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Welcome to a very special bonus
episode of the e-Commerce podcast

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with me your host, Matt Edmundson.

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The E-Commerce podcast is all
about helping you deliver.

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E-commerce wow.

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Now all of the links, notes, and
transcript from today's episode

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are available on our website
at e-commerce podcast.net.

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Now in this very special spotlight
episode, we take a break from the usual

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deep dive into specific e-commerce
topics, and instead, shine a light

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on a company that's making waves and
doing some pretty impressive work.

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In the world of e-commerce and today
that company is Mason, who are doing some

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insane stuff in the world of AI, which
as we all know, is a bit of a hot topic

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at the moment in the world of e-commerce.

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And our guest is, uh, Kaus Manjita,
who is the CEO and founder of Mason.

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Now Kaus is a celebrated founder and
expert product creator with over 16

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years of experience in the world of
commerce enablement, with a passion for

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making technology accessible and user
friendly, she has devoted her career

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to ensuring that everyone can reap the
benefits of cutting edge innovations.

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Now, Kaus is a natural people person.

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Which is a beautiful thing on
a podcast, let me tell you.

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Uh, she loves connecting with fellow
entrepreneurs and developers, marketeers,

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brand builders, designers, you name it.

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Whether it's over a cup of coffee
on a Zoom call through Instagram

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or of course on a podcast.

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Now, boasting an impressive background.

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Kaus has honed her skills at industry
giants such as IBM Commerce, Myntra,

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which is Walmart fashion in India, uh,
and Paytm, which is part of Alibaba.

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Working in diverse locations, including
Atlanta, San Francisco, and India.

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All very enviable, I feel.

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And today she divides her time
between Toronto and Bangalore

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leading an international team of
talented creators at Mason, which

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all sounds extremely impressive
if, if I'm honest with you, Kaus.

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So welcome to the show.

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Great to have you here.

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How you doing?

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I'm doing good.

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Extremely impressive, but also
extremely tiring for some people.

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But I think once you get over,
once you get over that constant jet

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lag, you're like, you know what?

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I can sleep anywhere.

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I can just take my break anywhere.

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We're good.

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So I, it's interesting.

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So you must spend a lot of
time on airplanes, right?

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Just traveling all over the place.

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I do.

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But I'm raking up a ton of miles.

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I'm trying to use them
as much as I can too, so.

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So what's your top tips
for dealing with jet lag?

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I think the most important
thing is that you gotta,

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wherever you land, I mean, just.

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Behave like that's your
schedule now, right?

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Mm-hmm.

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It doesn't matter.

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And, uh, it, it, it's much better.

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At least for me, it works out
much better if I land in the day,

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I'm gonna go through the day.

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I'm gonna sleep as much
as I can only at night.

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And strangely enough I'm realizing
that there's like this little.

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You know, half an hour, around 5:30 to 6,
uh, five to six every evening, um, that

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I actually feel super sleepy and that
works out whichever time zone you're in.

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So I try to take a power
nap if I can for 15 minutes.

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Yeah, I think these are, these
are probably the two things.

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You gotta find your own rhythm.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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I mean, if I took a power nap at
5:30, my nap would last probably until

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like 7:00 AM the following morning.

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I dunno if I could do a 15
minute power nap that time of

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the day, but maybe two o'clock.

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But yeah, no, it's interesting.

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So you are, um, you're traveling,
you know, doing a lot of travel.

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You've got teams, uh, halfway around the
world from each other in a lot of ways.

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Mm-hmm.

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And doing some great stuff for Mason.

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So tell me about Mason.

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How did you get started?

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Uh, in Mason, you kind of, you've
done some impressive stuff, you

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know, like with IBM and all that
sort of stuff, but why Mason?

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How did you get involved in that?

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Yeah, and, and I think it goes
back to kind of like this.

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Um, very interesting dichotomy and mix.

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And I've used that statement
of like, over the years in, in

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many, many different settings.

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But I've always been, uh, you
know, a very creative kid.

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Uh, love, love like painting,
reading a ton of books, et cetera.

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Uh, gardening, I don't know,
just hanging out with like my dad

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and daydreaming in the backyard.

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But, uh, on the other hand, uh, you
know, Science fiction reader like

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Isaac Asimov was pretty much the
first, you know, person I think.

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Well, I was in 6th standard or something
and I just couldn't let go all everything.

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Whatever he is written, Arthur C.

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Clarke and, and then June
series and stuff like that.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, so there's been this like
very interesting dichotomy that I,

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that I've always been in, and it
continued I guess across this whole.

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You know, work experience, I would
say, um, always straddling different

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regions, always straddling the world
of technology and consumer behavior.

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Uh, you know, um, and, uh, somewhere
when I was, uh, you know, working

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at Walmart's Myntra in India, uh,
it, it suddenly struck me that, you

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know what, uh, The world's shifting.

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Uh, the enterprises are becoming,
I would say, solo-preneurial.

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Mm-hmm.

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Rather than just an enterprise.

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And, and every product, everything that
we do, every system that we use is just

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getting more and more geared towards
empowering that individual, right?

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And so people like me who love creating
great experiences, who love making

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technology simple, um, I don't code,
I'm terrible at it, but can I work with

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people who code and can I work with AI
or whatever else, you know, happens?

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Um, and I can, can I continue
to add value, uh, to someone's

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life and to someone's goals?

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Something that they're trying to achieve
every day using technology, right?

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Yeah.

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So that's, that's, that's been I guess,
the connecting dots throughout my life.

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So when I was at Myntra, uh, uh, you
know, we were, me and my co-founder,

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coincidentally, were working on a
bunch of systems, uh, to power revenue

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on the and Walmart platform in India.

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And so it was all about powering those.

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You know, um, uh, millions, 500 million
plus, uh, you know, consumers who are, uh,

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visitors who are coming in empowering them
to take, to discover beautiful products.

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Yeah.

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Uh, enjoy the whole shopping experience.

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Um, nudge them with decision, with,
with, with things that help them

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take a decision to buy, right?

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Mm-hmm.

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And, and, but enjoy the process
more importantly, right?

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What shopping, shopping is not, is
a lot more than buying, right Matt?

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It's, it's shopping is fun.

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It's buying plus fun, I guess.

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Yeah.

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Um, so, so somewhere along that
line, uh, we realized that we've

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been working in large corporations
for a while, uh, empowering large

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marketplaces, which are closed systems
end of the day and we felt like

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why not kind take all our
learning, simplify it.

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No matter how powerful it is under the
hood, but simplify it and take it to

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the rest of the 99% of retail, those
solo-preneurs, the brands, the, you

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know, founders, the entrepreneurs.

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Yeah.

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And actually help them, help them,
you know, get more, more orders, get

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more revenue, essentially win, right?

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So that's, that's where
I guess it all started.

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Wow.

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So this desire to bring the
secrets of the big boys, uh, and

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get them accessible to everyone.

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Yeah.

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Uh, I I like that.

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Absolutely.

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That's so great.

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So when was Mason started?

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When did you take the leap
from, uh, Myntra into Mason?

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Uh, it was not a direct straight journey.

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It, it, it's never is.

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And uh, we, we started, uh, we
started something called Kubric

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first, and that was, I guess we
were very early in generative ai, so

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that was all Kubric was all about.

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We were working in large
marketplaces, remember?

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So a lot of our experiments, you
know, gave us learning that hey,

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visuals, creatives great, great
looking products, great looking,

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you know videos around products,

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all of that really help
shoppers engage and mm-hmm.

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You know, they, they love it.

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Um, so, but, but it's a lot of work.

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We had like a hundred member, sorry, it
started with a 30 member team and then

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was moving towards a hundred member team.

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Wow.

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To actually just power all that
beautiful things that you see on any

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platform, um, any shopping platform.

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And, uh, we said that, hey, like.

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You know, generative AI is interesting.

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Uh, this was 2018-19, and we said
that hey, we both wanted to, uh, you

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know, create this, uh, AI platform for
generating all this shopping content.

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Uh, visual content and,
um, we were little early.

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Gen AI is not where it's today.

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It was, it was, you know, a
while back and, uh, at some

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point in 2019 we realized, hey,
this is, you know, we are early.

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Um, we, we'll need a lot more funding
and a lot more research and a lot

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more, you know, ammo to actually
make a, make a difference, right?

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So, yeah.

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Um, so yeah.

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So, but, but during that time we kind of
chanced upon this whole idea of empowering

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smaller brands, uh, to do better sales.

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So we kinda pivoted and we stopped
Kubric and then we moved on to do Mason.

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Uh, we launched it first in 2020
in the middle of the Pandemic.

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Good time to launch a business.

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Yeah.

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Perfect, isn't it?

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Yeah.

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Um, and about, uh, may to June and yeah.

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So we've been what live for about
two, two and a half years going,

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gonna be three years this year.

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Yep.

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Okay.

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So in two and a half to three
years in digital terms is actually

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a really long time, isn't it?

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It's, um, it's, it's a yes.

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When you think about the technological
changes just in the last two to

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three years alone, I mean, it's,
it's quite astounding stuff that you

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guys must have witnessed just in your
own business, I would've thought.

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Yeah, I think just the last
couple of months itself, the

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whole world's gone tipsy.

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Um, and I mean, you know, uh,
prompt engineering mm-hmm.

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Was given a domain and now
everybody's like, Hey, how to

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be a prompt engineer, right.

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So, so yes, thinking super fast.

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But what we realized, and I was actually
talking to someone today, um, uh, from

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the Signal Fire, nfx, you would've.

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Seen that, uh, uh, nfx, uh, uh, online,
and they do a ton of interesting

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content, uh, around all this, you know,
interesting trends that are happening

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in the ecosystem, startups, technology
and all of that backed by fund.

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But nfx itself is a really
amazing site to, uh, kind of find

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out what's, what's happening.

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And, uh, uh, very interestingly, they
said that, you know what, uh, it, it's

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in the end, it's all about are you
powering something super fundamental.

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Like, what is it like you strip
away all the jargons and all

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the tech and everything else.

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what is the fundamental
problem that you're solving?

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Right.

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And when you look at it,
commerce is so fundamental.

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It's like so basic human nature.

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there's always been trade.

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You always need things.

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Yeah.

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And there's always someone out
there who has that thing to offer.

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And uh, yeah.

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So, so at the core of what we do is
essentially, Um, we wanna power someone,

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to find something that they love and at
the right price, at the right time, right?

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And, so we wanna also help the person
who's selling it sell better, right?

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So that's, the core of it.

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So I think as long as you are
very true to that fundamental it,

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everything else just falls in place.

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Yeah.

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So how do you guys.

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I mean, that's a great statement.

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It's almost like a mission
statement, isn't it?

233
00:12:08,157 --> 00:12:08,877
What you've just said.

234
00:12:08,877 --> 00:12:11,667
And how do you guys then fulfill that?

235
00:12:11,667 --> 00:12:15,027
How, how do, what's the
outworking of that, um, in Mason?

236
00:12:15,987 --> 00:12:19,227
Yeah, and that's a great question
because, you know, there,

237
00:12:19,227 --> 00:12:21,387
there's always tons and tons.

238
00:12:21,387 --> 00:12:26,787
Retail is like red ocean, retail tech is
an ocean, its as old as retail itself.

239
00:12:27,267 --> 00:12:28,717
There's always been new technology.

240
00:12:29,557 --> 00:12:30,847
That's helping, you know?

241
00:12:30,907 --> 00:12:30,997
Mm-hmm.

242
00:12:31,387 --> 00:12:37,687
Larger small teams do stuff and, uh,
uh, you know, when, when you step back

243
00:12:37,687 --> 00:12:41,887
and you think about it, uh, what's
the problem in the, in the whole

244
00:12:41,887 --> 00:12:46,777
ecosystem today and, uh, the first
generation of commerce online commerce.

245
00:12:47,112 --> 00:12:50,382
Was all about this marketplaces
like Amazon, et cetera, right?

246
00:12:50,652 --> 00:12:53,352
And nobody had a clue like, how do I sell?

247
00:12:53,352 --> 00:12:54,102
How do I buy?

248
00:12:54,102 --> 00:12:55,002
Like both sides.

249
00:12:55,542 --> 00:12:55,692
Yeah.

250
00:12:55,692 --> 00:12:56,292
Clueless.

251
00:12:56,652 --> 00:12:58,602
And they said that we'll
give you this black box.

252
00:12:58,602 --> 00:13:02,082
You don't, just don't have to worry
about anything you wanna sell.

253
00:13:02,087 --> 00:13:03,523
Come here, we'll help
you do everything else.

254
00:13:04,137 --> 00:13:05,997
You wanna buy, just
come here, you're fine.

255
00:13:06,147 --> 00:13:06,447
Right.

256
00:13:06,897 --> 00:13:10,137
And then the next generation
like, but that was a black box.

257
00:13:10,137 --> 00:13:14,347
So the next generation of, I guess
online commerce is like Shopify or Yeah.

258
00:13:14,347 --> 00:13:16,047
WooCommerce or all of that.

259
00:13:16,047 --> 00:13:16,377
Right.

260
00:13:16,587 --> 00:13:19,932
They're saying that,
Like, why, why the seller?

261
00:13:19,932 --> 00:13:22,572
Like why are you stuck on,
on that platform, right?

262
00:13:22,577 --> 00:13:22,702
Mm-hmm.

263
00:13:22,782 --> 00:13:26,682
Like, you need to kinda talk
about who you are beyond just

264
00:13:26,682 --> 00:13:28,452
being like a Craigslist, right?

265
00:13:28,452 --> 00:13:28,692
Yes.

266
00:13:28,802 --> 00:13:29,022
Yes.

267
00:13:29,052 --> 00:13:33,702
And, uh, uh, you, you should stand
out and so why not create your own

268
00:13:33,702 --> 00:13:35,712
personality and create your own presence?

269
00:13:35,922 --> 00:13:39,642
And so that is the next generation of
commerce, which is again, you know,

270
00:13:39,642 --> 00:13:41,442
your own store and stuff like that.

271
00:13:41,447 --> 00:13:41,462
Mm-hmm.

272
00:13:41,542 --> 00:13:41,622
Right?

273
00:13:42,222 --> 00:13:45,912
Uh, but actually at the core of
commerce is us, the consumers.

274
00:13:46,332 --> 00:13:47,862
It's us like we are buying.

275
00:13:47,922 --> 00:13:48,282
Right?

276
00:13:48,282 --> 00:13:52,332
It's, it's not, yes, definitely the
brands who are selling us stuff, but

277
00:13:52,632 --> 00:13:54,552
the core of it is we need something.

278
00:13:54,552 --> 00:13:57,822
That's why someone can sell
something to us, right?

279
00:13:57,882 --> 00:13:57,972
Yeah.

280
00:13:57,977 --> 00:14:00,042
If we didn't need it,
it just wouldn't matter.

281
00:14:00,342 --> 00:14:02,652
Even if we give stuff for
free, people don't want it.

282
00:14:02,652 --> 00:14:07,407
If we don't need it, so, The next
generation of commerce, how we see it

283
00:14:07,407 --> 00:14:10,227
online commerce is, moving already.

284
00:14:10,287 --> 00:14:13,827
If you see the TikTokification
of commerce that we,

285
00:14:14,477 --> 00:14:15,037
I love that phrase.

286
00:14:15,037 --> 00:14:16,537
The TikTokification.

287
00:14:16,537 --> 00:14:17,177
I love that.

288
00:14:17,947 --> 00:14:18,327
Right?

289
00:14:18,697 --> 00:14:22,287
That's all about like the
discovery, the engagement.

290
00:14:23,267 --> 00:14:28,262
Getting to getting to discover interesting
things that maybe you are just super

291
00:14:28,262 --> 00:14:30,182
excited by and you might just buy.

292
00:14:30,222 --> 00:14:33,122
So, it's selling at the point
of inspiration, selling at

293
00:14:33,122 --> 00:14:34,592
the point of intent, right?

294
00:14:34,892 --> 00:14:38,782
It's not forceful, it's not a
search based commerce world, right?

295
00:14:39,092 --> 00:14:39,752
It's, it's help.

296
00:14:39,812 --> 00:14:43,952
It's the whole new next generation is all
about discovering these beautiful, amazing

297
00:14:44,372 --> 00:14:46,292
things to that we might just wanna shop.

298
00:14:46,562 --> 00:14:47,042
Shop.

299
00:14:47,522 --> 00:14:53,457
And so, What we are doing fundamentally is
we wanna be that infrastructure that helps

300
00:14:53,457 --> 00:14:55,317
with the consumer first comms work, right?

301
00:14:55,317 --> 00:14:56,577
Like that, that we want.

302
00:14:56,757 --> 00:15:01,377
We want to eliminate the middle
man and help brands and you know,

303
00:15:01,377 --> 00:15:05,727
consumers connect on an open
market like why closed market.

304
00:15:05,997 --> 00:15:06,267
Right?

305
00:15:06,567 --> 00:15:09,747
So that's, that's our, I guess
the epic calling or the vision.

306
00:15:10,167 --> 00:15:15,537
And yeah, how we do it today is like we
help you first understand your consumers.

307
00:15:15,537 --> 00:15:18,227
So there's a lot of
discovery, engagement related.

308
00:15:19,032 --> 00:15:20,112
You know, modules.

309
00:15:20,292 --> 00:15:23,892
And then the next step towards is once
you understand the consumers right?

310
00:15:24,072 --> 00:15:27,072
Now, how can I help that
consumer take a decision to buy?

311
00:15:27,072 --> 00:15:29,382
That's what, so that's the
next phase of what we do.

312
00:15:29,382 --> 00:15:29,442
Yeah.

313
00:15:29,442 --> 00:15:34,152
Which is essentially just, you know,
part one I guess is understanding and

314
00:15:34,392 --> 00:15:38,592
getting to know your consumer and,
uh, part two of our product is about

315
00:15:38,802 --> 00:15:43,362
now taking that knowledge and then
helping the consumer take a decision

316
00:15:43,362 --> 00:15:45,372
to buy in a very, in a very simple way.

317
00:15:45,377 --> 00:15:46,602
That would, that would be what we do.

318
00:15:47,727 --> 00:15:48,147
Yeah.

319
00:15:48,207 --> 00:15:48,897
I love that.

320
00:15:48,897 --> 00:15:52,767
I love how you simplified it as well,
because I, I, I, I appreciate under

321
00:15:52,767 --> 00:15:57,147
the hood, it's probably a little
bit more complex, uh, than that.

322
00:15:57,147 --> 00:16:02,877
But, um, I, I love what you were
saying there about how, um, at the

323
00:16:02,877 --> 00:16:06,597
core of commerce is the consumer who
wants something, who needs something.

324
00:16:07,812 --> 00:16:12,522
Um, and the rest of it is, is, is is
okay, but you've fundamentally gotta have

325
00:16:12,522 --> 00:16:14,442
the demand from someone to buy Right.

326
00:16:14,442 --> 00:16:15,222
Demand and supply.

327
00:16:15,222 --> 00:16:17,172
You've gotta have that demand
there from the consumer.

328
00:16:17,892 --> 00:16:18,262
Um, yeah.

329
00:16:18,492 --> 00:16:21,082
And, uh, I loved your
phrase, the tictokification.

330
00:16:21,102 --> 00:16:22,002
I might use that.

331
00:16:22,272 --> 00:16:23,902
Uh, you should, you should.

332
00:16:23,907 --> 00:16:24,042
Yeah.

333
00:16:24,042 --> 00:16:24,312
Yeah.

334
00:16:24,312 --> 00:16:28,392
The TikTokification, it's not actually an
easy word to say, but I get what you mean.

335
00:16:28,422 --> 00:16:31,602
Uh, you know, you buy it where
you're sparking this sort of desire.

336
00:16:32,217 --> 00:16:35,187
Uh, in people and your, and you
can shop you can, you know, talk

337
00:16:35,187 --> 00:16:36,327
to that and shop around that.

338
00:16:36,837 --> 00:16:41,487
So you are, you are taking then
people through this process, which one

339
00:16:41,487 --> 00:16:42,927
helps 'em understand their customer.

340
00:16:43,767 --> 00:16:43,917
Yeah.

341
00:16:44,127 --> 00:16:47,127
Which for me is, is, is one
of the critical things to

342
00:16:47,127 --> 00:16:48,327
e-commerce now, isn't it?

343
00:16:48,332 --> 00:16:52,137
Understanding who your customer
is and then two, under taking that

344
00:16:52,137 --> 00:16:56,217
understanding to then go, right,
how can I best sell to them?

345
00:16:56,217 --> 00:17:00,957
How can I, uh, best um, promote them.

346
00:17:01,047 --> 00:17:07,347
And so I'm assuming, given that, uh,
Kubric was involved in generative ai,

347
00:17:07,347 --> 00:17:12,957
that you've sort of snuck in a little
bit of that AI learning, uh, into Mason.

348
00:17:13,017 --> 00:17:17,728
And, um, so how does, am I right,
one, uh, in, in saying that, is there,

349
00:17:17,733 --> 00:17:21,237
is there sort of some AI trickery
involved in this whole process?

350
00:17:21,267 --> 00:17:22,197
Trickery is the wrong word.

351
00:17:22,337 --> 00:17:22,687
Magic.

352
00:17:23,027 --> 00:17:24,087
We do the right word.

353
00:17:24,387 --> 00:17:25,947
AI magic involved in this?

354
00:17:27,117 --> 00:17:27,597
Yeah.

355
00:17:27,597 --> 00:17:30,087
And, and yeah, you, we
can't run away from it.

356
00:17:30,087 --> 00:17:34,467
Like my, someone we know, like
one of our oldest, I guess.

357
00:17:35,217 --> 00:17:41,307
You know, backers and, and advisors
and, uh, he, he once, uh, you know,

358
00:17:41,307 --> 00:17:46,037
jokingly told us, uh, that, oh, the
OGs in Generative AI we're like,

359
00:17:46,107 --> 00:17:49,827
yeah, but, but jokes apart, I guess.

360
00:17:49,827 --> 00:17:51,837
Um, you, you can't run away from it.

361
00:17:51,842 --> 00:17:55,107
I mean, there's definitely, see at
the core of it, what we wanna do

362
00:17:55,107 --> 00:17:58,707
is essentially as you, you know, we
wanna connect the consumer and the.

363
00:17:59,412 --> 00:18:00,372
The shopper rather.

364
00:18:00,372 --> 00:18:01,902
And, and the seller, right.

365
00:18:01,902 --> 00:18:02,322
In a way.

366
00:18:02,652 --> 00:18:06,162
And, uh, um, but, you know,
sellers are overwhelmed.

367
00:18:06,222 --> 00:18:08,952
Like, you know, your, your core I.

368
00:18:09,867 --> 00:18:12,717
Uh, skill is that you can identify.

369
00:18:12,747 --> 00:18:15,687
Once you understand what consumers
need, you can find that thing

370
00:18:15,687 --> 00:18:17,847
and you can package it and you
can give it to them, right?

371
00:18:18,117 --> 00:18:20,667
But now why, why are you having
to know what's a web hub?

372
00:18:20,967 --> 00:18:21,897
What's an api?

373
00:18:21,897 --> 00:18:22,977
How do I set up this?

374
00:18:22,977 --> 00:18:23,547
How do I set up?

375
00:18:23,757 --> 00:18:26,707
So there's like so much of like
constant learning about things

376
00:18:27,057 --> 00:18:30,327
that are probably not really
required or you're just operating

377
00:18:30,327 --> 00:18:32,067
all the time, like multiple tools.

378
00:18:32,757 --> 00:18:35,502
You know, so much tech, so
much of like burning out.

379
00:18:35,802 --> 00:18:39,552
So, so, so AI definitely helps
in, because it brings that

380
00:18:39,552 --> 00:18:41,592
intelligent decision making mm-hmm.

381
00:18:41,832 --> 00:18:44,772
As long as you can set
the parameters right?

382
00:18:44,777 --> 00:18:44,792
Yeah.

383
00:18:45,132 --> 00:18:49,832
So example, example being just, you
know, how, how, what's, what sort of.

384
00:18:50,682 --> 00:18:54,852
Discounts can I give to, you know,
shoppers who are probably engaging

385
00:18:54,852 --> 00:18:58,452
with a product but not buying that
product at that point in time.

386
00:18:58,752 --> 00:18:59,142
Right.

387
00:18:59,232 --> 00:19:03,822
Would that shopper have a propensity
to just like be excited by a discount?

388
00:19:04,152 --> 00:19:05,817
Would that shopper not be excited?

389
00:19:05,857 --> 00:19:07,993
So there are many different
signals that you can use to.

390
00:19:08,562 --> 00:19:11,022
Even as a, as a, as a person,
that's what you'll do.

391
00:19:11,022 --> 00:19:13,782
You'll say that, Hey, that guy was
like looking at that product for

392
00:19:13,782 --> 00:19:18,852
a long time, was hovering over the
price, but then kinda not buying,

393
00:19:19,062 --> 00:19:20,472
maybe he's worried about the price.

394
00:19:20,472 --> 00:19:25,362
Maybe I'll tell him about, you know, the
like dude I can give you a 5% discount.

395
00:19:25,392 --> 00:19:27,312
Like, something of that sort,
like that's, that's what you

396
00:19:27,312 --> 00:19:28,602
would do in the real world too.

397
00:19:28,902 --> 00:19:33,552
So, so as long as you can set like
these sort of boundaries and objectives

398
00:19:33,552 --> 00:19:37,062
for the system, the system can
then keep, you know, running those.

399
00:19:37,437 --> 00:19:41,457
Experiment, saturations, whatever, and
then can actually eventually figure

400
00:19:41,457 --> 00:19:48,687
out what sort of consumer, you know,
behavior and insights will, you know,

401
00:19:48,687 --> 00:19:51,517
lead to what sort of outcome, right?

402
00:19:51,517 --> 00:19:51,717
Yeah.

403
00:19:52,317 --> 00:19:57,657
And they learn super fast and they can be
like multi, you know, multi so they can

404
00:19:57,657 --> 00:20:01,287
do like millions of consumers at the same
time, like, which is not possible for you.

405
00:20:01,992 --> 00:20:04,872
Uh, and, and they can take so many
different signals, which again, is

406
00:20:04,872 --> 00:20:07,212
super hard for people to process, right?

407
00:20:07,542 --> 00:20:11,502
Um, so, so that's how you kind of sneak
in, as you said, the power of ai, right?

408
00:20:11,507 --> 00:20:17,142
Because at the end of the day, if you
want to help, each shopper connect

409
00:20:17,142 --> 00:20:20,262
with the right seller and the right
product that the seller is selling

410
00:20:20,267 --> 00:20:23,922
at the right time, then there's a
ton of different data signals, right?

411
00:20:23,922 --> 00:20:23,982
Yeah.

412
00:20:24,372 --> 00:20:28,692
And you need to take quick, instant
decisions to now do something.

413
00:20:29,397 --> 00:20:34,227
Right, and that is decision making
is what is simplified with ai, right?

414
00:20:34,227 --> 00:20:34,317
Mm-hmm.

415
00:20:34,762 --> 00:20:38,307
Uh, but of course, just like data
and insights and analytics is

416
00:20:38,312 --> 00:20:40,137
a, a very important module too.

417
00:20:40,437 --> 00:20:44,307
Uh, you know, automation is an
important module that we have, uh,

418
00:20:44,312 --> 00:20:47,397
you know, vertical specific, which
is like if you are in beauty and

419
00:20:47,397 --> 00:20:49,737
personal care, how you have to sell.

420
00:20:50,112 --> 00:20:52,752
Sort of changes than if
you are in groceries.

421
00:20:52,932 --> 00:20:57,462
So we have like vertical specific,
category specific, uh, you know, uh,

422
00:20:57,522 --> 00:20:59,532
strategies and playbooks and apps.

423
00:20:59,742 --> 00:21:03,252
So all of that are the different
modules, but yet they're powered by

424
00:21:03,252 --> 00:21:05,262
this smart decision making engine.

425
00:21:05,592 --> 00:21:10,302
And, uh, at a very simple way, it's like
a set of rules that you set, but the

426
00:21:10,302 --> 00:21:12,042
system's like smart because it's an ai.

427
00:21:12,047 --> 00:21:16,377
So it's like learning as it's, you
know, Successful or not successful.

428
00:21:16,377 --> 00:21:16,437
Yeah.

429
00:21:16,497 --> 00:21:17,007
Yeah.

430
00:21:17,097 --> 00:21:17,577
No, fair.

431
00:21:17,577 --> 00:21:18,117
That's great.

432
00:21:18,177 --> 00:21:18,897
Sounds great.

433
00:21:18,957 --> 00:21:25,737
And I'm curious, uh, Kaus, when you talk
about, um, the ability to handle all of

434
00:21:25,737 --> 00:21:30,957
this data, um, if I'm listening to the
podcast and thinking, well, this all

435
00:21:30,957 --> 00:21:36,207
sounds great and, and interesting and
helpful, um, but I'm just starting out

436
00:21:36,237 --> 00:21:40,827
is, is, is what you do still helpful
for the startup or, or do I need

437
00:21:40,827 --> 00:21:45,942
like, A million lines of sales data
before it starts to get interesting.

438
00:21:46,872 --> 00:21:52,122
Yeah, actually, uh, honestly
speaking, forget about the data,

439
00:21:52,392 --> 00:21:54,012
like keeping the data aside.

440
00:21:54,342 --> 00:21:59,042
If you are in, in your e-commerce
journey, right, or in your brand journey,

441
00:21:59,742 --> 00:22:03,792
you're a brand founder and you're still
trying to figure out product market fit.

442
00:22:04,147 --> 00:22:07,452
Like you're still figuring out what sort
of products should I even, you know,

443
00:22:07,452 --> 00:22:09,402
what sort of category should I exist in?

444
00:22:09,402 --> 00:22:09,462
Yeah.

445
00:22:09,462 --> 00:22:10,902
Like what's my sweet spot, right?

446
00:22:11,142 --> 00:22:17,142
What is the kinda customer like, am I
selling to only Gen Z women or like, am I

447
00:22:17,142 --> 00:22:19,302
also kinda branching out into millennials?

448
00:22:19,302 --> 00:22:19,932
Like where am I?

449
00:22:19,937 --> 00:22:20,202
Right?

450
00:22:20,442 --> 00:22:24,702
So if you are still in that, you
know what product market fit.

451
00:22:25,032 --> 00:22:25,722
You know, phase.

452
00:22:25,722 --> 00:22:26,082
Right?

453
00:22:26,292 --> 00:22:30,132
Then of course, keeping a system
in the middle that's helping you,

454
00:22:30,792 --> 00:22:32,712
your consumer shop better mm-hmm.

455
00:22:32,952 --> 00:22:35,202
Is, is essentially, I
think, an overkill, right?

456
00:22:35,207 --> 00:22:37,602
Because you have, you have
product market fit, you have

457
00:22:37,602 --> 00:22:38,922
zero to one journey to cover.

458
00:22:38,922 --> 00:22:39,042
Mm-hmm.

459
00:22:39,282 --> 00:22:43,212
And I think it's the same, even if
I'm a, um, uh, you know, software

460
00:22:43,217 --> 00:22:47,112
startup right before I, I find product
market fit before I figure out what's

461
00:22:47,112 --> 00:22:49,092
the problem and how I wanna solve it.

462
00:22:49,392 --> 00:22:52,587
Like putting any sort of growth
engines is like, Meaningless.

463
00:22:52,587 --> 00:22:52,827
Right?

464
00:22:53,007 --> 00:22:56,967
So we usually, uh, you know, operate
in the sweet spot of, you know, once

465
00:22:56,967 --> 00:23:01,287
you're from product market fit, maybe at
about, you know, one to 2 million in gmv.

466
00:23:01,317 --> 00:23:01,737
Mm-hmm.

467
00:23:01,977 --> 00:23:03,357
Um, and, and then beyond.

468
00:23:03,597 --> 00:23:07,017
That's where you know your
question of what am I even selling?

469
00:23:07,017 --> 00:23:08,637
Like who am I that that's gone.

470
00:23:09,057 --> 00:23:13,047
And then now you're trying to like figure
out how do I continue to scale, scale,

471
00:23:13,052 --> 00:23:18,087
scale, and without having to put like
a ton of people, systems, all of that.

472
00:23:18,432 --> 00:23:18,912
Yeah.

473
00:23:19,152 --> 00:23:19,392
Yeah.

474
00:23:19,392 --> 00:23:20,022
No, that's great.

475
00:23:20,112 --> 00:23:20,562
That's great.

476
00:23:20,622 --> 00:23:29,052
And so is, is what you do, um, something
that connects, say with Shopify,

477
00:23:29,112 --> 00:23:31,062
is it its own standalone store?

478
00:23:31,092 --> 00:23:35,232
I mean, um, who, who's your, who's
your target market, I suppose,

479
00:23:35,237 --> 00:23:36,662
in, in with, uh, with Mason?

480
00:23:37,572 --> 00:23:37,862
Yeah.

481
00:23:38,202 --> 00:23:41,782
We, we are, um, uh, we have.

482
00:23:42,117 --> 00:23:46,317
Out of the box, uh, apps and
plugins for different ecosystems.

483
00:23:46,317 --> 00:23:49,107
So on Shopify we have an app
called Mode Magic, for example.

484
00:23:49,112 --> 00:23:49,137
Mm-hmm.

485
00:23:49,707 --> 00:23:53,637
Um, so you can, you don't need to
like integrate it to your store.

486
00:23:53,637 --> 00:23:56,457
You can literally just install
it from the app store and then

487
00:23:56,462 --> 00:23:57,817
you get like all these different.

488
00:23:58,412 --> 00:24:02,232
You know, capabilities I was talking
about all these different apps, all

489
00:24:02,232 --> 00:24:04,242
of that, like connected through that.

490
00:24:04,242 --> 00:24:04,632
Right.

491
00:24:04,872 --> 00:24:10,242
Um, so we definitely have like default, I
would say single click integrations, uh,

492
00:24:10,272 --> 00:24:13,312
in a, in a nerdy way, um, uh, available.

493
00:24:13,932 --> 00:24:18,012
Um, but then as, as you sort of
start becoming bigger, you might

494
00:24:18,012 --> 00:24:20,562
use more customized platforms.

495
00:24:20,742 --> 00:24:20,802
Yeah.

496
00:24:20,802 --> 00:24:25,992
That we've seen for some of our, uh, we
primarily sell to SMB and mid-market.

497
00:24:26,217 --> 00:24:26,757
You know, brands?

498
00:24:26,817 --> 00:24:27,237
Mm-hmm.

499
00:24:27,317 --> 00:24:30,807
Uh, we do happen to have some brands
who are of course, in the larger part

500
00:24:30,812 --> 00:24:34,737
of mid-market, kinda like getting
into the enterprise space, so they

501
00:24:34,737 --> 00:24:37,017
start doing a lot of customizations.

502
00:24:37,017 --> 00:24:41,217
That's where we have open APIs
where they can, uh, you know, do

503
00:24:41,222 --> 00:24:44,957
integrations and stuff, but that's not
like a large part of Google Service.

504
00:24:45,447 --> 00:24:45,957
So, mm-hmm.

505
00:24:46,057 --> 00:24:53,232
Our goal is to, help everybody, as
much as possible, as large a part

506
00:24:53,232 --> 00:24:58,742
of retail as possible, get powerful,
strategies and technology and systems.

507
00:24:59,342 --> 00:25:01,152
but in a very simple and easy way.

508
00:25:01,152 --> 00:25:04,932
So, uh, having default integrations,
having like apps that are like one click.

509
00:25:05,582 --> 00:25:08,432
Easy for you to just put on
top of Shopify, for example.

510
00:25:08,492 --> 00:25:09,422
It's, it's very important.

511
00:25:09,422 --> 00:25:11,672
So we have, we have, we're
outta the box on Shopify.

512
00:25:11,672 --> 00:25:14,462
If you're on Shopify, you just
have to go to the app store

513
00:25:14,462 --> 00:25:16,082
find us install and you're done.

514
00:25:16,202 --> 00:25:16,292
Mm-hmm.

515
00:25:16,652 --> 00:25:17,872
Um, same for, uh, BigCommerce.

516
00:25:17,952 --> 00:25:17,982
Uh.

517
00:25:17,982 --> 00:25:19,952
WooCommerce etc.

518
00:25:21,132 --> 00:25:25,692
Yeah, but I, I, I'm, it's good to hear
that actually it's not, not just Shopify,

519
00:25:25,722 --> 00:25:27,702
because I, I love Shopify as a platform.

520
00:25:27,702 --> 00:25:28,152
I do.

521
00:25:28,152 --> 00:25:29,092
And it mm-hmm.

522
00:25:29,392 --> 00:25:32,172
We, we always, we, we've had
people on the show who talk about,

523
00:25:32,177 --> 00:25:33,372
oh, we can do this with Shopify.

524
00:25:33,372 --> 00:25:34,782
We've got this app, this integration.

525
00:25:35,442 --> 00:25:39,172
Um, and I, I do, I am a big fan
of Shopify, but I'm not on it.

526
00:25:39,792 --> 00:25:44,292
Myself, uh, you know, I have my own
custom site and so it's nice to hear that

527
00:25:44,292 --> 00:25:49,272
there's an API function where I can just
suck all the a, uh, AI magic out of you

528
00:25:49,272 --> 00:25:51,012
guys and, and help my business with that.

529
00:25:51,582 --> 00:25:51,912
I love that.

530
00:25:52,092 --> 00:25:52,632
That's great.

531
00:25:52,992 --> 00:25:56,562
So what kind of, I mean, I just talking
about e-commerce businesses then, uh,

532
00:25:56,562 --> 00:26:02,592
Kaus what sort of, um, what sort of
success stories are there of companies

533
00:26:02,592 --> 00:26:07,602
that have seen maybe great results with,
with your tech, with Mason's technology?

534
00:26:08,412 --> 00:26:13,242
Yeah, we have like recently started
actually being a little proactive about

535
00:26:13,242 --> 00:26:16,752
getting all this success stories and
you know, we're product founders and

536
00:26:16,752 --> 00:26:22,332
I think like that's one, I think off
topic line that I'm, I'm tugging at.

537
00:26:22,332 --> 00:26:26,172
But I, I think I keep, like every time
I meet a founder who's like a product

538
00:26:26,177 --> 00:26:28,702
founder and I am like, you know what?

539
00:26:29,382 --> 00:26:33,522
Just get out there and think about
marketing or talking about what you do.

540
00:26:33,522 --> 00:26:35,082
Like these are important things.

541
00:26:35,082 --> 00:26:39,872
Like you can't be like hacking away in
your, you know, in your garage forever.

542
00:26:40,332 --> 00:26:43,752
But, but you gotta, you gotta
have case like understand stories

543
00:26:43,752 --> 00:26:48,232
I think fundamentally have have
about how do you pull out those.

544
00:26:49,062 --> 00:26:52,452
Case studies, but think of them as
customer stories end of the day.

545
00:26:52,452 --> 00:26:55,542
So yeah, we do, we are getting
a little diligent about it.

546
00:26:55,872 --> 00:26:59,442
And we do have a few customer stories,
but interesting things that we're seeing

547
00:26:59,442 --> 00:27:04,872
is that, um, uh, you know, uh, one of the
interesting teams, and I love that, uh,

548
00:27:05,022 --> 00:27:09,412
cause that was one of the first customer
stories that we did, is sports, uh, uh,

549
00:27:09,582 --> 00:27:14,332
and, uh, fitness, uh, express and, uh,
you know, single founder adding this.

550
00:27:14,802 --> 00:27:19,872
Uh, kind of like a sports and fitness,
uh, you know, store selling to, uh, us.

551
00:27:19,932 --> 00:27:24,912
Uh, you know, he's based out of us and
selling to us customers, and, uh, he was.

552
00:27:27,492 --> 00:27:30,492
How do I have so many
different things to do?

553
00:27:30,642 --> 00:27:35,622
And now I have like, he's on Shopify and
Shopify app store, if you notice is crazy.

554
00:27:35,627 --> 00:27:37,882
It's like what, eight thousand,
nine thousand different apps?

555
00:27:37,882 --> 00:27:39,442
No, the the choice is overwhelming.

556
00:27:39,632 --> 00:27:39,922
Yeah.

557
00:27:39,922 --> 00:27:40,162
Yeah.

558
00:27:40,182 --> 00:27:40,402
No.

559
00:27:41,982 --> 00:27:45,732
And other app, like, you know,
I get you more conversions.

560
00:27:46,562 --> 00:27:49,692
And so he was thinking, he
was like, I need like this.

561
00:27:50,412 --> 00:27:53,952
Just like one thing where I
don't have to worry about like

562
00:27:53,982 --> 00:27:56,532
homepage or PDP or channel.

563
00:27:56,952 --> 00:27:59,442
I need like something for
my browse to buy journey.

564
00:27:59,442 --> 00:28:01,612
Like it's as simple as shoppers are coming

565
00:28:02,052 --> 00:28:05,502
to my homepage, to my store,
wherever, home pd, it doesn't matter.

566
00:28:05,772 --> 00:28:06,942
And then they're dropping off.

567
00:28:07,032 --> 00:28:08,592
So I don't want him to drop off.

568
00:28:08,592 --> 00:28:11,982
I want them to stay on
my store and get to buy.

569
00:28:12,392 --> 00:28:16,422
Can I get a solution that sort
of like connects dots, right?

570
00:28:16,662 --> 00:28:21,632
Um, so I think over the first, just
three to four weeks, he got, uh,

571
00:28:21,637 --> 00:28:25,062
uh, $17,000 additional in sales.

572
00:28:25,062 --> 00:28:26,172
It's a small store.

573
00:28:26,472 --> 00:28:29,312
Uh, but they were so excited and
we were like, I would be too.

574
00:28:30,357 --> 00:28:32,937
Yeah, and we were like,
we gotta do more stories.

575
00:28:32,942 --> 00:28:37,107
Like, like why weren't we, we're all
looking at data all the time, you

576
00:28:37,107 --> 00:28:43,527
know, you're like, yeah, we're adding
25% uplift and 25% more ATS and blah.

577
00:28:43,707 --> 00:28:45,867
And you're like, man, like no stories.

578
00:28:46,227 --> 00:28:46,427
Yeah.

579
00:28:46,587 --> 00:28:47,967
Like that's stories where it's at.

580
00:28:47,967 --> 00:28:47,968
Right.

581
00:28:47,973 --> 00:28:49,737
People like a good story, don't they?

582
00:28:49,857 --> 00:28:51,807
Uh, stories with good endings as well.

583
00:28:52,287 --> 00:28:52,587
Yeah.

584
00:28:52,737 --> 00:28:57,252
And why does that, 17 came when you think
about it, he, that was something that

585
00:28:57,252 --> 00:28:59,052
was just lying on the table for him.

586
00:28:59,412 --> 00:28:59,532
Mm-hmm.

587
00:28:59,562 --> 00:29:04,152
And it's, it's a lot for a small
brand for a single founder.

588
00:29:04,152 --> 00:29:08,322
It's, it's, you know, it's, it's,
um, it's the power to be independent.

589
00:29:09,342 --> 00:29:14,232
No, it's also, I mean, I'm curious what
did, so he installs the app on his, um,

590
00:29:14,262 --> 00:29:15,882
fitness store, which is a Shopify site.

591
00:29:16,002 --> 00:29:16,152
Yes.

592
00:29:16,332 --> 00:29:23,052
Um, what sort of things did he use from
your technology that really helped him?

593
00:29:23,967 --> 00:29:24,297
Yeah.

594
00:29:24,327 --> 00:29:24,657
Yeah.

595
00:29:24,867 --> 00:29:27,777
A couple of examples are,
you know, very simple.

596
00:29:27,777 --> 00:29:31,977
You always think about like, everybody
does this cart recovery stuff, right?

597
00:29:32,187 --> 00:29:32,277
Yeah.

598
00:29:32,337 --> 00:29:38,547
Uh, but you tend to forget that,
you know, keep your store on, on

599
00:29:38,547 --> 00:29:39,957
their desktop or on their phone.

600
00:29:40,617 --> 00:29:42,687
On their browsers and they keep come.

601
00:29:42,747 --> 00:29:44,457
They're like they chance upon it.

602
00:29:44,457 --> 00:29:47,637
They come back to that
tab at some point in time.

603
00:29:47,967 --> 00:29:51,927
So, you know, a simple, very
simple embed that's not like,

604
00:29:52,247 --> 00:29:56,867
not a popup, not interruptive,
but an embed that just shows up.

605
00:29:57,742 --> 00:30:02,302
And then gives you, if you are a person
who likes discounts because you have

606
00:30:02,302 --> 00:30:03,592
done some stuff on the store mm-hmm.

607
00:30:04,067 --> 00:30:08,772
And you're kind like, you know, there
is the AI has figured out that Kaus

608
00:30:08,852 --> 00:30:15,422
you know loves bargains, you discount,
of course, keeping margins in mind.

609
00:30:16,082 --> 00:30:22,202
Um, We just saw such a big change in how
shoppers were reacting to that, right?

610
00:30:22,452 --> 00:30:22,692
Yeah.

611
00:30:22,697 --> 00:30:26,682
People sometimes just need a reminder,
but they don't like if the reminders

612
00:30:26,687 --> 00:30:28,482
dropping in on email, it's too intrusive.

613
00:30:28,482 --> 00:30:32,382
Like, Hey, I, I left store
tab open for a reason.

614
00:30:32,382 --> 00:30:34,693
I'm not like, don't, you don't
have to remind, I get super.

615
00:30:35,352 --> 00:30:41,112
I personally get a little annoyed when
I get, like, we're missing you and

616
00:30:41,112 --> 00:30:44,952
here things left in the, I'm like, I
left in the cart for a reason, right?

617
00:30:45,342 --> 00:30:47,052
I'm, I'm gonna go back if I want it.

618
00:30:47,382 --> 00:30:52,342
And, uh, and then, you know, um, if I'm
a discount hunter or, or a bargain hunter

619
00:30:52,662 --> 00:30:55,022
or just everybody loves a deal, right?

620
00:30:55,682 --> 00:31:01,212
So if I see that something that was
at, uh, you know, $50 is at $45, why?

621
00:31:01,272 --> 00:31:02,982
Like, and it's for five minutes.

622
00:31:03,012 --> 00:31:03,492
Why not?

623
00:31:04,542 --> 00:31:06,192
That's, that, that's the tipping point.

624
00:31:06,192 --> 00:31:06,252
Yeah.

625
00:31:06,432 --> 00:31:12,012
So that was one very simple example
of, you know, how, um, a very common

626
00:31:12,012 --> 00:31:14,292
strategy, like cart recovery reminders.

627
00:31:14,292 --> 00:31:14,382
Mm-hmm.

628
00:31:14,622 --> 00:31:18,582
But then you just add this intelligence
to it, make it way more palatable for

629
00:31:18,582 --> 00:31:21,432
the consumer intent that you have, right?

630
00:31:21,432 --> 00:31:26,292
It's not a blanket popup or an
email that's thrown at everybody.

631
00:31:26,292 --> 00:31:26,352
Yeah.

632
00:31:26,352 --> 00:31:29,257
By just personalizing, you
know, Hey Matt, or hey Kaus, no.

633
00:31:29,257 --> 00:31:29,407
Right.

634
00:31:30,222 --> 00:31:34,632
It's, it's something that's kind of like
looking at your behavior and looking at

635
00:31:34,632 --> 00:31:39,522
you as a person and how you're thinking
and how you probably have interacted,

636
00:31:39,527 --> 00:31:42,972
and then depending on that, showing
you different versions of that match.

637
00:31:43,452 --> 00:31:47,052
And we, we saw, that's actually
one of our, you know, very,

638
00:31:47,052 --> 00:31:48,462
very high performing strategies.

639
00:31:48,837 --> 00:31:49,077
Yeah.

640
00:31:49,077 --> 00:31:49,347
Yeah.

641
00:31:49,677 --> 00:31:50,367
That's really interesting.

642
00:31:50,607 --> 00:31:54,837
So I, I guess one question which then
comes into my head Kaus as you're, as

643
00:31:54,837 --> 00:32:01,827
you're talking is, um, if, if you are
using this technology to make these

644
00:32:01,827 --> 00:32:06,207
intelligent sort of decisions, you
know, the sort of intelligent thinking.

645
00:32:06,207 --> 00:32:06,267
Yeah.

646
00:32:06,297 --> 00:32:10,107
So we're gonna give this, this particular
Kaus is on the site again, we know we

647
00:32:10,107 --> 00:32:14,127
need to give her this discount to get
her motivated to go to the next stage.

648
00:32:14,397 --> 00:32:17,127
We're not gonna send her a
shed load of emails, um, but

649
00:32:17,127 --> 00:32:18,207
we're gonna do X, Y, and Z.

650
00:32:18,327 --> 00:32:21,747
We're gonna give her the $5 off
the $50 purchase or whatever it is.

651
00:32:21,747 --> 00:32:21,807
Yeah.

652
00:32:21,867 --> 00:32:24,777
But we're gonna put a time
restraint on there of five minutes.

653
00:32:24,867 --> 00:32:26,067
So you got five minutes.

654
00:32:26,187 --> 00:32:26,427
Okay.

655
00:32:26,427 --> 00:32:26,917
I'm gonna buy.

656
00:32:28,557 --> 00:32:32,337
The power behind that, which is
obviously what you guys do at Mason.

657
00:32:33,507 --> 00:32:36,807
Does that, cuz this has come up,
uh, in a conversation with several

658
00:32:36,807 --> 00:32:40,227
people recently, and I'm, I'm curious
to, to, to see how you respond.

659
00:32:40,767 --> 00:32:43,467
Does that affect my site speed?

660
00:32:43,827 --> 00:32:45,537
Does that slow things down?

661
00:32:45,537 --> 00:32:49,467
Because Yeah, a computer somewhere is
having to think of a trillion different

662
00:32:49,467 --> 00:32:51,357
things at once to, to create an output.

663
00:32:52,167 --> 00:32:56,427
Um, or, or, or have you sort of managed
to get it to do all of this sort of

664
00:32:56,427 --> 00:32:58,647
stuff, uh, in a, in a nanosecond.

665
00:32:59,457 --> 00:32:59,787
Yeah.

666
00:32:59,967 --> 00:33:03,387
And a lot of this is actually
something that needs to be

667
00:33:03,387 --> 00:33:05,367
constantly thinking, right?

668
00:33:05,367 --> 00:33:05,427
Yeah.

669
00:33:05,787 --> 00:33:10,137
Um, so, so when Matt dropped off,
right, why did he drop off, right?

670
00:33:10,137 --> 00:33:14,397
Like, what do you think can,
would be a best way to kind of

671
00:33:14,397 --> 00:33:15,907
engage him when he comes back?

672
00:33:15,937 --> 00:33:20,697
Like, what would be the best kind of
things I can do right when he comes back?

673
00:33:20,877 --> 00:33:22,677
I think these sort of decisions have to.

674
00:33:23,457 --> 00:33:25,827
Are running, uh, constantly.

675
00:33:25,917 --> 00:33:26,157
Right?

676
00:33:26,367 --> 00:33:32,157
And uh, that's because you can't, like,
you can't wait for me to go there, do this

677
00:33:32,667 --> 00:33:37,857
computation, then probably come back and.

678
00:33:38,412 --> 00:33:42,762
Generate that experience too, because
that, that, that, let's say that widget

679
00:33:42,762 --> 00:33:46,902
or that, you know, embed or that little
carousel that comes up is actually

680
00:33:46,907 --> 00:33:48,312
generated on the fly too, right?

681
00:33:48,342 --> 00:33:48,432
Mm-hmm.

682
00:33:49,002 --> 00:33:52,902
Uh, so if you're waiting for all of
that, of course it would, uh, the, your

683
00:33:52,907 --> 00:33:54,872
side, your store wouldn't slow down.

684
00:33:54,872 --> 00:34:00,062
Your site wouldn't slow down, but that
nudge will not be there at on time.

685
00:34:00,832 --> 00:34:05,612
And, and you've got like, three, to five
seconds to grab someone's attention today.

686
00:34:05,942 --> 00:34:06,822
It's crazy.

687
00:34:06,852 --> 00:34:13,052
we are all goldfish, so, so yes, we
do a lot of these, these computations

688
00:34:13,152 --> 00:34:16,832
we kind of constantly make, uh,
the system is constantly looking

689
00:34:16,832 --> 00:34:20,732
at things that are happening and,
and of thinking through what can be

690
00:34:20,737 --> 00:34:22,352
done next and kind of keeping that.

691
00:34:22,947 --> 00:34:26,757
In a way in memory and ready if,
but of course, like things like

692
00:34:26,757 --> 00:34:28,107
generating that little thing.

693
00:34:28,257 --> 00:34:30,717
Nowadays they don't, it does,
it just doesn't take time.

694
00:34:30,722 --> 00:34:33,717
You've seen, you know, the
ChatGPT and how it works, right?

695
00:34:33,737 --> 00:34:34,357
So, oh yeah.

696
00:34:36,297 --> 00:34:36,567
Yeah.

697
00:34:36,567 --> 00:34:40,617
How, and by the way, like it's just
showing to us that it's typing,

698
00:34:40,617 --> 00:34:43,647
but actually that entire frikkin'
answer has been ready since you

699
00:34:46,827 --> 00:34:48,087
put it on the screen already.

700
00:34:48,357 --> 00:34:48,477
Yeah.

701
00:34:49,017 --> 00:34:52,827
It's giving you a feeling that it's a
person and it's thinking it's typing.

702
00:34:53,247 --> 00:34:54,388
No, it's, it's all there.

703
00:34:54,393 --> 00:34:54,587
Right?

704
00:34:55,017 --> 00:34:58,707
So, um, it, it, it was there
the moment you asked a question.

705
00:34:58,707 --> 00:35:05,292
So many of these systems are super, super,
Uh, you know, fast to generate something.

706
00:35:05,802 --> 00:35:10,092
But of course, like computing, what
to generate is something that you

707
00:35:10,092 --> 00:35:14,562
have to do as things are happening
and you have to on constantly kind

708
00:35:14,562 --> 00:35:17,772
of like refine your understanding
of that person on the other side.

709
00:35:17,982 --> 00:35:19,092
And that's what the system does.

710
00:35:19,392 --> 00:35:19,512
Yeah.

711
00:35:19,652 --> 00:35:21,192
And that's your system, isn't it?

712
00:35:21,192 --> 00:35:23,232
That all that computing
power is on your end.

713
00:35:23,232 --> 00:35:24,072
It's not on my end.

714
00:35:24,252 --> 00:35:24,462
Yeah.

715
00:35:24,852 --> 00:35:25,692
No, it's not.

716
00:35:25,692 --> 00:35:26,982
It's, it's on the cloud.

717
00:35:26,982 --> 00:35:28,692
It's in our, you know, in our systems.

718
00:35:28,692 --> 00:35:28,872
Yeah.

719
00:35:28,877 --> 00:35:31,902
That's, that's not, that's not
at all operating on plant or

720
00:35:31,902 --> 00:35:32,982
anywhere else in our store.

721
00:35:33,642 --> 00:35:34,002
Yeah.

722
00:35:34,002 --> 00:35:34,362
Okay.

723
00:35:34,962 --> 00:35:38,922
Uh, let me go back, uh, Kaus to something
you said earlier, you use this phrase,

724
00:35:38,927 --> 00:35:43,573
the no code, um, you, you didn't
code, uh, you know, the no code thing.

725
00:35:43,578 --> 00:35:48,882
So what's your take on the sort of the no
code movement and how it's changing the,

726
00:35:49,032 --> 00:35:54,132
well probably explain what no code is,
um, and then, and then explain how you

727
00:35:54,132 --> 00:35:58,092
think it's changing e-commerce and, um,
you know, for brands and marketplaces.

728
00:35:59,567 --> 00:36:04,077
I like to say, and I posted about that
and I didn't get, like I, I post on

729
00:36:04,077 --> 00:36:05,907
Twitter like once in a million years.

730
00:36:05,907 --> 00:36:09,027
I used to post on Twitter once
in a million years, and then I

731
00:36:09,027 --> 00:36:14,272
expect that tweet to go viral
and it obviously doesn't.

732
00:36:14,272 --> 00:36:16,377
I'm laughing because I'm exactly the same.

733
00:36:16,437 --> 00:36:18,117
I genuinely am exactly the same.

734
00:36:18,117 --> 00:36:18,777
I can't remember that.

735
00:36:18,777 --> 00:36:18,927
Yeah.

736
00:36:18,927 --> 00:36:19,707
Anyway, sorry.

737
00:36:20,607 --> 00:36:24,197
But, but isn't it like, I'm
like, why it was so smart.

738
00:36:24,197 --> 00:36:26,297
Why isn't anybody engaging with it?

739
00:36:26,357 --> 00:36:32,807
But yeah, like once in a million
years, 2009-2019, like, that's

740
00:36:32,807 --> 00:36:33,917
literally the two tweets.

741
00:36:34,367 --> 00:36:40,697
But, uh, I, I love this example
that just hit me one day.

742
00:36:40,697 --> 00:36:46,607
Was that, you know, um, the Quill
was the OG of the no code, right?

743
00:36:46,607 --> 00:36:49,067
Like before that you were
like taking that hammer thing.

744
00:36:50,397 --> 00:36:54,567
You are in the clay tablets and
you're like ramming away and you're

745
00:36:54,567 --> 00:36:57,777
writing things, and then the quill
came and it changed everything

746
00:36:57,777 --> 00:36:59,217
because now anybody can write, right?

747
00:36:59,277 --> 00:36:59,397
Mm-hmm.

748
00:36:59,642 --> 00:37:04,977
So that's, that's so no code is no
codification essentially is actually

749
00:37:05,367 --> 00:37:08,967
making something so simple that anybody,
making a technology simple enough

750
00:37:09,207 --> 00:37:10,767
for everybody to have access to it.

751
00:37:10,767 --> 00:37:11,877
We just call it no-code.

752
00:37:11,877 --> 00:37:13,857
Happen to call it No-code today, right?

753
00:37:13,862 --> 00:37:13,887
Yeah.

754
00:37:14,277 --> 00:37:17,987
And it's the same with, uh, when you
think about it with spreadsheets, right?

755
00:37:18,227 --> 00:37:22,697
Like databases, just like all complex
things and spreadsheets are so simple,

756
00:37:22,697 --> 00:37:26,747
like who's gonna go and when you
think about like having a database

757
00:37:26,752 --> 00:37:30,797
and having SQL queries and running
and trying to compute, but then a

758
00:37:30,797 --> 00:37:35,877
spreadsheet does a lot of smart and
intelligent and very difficult computing.

759
00:37:36,822 --> 00:37:40,122
Uh, just a tiny function that you
can, you know, you can just see equal

760
00:37:40,122 --> 00:37:44,322
sum and then, wow, I can, I can like
do summation across like hundred

761
00:37:44,322 --> 00:37:46,332
different, you know, rows and columns.

762
00:37:46,332 --> 00:37:49,252
So, so that's what
no-codification is all about.

763
00:37:49,432 --> 00:37:53,652
It's making technology simple enough
for anybody to have access to it.

764
00:37:54,542 --> 00:37:58,052
If the printing press didn't
happen, like we'll still be like

765
00:37:58,172 --> 00:38:01,262
printing press is giving us the
no-code version of knowledge, right?

766
00:38:01,262 --> 00:38:01,462
Yeah.

767
00:38:01,467 --> 00:38:04,202
So, or gave us the no-code
version of knowledge.

768
00:38:04,207 --> 00:38:07,892
So I think that's, I think
is, is what no-code is, right?

769
00:38:07,892 --> 00:38:08,012
Mm-hmm.

770
00:38:08,252 --> 00:38:10,322
Like we, we tend to call
it a no-code movement.

771
00:38:10,622 --> 00:38:14,402
Doesn't mean that, oh, whether
coding or not coding is important.

772
00:38:14,407 --> 00:38:16,102
I think that's not the question here.

773
00:38:16,632 --> 00:38:21,852
The question is, can we give subject
matter experts the power to create, right?

774
00:38:21,852 --> 00:38:21,853
Mm-hmm.

775
00:38:22,452 --> 00:38:26,142
And in this case, in the online
world, in the digital world, the

776
00:38:26,147 --> 00:38:28,182
tech world, it could be create apps.

777
00:38:29,082 --> 00:38:29,742
So yeah.

778
00:38:30,357 --> 00:38:33,387
Yeah, no, I, that's a good
explanation of no code.

779
00:38:33,567 --> 00:38:34,137
So, yeah.

780
00:38:34,887 --> 00:38:35,697
How is it?

781
00:38:35,877 --> 00:38:36,177
How is it?

782
00:38:36,177 --> 00:38:38,467
But it didn't go viral,
didn't that, that's didn't go.

783
00:38:41,277 --> 00:38:44,427
You can just, just, I'll tell you what,
I'll follow you on Twitter and then,

784
00:38:44,487 --> 00:38:48,687
uh, when I go on in 10 years time, I'll
like it and then maybe it'll go viral.

785
00:38:48,867 --> 00:38:49,527
Uh, I dunno.

786
00:38:50,067 --> 00:38:56,577
Um, so apart from the tweet, obviously,
um, and, you know, the, the, the.

787
00:38:57,117 --> 00:39:00,897
The sort of the take thing you
have on no-code, how does that, how

788
00:39:00,897 --> 00:39:03,777
does that change things for the,
for the e-commerce entrepreneur?

789
00:39:04,857 --> 00:39:05,847
And it does, right?

790
00:39:05,852 --> 00:39:08,217
Because today we were talking about it.

791
00:39:08,832 --> 00:39:11,802
Why do I have to know
what's a web, what's an api?

792
00:39:11,892 --> 00:39:12,772
Like everybody does it.

793
00:39:12,772 --> 00:39:14,082
You have like an api, you're fine.

794
00:39:14,182 --> 00:39:14,332
Right?

795
00:39:14,362 --> 00:39:19,962
Matt, you're one of, one of very few, but
a large part of eCommerce brand mm-hmm.

796
00:39:20,202 --> 00:39:20,862
Creators.

797
00:39:20,862 --> 00:39:21,522
Founders.

798
00:39:21,522 --> 00:39:24,792
Like, it's just a lot of things
that you have to learn, which they

799
00:39:24,797 --> 00:39:28,482
probably, your, your core skills
are not, that you call skill is

800
00:39:28,482 --> 00:39:30,462
probably curation of great products.

801
00:39:30,462 --> 00:39:34,482
Like you look at something and you know
that this will click with this kinda

802
00:39:34,857 --> 00:39:37,257
shoppers for this sort of reasons, right?

803
00:39:37,587 --> 00:39:41,187
And, and, uh, so what
No-code gives us ability.

804
00:39:41,187 --> 00:39:46,257
It, it, it simplifies complex
things and gives you the ability

805
00:39:46,257 --> 00:39:47,817
to do things on your own.

806
00:39:48,237 --> 00:39:52,437
Um, Again, for example, like
this whole price drop thinking

807
00:39:52,437 --> 00:39:53,607
that I was talking about, right?

808
00:39:53,607 --> 00:40:00,357
Like you wanna engage people who are,
uh, or rather you wanna power shoppers

809
00:40:00,357 --> 00:40:04,147
who are engaging with certain products,
but you want to take a decision to

810
00:40:04,147 --> 00:40:10,197
give them certain discount in, in some
places, not in other, and you want to

811
00:40:10,197 --> 00:40:14,427
also define probably the boundary of
like, Hey, that nudge that you give

812
00:40:14,432 --> 00:40:16,557
has to look like my brand colors.

813
00:40:16,557 --> 00:40:19,737
And, you know, you should, I,
I, I want it in this way and

814
00:40:19,737 --> 00:40:21,327
I don't want it as a pop-up.

815
00:40:21,327 --> 00:40:24,957
I want it as an like, you know, this sort
of like a embed or a banner or whatever.

816
00:40:25,267 --> 00:40:26,347
These decisions.

817
00:40:26,377 --> 00:40:29,017
It's like, imagine today how people do it.

818
00:40:29,017 --> 00:40:31,807
They're like, you have to work
with developers or someone who at

819
00:40:31,807 --> 00:40:37,557
least knows something or installing
four, five different apps and know

820
00:40:37,557 --> 00:40:37,917
how all of that work together.

821
00:40:37,917 --> 00:40:40,617
Like even that's, that's like hard, right?

822
00:40:40,617 --> 00:40:41,037
Mm-hmm.

823
00:40:41,122 --> 00:40:44,307
So, so what No-code, any sort
of, no-code systems do, and

824
00:40:44,307 --> 00:40:46,137
there are so many now, right?

825
00:40:46,437 --> 00:40:49,257
Uh, it's just, it's just
makes things self-serve.

826
00:40:49,577 --> 00:40:49,997
Mm-hmm.

827
00:40:50,082 --> 00:40:54,267
Um, and gives you the power to run
your business on your own terms and

828
00:40:54,267 --> 00:40:59,717
go live with your ideas and your
strategies and your decisions fast.

829
00:41:00,297 --> 00:41:05,007
And it's so powerful because the
fundamental construct of that is

830
00:41:05,007 --> 00:41:07,377
that you can now test what works.

831
00:41:07,722 --> 00:41:10,602
For your shoppers instantly, right?

832
00:41:10,602 --> 00:41:10,662
Yeah.

833
00:41:10,842 --> 00:41:13,302
If you wanna go from launching like.

834
00:41:13,782 --> 00:41:17,942
If I'm a yogurt seller and I wanna
move to like oat milk yogurt,

835
00:41:18,372 --> 00:41:21,402
like is that something that
shoppers will even engage with?

836
00:41:21,462 --> 00:41:21,762
Right?

837
00:41:21,972 --> 00:41:26,082
Like before I even invest in
creating oat milk yogurt, maybe I

838
00:41:26,082 --> 00:41:27,462
wanna like test that out, right?

839
00:41:27,467 --> 00:41:27,822
Yeah, yeah.

840
00:41:27,827 --> 00:41:30,732
If you had, if you had to wait
like a million years to just run a

841
00:41:30,737 --> 00:41:34,242
survey or just ask few people, like,
you would never be able to do it.

842
00:41:34,242 --> 00:41:38,322
So it empowers people to, to run
their business much, you know, uh,

843
00:41:38,382 --> 00:41:39,792
much faster, I guess, on their own.

844
00:41:40,002 --> 00:41:40,272
Yeah.

845
00:41:41,217 --> 00:41:41,997
No, I like that.

846
00:41:41,997 --> 00:41:45,837
Uh, uh, it sounds, as you were talking,
I'm thinking, you know, this is probably

847
00:41:45,837 --> 00:41:50,427
why chat gpt has captured everybody's
imagination because they've, boy,

848
00:41:50,427 --> 00:41:53,907
they've managed to take something
so complicated and boil it down to.

849
00:41:54,687 --> 00:41:57,657
I just feel like I'm chatting
to, I can talk to you, like I

850
00:41:57,657 --> 00:41:58,797
could talk to a normal human.

851
00:41:58,797 --> 00:42:01,557
And somehow you've made
that, you've made that work.

852
00:42:01,887 --> 00:42:01,947
Yeah.

853
00:42:02,037 --> 00:42:05,997
I know there's this big thing around
prompt engineering, um, which in effect is

854
00:42:05,997 --> 00:42:07,917
still the coded version of ai, isn't it?

855
00:42:07,917 --> 00:42:12,357
But it, it seems to be that actually
most people can get reasonably good

856
00:42:12,362 --> 00:42:15,377
stuff out of AI without really knowing.

857
00:42:15,882 --> 00:42:17,472
Crazy prompt engineering.

858
00:42:17,922 --> 00:42:22,032
They just need to know how to talk
to people or talk to the ai, right?

859
00:42:22,272 --> 00:42:24,512
And that, that simplification,
I think is a great idea.

860
00:42:25,632 --> 00:42:26,652
Yeah, I agree.

861
00:42:26,652 --> 00:42:32,082
And and that's why I feel like what chat
gpt, it's not like open AI didn't exist.

862
00:42:32,382 --> 00:42:32,472
Mm-hmm.

863
00:42:32,502 --> 00:42:36,772
But ChatGPT made it No code to an extent.

864
00:42:37,732 --> 00:42:41,592
You'll see and more, we should see more
and more things like that happening.

865
00:42:41,597 --> 00:42:41,632
Right.

866
00:42:41,632 --> 00:42:42,752
Because it just makes.

867
00:42:43,552 --> 00:42:47,092
Takes away the operational
overheads of anything.

868
00:42:47,392 --> 00:42:50,152
Like if I wanted to publish an
e-book, it would be like, oh my

869
00:42:50,152 --> 00:42:52,012
god, research and writing and this.

870
00:42:52,012 --> 00:42:52,372
Mm-hmm.

871
00:42:52,457 --> 00:42:54,112
You can get like the first version.

872
00:42:54,117 --> 00:42:56,732
Of course, it's, it's a GPT version.

873
00:42:56,972 --> 00:42:57,202
Mm-hmm.

874
00:42:57,202 --> 00:43:01,302
That's fine, but it's out there and now
you can spend your time doing things

875
00:43:01,302 --> 00:43:02,712
that are more important, like mm-hmm.

876
00:43:03,132 --> 00:43:06,192
When do you wanna, what
information you wanna put?

877
00:43:06,192 --> 00:43:08,412
How do you wanna engage your reader?

878
00:43:08,412 --> 00:43:16,332
Like what is interviewing experts to put
those quotes and case studies in there.

879
00:43:16,332 --> 00:43:18,168
Why should you waste your
time just researching, right?

880
00:43:18,168 --> 00:43:18,526
Yeah, so no code is super powerful.

881
00:43:18,526 --> 00:43:18,584
Yeah.

882
00:43:18,584 --> 00:43:18,702
Yeah, no.

883
00:43:18,702 --> 00:43:19,302
Incredible.

884
00:43:19,307 --> 00:43:19,702
Incredible.

885
00:43:20,922 --> 00:43:22,152
So where do you think it's all going?

886
00:43:22,152 --> 00:43:23,412
What does the future look like?

887
00:43:23,712 --> 00:43:27,552
Um, with, with all of this stuff,
you've got generative ai, you've

888
00:43:27,552 --> 00:43:32,892
got no code, you've got Mason
doing some funky stuff, you've got

889
00:43:33,112 --> 00:43:35,462
e-commerce just exploding still.

890
00:43:36,252 --> 00:43:38,082
Um, where do you, where
do you see it all going?

891
00:43:39,867 --> 00:43:44,937
I think more open markets, um, you know,
where, uh, you know, if both sides.

892
00:43:44,937 --> 00:43:46,377
And it's important for both sides.

893
00:43:46,377 --> 00:43:46,587
Right.

894
00:43:46,592 --> 00:43:47,907
As shoppers.

895
00:43:47,907 --> 00:43:48,207
Right.

896
00:43:48,207 --> 00:43:49,347
As as consumers.

897
00:43:49,827 --> 00:43:54,957
And, and we kind of touched upon it, I
think like the whole interesting part of,

898
00:43:55,227 --> 00:44:00,037
of commerce is shopping and shopping is
that shopping is so much more than buying.

899
00:44:00,097 --> 00:44:00,517
Mm-hmm.

900
00:44:00,597 --> 00:44:00,917
There's.

901
00:44:01,317 --> 00:44:05,667
You know, in, in today, a lot
of what we used to do, think of

902
00:44:05,667 --> 00:44:10,137
shopping on the online world, uh,
was so away from what, how we used

903
00:44:10,137 --> 00:44:11,847
to shop in the offline world, right?

904
00:44:12,147 --> 00:44:12,657
Every day.

905
00:44:12,657 --> 00:44:14,517
It's not about search-based shopping.

906
00:44:14,517 --> 00:44:19,857
It's not like you search for t-shirt,
v-neck,  X, Y, Z, and then you get

907
00:44:19,857 --> 00:44:21,297
that exact thing and then you have.

908
00:44:21,312 --> 00:44:23,752
You know, you 20 choices and
you'll take it or leave it.

909
00:44:23,772 --> 00:44:24,102
Right.

910
00:44:24,372 --> 00:44:27,372
So there's this very interesting
video by Connie Shannon and

911
00:44:27,372 --> 00:44:29,062
I'm, I'll forward that to you.

912
00:44:29,062 --> 00:44:29,582
You'll love it.

913
00:44:29,832 --> 00:44:33,672
It's where she talks about this like
discovery based thing, entertainment

914
00:44:33,672 --> 00:44:37,212
based shopping, like this whole world
of commerce is moving to something

915
00:44:37,212 --> 00:44:41,897
where, You can find things that
you love that works for you, right?

916
00:44:41,897 --> 00:44:41,987
Mm-hmm.

917
00:44:42,227 --> 00:44:46,187
And so technology in AI will not just
impact the shopping and the buying

918
00:44:46,187 --> 00:44:50,777
experience, but also, you know, the, the
creating of the product experience, right?

919
00:44:50,782 --> 00:44:54,917
Like, can we create over time, like
manufacturing, et cetera, where, you

920
00:44:54,917 --> 00:44:59,087
know, if I like V-necks, but I like
the same color and you like what you

921
00:44:59,087 --> 00:45:03,287
like around neck, can we get the same
t-shirt in our own personalized ways?

922
00:45:03,437 --> 00:45:05,837
But I get it at a discount
cause I'm a discount hog.

923
00:45:06,117 --> 00:45:08,882
You are not, so you
get it how you like it.

924
00:45:08,882 --> 00:45:09,242
Right?

925
00:45:09,452 --> 00:45:13,052
So I think, I think stuff like that
is where you, you are gonna move

926
00:45:13,052 --> 00:45:17,442
to, because technology and AI and a
lot of things that we do in Mason is

927
00:45:17,442 --> 00:45:19,652
gonna impact the way shoppers are.

928
00:45:20,007 --> 00:45:21,377
You know, discovering, yeah.

929
00:45:21,397 --> 00:45:25,347
Loving and finding the right products,
and I'm sure there's gonna be like

930
00:45:25,347 --> 00:45:28,467
this very interesting movement in
your manufacturing and all of that

931
00:45:28,677 --> 00:45:33,177
that's gonna get that personalized,
incredible product to the shopper back.

932
00:45:33,267 --> 00:45:33,657
Yeah.

933
00:45:33,747 --> 00:45:34,017
Right.

934
00:45:34,022 --> 00:45:38,447
So, so that's what I, I think is, is gonna
be the future of shoppers, super exciting.

935
00:45:38,927 --> 00:45:39,837
Yeah, it is.

936
00:45:40,347 --> 00:45:41,367
And I, I agree.

937
00:45:41,367 --> 00:45:43,017
I think this, this sort of.

938
00:45:43,497 --> 00:45:47,007
The ability to personalize, which
is more than just putting somebody's

939
00:45:47,007 --> 00:45:48,147
name on something, isn't it?

940
00:45:48,177 --> 00:45:48,718
You know, it's, yeah.

941
00:45:48,787 --> 00:45:49,077
Yeah.

942
00:45:49,347 --> 00:45:53,277
Um, the ability to personalize is
becoming more and more interesting to me.

943
00:45:53,277 --> 00:45:59,037
And, and, uh, whether it's print on
demand, 3D printing, I mean, you can

944
00:45:59,037 --> 00:46:04,617
even, you can get most things, like,
I can get bespoke meals made for me

945
00:46:04,617 --> 00:46:05,997
now and all kinds of stuff, can't you?

946
00:46:05,997 --> 00:46:10,137
And it's, it's, um, it's
interesting to see where.

947
00:46:10,947 --> 00:46:13,917
Where that's all going to that
actually the, the ones that are

948
00:46:13,917 --> 00:46:16,317
winning, well, it's winning long term.

949
00:46:16,317 --> 00:46:19,527
The ones where you can certainly make
better profits seems to be in this,

950
00:46:19,767 --> 00:46:21,117
this high level of personalization.

951
00:46:21,277 --> 00:46:21,557
Right.

952
00:46:22,672 --> 00:46:22,917
Yeah.

953
00:46:22,917 --> 00:46:25,437
And, and that all boils down
to whether you understand the

954
00:46:25,437 --> 00:46:27,237
person on the other side or not.

955
00:46:27,237 --> 00:46:27,537
Right.

956
00:46:27,537 --> 00:46:34,047
And so having, the power and the
capability to understand and constantly

957
00:46:34,047 --> 00:46:39,177
refine your understanding of that person
and the shopper on the other side becomes

958
00:46:39,177 --> 00:46:40,917
super powerful and very, very important.

959
00:46:41,057 --> 00:46:44,787
Without that, you, can't personalize
because you're, superficial.

960
00:46:45,567 --> 00:46:46,977
Yeah, that's so true.

961
00:46:47,157 --> 00:46:47,997
Very fascinating.

962
00:46:48,147 --> 00:46:48,837
Very fascinating.

963
00:46:49,347 --> 00:46:55,152
So, um, Kaus, what sort of things are you
guys working on at Mason at the moment?

964
00:46:55,152 --> 00:46:59,112
What sort of, what, what, what have
you got in your dev dev pipeline?

965
00:46:59,112 --> 00:47:01,542
What's some, what are some of
the exciting updates that maybe

966
00:47:01,547 --> 00:47:02,742
you can share that are coming up?

967
00:47:02,832 --> 00:47:03,822
I'm, I'm really curious.

968
00:47:05,592 --> 00:47:10,152
I think the first, like it goes back to
what we, I just mentioned about how can

969
00:47:10,152 --> 00:47:14,442
we help, how can you understand your
shoppers better and constantly refine

970
00:47:14,442 --> 00:47:18,662
that understanding and  a lot of it is
not like first party third party data.

971
00:47:19,347 --> 00:47:22,837
We do, we do operate in that world,
but can we move to zero party day data?

972
00:47:22,857 --> 00:47:25,977
Like, can we help you understand
the consumer because the

973
00:47:25,977 --> 00:47:28,437
consumer or the shopper's telling
you what they want, right?

974
00:47:28,497 --> 00:47:28,587
Mm-hmm.

975
00:47:29,157 --> 00:47:33,447
Uh, so in the world of bpc, in the world
of beauty and personal care, it's about,

976
00:47:33,627 --> 00:47:39,597
you know, I, it's very personal, so I
do care that my skin is dry and I want.

977
00:47:40,112 --> 00:47:43,802
You know, uh, water-based or a
serum based moisturizer don't

978
00:47:43,802 --> 00:47:45,182
give me an oil-based one, right?

979
00:47:45,272 --> 00:47:45,362
Mm-hmm.

980
00:47:45,602 --> 00:47:48,722
I'm willing to give you that
information as a brand or a seller.

981
00:47:48,932 --> 00:47:52,612
If I know that you'll, it'll help
you find right product from me.

982
00:47:53,722 --> 00:47:59,477
So giving more generative AI power to
help you understand that consumer at

983
00:47:59,497 --> 00:48:03,577
that zero party level, that's like a
big leap that's coming up, uh, soon.

984
00:48:03,847 --> 00:48:08,977
I'm very, very happy to give you a sneak
peek before it goes out to the world.

985
00:48:09,237 --> 00:48:10,417
You're on the list now.

986
00:48:10,417 --> 00:48:11,047
You're on the list.

987
00:48:11,052 --> 00:48:11,177
Yeah.

988
00:48:11,177 --> 00:48:11,337
Yeah.

989
00:48:11,727 --> 00:48:12,297
Make sure you do.

990
00:48:12,607 --> 00:48:14,047
Yeah, yeah, for sure.

991
00:48:14,497 --> 00:48:15,277
No, that'd be awesome.

992
00:48:15,487 --> 00:48:22,057
And I, I guess, um, my, the question
I've been saving up, um, Kaus for

993
00:48:22,447 --> 00:48:26,797
since the start of this conversation,
where did the name Mason come from?

994
00:48:28,262 --> 00:48:32,502
I, a lot of people do ask me cause
they're like, Mason sounds like

995
00:48:32,502 --> 00:48:36,012
something that's like a builder and
this, that actually it's a little

996
00:48:36,012 --> 00:48:37,662
bit more philosophical than that.

997
00:48:37,662 --> 00:48:41,472
And we think of, like, me and my
co-founder were like, we were like

998
00:48:41,592 --> 00:48:45,022
kind in the fag end of Kubric and
just like thinking about starting

999
00:48:45,022 --> 00:48:50,652
this and, and we were thinking like
we kind of had this like, you know,

1000
00:48:51,237 --> 00:48:53,607
A little hazier version of this view.

1001
00:48:53,667 --> 00:48:54,117
Uh mm-hmm.

1002
00:48:54,357 --> 00:48:57,627
And a lot more clearer now, I'm sure
I'll be way clearer one year down

1003
00:48:57,627 --> 00:49:00,897
the line, or two years down the line,
but we knew somewhere that shopping's

1004
00:49:00,897 --> 00:49:04,677
changing fundamentally, uh, online
shopping has to become more and

1005
00:49:04,677 --> 00:49:07,527
more like how shopping used to be.

1006
00:49:07,527 --> 00:49:07,617
Mm-hmm.

1007
00:49:08,277 --> 00:49:13,437
Uh, very personal, very, you know,
about me and who was selling me.

1008
00:49:13,557 --> 00:49:14,007
Right.

1009
00:49:14,427 --> 00:49:19,597
And, um, and we knew it needed
something very fundamentally different

1010
00:49:19,597 --> 00:49:23,562
in the kind of technology that
will power you to reach that world.

1011
00:49:23,622 --> 00:49:23,892
Right.

1012
00:49:23,892 --> 00:49:25,482
It's, it's a big shift.

1013
00:49:25,812 --> 00:49:32,082
And for us, masons are the people
who actually build new worlds.

1014
00:49:32,622 --> 00:49:34,692
And build new thing things, right?

1015
00:49:34,872 --> 00:49:38,232
So we, we were talking about like,
hey, you know, when Mars, the colony

1016
00:49:38,232 --> 00:49:41,352
in Mars starts and Elon Musk gets
there, you know, the first people

1017
00:49:41,352 --> 00:49:50,492
who are gonna be there are like the
masons, they are gonna build, masons

1018
00:49:50,612 --> 00:49:52,122
are gonna build the first Mars colony.

1019
00:49:52,422 --> 00:49:56,922
And then, you know, we were like, why
not call our, call ourselves Mason?

1020
00:49:56,922 --> 00:50:00,102
Because it just feels like we
are kind of building that first.

1021
00:50:00,462 --> 00:50:04,812
You know, that, that first building blocks
and infrastructure of this new world.

1022
00:50:04,812 --> 00:50:06,312
So yeah, very philosophical.

1023
00:50:06,462 --> 00:50:06,752
Yeah.

1024
00:50:06,822 --> 00:50:08,172
Yeah, very philosophical.

1025
00:50:08,382 --> 00:50:11,952
Was that, um, I, it's one of those
things that, uh, quite a lot of people

1026
00:50:11,952 --> 00:50:15,552
struggle with when they name their
company, coming up with a new name.

1027
00:50:15,972 --> 00:50:19,592
Uh, was it something that instantly came
to you guys, or was it like this took

1028
00:50:19,842 --> 00:50:21,822
months to just to figure out the name?

1029
00:50:22,872 --> 00:50:26,712
I think it just came, we weren't
really like, Planning about it.

1030
00:50:26,872 --> 00:50:27,152
Mm-hmm.

1031
00:50:27,158 --> 00:50:30,252
Like consciously, uh, thinking
about what's the name gonna be.

1032
00:50:30,402 --> 00:50:32,442
But both of us are super
obsessed with names.

1033
00:50:32,442 --> 00:50:36,072
Like every time we launch a feature
or a product or a new app or an

1034
00:50:36,072 --> 00:50:38,842
engine, we're constantly, what's
the name, what do we call it?

1035
00:50:42,312 --> 00:50:46,272
Is your North star in some way ? Like
when you define that you are, um,

1036
00:50:47,382 --> 00:50:51,702
I guess your DNA and your ethos
sort of aligns with it in some way.

1037
00:50:51,707 --> 00:50:52,602
Yeah, yeah.

1038
00:50:52,812 --> 00:50:59,652
So we're obsessed with naming,
so I don't remember it being very

1039
00:51:00,432 --> 00:51:03,617
conscious but I'm sure it was like
lots of beer and coffee and one

1040
00:51:03,737 --> 00:51:08,512
usually the beer usually
the, the sort of the social

1041
00:51:08,532 --> 00:51:09,792
ingredients find a good company.

1042
00:51:09,792 --> 00:51:09,972
Now.

1043
00:51:10,602 --> 00:51:11,602
Um, listen, Kaus.

1044
00:51:11,622 --> 00:51:14,322
This has, uh, been a great conversation.

1045
00:51:14,352 --> 00:51:16,662
Um, uh, genuinely really enjoyed it.

1046
00:51:16,662 --> 00:51:21,762
And if people wanna find out more, um,
about Mason, if they want to connect

1047
00:51:21,762 --> 00:51:23,772
with you, what's the best way to do that?

1048
00:51:25,022 --> 00:51:30,957
GetMason.io is our site, we have,
uh, you know, our, our e-commerce

1049
00:51:30,957 --> 00:51:34,667
expert team, they love helping and
talking to people as, as much as I do.

1050
00:51:34,957 --> 00:51:37,257
Uh, so we have like this
little form and you fill it up.

1051
00:51:37,257 --> 00:51:41,127
Someone's call you, you know, have
great conversation with you, at least

1052
00:51:41,217 --> 00:51:46,722
at the very least, or, you know, I
love, still love talking to everybody

1053
00:51:46,722 --> 00:51:49,672
that I can, as much as my time permits.

1054
00:51:49,982 --> 00:51:50,172
Mm-hmm.

1055
00:51:50,172 --> 00:51:54,282
And I, you know, get into
customer calls as often as I can.

1056
00:51:54,642 --> 00:51:59,892
And so if you ever are on LinkedIn, I'm,
as you can see, as you already understood,

1057
00:51:59,897 --> 00:52:04,152
I'm not on Twitter, once in a decade.

1058
00:52:04,522 --> 00:52:08,992
So not on Twitter, but if you're on
Instagram or on LinkedIn, you're gonna

1059
00:52:08,992 --> 00:52:14,552
finds Kaus Manjita pretty easily and then
you just DM me and yeah, we can catch up.

1060
00:52:15,302 --> 00:52:16,082
Fantastic.

1061
00:52:16,107 --> 00:52:16,717
Fantastic.

1062
00:52:17,427 --> 00:52:22,107
So that website again is
getmason.io and you can find

1063
00:52:22,107 --> 00:52:23,397
out all the information there.

1064
00:52:23,607 --> 00:52:29,337
We will of course, link to the website
and Kaus' LinkedIn and Instagram profiles.

1065
00:52:29,982 --> 00:52:32,532
And if we can dig it out, maybe
the Twitter profile as well, just

1066
00:52:32,532 --> 00:52:34,632
so you can go have a look at the
tweet she wrote 10 years ago.

1067
00:52:35,202 --> 00:52:38,862
Uh, we'll put all of that,
uh, in the show notes.

1068
00:52:38,862 --> 00:52:39,342
Of course.

1069
00:52:39,342 --> 00:52:41,382
So Kaus, thank you so much
for coming on the show.

1070
00:52:41,382 --> 00:52:42,612
It's been a real treat.

1071
00:52:42,672 --> 00:52:46,602
Um, really enjoyed getting to know a bit
about, a bit more about Mason and what

1072
00:52:46,607 --> 00:52:48,182
you guys are doing and sounds fantastic.

1073
00:52:48,582 --> 00:52:50,382
So thank you for coming on.

1074
00:52:51,312 --> 00:52:52,452
Thank you for having me.

1075
00:52:52,962 --> 00:52:53,562
No problem.

1076
00:52:53,562 --> 00:52:54,612
It's been great, hasn't it?

1077
00:52:54,702 --> 00:52:55,602
Great conversation.

1078
00:52:55,932 --> 00:53:00,192
As I said, all of the links, uh, the
notes and the transcript will be available

1079
00:53:00,522 --> 00:53:03,052
on our website, ecommercepodcast.net.

1080
00:53:03,762 --> 00:53:07,182
And if you sign up to our newsletter, they
will be coming straight to your inbox.

1081
00:53:07,512 --> 00:53:10,422
Huge thanks again to Kaus
for joining me today.

1082
00:53:10,422 --> 00:53:13,302
Now, be sure to follow the e-commerce
podcast wherever you get your

1083
00:53:13,302 --> 00:53:17,232
podcast from because we've got yet
more great conversations lined up.

1084
00:53:17,577 --> 00:53:20,097
I don't want you to miss any of them.

1085
00:53:20,187 --> 00:53:24,537
And in case no one has told
you yet today, you are awesome.

1086
00:53:24,627 --> 00:53:25,137
Yes, you are.

1087
00:53:25,137 --> 00:53:26,217
Created awesome.

1088
00:53:26,547 --> 00:53:28,287
It's just a burden you have to bear.

1089
00:53:28,677 --> 00:53:29,577
Kaus has to bear it.

1090
00:53:29,997 --> 00:53:30,727
I have to bear it.

1091
00:53:30,987 --> 00:53:32,427
And you can bear it as well.

1092
00:53:32,547 --> 00:53:33,597
We all have to bear it.

1093
00:53:33,597 --> 00:53:34,137
That's right.

1094
00:53:34,467 --> 00:53:37,287
Uh, the E-Commerce podcast
is produced by Aurion Media.

1095
00:53:37,287 --> 00:53:41,027
You can find our entire archive of
episodes on your favorite podcast app.

1096
00:53:41,027 --> 00:53:43,937
The team that makes this show
possible is Sadaf Beynon, Estella

1097
00:53:43,937 --> 00:53:45,967
Robin and Tanya Hutsuliak.

1098
00:53:46,527 --> 00:53:50,637
Theme song was written by Josh Edmundson,
and as I mentioned, if you would like to

1099
00:53:50,637 --> 00:53:55,637
read the transcript or show notes, head
over to the website, ecommercepodcast.net.

1100
00:53:56,667 --> 00:53:58,017
They're all there waiting for you.

1101
00:53:58,017 --> 00:53:58,647
Yes, they are.

1102
00:53:58,977 --> 00:54:00,117
So that's it from me.

1103
00:54:00,117 --> 00:54:01,207
That's it from Kaus.

1104
00:54:01,232 --> 00:54:02,967
Thank you so much for joining us.

1105
00:54:03,207 --> 00:54:05,008
Have a fantastic week
wherever you are in the world.

1106
00:54:05,427 --> 00:54:06,237
I'll see you next time.

1107
00:54:06,687 --> 00:54:07,107
Bye for now.