1 00:00:00,150 --> 00:00:03,210 This is like TV advertising for our generation, 2 00:00:03,450 --> 00:00:06,840 but way better than TV advertising could ever be. 3 00:00:19,890 --> 00:00:23,820 Well, hello and welcome to another edition of the E-Commerce Evolution podcast. 4 00:00:24,060 --> 00:00:27,420 I'm your host, Brett Curry, CEO of OMG Commerce, 5 00:00:27,420 --> 00:00:29,970 and today is a unique episode. 6 00:00:30,420 --> 00:00:32,670 This is actually a recording that I did. 7 00:00:32,670 --> 00:00:36,240 I was a guest on my buddy Jordan West's 8 00:00:36,810 --> 00:00:40,890 podcast and we dove into YouTube. Now, 9 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:45,690 Jordan West is a pro. He is a master of TikTok shops. 10 00:00:46,020 --> 00:00:47,970 He's built multiple brands, 11 00:00:47,970 --> 00:00:52,260 and his podcast is the secrets to scaling your E-Commerce brand. 12 00:00:52,980 --> 00:00:54,990 And we talked all about YouTube. Now, 13 00:00:55,500 --> 00:00:57,540 the reason we dove into this episode right now, 14 00:00:57,540 --> 00:01:01,800 this is coming off the heels of really a groundbreaking research 15 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:05,850 piece or research project that was released by House Analytics, 16 00:01:05,850 --> 00:01:07,770 HAUS. 17 00:01:08,070 --> 00:01:12,870 Olivia Corey and team there have done some brilliant work all around the 18 00:01:12,870 --> 00:01:17,460 idea and the practice of measuring incrementality. We're seeing the true 19 00:01:17,460 --> 00:01:20,670 impact of channels. And so they tested, 20 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:25,890 they did 190 incrementality tests that involved YouTube with 21 00:01:25,890 --> 00:01:29,610 74 brands, and the results were mind blowing. 22 00:01:29,820 --> 00:01:34,470 She was on a podcast with Andrew Ferris Albe on that podcast soon as well. 23 00:01:35,100 --> 00:01:40,080 But the idea here is that YouTube severely underreport or Google Ads severely 24 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:44,910 underreport, the actual impact the YouTube ads has to the tune of about 25 00:01:44,910 --> 00:01:48,570 70% underreporting. Or another way to look at that. 26 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:53,220 The reverse is it's about 3.42 x more 27 00:01:53,220 --> 00:01:54,450 incremental than what you see there. 28 00:01:54,450 --> 00:01:57,720 So if you're seeing a one row as an example in platform, 29 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:02,280 the actual impact is probably a 3.42 x ROAS or 3.42 roas, 30 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:04,770 which is amazing. And so in this podcast, 31 00:02:05,370 --> 00:02:07,770 Jordan asked me about our experiences as an agency. 32 00:02:07,770 --> 00:02:12,360 We're known as one of the top YouTube ad agencies for D two C 33 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,930 brands. So tell lots of stories, lots of examples on the creative side, 34 00:02:15,930 --> 00:02:20,550 on the measurement side ways we've used YouTube to grow retail sales, 35 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:24,780 omnichannel sales, I think it's going to be informative, instructive, 36 00:02:24,780 --> 00:02:27,690 and hopefully fun. So with that, 37 00:02:27,690 --> 00:02:32,250 please enjoy the interview that I did with Jordan West 38 00:02:32,790 --> 00:02:34,140 YouTube ads. 39 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,550 Hey guys, Jordan West back here Today. 40 00:02:38,550 --> 00:02:41,730 I am so excited about this podcast episode. 41 00:02:41,730 --> 00:02:46,530 I have one of the experts in the space in the YouTube space that is 42 00:02:46,710 --> 00:02:51,150 Brett Curry on the podcast for I believe a second time, maybe even third time. 43 00:02:51,150 --> 00:02:52,950 Brett, welcome back to the show. 44 00:02:53,010 --> 00:02:57,180 Yeah, Jordan Min awesome to be here. It is for sure, at least the second time. 45 00:02:57,180 --> 00:03:01,810 And maybe the third, I'm not sure, but let's make this the best one yet. 46 00:03:02,590 --> 00:03:03,280 That'll be our goal. 47 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:06,280 I was so happy when you reached showed to me, I'm like, yes, I want to. 48 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:08,200 I was really hoping we were going to talk about YouTube. I just said, 49 00:03:08,410 --> 00:03:10,390 Brett Ray showed. I'm like, I will have him on the podcast. 50 00:03:10,390 --> 00:03:13,210 I have no doubt that there's going to be tons of value here. 51 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:17,590 So really looking forward to this. Brett, before we begin and really dive in, 52 00:03:17,920 --> 00:03:19,780 tell for people who dunno anything about you, 53 00:03:19,780 --> 00:03:21,940 tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do. Totally. 54 00:03:21,940 --> 00:03:25,090 So I'm the CEO co-founder of OMG Commerce. 55 00:03:25,090 --> 00:03:27,880 We are a performance digital marketing agency. 56 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:32,560 We focus primarily on D two c e-commerce and omnichannel retail brands, 57 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:35,620 specialty with YouTube ads as we'll talk about today. 58 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:38,500 But also all things Google. We lean into meta. 59 00:03:38,740 --> 00:03:41,740 We're full service on Amazon and we do retention marketing as well. 60 00:03:41,740 --> 00:03:42,700 So email and SMS, 61 00:03:42,700 --> 00:03:47,230 but I'm just passionate about marketing that works and marketing that 62 00:03:47,500 --> 00:03:51,100 builds a brand and also drives bottom line impact. 63 00:03:51,100 --> 00:03:55,930 So got team of about 40. We've been doing this since 2010, won some cool awards, 64 00:03:55,930 --> 00:03:58,810 been featured with some Google case studies and some other fun stuff. 65 00:03:58,810 --> 00:04:03,160 But at my core, I'm a marketing and business junkie, 66 00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:05,440 and so thrilled to be talking with you today. 67 00:04:05,530 --> 00:04:07,900 Awesome, awesome. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. 68 00:04:07,900 --> 00:04:11,350 I think one of the interesting things that you and I were touching on before we 69 00:04:11,350 --> 00:04:16,000 actually pressed record here was this idea around trying to measure 70 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:20,110 incrementality of some of these channels that are really hard to measure. 71 00:04:20,110 --> 00:04:23,950 So for me, everyone knows I've gone super hard on TikTok this year. 72 00:04:24,490 --> 00:04:27,490 I think the reason why TikTok shop was so interesting to me is that we always 73 00:04:27,490 --> 00:04:29,980 knew TikTok was driving business results. 74 00:04:29,980 --> 00:04:31,030 Yes. But. 75 00:04:31,030 --> 00:04:33,850 No one could ever tell you that there was no measure, couldn't. 76 00:04:33,850 --> 00:04:34,683 Measure it. 77 00:04:34,900 --> 00:04:38,470 Right? Because it just doesn't work like that on TikTok. 78 00:04:38,470 --> 00:04:42,280 It's not a direct response channel. In the same way now TikTok shop is right. 79 00:04:42,280 --> 00:04:43,660 Shop has changed all of that, 80 00:04:43,660 --> 00:04:45,880 and we have this nice closed ecosystem that you can measure, 81 00:04:46,150 --> 00:04:49,630 but I talk about this halo off of TikTok shop the entire time. 82 00:04:50,230 --> 00:04:51,610 But interestingly, 83 00:04:51,850 --> 00:04:56,500 YouTube is such a similar channel to me where it's like how many times do I, 84 00:04:56,500 --> 00:04:59,590 am I watching something on YouTube? I see an ad and I'm like, yeah, 85 00:04:59,650 --> 00:05:02,530 I should go buy that product. I totally forgot about that. 86 00:05:03,010 --> 00:05:07,840 I never in my life have ever clicked from a YouTube ad over into buy a product, 87 00:05:07,870 --> 00:05:11,440 never once because I'm watching something, but it's there with me. 88 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:13,660 It's the TV of 2025. 89 00:05:13,710 --> 00:05:14,543 Exactly. 90 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:15,433 Yeah. And. 91 00:05:15,550 --> 00:05:16,150 It's so interesting. 92 00:05:16,150 --> 00:05:18,190 Walk me through this. What are your thoughts? 93 00:05:18,190 --> 00:05:20,200 Why are you still in the YouTube game. 94 00:05:20,260 --> 00:05:20,650 And. 95 00:05:20,650 --> 00:05:21,970 How do you continue to. 96 00:05:21,970 --> 00:05:24,580 Scale? Partially because I'm a glu for punishment. 97 00:05:24,580 --> 00:05:27,250 I don't like to do anything the easy way. Apparently. 98 00:05:27,610 --> 00:05:31,330 I like to get beat up on a daily basis. So leaning into YouTube, 99 00:05:31,330 --> 00:05:32,530 it's a bit of a battle. 100 00:05:32,770 --> 00:05:37,390 A lot of people have rid off YouTube as a viable channel for growing their 101 00:05:37,390 --> 00:05:37,960 business. 102 00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:41,490 A lot of people opt to just pour all their dollars back into meta and hey, 103 00:05:41,590 --> 00:05:45,770 I'm a believer in meta ads. We spend on meta, even as an agency, of course, 104 00:05:46,030 --> 00:05:47,890 not just for our clients, but for omg, but for. 105 00:05:47,890 --> 00:05:49,610 Yourselves, of course. 106 00:05:49,840 --> 00:05:53,680 I love. But YouTube is so unique, and I love the way you framed it, 107 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:55,180 and I fully agree with this statement. 108 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,460 This is TV advertising for our generation, 109 00:05:58,670 --> 00:06:02,060 but way better than TV advertising could ever be. 110 00:06:02,390 --> 00:06:04,010 And I'll kind of set this up a little bit. 111 00:06:04,010 --> 00:06:07,550 So I got my start when I was in college in the early two thousands. 112 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:11,960 I worked at a radio station and they got involved in some TV and stuff, 113 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:16,050 but I just remember talking to local retailers, local furniture stores, 114 00:06:16,100 --> 00:06:18,650 local car dealerships, local restaurants, 115 00:06:18,710 --> 00:06:22,850 and they would tell me things like when we advertise on radio, maybe it works, 116 00:06:22,850 --> 00:06:25,760 maybe it doesn't, I don't know. But when I run TV ads, 117 00:06:26,660 --> 00:06:30,170 people come in and people mention it, and they couldn't directly attribute, 118 00:06:30,170 --> 00:06:34,250 but they could feel it and they could see it. When the TV ads were on, 119 00:06:34,250 --> 00:06:38,630 people were coming in, right? That's incrementality. You shut TV off. 120 00:06:38,690 --> 00:06:42,860 That business goes away. And so that's what YouTube is now, 121 00:06:43,010 --> 00:06:47,720 and we've all just gotten addicted to last click or multitouch 122 00:06:47,750 --> 00:06:51,440 attribution models where we want to see the click. 123 00:06:51,470 --> 00:06:56,150 We want to see the evidence that this ad led to this sale or this 124 00:06:56,150 --> 00:06:58,730 result. Ultimately, I think we were all coming to that. 125 00:06:58,820 --> 00:07:02,210 We've kind of come full circle. It was like, oh, offline is so difficult. 126 00:07:02,300 --> 00:07:05,660 You can't measure it. Online is magical. You can measure everything. 127 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:10,760 To always we're measuring online is really shortsighted and maybe not very 128 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:15,260 helpful. We want to just as an example, lean in fully to roas. Well, 129 00:07:15,260 --> 00:07:18,890 if you want to maximize roas, just run branded search. That's the maximum. 130 00:07:19,070 --> 00:07:23,390 ROAS course. Of course. And then try scaling in. Yeah, right. 131 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,100 This is the hilarious thing. It is funny. 132 00:07:28,100 --> 00:07:31,190 I've been trying to lean in on how, for me, 133 00:07:31,190 --> 00:07:34,820 I owned a bunch of brands over the years and trying to lean in on how I can help 134 00:07:34,850 --> 00:07:36,290 e-comm brand owners, 135 00:07:36,290 --> 00:07:38,780 especially the smaller ones that we don't work with anymore. 136 00:07:39,020 --> 00:07:39,830 I'm trying to figure out, I'm like, 137 00:07:39,830 --> 00:07:42,800 how do I help you guys that are listening to this podcast? 138 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:44,180 A lot of you guys are listening to this podcast, 139 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:46,760 and profitability is an interesting thing. 140 00:07:46,940 --> 00:07:51,800 We've been obsessed with these marketing metrics that just don't matter 141 00:07:53,060 --> 00:07:54,560 What we see in branded search, 142 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:58,880 what we see in most people running Facebook ads on bottom of funnel. I'm like, 143 00:07:59,030 --> 00:08:01,700 good. You think that looks good? Who cares? 144 00:08:01,700 --> 00:08:03,560 It doesn't do anything for your business. 145 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:05,720 It's not going to make you profitable at the end of the day. 146 00:08:06,020 --> 00:08:07,490 This is something I obsessed with. 147 00:08:07,490 --> 00:08:10,400 It off up, probably no negative impact to your business. Shut that off. 148 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:12,020 You'll probably get all the sales. You're currently kidding. 149 00:08:12,500 --> 00:08:15,590 Totally, totally. Exactly. YouTube again, 150 00:08:15,590 --> 00:08:20,150 I was telling you about a funny little small case study and from a colleague of 151 00:08:20,150 --> 00:08:23,090 yours that's running this ad accountant, it's us spending a ton, 152 00:08:23,090 --> 00:08:25,160 I think it's 20 or 30 KA month right now, 153 00:08:25,580 --> 00:08:29,630 but I will tell you it as we scale it up, right on platform, 154 00:08:29,630 --> 00:08:33,590 it's showing about a one return on ad spend. So normally you'd say, 155 00:08:33,620 --> 00:08:37,460 let's turn that off, right? Yeah. Well, when we turn that off, everything dies. 156 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:42,500 There's no business. So that's number one. Number two, 157 00:08:42,590 --> 00:08:44,870 the MER is about 3.5, 158 00:08:46,250 --> 00:08:50,750 so I'm not dumb. I know something's happening there. 159 00:08:52,580 --> 00:08:56,040 So that's my sort of look at all of this of like, wait, 160 00:08:56,130 --> 00:09:00,990 we've got to get out of this granularity that we think that we know how a 161 00:09:00,990 --> 00:09:03,330 customer journey works. Come on. 162 00:09:03,390 --> 00:09:05,820 We'll never know how a customer journey exactly works. 163 00:09:05,910 --> 00:09:09,600 Customers don't know how their customer journey works. They don't know they're, 164 00:09:09,870 --> 00:09:12,330 they're seeing things and reacting and then reacting again. 165 00:09:12,330 --> 00:09:15,780 And they probably couldn't even stitch together their buying journey. 166 00:09:15,780 --> 00:09:20,280 So what makes you think you'll nail that with 100% accuracy? You just won't. 167 00:09:20,940 --> 00:09:22,650 So tell me what you guys do. 168 00:09:23,670 --> 00:09:27,390 You've been all in on YouTube since I've known you. You're the YouTube guy, 169 00:09:27,390 --> 00:09:28,170 Brett. 170 00:09:28,170 --> 00:09:29,430 Yeah. I mean, this is what we're known for. 171 00:09:29,430 --> 00:09:33,870 A lot of big brands come to us because we've cracked the code, so to speak, 172 00:09:33,870 --> 00:09:38,700 on how to make YouTube ads work. And the good news is, 173 00:09:38,700 --> 00:09:43,530 while it's not measurable in the same way that meta 174 00:09:43,530 --> 00:09:47,640 ads are, or in the same way that search or shopping ads are, 175 00:09:47,790 --> 00:09:50,490 you can measure it. You've just got to work a little bit harder. 176 00:09:50,490 --> 00:09:53,220 You got to kind of triangulate the truth a little bit, 177 00:09:53,220 --> 00:09:56,250 but you nailed it earlier, Jordan, when you said, 178 00:09:56,430 --> 00:10:00,480 I've never clicked on a YouTube ad, right? YouTube is the TV of our generation. 179 00:10:00,570 --> 00:10:04,020 Nobody clicks on their tv. So you just use that as your comparison. 180 00:10:04,020 --> 00:10:07,350 And actually this is interesting. Over 50% of views now, 181 00:10:07,350 --> 00:10:11,550 and I've seen numbers show as much as 60% of all views on YouTube, 182 00:10:11,550 --> 00:10:15,150 just the YouTube app are on TV screens. 183 00:10:15,180 --> 00:10:19,800 It's the fastest growing platform or fastest growing screen for YouTube 184 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:21,180 consumption. Yes, 185 00:10:21,180 --> 00:10:26,160 there's the option to send a phone or you can scan a QR code on those YouTube 186 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:29,310 ads that appear on a smart TV or a connected tv. 187 00:10:29,430 --> 00:10:32,400 But that's so rare that usually you're doing something on YouTube, 188 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:33,810 you're probably not going to do those things. 189 00:10:33,810 --> 00:10:38,160 And so it's just people don't interact with YouTube the way they do, 190 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:41,400 even Facebook or TikTok. And so you have, 191 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,010 I want to give you that at a core level. Yeah, go ahead. 192 00:10:44,340 --> 00:10:47,760 I just want to give everybody a fun anecdote here. 193 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:51,750 So my kids watch a lot of YouTube. They've got the few creators that they love. 194 00:10:51,750 --> 00:10:56,070 My daughters love Mariah Elizabeth, she does all these crafts and stuff, 195 00:10:56,070 --> 00:10:58,800 and then obviously Mr. Beast, right? Everyone, Mr. Beast. 196 00:10:58,800 --> 00:10:59,730 Mr. Beast. Beast. Yep. He's the best. 197 00:10:59,730 --> 00:11:04,170 And there's these massively long YouTube ads in between, right? 198 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:05,400 There's like 62nd. 199 00:11:06,630 --> 00:11:11,280 My kids recently came to me and they said, dad, I hope in the next election, 200 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:14,550 now remember I'm Canadian and we are now going, right, of course. 201 00:11:15,090 --> 00:11:17,310 Just like everyone's making the swings. 202 00:11:18,300 --> 00:11:20,520 And so they come up to me and they're like, dad, 203 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:24,090 I really hope in the next election that you're going to be voting for Pierre 204 00:11:24,090 --> 00:11:27,510 Polly because his tax plan seems really good. 205 00:11:27,510 --> 00:11:29,190 Remember this is 11 and 9-year-old. 206 00:11:29,730 --> 00:11:32,430 I've heard a lot of things about what he said, and I'm like, 207 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:36,090 don't ever tell me YouTube ads don't work because exactly. You. 208 00:11:37,050 --> 00:11:40,620 Have to be watching them, dude, that is so good. 209 00:11:40,950 --> 00:11:43,050 And I remember as a kid, for me, 210 00:11:43,050 --> 00:11:47,310 and this still was stuck in my brain and probably meant that I was destined for 211 00:11:47,310 --> 00:11:48,930 a career in advertising. 212 00:11:49,140 --> 00:11:53,890 I remember trying to convince my parents to buy Ginsu knives because I 213 00:11:53,890 --> 00:11:57,160 saw these great commercials and I'm like, guys, you don't understand. 214 00:11:57,790 --> 00:12:01,960 You can cut through a can of Pepsi and then you can cut a tomato without 215 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:06,040 sharpening. And I'm just regurgitating the ad, but it's such a good example. 216 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,460 So yeah, your kids are now a spokesperson for political qualities. 217 00:12:10,060 --> 00:12:11,020 Exactly. Exactly. 218 00:12:11,140 --> 00:12:14,610 Yeah, that's such a good story. Anything. 219 00:12:15,710 --> 00:12:19,810 So what's funny is that this is years ago, I think this is 2018, 220 00:12:19,810 --> 00:12:22,330 maybe 2017 or 2018, somewhere around there. 221 00:12:22,420 --> 00:12:25,660 And we just had this little tiny agency at the time. 222 00:12:25,660 --> 00:12:28,450 Now we're kind of similar to your guys' size. 223 00:12:28,450 --> 00:12:30,220 I was actually just looking around 40 right now. 224 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:31,233 And. 225 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:32,860 I think there was three of us at the time, 226 00:12:32,860 --> 00:12:37,810 and my accountant decided to run for mayor, and I thought to myself, well, 227 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:42,730 what's the best way that I can get him seen by 228 00:12:42,730 --> 00:12:46,000 everybody in the city that we live in? Abbotsford, it's called. It's like, 229 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,630 how can I get him seen? And I was like, I think I'm just going to go to YouTube. 230 00:12:49,750 --> 00:12:52,690 And so I've made these really long videos of him. 231 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:55,840 Remember he was a candidate that nobody knew. 232 00:12:56,050 --> 00:12:59,470 He ended up getting second place and getting about, 233 00:12:59,470 --> 00:13:02,320 I think it was somewhere around like 30% of the vote. And I was like, whoa. 234 00:13:02,350 --> 00:13:06,340 And even more, we have this meme account on Instagram called Asford Memes, 235 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:11,140 and one of the posts on there was about his YouTube videos being everywhere. 236 00:13:11,140 --> 00:13:13,360 And I was like, crazy. Yes, this works. 237 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:15,190 I wish I would've just tripled down on that. 238 00:13:15,310 --> 00:13:16,510 No doubt. No doubt. Yeah. 239 00:13:16,510 --> 00:13:19,600 Last kind of little anecdote that's related to this part of what we're talking 240 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,120 about. We have an appliance store client, 241 00:13:22,210 --> 00:13:23,590 someone that I've known a long time there. 242 00:13:23,590 --> 00:13:26,380 They've got locations here in Springfield in Missouri where I'm based, 243 00:13:26,380 --> 00:13:27,730 but all over Oklahoma and stuff. 244 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:29,890 So we've been talking to them for a long time about, Hey, 245 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:32,920 give us a little bit of your TV budget, because they spent a lot on tv, 246 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:34,120 sell appliances, 247 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:38,290 give us a little bit for YouTube because we were running all their Google search 248 00:13:38,290 --> 00:13:40,900 ads and stuff like that. And so they finally gave us a budget, 249 00:13:40,900 --> 00:13:42,430 not a ton of budget, 250 00:13:42,430 --> 00:13:46,510 but some for a few key markets for one of their appliance chains. 251 00:13:46,570 --> 00:13:51,490 And they just came back to us and they said, guys in Q1 so far of this year, 252 00:13:51,610 --> 00:13:56,350 these stores are up 35% over last year. 253 00:13:56,440 --> 00:14:00,010 One of their other chains is flat, basically. And they're like. 254 00:14:00,010 --> 00:14:02,250 Interesting. So you got to have a case study. 255 00:14:03,050 --> 00:14:07,090 A case study. Yeah. So I don't know if they want anything released publicly. So 256 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:12,550 I've got a few case studies I can get into in detail with you, please. Yeah. 257 00:14:12,550 --> 00:14:15,220 Yeah, 35% over other stores. 258 00:14:15,220 --> 00:14:18,970 And the only thing they changed was taking some TV budget, 259 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:22,630 putting it onto YouTube, and voila, they got more gross. 260 00:14:23,380 --> 00:14:26,500 I mean, this is the thing that we've talked, and we've talked about this. 261 00:14:26,500 --> 00:14:29,980 It's funny because I'm on TikTok land over here and you're over in YouTube land, 262 00:14:29,980 --> 00:14:33,700 and these are the two things that nobody on Twitter really ever talks about 263 00:14:33,940 --> 00:14:35,770 because they can't measure them, 264 00:14:35,770 --> 00:14:39,280 and yet we all know that they drive both of these, 265 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:42,520 drive this massive halo. Right? There is, 266 00:14:43,060 --> 00:14:46,060 I'm sure we'll talk in very generalizations here, 267 00:14:46,060 --> 00:14:50,020 but I was talking to a guy the other day who happens to do some advertising for 268 00:14:50,020 --> 00:14:53,210 one of the biggest supplement companies on Amazon, 269 00:14:53,300 --> 00:14:56,210 and they're the biggest supplement company right now on, 270 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,340 or one of them out on TikTok shop. 271 00:14:58,610 --> 00:15:02,660 Their Amazon business has doubled this year with no more Amazon spend. 272 00:15:03,470 --> 00:15:05,120 All I'm saying is we've got, 273 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,130 if you guys are going to get anything from this episode, 274 00:15:07,130 --> 00:15:11,030 just remember that in the meme curve, 275 00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:15,500 the person that is obsessed with Triple Whale is 276 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,640 not the one at this end of the curve, right? Yep, yep. 277 00:15:19,850 --> 00:15:22,100 If you're obsessively looking at your numbers like that, 278 00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:23,510 that's not how you run a business. 279 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:23,990 Totally. 280 00:15:23,990 --> 00:15:24,750 That's not how you do it. 281 00:15:24,750 --> 00:15:28,460 Yeah, yeah. So true. So let me give you a couple of examples, 282 00:15:28,460 --> 00:15:29,690 a couple of additional examples, 283 00:15:29,690 --> 00:15:32,240 and then we may want to talk through too at some point. 284 00:15:32,510 --> 00:15:34,550 When does it make sense to start testing YouTube ads? 285 00:15:34,550 --> 00:15:37,370 When are you maybe not ready to test on YouTube ads? Because I will say, 286 00:15:37,610 --> 00:15:41,180 even though I am a believer in YouTube ads, I talk about it all the time. 287 00:15:41,180 --> 00:15:42,200 I speak on stages. 288 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:45,950 I get invited to YouTube offices a couple times a year to teach brands how to do 289 00:15:45,950 --> 00:15:47,510 this. It's not for everybody, 290 00:15:47,510 --> 00:15:50,990 and it's not the place to start if you're a young brand, 291 00:15:50,990 --> 00:15:53,960 probably so happy to talk through that. 292 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:56,630 But one case study that I think is really interesting, 293 00:15:56,630 --> 00:15:59,150 so this was a brand we worked with a number of years ago. 294 00:16:00,140 --> 00:16:03,170 It's a haircare product for women with thinning hair, 295 00:16:03,230 --> 00:16:05,510 and this actually works so well that now the founder, 296 00:16:05,510 --> 00:16:08,330 he sold the business and now he's a partner in OMG, 297 00:16:08,330 --> 00:16:10,490 which is kind of a cool fun first. 298 00:16:10,790 --> 00:16:11,540 That's so fun. 299 00:16:11,540 --> 00:16:13,280 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So with Kiran, 300 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:15,800 they were doing a lot with direct response tv, 301 00:16:15,980 --> 00:16:18,050 doing a lot with Meta and a few other channels, 302 00:16:18,050 --> 00:16:20,510 but they could not get YouTube to work. They tried it, 303 00:16:20,540 --> 00:16:22,280 tried and failed a number of times. So we came in, 304 00:16:22,490 --> 00:16:24,320 we remapped the campaign strategy, 305 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,620 we tweaked their creatives because the creative were powerful, 306 00:16:27,830 --> 00:16:31,040 but they weren't quite built for YouTube, so we redid the creatives. 307 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:32,990 Are we going to get into that? 308 00:16:33,230 --> 00:16:38,000 Because I think that's an interesting thing to get into is what makes a YouTube 309 00:16:38,210 --> 00:16:39,560 creative amazing. Sure. 310 00:16:39,650 --> 00:16:43,850 Yeah. So we can kind of dig into our formula guidelines there on creative, 311 00:16:43,850 --> 00:16:46,430 but we tweaked the creative, we redid the campaigns. 312 00:16:46,430 --> 00:16:49,910 We focused on who we're going to target on YouTube because targeting is so 313 00:16:49,910 --> 00:16:50,743 important on YouTube, 314 00:16:50,810 --> 00:16:55,340 we went from zero to a million dollars in spend on YouTube and under 90 days 315 00:16:55,850 --> 00:17:00,620 while hitting their target CPA. So this was direct response, 316 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:05,360 applicable sales. Wow. They had a high CPA ceiling, 317 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:08,750 they had a landing page that converted really well. They had a great product. 318 00:17:08,750 --> 00:17:12,890 They had a high take rate on subscriptions so they could pay a lot for new 319 00:17:12,890 --> 00:17:17,060 customers. So it all worked, but that was just purely D two C. Now, 320 00:17:17,060 --> 00:17:20,060 what we found then is as we started doing that for months and months and months, 321 00:17:20,060 --> 00:17:23,240 we were asked to help them with their Amazon business, and they were like, 322 00:17:23,420 --> 00:17:26,420 Amazon's really taken off. Amazon is going like gangbusters. 323 00:17:26,660 --> 00:17:28,460 And so we started helping them grow on Amazon. 324 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:30,620 We do full Amazon channel management. Well, 325 00:17:30,620 --> 00:17:33,980 we hit a patch where we had to pause YouTube ads for a bit due to some internal 326 00:17:33,980 --> 00:17:36,110 tracking and a couple of the things you had to pause it for a bit. 327 00:17:36,380 --> 00:17:39,260 Oh, my favorite kind of AB tests where it's like, yeah. 328 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:39,980 Exactly. 329 00:17:39,980 --> 00:17:41,450 I was forced to do this. 330 00:17:41,540 --> 00:17:46,100 The credit card bounced and I didn't see it for seven days. The best tests. 331 00:17:46,100 --> 00:17:48,200 Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. It wasn't a credit card best, 332 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:50,460 but they had to pause for a bit right when they did, 333 00:17:50,670 --> 00:17:52,740 because we had full visibility into Amazon, 334 00:17:52,740 --> 00:17:56,130 we were managing Amazon branded search cut in half, 335 00:17:56,550 --> 00:17:59,220 cut in half when we had to pause YouTube. 336 00:17:59,220 --> 00:18:02,100 Then we got YouTube back and they were rock and rolling again before long, 337 00:18:02,250 --> 00:18:05,520 but we were like, holy crap, that's pretty crazy. 338 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:10,170 So basically we came to the conclusion that it was about a one-to-one ratio for 339 00:18:10,170 --> 00:18:13,950 every conversion. We saw D two C, we were getting at least one on Amazon, 340 00:18:14,010 --> 00:18:17,220 and one of the data scientists on the team was like, it might be two. 341 00:18:17,430 --> 00:18:19,410 It might be two to one for every one you're getting D two C, 342 00:18:19,410 --> 00:18:21,030 you might be getting two on Amazon. 343 00:18:21,030 --> 00:18:25,530 And so it's one of these things where were they in retail as well that were they 344 00:18:25,530 --> 00:18:27,960 in retail as well? They were not in retail. 345 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:31,680 Now I've got another case that I talk about that there was fully retail in 346 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:35,430 Walmart stores. That's incredibly fascinating. But this brand, no, 347 00:18:35,430 --> 00:18:36,630 they were multi-channel. 348 00:18:36,630 --> 00:18:40,950 So they were D two C plus Amazon plus a few other marketplaces. 349 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,290 They were not in stores at that time. 350 00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:46,260 Okay, okay. Insane. 351 00:18:46,290 --> 00:18:51,210 And also I think that we all brand people who have been 352 00:18:51,210 --> 00:18:55,680 in this game for a while are those things you do that you can't measure. 353 00:18:56,310 --> 00:18:57,143 That. 354 00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:03,930 Is the right thing to do and actually drives the top of funnel business, 355 00:19:03,930 --> 00:19:07,650 but then you're convinced by somebody, maybe it's a new CMO, 356 00:19:07,650 --> 00:19:11,100 maybe it's a new somebody who comes into the space, 357 00:19:11,310 --> 00:19:15,990 maybe it's just a viral tweet on Twitter or on whatever we call that thing now 358 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:19,350 that just shouldn't have gone viral because it was wrong. 359 00:19:19,980 --> 00:19:23,640 You must measure everything. I only scale things that are measurable. 360 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:24,540 And then you're like, oh, okay, 361 00:19:24,540 --> 00:19:27,390 well I'm going to turn this thing off and then your business tanks. 362 00:19:30,090 --> 00:19:30,190 And I think it's important. 363 00:19:30,190 --> 00:19:33,600 We're certainly not making the case to measure less and we're not making the 364 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:35,130 case to pay attention to your numbers. 365 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:39,390 It's just that not everything can be measured the same way. 366 00:19:39,780 --> 00:19:43,470 I heard this, some of my team made this analogy one time. They were like, Hey, 367 00:19:43,470 --> 00:19:44,970 think about a light switch. 368 00:19:45,570 --> 00:19:49,830 You flip a switch and the result you don't see on the light switch, 369 00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:52,650 the result is over here with the light. I was like, 370 00:19:52,650 --> 00:19:55,740 this is a pretty good analogy where that's a really good analogy, Brett, 371 00:19:55,830 --> 00:19:58,650 like YouTube, you're running YouTube, you're doing this thing right here. 372 00:19:58,770 --> 00:20:02,640 The results are over here. You see the results over here, they're there. 373 00:20:02,940 --> 00:20:06,570 You've just got to look for them. And measuring them is harder. 374 00:20:06,570 --> 00:20:09,630 So I don't think you should measure less. I think you should measure more. 375 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:14,730 I just think you should understand that ROAS is a bad metric overall if that's 376 00:20:14,730 --> 00:20:17,160 all you're looking at and the whole picture, 377 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,100 understanding incrementality and real growth and real impact. 378 00:20:20,250 --> 00:20:22,020 It takes some work. It takes some work to measure it. 379 00:20:22,020 --> 00:20:23,610 So you got to look at everything. 380 00:20:23,850 --> 00:20:26,580 I can also show you a case study that might be helpful. 381 00:20:26,580 --> 00:20:29,700 It's from Arctic coolers, so coolers and drinkware, a Yeti competitors. 382 00:20:29,970 --> 00:20:32,880 Happy to dive into that or I think you may have had a question right there. 383 00:20:32,910 --> 00:20:36,240 I do have a question I have to put in the middle here, Brad, I'm so sorry. 384 00:20:36,420 --> 00:20:40,140 But how are tools like Prescient and mms, do you trust them? 385 00:20:40,230 --> 00:20:42,840 Do you think that they are telling the full story? 386 00:20:43,170 --> 00:20:46,320 Do we need to move from an MTA model into an mm M model? 387 00:20:46,500 --> 00:20:47,860 Just what do you think about that? 388 00:20:47,950 --> 00:20:49,450 It's a great question. 389 00:20:49,450 --> 00:20:52,960 So I think there's a couple things at play here. 390 00:20:53,110 --> 00:20:56,320 I still like MTA tools. I think they serve a purpose. 391 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,680 We have clients who use North Beam clients who use triple whale. I like them. 392 00:20:59,740 --> 00:21:01,510 I think we can gain some insights there. 393 00:21:01,510 --> 00:21:03,250 They got different models you can kind of play with. 394 00:21:03,250 --> 00:21:05,680 And so it can give some insights. Certainly, 395 00:21:05,890 --> 00:21:10,780 I do tend to think that an incrementality test 396 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,590 plus an MMM type of approach is probably a little bit better. 397 00:21:14,650 --> 00:21:18,460 I would lean that way. But I think you can also do things like, hey, 398 00:21:18,460 --> 00:21:22,960 if you can track in platform performance and you can do things like 399 00:21:23,020 --> 00:21:26,680 incrementality tests on your own, which you can do that. 400 00:21:26,710 --> 00:21:29,410 You can set up geo tests, geo holdouts and things like that. 401 00:21:29,420 --> 00:21:32,440 Totally just do holdouts, right? It's that simple. Just do a geo. 402 00:21:32,980 --> 00:21:37,540 Let's say New York and California are bringing you basically the same. 403 00:21:37,540 --> 00:21:38,650 That's right. California and Texas, 404 00:21:38,650 --> 00:21:43,000 just because they're similar and similar populations. If they're doing that, 405 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:47,470 you can just hold out Texas and then you can know measure the impact. 406 00:21:47,770 --> 00:21:48,010 There's the. 407 00:21:48,010 --> 00:21:51,220 Impact. And so there's also, there's some tools that Google can help you with. 408 00:21:51,220 --> 00:21:54,670 They'll do things like search lift studies, they do conversion lift studies, 409 00:21:54,670 --> 00:21:58,210 which basically is a way for them to do their own kind of holdouts and tell you 410 00:21:58,210 --> 00:22:01,930 the incrementality of a particular campaign type. Quite useful. 411 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:05,290 So I think that can kind of get you on the right track. 412 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,650 And I do think one of the best numbers, the best metrics, 413 00:22:08,650 --> 00:22:11,800 which you really don't need any fancy tool for is mer, right? 414 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:16,690 Look at your total media efficiency ratio and watch how that 415 00:22:16,690 --> 00:22:20,200 fluctuates as you lean into one channel over another. Hey, 416 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:22,360 when I really lean into YouTube for a couple of months, 417 00:22:22,420 --> 00:22:24,880 my MER improves and my top line grows. 418 00:22:25,300 --> 00:22:27,850 That sometimes simple is all you need, 419 00:22:27,850 --> 00:22:31,360 but you've got to be looking in the right places. I love MMM. 420 00:22:31,360 --> 00:22:34,450 I've not used prescient, but I've heard good things about them. 421 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:39,190 But I do think the world is probably shifting more to MMM and incrementality 422 00:22:39,190 --> 00:22:41,730 tests and less towards MTA. 423 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:42,633 Yeah, yeah. 424 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:47,320 MTAI think was something that we brought in when we needed it, right? 425 00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:49,300 And especially post iOS 14.5. 426 00:22:49,300 --> 00:22:52,300 Solve some real problems there for a bit. Yeah, for sure. 427 00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:53,680 Absolutely. So Brett, 428 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,290 I want to get into your case study and then after your case study, 429 00:22:56,290 --> 00:22:57,790 I want to hear your, so guys, 430 00:22:57,790 --> 00:23:01,810 stick around because Brett is going to break down what makes a perfect YouTube 431 00:23:01,810 --> 00:23:02,160 ad. 432 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,270 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So excited about that. 433 00:23:05,170 --> 00:23:09,250 I guess about a year ago I was speaking at the YouTube offices in Los Angeles 434 00:23:09,250 --> 00:23:12,610 teaching a group of brands how to grow on YouTube. Met the folks from Arctic, 435 00:23:12,610 --> 00:23:15,640 which I was not that familiar with that brand prior to that point, 436 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:20,620 but Arctic is, they sell wheeled coolers like indestructible, 437 00:23:20,620 --> 00:23:23,950 the best cooler I've ever had. They're direct competitor to Yeti. 438 00:23:23,950 --> 00:23:28,600 I think they're better and they're less expensive. They also sell drinkware. 439 00:23:28,630 --> 00:23:31,540 And I'm a big Tumblr fan. I drink a lot of coffee. Jordan, 440 00:23:31,540 --> 00:23:32,920 are you a coffee drinkers? Well, Jordan. 441 00:23:33,130 --> 00:23:37,960 I drink a cup or two a day. My son got me this cup here. I dunno, 442 00:23:38,380 --> 00:23:39,940 like a liter basically. 443 00:23:39,950 --> 00:23:43,870 It's kind of cool. Yeah, love coffee. 444 00:23:43,870 --> 00:23:46,760 I go to bed singing about right as some of them big fan. 445 00:23:47,090 --> 00:23:52,040 But Arctic has drinkware that is ceramic lined. One pet peeve, 446 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:54,380 and this is going to show that I'm a little bit of a snob when it comes to drink 447 00:23:54,380 --> 00:23:56,960 beverages. If you drink out of a metal Tumblr, 448 00:23:57,170 --> 00:24:00,110 it smells and tastes a little bit like steel, right? 449 00:24:00,110 --> 00:24:03,860 Almost like you have blood in your mouth, a little bit of that, right? 450 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:05,930 The ceramic lining completely takes that away. 451 00:24:05,930 --> 00:24:08,750 It tastes like you're drinking out of your favorite ceramic mug or whatever. 452 00:24:08,750 --> 00:24:11,150 It's brilliant. Anyway, met Arctic. They were like, Hey, 453 00:24:11,420 --> 00:24:15,350 we want to get YouTube to work for us, and here is our hypothesis. 454 00:24:15,500 --> 00:24:18,770 Can you help us prove it? We want to see if YouTube will drive in-store sales. 455 00:24:18,980 --> 00:24:23,900 They were just put into all Walmart stores are almost all Walmart stores 456 00:24:23,900 --> 00:24:28,130 nationwide. They wanted to know if we ran some targeted YouTube tests, 457 00:24:28,250 --> 00:24:32,060 can we see a measurable lift in Walmart sales? And so we said, 458 00:24:32,060 --> 00:24:35,150 we love this idea. They had great creatives. 459 00:24:35,150 --> 00:24:37,130 We coached them a little bit and helped them with their creatives, 460 00:24:37,130 --> 00:24:39,350 which we'll get into more in a minute. But here's what we did. 461 00:24:39,380 --> 00:24:43,970 We basically did some studies with the help of Google to find what 462 00:24:43,970 --> 00:24:47,630 cities had really high category demand, 463 00:24:47,630 --> 00:24:52,280 meaning people looking for coolers and wield coolers, 464 00:24:52,460 --> 00:24:54,980 but then had varying ingredients of demand for Arctic. 465 00:24:54,980 --> 00:24:57,020 And this was all based on Google's search behavior. 466 00:24:57,410 --> 00:24:59,690 So we mapped out and we said, okay, let's do a test. 467 00:24:59,690 --> 00:25:04,190 Let's choose 19 markets that we think are poised for growth, 468 00:25:04,340 --> 00:25:07,070 got good store count, good inventory levels, things like that. 469 00:25:07,220 --> 00:25:11,840 Let's match those with 19 control markets that are basically the same size and 470 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:12,830 same everything. 471 00:25:12,980 --> 00:25:16,040 And we're going to spend YouTube dollars in the test markets and we're going to 472 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,450 hold out and the control markets, we're going to do that for five. And. 473 00:25:18,450 --> 00:25:20,850 There was Walmarts in all. Walmarts. 474 00:25:20,850 --> 00:25:23,240 In all of them. Yeah, exactly. So then we could do, 475 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:26,930 so it's a mashed pair holdout type study. 476 00:25:27,530 --> 00:25:30,920 So we lean in hard and we used all of our resources to build out the right 477 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,230 campaigns and maximize views, 478 00:25:33,230 --> 00:25:36,200 and we did lean in heavily to connected tv. 479 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:40,670 So that was a great placement for these ads. And we measured on YouTube. 480 00:25:40,850 --> 00:25:45,350 On YouTube. All YouTube's connected like YouTube's TV placements. Exactly. 481 00:25:45,350 --> 00:25:46,183 This is now. 482 00:25:46,220 --> 00:25:50,270 YouTube tv. A lot of people ask about that. I'm a subscriber to YouTube tv. 483 00:25:50,270 --> 00:25:53,150 It's a good cable replacement. That's a separate inventory though. 484 00:25:53,150 --> 00:25:56,420 It's powerful, but it's actually a pretty small percentage of YouTube views. 485 00:25:56,810 --> 00:26:00,440 And if you buy YouTube ads in the platform, like in the Google Ads platform, 486 00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:02,480 you're going to be on traditional YouTube. 487 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,930 But here's one really crazy side note that ties into this. 488 00:26:05,930 --> 00:26:09,050 More people stream YouTube on connected TVs. 489 00:26:09,050 --> 00:26:13,130 So the good old fashioned YouTube app on connected TVs that stream any other 490 00:26:13,130 --> 00:26:14,810 platform. So YouTube, I. 491 00:26:14,810 --> 00:26:16,910 Do not doubt that even for a second. 492 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,180 Bigger than Netflix, bigger than Hulu, bigger than Disney plus, 493 00:26:20,540 --> 00:26:23,210 it's bigger than Hulu. Disney Plus and a few others combined. 494 00:26:23,450 --> 00:26:26,180 It's bigger than Netflix, but not that dramatically. 495 00:26:26,270 --> 00:26:29,900 So we leaned in heavily to connect to TVs. There's so much inventory, 496 00:26:31,010 --> 00:26:32,600 there's so much. The inventory is insane. 497 00:26:32,780 --> 00:26:35,630 So many people aren't advertising here because they don't get it and they don't 498 00:26:35,630 --> 00:26:40,040 understand it. And so CPMs are pretty low compared to men and other places. 499 00:26:40,190 --> 00:26:41,180 A lot of opportunity here. 500 00:26:41,390 --> 00:26:44,160 So we did this five week test and we measured it all along the way. 501 00:26:44,430 --> 00:26:48,330 We did see Lyft and D two C, so we were able to measure those and track those. 502 00:26:48,420 --> 00:26:52,470 All the ads said, go to Walmart, go buy this at your local Walmart. 503 00:26:52,500 --> 00:26:56,520 You could click to find a local store through Google tracked people that visited 504 00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,390 stores. All of this was all about local, but we did see some D two C sales, 505 00:27:00,390 --> 00:27:02,370 right? Some people were just like, of course I'll buy it. 506 00:27:02,370 --> 00:27:03,600 Online course. No, I want to buy it now. 507 00:27:03,610 --> 00:27:05,280 Yeah, I want to buy it now. I want to buy it online. 508 00:27:05,430 --> 00:27:07,800 We saw Lyft on Amazon because a lot of people were like, yeah, 509 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:09,720 I want to buy it now, but I don't want to buy it from your store. 510 00:27:09,750 --> 00:27:11,820 I want to buy it on Amazon because that's my favorite. So we saw that. 511 00:27:12,210 --> 00:27:14,520 But here's what we saw inside a Walmart stores. 512 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,180 We had three different groups of markets. 513 00:27:18,270 --> 00:27:22,830 The worst performing group saw a 12% retail store 514 00:27:22,830 --> 00:27:27,420 lift in comparison of the test markets to the control markets, 515 00:27:27,570 --> 00:27:31,890 test markets 12% high degree of confidence lift 516 00:27:32,250 --> 00:27:35,550 over their control markets were very similar in size and nature and all that 517 00:27:35,550 --> 00:27:40,170 stuff. The best group was 25% lift 518 00:27:40,530 --> 00:27:44,910 over the control market. So basically they were like, 519 00:27:45,180 --> 00:27:47,790 holy crap, this is great. Let's do more of this. 520 00:27:47,790 --> 00:27:49,260 It actually lets us run a whole bunch of, 521 00:27:49,860 --> 00:27:52,020 or getting more of their business. Google was like, Hey, 522 00:27:52,020 --> 00:27:54,330 we got an agency excellence award for it. 523 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,930 We really leaned into this more in the process too. 524 00:27:57,930 --> 00:28:01,950 We also did what's called the search lift study where Google can look at, hey, 525 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,640 people that saw your ad versus people that didn't see your ad, 526 00:28:05,820 --> 00:28:09,480 what kind of impact does that have on people searching for your brand? 527 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:15,240 So we saw a 241% lift in branded searches 528 00:28:15,660 --> 00:28:19,230 from this ad campaign, and this is where it's like, okay, 529 00:28:19,230 --> 00:28:22,590 you've got to kind of look at the holistic picture. And I will say, 530 00:28:22,590 --> 00:28:25,260 this is where YouTube really shines from omnichannel retailers. 531 00:28:25,260 --> 00:28:29,490 They can shine for multichannel retailers as well, but the results were stagger. 532 00:28:29,610 --> 00:28:31,830 Incredible. We don't have much time here. Brett, 533 00:28:31,890 --> 00:28:34,440 I want you to walk me through before you go, 534 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:37,500 walk me through what the perfect YouTube ad looks like. 535 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:38,393 Yeah, 536 00:28:38,430 --> 00:28:42,480 there are a few elements and I've got a guide that we can mention that's free 537 00:28:42,750 --> 00:28:45,030 that walks through 17 of our favorite YouTube ads. 538 00:28:45,030 --> 00:28:47,790 It breaks down each one and shows. Great. We'll. 539 00:28:47,790 --> 00:28:50,610 Get that down in the show notes. And if you guys are watching this on YouTube, 540 00:28:50,610 --> 00:28:52,230 it'll be down in the description. 541 00:28:52,230 --> 00:28:55,440 Below. Awesome. So the first thing, no surprise here probably, 542 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:59,340 but you need a hook first. Five seconds is critical. People are, 543 00:28:59,340 --> 00:29:01,350 if it's a skippable ad, which is most of what we run, 544 00:29:02,190 --> 00:29:04,350 you got five seconds to really hook somebody. 545 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:08,130 Some people are watching hovering with their finger of the mount over the skip 546 00:29:08,130 --> 00:29:12,090 button ready to click. So you got five seconds to convince them, Hey, 547 00:29:12,090 --> 00:29:14,280 wait a minute, check this out a little bit longer. 548 00:29:14,670 --> 00:29:19,170 So hook is important and what we say is you need to make sure you're hooking the 549 00:29:19,170 --> 00:29:23,100 right person. So don't come up with just some random hook explosion, 550 00:29:23,100 --> 00:29:26,580 something funny guy in a gorilla suit, something just wild. 551 00:29:26,610 --> 00:29:30,420 You want to interrupt the right person, right? So your ideal target, 552 00:29:30,690 --> 00:29:32,760 but then you want to up because you only pay based on. 553 00:29:33,330 --> 00:29:37,320 An actual view through. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So you don't want the wrong, 554 00:29:37,620 --> 00:29:39,480 you basically want to be like, Hey, everyone else don't watch. 555 00:29:40,650 --> 00:29:40,860 Yeah, 556 00:29:40,860 --> 00:29:45,190 you want the non-ideal shopper to skip because you only are paying for good 557 00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:45,940 views. 558 00:29:45,940 --> 00:29:48,730 And so you want someone to choose to watch your ad if they're in your market. 559 00:29:48,730 --> 00:29:51,880 So something to grab their intention, thought provoking question, 560 00:29:51,940 --> 00:29:55,120 a bold statement showing something right in their face. 561 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:56,860 But it needs to be related to what you saw. 562 00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,130 So it needs to be related to the problem you're solving or the relief you're 563 00:30:00,130 --> 00:30:02,620 bringing or the enjoyment that your product is offering. 564 00:30:02,620 --> 00:30:04,840 So it's got to be relevant, a relevant interruption, 565 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:09,130 a relevant hook to the right person. So the hook is critical. Next, 566 00:30:09,130 --> 00:30:10,420 if you're D two C, 567 00:30:11,230 --> 00:30:14,170 essentially most of our clients are retail in some way. 568 00:30:14,380 --> 00:30:15,880 It's got to be a product demonstration. 569 00:30:16,060 --> 00:30:19,570 You need to now show me the product in action. And Jordan, 570 00:30:19,570 --> 00:30:22,720 I like a typical demonstration. 571 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:27,070 So what's the proper use case of this one? A good example is a flex seal, 572 00:30:27,070 --> 00:30:30,970 like the spray on thing to seal. If you have a leak, 573 00:30:31,420 --> 00:30:33,610 leak in your gutter or leak in a pot or whatever, 574 00:30:33,610 --> 00:30:35,170 you spray flex seal on your obsolete. 575 00:30:35,170 --> 00:30:37,990 So I like a standard use case demonstration. 576 00:30:38,140 --> 00:30:40,450 This is how you seal your gutters type of thing. 577 00:30:40,630 --> 00:30:42,610 But then I like an over the top demonstration. 578 00:30:42,610 --> 00:30:45,130 If you can throw that in there too. It's kind of like the, 579 00:30:45,130 --> 00:30:45,730 I dunno if you like the. 580 00:30:45,730 --> 00:30:47,320 Pepsi can thing you talked about before. 581 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:51,100 Yeah, exactly. So it's like the knife, 582 00:30:51,100 --> 00:30:53,440 the Ginsu knife commercial where they cut through the can or the old, 583 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,890 old super glue commercial where they in one cut, 584 00:30:56,890 --> 00:30:59,890 put super glue in the bottom of a guy's shoe and stuck him to the ceiling, 585 00:31:00,100 --> 00:31:02,020 held it, and then he stayed there anyway. 586 00:31:02,350 --> 00:31:05,290 So show a dramatic product demonstration too, 587 00:31:05,290 --> 00:31:08,230 because you want them to see the standard demonstration and say, 588 00:31:08,470 --> 00:31:11,470 I could do that, right? But then they're also kind of skeptical. 589 00:31:11,830 --> 00:31:13,720 I like talk about Missouri, 590 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,320 where I live is we're the show me state and our state animal is a mule. 591 00:31:17,380 --> 00:31:21,250 We're stubborn. We believe nothing. You got to show us before you believe us. 592 00:31:21,700 --> 00:31:23,860 Picture that your audience is from Missouri, right? 593 00:31:23,860 --> 00:31:26,080 You got to show them and they're going to be skeptical. 594 00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:29,770 Standard product demo and then over the top product demo. 595 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:31,420 Then I like some social proof, 596 00:31:31,420 --> 00:31:35,800 so show me something that proves that other people like 597 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,770 me love this product. So this can be reviews. 598 00:31:38,770 --> 00:31:42,250 So when we were doing stuff for native deodorant and we helped them really scale 599 00:31:42,250 --> 00:31:46,780 on YouTube, we said like, Hey, there was only over 50,005 star reviews. 600 00:31:47,140 --> 00:31:51,280 How could 50,000 people be wrong type of thing. So some kind of social proof. 601 00:31:51,340 --> 00:31:55,690 Then I like some kind of risk reversal or some kind of offer where it's like, 602 00:31:55,690 --> 00:31:59,710 hey, do this, try this, experience this. We'll take away the risk. 603 00:31:59,770 --> 00:32:03,880 And then a firm call to action. And so that call to action is, Hey, 604 00:32:04,030 --> 00:32:07,930 click here to learn more. Go to Amazon and buy it. 605 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:11,470 Buy it from your favorite retailer. Something like that. So how. 606 00:32:11,770 --> 00:32:15,340 Professional does the filming need to be on YouTube? Again, 607 00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:19,420 I talk about TikTok all the time, right? It's the opposite, right? 608 00:32:19,420 --> 00:32:23,770 You don't want professional filming, it doesn't work. It's the antithesis. 609 00:32:23,770 --> 00:32:24,430 What about YouTube? 610 00:32:24,430 --> 00:32:27,580 Yeah, it's kind of the same with meta too. Sometimes it's the unpolished, 611 00:32:27,580 --> 00:32:31,990 the shot with the phone kind of raw candid stuff. It works on YouTube. 612 00:32:31,990 --> 00:32:33,880 You do need a little more polished. 613 00:32:34,090 --> 00:32:37,150 Think again about the frame that this is like TV and a lot of people are 614 00:32:37,150 --> 00:32:40,880 probably watching it on tv. A little more polished is important. 615 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,800 Now we found that we've a lot of success with an ad that is professionally 616 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,230 produced. You don't have to spend tens of thousands of dollars on it, 617 00:32:48,230 --> 00:32:51,800 but you need good lighting and a good camera and good audio and things like 618 00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:52,400 that. 619 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:57,380 But sometimes when you mix good production value with some raw stuff mixed 620 00:32:57,380 --> 00:32:59,120 in, so good high production value, 621 00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:03,020 then throw in some UGC either in the middle or at the end. 622 00:33:03,110 --> 00:33:07,040 That combination extremely powerful. Now we've also, 623 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,980 we scaled this auto brand on YouTube a couple of years ago, 624 00:33:09,980 --> 00:33:13,970 and basically all they had was UGC, but it was really good UGC. 625 00:33:14,180 --> 00:33:15,590 And so we did UGC mashups, 626 00:33:15,590 --> 00:33:17,690 which just a whole bunch of customers showing their car, 627 00:33:17,690 --> 00:33:19,400 talking about why they love the product, things like that. 628 00:33:19,580 --> 00:33:23,750 But then we added some editing and some graphics and some transition that really 629 00:33:23,750 --> 00:33:28,040 made it look polished and that thing scaled like crazy. So it's definitely going 630 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,610 to be higher production value than TikTok or Meta, 631 00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:36,350 but it does not have to be million dollar type of stuff that you see on Super 632 00:33:36,350 --> 00:33:37,880 Bowl commercials. You don't need that. 633 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,850 And then I'll also say if you're running an ad on Instagram reels or on TikTok 634 00:33:41,850 --> 00:33:43,220 or TikTok shops, whatever, 635 00:33:43,370 --> 00:33:48,200 you can take that ad almost exactly how it is and run it on YouTube 636 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:49,910 shorts. I will say though, 637 00:33:49,910 --> 00:33:54,350 I haven't seen as much results with YouTube shorts only as I have when you're 638 00:33:54,350 --> 00:33:56,750 kind of doing all of YouTube or you got YouTube shorts, 639 00:33:56,750 --> 00:33:59,570 you got YouTube on desktop and mobile and connected TVs, 640 00:33:59,570 --> 00:34:01,970 which takes all a little bit different format for each of those. 641 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:04,070 That's when it really works. 642 00:34:04,070 --> 00:34:06,860 We've seen less of an impact when it's just YouTube shorts. 643 00:34:06,950 --> 00:34:08,930 Last question, because I am late for a meeting. 644 00:34:09,170 --> 00:34:10,003 Yeah. 645 00:34:10,010 --> 00:34:13,640 What length are we looking at here? Is there an ideal minimum length? 646 00:34:13,970 --> 00:34:17,510 And I am saying minimum because I understand that there probably is a minimum. 647 00:34:17,630 --> 00:34:17,990 There is. 648 00:34:17,990 --> 00:34:22,820 I prefer 45 seconds to three minutes as kind of an ideal 649 00:34:22,820 --> 00:34:26,870 length that if you could shoot for 90 seconds or 60 seconds, that's great. 650 00:34:26,900 --> 00:34:29,960 Ultimately it's got to check the box, it's got to hook somebody, 651 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:30,890 it's got to be compelling, 652 00:34:30,890 --> 00:34:33,200 it's got to have the product demo and the social proof and the offer and all 653 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:37,190 that. But usually if it's a little bit longer, the more you tell, 654 00:34:37,220 --> 00:34:39,920 the more you sell, right? The more you show, the more dough. 655 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:41,570 I just made that on the spot. That's actually really lame. 656 00:34:42,260 --> 00:34:44,960 We've that are like 62nd cuts, 657 00:34:45,020 --> 00:34:48,950 outperform 32nd cuts when it's basically the same ad, just the 60 numbers, 658 00:34:48,950 --> 00:34:49,730 A 32nd, 659 00:34:49,730 --> 00:34:54,500 the 62nd does better with clicks and overall 660 00:34:54,500 --> 00:34:56,540 lift in sales. So generally speaking, 661 00:34:56,660 --> 00:35:00,410 we want to go kind of in that 45 to minute and a half range, 662 00:35:00,410 --> 00:35:02,330 but as much as three minutes can also work. 663 00:35:02,330 --> 00:35:04,220 Thank you. Thank you, thank you. 664 00:35:04,220 --> 00:35:08,720 Where can people find out more about what you are up to and chat with OMG 665 00:35:08,720 --> 00:35:09,260 commerce? 666 00:35:09,260 --> 00:35:11,480 Absolutely. So omg commerce.com, 667 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:15,710 click the Let's talk button and that's how you end up getting with our team. 668 00:35:16,340 --> 00:35:18,860 You can find my podcast there by clicking on resources. 669 00:35:18,860 --> 00:35:20,630 You can see the YouTube guide and up there as well. 670 00:35:20,660 --> 00:35:23,420 And then I'm active on LinkedIn, so hit me up on LinkedIn. 671 00:35:23,420 --> 00:35:24,440 Would love to connect to you. 672 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:29,180 I do talk about all things D two C and retail and business and Google and Amazon 673 00:35:29,180 --> 00:35:32,690 and all kinds of stuff. So would love to connect on LinkedIn as well. Awesome. 674 00:35:32,780 --> 00:35:32,930 And. 675 00:35:32,930 --> 00:35:34,280 I'm looking forward to coming on your pod. 676 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:35,540 It's going to be, let's do it, man. 677 00:35:35,900 --> 00:35:39,660 It's going to be a blast schedule talk TikTok shop. So I'm excited. Awesome. 678 00:35:39,660 --> 00:35:41,940 Well thanks again for your time today, Brett. Thanks Jordan. 679 00:35:44,220 --> 00:35:47,400 And as always, thank you for tuning in. We'd love to hear more from you. 680 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,660 So let us know what topics would you like to cover on this pod. 681 00:35:51,660 --> 00:35:54,750 And if you know somebody that would benefit from this episode, 682 00:35:54,750 --> 00:35:59,400 please share it and leave us a review on iTunes. That would make our day. 683 00:35:59,820 --> 00:36:02,100 And with that, until next time, thank you for listening.