Welcome to Close it now, the podcast that's revolutionizing the H Vac and home improvement trades industries.

Get ready to dive deep into the world of heating, ventilation and air conditioning.

We're turning up the heat on industry standards and cooling down misconceptions.

And we're not just talking about fixing vents and adjusting thermostats.

It's about the transformative movement that's reshaping the very foundation of H Vac and home improvement.

We're the driving force, inspiring top performers who crave excellence not only in their professional endeavors, but also in fitness, nutrition, relationships and personal growth, proving that we can indeed have it all.

This is Close it now, where excellence meets excitement.

Let's get to work.

Now, your host, Sam Wakefield.

Five, four, three, two, one, go.

It's time.

This is the Discovery Trilogy, part three.

The questions that create clarity.

Because people don't buy answers, they buy understanding.

So let's get into this.

Welcome.

Sam Wakefield here.

So here's a question for you, or not a question.

Here's just a.

Let.

Let's start here.

So you all know, because you've experienced this, and if you haven't experienced this, you just haven't been in enough homes and enough appointments yet.

But there's a moment in every appointment when the homeowner leans back, looks at you differently and says, no one's ever asked me that before.

That's not just a good question.

That's the moment you've won the sale.

Because now you're not a salesperson, you're a trusted guide.

You're the tour guide now.

And that's the moment the sale was made.

May or may not have even seen price yet, but that's when you're now trusted.

And so that is what we're going to get into is the third part of this Discovery trilogy.

Because so far, what we have covered, we're going to move from what to ask to how to listen and from selling features to unlocking emotion.

This is where we're moving from that.

We're moving from what to ask to how to listen and from selling features to unlocking emotion.

So the theme here is discovery is not about finding the problem, it's about helping the homeowner discover themselves in the solution.

So let's get into this.

Thanks for joining me.

I am Sam Wakefield, host of the Close it now podcast.

Welcome, everybody.

If you've listened for a while or if you're brand new, thanks for being here and welcome as well.

I'm going to take a second.

Raise your hand.

It's okay if I take a second and reintroduce myself because it's been a minute, so if you don't know.

Yes, I wrote a book, co authored a book last year, hit international bestseller list.

Huge announcement.

This is a big celebration moment if you want to celebrate with me.

This podcast, the Close it now podcast, just moved up in the rankings globally.

It was a top 2% podcast, which means more listens than 98% of the other podcasts in the world.

Well, we just moved up in the ranking to one and a half percent.

So that might not seem like a lot to some of you if you don't know what those numbers mean, but when you're talking about a few million podcasts running globally to move up half of percent from we're now not only ranked higher than 98%, now it's we're ranked higher than 98 and a half percent.

That half percent was a huge jump.

So thank you every single one of you who have listened.

There has been a huge increase in listenership lately.

So thank you for everyone for sharing this podcast to your friends, to your co workers, to to your as all those service managers and owners and sales managers, sharing it to your teams and vice versa, sharing it up the chain.

This has been a labor of love.

I've absolutely love recording these episodes for all of you.

So thank you for listening.

Big celebration moment.

I have an ask if you would go to Google and leave me a just search close it now on Google and leave me a five star review or go to Apple podcasts and leave me a five star review.

If you've ever gotten value from the show that would be dramatically appreciated and it would be super awesome.

So it just dawned on me watching myself record this.

If you haven't subscribed on the YouTube channel, make sure to go subscribe on the YouTube channel.

Because the fun part is I realized because you get a sneak peek behind me, my whiteboard behind me.

How many of you have ever watched the Big Bang Theory?

One of the things I loved about the Big Bang Theory was they would have a local professor from, I think it was from Berkeley come in and the physics professor and actually write on the whiteboard to have legitimate physics equations and stuff.

And so what he would do, he would actually write the answers to the tests that the students were in during those sessions and stuff.

So during that week, so if they actually went to the show, they would get the answers to some test questions.

So it was legitimate.

So it reminded me of that because on the whiteboard behind me this is so where I record my podcast is also when I do one on one coaching, there's always typically something on the board behind me that I've covered with my coaching clients, usually the day of or a day or two before I've recorded.

So if you want to get a peek into the mind of what it looks like to coach with me, watch the YouTubes because there's the sneak peeks behind there.

Also on that topic, I just had a couple people graduate from the one on one coaching program.

So I've got a couple spots open.

So if you want to know more about what it looks like to coach with me directly, that is you and I reach out samoseitnow.net or you can go to closeitnow.net, right to the website and fill out the form and we'll be I'll be in touch.

And it's not I'm not a bot when I text you, I'm actually reach out to you directly because I believe in relationship, not just transaction and building relationship.

If we coach together or not, the relationship is the most important part.

So if you want to know about coaching with me, if you want to get your numbers doubled or tripled over this next bit, let's chat because that happens all the freaking time when people work with me.

So.

So let's go.

Let's get into this episode.

No more Dilly Dally.

And I'm fired up today, in fact.

Oh, so what's in your cup?

This is probably why I'm a little bit fired up.

I've got some.

It was just in a hurry so I grabbed some Nespresso pods.

I've got a couple Starbucks Colombian today.

And I just ran it into some iced, iced it, put some milk, 6 ounces of milk in there.

120 calories.

I started 75 hard this week.

If you're, if you've ever done 75 hard, I'd love to hear from you.

In the Facebook group, we started an accountability group starting 75 hard.

And so if you want to be part of that, I have a feeling I'm going to do this regularly.

The gift I'm this is date of recording is October 9th.

So we started 8, 7, 6.

We started October 6th, 2025.

The gift I'm giving myself this year for Christmas is the gift of abs.

So what are you giving yourself for Christmas?

You have to give yourself something that as hard as we work in everything we do, you have to take a moment to give back to yourself.

Self care is so important.

And this might seem like an odd version of self care to some of you, but committing to this program for me is really taking, for me taking care of myself.

So I'm paying it forward.

So what that means though is I'm insanely accurate with every single thing that goes in my mouth.

I'm measuring it using my fitness pal app and tracking calories.

So what can you do today to move yourself 1% better today than you were yesterday?

And it's not just in your sales skills.

Sales is not the performance of an hour while you're in the house.

It's the overflow of your life.

So if you're not taking care of all of the other elements in your life that create a top performer, you cannot be a million dollar earner and eat off the dollar menu.

You are a machine and it cannot function on cheap fuel.

So put in the work because that self discipline is worth it.

So let's get into this episode.

Before we do, let's toast, everybody.

What are you drinking today?

What's in your cup?

You got a latte?

You've.

Do you have special beans?

Do you, have you got whiskey in your cup?

You got what's in your red solo cup?

What are we drinking today?

Let's start a chat in the Facebook group about it.

Let's talk about it.

But everybody, let's toast this episode and we'll get into this content.

3, 2, 1.

All right.

Got some espresso and I am fired up.

I'm ready to rock.

So getting back into this Discovery is not about finding the problem.

It's about helping the homeowner discover themselves in the solution.

So so far we've covered in the first part, episode one of the Discovery trilogy, you learned how the appointment timeline moves through energy and time and then from past, present to the future.

In episode two, we talked about the setup and some of the mindset around discovery and conversation starters.

We talked about mirroring.

We use the I introduced the observations versus concern question and then listening to understand, not to respond.

So this is episode three.

This is the practical tool tool set.

I'm giving you tools for your tool belt.

The questions that create clarity and unlock urgency through empathy.

And we're going to talk about some brain science and we're going to talk about how to be a surgeon and use precision instead of being a blunt object.

So that is what we are getting into today.

And yeah, I love it.

So here's the, here's the first concept I want to introduce to you because you have to remember you can't build emotional value if you're only asking questions.

And we're only exploring logical pain.

So let me define this for you a little bit.

Logical is the stuff.

It's the, you know, so when we're asking questions.

So let's take this path.

When you're getting into your discovery, into your.

Some people call it the needs assessment.

I hate that term because it limits our mind around what we think we're asking about.

So it's a discovery.

Just generalize it.

It's discovery.

So what happens here?

You want to do these questions in two passes.

We want to ask questions about one thing first and then the second.

So there's a couple ideas around this that I want you to think about.

The way that we're at.

Yes, we're asking questions for us to find out what they're experiencing.

You know it.

When you're.

When you're amateur at this, you think you're asking questions strictly to find out what's broken.

Is there a duct that's disconnected?

Really?

Just to figure out how you can troubleshoot better.

That's a very technician type of what's wrong, let's fix the broken thing mindset, people.

The house does not write the check.

People write the check.

So we have to change the way we think.

If we want different outcomes, Remember, we have to change our thoughts.

So changing the way we think will get us different outcomes.

So there's several purposes for discovery.

One is we need to ask more and better questions.

Yes.

So we can get clarity on what their real problem is.

And remember, the real problem is not the fact that this thing is broken.

The real problem is their frustration surrounding why they can't live the way that they want to live.

And so we're getting clarity there.

But more importantly, most homeowners don't truly know.

Depending on what your industry is, some it's more obvious than others.

But most homeowners don't truly know exactly what their problems are until we ask better clarifying questions.

So they get crystal clear on the problem as well.

Because until they're clear on the problem, we can't show them a clear solution because they may or may not believe that it's going to solve whatever this mystery like, thing is that's going on.

But when they're clear on it, there's a quote that I heard a good while back from my friend Jimmy Jay's.

He says a problem that is well defined is half solved.

And so this very much applies here.

So we're asking the questions to help them get clarity on the problem.

So the first pass of questions, we want to frame your questions like this.

If you were on a telephone, imagine old school curlicue cable attached to the wall, not a cell phone, not even a wireless phone.

You got old school curlicue cable and you are, and you're not in the house, you cannot see what's going on and they don't know anything about your industry.

How would you have to structure your questions to get the correct information from them, but do it in a term that they can understand.

That's how you want to think about how you ask your questions in discovery.

So no, we don't go into the house and start asking do you know what the R value of your walls are?

That's stupid questions in this time it has nothing to do with anything.

And if you have a clue what you're doing, you're going to figure that out anyway on your own.

So don't ask stupid questions like that.

Ask stupid questions, get stupid answers.

Completely irrelevant answers do the work.

But, so this is making sense, everybody.

And so, but you want to ask questions in a way to help them come realize what's truly going on.

And then guys, the yawns today.

Hopefully we'll edit that out and if not, you get what you get.

This has been a long day.

So, so, so okay, so we're asking the questions.

So the first pass is asking question exhaust all the questions about the problem.

So first pass is the problem.

This is the logic.

This you've all heard.

People buy on emotion and justify it with logic.

This is the logic piece.

It's data based questions.

What's happening where, when, how often, how long has that been happening?

Does it get worse at certain times of day?

So I'll give you some examples.

We'll take an easy one.

Let's take a bedroom that's too hot in the summer, too cold in the winter.

And the questions about the problem would sound something like okay, obviously start with tell me more about that.

How bad does it get?

Have you ever measured it?

How much of a difference is it between the rest that are in the rest of the house?

Is it door opened or closed or.

Or both?

Is it daytime, nighttime or both?

Is it summer and winter?

Is it spring and fall?

Is all the seasons the same?

And so just really diving into all of the, what, you know, who noticed it first?

How long has it been going on?

All those types of things.

So that's questions about the problem itself.

But then when you've exhausted all those, you need to do pass number Two over the situation.

And that is where you want to start asking questions about the person or people that the problem affects.

So then we turn the corner and.

Because this is the emotional and human impact side of your questioning.

So who does it affect?

How does it make them feel?

What do they wish was different?

So who lives in that space?

Okay, great.

Tell me more about that.

Do you think that, you know, how does it show up?

What would it mean if this problem were fixed?

So, for example, we'll use just my house, my daughter's bedroom.

It's too hot.

It's too hot in the summer.

She sleeps with the fan on her face.

She sleeps with her window open in the winter.

Um, I'm currently in a rental.

So I have, I've only, only willing to invest a certain amount into this house.

So sadly, I haven't been able to completely solve this problem.

It's dramatically better than what it was when we first moved in.

But can't wait till I get to the next house, till we get to our, our next place.

So.

Because I'm going to make sure everything is great.

But so everybody, you get a peek into my personal life.

Because transparency is everything.

The more vulnerable and quick side note, quick pop out your ninja trick.

Especially when we start getting into discovery.

The more and just when you're having conversation with people, the more vulnerable and the more you authentically share your own life with them, they will.

Because you're the tour guide, you're leading with these mirror neurons, like we've talked about in past episodes, they will become more vulnerable and share and open up with you.

So you lead the conversation by sharing something and they will share back.

So getting back to this topic, so questions about.

Okay, wow.

So tell me more about.

So who lives in that room?

You know, whose room is that?

So I'm going to role play it back and forth with myself.

So it could sound something like.

Okay, whose room is that?

Oh, it's my daughter's room.

Oh, it's your daughter's room.

Okay.

How old is she?

She's 14.

Okay, great.

How long have you been here?

Well, We've been here 10 years.

Has it always been her room?

No, she moved in probably six or seven years ago.

Or five.

Six years ago.

Okay, great.

Perfect.

Okay.

So, you know, does she ever complain about it?

Oh, yeah, she complains.

You know, the peaks of the seasons.

Oh, wow, that sounds pretty rough.

And so, I mean, does it affect her sleep?

Yeah, yeah, it definitely affects her sleep.

Oh, wow.

So is it like groggy, hard to get around in the morning sometimes.

Oh, for sure.

Yeah.

It's sometimes difficult getting up, going to school, man, that's awful.

I mean, do you think it affects her schoolwork?

So see where I'm going with the questions?

We start asking about first layer problems, then you start asking about second and third, you know, third layer consequences of the temperature issue.

So, yes, it's uncomfortable, but what does it affect?

How does it affect them?

You know, does it affect their sleep?

Does it affect this, does it affect that?

If the kid is in along these same lines as, you know, for example, if their kids are in sports, like, wow, you think if they're not sleeping good, it affects their sports performance?

Of course it does.

So a lot of these are things that people don't even think of that now we're helping them to get clarity on not only the problem itself, because, okay, so the room is too hot, but what does it affect?

And as we start to tie all of this, connect the dots in their brain, because you have to remember, most people don't naturally have the ability to connect the dots between what we discover is the problem and how it affects their life.

But the more we can verbalize it, more importantly, the more they verbalize it, it becomes real and it becomes tangible.

And now they're starting to understand how these dots connect.

So now they can see the importance and see and understand the importance of solving the problem to change the way that their loved one's life will change.

Is this making sense?

So this is how to do real discovery.

And so a little bit of brain science here on this.

You know, there's two, two pieces of the brain.

One's called the neocortex.

One's called the limbic brain.

The neocortex handles facts and logic.

It justifies their decisions.

And then the limbic brain that drives emotion, trust and action.

So great discovery bridges the two.

And this is why we just talked about that.

Because logic gives permission, emotion gives propulsion.

So another way to say it, I'm going to give you a lot of one liners coming from different angles because I want, I truly want you to understand this principle in this concept, because once you get it, it's going to change everything in the way you do your sales.

Logic builds comfort, emotion builds commitment.

Logic builds comfort, emotion builds commitment.

So now that we understand these basic principles, let's dig a little bit deeper.

And so, you know, and in that role play, you heard me give you several different examples of questions.

These are not the only questions.

I'm here to tell you that it's endless.

There's unlimited number of questions depending on what's going on in your situation.

You can ask a million different questions based on that.

So what made you decide to call today?

How bad does it get?

Has it always been that way?

What, what happens when it's at its worst?

What can you not do because of it?

If we could fix that, what difference would that make for you?

So understanding these questions and understanding the answers to these questions, it.

Because what happens here?

And this is the cool part.

So here's the ninja, ninja trick.

Brain science piece of this and why it works so well.

Each follow up question releases dopamine in their brain.

That is the curiosity.

That's the curiosity.

Brain science, brain chemical.

When homeowners explain more, their brain rewards them with this dopamine.

So they enjoy the conversation.

The more they talk, the more they trust.

The more they trust, the more they buy.

So you have to stay curious always.

You cannot be too curious.

Like, imagine yourself, you're not an interrogator, you're a detective.

You're a detective.

You're freaking Sherlock Holmes.

Put on the hat, grab the bubble pipe.

And because here's the difference, Good salespeople will answer questions, great ones earn the right to ask better ones, right?

So if homeowners ask you a question, you answer it.

If you're, if you want to be great, you're going to earn the right to ask them five times as many questions as they're asking you.

Because that's the only way you can be a consultant.

Because people will trust a consultant because you're working together on a project.

You're not trying to sell them something.

You're teaming up to solve the problem together.

So let's move on a little bit.

Let's see what's our time here?

All right, so one thing that's really important in this is the flinch.

Flinch and empathy.

So if you've never heard what a flinch is, this is actually a negotiation principle.

There's an old school book called the Secret Power of Negotiation called by, I think it was the Secret Power of Negotiation by a guy named Roger Dawson.

Incredible book, highly recommend.

But so the flinch is an actual specific.

And Chris Voss actually even talks about it in, in Never split the difference.

So when a home, when they reveal something, when you're dealing with your homeowners and they reveal something personal or something out of the ordinary, pause and react, even just sometimes slightly, you can actually build in the reaction a little bit on purpose.

And so in the flinch, here's what Happens.

We have to.

This is in.

Let's take a different, totally different look for a second and we'll come right back to the flinch.

Think about it in these kind of terms.

We've talked about this before.

In other episodes, the difference in, say, medical care when we go to the doctors.

We've all heard these terms.

Bedside manner, good bedside manner, bad bedside manner.

Why do we trust certain doctors over others?

And this really is a big part of it is that reactive, coactive listening, meaning responding and reacting to how they are communicating to us.

So here's a couple of examples.

Think about it in these terms.

When you have a doctor that goes through.

And I've told the story, my mom just went through this.

She had two different doctors.

She was looking at heart surgery.

The first doctor she just really didn't resonate with.

She couldn't really tell why.

She said it felt very clinical, very sterile.

By all, you know, all practical purposes, that first doctor was as qualified or more qualified than the second doctor she ended up going with.

Why did she choose the second doctor?

The second doctor was very personable, super warm, super friendly, showed signs of caring, was a lot younger, way less experienced, but she felt seen and heard in, in the conversation.

So that's why she chose the second doctor.

So now let's apply this.

When we are talking about the flinch and the empathy that in these conversations, you know, when they reveal something personal or they reveal something that they share, something that is an issue, we pause and react.

Even if it's just slightly, oh, wow, that must be miserable.

Or wow, that sounds exhausting.

Tell me more.

Those types of reactions, when you react with empathy, their brain literally is going to mirror your calm and the trust is going to skyrocket.

So that's why, you know, not just listening flatline, actually paying attention, and you react to what they're telling you.

Wow, that must be awful.

Well, tell me more about that.

Gosh.

Or social proof.

It.

Geez, that's.

You know, we work in this neighborhood a lot.

Most of your neighbors don't have to experience that.

This must be pretty rough, those types of comments.

And then really.

And not because you're fabricating it.

And so don't hear what I'm not saying.

What I'm not saying is just use this type of tool.

This is the difference in influence and manipulation is intent.

If you're learning these tactics to try to manipulate by artificially inflating something that doesn't need to be artificially inflated, then you're wrong.

But also just having a normal Conversation with somebody that in your daily life, if somebody was telling you about something that was they were experiencing, you would react normally.

Just be a normal freaking human being.

Stop being weird and start selling.

You don't have to become someone you're not.

These conversations.

So that is where so always temper it.

These, yes, we're learning these types of techniques and skills and tricks.

But it's also, you have to maintain integrity, service at the highest level.

Yes, but I go through a lot of this to remind people just to have a normal conversation.

So many times we get in this sales role and we tell ourselves these stories that oh, I, I can't react.

I'm the professional here.

It's like, yes ma', am, yes sir, no ma', am, no sir.

This is what we do.

This is how it's good.

But no, that's bad bedside manner.

That's the very clinical technician, the very clinical salesperson, the clinical doctor that sure adjust accordingly.

Some people, that's what they want and the better you get, your intuition will tell you when that's what's needed.

But for most people, for the most part, the warm, friendly, I'm here to help attitude and reaction is what most people need.

So you've got to take all of this into account and temper it.

We've got to zoom way out from where we normally are.

So let's get into the next piece because this is really where it starts to come together.

So you take all of this discovery, you take the, you know, where we're acting and then just build a list together.

You know, I've got a whole methodology and a process that I take people through when I do trainings at their locations for their teams or when I do one on one coaching.

But basically the short version of this is just build it together.

It's okay.

It's okay if I make a list and write down the most important things.

That way I don't forget them or miss anything as we go through.

Yes, of course.

And so, wow.

So when you're going down those lines of questioning and you get to, you've gone, you've talked about the problem, you've talked about the logic and then you've talked about the emotional side of it.

The person or people that the problem affects and how it's limiting their life and how it would be different in their life if that problem were solved, then just wrap it up with, wow, so this sounds like a pretty big problem for you then if we could.

And then give whatever it is if we could X so you don't have to.

Y.

Would that help you?

So if we could even out the temperatures in that bedroom so your daughter didn't have to, you know, have the extra fan and she slept better, would that help you?

Yes.

If we could reduce the number of allergens in the home so that you didn't have to wake up with bloody noses or would that help?

Yes.

If we could get rid of the horrible noise in the garage door that wakes you up at 5am every single morning when your husband leaves for work, would that help you?

Yes.

Whatever it is.

So once you've got that type of a.

Just a soft question.

Okay, great.

So sounds like this is pretty important.

Remember that list we talked about earlier?

Would you like me to add this to the list as something you definitely want me to take a look at today?

Yes.

Great.

Now I know what's important to you.

We'll put it down.

And then once you get two or three things down, just this is where it becomes coactive, it becomes creating this project together.

Because this is where it no longer becomes just your project, but their project together.

Because what you don't want is, okay, I put this, I did this for you.

I put this together for you.

Yes, I understand there's some language around that and some trainings that are out there, but that's 20 year old type of mindset.

Our buyers today don't respond very well to that a lot of times.

And so let's build this together type of idea is very different and it's very much the way that buyers today like to be approached.

So now we've got this list.

Okay, great.

So I'm good.

If you could so hand them the list, actually give it to them with the pin.

Say, okay, if I get you to prioritize these for me, that way I know what the most important and least important is.

And then the moment that they grab that pin and they grab that list out of your hand, now they are taking ownership of this project and it's now your project together, not just your project, you're trying to sell them.

Now they're helping to build the project.

And the moment they start building the list, it stops being your project, it becomes their project.

And so there's of course a ton of brain science behind why this is important and powerful.

And then that's where we get into the rest of this process.

So that's the end of the discovery.

So we go through, we've asked great questions.

And to summarize all this, when you ask better questions, you're not Manipulating people.

You're setting the decision making brain free and so you're helping them put words to the discomfort that's been living in their head rent free and it's been living in their head for months.

And so you're helping them get clear and clearly articulate it.

So now they have clarity around the problem and now then you can give them clarity around the solution.

That has nothing to do with the product or service that you sell, has nothing to do with the equipment, with the ductwork, with the garage door opener, with the water heater, with the water treatment.

It has everything to do with what they're experiencing and then what their future pacing of their life is going to look like.

So sales isn't about talking people into something, it's about talking them back into themselves, giving them clarity and seeing a solution, seeing a path out of it, seeing a path, a clear path out of their problems.

So let's recap super quick.

We've got the two paths.

Questioning model problem and then person mirroring and labeling.

Basically it's empathy on demand.

Digging deeper, finding the symptom, finding the real emotion, creating ownership through the co creation of the list.

And real discovery equals real connection.

Because when you do discovery right, closing becomes nothing more than helping them take the next logical step.

And that's exactly what I've said for years.

I learned this years and years and years and years ago from my original great cells trainer Mike that I learned from at the basement Systems Network years ago when I owned my Dr. Energy Saver franchise.

You know the logical and him and Larry Janesky.

Those two, if you know who they are, huge shout out.

I used to take classes from both of them all the time.

The logical conclusion to a well executed cells process is the cell because you've handled all the objections in the process, there's nothing left.

And the logical conclusion is the logical next step is the sell.

So if this episode has helped you go back and listen to the whole trilogy, it is the blueprint for the kind of discovery that just closes with ease.

It's simple.

And if you want more doors to practice with, more people to practice in front of, make sure to go grab your guerrilla marketing guide atdoor the number2doorinstitute.com.

It's how to fill your calendar without ads or cold calls.

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And until next time everyone, this wraps up the Discovery trilogy and that is how you become someone worth buying from.

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