Welcome to Close it now, an H Vac sales training podcast with Sam Wakefield.

Here we'll build your reputation in residential H Vac sales to be the expert influencer in your market.

You'll get insight into the top minds in the industry as they share their skills and hacks to help you on your journey.

This podcast isn't just about selling more.

It's about understanding your customers needs and building efficiencies behind the scenes so you can sell more but work less while being top of mind when people think H Vac.

Now let's get started with your host of the Close it now podcast.

This is Sam Wakefield.

All right, welcome everybody.

This is Close It Now.

I'm really excited about this episode today.

Today we've got a special guest, Mike Claudio.

He is a freaking expert, rock star, trainer, business coach.

He is a sales expert and this is the cool part.

I came across him on YouTube the other day.

So if you haven't checked out Mike Claudio on YouTube, definitely go check out his channel.

He has some amazingly great content.

His focus is for construction and general contractors and that and just basically general construction overall.

And I was so excited to come across him though because so many things that he talks about, I talk about and the similarities started to really hit home with me because just made me realize the philosophy is the same.

You know, you guys, when we're out in the world, when we're doing what we're doing, there's some common themes for success.

There's some common themes for.

There's the expression success leaves clues.

And when you find those clues, you follow those as far as they can take you because that's how you learn, that's how you grow, that's how you become better.

So I'm super excited today.

Mike's got 15 years experience in sales.

He has got over seven plus years in the construction industry.

He's coached and taken several businesses.

And here's the cool part.

In multiple trades, not just in one thing, in multiple trades, grown to over seven figures.

That's a million bucks, guys.

Million bucks a year.

That's a big number.

Also in his own sales, they've thrown up some massive numbers.

At a roofing project.

$1.2 million for one single project.

Also had in remodeling.

Sold a remodeling project for just under half a million bucks.

So those are some pretty rock star numbers in anybody's world.

And so I'm super excited to welcome today Mike Claudio.

Mike, how you doing man?

Good, man, appreciate it.

Excited to be here.

That's a hell of an intro.

Yeah, dude.

Well, it's a hell of a reputation, man.

But I'll be honest, I know there's a lot of people out there that tout big numbers, but I'd like to give some context to those throughout this call and what those really meant to those businesses when I sold them.

Because it's easy to say I close a bunch of big projects, but most of Those came after 18 to 24 months of selling little shit and growing and growing the brand and growing our message and growing our identified client, which I know we're going to get into today.

But you I'm not some like, oh, I only close big projects.

Like those were the.

Some of the biggest ones I closed after months, if not years of doing the right thing consistently.

So there's a lot of tools out there that like I close million dollar projects every month.

No, you don't like that's a. I've sold fifteen hundred dollar repairs and I've sold $1.2 million roofs.

And so I kind of know all aspects of residential and somewhat commercial construction in what these people are dealing with and how they make decisions and kind of all sides of it.

Because I didn't start selling big project selling repair work for a remodel company and then started selling $40,000, $60,000, $150,000 and then you know, capped out before I left that company about a half a million dollar projects.

There's a lot you learn that I learned the hard way that kind of led to why I coach the way I do because I trying to shorten that failure gap for a lot of salespeople and business owners in the industry.

Because dealing with homeowners is tough.

It is, it is definitely something we all know and as you know, the focus of close it now we are predominantly H Vac, but also we've got some other trades, plumbing, electrical.

I have a big fan shout out to jp he sells cars, he's in the automotive industry and he loves my podcast.

He says, okay, the philosophy is the same.

Anytime you say air conditioner, I just in my mind substitute it with car.

And because it works and just like we're talking about right now, the philosophy is the same.

It's about serving people, it's about solving problems in a way that no one else is willing to do the due diligence to solve the problem.

It's also understanding who those people are because everybody's not your ideal client.

And I think that's one of the biggest misconceptions this Industry is like, everybody with a home is a good referral for me.

No, it's not.

110% agree.

That's awesome.

So, yeah, so we were talking the other day and one of the things that we had covered, your philosophy surrounding the four pillars of what makes a great sales call, basically, in general, not just a great sales call, but basically soup nuts of the whole process.

I definitely like to go into that a little bit today and give everyone just a really good feel for that philosophy that you have, what you teach in your courses and your trainings and stuff.

So when I got into the industry, it was like 2012, 2013 timeframe and like the world of social media is not what it was today.

Like funnels and ad spend and Google Ads and Facebook funnels and all this other stuff.

Like it was around, but it wasn't as relevant as it was today.

So I took several businesses and grew them by seven figures without spending a dollar on leads.

Like, without spending really much money on marketing in its normal sense.

Wow, that's amazing.

So what I teach and what I go over is really around relationship building and outbound sales, like prospecting, outbound, social media, engagement, referral, partner creation, networking, branding, investing in the marketplace in your region.

But not really like, hey, I'm just gonna put a bunch of money on the Internet.

I'm gonna help whatever leads come my way.

So that is a unique approach where a lot of people right now, I'm sure, have you seen it?

There's a lot of people that are touting like, hey, just spend money on ads and you'll get leads.

And that just wasn't my approach.

So I kind of built.

Took my experience from corporate America and kind of blended it into this industry and kind of came up with the four main pillars that we'll call them as far as what I focus on the most, which is identify, target, qualify and acquire.

And basically it's identify what an ideal project looks for you, demographically, psychographically, project type.

Understand how to target them through prospecting, networking, referral, partner creation.

Then what to do to qualify that lead when it comes in, because we've all wasted time on crappy clients and then you found out too late.

So how to properly qualify them, not just once they call in, but how do you use your messaging in your social media and your website and other campaigns that you might do to help qualify in the right clients and out the wrong clients?

And then what do you do to differentiate yourself before, during and after in home sales consultations to differentiate yourself to Close the deal.

And I think if you can do those four things effectively, at least I've personally proven this through my own personal efforts and then through coaching other companies, you will grow more sustainably.

You may not spike overnight because you just got a bunch of leads.

But the problem is, is that in my opinion, leads are getting more expensive and lower quality because these lead sourcing companies like the Angie's List and Home Advisors of the world make money by selling leads.

So they have to have more leads to grow their revenue and they're not qualified.

They're basically saying, hey, are you willing to say you're interested and we're gonna go sell your interest to a bunch of people?

Yeah.

And we all had incredibly terrible, you know, there's lawsuits all over the country right now against companies like that for falsely advertising and providing like incredibly poorly qualified opportunities.

So I'm more about hunting and going out and doing the right things and building the relationships on my own efforts as opposed to like casting a line, putting some bait on it and hoping somebody bites.

Right.

It's a little bit of a different approach, but it's not for everybody.

If you're, you're not comfortable being on camera, you're not comfortable being in front of people.

Like it would help you a lot to learn what I teach, but it's not for everybody, you know, but for the people who are out there.

I'm not a door knocker, I'm not, I'm more of a relationship builder.

I'm not a one call close guy.

I'm a, you know, soft close and then follow up like I'm right.

I don't think homeowners in general right now, the environment has taught them that they can make decisions in their own timeline.

What I coach on is how to use and implement your sales process, but within their timeline, really driving your process, but letting them control the speed.

Because I mean, I'll tell you right now, 40 plus percent of my sales over the six or seven years that I was doing it personally came from follow up directly.

And I sold over $10 million in projects.

So follow up equated to $4 million approx sales over a five to six year period.

And that is the primary focus is how do I create a good experience, communicate proactively, communicate professionally, guide them through a very tactical in person consultation and then follow up the right way to get to close the deal when they're ready.

Because the minute you force somebody into making a decision in person, the buyer's remorse is real and they feel, I think Homeowners feel icky about it.

They don't feel like they're not going to refer you to somebody else because they don't want you to push them into doing something they're not prepared to do.

You consult them through the process and help them, educate them on what is and is not a good idea.

You'll lose projects that will come back and say, hey, I hired the other guy, but can you come fix what they did?

Like that happened a ton of.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

They just knew I was gonna give them the honest answer, like I'm not gonna tell them what they want to hear to close the deal.

I'm giving them the information to make an educated decision.

When you do that, you really create more of a better user experience.

Yeah, I have actually a very, very similar story.

I did a quoted a project for a gentleman and he ended up going with somebody else.

He was like, you know what?

I like you.

Everything was great.

The presentation was great, the info's great, the project's great.

But I went with this other guy because he was a lot cheaper.

And it was about six months later, his neighbor calls me and says, hey, you're a referral from my neighbor.

And I started looking back at my records.

I'm like, wait a minute, he didn't go with us.

And so when I got over there, he says, yeah, he, he told me that he recommended you even though he didn't use you and said, absolutely, do not use the company that he used because it was nothing but headaches and trouble.

And so I ended up getting a fantastic sell out of the neighbor.

That happens more often than not, man.

Yeah.

Because of integrity and service and just solving problems.

So, yeah, so I'd like to circle back kind of where you started with because I know one of the big hot topics right now in the, in our environment and in the world, especially with all the Coronavirus and COVID 19 and all this craziness that's going on is it's kind of feast or famine right now with the companies that I'm working with.

I'm either hearing like our company is, we've just had record breaking month, but then I'm.

That's not the majority.

The majority of companies out there.

And people in the industry, in all industries are having a hard time getting the phone to ring.

So let's circle back on that.

The kind of what you were talking about, about the guerrilla ways to acquire leads, acquire clients and customers without having to dump a lot of money into marketing and ad spend and that kind of thing, because I know our company.

Our average cost per lead is about $600 per lead that comes in in our marketplace, and it's enormous.

That's a big number.

So, yeah, it's a huge number.

So we do everything we can to try to, of course, get referrals and that kind of stuff.

But what are some ways to do that a bit better?

I know everyone is really wanting to know that right now.

You know, the unfortunate reality is it's not quick.

Like, you know, the tactics that I use are not fast.

But what happens is, like, companies that are thriving right now are the ones that put in the right work to build a relationship with their market over the last three to six months.

They're working through a pipeline that was built up because of value.

They put in people who are just waiting on the next lead.

When that faucet turns off, your business turns off.

And that's why I've seen businesses doing 4 to 5 million go bankrupt in three months because they were spending $40,000 a month on fricking leads.

When the leads dry up, it doesn't matter how much money you have.

There just aren't leads there.

But there's still people making decisions.

And what I really coach on, and this isn't a new theory, and I'm not taking credit for this, but, like, people buy from, they know, like, and trust.

Well, the best way to get people to know, like, and trust you is to pour into your market with content that is entertaining and educational.

So if you're saying, like, I don't like the way I look on camera, you're losing right now.

And, you know, get it, you know.

So suck it up, buttercup.

But here's the thing.

This always makes me laugh, but if you're sitting on, if you're listening right now saying, yeah, I hate the way I look on camera, what do you think you look like in people's homes when you're selling them?

It's the same, right?

It's the same face.

And if you don't like it on camera, you sure as don't like it in person because you can't even edit it, right?

Like, so that's always made me laugh a little that people are like, I don't like the way I look on camera.

Well, what do you think you look like in person?

It's the same.

What you need to be doing is putting out consistent content on your platforms.

Whichever one you're on, start with the one you're most comfortable with and create some sort of a content tree to start to build a relationship with your audience.

And anybody who's been on social media for any period of time has built relationships with somebody they don't know that they feel like if they saw in person, that they'd be friends with.

Right.

Your audience is no different with you.

And what happens is, is that people who relate to the way you communicate, the way you think, the way you problem solve, the way that you articulate, become better clients because they already know that they like the way you communicate.

And people who don't like the way you communicate or the way you think or the way you problem solve won't call you.

Well, who wants to work with somebody doesn't like the way you operate?

Those are really challenging clients.

But people are afraid to qualify out because of the feast or famine or scarcity mindset of.

I don't know where my next leads coming from.

Well, if you fall in love with the process of building a machine that gives you leads, you're not worried about the leads.

You're worried about the content.

You know, most.

This is a stat that kind of surprised me.

Even I learned over the last year or so is of everybody who will ever buy from you, only 6% are ready to make a decision right now.

Wow, that's amazing.

60 to 70% will make a decision in the next six months.

So if you're not putting content out consistently, they'll forget about you after that one ad they saw or that one mailer or that ad in a magazine.

Like, they'll forget about you because they weren't ready to make a decision.

They'll make a decision in four to six months with whoever's at top of mind when they make that decision.

So your job is to cultivate that relationship consistently so you're always the person they're thinking of.

Now, when you say that is by.

Video content, doing entertaining and educational stuff to inform and entertain your audience, because that's what people will remember and that's what makes people stop.

Like in the H Vac world, before and after, pictures of a heat pump ain't gonna get it done right.

What are some better ideas?

I was gonna say.

So when you say putting out content and using platforms, 100% agree.

And I know what you're talking about.

But as you know, lots of, you know, lots of contractors, lots of trades, not as well versed with social media or any type of digital marketing because they've been busy doing the work.

Yep.

Right.

So what.

What would you.

If I was brand new and I was coming to you as a coaching client.

You said, okay, you don't have anything right now.

Let's get started.

How would you walk me through that process of where should I go first?

Was the kind of easiest entry.

And at the same time, what do you mean by content?

Because if before and after pictures aren't enough, what is enough?

What do you really recommend?

No, that's a good question.

And I think we probably both deal with it a little bit where we're like, we underestimate the different levels of knowledge of it.

And you don't want to get too granular, but it's a great question.

So would start with a business Facebook page and a business Instagram page.

I think that's where the average homeowner or consumer is going for information.

Okay.

So people say, do I need a business Facebook page?

Some.

Some tips on that?

No one's going to see it unless they're looking for it specifically.

Unless you put ad dollars behind it.

So Facebook is a for profit business and on business pages on Facebook, no, they will not show it to hardly anybody.

Like, I have over a thousand followers on my business Facebook page.

If I don't put money behind it, 20 people are seeing it.

Right.

They throttle that pretty aggressively.

You can put a small amount, like a dollar or two a day behind a post, which I'm not gonna get into today to build all that out, but it's there for when people search for you.

Instagram is a lot easier for people to start to build a relationship because it's easier for you to engage with other pages.

Like, I'm really big on outbound social media engagement, where what that looks like is if you're, let's say, an H VAC company and you want to get involved with some of the biggest real estate groups in your region, you would start your business Instagram page and then go engage with those business pages so they can see your name and engage back with you.

So you'd go follow their page.

You'd like a couple of their posts.

You'd comment on some of their posts.

Maybe you shoot them a dm.

Just introduce yourself.

And that's a really easy way to get to people who would not normally answer the phone or answered an email.

Sure.

So DM is direct message for all of you out there.

That is, you would send them a message on Instagram, but really just honestly, like following their page and then getting them to follow you back.

Because, like, if someone follows you, more often than not they're going to follow.

You would follow them back, right?

You would engage with their page in some way.

So that's.

That gets you to the content question.

What is good content?

So one of the simplest ways to start, if you're like, I have no idea what to talk about at the end of every day, I want you to sit in your truck or your van and say, what is the biggest lesson I learned today?

And what is the biggest problem I solved today?

And nine times out of 10, those lessons and problems that you're engaging with, the majority of the people that would want to hire you are dealing with the same thing, right?

So you would just tell the story, hey, just leaving a client's house, and they were really complaining because one of their zones, the upstairs in their house was just not getting to the right temperature.

But the bottom was.

Well, what we found out was the damper here, this here, this heat pump or this other thing.

And we were able to solve that today and get their house right back to temperature.

If you're dealing with something like that, I'd love to talk to you about it.

Nice.

Nice.

That is tell the story.

Tell the story.

And whatever biggest problem or lesson you learned today, because it could be something simple like, don't be afraid to be vulnerable.

Like, you could say something like, man, I ran into this.

We learned this crazy new thing about these new carrier units that we didn't know before, and now we're reversed in this.

Like, if you're dealing with this, maybe your technician or the company you've been using doesn't realize of this new technique or this new tool or this new problem.

And we learned that today, and now we're ready to talk about that with future clients because we were able to get with carrier, understand what this new problem was, understand what this new part needed is, and now we can help this problem better and more modern going forward.

You know, talking about the biggest lessons you learned or this new tool you found or this new process you learned.

Because what happens is when people start to engage, so you outbound, you follow a bunch of these people.

Property management companies, real estate agents, maybe contractors.

However, your.

Whatever your H Vac business focuses on.

But then you start putting out content that shows you're an expert.

Because what has historically happened is you will get on and say, hey, I'm Mike Claudio with Mike Claudio H Vac.

And we operate with integrity and we're the best in town and we'll get to you quickly.

Well, that works.

If everybody else is saying, hire me at your own risk, I might take advantage of you.

Right.

But there's no differentiating factors to that.

People know it's just lip service.

But when you start to tell the stories about what you're doing day to day and how you're helping people and the problems you solve, people will learn that you are trustworthy and have integrity and operate effectively and are really good at what you do without you needing to say, we're really great and we operate integrity.

Because you're just telling people how you operate consistently.

And man, that works so much better.

Because ultimately, and I mean this with all due respect, none of your clients give a shit about your backstory.

They're only concerned are you, are you capable and are you capable and affordable to solve a problem I have.

Right, right.

That's all they care.

Totally agree.

Literally all they care about.

Well, because everybody tells the exact same backstory on paper.

And I just had this conversation with somebody yesterday, she's like, well, on paper your, your quote looks the same as every these other three I'm looking at.

Well, on paper your company looks the same as all these other companies because y' all are all have a reputation, you've all got good ratings, you've all got good reviews, except the prices are different.

Why should I buy from you?

What is different about you versus any of these others?

Because it all looks the same to me.

I'll simplify this as simple as I can make it.

You are your only differentiating factor.

People buy people.

People don't buy products, they don't buy brands, they don't buy reputation.

They buy people who do they feel most comfortable with that can solve their problem.

And I'll prove it to you.

And this is something that, like I've been saying for years, and it typically helps people click, but if people bought brands and products, Nike would never need a person in one of their commercials.

They would only need shoes, Right?

But they put LeBron James in there because people buy LeBron James, not Nike.

Right?

So in your, in your world as an H Vac company, I don't care how long you've been in business.

Yes, it's great as a credibility checkpoint, but it's not the first line of offense that you're putting in front of people.

You are it.

Right?

Because you know, when I, when I went from, when I sold that half million dollar remodel project, we were 20% more than everybody else.

But the client said, hey, you have the least amount of experience and you're the most expensive, but I believe that you care the most and you will be, you will Be the somebody I want to work with for the next six months while we execute this large project.

Right.

Right now, then that's so powerful.

Me and we were going up against, like, some 60 year old companies in Charlotte.

We were a few years old and with no experience in a project that size.

But we won it because she trusted Mike Claudio.

And then when Mike Claudio went from remodeling to roofing, everybody still hired Mike Claudio for whatever they needed, because Mike Claudio had built a reputation.

And you're no different within your H Vac company.

Like, a technician could jump companies and not lose a single client.

Right.

Because they believe in that technician.

Mm.

So when somebody see it happen all the time in the industry.

And so be.

Be incredibly more focused on the name on your back than the name on your chest.

Mm.

I think it's incredibly more powerful and people will buy into that.

Well, why would I hire you?

Well, you're gonna hire me.

Not my company, not the products.

Because, I mean, to be fair, your equipment and products are not competitive.

They're all basically the same.

Yeah.

So, like you're saying, hey, why'd I hire you?

Well, you're hiring me.

My name, who I am, you would hire me because you believe I'm the best.

To execute your project effectively and on time.

Right.

That's it.

You can tell that story effectively.

You will win way more than you have won to date.

If you've been focusing on the brand and the background and the integrity and all that.

Like, it just.

People just don't matter.

People just don't care.

So end every day and either write down or just do a video sitting in your truck.

What is the biggest lesson you learned that day?

Or what is the biggest problem you solve that day?

And if you just tell that story every day, you will never run out of content because you solve different problems for different people every day.

Oh, that's fantastic.

Thank you for that insight.

Because I know that there are people all the time.

That's one of the biggest topics.

Well, not just right now, obviously.

It's increased right now because the phones aren't ringing either they're not ringing quite as much, or if companies have been making this kind of content and the company is.

I was literally talking to a guy yesterday.

Their company at almost $300,000 in sales yesterday, because they have been putting out this massive amount of content for the last two months of.

Here's what we're doing there.

Pictures all the time.

Here's the concerns these people have.

And pictures all the times with masks and gloves.

And they're talking about the, hey, check out this cool ozone machine we put in every single vehicle we have.

So all of our tools can get sanitized between calls.

And so for the last two or three months, they've been building that and building that, building that.

And people know, hey, if I want, if I'm going to have a safe visit from somebody, I'm going to call these guys because they're the ones doing it.

And so it's 100% proving out right now.

Literally yesterday in a conversation I had.

So that's so powerful.

You have to do it consistently, you know, and that's the bit where I think a lot of people get hurt.

General is like, it's worse to start and stop than to not start at all.

If it looks like you have two or three weeks of activity and then take two or three months off, people think you just went out of business, right?

So you got.

Once you start, it doesn't need to be every day, but it has to be the same cadence.

Like if when you create a social media structure or a content tree, it's, I'm gonna have the same cadence or the same schedule every week.

Like, I'm gonna have this post on Monday, this type of post on Wednesday, this type of post on Friday.

And then your audience gets used to the cadence of seeing you.

And you'll eventually, if you miss a day, you'll have people be like, hey, man, didn't hear from you today.

Yeah, it's like, what's going on?

And that, man, that shit happens regularly with me if I miss something.

Yeah, no, that's so powerful.

So powerful.

I love it.

So once we've established a good cadence online, social media start to get some of the awareness out.

Starting to get top of mind, really starting to develop a fan base, basically building an audience of people who are starting to know, like, and trust you.

Of course, that's always been called the living room effect.

That term got coined back in the, like 40s and 50s when TV was first coming out.

These all the stars would start complaining to their managers and to their.

Their producers and their agents and stuff.

Like, hey, I.

That's when people initially started when they were in public, there were all of a sudden stars and people started really, the whole paparazzi effect started to happen.

And they're like, man, these people keep coming up to me and acting like they know me as if we had been friends forever.

And so in that case, that's how that term got coined.

But doing living proof of this at 100% and I can and I'm sure you having the same experience and anyone who consistently does content like this, especially doing just Facebook lives or Instagram lives or videos, that kind of thing, you will come across people and one of actually one of the tips that I always give and it's super easy to do.

Everybody in our company has done it.

Everybody I coach, we have them do it, record it doesn't have to be big or flashy.

Just get some little background with your maybe company logo or something record on your phone, make a quick video, less than a minute of how hi, my name is Sam Wakefield.

My name is Whatever.

I'm excited to meet you today.

I'm excited to serve you a couple things to think about before our visit.

I'll be there here in just a little bit.

It'll be great to meet you.

It doesn't have to be any more than that.

Even if that headshot can accomplish that relatability so that they know who's going to be walking up to their front door.

Especially with the older generation they're very hesitant of letting men into their home.

So just given that picture, a brief description of hey can't wait to see you later today would be very powerful.

Yeah, yeah, you can sit.

Yeah send just a pre made thing.

It's your picture in a quick bio or a little one minute video.

So what we do is.

That's a great idea.

Yeah.

What we're doing is we're just telling everybody, you know, have it preloaded in a quick little YouTube link and then just when you make your pre call when you're going say hey I'm going to text you this quick video or email it, whatever they prefer.

Appreciate if you watch that before I get there.

But what's happening?

You're literally they're expecting you now as you're walking up to the door more often than not people open the door and say oh hi Sam, I recognize you from your video.

And how different is that from back when you used to knock on the door and then they would have that hesitance of who are you again?

And for the people out there right now saying I'll never get my technicians to do that, you can automate that process through some sort of a mailing campaign or mailchimp or constant contact or you can set up automations of send this email to these people on these days.

So like don't think I'll never get my guys to do that.

Like take it to the next level.

You can automate that Process through a lot of other platforms for that.

Yeah.

Service Titan is a big company like CRM for the service industry.

Yeah.

Process for trades and that kind of thing.

That program will actually do this for you.

You just have it preloaded.

As soon as the dispatcher hits go, it sends to the people automatically.

Yeah.

So it's not even something you have to think about each time.

So if you have that, so many.

Great ways to connect that the like our industry as a whole is behind on from a. I'm not even call professionalism.

Just building a relationship with your client base that makes them believe and trust in you and know who you are and be able to refer you better.

And is that video gonna help you close more deals?

Probably.

But what it's really gonna do is help you get more referrals.

So back to the how do we get more leads?

The way you make people feel at the beginning and end of your transaction is how they'll remember you.

Period.

It has nothing to do with how you handle in the middle.

You be the greatest technician in the world but if you don't say bye or you don't leave something or you don't thank them, they're not going to remember you.

Right.

So it's how you start, initiate and how you end is really how you start to grow Referrals from those people as opposed to, you know, I fixed your air handler really well.

No one cares.

They don't.

Yes.

They don't know what right and wrong is.

So they're not going to know anything.

But it's how did you make them feel throughout the transaction from start to finish?

That is really what makes them willing and excited to refer you to other people.

Yeah, absolutely.

I love it.

It's good stuff today.

So moving past that initial phase there, getting into and this is something I think sounds like we need to make this a two part episode.

I could talk for days on this stuff, I mean.

Oh, that's right.

So we've hit pillar one which is that attraction.

Pillar two is the sorting process.

Right.

Qualification.

Yep.

Let's cover that and wrap up there and maybe reset a second appointment.

We'll talk about pillars three and four if you're okay with that.

Yeah.

So let me just clarify.

So Target was pillar 2.

Identify target 1.

We'll do qualify and then we'll go back, we'll do a second one for identify and.

And yeah, yeah that'd be good.

But alright.

So if you're getting leads right now, you know, how do you go about qualifying them?

You know Some of that is through the way you message through your social media and what you're saying and how you're saying it and how you're delivering, who you're helping and where you're helping.

Cause just something simple as saying like, hey, just got finished replacing a unit on a 5,000 square foot house on this side of town or in this neighborhood, lets those people know that you work in their neighborhood and lets other people know you don't do cheap work.

So if you qualify out the people who are very conscious of price, which is good for us, right?

And then qualifies you in to people who are like, okay, he's done work, rental house my size, I can trust him.

Right?

Because people just don't know.

People are very hesitant to hire service companies because it's very difficult right now to identify who's going to take advantage of you and who's not.

The bottom line is there are people in our industry that screw people over every day.

So the client is concerned with that.

So the first step is like your passive, what I call outbound qualifiers, which is how you tell the stories of what you do and who you help.

Because it does subconsciously help people identify themselves.

And when you tell that story well, when you do a good job telling the story on what you do and how you do, the ideal clients will see themselves as a character in that story, which makes them feel more confident in being helped by you.

And it will help the not so ideal clients identify themselves as not a person that you're interested in helping.

And do you qualify out some people you might have been able to help?

Yes.

But do you qualify in a lot of better clients?

Absolutely.

And I'll take that swing any day of the week.

Right.

But then when you're asking questions over the phone, right.

It's how are you qualifying them once they identify themselves as someone who's interested in your service?

If it's an emergency call, that's a little bit different.

I'll be honest, I've never really been in that world.

Like I have not been in the emergency service world for, you know, H vac, plumbing, electrical.

Most of the stuff I've sold has been elective.

So it's a little bit different because it's more.

There's more of a process to it.

But there's three things that I think make or break a client transaction that you can uncover on the first call.

It's how transparent are they, how flexible are they, and what is their geographic location.

There's a number of ways to Uncover that part of it is understanding.

Do they have a budget?

Do they not?

Do they have like relatability to what it's going to cost?

Do they agree to a range of fee before you come out?

Do you have an inspection fee or a trip fee that they're willing to abide to?

If you're not charging at least a minimum trip fee, you need to be like, right, absolutely, 100%.

I know most do.

But if you're listening right now and you're saying, no, I'll go out for free, you're the reason you're getting crappy.

Clients.

Love it.

So if you understand, are they willing to be transparent about what's going on?

If they're like, well, I don't know what's happening?

Or one of the best questions I've ever asked is what problem are you hoping to solve by contacting me?

Because when you relate what you're doing to a problem they're experiencing, it becomes less about the cost of it and more about the value of it, right?

Because if you're saying like, hey man, my mother in law just moved in and she's constantly freezing cold, the difference between 500 and $750 for that ain't nothing compared to making her mother in law comfortable.

It's again how you make them feel.

How you make them feel, right?

So if you can uncover the question of, hey, what problem are you hoping to solve by calling us?

They're like, hey, can you just come out and look at my stuff?

Well, I want to better understand what's going on.

Nah, just come on out.

That's someone who's not transparent, like they're not willing to communicate with you.

And if you can't get them to communicate proactively over the phone, what do you think it's gonna be like when you get time to invoice them?

Are you tired of chasing money?

It's gonna be terrible.

Right?

So then how flexible are they?

Right.

Hey, I need you to come out this afternoon.

Well, our next technicians available, let's say three days from now.

Oh man, I really need somebody today.

Well, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

You know, we don't have anybody available and if they're not willing to be flexible to your timeframe, again, inflexibility shows me that they're not going to be an easy client to work with.

Is that 100% accurate?

Let me clarify this.

Nothing in sales, in any industry, with any client is ever 100% the same way.

You can say the same thing to Ten people and get seven and a half different reactions, period.

So don't like what if me or yeah, but me.

It works the majority of the time.

And I get that a lot.

Like, well, what about this one client I had three years ago?

No, stop.

When I talk about best practices and sales tips, I talk about the middle 75 to 80%, right?

The top 10%, the bottom 10%, you can't make decisions around, they're so far irregular.

You have to focus on that middle 70 to 80%.

Yeah, there's always anomalies.

There's always anomalies, but what works the most often and when I ask questions, if I don't feel like they're being transparent and flexible or they're not in a good geographic location for me, that I can't effectively manage my existing client base and get to them in a timely fashion to deliver the client experience I would want to deliver, it's not worth doing.

Right.

So, and here's the part that I think a lot of people underestimate.

When someone calls you specifically in a reactive environment like a service company, they are not always looking specifically for you to solve their problem.

They're looking for a solution to their problem.

So if you tell them, hey, for what you're looking for right now, we typically range between 1500 and 2500 dollars and you get a whoa, that's way more than I thought it would be.

Hey, why don't you call these two or three other people and just see where they're price at.

I believe I'm competitively priced and if you find someone way cheaper, by all means give us a call back if you don't be okay doing that.

Because I've always used the same example.

If someone went to a real estate agent and said, hey, we have a $300,000 budget for our house and that real estate agent showed them every possible house they could around $300,000 and that person couldn't find something they wanted, they'll change their budget, right?

It's not your job to meet a client's in really just inaccurate budget.

They have an improper expectation of what their solutions gonna be.

That's not your job to meet that.

Like just because they've been watching DIY Network and HGTV and think for 700 bucks, because on that flip house that one time they only spent 700 bucks.

But really it's a $7,500, you know, replacement cost, right?

That's not your problem.

It's your job to maintain your business profitability.

It's not your job to maintain improper cost expectation on the client side.

So it's.

I'm all about letting them go look around and if they come back, great.

And then I know I have them.

Absolutely.

More often.

This is such a good conversation.

I'm so glad we're having this because such as we all know, in any trade, any construction, anything, that's the trap that just about everyone at some point in their career gets sucked into of thinking that you need everyone who knocks on your door, rings your phone, or sends you an email.

We don't need everyone.

We don't need a per.

We need people.

We don't need a person.

And just like you were saying earlier, if we're doing a great job of creating the right message and the right idea of who we are and the problems we solve.

And again, it's not about a product.

It's not about, okay, here's my brand, or it's not about this one type of air conditioner.

It's a two stage and that's what we do.

Who cares?

It's about solving the problems.

Communicate that effectively.

We'll have more clients than we know what to do with.

And we'll be able to grow and scale in a way that with the right margins and the right profitability, not just because we have bigger volume.

Yeah, you can be all fired up over here.

But the biggest thing is, and I think we all experience this, like, I think we've all gotten the calls of, thank you for answering.

You're the fourth person I've called.

Right.

Like we've all had that scenario in some way, shape or form.

So giving them the opportunity to call their people and realize they're not responsive makes that little bit extra.

They're gonna pay you a lot worth it because they know you're gonna be reliable.

And we've all had that call like, hey man, thank you for answering.

You're the fourth person I've called.

Price just went up.

Nobody's gotten back to me.

And you were out ready somebody else.

You tried that.

Like there's a certain balance there where, like there are certain times you have to give money back or a discount because you screwed up.

And there are certain times that supply and demand requires that you increase your price a little.

But I'm not saying gouge people.

I mean, don't get me wrong here, like, but adding 5 or 10% or a few hundred bucks to something, because there are plenty of times you have to drop your price because of things you've done wrong.

It's business.

I mean demand and quality and control and you got to stay profitable if you're willing to give people money back.

Sometimes you have to be willing to overcharge.

Some people sometimes not overcharged.

Not gouge, but above what you would normally charge for something, right?

Absolutely.

And it's absolutely the market.

You know, there's times and every single industry in the world does this.

That's the reason anybody has a sale is to incentivize people to move forward.

Now they maybe need that extra bump on their books or anything like that.

So we, you know, that's the reason for discounts.

But 100% agree.

That's something that the other side of that, that most people are scared to talk about truly is when it's peak season, does the price go up a little bit?

More importantly, do you stay at the price you should already have it priced at and not give additional discounts?

And that's how to do it, with honesty and integrity.

We're not increasing the price just because it's busier, but it is kind of foundationally a great way to do this.

Everyone is set a book price, set a standard price.

That is okay, look at your entire year.

On the busiest time of the year, the peak season, you've got craziness going on.

What would you want to be able to charge and set that as your standard all the time price.

And then the way you can control it the rest of the time is figure out ways to offer sales or discounts or those types of things.

Or maybe instead of reducing your price, which you can do because it's always more profitable this way, include another item or two, maybe a couple of accessories you're offering at no extra charge right now.

So you're giving them extra value.

I like that significantly better than discounting.

I rather increase the value of a service for the same fee than decrease the cost of that service.

Because when you do that, a number of things happen.

First off, it shows you don't value what you're doing and so that makes the client not value what you're doing.

Yeah, you don't ask for a discount at the Ferrari place.

But also what happens is you get into the discount cycle where you have to because a lot of people are just waiting for the next deal.

If you're somebody who's like every other month is offering some sort of discount, why would someone not wait another month to get the lower price they would?

So then you have to discount to get people to make decisions.

So I prefer doing a value add to the baseline service than to discount the baseline service fee.

My opinion, do that as you want, but I think.

Totally agree.

Totally.

You start discounting services, it's a rabbit hole that you don't know when to stop and eventually you're basically rubbing nickels together to get by because you discounted yourself into the ground.

Yeah, absolutely.

And that's, you know, specifically in the H Vac trade.

That's something that one of the biggest topics is slow season comes around and you have all these companies that start just knocking the bottom out of the price just to get the job when we all know that they are literally paying the client to work for them.

That project is so far in the red because of where the margin landed just to earn the project and that's not doing anyone in any, any of the other companies or themselves any favors.

So yeah, 100% agree.

If you can't be the cheapest guy in town, which you never will be, be the most expensive and offer more value.

Yep, agree.

Completely.

Yep.

I love it.

Love it.

Good stuff, man.

Now we should probably do a second one.

I think that was a good episode and I think we should definitely hit a second one on the other parts of what I think are important about.

Oh totally.

Because I get to talk for an entire hour about how to run an in home consultation.

I love it.

Oh it's so good.

Well cool.

So before we wrap up here and yeah, 100% we'll set that up.

So for everyone listening, this will be part one of a two part series that that we're going to do with Mike Claudio of and so company name.

We need to get this out there.

When Rate Consulting, that's W I N R A T E Consulting.

So there's a couple places that you can find him.

Where can they find you, Mike?

So a few places I would say Instagram's at Winrate Consulting is where one of my primary content sources are.

I also host a podcast called Big Stud Sales.

It is an industry specific sales marketing leadership type podcast.

And I also run a private Facebook group just called Construction Selling.

It's really just best practices tips and tricks about in home construction sales.

So I would love to have you guys join.

I mean there's a.

You have to submit to join but it's a free group so.

But I post pretty regularly.

There's a lot.

There's over 700 members now.

So there's always people talking and asking questions about different sales stuff and you know, ultimately I think it's a great group for people to get information about what you do every day and how to do it a little bit better.

Perfect.

I love that.

So Win Rate Consulting on Instagram.

Win Rate Consulting, Big Stud Sales is the podcast name.

And then the Facebook group, one more time, the name of the Facebook group, Just Construction Selling.

Construction Selling.

That's beautiful.

Love it.

So, and if you, if you, if you are on YouTube, I also host, of course, the Close it now podcast you can find as well.

That's a little more specific to the H Vac industry for residential in home sales.

But again, just like we were talking about earlier, the philosophy is the same.

So all of my people who listen to Close it now go find Mike at Big Stud, Big Stud Sales.

And everyone go subscribe, follow, do all the things.

Let's, let's help him grow his business as well.

And if you need overall ensure that Mike would be willing to do a discovery call with any of you business owners out there, entrepreneurs wanting to grow your businesses.

He is.

Just because he hasn't specifically worked in H Vac before does not mean that every single thing that he's talking about is 100% applicable.

And that's why I bring in people from other trades and other industries.

Because if you want to get really get down to it, the H Vac industry is old and boring and everyone has done the same thing for too long and it's stale.

And so it's time to bring in some new ideas and some new concepts from outside of our industry to bring it some new life and pump it back up.

And so there's no reason you can't dominate your market, especially right now with everything going on.

We've been talking a lot about virtual sales.

We've been doing all kind of different ways to do no contact appointments all the way from sales to service to installation.

You can literally do every bit of that.

No contact.

Don't even have to be in the same part of the house as individuals wear protection.

And people are loving it because it's how we care and how we make them feel.

People don't care how much you know until they know how much you care.

And that is what happens every single day.

So thanks again, Mike, for being on this episode of the Closing now podcast.

And I will reschedule as well for our next one.

And okay, everybody, go out there and save the world one heat stroke at a time.

Save the world one frostbite at a time.

We will talk to you again soon.

Thanks for listening to Close it now with Sam Wakefield.

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