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[00:00:17] The Missional Life - Dan: All right, welcome back to Mission Life Podcast. Today, we're joined by Alicia Michelle, a certified Christian life coach and neuro coach with a passion for equipping others to better manage emotions through a biblical and scientific lens. Alicia is the host of the award winning podcast, The Christian Mindset Coach, and her new book, Emotional Confidence, outlines a simple three step tool to help us find peace in our emotional lives while drawing closer to God.

[00:00:41] The Missional Life - Dan: Welcome to the show.

[00:00:43] Alicia Michelle: Hey, thank you so much. Love talking to you guys today.

[00:00:46] The Missional Life - Dan: Absolutely. You know, you've helped thousands of people manage emotions through your coaching courses and podcast. What first sparked your passion for helping so many others in this way?

[00:00:59] Alicia Michelle: Well, I think it was years of not dealing with my own emotions.

[00:01:03] Alicia Michelle: It was all kind of sprang from that. Incident that happened to me in 2017 share about it in more detail in chapter one of the book and I'm happy to share about it here too, but it was a life changing moment where I realized that even though I had known these truths about who I was in God and Logically believed them.

[00:01:20] Alicia Michelle: I was operating from this whole other mindset of Believing lies about my worth and about being enough and a lot of that stemmed from years of Of not knowing what to do with my emotions, not addressing them, not like being afraid of them because they, it was told to me from a very young age that they weren't good.

[00:01:42] Alicia Michelle: They kind of got in the way that I was just supposed to push them down. Just, you know, keep going forward. Stop thinking about that, you know? So they were there and I didn't know what to do with them. And as I, as God led me through this whole process and began to bring that massive healing in my life, I realized that even though I was working with women at that time, then That this really was a huge issue for so many people as to why they, they believed that truth, but they couldn't live from it, that there was all this stuff inside that we hadn't, as the church, really ever explored how to do that beyond just say, We'll just pray about it or give it to God, which those are truths.

[00:02:21] Alicia Michelle: Those are truths, but that's not necessarily a helpful tool in the moment when we're feeling all these feelings and we don't know what to do with them. So for me, it really came about as just seeing this, this thing in my life change and the importance of it. And then seeing a need in the church to be able to help other people find freedom in this area.

[00:02:39] The Missional Life - Dan: Wow. That's so amazing because I think in so many ways for us as believers, we can. , help other people. But when it comes to our own internal mind, our own internal hearts, we can have struggles believing those things for our own effect. We've been walking with somebody that's been walking through some of that as well.

[00:02:57] The Missional Life - Dan: And, , and we've gone through some of that ourselves, that you can speak those promises and you can speak that for other people. But man, when it comes to applying, sometimes it's really, really, really difficult to accept that into your own heart. And, that's really where. We find ourselves , in such big problems is because we get lost in those mind games and in those heart games, and that's where you excel in helping people break free.

[00:03:20] Alicia Michelle: Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's my passion. And I think a lot of it comes from being able to understand how God made our bodies, how he made our minds. There's this freedom in, in, in understanding the scientific process because then when we know, oh, this is my body's reacting, or my mind even is reacting this way.

[00:03:38] Alicia Michelle: Because that's how it was designed. It doesn't, it doesn't excuse a behavior, but it allows us to understand it so we can go, Oh, so to fix that, let me do this. So then I can get in line with God better. Like it works so well, shockingly, imagine that since God designed science, you know, it works so well with how God, Partners wants us to partner with him in allowing our whole mind, body, soul to be surrendered and to serve him.

[00:04:03] Alicia Michelle: So I love when we can understand that and, and give it to him fully, you know, we have this whole body to give to him, to, to live for him.

[00:04:12] The Missional Life - Amanda: That's such a great thing to share. Just, , learning how to deal with that. Can you give us an example of how you would. Deal with an emotion and the physical reaction, what to do in that moment.

[00:04:24] The Missional Life - Amanda: Just a scenario that you've seen or experienced.

[00:04:28] Alicia Michelle: Sure. Yeah. So there's a method that I teach in the book, which is called a D D. And I always have to say, it's not that a DD that we all talk about. It's a different. It's an, it's a, a a method, a part three part thing that we teach, but, but even before we get to something like ADD, which is a logical process of working through an emotion, you have to, or we have to help ourselves get into the right place in our mind, in our bodies, in our nervous system, technically, because when we are in the depth of an emotion, the sympathetic nervous system, which often you hear about things like fight or flight, that whole idea, that is what is, is.

[00:05:08] Alicia Michelle: working in our mind. And so that means yes, things like the amygdala are firing, trying to protect us. The blood is pumping into our arms and legs to try to help us run away and to defend ourselves. So it's no wonder that when we're feeling an emotion, we just want to respond. So when we get out of an emotion, we can, we can help ourselves get out of emotion, I should say, by switching on a different part of our nervous system, which is the parasympathetic nervous system.

[00:05:36] Alicia Michelle: And that is the calm and digest kind of side of our bodies where the logical mind is in control. We're able to rationally work through and think through how we want to respond. And really, I think at that point, listen to the Holy Spirit a lot easier and respond with him and how he wants us to, to do things.

[00:05:56] Alicia Michelle: So an example of that where, Where I actually went through this yesterday, I had shared with you guys before we got on the air that I live in Southern California, I am not close to those big fires that they've been talking about, but we woke up yesterday morning and there were three fires in our area.

[00:06:12] Alicia Michelle: In fact, my son, my youngest son's school was under a mandatory evacuation and the fire was probably a quarter of a mile from where his school is. And so we were like, Okay. Good morning. You know, out of all of a sudden. And so I feel, I feel like that's important. I'm sharing that to say that when, when we got to that situation, my husband and I yesterday morning, I felt like we were given a choice, you know, like my choice could have been, Oh my gosh, I just want to freak out and watch the news all day.

[00:06:40] Alicia Michelle: Make sure we're okay. Like, All of those things that we think when we're scared, you know, we, we, we looked at what was going on. We made a fair assessment of how safe were we, where we are at right now. And then we came together and just said, Lord, we are going to rationally process this. You know, we're not gonna, we're not going to go into that freak out mode.

[00:07:02] Alicia Michelle: We're going to be aware, but we're going to choose to let. Your power and your strength be our strength today as we trust you for next steps. That choosing that is, is a big part of, I think what we're faced with every day with our emotions is once we learn these sort of tools, it's in the moment, what are you going to do about it?

[00:07:22] Alicia Michelle: You know, you can learn all these things, but I still, even after doing this for a while and learning this stuff. I still had the temptation to go to that place where I could have just let my sympathetic nervous system take over and, and absolutely run the show and freak out because that's, I'm a natural worrier, anxiety kind of a person.

[00:07:42] Alicia Michelle: But God has taught me that, you know, that, that fork in the road is there, but where are you going to go? What are you going to choose today? So yeah, that, that was an example of, of in that moment just deciding this is real I'm not going to deny it. That's the acknowledged part. And we can break down another example of ADD in a minute, but we're acknowledging it it's, it's real, but what's true right now, this is what we see as true.

[00:08:05] Alicia Michelle: So because of that, we're going to decide here's where we're going to live today. Here's how we're going to handle it.

[00:08:11] The Missional Life - Dan: That's amazing. You know, we begin to hear about a problem and then we we rehearse it in our mind.

[00:08:17] The Missional Life - Dan: We rehearse it in our brain Until it gets down into our heart and then all of a sudden we have even a bigger issue , you know the bible talks about , as we begin to speak things take no thought Saying and a minute we start saying Talk about now all of a sudden we're into a whole other realm, as you know, within your education.

[00:08:32] The Missional Life - Dan: And so I'm just wondering , what are some other ways in addition to ADD? That people can begin to deal with those emotions and those struggles of overthinking and that emotional overwhelm.

[00:08:41] Alicia Michelle: Yeah, that's a great question. That's a very everyday struggle we all face.

[00:08:46] Alicia Michelle: Overwhelm itself is very interesting because overwhelm is not necessarily a bad thing. It's just If we can think of our emotions as these check engine lights for what's going on in our soul, then we can see something like overwhelm as the system, like just being overloaded, like any other system would be.

[00:09:05] Alicia Michelle: And it's telling us there's a lot going on. There's a lot happening. That we need to kind of stop and pay attention to almost like, you know, a sixth sense where we can, we smell, we see, we touch, we taste the world around us, but this is almost like our soul is responding to what's happening. And again, that's not always an accurate response in terms of this is how we should respond, but it's fair to say again, like the situation with the fire, it's fair to feel, to feel overwhelmed and fear in a situation like that, because that's normal.

[00:09:38] Alicia Michelle: It's normal to feel that. The thing is, is we get to decide what we're going to do with something like overwhelm. And two things that I think bring freedom here. Number one, knowing that our emotions are just sensory inputs of what's happening. They're no, they don't have to be the thing that controls us.

[00:09:56] Alicia Michelle: They don't have to be the thing that tells us what to do next. They are invitations from God to say, It's, there's a lot going on inside. Let's, let's, let's take a breath and let's see what's going on. Let me work with you on it. You know, it's, it's an indication. It's not a condemnation of, I'm doing this wrong again.

[00:10:13] Alicia Michelle: I shouldn't be thinking like this. I know, you know, that we often can get stuck in, especially when we're like, well, God wants me to believe this and I, and I should do this. So being able to just first recognize it's this, it's a signal. That it's normal to feel this way and it's a signal and that God sees it and he's not being mad at us for seeing it or experiencing it.

[00:10:33] Alicia Michelle: What he wants us to do is then to say, okay, let's have a conversation about it. Let's work through it. So noticing is another really, really, really important step. I just had a call this morning with a client who is starting this kind of work and she was like, I just couldn't believe. When I began noticing my thoughts, it sounds so silly, like so basic.

[00:10:53] Alicia Michelle: She was like saying, it sounds so basic, but just noticing what I was thinking, noticing what I was feeling throughout the day without instantly being like, well, I shouldn't feel that I shouldn't do that. You know, she started seeing, okay, I'm noticing this and I'm noticing this pattern and I don't have to respond if I, you know, in this way, if I, if I want to or not, but just even that freedom, it gives so much freedom when we can recognize that these are sensory things that were happening and when we begin to notice what, what's going on, then we can do something about it with God.

[00:11:26] Alicia Michelle: So even if someone feels that overwhelm, first of all, to say that like that, that overwhelm happening is like a system overload. It doesn't mean that that's necessarily. the root of what's going on. A lot of times it's like an iceberg where the overwhelm and anger are kind of the top emotions that we feel.

[00:11:42] Alicia Michelle: So we kind of have to work through the reality of the overwhelm happening to get to what's underneath it. But it's, it's a good place to just start and just notice. And see why it makes sense. You're feeling this way, but as you invite God into that whole conversation, does that make sense? Or what do you guys think?

[00:12:01] The Missional Life - Amanda: Yeah, absolutely. You know, I was just thinking about , the fight or flight mode, it's a gift in the sense of if there is imminent danger, if you're standing near a fire, let's say the building's burning, you want to run away or you want to move away of a moving car, , but when there's the emotional overwhelm where there's not imminent physical danger, but those same things are triggered in us, it's so important to learn how to step back Yeah, and assess the situation like you said taking captive those thoughts, , which is scriptural, the Bible shares take captive every thought to the obedience of Christ and I've had experience in healthcare, how important it is to be able to step back , in an emergent situation, but again, that's why, , there's trainings that you go through.

[00:12:44] The Missional Life - Amanda: So it just, it becomes automatic and you know what to do, you know, what spot to get into, you know, the things that you need to be doing because it's just muscle memory that kicks in. So, like you said. Learning to take those thoughts captive and going through that three step process is so pivotal, especially for believers, because if we're stuck in these emotional cycles, then whatever mission, the calling that God has on our lives, it's going to be inhibited by those things.

[00:13:11] The Missional Life - Amanda: So breaking through that is so important for the body of Christ, the church to be at its full potential.

[00:13:18] Alicia Michelle: Yes, yes. And I think that an important part of what you talked about is this idea of being able to learn what are the signs that I'm in that sympathetic nervous system as part of the emotion, which is pretty normal that you would be.

[00:13:31] Alicia Michelle: That's typically the brain's response. So learning how to switch out of that. Because the body, again, has those two operating things, the sympathetic nervous system, fight or flight, or the rest and digest of the parasympathetic. So, if we can learn different things to do with our bodies spiritually, to help us switch out of that mode.

[00:13:51] Alicia Michelle: And, I encourage people to, There's a whole list of them in the book. I encourage people just to experiment and see what works for you in this situation. You know, have your whole tool belt with you, try things on and see. And that's a really important part of this emotional management process because again, if we can come, even if we have a great tool like ADD.

[00:14:10] Alicia Michelle: If you're not in a place where your logical mind can think through it, then it's not going to be very effective. It's not as effective as if you were able to switch over and then you can process. So I think sometimes people talk about finding calm and that's great. That's kind of what that process is, but we can find calm.

[00:14:27] Alicia Michelle: We need to find calm, but then do that and then take that next step to actually work through it using something like ADD.

[00:14:33] The Missional Life - Dan: Yeah, I love how your approach really blends science and and scripture and I'm just wondering if you could explain that a little bit more because most of us would agree with the statement that we're spirit soul and body, but don't fully know how those interact to successfully navigate some of these challenging situations.

[00:14:51] The Missional Life - Dan: So , first, could you explain how those interact a little bit more and then how do you see science and faith working together to help people manage emotions?

[00:15:00] Alicia Michelle: Sure. I think that there are, as God's word says, there are those different parts of us.

[00:15:06] Alicia Michelle: And we maybe tend to forget. We've over focused sometimes on just the spirit side and that obviously is a very, very, very important side, but we are spirits housed in a physical body. So even if my spirit is a certain belief or has a certain way of how it wants to approach a situation, if for example, I'm struggling with low blood sugar or I haven't had a lot of water for the day or I've had three hours of sleep, all of those things can affect my emotions and can affect my emotional response.

[00:15:39] Alicia Michelle: So sometimes it's, it's. We do ourselves a disservice by just saying like we're trying to just make ourselves believe certain things or make ourselves act certain ways What if we could work in harmony with how we want to live how for God, you know through our spirit by understanding? Hey, what's going on with this this physical shell that I'm living in?

[00:16:01] Alicia Michelle: right now. Does it make sense why it's really harder for me to tap into the spirit today or harder for me to follow him today because of what's going on? Okay. You know, again, you were out late, you didn't get enough sleep. You haven't had anything healthy to eat for 10 hours. You know, it's going to affect.

[00:16:17] Alicia Michelle: The, the, the hormones and the balance of my blood sugar is going to affect how I respond. Doesn't give us an excuse to sin, but it helps us understand it so that then we can go back and go, okay, before I respond, let me go get some water. Let me take a second to take some deep breaths, make sure I've eaten something healthy.

[00:16:34] Alicia Michelle: It's amazing how much things can change when we do that. So it's, I think just understanding and giving ourselves that space to be humans, fully humans spirits right now who are trapped in these earthly bodies and, and learning to, to care for that part of us, not as, as, as lesser than, but as the home for what our spirit lives in.

[00:16:57] Alicia Michelle: Right now. So I think just understanding that and understanding some basic things about how the brain works, it makes it a lot easier to know how to take care of ourselves in the same way that we learn about, you know, if you were to have some sort of disability where you had to adapt and adjust your life to now this new sort of living style of living, like you would learn everything.

[00:17:18] Alicia Michelle: For example, my husband is type one diabetic and was diagnosed about 10 to 12 years ago, didn't grow up with it, but had to learn with it. Okay, now we have an insulin pump. Now I have to track all my carbs. He had to learn all of that about himself to just keep functioning and keep living. So what if we could learn these things about how emotions work in our body and how our physical body and spirit work together so that we can, again, make it live the way God wants us to live fully as one whole unit together.

[00:17:48] The Missional Life - Dan: I'm going to pivot a little bit . I know some of the other things that so many of us struggle with, and I know that you have. And I'm just wondering if you could help us understand some of the methods and different tools that you have seen that are successful.

[00:18:05] Alicia Michelle: Perfectionism and people pleasing. Those were things that were definitely a big part of my story growing up. And the thing with perfectionism and people pleasing is people who struggle with that, they know. Like, they could tell you, I know I don't have to be perfect. And they can say, I know I don't have to make that other person happy.

[00:18:23] Alicia Michelle: Right? We know this, but what is happening is there are these subconscious soundtracks, these things that are running in our, in the more subconscious parts of our mind that are really running the show. And that is the truth, quote unquote, that we're living from. It usually relates to. Worth, enough, and love.

[00:18:44] Alicia Michelle: And those three parts of our identity, am I loved? Am I worthy? And am I enough? Those are formed in the early years between like the ages of nine to 13. The mind is, that part of the brain is very much like a supercomputer, just gathering information and input around it and to create habits and patterns.

[00:19:01] Alicia Michelle: It's trying to streamline so that the brain doesn't have to use too much glucose and other areas. So if it can streamline things like How to ride a bike or how to eat with a fork. We don't have to think every single time about how to do that. That's a blessing of that side of our brain. But it's also where some of these things like our identity are found.

[00:19:21] Alicia Michelle: And if we have streamlined those thoughts that around worth, love, and enough, like I can say that, but if I, if the brain has been reinforced to believe when I. I am perfect when I do things in a, in a manner that other people see as, as good, I get approval from it. Then that makes me feel loved. So it's almost like the brain is not seeing it from a truth filled Christian standpoint of what God says.

[00:19:49] Alicia Michelle: It's just seeing a reaction. Oh, that made me feel good when I did that for that other person. Even though I pushed down my own feelings. They were happy with me and that made me feel good. So these habits start, or these, these, these, these patterns start being built. And a lot of times we don't notice it until we're in a place where we're realizing, Oh, wow, that's broken.

[00:20:10] Alicia Michelle: That's not how God wants me to live. And so the work I love doing with women is, this is one of the programs I have is called the Christian Mindset Makeover. And that's where we take a significant amount of time digging deep into how do these patterns form in our brain that make us, make us believe that we have to be perfect.

[00:20:28] Alicia Michelle: Even though we know God says we're not, we don't have to be, you know, that he is perfection. What are those things? Where do they come from? And we use a scientific process called brain priming. To rewire those neurological thoughts in our subconscious mind that are telling us What that, that pattern is, we're, we're, it's almost like if we're at a crossroads and, and the trigger happens, the brain will always, has always chosen this, and this is a really well, well carved groove as the pattern.

[00:20:58] Alicia Michelle: We, through this process of brain priming, we're, we're, We're dismantling that pathway and we're creating a new pathway that every time the trigger happens, it's going that direction instead of this direction. And the beautiful thing is God created our brains to continually be changing. It's something called neuroplasticity where our brains are, every thought we have, every, every thought we have is, is shaping those pathways in our minds.

[00:21:24] Alicia Michelle: And we're given 1200 new neurons every single morning. So I always think of that's like that lamentations verse that says his mercies are new every morning. This is our brains are always being remade and redone. And we have a chance to decide what are we going to be reinforcing? What are we going to be building?

[00:21:41] Alicia Michelle: So God gives us this path and this, this way to do this. Brain priming typically takes scientists have said between 60 to 60. Three days, kind of that path or that, that timeframe for things to be fully switched over so that when the trigger happens, it doesn't go path anymore. It's now going on path B.

[00:21:58] Alicia Michelle: And I love using that technique with, in the context of helping people let that truth be the truth of God, because then it's like, we're operating subconsciously from that truth. It's not just a logical thing. I'm believing, but the subconscious mind and the logical mind are united together and believing this truth about who they are in God.

[00:22:19] The Missional Life - Amanda: You know, coming from the female perspective, you know, working with women what would you say are the top root causes of this perfectionist thinking this people pleasing? And , I know women, , are more prone to dealing with those things than men are overall, but, , can you just speak to that?

[00:22:38] Alicia Michelle: Sure. I mean, it's, it's hard. We, we don't want to necessarily generalize how women are in general or not, but traditionally we are the ones who maybe carry that heart side of the family to, to care and, and be home, maybe taking care of younger ones. We're the ones who, our brains are, are, are, Like, I'm sure you guys have seen this where the female brain has hearing like five things happening at once, you know, and, and the guy's like in his box.

[00:23:08] Alicia Michelle: He's right here, you know, he's thinking at one thing at a time and there's benefits to both. We're not saying one is better than the other, but I think because we are wired to care and to nurture and to love. And also as modern women, we're told that we can do anything and be anything, which are all good messages too.

[00:23:30] Alicia Michelle: Yet if we, if we, you know, go to those extremes with both of those things, it's, it's like the, the caring without boundaries. You know or maybe again, we saw that there's so many reasons why it could, it could develop, but I think that for women, the, the caring instinct kind of could play into that part of, of wanting to make everyone happy, wanting to make sure everything's okay.

[00:23:53] Alicia Michelle: Which is stronger in some than others like that could really play into the people pleasing and then the perfection side, maybe it's this, I do have to carry the whole world on my shoulders because I'm not I have lots of options as to how I can be, and I want to hold all of them. You know, that's what we're told we were supposed to do.

[00:24:10] Alicia Michelle: So there's some, some ideas, but well, you know, do you feel like that? Or do you feel like there's other things that in you as a woman that could be bringing some of this out?

[00:24:19] The Missional Life - Amanda: Yeah, I think, , growing up and I was the youngest of four kids in my family and , oftentimes, you know, just go with the flow, , and I was often in a good way called the peacemaker, , met in a positive light, but then, , as you grow up and carry that into adulthood it's not a bad label by any means, but it can also.

[00:24:40] The Missional Life - Amanda: Cause you to put that burden on yourself. Like you said, you know, when we're supposed to let Jesus carry our burdens for us and put our trust in him and let him set the tone in our homes and let him be the focus instead of trying to like force it to happen, , trying to make it happen. So yes, I, as a female and especially in health care it's become a very people pleasing industry.

[00:25:04] The Missional Life - Amanda: And, and, you know, you want to care and take good care of people and make, help them feel good. So that burden can become pretty heavy when you look at yourself, and lose that focus on Christ and just let that pressure go of what you can control and what you can't control.

[00:25:22] Alicia Michelle: Well, and then there's that part of, there's that, that, that if you've ever studied things like the Enneagram or like a type two on the Enneagram is someone who is very much about serving and, and, and concerned about others feelings and wanting to help.

[00:25:37] Alicia Michelle: So an unhealthy side of someone like that would be people placing kind of like what you're saying. It's like if we've learned from a young age. People are happy when I just, you know, I, I put my needs aside and I try to love them and I don't really care about what I'm feeling or even in a dysfunctional way.

[00:25:54] Alicia Michelle: We mean, of course. Because serving is part of who we need to be as Christians. But when we do that in a dysfunctional way, but we see it creates other people's happiness, then there can be that pattern if we're not strong enough to go, but that's not right. That's not how God wants us to be. That's unhealthy.

[00:26:11] Alicia Michelle: You know, we don't feel like we can call that out or put a boundary up. That's when those are some of those signs that yeah, people pleasing could be an issue. Here, but understanding again, like there's so many patterns that can create that makes sense why it could be there

[00:26:27] The Missional Life - Amanda: and even with social media being newer on the landscape in the last decade plus now, what tips would you give to people to navigate, , dealing with that perfectionist people pleasing in that landscape because that can, you know, cause derailment very quickly.

[00:26:44] The Missional Life - Amanda: It has a lot of positive things in itself. You know, good things are, you know, shared through social media, but it can also unfortunately cause a lot of damage to our brains if we allow it to. So. I just wondered what your thoughts are on that.

[00:26:59] Alicia Michelle: Yeah, I, I think one of the greatest skills that we need to learn right now is learning to notice and again, do something about what we're noticing inside.

[00:27:09] Alicia Michelle: So for social media, this is a perfect example of how that applies because there are good messages and there are not good messages, obviously. We get, we need to learn that. Everything coming at us, we get to decide what we're going to put in our bodies, what we're going to put in our minds. And if we notice that there are things that are causing us to feel selfish ambition coming out, feeling jealousy, feeling comparison, feeling like inadequate, not enough, those sort of triggers that are coming up, I think we, we, we need to decide.

[00:27:48] Alicia Michelle: It doesn't. It doesn't mean that we all have to just throw our phones out the window and never use social media. For some people, that's probably a good option, or maybe taking a break from it to kind of come back and see how you want to define it can be helpful. But being aware and when you sense that, go asking ourselves, why, why is that coming up?

[00:28:07] Alicia Michelle: That's interesting. You know, just, just again, noticing that's, that's coming up and do I want to keep feeding that in me? Is this still safe for me? Do I need to put some boundaries up? Do I need to think about who I'm following? Do I need to not even be on this platform anymore? I know over Christmas break, I took three weeks off social and of email and just work in general.

[00:28:29] Alicia Michelle: And during that time I came back deciding that I wanted to have a separate phone for, for work activities, but also for social media, because I really found how much lighter and More hopeful. I felt just in my days when I didn't feel like I had to spend every second getting on there. And it was so much just like unconsciously doing it.

[00:28:54] Alicia Michelle: It wasn't like I was, it was just like, you're sitting there and you're open time. Oh, well, I'll just go check Instagram really quick or whatever. And I'm like, I don't want to be that way anymore. So I had to take a three week break and really ask God, what do you want me to do with this? And then now I have specific times in the day on another phone where I, that's in the other room that I pick up and say, okay, I'm going to look at this and respond, but I have, you know, 30 minutes or whatever.

[00:29:19] Alicia Michelle: And then it goes back. So for me, I've had to do those kinds of boundaries, but I think it's really, it starts with noticing and being willing to do something about it because we have to protect our mind. We have to guard our hearts. Like the word says, we have to guard our heart with all diligence. It's the wellspring of our life when it starts with noticing.

[00:29:36] Alicia Michelle: I think that's

[00:29:38] The Missional Life - Dan: so. So well said. And I know we focus on many of the negative things in our mind, but there's a lot of positive things on our mind. So I wanted to kind of go in that direction. You talk about cultivating emotional confidence at the daily practice. And so what are some of the small practical habits that listeners can start doing today that can help them build their confidence?

[00:29:59] Alicia Michelle: I think when we can start by just recognizing those truths about emotions and Looking at emotions from those lenses that God made emotions. God is with us in our emotions, that they're indicators of what's going on, that we don't have to always feel a certain emotion. Like I think there's a big emphasis on joy and being happy all the time in the church, which of course it's a great side.

[00:30:26] Alicia Michelle: It's a great emotion to feel happy and joyful, but sometimes to get to that joy, we've got to walk through some of the other stuff underneath. And so a willingness to say, I can, I can still feel that centeredness of joy and knowing who I am in God, but also be willing to walk through the difficult parts.

[00:30:44] Alicia Michelle: So the confidence in, in managing our emotions in terms of emotional confidence, it comes from beginning to really get into the ring with the Lord on this and beginning to step in and to add, you know, he's so good and so kind to let us do it a little at a time, getting in there. Working with the Lord using a tool like ADD and, and, and seeing over and over, it's safe for me to look at this emotion.

[00:31:11] Alicia Michelle: I can feel this without it completely upending the cart of what I believe as a Christian, you know, because sometimes we're like, Ooh, I can't even feel that because that's not right for a Christian to think or to feel that emotion. And we're not living in that emotion. We're just seeing that it's there.

[00:31:25] Alicia Michelle: And we're asking God for help to help us know what to do with it. You know, that's different. So being able to, to, to work through that process with God over and over, it develops in you this confidence, this ability to believe that there's always, always, always going to be emotional things that come our way.

[00:31:42] Alicia Michelle: Jesus said, we're going to live in a stressful world. We're going to have trouble, but take heart because I've overcome the world. So we're not going to try to avoid the fact that emotions are here. But we, as we practice this over and over, we become aware that, okay, God's helping me know what to do when this happens.

[00:32:01] Alicia Michelle: He's helping me find that calm and how to switch my body over. He's helping me acknowledge it, help me to find the truth in it and take the next step. It develops this, this, this. This fierceness in you that with holding God's hand, I can do this. I don't have to be afraid of what I'm feeling anymore. And I don't have to be mad at myself that I have these up and down emotions.

[00:32:22] Alicia Michelle: I can ask God for help and he's going to help me. I've seen him do it over and over. That's when that confidence comes in.

[00:32:30] The Missional Life - Dan: God doesn't want us to, to shirk back. And so many times I feel like we've been. As christians almost told to Oh, a lower view of ourselves then, and we begin to almost Put down the gifts and the talents and the anointing that he puts on our life for fear of being confident and for fear of being perceived as Prideful and i'm just wondering like where do you draw the line between Being prideful and being confident because confident is a very healthy thing, actually, but pride is that confidence that's taken a little bit too much. And so just wondering if you could speak to that, the difference between pride and confidence.

[00:33:09] Alicia Michelle: This is such a great question because I feel like I struggled with this for so long. I feel like growing up, how can I be confident and not be prideful? What does that look like?

[00:33:20] Alicia Michelle: And the place that I have come to, to rest on this is pride is believing that I can do everything before me on my own. It's believing that I'm where I'm at because of my efforts. It's the central word is me. It's about me, me believing that I can do this, that I don't, Need to trust or lean on anything and confident is saying, I believe that I'm going to get through this, but I know that I am not where I am today and I'm not going to be able to do this to the level that I'm called to do this, especially the excellent level that God wants me to serve without God.

[00:33:56] Alicia Michelle: So I am confident. that he is going to use me as a tool to let his spirit move through me. It's it's him empowering me to, to let the, the talents and the blessings come out in my mission versus me saying, let me take these talents and go in here and just show you how to get it done, you know, or taking credit for the things that God has done in my life.

[00:34:17] Alicia Michelle: You know, I think the longer you live in Christ, the more that you see, oh yeah, I cannot do this. I cannot do this life without you. And. And so I think just focusing on the difference between am I, am I doing this with my own power versus I have talents, I have gifts that the Lord has given me and I have a God who cares about me and is directing my steps.

[00:34:41] Alicia Michelle: I'm grateful that that that's where I'm putting my confidence. That's where I'm putting my, my, I think of confidence is like this. central clearing, maybe in the middle of a, of a battle raging around you. It's that central place where you can just sit, you see the battle around you. It's not that the battle is no longer there, but you know, that with God's help, you're going to get through it.

[00:35:04] The Missional Life - Dan: It's so easy to begin to focus , on ourselves . But when we're really living healthy, we're aware of who we project ourselves as to our surrounding community.

[00:35:13] The Missional Life - Dan: But how do we demonstrate these things in our own lives? No, you're a mother of four. How do you live these things out in your own life in front of your children? And how are you, teaching your children to live these things out in their own lives so they don't struggle with the same things that so many other Christians and people in the world ?

[00:35:30] Alicia Michelle: Yeah. So I feel like, again, God has brought a lot of clarity in my life in the last, probably, Nine years because of this whole situation of what I went through. And I wish that as we all do, we have parent as parents, we wish we could go and change how we, how we thought about certain things or how we taught our kids certain things.

[00:35:55] Alicia Michelle: I don't think I taught my kids anything bad. about emotions when they were super little, but I definitely know that I relate to my emotions differently now. And I drew, I actively address them differently than I did when they were smaller. And that's just because, you know, we only can give from what we know, right?

[00:36:12] Alicia Michelle: So it's, it's not, it's just how it is now. I, I have a 22 year old, 20 year old, 17 and 13. So we are in the height of teens and emotions and big decision making and college and all of those things. Life choices, like you're now deciding some of these things that we've talked to you about, you know? So I have.

[00:36:39] Alicia Michelle: Now, especially probably the last six years, I really feel like emotions are a lot more, they're a lot less scary for me to think about. So they're a lot less scary for me to let my kids feel. Whereas before I was like, you know, I don't even know how to handle that in my own self. I think that's what, how I processed it.

[00:36:58] Alicia Michelle: Like, so don't go there. We're not going there. You don't need to be that way. But that, cause that's how I processed it. So now I, my husband and I, we, we talk about emotions in a way that says it's okay to have this feeling. We have to be careful that the feeling never oversteps and certainly doesn't guide the decision we make in our lives or in that moment, because that's not what's to guide us.

[00:37:21] Alicia Michelle: God's truth guides us. So there can be safe places for you to feel and express that. We don't want that to, to affect relationships. In our emotions, we don't want it to cause sin or breaking of our relationship with God. And if it does, then we need to make amends in those areas. But overall, the message is, it's okay to feel what you're feeling and you don't have to choose to believe it.

[00:37:46] Alicia Michelle: You don't have to let it dictate your future. So example of that there's a story I tell in the book of my daughter when she was about 15. One day she texted me and she was in the middle of class. She had texted. Mom, I feel so ugly. No boy will ever like me. And so as a mom, your first response is just like, Oh, as a woman, we've all felt insecure or inadequate in some way.

[00:38:10] Alicia Michelle: I'm sure men do too, but around our looks, especially we all struggle with that. And you as a mom just want to go, that's not true. You're so beautiful. You're going to find the guy, right? Because we've lived long enough. to, first of all, see our kids and they're like, you're gorgeous. Like you're talking about, right?

[00:38:27] Alicia Michelle: And then we see how God works all these things out. We're like, of course, like all these things are gonna happen. But I recognized in that moment, what I would have wanted to be told, because I think the easy answer is to just go, you're lovely and you're going to be great, you know, kind of just say that, but it's like, but that doesn't address what I'm like, I still feel this way.

[00:38:49] Alicia Michelle: And so you feel like, well, then I shouldn't feel that way. Like you just keep stuffing it down more. So what I said to her was, you know, it's normal to feel. Not pretty, not like a guy's ever going to like you. We all struggle with that. We all struggle with feeling like we're not enough. What is the truth that you know about who you are in God? Take both of those acknowledging the reality of it and take the truth. And I want you to determine how you're going to respond because I can tell you all day. You're beautiful, you're great, all these things, but you get to choose what you're going to pick up.

[00:39:24] Alicia Michelle: So God is, again, put you at that crossroads to decide, are you going to pick up what you now know to be a lie based on what he says and who, who he says you are? What are you going to keep giving glucose to in your brain, so to speak? What are you going to keep feeding? I can't make you. Decide anything.

[00:39:42] Alicia Michelle: This is that first lesson that, honey, you need to learn that what you keep feeding in your brain is going to grow. So decide today. What, who are you going to choose? You can choose life, you can choose death around this. And I feel like that was helpful because I see her now as a 17 year old coming against those sort of emotions.

[00:40:04] Alicia Michelle: And not necessarily just trying to talk herself out of it, but seeing it as part of the human condition to feel these things and recognizing that she has a choice on what she wants to do with it. And I don't know, I just feel like if I can teach my kids that to not just see it and try to cover it up, you know, but to see it and to know that I have a choice on what I want to do with it.

[00:40:26] Alicia Michelle: I think it helps a ton.

[00:40:29] The Missional Life - Amanda: Yeah, that's so good. And I just want to piggyback off of, , the story you shared with your daughter, because those thoughts will come, and they will intrude in different ways, different times, but learning how to manage that, it, it just reminds me of I'll call it a parenting win, something I was very thankful for amidst many parenting failures.

[00:40:49] The Missional Life - Amanda: Amen. I mean like that's what I feel

[00:40:51] Alicia Michelle: that story and like I tell that story about the fire, like I don't want you to think like I'm just like this perfect super Christian because we all have moments. Those were some examples where I feel like God allowed us to make a good choice. Yes. And they're highlighting what we're talking about.

[00:41:04] Alicia Michelle: So we're, yes. So yes.

[00:41:07] The Missional Life - Amanda: So one day it was just beautiful day. My daughter was four. We lived near the YMCA and the, in the city we lived in. And so I pulled her in a little wagon down to the playground and. In, , young child terms, I had been teaching her just. You know, if kids did name calling, , just, well, is that true? , is that what God says about you? Like what would grandma and grandpa say, you know, and like positive people in her life, what would they say?

[00:41:34] The Missional Life - Amanda: And. She had this experience at the playground. And she comes up to me and as we're heading home and I didn't even know there was an issue going on because she at four years old handled it all on her own, where this girl was calling her name for no reason other than just, you know, kids on a playground.

[00:41:54] The Missional Life - Amanda: And she said, mommy, she called me this, but. I knew it wasn't true, because that's not what grandma and grandpa would say. So I thought, oh my gosh, thank you, Lord, that she got that at such a young age.

[00:42:12] Alicia Michelle: Right. That she could see the difference, you know, and, and decide, but I don't want to, I don't want to think about that.

[00:42:19] Alicia Michelle: I'm going to think about what the truth is, you know?

[00:42:23] The Missional Life - Dan: Yeah. I love that. , as you were sharing, that's what stuck out to me how you had in your sentence, truth. And. Who you are in Christ who does God say you are? Yeah, and that's what we really need to build our life.

[00:42:35] The Missional Life - Dan: That's what God is telling us from the get go Hey, you're my beloved. You're my precious. You are the one that I've set my affection on and so over and over In the Bible God goes out of his way To let us know his affection his love towards us his endless love towards us and and that we are his and that he's put his mark on us and that's so important for us to disconnect from the identity that This world tries to put on us and understand who we are because so many of us forget that we truly are as you mentioned earlier spirits Inside bodies are true.

[00:43:09] The Missional Life - Dan: Identity is our spirit. We are in our true form is who we are in our spirit. And yet these, natural things, , these carnal, these, bodily things, and bodily images and identities try to attack the real true image of who we are in our spirit. I think that's so important to find freedom.

[00:43:26] The Missional Life - Dan: Want to make sure that our listeners know about your new book Emotional Confidence. And we also want to know where can our listeners find your new book?

[00:43:35] Alicia Michelle: Oh, thank you. It's been a great conversation. I appreciate it.

[00:43:39] Alicia Michelle: One of the areas we've talked about today. So I would love to connect with anyone listening. If anything here really stuck out to you or like I need to talk to someone about that, or I would just love to hear more about what that could be like in my life. A great way to, to learn more about the work that I do is at the website, Alicia, michelle.

[00:43:56] Alicia Michelle: com. And it's a L I C I a M I C H E L L E. com. You can even get on that, website, you can get the free first chapter of the book. So you can download that first chapter and check out the book, emotional confidence and see what you think. So that's a great place to start. I also genuinely love talking to people about these things on Instagram.

[00:44:20] Alicia Michelle: So a lot of times We have posts over there over there every day and I will DM someone who's responded or just have a conversation with them and say, Hey, let's, let's get on the phone for 15 minutes. And I would love to hear more about how that applied for you or what, what God is doing in your life in this area and how I can encourage you.

[00:44:38] Alicia Michelle: So if you want to. Want to kind of gain and join in those conversations that's at Alicia, Michelle coach is my handle. And again, I would love to just talk to you more about all of these things. We do have a podcast as well. The Christian mindset coach. It's a great way to get in there and see some of the things that I talk about as a coach and learn a few tools that I use every day.

[00:44:59] Alicia Michelle: So either of those ways, the website and getting the free chapter of the book connecting on Instagram or just listening to the podcast and starting there. It was great place to get connected.

[00:45:10] The Missional Life - Dan: Thank you so much for being on the show, but more importantly, thank you for using the gifts and the talents, the anointing that God's put in you to help bring the freedom that God wants all people to walk in.

[00:45:22] The Missional Life - Dan: And so we just speak blessing over, your new book and over your ministry and over your podcast. And we're so encouraged to see how God will continue to use you in the days and the years to come.

[00:45:31] Alicia Michelle: Thank you. Likewise. Thank you so much.

[00:45:34] The Missional Life - Dan: Amen.