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A fun topic today is employee
advocacy really just an engagement

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pod with a company logo on it?

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G'Day everyone.

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It's Michelle J Raymond, and I hope
that you're all having a wonderful

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week wherever you are in the world.

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And this week, listeners, we're gonna
have a bit of fun with this one, and it

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was sparked by a LinkedIn post that I
saw that really grabbed my attention.

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Now the person has since blocked me.

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Like I don't even know
what's going on there.

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I thought we were just having
a backwards and forwards

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conversation, but here we are.

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So I thought we would continue the
conversation here on the podcast.

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So what was the post?

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The post was essentially capturing
some information that the person had

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seen where a brand was going on, about
how great their marketing strategy

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was because essentially what they did
was got their team when they did a

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post, drop it in a Slack channel, and
then the whole idea was all the other

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employees would then swarm to that post
and then like, and engage and comment.

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Now on the surface that sounds like
employee advocacy to me, but the person

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was most upset because they said, this
isn't good marketing, that we should

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actually leave it up to the audience to
decide whether the content is good or not.

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So IE put the post out there.

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See what the audience reacts,
without the help of all your

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teammates and go from there.

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Now there's pros and cons to
everything in life, and I thought

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it would be a bit of fun to have
this discussion in today's episode.

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When we get to the end of the
episode, I'd love to hear from you.

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What do you think?

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Is this a great marketing strategy?

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Is it employee advocacy?

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Or is it an engagement pod
with a company logo on it?

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Let's get into this right after this quick
word from our podcast sponsors, Metricool.

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Let's start with what I think an
engagement pod is, and I think that's a

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great place to start, 'cause not everybody
knows what they are or that they exist.

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But essentially for me, an engagement pod
is a group of people most likely going to

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be strangers that have no real relevance.

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Set up a reciprocal arrangement,
normally these are paid groups

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that they wanna be a part of.

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Where each time you do a post,
they will engage with your post.

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And these are done on scales
of anywhere from small groups.

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It could be a group of friends, say
10 or so people all the way up to

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manufactured pods that are closer to
hundreds, even thousands of people

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that pay to be a part of these groups.

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And it's all designed
around gaming the algorithm.

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So the algorithm typically in the
past has always loved that if your

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post goes live, the more people
that engage quicker the more that

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it would show it to other people.

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'cause it seemed like that post
was popular and resonating.

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Now I'm gonna park it to the side right
now that LinkedIn is wiser to this.

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All the social platforms are, and they
have things in place where this isn't as

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effective as what it was historically.

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But let's just park that
idea just for a minute.

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.
But ultimately, when we're talking
about engagement pod behaviour,

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what they're after is reach.

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So they don't care about relevancy.

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It's about how can I look as popular as
possible so that I don't have to deal

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with the fact that as I'm sitting here,
my post has got zero likes and the next

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post that I saw in my feed, they've
got hundreds, they've got 50, they've

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got 80, like whatever the numbers are.

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Like let's be clear.

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When you're starting out on
LinkedIn, it feels awful.

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So if you get an invite from somebody
to say, come and join my community.

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We all support each other.

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Doesn't that sound amazing?

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Like of course, like I'm on
team community, don't get me

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wrong, but engagement pods
are really just run for money.

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The thing that you need to understand
listeners, is that some of those

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let's call them famous, or are they
infamous, faces that you see on

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LinkedIn that consistently get hundreds
of likes every single post without

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fail, with the same people turning up?

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What do you know?

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It's a sure sign that this is
probably linked to an engagement

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pod of some description.

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Now, I don't care what names they call
'em, you can come up with a fancy name.

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The idea behind them is exactly the same.

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So if that's an engagement pod, what
is employee advocacy meant to be?

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Because I think that's important
that we have a look at that as well.

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'cause that could also be a term that
some of you aren't familiar with.

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So think about employee advocacy like
within any one company, the idea is

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that you would get your employees
out there and active on the platform,

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posting content around the brand,
or topics related to the brand, but

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they're adding their own perspective.

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And also, at the end of the day,
representing the company brand.

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And the reason that employee advocacy
is something that I am really on

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board with is because we know when
it comes to platforms like LinkedIn,

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organic reach on the company page
is down in the minimal percents

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versus posting on personal profiles.

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That's where the connections are.

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That's where community is built and
that's where the relationships can

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be formed, and ultimately that's
what we hope will be is the answer to

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getting more business from LinkedIn.

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That's the whole point of it.

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So it's more about thought leadership,
allegedly, and not just engagement.

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So how can your brand and your employees
lead conversations in the industry?

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But I think there's a really uncomfortable
question that comes up when we talk about

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employee advocacy and this person's post
that I genuinely wanted to know where

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the line would be drawn between teammates
helping each other, which we would expect

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within a business as part of the culture
anyway, versus engagement pod behaviour.

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Like what is the difference?

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And I think the question that we need to
have a look at, is if the goal of your

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employee advocacy team is just to get
everybody to go and like the posts, that

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looks a little bit suspicious to me.

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So let's take this to the next
step and have a look at how this

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actually played out in this example.

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I've got a question for you.

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If your employee advocacy program is
basically built, drop a link to the post

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in the Slack channel and you can insert
whatever tool you like to use instead

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of Slack and everybody go and like it.

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Is that really advocacy.

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Or is it just an internal engagement pod?

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And I want to, before we go past
this, just acknowledge the reality

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of what's going on for businesses.

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With organic reach being lower, I
actually do think that you need some

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level of coordination within the business.

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I don't think in 2026, and I see it
with my clients, that you can have

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everybody win all running off by
themselves, like LinkedIn is a team sport.

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I'm on the record saying
that over and over.

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You know how I feel about the Power
of Two, it's business brands and

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employee brands working together.

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And I don't think that just 'cause
teams work together that automatically,

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that means manipulation, which is
kind of what this person was implying.

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And I could see where they're coming
from and to be fair if that's your only

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part of the strategy is like, and comment
on a link that you've been given, I

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can see where the person's coming from
and I actually agreed with them and

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I a little bit bummed that we didn't
get to continue that conversation.

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Where does the line get drawn between
what's just engagement pod behaviour,

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liking and commenting for the sake of it,
versus what employee advocacy really is.

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Listeners, this is where I draw the
line on the difference between the

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two, and I would love to hear from you.

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Where would you draw the line?

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And for me, I think it really comes back
down to the intent behind the behaviour.

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When you join an engagement pod, which
hopefully after listening to this, you

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run the other way, and certainly, you
know, we are not aligned in our values.

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If you do wanna join one.

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It's all about manufactured
engagement or forced engagement.

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You pay, you have to do this, and quite
often we'll see generic comments, or these

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days even worse, those AI comments like,
can we not I've had enough of those, even

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more than generic, you know, great posts.

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Thanks for sharing that type of stuff.

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They never add any real value
and the conversation is pretty

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limited and you can tell because
it's not around a topic, right?

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And LinkedIn's new feed is designed
and built around topic alignment.

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So engagement pods of people from
all over the world in all different

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industries for unrelated topics is
really not going to be very helpful.

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So what's the flip side to this?

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If we are looking at intent.

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Well, I love the idea of
employees amplifying the brand.

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It takes a lot to get
an employee to do this.

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I don't care even how easy people make
it out, that hey, just drop the link and

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everyone's gonna run over and engage.

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Like, no, it is not that simple.

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I've worked with too many people
and too many businesses to know

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that that's not as simple as it is.

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I think the difference then becomes the
thoughtfulness or the intent as well

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behind the comments that people leave.

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Are they adding to the conversation?

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Are they sharing their experiences?

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Are they finding a way to get
involved that actually moves that

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conversation forward rather than
just commenting for commenting sake..

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And I think, you know, it does for
me really come back to, is it a real

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discussion and is it real expertise, not
just something that's manufactured by AI?

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So if I had to draw the difference
behind the, the two things for me,

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it's definitely, one about intent, two
about authenticity and three, I think

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engagement pods are about, you know,
gaming as opposed to a well run employee

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advocacy program is about distribution.

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How do you get good content
seen by more people that would

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be interested in that topic?

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This is something that I know the line is
gonna be different for everybody, and some

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of you might say, you know, on the surface
it doesn't seem like any difference.

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For me it's about intent.

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So drop it in the comments, let me know.

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How do you draw the line?

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What things are you gonna factor in?

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If I use an employee advocacy
tool, does that automatically

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make it employee advocacy?

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Or is it the behaviours
that we're judging?

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I don't know.

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I'd really want to have this conversation
'cause I think it's an important one.

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And as you know, I have in my headline
over on LinkedIn Company Page Led

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Growth Scaled with Employee Advocacy.

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So I'm a big fan of this, but definitely
for the distribution and not for gaming.

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We have zoomed right in on the
difference between engagement pods and

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employee advocacy, but I want you to
zoom out a little with me right now

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and have a look at the bigger picture.

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When I talk about the Power of Two and
that is company pages and employees

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working together for those greater
business goals, whether that's

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brand awareness, whether it is new
leads, whether it is signups for

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your newsletter, like I don't care
what the thing is, but I absolutely

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believe that the goal of employee
advocacy is not likes and not comments.

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It is visibility.

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It is credibility.

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It is genuine conversations, and
it's those sales relationships

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at the end of the day.

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And I like to look at it, that when you
get this right and support people to want

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to go out there and put themselves out
there and create content, and you create

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a culture and an environment where your
teammates want to support you while you

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do that, then what happens is you actually
naturally get a great conversation and

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people that actually want to engage.

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When people do it willingly, and I'm
not talking in the beginning where

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it's a little bit weird for everyone
and there's maybe incentives in place.

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I think that's a smart move because
it is a big deal to get people

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to put themselves out there.

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And so I'm not anti that side of
things, but genuinely I want them to

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feel like they wanna be a part of it,
not that they have to be a part of it.

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A quick test for you to figure
out the impact of these programs.

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If your employee advocacy program
disappeared tomorrow, would anyone

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outside your company actually notice?

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And if the answer is no, then it might
just be an engagement pod with payroll.

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Yeah, let's sit with
that one for a minute.

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And it comes back again to
why is the company doing this?

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What is the intent behind the company?

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Are they forcing people
to be a part of this?

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Guilting, shaming, uh, you know,
all kinds of, behaviours that

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ultimately make people feel forced
that they have to be a part of this.

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And if it's only your team that's engaging
in posts and not anyone outside of that

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circle, then you have a problem as well.

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So I do go back to the original
post that I can't see anymore and

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I can't link to, unfortunately,
'cause I'm blocked as I shared.

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But I actually genuinely believe that
there was an important point in that

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post, that if you don't let people
outside of your employees engage, or

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they feel overwhelmed or feel like it's
just a party for your team and they stay

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back, then that can be equally damaging.

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And I know it doesn't look great
because you don't get as many likes and

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comments and impressions potentially.

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But sometimes we have to think,
why are we even doing this?

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And if the answer is for your audience
and being in service of your audience,

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which is what I will always come back
to, then that's the most important thing.

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So measure who else is getting
involved in the conversation.

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Listeners, as we wrap up today's episode,
I'm gonna leave you with my final

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thought on where I sit with this one.

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Helping your colleagues to amplify
their good ideas isn't gaming LinkedIn,

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so for me, it's not an engagement pod,
but I also challenge you to take a look

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and see are the only people engaging
with this content, your coworkers?

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If the answer is?

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Yes.

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You might wanna ask a few more questions.

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Until next week, cheers.