00:00:00 Sana: Listeners, we're often sold a version of success. Um, it's a straight line. You know, it starts with your school career stability and maybe, maybe somewhere along the way. Purpose. But then honestly, after so many years, listeners, what I've realized and what I've also realized through so many conversations with our guests that real life rarely moves in straight lines. Sometimes it looks like filling out university applications one week and discovering you are pregnant the next. Sometimes it looks like studying for exams while raising a child. Sometimes it looks like building a business while people quietly assume your life has already peaked. Today's conversation is about that gap between what people expect from a woman's life and what women actually build when they refuse to shrink.

00:01:15 Sana: So welcome back, listeners to this very powerful episode on the Best Blend podcast. I'm your host Allison is my guest. She knows this journey firsthand. At eighteen, while most people were just starting adulthood, she was preparing to become a mother. By twenty, she was raising a child, working, studying, and pushing toward university. She went on to graduate, qualify as a midwife, navigating one of the most demanding healthcare systems in the world. But. But after experiencing the realities of under-resourced system and becoming a mother of three, she chose a different path. And today she is building two businesses and using her experience to help women and girls see possibilities that society often hides from them. Because sometimes, sometimes empowerment doesn't start with a huge Instagram were the motivational quote. It starts with survival. And slowly. Slowly and slowly turning that survival into leadership. So today we are going to talk about female entrepreneurship, the realities of starting over. The tension between non-profit missions and business sustainability, and the deeper question behind empowerment. What does it actually take to help women realize their potential beyond just telling them they can? So let's get into it. And listeners, let's welcome our incredible guest, Bethany Too-b. Bethany, welcome to this blend, and I'm absolutely honored to have you here with us.

00:03:06 Bethany Twibey: Thank you. Thank you very much for having me on. It's very honored to be here.

00:03:12 Sana: Um, Bethany, I mean, this is, this is really, um, and, you know, it's kind of very, very, um, layered because you're beginning, it started with something that, you know, people can have different opinions about. But then what I would like to say is motherhood, if I put it in the context of the profession and the business part, it's a full time job. I think it's more than full time job. You know, people say that mothers are the best managers out there. It's a full time job. And right at the age of eighteen, I mean tender age, you're just beginning your your life out there, your planning for your career. You have so many dreams and ambitions. I mean, it's, it's a, it's a huge, huge, um, um, kind of decision that you took. I'm really glad that you're here to, um, I don't know, maybe inspire or, or, uh, not just motivate, but, but, you know, share your lived experiences and help people understand that what exactly women empowerment is and what exactly it is not as popularly. You know, it is portrait. So thank you so much for being here. Bethany.

00:04:31 Bethany Twibey: Thank you so much for having me here. Yeah, I definitely agree. I think when you fall pregnant at eighteen years old, one week I was applying to university and doing my A-levels and my natural progression was just going to be from, um, A-levels through to university. And then you find out you're pregnant and obviously you have a decision to make whether you're going to carry on with that pregnancy and have a baby and your whole life is going to change. And I think the narrative is that you are no longer going to be able to go to university and you are going to struggle and you're going to suffer. Um, and I think it's a massive challenge. Eighteen years old, you're still finding yourself and you also have the added pressure of raising a child and trying to get them through their childhood to adulthood and a young person. I'm healthy and happy and managing their emotions and their expectations and what they've got going on in their life. While you're trying to figure out your own life, which I think contributed to kind of going around the houses a little bit with my career, but I think everything along the way contributed to where I am now.

00:05:35 Speaker 5: Mhm.

00:05:36 Bethany Twibey: Mhm.

00:05:37 Sana: Yes, absolutely. And, uh, this is more and more kind of, um, a huge, huge challenge to navigate through because not only it's about, um, uh, you know, navigating university work and motherhood at all once, but all at once. But, but, you know, in, in many cultures, um, it kind of contributes or it kind of becomes the sole reason of, uh, a woman becoming alienated from her loved ones, shunned in the society because it's not looked, uh, at in a very positive sense. Um, there is character assassination. There is a lot of, um, you know, labels put in there and I believe, um, women who navigate through those situations. Um, yeah, it is challenging, but then it's really powerful to see, you know, how irrespective of all that noise, they are still able to be laser focused very much, um, mentally strong to go through all those trials and tribulations, to go through the bliss, the love of motherhood, doing their job, studying, making something out of her own career, taking care of her, of her kids, of her kid, of her baby. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's absolutely, uh, it's on another super power level. I don't know.

00:07:08 Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:07:09 Bethany Twibey: Even in the UK, obviously, we are not centered so much around culture and religion in the same way as some other parts of the world are. So. In one sense that lifted the pressure. But there still is very much that assumption that you are a teenage mom and you are not going to achieve very much, and potentially you're going to depend on welfare benefits and things like that to get through life. And I think if anything, being eighteen years old and having to make such a huge decision kind of frames all the other decisions I make as quite small, whereas other people might think they're massive decisions and be really afraid of them. But I don't think anything is as big of a decision as having a whole child to look after. Um, especially eighteen years old. I, I lived at home with my parents when I found out I was pregnant and then moved out of home for the first time, sat my final A-level exams and had a baby. And then when my baby was about fifteen months old, I became a single mum. So that was a very different life to navigate as well, having just myself to depend on and family support as well. Um, but I think it drove me to kind of prove people wrong because I was like that. That isn't the end of my life. I am still a person and I have the same skills I had before. I was slightly delayed by two or three years getting to university, but I still got there in the end and did what I wanted to do. Um, and I think it's something that I really am passionate about educating people on as to how you make a decision. You don't have to stick by that path in your life forever, obviously. My child wasn't going to disappear anywhere, and she was always going to remain my responsibility. But I didn't have to become a self-fulfilling prophecy, I guess. And when I then graduated as a midwife and went into the NHS and realised it wasn't an environment that I enjoyed working in, I didn't thrive there. I think it would have been very easy to think, well, I've spent three years doing this degree and that's everything I wanted, so now I have to stick with it. But I think we need to feel so honored that we are here on earth and we have every day to live, and we need to be so happy in what we're doing that there just isn't time to wait around and be unhappy. Um, so yeah, I think it prepared me to kind of just make decisions for what works for me, what works for my family, what I'm passionate about, and not picking over fearful of them.

00:09:29 Speaker 5: Exactly, exactly. I think I.

00:09:31 Sana: Love that, um, honesty, um, because, um, it kind of, you know, we kind of, uh, romanticize resilience. Um, but in real life, I think, uh, um, perseverance, it usually feels, um, it's very unglamorous. It's exhausting. Um, and, um, you know, especially when you are raising a child while trying to build your own future. The pressure is not, um, not, you know, uh, it's not theoretical. It doesn't go by the book. It is very, very real. And, um, I would also like to understand from you because you are now focusing on helping women and girls realize their potential now. Um, I mean, um, we, we just celebrated Women's Day. We celebrate women in entrepreneurship. We celebrate women in tech. Um, we celebrate our mothers, sisters, daughters, um, partners. Um, I mean, it's, it's used a lot in business and social media. And personally, what I feel is to an extent where it's, it's really kind of feels like, um, a nice to have a must have or it looks good for PR or, um, you know, maybe, um, it just appeals to the masses from your perspective, what does women empowerment actually look like in practical terms? You know, beyond all that motivational language?

00:11:08 Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:11:08 Bethany Twibey: So that's, um, very ironic actually. I did a post on International Women's Day. Saying, Is International Women's Day really happy, or is it just a opportunity for PR? And I think to have an International Women's Day is obviously a huge positive, and we can celebrate the advancements we've made in terms of what women are doing now in their lives that they wouldn't have been doing fifty years ago. But I also think we have to be careful to tread that line of not celebrating equality, because it should be the bare minimum. Um, and I think brands who are using it to solely offer discount codes and bring business in, obviously they are businesses and they are doing that for publicity. But I think days that mark, for instance, International Women's Day needed to be treated carefully and the actual messaging behind it still coming through, rather than being really overpowered with strong women because it's very easy to portray. The women in society who are winning, the women who are in the six seven figure jobs and businesses and have the stable families and the opportunity. But we also need to remember that there are women in the UK where I live, there are women throughout the world who definitely do not have those opportunities, do not have those rights or freedoms, and are dealing with um, oppression and domestic violence and lack of protection from the society they live in. Um, and I think we need to see both sides of it to really do justice for days like that, rather than seeing it as a very glamorous International Women's Day. Let's celebrating all our nice clothes with all our nice businesses and nice cars, because that isn't what it's about.

00:12:55 Speaker 5: Yes. Yeah, that's that is actually a very.

00:13:00 Sana: I must say, raw and something that I also personally believe that it's not just, um, that, you know, to be a successful woman, you have to be successful only in your professional career. I mean, let's say a daughter, um, who is not allowed to, um, maybe study in her graduation or not to go outside, leave her family and work outside, live in some big city out there. Um, she's, she's defying all the odds and she's still surviving in there. She, she's learning all the ways to be independent. And in some ways, um, she knows, she knows her way out there. She has her clarity. Um, she, she deserves to be celebrated. A mother who is, is, um, prioritizing her family, um, for unfortunately sacrificing her own well-being, but at least, you know, uh, but at least, you know, she's, she's conscious of the fact that, yes, she's sacrificing something because of her kids, of her family, of her loved ones, because she wants a better future for her kids. She needs to be celebrated as well. And it's not just about the, the corporate, um, the black coats and the, the cars and then the, the money out there.

00:14:26 Bethany Twibey: Yes, definitely. And I think one of the things I feel really passionate about and having a background in maternity really opened my eyes. So there has been a massive agenda in the UK for, um, recognising why black and minority ethnic groups are at a disadvantage within the UK maternity system and there is a higher incidence of mortality. And I think people who are in a privileged position, and I recognise I'm in a privileged position to have had a child at eighteen and had the opportunity to go to university, and I have the opportunity to not face discrimination based on my culture or skin colour or religion, and I have the freedom to make choices. And I think we need to recognize those privileges and make those decisions to pave the way for other people, but not forget those other people in the background because they won't have those same opportunities. And just because on paper, they haven't achieved what we have achieved, they have probably faced a lot more hardship and a lot more difficulty to get to where they are in life, opposed to somebody who has sort of had a stable foundation staff on.

00:15:39 Sana: Yeah, yeah. And something you mentioned, Bethany, is what I feel, freedom of choice. I mean. It is it is still evident that there are many cultures, many countries, many societies where especially for women, for girls, that freedom of choice is not applicable. It is not. I mean, I think there's there's still a long way to go ahead. Um, and, and, um, I also see that, you know, um, unfortunately there is a kind of a very, um, unfortunate, um, unfortunate, uh, interpretation of equality and women empowerment. I believe that women empowerment is not talking about that, you know, um, everything has been done wrong to us or, um, looking at other gender and, uh, you know, it's, it's toxic and it's bad. All of, all men have done wrong to us and, uh, it's, it's time to, um, you know, it's time to kind of seek revenge or, um, to, uh, to outshine everyone else. I think, uh, true women empowerment for me is a very kind of a balanced and layered approach. Um, equality. It's, it's not about that just to make sure that, you know, thirty percent of your workforce is female. That's why you are appointing females. But at least when you're looking at a particular level or role in your workplace, you are equally considering men and women depending on their skills, on their capabilities, what can they bring up to the table? If the role is demanding that, yes, the person has to be, let's say, um, empathetic or the person has relevant experience, she or he can, uh, he has or she has that approach in there. I don't think that, you know, uh, this approach should be considered that, you know, just because she's a woman, that's why I'm hiring her. No, because she's capable and she's equally equally. She equally deserves that role because her skills, her contributions, her experiences, her way of thinking it matches to what exactly the role demands or what the company demands or whatever it is. That's why she deserves to be in here. So that's that's how I see, you know, especially in the in the in the professional world.

00:18:20 Bethany Twibey: Yeah, definitely. I agree. I think that equality is a pretty different difficult word. Um, and I think trying to get equality for men and women when they both individually face different barriers and different problems throughout life is very difficult to achieve. Um, and I think it's very difficult to apply something that gives across the board equality. For instance, women are always going to need, in an ideal world, maternity leave and women are always going to struggle more with reproductive health than male counterparts. Um, males are going to struggle potentially more with the pressures, especially in the cost of living crisis, with being the main earners and having the financial pressure while they have young families. And I think it's a difficult thing to navigate because I think it's very easy to focus on what is relevant to you. And if obviously you're a woman and you're focusing on what's relevant to you, it's easy to forget the other things in society that are happening. And I think empowering women is making sure that they have access to the same opportunity. Not that they automatically get those opportunities just because they're female. And I think one of the problems that I'm seeing with new founders is they want a completely female run team. And I do feel like males have a huge contribution to businesses, and they use different parts of their brain that are a little bit more analytical and maybe a little bit more brutal than women. And sometimes that is very much needed in business. And obviously working as a midwife before that is a very, very female dominated environment in terms of both patients and staff. And you can see how sometimes that really doesn't work because there isn't a balance of masculine and feminine energy. And I don't necessarily think that's a benefit either. Um, so yeah, I think equality is a very difficult thing to achieve. And I think it's a very difficult thing to summarize. Um, and on the flip side, I think whenever you are trying to talk about equality for women, it's very easy to kind of get branded a feminist, which now has very negative connotations around it and not be able to get your voice heard in a serious way, because I think men feel attacked by the fact that women want more when we're not attacking them directly. It's the infrastructure of society that is a problem rather than men, if that makes sense.

00:20:52 Sana: It does. It does bad thing. At least for me. It does absolutely make sense. I mean, yeah, maybe a few of our listeners, they wouldn't agree with this. Maybe their perspectives. And, and I think that's how healthy conversations around, um, because, you know, these are once again, very, very difficult layered, um, uh, aspects to talk about as a society, as a human in there, but at least what is non-negotiable is the agency, the freedom of choice. I think that is something, um, the basic, the basic idea, the basic, um, um, you know, essence behind feminism. It all started that, you know, we should get the freedom of choice. We can, we do have the choice to make decisions for our own life, not dictated by maybe the patriarchal society or our fathers or our families. Um, and also because, you know, you mentioned about midwifery, um, you qualified as a midwife in twenty twenty one. Um, you have also openly spoken about how difficult it was to work with an AR with an under-resourced system like NHS. Um, what what made you realize that staying in that system wasn't aligned with the kind of impact you wanted to create?

00:22:17 Bethany Twibey: I think going into midwifery, it is a very romanticized profession and especially within the NHS, there is a lot of litigation, which in turn means there's a lot of policies and a lot of red tape. And I think there is certain language used within maternity, such as you're not allowed or you are allowed. And I think when a woman is in a position where she is birthing a baby for ninety nine point nine percent of them, they're never going to make a decision to endanger themselves or endanger their baby. And I think when you really sit back and look at the modern maternity system across developed countries, sometimes we are doing more harm than good with the intention with the interventions we make. Um, and I think when you're in such a clinical environment and you can see that the rate of induction and the rate of C-section is increasing, but the outcomes are not getting any better. You sometimes have to analyze why that might be. Um, when it's under-resourced. You also cannot spend the time with the woman that you would like to spend with them. And therefore the increased incidence of birth, trauma and postnatal depression is forever present. And you cannot offer that woman the support she needs to go into motherhood, feeling prepared and feeling like she can do her best. Um, I don't think in Western society we give mothers enough space to care for themselves during pregnancy and postnatal. I think we're very privileged in terms of we have a maternity leave sort of system, But I don't think we actually allow women that space to heal and bond with their babies, because it's very much you go home and you want to pretend like you're doing really, really well and you want to invite your family around. And I don't think there is enough space for that mother infant dyad to really bond, um, and initiate breastfeeding in a way that they would want to. And I'm never going to say that everyone should breastfeed or every woman should have a natural birth because that doesn't work either. But I think the, again, the opportunity should always be there and be facilitated in the best way possible for that mother. Um, and that baby. And I think when you're looking after several women at a time, you cannot tailor that care. And when you're being told you cannot allow that woman to have the birth she wants to have, when ultimately it is her choice. And I think, again, everything comes down to language and how you use that language because Legally within the maternity system. In the UK, women are allowed to do whatever they want to do. Um, but when you're putting it over to a woman that she isn't allowed, she's going to take it very literally. And I think seeing how the maternity system works, I knew I wasn't going to be able to fulfill what I needed to fulfill in myself, to empower women to feel like they've reached their highest potential in whatever area of life and whatever stage of life they're going through.

00:25:27 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah.

00:25:29 Sana: And, uh, I think it's, it's, there's often this tension between the institutional systems and, and individual purpose. Um, uh, so if, if I, if I can, uh, I think, uh, this is a perfect way to kind of, uh, put it, um, if we look at what, you know, Max Weber, sociologist, he wrote about like how, uh, large, uh, this huge, big institutions they can become. Um, uh, bureaucratic, uh, to the point where, um, their original mission, uh, that entire, you know, fundamental message on which the entire institution was built, it kind of gets diluted. And I think in healthcare, especially, um, we, we hear that many professionals, I mean, they entered just because they, they, they, they care for people, but then they themselves end up overwhelmed by the structure around them. So, um, it all makes sense. And Bethany, before we wrap up, um, because you are now running a business, uh, you're focusing on empowering women. Um, and, uh, it reminds me of an episode, which I did, um, a few days back with another, uh, female guest of mine, Robin Harris. You know, we were discussing about the, the business and the, the mission driven business and the profitability part. Often it's a, there's a huge kind of tension between both of these. So how do you balance helping women and girls with the practical realities of running a company?

00:27:13 Bethany Twibey: Yeah. So in the UK, we have a company set up called a community Interest Company, which in its simplest terms, kind of sits halfway between a typical for profit company and a charity. So you are able, within that business set up to make profit and sell services, and you can also apply for external funding, and we can apply for funding from places like the National Lottery is a very big one. And that is where our most recent source of funding came to allow us to deliver our upcoming project. And I think being in both sides of the business, for profit business and nonprofit business. They obviously run in very, very different ways. And in a nonprofit business, you have your aims and your missions, but you are also constrained by what funding is available at what time and what those funders priorities are of what you spend their money on. So you are pitching to funders to say, I want to do this project, and this is why I think it's worthwhile funding and this is what my community wants. If you obviously go through a period where funders aren't aligning with what you are wanting to deliver, your services do kind of come to a stop in terms of free services. So I think there's definitely a place for both, and it's something I'm wanting to build up into two streams where you are meeting the needs of people in community and society who cannot access those services normally because of financial barriers, and also offering my skill set to people who want to pay for it. And they kind of will circle will go round in a three hundred sixty and co-fund each other. Um, so yeah, it's, it's quite a difficult landscape to navigate. And having had. To reach the people who really need them because businesses ultimately, the more money you're investing, the more money you expect to get back. If it's a viable business. That isn't the case with a non-profit. You don't just have endless amounts of funds coming back in. But I would say the, um, reward comes from the impact you're making as well. And I think it's very important to remember not everything is money. Obviously, we need money to live and we need money to be able to do the things we want to do. But there is also a lot of reward to be had in recognising you've made an impact and a change to other people's lives, who ultimately may not have recognised that they could have even reached that potential. Mhm, mhm.

00:29:51 Sana: And, you know, it makes sense. I mean, maybe that that tension. Um. It depends. It depends on, on, um, company to company founder to founder, I think, uh. It's not more about making that company investable or appealing to the investors, but it's more about, um, yeah, the impact you're making and of course, how you can work around to sustain that company. I mean, you can find your niche in there. You can find like minded people who will be a part of that mission. Um, and maybe they're, they're willing to, um, I mean, there are exceptions. There are cases, there are companies, there are people who are actually, you know, they're, they're not a part of that conventional, um, I would say herd or tribe. Um, they'll always be their people and, you know, probably, maybe, uh, you know, who can also support financially, who can also support that mission? Um, without maybe nothing back in return. But yes, there are exceptions. So I think, uh, you kind of get to, uh, find your own, um, circle your own niche and not just make it profitable or investable for the investors out there. So yeah, that makes sense.

00:31:18 Bethany Twibey: Let me yeah, I think as well, having run businesses before, it's very clear to see sometimes why nonprofits struggle to grow. And I think when you are applying for funding and you are successful in getting funding, it's important to be strategic. What you are doing with that funding to ensure you grow and ensure you become appealing to bigger, like non-governmental organizations and to, um, public funds as well, not just privately funded grant funding coming from public funds, so you can continue to make that impact. And I think working with women and girls is notoriously underfunded across the world, and it does make it a little bit more difficult. But I think as long as you're measuring the impact you're making and working with what the government are aligned with. So the government are obviously aligned with improving health, improving employment, improving people's overall wellness because it takes pressure off of other services. And in the meantime, you can still create that same amount of impact. I think it's really important to look at the long term of any business, and I think that's one of the benefits of coming into a non-profit and being the founder of a non-profit, having already run businesses, you you aren't just focused on this project, you're running for the next twelve months. You're focused on what comes after that and how you can grow and who you can be making connections with within other organizations that may be able to support you later down the line, such as our local councils have recently got some funding that really aligns with what I'm doing, and I think that has happened intentionally because of the way I have designed the projects I'm delivering. Opposed to accidentally aligning. Um, so yeah, I would say for anybody looking at non-profit, it's definitely important to look at what is going on in the wider world and whether you are going to be able to continue the work that you are doing. Um, to make sure that you're, you have longevity of your company because it's a hard thing to build up a company and market a company, whether it's for profit, nonprofit, it's hard work to market that and grow a company. And you don't want to get to the end of the road and realize that there is no more funding coming into your business and your demographic. The demographic of your audience is ultimately not going to have money to invest in paid services within your business. So I think it's important for nonprofits to look at the longevity of what they're doing, as well as the short term impact.

00:33:49 Speaker 7: Makes sense.

00:33:49 Sana: One hundred percent makes sense. Uh, this was, uh, really, I think in such, uh, a less, uh, you know, with, with so much, uh, so less time we explored, um, so much. Um, so I should really, uh, appreciate, um, because I think, uh, this was one of those conversations where not only we got to know your journey, we got to know your story, but, uh, we got to understand, um, that, you know, people's lives, they really unfold according to society's timeline and, um, setbacks. Maybe it's a career pivot or a layoff or leaving a system that no longer fits. They do become the turning points that reshape a life. So thank you so much, Bethany. And of course, if our listeners, they would like to connect with you, um, get to explore the work that you are doing. What's, what's the best way?

00:34:51 Bethany Twibey: Yeah. So we have a project coming up next Thursday. So that'll be Thursday, the nineteenth of March. Um, and that is our first session for the women's Empowerment program. It's called Raise Her Up. We'll be starting with mindset and confidence, working our way through skills identification and then coaching around employment, marketing and business. Um, they can access that through our website, which is ww dot co dot UK. All our social handles are raise her c I c and we're on Instagram and TikTok. They're our main platforms where you'll find us.

00:35:29 Speaker 7: Of course, of course. So, um.

00:35:32 Sana: What I'll do is I'll have all the links mentioned. Um, so do check out Bethany's project upcoming on nineteenth March. We'll get to find all the details attached in the show notes, find them along with this episode on whichever platform you're listening to the podcast right now. And do follow us because if because if, if conversations like this resonate with you, the honest ones about work, ambition, and the complicated paths people take to build meaningful lives, then I hope that you do follow this film because we keep on bringing such amazing, amazing conversations with incredible guests like Bethany and Bethany. Once again, thank you so, so much for being candid and sharing your, your, your journey, your story with us and the work that.

00:36:25 Bethany Twibey: You very much for having me on. I really appreciate it. And it's been a lovely conversation.

00:36:30 Sana: So of course, of course. And listeners, thank you so much for being such lovely listeners for tuning into this blend. And uh, until next time, this is your host Sana, and I'll catch you in the next episode. Thank you.