Daniel Murray: Welcome to a new special series called The Bathroom Break. That extra 10 minutes you either have to listen to marketing tips or use the bathroom or both, but I don't recommend both, but that's your choice.

Jay Schwedelson: This collab's gonna be super fun. We have Daniel Murray from The Marketing Millennials and me, Jay Schwedelson from the Do This Not That podcast and SubjectLine.com.

Daniel Murray: Each episode in the series, we are gonna go over quick tips about different marketing topics, and if you wanna be in the bathroom, fine, just don't tell us about it. Thanks for checking it out.

Jay Schwedelson: Bathroom break is back. This is Jay Schwedelson from Do This Not That. I'm here with Daniel Murray, the marketing millennial himself.

Jay Schwedelson: So Daniel, before we get into, uh, should you be doing your marketing, your regular marketing during holidays, like this episode being released on Memorial Day, um, I got a question for you. You were just recently at a, um, like an industry event or whatever, and there was networking parties and stuff. I absolutely can't stand going to networking parties.

Jay Schwedelson: I do them. Do you get hyped for them? Do you love walking around and interacting with people, and is it like, do you, the night before can you just not sleep 'cause you're so excited about them?

Daniel Murray: No, I want to go back to the hotel room. That's my- I do not like networking events, and it's even worse when you're hosting it, 'cause then you have to totally be o- on the whole time.

Daniel Murray: So I don't like... It's, it's a mixed bag. It depends on like what conference too, and what type of people are there.

Jay Schwedelson: So if you're going to a networking event and, uh, you're not like, it's not your network event, you're going to somebody else's networking event, like what would you say the average amount of time that you'll try to spend there before you kinda do the, you leave without anybody knowing?

Daniel Murray: Yeah. 30 minutes max. I, an Irish goodbye. Like... 'Cause some people wanna like sh- you, you've said this before, but some people you just wanna show face so they see- Right ... that you were there. I did that at INBOUND. Someone had like a meetup, and they said, "Come," and I went for like three minutes, said hi, and then Irish goodbye-ed.

Daniel Murray: Um, so. Do

Jay Schwedelson: you think anybody likes going to networking events, or does everybody there actually all just-

Daniel Murray: No, I think people love it. I think some people just go to conference for the parties, not the, the conference.

Jay Schwedelson: So you and I are just horrible people that are antisocial.

Daniel Murray: Yeah. Pretty much.

Jay Schwedelson: Okay, good.

Jay Schwedelson: Pretty much. All right. Listen, this thing is coming out on Memorial Day, and so there's a lot of debate, should you keep doing your marketing on a holiday or a Sunday, or any of these off hours, or should you kinda freeze it 'cause it's not gonna do as well as the regular days of the week? Whether you're a business marketer, a consumer marketer, whatever you are, should you be treating kinda the holiday days differently than regular marketing days?

Daniel Murray: I always think that if you have something consistent going on, a consistent newsletter, a consistent webinar series, a co- consistent event, uh, consistent anything, or consistent posting on social, I wouldn't break consistency for a holiday. I think that's rid- ridiculous to, to do that. I think you keep it as business as usual.

Daniel Murray: I think there are maybe some- religious holidays that are ex- exceptions to the rule, but, um, most holidays I don't think. Business as u- I, I think business as usual. People expect you to show up on that day. And also people, s- most, a lot of marketers have more time, uh, or m- more business professionals have more time during those days, so they're opening emails or they, it's in their inbox and they see it, and they want to read it, because a lot of them don't have time during the week to just open a, a, a normal marketing email.

Jay Schwedelson: Yeah, and I'll give you two kind of tactical things you could do related to around holidays. One is if you send out Your email to your database, let's say on Memorial Day, right, to your fire full database. Uh, what you can do with that information is you're gonna get back a lot of, uh, auto replies. People saying, "I'm out.

Jay Schwedelson: Contact blah, blah, blah. I'm on vacation." 'Cause a lot of people go on vacation. They tie it to a three-day weekend. And what you can do is you can take all of that data, unless you're in Europe, 'cause EMEA has GDPR, so you can't do that there. But you take all the auto replies, and you could do something simple.

Jay Schwedelson: You could use an AI tool to strip out all the email addresses in the auto replies that you get, and then you could take that data and use it for retargeting and remarketing, because those contacts that are in those auto replies from your database are very likely the exact right people that you should be marketing to anyway.

Jay Schwedelson: So those auto replies are gold, and you can get those during those, uh, holiday weekend or weeks or whatever. And I know everyone's like, "You can't do that." Well, you can do that. I'm not telling you to take the data and, and make them your newsletter subscribers. But you could absolutely do that to target them and remarket to them for your programmatic stuff.

Daniel Murray: And another thing you could do, too, is what I, we used to do back in the day when I, when, with auto replies is you send it to the CRM so, like, sales knows there's an, an extra contact. Yeah. So, so you, instead of, you don't have to market, but you give it as a, a- Yeah ... an additional lead in the CRM to a salesperson or something like maybe they're getting, trying to get in contact with this.

Daniel Murray: This person's not reaching out, right? Reach out to this person. Um, so you can auto... Now AI, you could do it way easier, and you can strip it out and say, "Hey, match it with a target account," um, and say, "This is another person at the company that belongs to this person." So that's another thing you could do with those auto replies.

Jay Schwedelson: 100%. And you know, the other thing is you should talk about the moment. So for example, we did, um, whatever the last holiday was that had a big barbecue or whatever tied to the holiday. We, our emails on that day that we sent out promoting stuff, literally the subject line says, um, "The barbecue's boring, but dot, dot, dot."

Jay Schwedelson: And you open it up and it says, "You're at a boring barbecue, but check this out since you're bored." And actually trying to talk to the moment that people are in, right, I think can get you a lot. We, it had an incredible performance, that email, because the more that you can be of the moment and speak to the moment, the more people are like, "Oh yeah, I'm going to check this out."

Jay Schwedelson: So you don't just wanna, like, pump out your regular garbage. The other thing that, Daniel, I know you're into this, is long-form con- long-form content during, um, a weekend or during a holiday can do particularly well because of the time somebody has.

Daniel Murray: I believe in marketing at less Like when people think it's a, a best practice, 'cause you will go into these, these blog posts for years and say, "Here is the perfect time to like send an email," and people only follow the perfect time to send an email, and they'll ignore holidays, they'll ignore weekends, and stuff like that.

Daniel Murray: And you've said this, I- you said this before the podcast, and I know you're gonna bring it up, but it doesn't really matter if it 40% instead of 50% opened it. Uh, it's still people opening your emails and digesting- Right ... that email. And you could also do a s- resend it to non-openers. You could do a lot of things that are happening.

Daniel Murray: So if you'd have something consistent, stick to the consistency, and also market on these holidays. I don't think it's something you should ne- turn it off because people say it's the wrong thing to do.

Jay Schwedelson: So let me ask a question. Beyond email, though, let's talk about social. I mean, uh, it's Memorial Day. Are you gonna post on LinkedIn?

Jay Schwedelson: Uh, and are you okay with the fact that you might get a fraction of your normal engagement? Or are you like, "No, no, no, certain things I wouldn't do on a holiday"?

Daniel Murray: I think the be- the most important thing on social is consistency and habit-forming. So you, you should always build that muscle of- 'Cause you can skip, when you skip one day, then you're like, "Ah, maybe I'll skip another day," and it becomes this, like, cycle of skipping, skipping, skipping.

Daniel Murray: So if you post every day on a Monday and then a holiday falls on a Monday, it doesn't mean skip that Monday because just post something and it, know it's gon- might get less engagement. Or it might be more engagement, 'cause now, like, the LinkedIn feed has this, like, 24 to 48-hour, like, window, so it might show up n- the next day or the following day on other people's feeds because it get, it got fed and it got...

Daniel Murray: And you were s- competing against less posts on a business network. So I think you should try it at least or keep that muscle, like, moving during those, those, those days.

Jay Schwedelson: By the way, it's so interesting you say that about LinkedIn, 'cause I've been seeing that too. It's like it used to be whatever the engagement you got in that first half an hour, hour, you'd be able to say, "Oh, this thing's gonna rip," or, "It's not gonna rip."

Jay Schwedelson: Now it's like I wake up in the morning and I have a post that was doing okay, and then I wake up in the morning, by the time I wake up, this thing's, like, went bonkers or whatever, and I'm going, "Ze- Yeah ... how the hell did that happen?"

Daniel Murray: I had a post yesterday that, like, had probably, like, 90 likes in two hours, and then by the time the day ended, it ended up, like, at 4 or 500.

Daniel Murray: But, like, I, normally I would say this is a flop post, but now LinkedIn's- Right ... serving it to new people. But I think it's this new interest-based of, like- Mm-hmm ... okay, this, now a marketer sees it, and now another marketer sees it, now another marketer sees it, and it's this, um, cycle of more and more... Wants to show it to the actual people who s- want to view it versus people...

Daniel Murray: Before, it just showed it to everybody and it got likes- Yeah ... it got likes, and then if people had pods, it worked. Um, so I think it's actually a better algorithm than it used to be. Yeah, yeah,

Jay Schwedelson: yeah. Yeah. I agree with you. All right, so one last thing, back to the original topic. So we don't like going to networking events, but now it's Memorial Day.

Jay Schwedelson: You get invited to a barbecue. Um, are you like, "Yes, I really like going to barbecues. I like doing it in a social setting," or do you feel the same way about, like, barbecues and stuff as you do networking events? At business stuff

Daniel Murray: There's two sides to this coin. One is do you need, like, your kid to get in and be friends with that other kid and- Right

Daniel Murray: start, and so there's, like, that strategic play of it, and I, I love, like, we're calling this a strategic of, of going to a memorial. But also I think that if you don't go to things, you stop getting invited to things. Um, and if you're like- Well, Tom will say whatever ... yeah, well, yeah. But at the, when you're, like, making new friends, it's hard to say.

Daniel Murray: Right, right. Yeah, but I think, yeah, um, Jay's the type of person who's like, "I don't wanna do any- I don't wanna hang out with anybody. I don't wanna see anybody. I, I only wanna do my own thing and on my own time." Wait, can I

Jay Schwedelson: tell everybody how bad I am? This is the truth, okay? Sure. Daniel and I live relatively close to each other, okay?

Jay Schwedelson: And, um, and he moved into a new home. I would say, h- uh, what'd you move into that home, like, six months ago or something like that? Yeah. And so me and my wife got Daniel and Ari a housewarming gift. It has been sitting on our counter in our house since the day that you guys moved in, and I'm talking about Daniel lives within, like, I don't know, five, 10 miles of where I live.

Jay Schwedelson: And we just haven't brought it over 'cause we're really weird people.

Daniel Murray: No, it's not even five to 10 miles. It's, like, five to 10 minutes of, of, like- Right ... um, like- Right ... but also the, the funny part is too is that I li- I used to live, like, 100 miles probably from Jay. Right. Um, and I probably saw him more in the 100 miles- Right

Daniel Murray: than I saw him in

Jay Schwedelson: the- Right ... the, the, 10 minutes of- That's right ...

Daniel Murray: uh, yeah, he's, he, he doesn't like seeing people. And even when they get closer, um- Yeah ... he has one of his best friends that moved near, too, and he's like- Yeah ... he's, "No, I don't wanna see you."

Jay Schwedelson: No. No, 100% right. "No, I don't wanna see you." I don't know what the hell's wrong with me.

Jay Schwedelson: I, I always... I am in therapy. I'll admit it. I'm fully in therapy, and I talk about this, and I'm trying to work through it, and so far I've not had a breakthrough. So we'll, we'll- Well, you're

Daniel Murray: probably never, never gonna have a breakthrough on this. Right. I don't think

Jay Schwedelson: so. Well, I don't even know if this episode's gonna break through, but we've covered a lot as usual.

Jay Schwedelson: Listen, everybody go to Daniel's feed. Leave him a Spotify comment. Leave him an Apple review. The guy loves that stuff.

Daniel Murray: And, um- Also, everybody go buy Jay's n- new book. Um- Oh, yeah ... it's on Amazon. It's, it's actually releasing in, um, next month. June 9th. That's right. I have, I have two books coming. Um- Oh ... so it's gonna be really good.

Daniel Murray: Uh, Jay's gonna... I'm gonna, I'm gonna make Jay sign one of them for me. Oh, yeah.

Jay Schwedelson: He's

Daniel Murray: gonna love to do that. Uh, so- Yeah. Thank you. I

Jay Schwedelson: appreciate you. All right. We'll see you all at the next one Daniel, come on, man. I gotta get back to work. Get out of there. All right. While he's still in there, this is Jay. Check out my podcast, Do This Not That for Marketers.

Jay Schwedelson: Each week we share really quick tips on stuff that can improve your marketing, and I hope you give it a try. Oh, here's Daniel. He's finally out.

Daniel Murray: Back from my bathroom break. This is Daniel. Go follow The Marketing Millennials podcast, but also tune into this series. It's once a week, the Bathroom Break. We talk about marketing tips that we just spew out, and it could be anything from email subject line to any marketing tips in the world.

Daniel Murray: We'll talk about it. Just give us a, a shout on LinkedIn and tell us what you wanna hear. Peace out.

Jay Schwedelson: Later.