This is tearing down organizations. Right. It's not going through with a scalpel. It's not using as Louis said, um, uh, forensic, uh, government individuals that would know exactly where to go and look. This is really just coming in with a sledgehammer and tearing it down. Do you see this moving forward? Do you see the federal government breaking? Because it's not a startup. Do you see this being a situation where it's going to cause more harm that we don't even know about right now? Or do you just see this as, hey, he's doing what he's supposed to do, and this is going to save us money. And more importantly, it's going to make the country better.

Well, you asked a lot of questions right there. Excellent. That was a lot. So pick one. Let's talk about the tax policies, right? Yep. The tax policies are no tax on tips, right? No tax on social security. And what was the other one on my brain did at this moment. So his tax policies is right in front of you. He's trying to alleviate all of the taxes and all of the things that hinder us from, I believe of creating small businesses or getting access to capital. I mean, we have a lot of barriers in front of us. And I think a lot of those tax policies are going to be very, very helpful to the middle class and the people that work hard every day. I believe that. That is proven. When you do that, when you turn on that faucet, that is proven. Now, all the other policies, I'm not here trying to figure out all of those other things, but I'm suggesting that the more, the less wars that we're in and the less money that we spend all over the world trying to dictate what other countries do can bring more value to our bottom line. If it's social services, whatever that looks like in the future, if it's education, whatever that looks like in the future. Or if it's something that will drive economics and those local communities. If that's in our future, I think that opens up a big discussion for us to have. So looking back and saying these, these, um, um, prescriptions of policy prescriptions were not were helpful, but let's say which ones are going to be better in the future. What, why aren't we doing that? All I hear from everybody is like Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump. And I'm like, well, wait a minute. How did we find ourselves here in the first place? So here's an opportunity to move and have a different kind of conversation. So what's the problem with that? Everything that elected officials do is not going to be perfect. Because I can go back verse and chapter and verse and deal with that. But what do we do about moving in the future? What about it?

So, so you would be against us taking over Panama Canal, taking over Greenland and annexing Canada based on what you just said, correct?

I would be against

it. Yes, because you just said we're not trying to wage.

If it's an economic opportunity for this country, I would be for it. Why would I not be for it? Because you just said,

you just said. No.

Colonialism.

No, I'm saying, no, no, no. No, I'm saying, I'm not, some of his prescriptions, the former, whoever you like, just think, if you say for 20 years, 30 years, we supported this group. They're policy prescriptions have not really helped us in a big way at all from an economic development perspective or a community development perspective. So I'm saying to you, here's another alternative. People are looking for that, even if it's him or someone, someone else or some other group, they're not buying it anymore, which is selling and not buying

right. So, Kev,

there's going to be some improvement on the tax side on the inside. He's saying, listen, administrative state, you've been running this country into a hole. It's his prerogative to get rid of them. That's just prerogative. It's business. Get, he got rid of him.

Here's the thing though. And, and, and look, two things can be right at the same time, right? Where I, and Dr. Burden, I want to give you the final thought on this, but where I struggle is that, and I'm just listening to what you're saying and I'm really trying to comprehend it. The thing is, is this, it's like for, until Trump showed up, everything was horrible. Okay. The government was horrible. We didn't grow. We've been going backwards ever since. And that's just not true. Okay. When Bill Clinton was president Obama sold hope. Obama sold hope. Hold on. Hold on. No, no, no.

Kev. Kev. Kev. Hold on, Kev, hold on, hold on, hold on. Change whatever Clinton was. Bill Clinton. Clinton

said You wanna change tomorrow? Wait a minute, when Clinton gotta know that. But here's, here's, here's the thing though. Kev on now. When Clinton was president, come on. Okay. Let's be fair. The economy grew like this. Why? Okay, why so? Hold on one sec. You just got a minute, minute. My point is people forget that today. Okay. Now it's like for the last 20 years or last 30 years, it's been horrible. And this is not true. That's my point here, right?

When I'm not suggesting that the economy was bad for 50 years, I'm saying you had, you asked a conversation for the last 16 years of those 12 years, right? There's been no real growth in my community whatsoever from economic development perspective. I'm looking at tax policy, so the question was tax policies. All of his tax policies freed up capital to be dispersed into those markets where people were spending their money, stimulating the economy. So I'm not, all of that emotional stuff I'm not even interested in. I'm saying here are some things that he's doing and I can go on and on and on and on without all of the other color to it and say it's beneficial. You just got to know why. Right. Okay. That's all I'm saying.

Dr. Burton. Last, last point. Last thought on this.

I think that, um, a lot of people are duplicitous and they say one thing and they do something different. I think Trump is a lot of people and I think Elon Musk is a lot of people. Um, and I do think that they are not interested in efficiency. They are interested in anarchy and chaos and confusion, which is why he makes these grand proclamations. I mean, there are 101 lawsuits. Now. I think we're up to 101 lawsuits against things. He said he's going to do. He's done them. He's not legally able to do them. So now we got to go back and figure out how to fix it. You know, if they, if they want to fix it, he's, he's, uh, doubling down on some things too. Right? So I think that. Okay. We are in trouble. I think that our government is going to be broken even more so than it already was challenged. I won't say it was broken necessarily. But yes, it needed to be more efficient. I agree with that. Does it need to be more efficient by, um, telling people that they're firing them for 4 performances? And they're actually able to document and to produce, uh, evidence that they did not have poor performances. They have been overperforming, uh, for the last 10 years that they've been in the role. Um, and so I think that you have to be more thoughtful and intentional. I think that Louis was hit that was right on target with the forensics accounting, which typically happens and should happen. Um, but no, I think our anarchy is the order of the day and it's an abuse of power. Um, Elon Musk having access to all of our private information, uh, is an abuse of power. We did not elect him, by the way. Um, and so no, I don't think that is sufficiency. I think we are in trouble and no one is coming to save us.

All right. Well, listen, let's get final thoughts. Okay. Appreciate the last, uh, the last segment. Louis, kick us off, buddy. Where do you want to leave the audience?

I think we're at a unique moment in time. We're at a crossroads. Um, I think many of us, I think the country in general has trouble wrapping their head around what's actually occurring because we believe it can't happen here. And it is happening here. Uh, and the reasons for it. Um, are complex. I don't think there's a, a single answer to that. I think that's something that historians might look back on on this period in time. And, um, uh, And help explain what it is that we're undergoing the Weimar Republic just before, um, uh, Hitler sees power was 1 of the most sophisticated societies on on the planet. Um, so I think we're living through challenging times. I think it's important for us to continue discussing the issues in an open way in an honest way, being intellectually honest. It's important to discern fact from fiction. Hyperbole and most importantly, and this is what I've shared with my daughters is that it's important for us to build the communities that we want to live in. The government might not reflect our values, but we do retain the ability to build the sort of communities and lives that that we want to live in and that. For the moment is still within our purview. So, uh, I look forward to continuing these types of conversations because I think it's healthy to discuss it. Um, and I, I try and stay optimistic about the future.

Awesome. Gav,

well, thank you for inviting me. I love these conversations. I mean, they're really heartfelt conversations. I think we should be open to it. And, um, I think this is a great time for the country. I think this is a great time for my group to do some real reassessment of where we see ourselves in the future. And everybody's, you know, thoughts are very, very helpful as long as they are built on with context. And I really appreciate that. And, um, thank you. Anytime you want me to come on, I'll come on. It was a great conversation. I appreciate it.

Thank you, my brother. Dr Burton.

Uh, thank you for having me. I think that we need to, um, be very clear about how we communicate, uh, particularly when it comes to these disinformation and misinformation campaigns, uh, that influence people to do things that are against their own interests. Um, I think that people need to think for themselves and think critically of all involved, whether it's your party or another party. Um, and I think that people have to stand up to what is happening, um, or else we're going to get run over. I mean, we're being run over now. Um, and so it's important to understand the policies that are in place is important to understand where they come from, and the history behind them. It's important to see who has done what. It is important to understand that there was a lot of rebuilding that had to be done in this last administration based on the devastation of the 45 administration. Um, and so some of the things you may have thought you were going to see, and you weren't able to see, uh, were because of that. But I think, ultimately, what we need to do, and I think Louis hit the nail on the head in that way is to learn how to live together and how we're going to do that. And what does that look like? And how we're going to be accountable to and for each other because we're not, you know, we're not going anywhere. People are saying, oh, I'm going to go here. I'm going to go there. Some people are going to become expats for sure. Some people became experts last. Uh, administration, some people became expats and with 45 administration, um, but, you know, ultimately we are all here and we all have to live together in the same neighborhoods, go to the same schools, um, different churches because it's America. But ultimately, we want to figure out how to live together in a way that is meaningful and to have a government that works for the needs of all, not just some.

I love it. I love it. I really, so number one, we want to thank you guys for coming on, having a very spirited conversation. These are conversations that we have to have. Okay. Uh, to be honest, I sat here today and I learned, I learned a couple of things, which was great that I didn't know. So I want to thank the guests for coming on and sitting down around the round table and sharing their perspective. So now I think it's time for Tony's Tidbit. So, the Tidbit today, economic storms and political shifts may shift the table, may shake the table, but the same hands that cast the vote have the power to rebuild when the systems try to break us. Our communities are built to weather it all. And you heard a lot about community and stuff today on this episode of pull up speak up,

and this is a time in our program where we want to make sure that you tune in to our segment need to know when the singer tune in to Dr. Burton segment need to know, uh, black as you get a perspective podcast is where Dr. Burton dives into timely and cultural topics that shape our community and our world. And you just got a slice. A piece of what that could, that could entail each and every week. So make sure you don't want to miss it.

You don't want to miss it. And you don't want to miss the next episode of the black executive perspective podcast, where we bring those hardcore conversations, powerful insights on the issues that matter most. It's not just a discussion, it's a movement, so don't miss the next chance to tune in to be inspired and join the conversation.

We also like to impart our call to action. We always want you to remember incorporating less, L E S S. Our goal here is to eliminate all forms of discrimination, and to achieve this, we're asking everyone to embrace L E S S. So the L stands for learn, educate yourself on racial and cultural nuances. I love the fact that we today didn't get a chance to hear ourselves in an echo chamber and we had different perspectives of thought, experience, education, location, and things of that nature were passionate, enlightened individuals were able to speak their piece. And we went away with something that we didn't have when we got into this conversation.

Absolutely. And then after you learn, you have E, which stands for empathy, to be open to understanding diverse views, so you can put yourself in their shoes. And we did a lot of that today. We had a lot of diverse views. Views here, which enlightened us all.

And the first S stands for share. You want to share your insights and enlighten others wherever you can. Don't hide it, divide it. And make sure that you can dismantle misinformation where it comes before you.

And the final S is for stop. We want to actively stop discrimination as it walks in our path. So if Aunt Jenny or Uncle Joe say something at the Sunday dinner table that's inappropriate, you say, Aunt Jenny, Uncle Joe, we don't believe that, we don't say that, and you stop it right there. So if everyone can incorporate less, L E S S. We'll build a more fair, more understanding world, and we'll be able to see the change that we want to see because less will become more.

We'd like to encourage you to tune in to future episodes that we have of all of our different shows that we provide here on A Black Is In The Perspective. Go back and look at some of the previous episodes of Pull Up, Speak Up, and other things that we've done in the past. You'll be thoroughly entertained. Make sure you go to the website, sign up for the newsletter, leave us a review, subscribe. Listen on your podcast. Where can they find us? Tony

Buddy. They can find a Black Executive Perspective podcast on YouTube, apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcast. And you can follow us on our socials of X, YouTube, TikTok, LinkedIn, Instagram at a black exec for our fabulous round table. Louis Rivera. Kevin D. Jenkins, Dr. Nsenga Burton, for the co host with the most, my boy down in Dallas, Chris P. Reed. I'm Tony Tidbit. We talked about it. We laughed about it. We screamed about it. We had a good time about it. We love you. And guess what? We're out. A Black

Executive Perspective.