So what's going on, everybody?

Hey, everyone.

Another great day.

Yeah.

Hope you guys enjoyed the podcast so far.

I mean, today's.

It just started.

It's great.

Yeah, I'm just messing around.

So that's like.

I don't know what you're keeping and what you're getting rid of at this point.

So.

No, I'm going to keep all that.

So this is gonna be great.

All right.

So, yeah, welcome.

I'm Matt.

I'm Derek.

And here we go again.

In fact, what we're going again is back to the cards.

Some of you might have remembered some episodes of our past prior to.

We did a long 12 week series on spiritual warfare.

Last week.

We talked about.

What do we talk about?

Disconnected.

Disconnected.

That's what it was.

That was on purpose.

And we actually talked a lot about that in our group afterwards.

So that was really cool to get to do that.

I love how God does that.

But we used to do these episodes where we have these talking point cards and we would pull some random things and talk about them.

And I feel like it's just a nice break to not have something completely planned out, considering that we've spent many, many weeks now having it.

Like, it's kind of like a breather for us.

Yeah, we'll probably do it this week, possibly next week, while we kind of try to figure out a plan going forward.

Because, yeah, we've exhausted all of our plans.

We've made plans and we've executed them, and now we have no plans.

Exactly.

So unless you guys have something.

If you guys have something you want to bring us, I mean, I'm all ears.

Ideas, you mean?

Yeah, like stuff.

Questions, ideas.

All that.

I know some of you did submit questions, inquiries, and there were so few people that did questions, but did enough of them that I just.

I gave something to all of them.

You got rewarded.

You could have been rewarded too, if you'd have just put them in with those people.

So.

Yeah.

So we're going to the Cards today.

Faux show.

Yeah, I'm excited.

I don't even know what we're talking about yet.

Oh, yeah, me neither.

That's the challenge.

That's the challenge of the cards for sure.

So thanks for showing up.

Our first question.

Oh, yeah, let's just jump right in.

I'm just gonna ask a question and then we'll pray.

Oh, we'll go right to the break after the question.

Maybe.

I don't know.

Who knows?

We'll see what happens.

Okay.

Depends on the question.

Is this a good one?

Not really?

We'll run with it though.

Okay, what we got.

Do you think you are a spiritual person and what does that mean to you?

Spiritual person?

So let's think about that for a second.

That's something that gets thrown around a lot.

I know in our day and age, I have stuff.

That's why it's.

You know, you can make it apply.

Something, but we can talk about conversation.

It's one of those that's like, eh.

But yeah, well, we'll go our own direction, go our own way right after the break, after these theme music, these messages.

Yeah, but there's not really a message.

It's not.

Welcome to the truth response.

I think I'm gonna pray.

I think you should pray.

I think I will pray today.

All right, sorry.

I immediately started thinking Nick's little.

Got the.

Pray it, make it today, whatever, however he does it.

Lord.

Yeah, I just.

I come to you thankful for just the ability to get on here and have a conversation that is both about you and how.

How weird to do life in you, but also like just guided by you, God.

I pray that the words that we speak are from you and that it can be a pleasing aroma to you, God, as we have this conversation.

And I pray that it is an act of worship as well, Father, that we can come to you where.

Where we are, but also where you are, God.

And then it doesn't fall on deaf ears, Father, I pray that what we have to say is meaningful, whatever it is that we're going to talk about.

And I pray that those who hear it, God, I pray that they hear your words in it and they're willing to go and start living your words, God.

So.

So whatever it is that we do or say here today, God, I just pray that before anyone hears it, I pray that you change it to be glorifying to you.

It's in your precious and holy name we pray.

Amen.

Amen.

So yeah, we're talking about the spiritual, right?

You think you are a spiritual person and what does that mean to you?

Well, I want to start by.

Actually, this is an interesting subject that I've been wanting to talk about lately because I was on the Internet the other day and I saw somebody that reached out on a local page like, hey, is anyone on here spiritual?

Actually, I think they were more likely saying something about they liked doing tarot and then like the cards and they also looking for people who are spiritual.

And there was a bunch of people replying that they did these things.

And I remember seeing one put one reply in Particular was like, yeah, I'm just spiritual and I get, I get a kick out of that.

You know, people going, well, I'm not religious, but I'm spiritual and stuff like that.

Because, you know, not all spirits are good.

So I don't know.

I mean, do you know what you're interacting with?

Because I don't think you do.

Yeah.

Especially when you get into some of that other stuff.

But even tarot.

Yeah, I mean, work, work.

Just saying you're spiritual or in tune.

The fact that there is spiritual things like that's.

It's not enough, honestly.

You know, you have to sort out what is true and you got to seek it, you know, because you know, James will tell you, I mean, even, even our enemy knows.

They know.

It's not that they don't have a.

They don't know who Jesus is.

It's not that they don't believe that he was a real person in truth, I mean, everybody, you know, but they take it.

They don't take it the step that we do.

We don't.

They don't make him their Lord.

They don't put their faith in Him.

They don't let rely on Him.

Are you talking like demons?

Oh, yeah.

Nah, See, I think it's even a step further than that on.

Let's go.

I think that they.

It's not that they don't accept him, it's that they.

They more than outright reject him.

Yeah.

And to a point of despise him.

Oh yeah.

And I think that it's because of.

It's because of us.

Yeah.

I mean, actually to some degree I think it's because of us.

Not, not necessarily in its entirety, maybe not at its origin, but at this point it's because of us that I think that they, they hate him so much.

Yeah.

Interesting enough, this came up in conversation recently.

I want to say it was with high schoolers.

I'm not sure about, like why the enemy hates us and why when it comes to forgiveness and stuff like that.

Basically.

I said it this way, first off, we're created by God, so they're going to hate anything that God creates because God once called us good.

But it's another level when you think about the fact that they cannot be forgiven and we can.

I think part of it though is that they made an informed decision.

Oh yeah.

That's the part that's the problem.

Right.

So like they can't come back from that, against it.

Which essentially, honestly, I. I take that as the, the unforgivable sin, you know, like That's.

Yeah, there's a lot of, like.

I don't know, I hear a lot of different things about the unforgivable sin.

And I think it's just an outright rejection of the Holy Spirit and God with the knowledge that he exists.

I'm with you there.

So, like, once somebody actually is like, yes, I know God exists, and I want nothing to do with Him.

I think at that point, that's on the proofs, in the pudding, at least on the.

On the verge of that.

Well, that's where the devil and his angels, you know, that's why they're in such bad shape, you know, is that they, you know, they had the truth in front of them.

They lived that truth.

They were in God's presence and in that, without any shroud whatsoever of God's there, and they rejected him.

And there's no coming back from that.

There's not a second chance for that.

Everything was there.

All you had to do was not do it and you're fine and they did it.

But us, because of our existence, because our existence relies on faith, because there's no.

He's not here constantly proving Himself to us in very concrete ways.

You know, we can be forgiven because we have to discover on our own him and what he's done for the world and more importantly, what he's done for us, and then put our faith in that and let him be the driving force in our lives.

And because there's that little bit of mystery, because there's that little bit of shroudedness, you know, that's what helps us to be forgiven.

And I mean, obviously, once you take that path and you find out how real God really is, if you were to reject him at that point, I mean, that would be.

I would think, in a similar way.

And I mean, I'm not.

I won't die on that hill just because I honestly don't know for sure.

Who would want to, really.

Well, I just mean, like, I don't know for sure what exactly the unforgivable sin is.

Right.

Yeah.

Blaspheming of the Holy Spirit is what is described as in scripture.

So I would guess that that means total outright rejection thereof.

If you take it down to its most basic terms, the blaspheme against the Holy Spirit would be to speak negatively against the Holy Spirit, which would be negatively against God.

Now, that's not in a negative, as we as humans do.

It is to.

If you recognize, if you can understand that God is always good, you're saying He's Not.

Which means that you're rejecting him flat out.

Yeah.

That's when you.

There's no coming back from that, apparently, according.

So, I mean, we don't have to get into that too much because, you.

Know, and I do want to.

I want to go back to what I originally said about they.

They hate him because, you know, of us.

I mean, it's not because of us.

It's because of his love for us.

Yeah.

So it really is because he said that.

And this is just about general.

More general.

But Jesus said that, you know, they're gonna hate you because they hated me.

Oh, yeah.

So.

And I think that applies to the demons as well.

So.

Yeah.

When you're getting into spiritual stuff like that, you know, just to go, oh, I believe there's spiritual things out there.

Great.

Yeah.

Right.

That's not enough.

It puts you in a very dangerous territory, actually, because, you know.

Yeah.

Am I a spiritual person?

Yes.

But I'm spiritually connected to the Father.

I'm spiritually connected to the Son, the Holy Spirit.

I made sure to seek out exactly what that means and not just stay in the middle ground where anything can and will happen.

Yeah.

We talked a little bit about the enemy in episode 208, which is also the second Spiritual Warfare episode.

We talked about understanding our enemy.

So if you want more on that.

Yeah.

And if you haven't gone, or maybe you need a refresher on the series, but if you haven't gone through it, that's a good one to talk about that.

And.

Yeah.

Really kind of start to flesh that out.

But it's not an.

I don't think.

Trying to just say spiritual.

If you're going to stop there, then you've stopped too far short.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But I definitely.

I mean, I think we're all spiritual beings.

Well, of course.

I mean, there's a spiritual side of each of us, just as there's a physical side of us.

And so.

Well, you and I had a conversation where I was reading some amazing research.

I can't remember the name of the woman right now, but she studies the brain.

It's her thing.

She's one of the highest brain researchers out there, and she knows more about it than most people on this planet ever will.

That being said, she is an advocate for the fact that we are three parts, body, mind, and soul.

Because of the ways that there seems to be another entity that interacts with the mind other than the body.

The body is just responsive to the brain.

So she says that in her research, there's just Too much that proves that there's another entity about us, maybe even within us, that interacts with the brain itself.

And so, yeah, we're in the image of the Father.

He's Father, Son, Holy Spirit.

We're mind, body, and soul.

Yeah, yeah.

And I think that lends well to.

To the scripture that we've hit on a lot lately.

And that is, you know, we are transformed by the renewing of our mind for a very specific purpose.

And that's to know God's will and to be able to do that.

But I mean, really, like renewing our mind that the body follows, you know.

So I think that's really good.

I would definitely say that being spiritual, as people say today, I think it's a very dangerous, slippery slope.

Oh, absolutely.

Just to chuck it up to spiritual, that can mean a lot of different things.

I would ask somebody who says they're spiritual to define that.

What do you mean by that?

What exactly does that mean to you?

I think, yeah.

And if you ask them to, and it's still a vague general answer, and that's still dangerous territory.

Although I think that it opens up to the opportunity to speak into that person's life.

So be ready for that, too.

It's kind of like Paul when he went to the areopagus.

That's exactly what I was thinking.

Exactly.

Where he's seeing all these statues of all these different gods and all these idols, and then he sees one put out to the unknown God, and he says, all right, yeah.

So you guys, he basically gives them credit.

He's like, well, you're kind of praising God, but let me explain to you who that is.

Yeah.

Do you want to know who this God is?

I know this God.

I know him.

And he lays it out for them in a great way.

I love how Paul did that.

It's a pretty boss move.

I mean, to be like, yo, I know who this one is.

I can tell you guys who this one is.

Let me bring you guys up to speed on the current events.

Really?

So good.

Yeah.

I don't know where that's at.

Where is that at?

That is, I think, Acts 19 or 18.

Oh, man, now I'm getting mixed up in my head.

Who did he talk to?

Paul Tibbe.

That's in Athens.

Areopagus.

Yeah.

But, yeah, so he just walks in there like a boss and then explains who God is, that God is not made by man, as he kind of slyly puts down every other God that they try to worship and then points out, is it 1917?

Man, I'm way off today.

17.

I know I was a teen, but in a later teen, I don't get credit for that.

Oh, and here's something.

This goes really well with what we're talking about, because in 22, it says that Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopolis and said, people of Athens, I see that in every way you are very religious.

For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription.

Inscription to an unknown God.

And it's in all caps, which is kind of cool.

It's like, anyways, you are ignorant.

So you are ignorant of the very thing you worship.

And this is what I'm going to proclaim to you.

Yeah, well, you know why they had that, right?

You know why they had that?

Just in case.

So they didn't anger a God that they didn't know about.

Yeah.

If there was a God they didn't know, they didn't want to make him mad by not having something for him or her in their mindset.

And so let's have this out there and be like, oh, this is for you.

And then Paul takes advantage of that and brilliant.

Really.

I'm actually mad at myself that I said 1819 and didn't understand it was 17.

Well, I need to step up my game.

Reread Acts.

Apparently I just went through whatever.

Hey, you know what?

Like that's, that's one of those things that there was no chapter and verse when it was written.

No, it was just a story.

Yeah, but it's just so cool.

I mean, if you want to read it, I definitely encourage you to Acts 17, 16, 34.

Check out it in its context a little bit, you know, and read the whole chapter.

Very boss move of.

Hey, yo.

I've noticed this thing about you.

After spending time with you after.

Okay, let's stop there for a second.

After spending time observing you, right?

Like, I've been paying attention to you, your ways, your customs.

And later Paul talks about to all people, I will become all things so that I may be able to basically reach them for the gospel.

So he's like, I have been in and amongst you.

I've not conformed to your ways.

Right.

Because that's a no, no.

As we talked about just a minute ago, don't conform to the patterns of this world.

But I have been observing you.

And you know, he praises them on being very religious.

I think that's a praise.

Like you.

You guys are very religious people.

You take seriously so seriously.

Your worship of Gods that you even got one just in case.

Yeah.

You know, you're missing.

You're missing the mark somewhere.

Yeah.

And.

And then he's like, yo, let me explain to you who that one is.

Yeah, he doesn't say all your other ones are wrong.

You know what's amazing about that?

It was the exact approach when you think about if you were to go into history and read about the people that were at the areopagus and what they were about.

So they were about their minds.

They thought they were the smartest people on the planet, and they spent most of their time just talking about the newest ideas and newest things.

And for them, it was all about who can be more brilliant.

And so the idea that he approached it like, hey, you guys don't know something, but let me fill you in.

Right?

I'm going to enlighten you.

I'm going to bring you new knowledge.

That is an incredible tactic to use.

He obviously played on their ego a little bit too, of like, you know, you guys are awesome.

You guys have done this thing.

And honestly, like, it's amazing that you worship this unknown God who I know.

Like, let me tell you about him so that you're not ignorant of it too.

You know, he didn't.

He didn't attack their practices.

He didn't attack, you know, who they were or their intelligence or anything like that.

He was just like, yo, let me.

Let me show you.

Yeah.

And he.

And as you read, I mean, we're not gonna.

We don't have time.

Well, we could.

But if you were to read further, and hopefully you'll read that at home, the.

You'll see that it was, we'll call it fairly successful.

I mean, it wasn't 100% successful, but there were some that were like, yep, I went in on what you got.

And then there were some that did want to hear more.

He caught their attention.

Oh, yeah, he was rejected by some.

That's what happens sometimes.

That happens in most gatherings.

Right.

Of the minds.

It's when somebody says something new, there's a lot of people that reject it.

Some people who are like, I would be interested in knowing more.

And then there's people who are like, this makes complete sense.

I mean, and it doesn't matter whether it's religious gathering or if it's just, you know, science even, you know, there's plenty of people in science that get rejected.

There's a lot of, like, especially in, like, geology.

Right.

That's a big one that gets hotly debated with, with the historians and all that stuff that all of that gets, you know, if there's a new idea, they just reject it and they kick them out.

You know, I mean, that's a lot of different sciences.

Especially.

Especially if any kind of science.

Math.

Yeah.

Especially if any kind of science just so happens to start leaning towards creation versus evolution.

Although.

And they get a little funny about that kind of.

But I don't know.

I think a lot of science.

See, and this is where the whole spiritual comes in.

Right?

Like the.

There's a lot of science.

I think that scientists will be like, well, yes, of course.

There had to be something that started it all.

Yeah.

And then they leave it there.

And so they have to walk on faith that there's something that they're unwilling to call God, you know, And.

And that's not all scientists.

Obviously, some scientists reject it.

Some scientists accept Christ, you know, But.

But a lot of scientists are on that.

Well, yeah.

Something had to start all this.

I once said to somebody, actually, I said this to my dad once, you know, here's the thing.

You can be on one side, you can be on the other.

And some people are like, well, I'm on the fence.

Well, guess what?

The devil owns the fence.

All right?

So you don't get to stay on the fence and think that you're in a safe zone now.

The fence is owned by the dough.

You need to either.

You need to pick a side.

Right.

Essentially, by not choosing, you've chosen.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, that's.

That's.

That's the truth, too.

And so as far as this goes, like, do I think I am a spiritual person?

No, I know I'm a spiritual person.

I know that I have a spiritual nature.

Yeah.

To me.

But new slash.

So do you.

Whether you know it or not, that's a whole nother story.

Whether you believe it or not, it's a whole other story.

But.

But everyone does.

Everyone has a spiritual nature.

They all are.

Whether they're willing to acknowledge it.

Right.

But the problem is, is when you're like, well, I just.

If you're looking into spirituality isn't just.

Just being spiritual.

Yeah, that's kind of you.

Nope, you need.

You need.

Once again, you're on the fence.

You need to sort this out for yourself.

All right, what's.

What's our next.

All right, what do we got here?

Let's see.

That was more than I thought it was gonna be.

We did do the yellow.

Do you want to draw one or you want me drawing.

I'll do one.

All right.

I'll do one.

Which ones go green next Green.

Green.

Green.

This time by.

It's an old NASCAR turn.

I don't know what that means, but.

It means on the next lap, the race starts or starts back.

All right.

Oh, man.

What does the people you surround yourself with say about your priorities?

Boom.

Yeah, that's a good one.

A lot of people say that you are to surround yourself with people that are better off than you.

Not better off in like, monetary, but necessarily, but like they are further along in whatever you are wanting to head towards.

Right.

They say that the top five people that you have in your life or that you follow or that you listen to are the people that are going to dictate where your future is going.

It's not always true.

I definitely think that the.

The five people that are closest to you, like, if you show me the five people you're closest to, I could pretty well tell you where you're at spiritually in life.

Because if you're surrounding yourself with people that disregard God or are quick to anger, are all of the things that aren't producing fruit, right?

The people that are not a part of the branches.

Right.

Not connected to the vine.

I can pretty well tell you you're not feeding into them as much as they're feeding into you.

And so you're going to start being like them.

That is.

That's almost for certain.

Now, if.

If it's a mix, that's another thing that could go either way.

But if all of the people that you're hanging out with, the majority of the people, the main people that you're hanging out with are unbelievers, I'd be careful because that.

That's exactly what happened to Israel time and time again.

Right.

They accepted these people into their.

And they conform to the patterns of their culture.

Right.

Instead of transforming the culture around them by sharing God.

Not saying that is universal.

I'm not going to claim that as a universal statement to where it applies always.

There are always exceptions to most rules.

Did you hear that?

There's always exceptions to most rules, unless.

They'Re gods anyway, so.

And then he can make exceptions if he decides.

I dig what you're saying.

I think that, you know, it's important.

It's important to put yourself in situations that will help you do better.

You know, that's kind of the purpose of the church, is to continue to help ourselves all seek God together and encourage each other.

But you know, what's interesting is that you can also, just by seeing the kind of people that people Draw in close because it's easy to surround yourself with church people, for instance.

Sure.

But if you look at who people allow into their lives, whether they are steadfast believers or maybe not, or even on the cusp or anything like that, you can start to see a little bit about, like it says about your priorities.

So, for instance, I do a lot of self reflection and I noticed that the people that I tend to draw in or allow to come closer are people that are what I see as 100% themselves.

What I mean by they're not fake.

They're not putting on a show.

I value genuineness.

And I mean to the point where sometimes unapologetically, themselves and you know, whether that makes them weird to what most people consider weird or a little abrasive to what people call embracive.

Like, I want to get to know someone's heart and I want them.

I want to know that that person is.

That's who they are.

Yeah.

They're not one way and then another way.

That's, you know.

And so, like, I look for that too.

Yeah, that's, you know, solid.

Yeah.

I mean, so it's interesting to see, like, if you're looking for people who are just fake, then you're going to have.

You need.

You need to do some self reflection and figure out why.

But if you are bringing people.

So for instance, like, you know, I think that's why you and I clicked.

You know, I'm just myself.

You're just yourself.

That's why I liked you right away, because I recognize that you, your wife.

And, and I am definitely that list of things.

I'm unapologetically me and I.

And that's am abrasive and weird.

So.

Okay, well, but, but I mean, but I value that in people.

I value people who.

This is who I am.

And you know, that's it.

And you know, if you look at the kind of people that I've drawn in, like yourself and Clint and even Kevin, feel a lot of these guys, like, are.

That's what, what you see, what I'm showing you, that's what you're getting.

And this isn't.

This is who I am.

Yeah.

And I love that.

I absolutely love people who can just show me their genuine self.

I like real people, genuinely real people like that, simply because most of the time, it doesn't matter what conflict you have with them, you're not gonna run them off because of it.

Yeah.

Especially if you are also that way.

Like, I am the way that I am.

I need to Change, because I'm not perfect.

Right.

There is growth that needs to happen, and I know that it comes from two places, and that's from God and from others.

Right.

That's how I learned to become better is from God first, but then also from the people that I surround myself with.

And so, that being said, I also value those people who are.

This is who I am.

I'm not going to change who I am for you.

But that will also speak that clearly into my life of, okay, here's some things you need to work on.

Yeah.

And I can do the same to them.

And you grow through that.

You become better through that.

Especially whenever you're both followers of Jesus.

I think what's raising that is it's incredibly freeing to being around people who are secure in themselves enough to.

Where even if it's something that maybe the rest of the world would reject, it allows you to be who you're gonna be and figure that out so that you can be your genuine self.

And then that's when you can have relationships that are open, open, open to each other and accountable and all those things.

But, like, when you.

If I find out, like, if I start to feel like I'm gonna try to feel someone out to see if there's someone I want to draw in or not, and I find out that they are giving me something, but they're not always that way.

If they say, if they're acting this way in front of me, but then they're.

I can tell that they're a different way also.

I will stop drawing them in.

Sure.

I will just kind of let it go and I'll just look in a different direction where I feel like, you know, and people.

People that are big on being nice to your face and then gossiping on your bag, you know, or.

Yeah.

They'll play like everything's great and then go and complain, you know, it's.

Sure, it's.

That's the kind of stuff that's like, why don't you just.

Like, why can't you just be real?

You know?

And so anyway.

So that's one example, anyway, that you guys can, like, take to the bank.

But.

Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of things you can kind of tell about, you know, middle schoolers show me something that's pretty amazing.

They're looking to be accepted, and they're trying to figure out who they are.

And so what they'll do is they'll find the group they think will accept them the most, even if.

Whether they have to put a show on or not, and.

And they will automatically just go to that group, and then they'll start trying on that group's clothes, so to speak.

They'll be like, all right, well, this group does these things, says these things, dresses these ways, and they start to adapt it because they found acceptance there of who they are, and they want to continue to have that at all costs.

High schoolers become a little bit more.

Not all of them, but a lot of them start to get a little more comfortable in their own skin, and so they're willing to branch out a little bit more.

They start to show their own personalities more, which is a lot of fun.

I value that.

I love to see someone's true personality comes out to me.

Like, if you have a. I've had a few different students that start out very quiet, and they don't really show who they are, but to see those.

However it happens, whether it's through the groups or events or whatever, to see their personality suddenly come out is exciting to me.

I really want to know who they are.

You know what I mean?

And so, like I said, it's just kind of neat.

But, yeah, the people you surround yourself with say a lot about you at all.

You know, who you are, where you're at in your faith walk, where you're at in your life walk, you know, and maybe even could also tell.

Show you that you have some things to work on.

Well, and I think it's good to be said that you can be secure in who you are, even if you don't necessarily like who that is.

Oh, yeah.

I mean, there's been plenty of times where I am still unapologetically me, but don't like who I've been, you know, Like, I don't.

I don't like where I've come to or whatever, you know, like several years ago, when I was burning all the bridges that I could, I was just being me, but at the same time, like, I didn't like who I had become.

That's, that's, that's.

That's good.

Yeah.

So.

Well, I mean, that's.

That's good.

And.

But also on the same line of thinking, when you.

When you can be your genuine self, if you're around people you feel like you can be your genuine self with, that also teaches them when you're not.

So, like, if you're off, whether they.

If you're interested in a different mood today, you're moody, you're broody, or you're a little depressed, it helps them call that out and go, hey, what?

What you see, you're off today.

You're different today.

Yeah, I don't.

You know, why are you acting like this?

And that doesn't necessarily mean.

Just for those listeners out.

Because I know what you're saying.

That doesn't necessarily mean that you're not being the genuine you.

It just means that they notice when things aren't going good.

They notice when things are rough.

They notice when you're upset or sad or struggling.

And it's because they've learned that.

That you don't.

This is your normal.

Yeah, you've got a normal.

But also like, you don't do certain things unless certain things are happening.

Right.

Like, you're not ever.

You're not faking being depressed or you're not faking having a bad day, or you're not faking faking having a good day.

You know, I often say, like, I wear my emotions on my sleeves.

Right.

You can pretty well tell if I'm having a good day, bad day.

Just am exhausted.

I mean.

Cause that looks like my bad day face.

It really, like if I'm just emotionally exhausted or physically exhausted, that's all the same face.

How many times have you walked?

You have just one face.

I'm a hard person to read.

But even then, but even then, even.

Then, the more that you're around you, you can tell.

Like, but how many times have you walked in the office and I'm like, you.

Okay.

Like, sometimes you're tired or sometimes you're going through it and I can tell that something's not right.

Right.

Right.

And.

And that.

So that's.

That's important to know too, is it's not.

It's not necessarily you being fake that they're like, ah, something's different.

It's the.

I notice because you are who you are and so you wouldn't be acting this way without, you know, feeling this way.

So.

Yeah.

I want to touch base on one last thing on this that you.

You kind of touched base on earlier.

And I have something to say about that.

So you said something about, like you should about surrounding yourself with people who are you see as a level above you or.

Yeah.

Or are gonna.

The very.

I said that.

But at the very least what I meant was was that are gonna push you to that next level.

Okay.

So I would say when it comes to people in your inner circles, you want to be careful about it because there starts to get close to a fine line of, is this a friend or am I using them?

So that would Be something and just careful.

Not in all cases, but it can be when you're like, look, I need to be around you because you should be able to be okay even if you're not.

What I want to say though about that specifically is that when it comes to voices, finding people who are further along in your field, the world we live in, I mean, you're listening to a podcast right now.

You're watching one maybe right now.

And the thing about it is there are so many good voices out there that are all over the place.

When it comes to no matter what you want to do, I swear there's a voice for it.

A lot of guys like myself, for instance, so I'm a minister, I'm a preacher, I'll work with preaching.

So when I want to think about preaching at a bigger level, higher level, or teaching the Bible at a higher level, I'll listen to guys that I think really have it, you know, not in an idolatry way.

Not like they're the greatest thing on the planet.

No, just in like, alright, how can I. I want to listen, I want to figure out what they know that I don't know.

I want to hear from them new ways to approach things.

And it's not in a way so preaching wise, it's not in a way, if I'm listening to preachers, to become a different preacher, like God gave me my own voice, you know, on purpose, but to hear like, okay, so this is a good way of thinking about this, this is a good way of presenting this.

And that helps me become a better communicator, is listening to great communicators.

Sure.

You know what I mean?

That's kind of basically the way, you know, I have guys, if I'm looking for ways to be a dynamic preacher, I'm listening to certain people versus if I'm looking to teach the Bible really well, I'm listening to other voices and stuff like that.

So if you're looking to advance yourself in, if it's Bible knowledge, that's one way to do it.

But if it's other fields, find people that are successful, listen to them, don't make idols out of them, but you know, learn from them a bit.

There's, there's some ways you can do it outside because this, I mean, obviously we are a faith podcast.

You want to check everything that people are teaching you and that you're gleaning from them, check it against the Bible.

Make sure that the things you want to start implementing in your lives are not going to go against your faith.

Yeah.

There are some people out there, especially in the secular world, that some of their tactics, although they may work, they may not be the healthiest for your soul, but.

But that is a good way of doing it.

So.

Yeah, on that note, if you're looking to advance, you want to start learning.

That's a good way of doing it.

Yeah.

And I mean, this was specifically like, the people that you surround yourself with.

Well, I mean, I'm talking about voices you're hearing all the time.

Right.

And I think that I'm not going against what you're saying.

I'm saying, like, that's where I went originally with it, and I agree with that.

But I also think that surrounding yourself with people in person, that you see as having it a little more together in whatever direction you're on now, let's be real, like, everybody's got their flaws.

Right?

Nobody's got it all together.

Yeah, Right.

Nobody.

There's nobody that does.

But what I mean by that is, for instance, me and Kevin, all right, real close buddies.

Kevin, that you guys know from the podcast.

One of the things that I just absolutely love.

And he's one of the real people that you just.

He's just a genuine dude.

One of the things that I do use him for is teaching.

I need to be taught how to do business.

Right.

And there is nothing that he knows better than how to do business.

Right.

He knows it.

I mean, that's not necessarily true that way, but he knows how to do that.

Now, we were buddies before I started using him for that.

And I think that using people sounds like a terrible thing to say, and I know that that sounds bad, but we use each other.

And the whole thing is it's.

You want to build a relationship where you use each other, but don't abuse each other.

Mutually beneficial.

Symbiotic.

Right.

Symbiotic in some way, shape or form.

Right.

And I glean business knowledge from him and I give him other things.

Right.

Whether that's helping him with emotions, that's one of the things that he talks about.

He's more apathetic than he is empathetic.

And so just being with him, you know, talking through things, processing things together, that's one of the things that I help him with because I'm overly empathetic at times and am run by my emotions a little too often.

Right.

And so.

And I also glean gleam that from him is that I'm learning how to do that a little less because I don't think we should be you know, run by our emotions.

We shouldn't be controlled by our emotions.

And so I.

There is some symbiosis, but it's not necessarily.

Like, it doesn't always look like the same subject or the same field or the same whatever, you know?

Yeah.

Like, I don't want it to be like, oh, you know, this for this.

And it's also not.

I would say.

I wouldn't count it that way if it's like, I'm paying you for this service.

Right.

Like, I'm talking about the people that you're friends with.

And I don't think it's a bad thing to use people.

I think it's a bad thing to abuse people.

And I think we need to distinguish those things.

I think relationship.

When you have.

You said you were friends with him first, you were buddies first.

Yeah.

I mean, when you have a relationship already and you look at a friend that's got something, and you're like, hey, can you teach me that?

Can you help me with this?

That's a whole different thing than, I think I need to be friends with him because he's gonna teach me well.

But Larry and I kind of became that way.

We became buddies because of his knowledge and the way that I just wanted to soak it up from him.

Right.

Like, but also, it's not to abuse the people.

Right.

Like, that's why I'm saying it's okay to use.

It's not okay to abuse because we get this mindset that using people is a bad thing.

And I'm here to tell you that the God of all creation uses people all the time.

Yep, he does, but he doesn't abuse people.

So, I mean, there's a difference, you know?

Yeah.

And.

And I understand that.

That we utilize that word in.

In a negative way more often than not use.

But I want to say, like, we need to understand that we are here to use each other in all sorts of ways.

Like, Scripture tells us that we are to carry each other's burdens.

Right.

Like, to help each other carry each other's load.

Which is crazy in some aspect because, like, Jesus says that, you know, here's my burden.

It's light, you know, like, and I will take yours.

So essentially, we're struggling to carry Jesus load that is light in comparison to our burdens that he has asked us to give us give him.

So there's a lot to unpack there, and we can do that in a different episode.

But I just.

I think that it's important to know that, like, the People that you surround yourself with.

It matters.

Yeah, it very much matters.

And I'm not saying don't be around the other people.

I mean you definitely want to be around non Christians so that your light, light of Christ can shine through you into them, right into their lives.

You want that.

But the closest people need to be very intentionally picked.

Yeah, you, I mean realistically, this goes beyond even the people that you're sticking around.

Anything that you're absorbing on a regular basis.

You know, if it's a lot of positive stuff versus negative stuff, you're gonna see a change in yourself.

So yeah, absolutely.

Positive is better than negative.

Alright, let's hit the next question.

Okay.

I don't like the way that's worded.

Okay.

But it is crazy because this was, this is part of what we're talking about in this week's Experiencing God.

So it says does God?

And then in parentheses it says or a higher power.

That's part.

I don't like.

Oh yeah, let's just go with God.

Does God seem personal to you?

Oh, and I literally today is day five.

That I did today.

I did day five of this week.

So five days of devotions.

And it was literally on like how God's personal, which was kind of crazy and cool.

Well, I mean, I would say absolutely for me especially.

Well, sure.

I would say yes for two main reasons.

Right?

I mean one, you can look at, anyone can look at this as, as you go through the Bible, God was never a hands off guy that makes him by default personable because he was always interacting with his creation and helping us to kind of guide us and get us back on track.

Obviously he did the most personal thing he can do is he came down on the earth and gave Himself up for us.

There's nothing more personal than what he did there.

But I would say in my own life he's so personal to me that when it comes to, I've told people this, when it comes to my faith before is that my faith is such that God has been so real to me that there's no going back.

And that requires a personal God.

He's not, it's not something I found in a book one day and said, okay, then this must be true.

It was something where I've experienced him experiencing God.

I've experienced him on personal levels in ways that you just.

Yeah, and it's just, I mean the way that he shows up in ways that, like whether that's an answered prayer or as somebody speaking a word of encouragement that is very specific that you know, that there's no way that they could have known that you were dealing with that specific thing.

Yeah.

Like, whatever.

Right.

Like.

Or whatever that looks like.

He shows up.

He really does.

Like, on a regular basis.

Do I experience something giant every day?

Not necessarily.

You know, like, I don't.

But just the fact that, like, I have a peace in the midst of chaos most of the time, like, is enough to know that he's right there.

Like, he's.

He's clearly right there because I.

In the midst of chaos, left alone would be a mess of a human being.

Yeah.

Probably causing more chaos than anything.

But, yeah.

I mean, he sends messages.

I tell you what, if.

So I stopped believing in coincidence quite a long time ago.

Not in any regular form.

I think it's like things just.

Sometimes you just can't.

The improbability is ridiculous.

But something happened, especially to my wife, recently.

I don't know if you know this story, but.

So she was in her Bible study.

Your wife's in that Bible study recently, and they're going through experiencing God.

And one of the things that she was, like, talking about was that she wanted to.

She had started to feel, which is actually what made me think about last week's episode, a little disconnected, you know?

And so she's like, I just want to.

I just want to know that I'm in.

I'm in the palm of his hand, right?

And that's the wording she used.

And this is significant because after she got out of that bubble study, so she's been helping me when it comes to some of my female students because she's a great mentor.

And so she reached out to one of them because she had been recently, like, mentoring them.

And this middle school student, right, she reaches out, hey, haven't heard, haven't talked to you in whatever, many days or whatever, and just want to make sure, you know, I'm still here, whatever, if you need anything.

And the student was like, oh, thanks very much.

And I can't remember what the beginning of what the student said, other than to say that she ended her text messages with, you're in the palm of his hand.

Like, that's an exactly, exact, verbatim, personal way that God hit her and said, I'm right here.

And sent an unlikely person, like a middle schooler.

What are the odds that they would write something like that?

Well, and if it was.

If it was something that happened, like, once in a blue moon, you could chuck it up to, like, chance.

Yeah, but this.

But that's pretty crazy.

In order for God to be a personal God and perceived that way, he has to do it more than that, right?

Oh yeah.

And he does.

He does.

He shows up to that all the time.

Like you said, it's too often for it to just be random happenstance.

Like it is constant.

Well, it goes back to the fact that God's constantly revealing himself in this world.

And he does it in two main ways.

He does it either through general revelation or personal or special revelation.

General revelation is things like creation itself.

Like, you can see that this is, there's a divine order to things.

You know, even scientists say, well, you know, I'm getting back on that boat for just a moment.

Like sometimes scientists will go, look, I mean, it's pointing towards creation because this doesn't make sense otherwise.

You know what I mean?

There's a design to this.

They can tell things, have intelligent design to them.

There's just a particular order to them.

And so when you look at things like that, God reveals himself generally in ways around the world.

But then you have special revelation.

The Bible could be an example of that.

Obviously Moses, different times where he interacted with people directly, special revelation how he interacts with your lives, sometimes sending those signs.

And so that definitely makes him as personal as it gets.

I mean, that moment for Sadie was an incredibly one on one personal moment that, you know, and she was just having.

She.

I mean, look, everybody has some bad days or you know, get a little frustrated with things.

But like when you're in that, and then God speaks to you in those moments, says, look, I'm right here.

You haven't, I haven't lost you.

I've been here the whole time.

That is such, I mean, talk about special, but personal, so deeply personal.

And you can't come away from those moments, especially when you're like, this is what I'm praying for, this is what I'm work want to get to and then have God answer and not know that it's him.

It's.

That's so perfect.

Yeah, I would say that I'd go as far to say that if you, if you're not seeing him in that way, like in, in a personal way on a regular basis, not saying daily, but on a regular basis you're not looking.

Yeah, especially if you're trying to interact with him like you're not, you're not looking because he, he is absolutely 100% in the midst of all of it.

And, and I would encourage anybody who is seeking God to just start looking for him in where he's working already, right?

Because he's working in your life already.

I.

We did this thing where we were supposed to go on this 30 minute walk for this experiencing God thing, right?

And we were supposed to just talk to God for the 30 minutes and see what he had to reveal to us.

Well, Lizzy did it with the dogs, right?

And she actually took our puppies, just the two of them with her, out.

And then that didn't last very long at all because they were dragging her everywhere.

And then, then she took our older dog and he is so pleasant to walk.

He could, he could probably be off leash if we really wanted to.

It makes me nervous to try to do that.

But anyways, so.

And one of the things that she said she noticed was like, like, I get it, God.

Like here's what it looks like.

Whenever I'm just trying to run off and do my own thing versus, you know, when I'm willing to be right beside you.

And so the puppies didn't get to go for a long walk, so I took them on, on the walk with me.

Same day, right?

We were doing the same day.

And so it was really cool because I went looking for God in the midst of that because I'd already heard Lizzie's story and that may not have been the purpose of the, the walk, but to say that I got a ton out of it is an understatement.

All kinds of things.

Whether it was sometimes when you are just pulling to go look at this thing, to go sniff this thing, to go do this thing that you think that you want, God will stand there and wait.

He sees what's ahead, he sees what's behind and he sees where you're at.

And sometimes he'll just stand there and wait until you're ready to move on and get back on track to what you're doing.

Because he's willing to walk life with you to.

You know, sometimes when you're so entwined in somebody else's life, it's so easy to be doing the same, whatever, mission, ministry, whatever, together.

But then sometimes God needs to unwind that leash a little bit and you gotta go do some separate things for a bit.

We all get to come back together in the end, right?

Like that's the greatest part of it is we all get to.

Everybody who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

And those who do the will of the Father will be known by Him.

So, like that we'll get to come back together at some point.

But sometimes we've got to Be separated.

Sometimes God pulls you in one direction and me in another.

And you mean.

So I'm just clarifying.

You mean sometimes people need to be separated from each other.

Sometimes God separates you because it's time for you to do this thing and you to do this thing.

Yeah.

Okay.

And so, like that seasonality.

I don't.

I get so tired of hearing the word in your life for a season.

But that's.

It is.

But that's what I'm basically describing, though, is that, like, sometimes you have intertwined yourself with another person, whether that is because God put you together or not.

That you are so in tune doing this thing together that sometimes God's got to stop untwine you a little bit and have you go separate ways.

Not because you're doing things together, but because he wants you to do these other things.

He wants you to have room to go do these other things.

And so sometimes that season, right.

It's cut shorter than others.

Sometimes there's people that are going to be intertwined with you forever.

I mean, there's just some people that go.

The life with you, I think that's the.

That is the call on a husband and wife, right.

Is that becomes one flesh thing.

Right.

Like, you guys are intertwined forever.

Like, that's the purpose of it.

That's the goal.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, I think in the same way, you know, we get into ministry sometime and we start to, you know, I've had a guy that I did.

It's kind of funny because I was thinking about him in both ways.

You were just talking in one way, like, he and I did ministry together for a season.

Yeah, I know you don't like that word, but whatever.

Yeah, it was great.

Like, we did.

And one of the things that was interesting to observe was that we used to do groups, ministries, and we would build up a group and start, you know, gaining a lot of members, and it was great.

And really start equipping people.

And then an interesting happened.

We'd get to a good size, and then our group would suddenly shrink.

And the reason it would shrink is because a lot of the people would then, well, we're building them up and getting them into Christ in their life on a regular basis.

And then they'd go out and do other groups, you know what I mean?

And they'd do other things.

This one wants to go do one with his wife now this one wants to go do this other group.

So the group would get real small.

And I remember one time he was getting really disheartened by it.

I was like, I think this is the point.

Sometimes we build people up to send them out.

And don't get me wrong, I understand there's a bit of maybe selfishness of going, I kind of wish everybody could stay here with me.

But that's not how it works.

Even in the church, sometimes you help introduce someone to Christ, and they might even start really pouring into the church, and then suddenly God calls them to a different place.

It could be a different church, could be a different city, could be different whatever.

And that's awesome.

We do the work God gives us to do to the people he gives us while he gives them to us.

And that's all we can do.

Because we're only here for a time, too, all of us, Whether it's.

You spend your life in a church, you're still only at that church for your life, and your life is finite.

So, you know, let's.

On this plane of existence anyway.

But, like, yeah, it's.

It's.

It's.

You do what you can while you can.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's good.

Yeah.

Do we have time for one more?

These are usually pretty short.

All right, let me see what we got.

Okay.

This is just a general Bible question.

Oh, boy.

Be a quick answer and we'll wrap it up.

Ready?

Sure.

Who were our first parents?

Our first parents?

Yeah.

Adam and Eve.

Yep.

Yeah.

Genesis 2.

4 through 25.

And Acts 17.

26.

Back to 17.

Acts again.

17.

That's wild.

That's crazy.

That's really.

That's really kind of crazy.

So.

All right, guys.

So here are the four questions we talked about today.

We talked about, do you think you are a spiritual person?

And what does that mean to you?

What does the people you surround yourself with say about your priorities?

Does God seem personal to you?

And who are our first parents?

Several of the answers talk.

We Talked about Acts 17.

Yeah, check that out.

17.

Read it.

Paul's a boss.

He kicks it.

Always learning off of Paul.

You know, you take that to the bank.

Cash it in.

Cash it in.

Yeah.

So.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

Today.

Hope you enjoyed today's Talking Point Cards episode.

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