Brett Johnson [00:00:00]:

We are Looking Forward Our Way from Studio C in the 511 Studios in the Brewery District. That's just south of downtown Columbus, Ohio. Hi. This is Brett. Regardless of which part of the country you live in, housing issues continue to crowd our news, whether It's affordable housing that's not available or renters are looking to pay or mortgage rates that are soaring. The issues continue to grow and create greater stress to working individuals and families. Today, we have 2 local and well respected experts to discuss the critical housing situation in Central Ohio. We welcome Carlie Boos, Executive Director at Affordable Housing Alliance of Central Ohio, and Michael Wilkos, Senior Vice President, Community Impact United Way of Central Ohio. Thanks to both of you for being here.

Carlie Boos [00:00:46]:

Thank you. It's a pleasure.

Michael Wilkos [00:00:47]:

My pleasure as well.

Carol Ventresca [00:00:49]:

Wonderful. We are so glad to see both of you. I heard a housing presentation that Carly and Michael provided To the Central Ohio Area Agency on Aging earlier this year, I knew we needed to include them in on a podcast, providing both information as well as the resources that are available in our community. But first, before we really get started into the topic, Let's hear more about Carly and Michael. And Carly, why don't you start our discussion? Tell us about yourself and your agency.

Carlie Boos [00:01:19]:

Well, thank you for inviting me to be here. This is gonna be a really fun talk, I think, we are the Affordable Housing Alliance of Central Ohio. Our work is to make sure that Central Ohio has the tools and the data and the research and, importantly, the support that it needs to solve our housing challenges. So we look at that through a lot of different lens. We're focused on homelessness. We're focused on housing affordability for renters. We're We're focused on homeownership and making it available and accessible. What we are really looking at is having a healthy community where everybody is welcome and they all have a seat

Carol Ventresca [00:01:49]:

at the table. Wonderful. Michael.

Michael Wilkos [00:01:51]:

So at United Way of Central Ohio, we are celebrating our 1 100th anniversary this year. And since our founding, we have always been focused providing supports for, vulnerable people within our community. We are a member of the Affordable Housing Alliance of Central Ohio and, support Carly and her work, 100%. But here at in Central Ohio, we fund ninety 2 nonprofits in Franklin County, and they are focused entirely in 2 buckets. One of those is basic needs, ensuring that people's basic needs are met. So Hunger, housing, homelessness, dealing with an emergency crisis, and the second would be, ensuring, students are on a pathway to academic So kindergarten readiness and high school, completion. Those 92 agencies, which by the way represent a Collective workforce of 13,000 people that are working every day to provide their supports. They are struggling in helping those families be stable in their housing. So we are critically invested in, the supports that are needed to keep people stable in their housing because if families can't be stable in their housing, then kids can't be Full in schools, and people can't participate in the economic prosperity of Central Ohio, and that is why this issue is very important to us. I've lived in this community for 35 years. I moved to Columbus to go to the Ohio State University to get degrees in urban geography and city and regional planning. And in that time, I have never seen a housing ecosystem that is more stressed than the one that we shared today.

Carol Ventresca [00:03:24]:

You know, it for for so many, literally, decades, We have been focused on homelessness, but I think until the pandemic, people didn't realize the issues of The housing, affordability, and availability. And now it's really at the forefront. So thank you both for coming and talking with us today.

Brett Johnson [00:03:45]:

Alright. Well, population growth in Central Ohio has exploded over the past, you know, 10 years. A 15.1% growth in Columbus outpaced other large cities that are comparable as that are in the conversations like we have in Portland, Houston, and Nashville. Each year, Franklin County gains 16,000 more people, and and we all look at it as a positive. We all wanna grow. We hate to see the, you know, the the other seas go down, but our metro continues to grow now. Michael, can you tell us about the individuals who moved here? You know, who are they? What part of Columbus is now their home? And what impact Did this have on those already living in that in those areas?

Michael Wilkos [00:04:21]:

Yeah. It's a great question. So I agree with you. The growth of central Ohio, it is very exciting. So I'll give some additional data to put this into perspective. Since 2010, Central Ohio has added 260,000 additional residents, while the rest of Ohio lost 20,000 people. The economic engine of the state is about a 25 mile radius from Broad and High. And once you leave that area, it is a very different state than what we have in Central Ohio. So what are the contributing factors to that growth and why Central Ohio, why are our growth numbers so Hi. There are 3 ways in which a metropolitan region can grow, and Columbus is growing in all 3 of those ways. The first would be through natural increase. That's births minus deaths. We have a very young median age in Central Ohio relative to other Midwestern cities. So as an example, Cuyahoga County, Cleveland, which has the same total population as Franklin County. The median age in Franklin County is 7 years younger than Cuyahoga, which means we just have a lot more of our residents in those childbearing years, which are having families and children. Mhmm.

Brett Johnson [00:05:29]:

So

Michael Wilkos [00:05:29]:

that's Half of our growth, 26% of our metropolitan growth is due to the in migration of international folks moving to Central Ohio. That is something that really was not part of our collective DNA until 19 nineties, and that has continued to pick up. We have a very diverse, continent of origin in which those people are coming from. Columbus is considered an emerging market when it comes To international arrivals. If you think of New York and Miami and Los Angeles, which have long been destinations for new Americans coming to the United States, What you see in those highly developed, cities is a, a continent of origin that is very diverse and almost equitably distributed. In an emerging market for new Americans, Columbus, Charlotte, Indianapolis, you tend to see international arrivals Coming from a particular continent of origin. So in the case of Charlotte, that's mostly driven by, Central and Latin America. In Central Ohio, we have this even distribution. People coming from Asia. They're coming from Central Latin America. They're coming from Europe. They're coming from all over the world. Why is that? Well, we have the Ohio State University, which is very much a global institution. We also have a large number of companies that really kind of operate on a global stage and even look at, organization like Honda, right, which is driving that growth. So let's go back. 50% of our growth is babies over deaths. 26% is due to the arrival of international, and then the smallest part of our growth, 24%, is the movement of American born Citizens moving from one part of the country to another, and they're choosing Columbus. But most of that growth of American born in migration is coming specifically from within Ohio. And the top destinations of American born in migration are, in order, Cleveland, Dayton, Akron, Detroit, Youngstown. Right? So we are pulling people from nearby cities Where those cities aren't doing as well economically. And what are the drivers of mobility patterns? People are seeking either economic opportunity or they're seeking education. And Columbus is a destination because we are creating jobs and we are an education center. And, oh, by the way, where does Central Ohio lose people do if we're pulling people from Cleveland, Akron, Detroit, Youngstown, our top destinations where we lose people to are Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, Charlotte, and Atlanta. So in many ways, Columbus is on this ladder for people up and out of Ohio. You tend to move to Columbus from a nearby city, and when you leave Columbus, you're leaving Ohio and you're leaving the Midwest. So why is Columbus growing at 15% Because we're growing through natural increase, we're growing through the in migration of international, and we are growing through domestic In in migration, and that's why our population is so significantly on that upward trajectory. And we are expected to continue to see Positive population growth in all 3 of those buckets.

Brett Johnson [00:08:39]:

The Northeast Ohio would really like to have I71 under construction all the time to slow things down.

Michael Wilkos [00:08:44]:

You know, what's Like, what's fascinating about that, Brett, is, the Columbus and Cleveland relationship is twice As strong as the Columbus to Cincinnati. Mhmm. Meaning that, when I rattled off that list of immigration from local, you'll notice that Cincinnati was not one of those places. So the number of people that moved to Columbus from, Cleveland, that Flow is twice as high as the flow from Cincinnati, and that's because the Cincinnati metropolitan economy is just has Consistently been doing better than Cleveland.

Brett Johnson [00:09:20]:

Yeah. Yeah. And and then to me, comparing Columbus to Cincinnati's, it it they're 2 different cities. Mhmm. I mean and I don't mean Columbus and Cleveland are similar, but it's just it's it's a different city. They are.

Michael Wilkos [00:09:32]:

All 3 of them are different. They are.

Brett Johnson [00:09:34]:

But it's just you know, you go there and it's just It's it's a southern part of Ohio. You know? It it it's you have to know what you're doing driving in there in Cincinnati. It's just a different feel of a City.

Carol Ventresca [00:09:45]:

But the the other thing too is that Cleveland is the northeast. You you have to go quite a ways to get to another large city. Yeah. Cincinnati is really Right up there with Lexington and Louisville, and they're they they have their own little sort of hub together much closer. I can remember in my 30 years at Ohio State way back when, the university was very concerned. The city of Columbus was very concerned with the brain drain. So I think at that point in time, education did a huge Move towards making sure there were reasons for the educated graduates to stay. Mhmm. And so They the university became very much a part of workforce development. So it's it's a it's a it's a closer tie.

Michael Wilkos [00:10:34]:

Well, as I was, sitting here listening to Brad, I was reminded that one of the things that I hear people say from Cincinnati is One of the questions people always ask another person is, what high school did you go to? Right. Because so much of the conversations Cincinnati is where in the Cincinnati region are you from? Where in Columbus? Nobody ever asks what high school you went to because there's this assumption that you probably didn't grow up in Metro Columbus. Yeah. You're probably from

Brett Johnson [00:11:02]:

somewhere where really good point. That's a good point. No.

Carol Ventresca [00:11:05]:

As I was gonna say, as a native Columbus site, we all talk about high schools. Because then we're really looking at what neighborhood did you grow I went to Catholic school, So I grew up in a different neighborhood than where my school was located.

Michael Wilkos [00:11:18]:

Brewery.

Carol Ventresca [00:11:19]:

So our our, Kids that we grew up with were not just those that we went to school with. Mhmm. We were because we grew up with kids from the public schools in our neighborhood. So it's a different conversation.

Michael Wilkos [00:11:31]:

I will often ask when I'm giving presentations about Columbus whether I'm in a room of, You know, corporation that's raising money for United Way or it's one of our funded partners where I'm speaking to maybe staff or their board or even a civic like a rotary or Kiwanis. Right? I will always ask by a show of hands, raise your hand if you grew up as a kid in Franklin or one of the adjacent counties. Normally, a third of the hands will

Carol Ventresca [00:11:56]:

go up.

Michael Wilkos [00:11:56]:

And then it'll say, how many of you grew up somewhere else in the state of Ohio outside Columbus Metro? There goes another 1 third of the hands. And then it's who grew up somewhere in the United States, outside Side of Ohio, and that's the remainder, or you're international. But no matter where I am, I usually never see more than one 3rd of the hands go up, which is you grew up here in Columbus.

Carol Ventresca [00:12:18]:

And right now, I'm only 1 fourth.

Brett Johnson [00:12:20]:

Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Exactly.

Michael Wilkos [00:12:22]:

That's pretty typical.

Brett Johnson [00:12:23]:

Yeah. Thanks. Yeah.

Carol Ventresca [00:12:25]:

So, Carly, we know that socioeconomic status, such as education levels, income, greatly affect a family's ability to find housing. Give us a picture of the families who are at risk in Central Ohio. What factors are intensifying those housing issues? Sure.

Carlie Boos [00:12:42]:

I would start though by saying that I think everybody who lives in Central Ohio is being affected by our housing shortage and the housing challenge that we're facing. It could be somebody who wakes up and struggles to pay rent or to pay mortgage. It could be somebody who has a friend or a family member that they love very much who is in that situation. Even if you are sitting at home listening to this and you feel secure, we are becoming very conscious of the fact that our job opportunities are going to be more limited. Our ability to prosper and find new opportunities can become more limited. Our ability to gain the kind of education and lifestyle for our children that we expect, All of those things are very interdependent with the amount and availability and affordability of our housing.

Michael Wilkos [00:13:23]:

One of the things I think I even learned from you, Carly, was this, You know, people talk about affordable housing.

Carol Ventresca [00:13:29]:

Mhmm.

Michael Wilkos [00:13:30]:

And when you hear that word affordable housing, it conjures up A mental model for people that sometime is about housing that isn't well maintained or is gonna bring down my property values. But what I've heard you say, Carly, is it's no longer a conversation on affordable housing. It's really about housing affordability, And housing affordability is affecting every single person because home values and rents have consistently been, increasing at a faster rate than people's incomes every single year for a long time now, which is causing a housing vulnerability for people who, Just a few years ago, would have never thought they could, feel that financial pinch around their housing and having to make decisions about where to spend that money. And if you don't spend that money on your housing, you become unstable very quickly.

Carlie Boos [00:14:21]:

Right.

Carol Ventresca [00:14:22]:

And and on top of the just the cost of the house itself, Now with insurance, taxes going up, everything, it it's become they're all becoming much more vulnerable in in those issues.

Brett Johnson [00:14:34]:

Is there a better phrase to use than affordable housing? Are we are we saying that wrong? No. I don't think so. Because I I I agree when you say it. We've Growing up with that affordable housing as in okay subsidized and beyond be less than a square 1,000 square feet. It's somewhere to live versus Being able to afford a home Mhmm. Is a different totally different conversation.

Carlie Boos [00:14:56]:

I think they bleed together, though.

Brett Johnson [00:14:57]:

Okay.

Carlie Boos [00:14:57]:

So when we talk about affordable housing, it's It's important to define the terms. Right?

Brett Johnson [00:15:01]:

But I

Carlie Boos [00:15:01]:

think that well, I know for the Alliance, the way that we think about it, a home is affordable if it's no more than 30% of your income, whatever that is.

Brett Johnson [00:15:09]:

Okay.

Carlie Boos [00:15:10]:

Right? So my income is gonna look different than a barista. That's gonna look different than an airline pilot. But as long as your housing is within 30% of whatever that wage is, You're gonna be in a safe, sustainable spot. So to flip that, when you're driving down the street, every single house you pass is affordable housing. Every single one of the 11 or so 1000000 people who live in the state of Ohio, everybody is in affordable housing. The question becomes, Who is that house affordable for? And do we have the right makeup that matches our population and what their needs are? Right. But I can drill down too, And we can talk about some of the numbers around it because while that's true, and everybody is feeling this pinch one way or another, some are definitely feeling it more.

Michael Wilkos [00:15:51]:

Yeah. Well, in the opening, Brett, when you talked about Central Ohio's growth, I failed to mention one additional perspective. And when you said Franklin County adds 16,000 additional residents every year. However, we've only been building housing for 10,500 people every year.

Brett Johnson [00:16:10]:

So I've already seen some number like that, and I can remember. It was way out of proportion.

Michael Wilkos [00:16:15]:

So what that means so think

Brett Johnson [00:16:16]:

about this.

Michael Wilkos [00:16:16]:

Every year for a decade, That's 5,500 people that we added in the county that nobody built a house for. And so that competition and was building and building and building. When the housing pressures accelerated across the United States during COVID, That happened here, but the other part of that backstory was this chronic underbuilding where every single year that housing competition was Getting more and more and more robust, and then during COVID, it really kind of accelerated. What that means is we are short tens of thousands of housing units, And one of the reasons why home values and rents here have jumped so much more than the average is because of those growth pressures in relation to how much supply the market has added. The other interesting thing is we have this Huge reduction in vacant and abandoned housing in Franklin County over the last 10 years. And I'm gonna give 3 Specific examples because I have just memorized these over conversations I have with lots of people. So let's look at Northland, which is a huge part of the city of Columbus. That neighborhood over the last 10 years added 13,700 additional residents, But only added 484 housing units. So think about that another way. Northland added the entire equivalency of the city of Bexley, but they essentially only added the size of 1 apartment complex. 484 housing units, But they added 13,700 people. How does that happen? 2 things. 1, Northland had a huge reduction in vacant and abandoned housing. In 2010, there were 4,000 housing units in Northland sitting empty. By 2020, that had shrunk by half. And then the number of people living per unit jumped significantly in Northland. If housing costs are jumping faster than your income, One way to compensate for that is to have more people living in that unit who can contribute financially to the housing cost. Two more quick geographic examples in this. Linden is now a growing neighborhood. Of the 12 census tracks in North and South Linden, 11 of the 12 Had population growth. But here's what's really concerning about Linden, and I've never seen this in the decades of studying housing and demographics and census data for Columbus. Linden lost 4% of all of its housing, but grew by 7.3% in population. They lost 4% of their housing, but the population of the neighborhood jumped by 26100. That's more people per unit, and the census now has Firm for people like Carly and I and for the 92 nonprofits that United Way funds. Anecdotally, what have people been telling Carly and I for years? Oh, As people get displaced, as people get evicted, they're moving in with friends and family. And where are people living doubled up? Not in Clintonville and German Village in Dublin. They're living doubled up in neighborhoods that struggle. Right? In places like Linden and Northland. Linden and Northland Added 17,000 additional residents, and there was no visual indication of that growth. You Couldn't drive through Linden Northland and see housing under construction. My last example is Reynoldsburg. Mayor Begany in Reynoldsburg, and Reynoldsburg is where Carly lives, and there's Amazing stuff going on in Reynoldsburg. In the Franklin County portion of Reynoldsburg, they added just 562 housing units, But the population jumped by 4,900 additional residents in the Franklin County portion of Reynoldsburg. So whether it's Northland or Linden or Reynoldsburg, what's important about this conversation is, yes, we can see growth when we drive down Polaris Parkway in South Old State Street, and you go from farms to new developments. You can see it on West Broad Street and North fourth Street and Long 3 when vacant lots are sprouting 4 5 6 story buildings, but there also can be significant growth in neighborhoods where you can't physically see it. The point of that long monologue is there is growth all over the metropolitan region, but now so many of these neighborhoods Have essentially filled up, and that inventory of vacant and abandoned housing has been used. There are nine Thousand less vacant housing units in this community than 10 years ago. So we're now starting this new period of growth Further behind because we no longer have those existing housing units sitting vacant that can get repurposed. And that's why we really need to increase production of housing in this region moving forward, and this is a skill set that Carly is better equipped than I.

Carol Ventresca [00:21:17]:

Michael, let me clarify something. When you're saying we lost 9,000 vacant units, I'm thinking a vacant unit is probably something pretty derelict, and nobody should be living in it anyway. Are you saying that they're gone or that Somebody's living in them.

Michael Wilkos [00:21:33]:

Thank you. Thank you for that clarification, and, I'll, answer it this way. In the case of Linden, There are 1,100 less vacant housing units than 10 years ago. 400 of those were demolished Because they were beyond the point of probably economic salvation, and they needed to come down. The other 700 were, existing housing units that were vacant. That means it could have just been sitting empty or could have been boarded up. And those 700 were renovated and brought back online. So when I say those 9,000 units of vacant housing disappeared. What I mean is they're now occupied. Right? They're either got demolished, which honestly, we didn't have a lot of demolition across this county in the last 10 years. We're not like Cleveland and Toledo and Youngstown, which have been sitting on large inventory of housing that has been sitting empty for a long period of time. And in the case of Northland, one of the examples I love showing and, you know, all you have to do to be a effective researcher anymore is go to Google Street View and click on the panes for years. Right? And you could see in 2011, there were entire apartment complexes on Northtowne Boulevard near Tamarac Circle in Northland, where the developer or the owner of that property would just, you know, board up the windows and walk away. If the housing market collapsed in 2006, 2007, Northland at that time was a weak market. Developer just, you know, sit on that real estate. Well, 10 years later, go back to Google Street View, that entire apartment Complex is back online. That was paint and carpet. Right? That wasn't we're not talking about 300,000 and 4000 square foot Turn of the century homes that might require a huge amount of investment to bring back online, like you might have on Brydon Road or East Broad Street from years back. So the housing situation in Central Ohio is much much different than the rest of the state. The point is everybody in Central Ohio is growing, and my last Sample would be after 50 years of population loss. Whitehall's population jumped by 11%, 11% increase, And it's not because Whitehall was building a lot of housing, but it was really, maybe people who moved into that housing that were senior citizens who, needed to move into more appropriate housing for where they were in their life cycle, who no longer wanted to be in that single family home that they've been in for decades. As they've transitioned out of that home, who is likely to have purchased that home after them is a new American family with multiple school age children. And that's what's driving the growth in Whitehall as a demographic shift.

Carol Ventresca [00:24:14]:

Right. So Brett and I had great relationships with the folks in Whitehall and have for years been the rah rah part of talking to folks about this is a great place to live. It's a great neighborhood. They're improving the schools. Go in there, buy a house for literally nothing, and rehab it, and you've got a wonderful starter home. A lot of those types of neighborhoods were in Northland. I grew up in Linden, went to school in Northland. Lots of little tiny pockets of fast building that happened in Northland Right after the World War 2 Korean wartime, people were coming back needing those little tiny box houses. One of the things that I've noted, and it's more personal known family and friends, is that that Northland community had a very Much older population, and they hung on to those little houses. They lived there till they died. Is has that been an issue, or is it just that's just too small of a number to to think more about it? It it when you've got a neighborhood just like Whitehall did, older folks were either moved or passed. Northland really is the same thing is going on.

Carlie Boos [00:25:33]:

Yeah. Well, we think about housing as a life cycle. Right? Mhmm.

Michael Wilkos [00:25:36]:

You

Carlie Boos [00:25:36]:

don't start off Wanting the same thing you're gonna want in midlife, and that's not gonna be the same thing you're gonna want as you get older and you have different mobility needs. We are seeing definitely consumer trends towards smaller Homes. You would think back to the nineties. It was country chic. It was giant homes on massive lots. Many many mansions. Yep. Yep. Mansions. We're not seeing younger people who want that. And I think part of that is they're looking to the Cape Cod's into these cute homes that are very sustainable, very affordable, and they're saying, you know what? I want I don't wanna spend all of my money on a mortgage payment that goes to massive square footage I never see, and I have to clean all weekend. I just want something small, and then I can use all that residual income to go on trips or to Right. You know, hang out with my kids and have a really enjoyable weekend. So you're definitely seeing these changes in what people want as far as their housing is. We're starting to tip into a discussion, though, of what the barriers are To getting us to housing sufficiency and why we are having so many challenges in meeting not just these affordability needs, but giving our residents the kind of housing that they want. And one of those big walls we gotta jump over is land use and zoning laws that were written in the 19 fifties For a population who doesn't look like us, who doesn't want the same thing as us, and it it's holding us back in a lot of ways. And that's not just The city of Columbus, it is throughout the region. It's throughout the country. Right?

Michael Wilkos [00:26:57]:

You know, there is this preference We've created, over the since the end of World War 2, where the single family detached home is somehow this iconic Status symbol that we are all supposed to wanna desire and want. And we've created this mental model of what we think the quintessential Central American home should look like, but that's really for, a certain part of the population during a Certain period of time, right, there's such a, negative perception that has been created about renters. And in this community, 45% of Franklin County households are renters.

Carol Ventresca [00:27:41]:

Wow. I didn't realize it was that high.

Michael Wilkos [00:27:43]:

So, in the state of Ohio, it is, 66% of Ohio are homeowners and 33% are renters. In Franklin County, it's 55 to 45. We're a younger community. Housing prices here are higher. But if you think about it, There is a, like, a 20 to 25 year time period of your life where that single family home with 3 or 4 bedrooms is The right housing typology for you. When you're young and single, you're in apartments. If you are, delaying creation of a family, you don't need family housing. You're in that, single family 3 4 bedroom home for this period of time, and then you become an empty nester. Let's look at Dublin. Dublin, is a community that went from 38100 people to 50,000 in 30 years. It has a lot of housing that is very similar In price point and square footage. But now as Dublin has aged, you have a lot of empty nesters who love Dublin, but they no longer want that 35 100 square foot house in Burefeld Village. They have disposable income. The kids are gone. They wanna travel. They don't wanna be, dealing with yard work. So what is Bridge Park? Right? Bridge Park in Dublin is really providing A retirement home, you're saying? Well, But

Brett Johnson [00:28:59]:

there's actually I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Bridge Park. Similar, but

Michael Wilkos [00:29:03]:

well, here's what I'll say.

Brett Johnson [00:29:03]:

Mister Hoang, I'm kidding.

Michael Wilkos [00:29:05]:

And I I love Bridge Park. Right? But if you think about it this way, If you are young and single and you're, having just started a family, what's driving your housing and neighborhood choice lifestyle.

Brett Johnson [00:29:17]:

Sure it is.

Michael Wilkos [00:29:18]:

All of these what's called 5 over ones. Right? Five levels of stick built construction over a concrete podium that's on High Street in West Broad and Longstreet, that's lifestyle. What is Bridge Park? What is Kingsdale? That's convenience. Mhmm. So Arlington and Dublin are real and and Hilliard, right, which is now also looking at wanting to do a mixed use downtown. And, you know, Worthington is struggling with, what they wanna do with the redevelopment of the Methodist property in High Street. That's about convenience. How do we keep right. How does Dublin attract young single people who are looking for lifestyle? Well, Young single people don't wanna be in your Field Village or Tartan fields. They wanna walk out their door, and they wanna have restaurants and entertainment. Bars. Bars.

Brett Johnson [00:30:04]:

Walk over this cool bridge over a river.

Michael Wilkos [00:30:06]:

Right. They wanna go to the North Market, you know, Bridge Park. Mhmm. That is lifestyle, but it's also convenience. So those young single professionals that want lifestyle, they're attracted to Bridge Park, and those empty nesters that have that home in, Muirfield Also wanna bring in Bridge Park, and I give Dublin a lot of credit. Mhmm. And I give, Arlington a lot of credit. What Arlington is doing at Kingsdale, You've got, 7 story apartment building. You've got a senior building going up there. You've got a rec center all right in the parking lot of a giant eagle. It's a beautiful thing. And now what is Whitehall doing? Redeveloping all that property at Broad and Hamilton to give a different type of housing typology that is focused on lifestyle and convenience, which is now providing these housing bookends and moving away from this nostalgic emotional manipulation that we should all be living in 4 bedroom single family detached

Carlie Boos [00:31:03]:

But, I mean, let me say too. It's not just single, wage earning, no children households. They might be gravitating towards more apartment buildings, but you look at the 2 hottest housing markets in the entire country. Right now, today, it is Gahanna. In the entire country, it is Gahanna. And what are they doing? They're investing in their downtown. They're investing in Creekside. They're putting multifamily density in there. They're putting shops. They're putting Entertainment venues. And what's happening to the single family homes? Value is going through the roof because everybody wants to be there. 2 years ago, it was Reynoldsburg Doing the exact same thing with old Reynoldsburg, putting in more apartments, putting in more housing, cultivating new small businesses. And what happened? The single family homes all around it got more and more popular.

Carol Ventresca [00:31:46]:

This this sort of answers a question about the complex where I live. I'm in a condominium complex, stand alone, Units that are I I mean, mine is 2,000 square feet. It's not a small condo by any stretch. 2 car attached garage, just enough, of the flower beds to that I can deal with. Poor Mike. That

Brett Johnson [00:32:12]:

was funny. Yeah.

Carol Ventresca [00:32:13]:

You know, just only what I want to do. They they were built early 2000. And at that point in time, when the whole Polaris Parkway stuff was sort of grinding to a halt, there were bits and pieces of land where people wanted Single family homes out of their McMansion into smaller, but still enough Space for a couple and their grandchildren. No kids. So my complex is not a senior complex, but the average age is probably 50. Mhmm. But they are not continued around the region because it's even though, it's Smaller, there's still a lot of land involved. It's expensive because there's there's more land than what you would get in a, Multilevel condominium building. But, you know, we all wanted to sell our houses and and still have our own property and equity. So that's and so I've I just keep wondering why isn't why aren't other people doing this? Well, there's not enough land to do it That where you could do it, and break even even.

Michael Wilkos [00:33:24]:

Yeah.

Carlie Boos [00:33:24]:

And this gets us right back into that affordability piece. Right. Right now in Franklin County, Just Franklin County, we have 54,000 families who are paying more than half their income towards housing. Big part of that is we don't have enough housing to go around. Just supply and demand fundamentals. But that's 54,000 of our neighbors who are taking 1 out of every 2 paychecks and giving it to a mortgage company or to a landlord, and that leaves very, very little leftover for food or medication. We see a lot of seniors in this physician who began rationing their medication and cutting prescriptions in half just to get through to the end of the month. If you blow that out and you don't look at just Franklin County, but you look at our whole region, 83,000 households who are doing that every single month. That's that's a real tipping point that we need to look at. If you go further down the economic ladder and you're not just looking at kind of the region as a whole, but just households who are earning minimum wage. Right? Full time, 40 hour a week employees, but they're minimum wage earners. We only have 1 home for every 3 people who needs it in that range.

Carol Ventresca [00:34:26]:

Mhmm.

Carlie Boos [00:34:26]:

2 thirds of our need every month completely unmet.

Carol Ventresca [00:34:30]:

I think they there was a a number that was thrown around there for a while that if you had a a minimum Wage earner, they literally would have to have two and

Carlie Boos [00:34:39]:

a half jobs to pay for housing. And worse than that, if they wanna buy just the median home today, the average home that's up for sale, guess how many jobs they'd have to work? Six six full time jobs. They would have to create 3 new days of the week just so that they go to work 24 hours a day during those new Yes. Mhmm. It's completely unsustainable.

Michael Wilkos [00:35:01]:

So, Governing Magazine, a couple months ago, wrote a piece about what's happened to American housing markets, post COVID. And it entirely focused on Columbus as being indicative of this trend. In 2013, in Central Ohio, you needed, Income needed to be, you needed to earn 2.3 times your income to afford the median price of a home. K. Now it's 4.1 in just 10 years. Columbus now has the same income to housing ratio as Cargo. That's how quickly the Columbus's housing affordability advantage has disappeared. So we were talking a lot about Whitehall and changing demographics and population growth. As we all know, Auditor Stanziano has recently come out with the new 3 year property, value increases. Number 1 in Franklin County was Hamilton Local, followed by Whitehall. So Whitehall home values have jumped 68% in 3 years. This is because so many people have been priced out Of the Clintonvilles and Grandviews and Doublins and all these other markets, they are now going into parts of Franklin County where that demand was not just a few years ago. And that's putting incredible pressure on these lower to moderate income places who are seeing the biggest jumps, and I believe Franklinton has the fastest jump in property values within the city of Columbus. And, I don't wanna be held accountable to this, but my memory tells me that in 36 months, the median price of a home in Franklinton jumped 100%. Mhmm. That is unsustainable. And when those tax bills come out, so as an example, when I estimated my, my neighborhood had been jumping in value, which is Wynelon Park, in, previous appreciations, but this time, my house only jumped by 22%, where the average for Franklin County was up 42%. When I did the little estimated calculation, it looks like my annual property tax bill might drop by $500 a year. That's not gonna be the experience for people in Hamilton local and Whitehall. Mhmm. And so I'm very concerned about what will happen to, senior citizens and people who, you know, purchased homes in the Reynoldsburgs and Hamilton Locals and Whitehall's, where now you're seeing huge jumps in those values, and those folks are gonna struggle with those bills. Right?

Carlie Boos [00:37:48]:

And that's gonna be broader than just Franklin County too. If you look out closer to the Intel site, we're hearing really trouble things coming out Johnstown out of Grandview. Yeah. You go to the other end of the the region, and you're looking at Honda and Marysville. Mhmm. This is across the board. Yeah.

Carol Ventresca [00:38:04]:

We did have a podcast with auditor Stanziano and posted it a few weeks ago. So there is a lot of good information on his website. So folks that are listening to this podcast, make sure you go back and listen to, to mister Stentziano's, podcast with us also Because there is help. There are people to talk to. Don't panic when you see those numbers. And, we're still in 2020 3, and those numbers haven't been finalized. So what you're seeing are estimates. So, don't panic yet.

Brett Johnson [00:38:37]:

Yeah. Well

Carlie Boos [00:38:37]:

and this is a live issue. Right now, the number one topic that is being discussed at the statehouse is how to deal with property taxes.

Carol Ventresca [00:38:44]:

Right.

Carlie Boos [00:38:44]:

So if it is something that you're feeling, this is a great time to Call your representative and just share your story. Very here's what I want.

Carol Ventresca [00:38:50]:

Very good point. And,

Brett Johnson [00:38:51]:

just Did they just passed to freeze, property taxes for older adults.

Carol Ventresca [00:38:56]:

Right? Or in the past that the the topic just came up.

Brett Johnson [00:39:00]:

Yeah. That's right. Okay.

Carol Ventresca [00:39:01]:

Yeah. Exactly. Hopefully, by the time this podcast is posted, We'll have more information on that, but it could help, those seniors at lower incomes. It's not a low low income, but it's a lower income That could could be saved money on taxes. So good. Mhmm.

Michael Wilkos [00:39:15]:

Last year, there were 20,000 I can't believe I I had memorized these numbers. Last year, there were 20,897 evictions that were filed. That was a jump of 35%, But the number of what's called writs of restitution or when a red tag gets put on a door because an action has been, decided, That went up 15% or not as much as eviction filings. Lastly, we look at How many people were set out when someone from the sheriff's department showed up to put your belongings out on the street because you did not successfully navigate this housing situation. That was well, 1 would be 1 too many. Right? Because we don't wanna see anybody in that situation. There were just 744 out of 20,900 of filings. 744 of those resulted in a set out. That was the lowest ratio of set outs as a function of filings we've seen in this community. Why? Because there has been a significant amount of money to help people pay their rent because of stimulus dollars. When the Biden administration just did a recent, additional authorization of eviction protection money, Franklin County in Columbus received $120,000,000, which is more than the state of California received Because that was a performance based contract, and no other community in the country did a better job of getting those dollars in the hands Of people who needed them to avoid that eviction than us. The nonprofit community here really Rose to the occasion, and she's not gonna take credit for it. But I give a lot of credit to the woman sitting to my left, miss Carly Boos.

Carol Ventresca [00:41:11]:

Oh, Carly.

Michael Wilkos [00:41:12]:

Running the Affordable Housing Alliance, right, advocacy organization. I'm gonna turn it over to Carly to talk about what those dollars will continue to be used for And this gift. Right? I mean, literally, a gift that we have received in this community to really prevent a lot of people from losing their housing. But at the not too distant future, those dollars will be gone, and we will be back to a very difficult situation, but Carly led the creation of, Rentful. And I want you to talk about all the great successes we've had as a community to help people be stable in their housing.

Carlie Boos [00:41:46]:

Well, I appreciate that shout out. I do reject all the credit, but I agree that Central Ohio is a national leader in this space. And you remember the context. When COVID hit, everybody lost their job. Everybody went work from home. Tipped employees had no tips. Hourly employees had no hours. It resulted in an immediate and significant eviction crisis. It was on our doorstep. There was no funding to be able to close that gap right at the beginning, so there was a whole litany of folks from not just in the state of Ohio, But throughout the country, he said we need something equivalent to the paycheck protection employee for employers. We need that for renters and for their landlords. Mean, importantly, this is about keeping properties safe and well maintained, and that cash flow is essential to that. We are beyond lucky to have Leadership in the state of Ohio. I think Sherrod Brown. I think, locally, Joyce Beatty. Both were very active during this time and making sure that these resources were able to get into the people, who needed it. We, here locally, it was a partnership between AHACCO, but more significantly, the United Way, the Seymour Institute, And the city of Columbus in Franklin County created a one stop shop. Information first. Education first. Here is what is going to happen in our community. Here's how you navigate through it. If you are one of those households that is in emergency need, here is how you access those funds. And that website is still alive. It is still very heavily trafficked. We're getting 20,000 visitors per month to that website.

Carol Ventresca [00:43:18]:

Carly, give us the website. Absolutely.

Carlie Boos [00:43:20]:

It is rentful614.com, and it's hopeful. Right? Rentful614.com. But let me contextualize that. We've got 20,000 people even today. We're sitting here in fall of 2023 after COVID has passed. 20,000 people coming to that website looking for help to pay their rent and to avoid an eviction. If instead of a digital queue that walked up to the website. It was a human line waiting for rental assistance. It would start at the Franklin County Courthouse doors in downtown Columbus, And it would snake around the corner, and it would go past the the state house. And then it would go past nationwide, and then it would go all the way down the short north, and then it would go All the way through the university district, and then it would turn left, and it would stop at the stadium doors for Ohio Stadium. And that would be every single month. That need is so intense, and I gotta circle it back to the fact that we don't have enough apartments that are affordable to people who need them. And another way of thinking about that, Columbus, as a metropolitan area, had the 8th highest rent growth in the entire country. The only cities ahead of us or those immediately ahead of us, San Jose and San Diego. And when you're comparing your housing options to California, it is appropriate to get scared.

Brett Johnson [00:44:39]:

Yeah? Yes. Yes. Absolutely.

Michael Wilkos [00:44:42]:

Well and I wanna because it, just popped into my head listening to you, Carly, is back to this question about affordable housing and housing affordability. And And I think everybody knows that, you know, in 2019 was the first time the city of Columbus had ever put affordable housing in a bond package. Right? Bond package up to voters. You know, voter approval for bridges and sewers and sidewalks and street lights. And in 2019, the city of Columbus put $50,000,000 into that bond package to incubate affordable housing. That $50,000,000 was, leveraged and, created two hundred and 50,000,000 in investment, and, 1300 units of affordable housing. And then in November, so just 10 months ago, by a super majority, Columbus voters approved $200,000,000 in a bond package for affordable housing that's going to, You know, build new housing, purchase housing, stabilize affordable housing. And if that same ratio is leveraged, That $200,000,000 in bonds could potentially create $1,000,000,000 in affordable housing. It is amazing What the city of Columbus and Columbus voters are choosing to do for our city. This is also aligned with zone in, which is the city of Columbus looking at the zoning code and saying, look, this is a 70 year old document. It's very much about the automobile. It's much about The favoritism towards single family low density zoning, zoning codes written in the 19 fifties are just unfortunately also gonna be racist, and the city of Columbus is kinda tossing that out and redoing that. Communities, though, like Worthington have also been looking at that And, wanting to potentially also allow voters there to vote on affordable housing bond package for Worthington. And And while the city of Columbus is doing great things, Columbus is only 45% of the metropolitan region, so everybody kinda has to be in this together. Because at the end of the day, A home is where a job goes at night.

Carlie Boos [00:46:52]:

Mhmm.

Michael Wilkos [00:46:53]:

And if we're gonna bring in, you know, Google and Intel and Honda And Hyperion, the hydrogen cell company, and a solar panel company in Pataskala, and nationwide children's at Wexner Medical Center and all these things that are creating just tens of thousands of jobs, we have to have housing that aligns with the economic development progress. So affordable housing or housing affordability, I wanna give you a couple specific examples of what we mean by affordable housing. A registered nurse who makes $75,000 a year and has 2 children as a single parent household, That person qualifies for an 80% area median income subsidized unit. A construction worker who is single and makes $50,000 a year would also qualify for an 80% AMI unit. A lot of people think this is, oh, you know, I don't really know, or I don't come in contact with, you know, people who are in need of truly very low, low income housing. Any one of us who has ever gone out to dinner just came into contact with someone who needs a 40% Area median income subsidized unit are what we consider to be very affordable because the average salary for a cook And a restaurant is $29,000 a year. And why I share those examples is because every one of us every day Comes into contact with someone who needs that, and I've heard people say the following. We entrust people to care for and raise our children. Think of childcare workers and how low that is. So it is odd to me intellectually and emotionally as I think, wow, I would trust you to care for and raise and educate my children, But I don't wanna create housing in my neighborhood for you to be a neighbor. Right. And we have, unfortunately and I've heard Robert Schottenstein, CEO of Mi Homes, Multiple times publicly say the following. He builds in 17 metropolitan markets across the country, And he said the suburban communities in Columbus are the most restrictive and exclusionary that he has seen across the United States. And one of the reasons why some of Columbus's suburban communities kinda get away with that is because the city of Columbus, which is 220 square miles, which is the exact same land area as the city of Chicago. The fact that the city of Columbus is in 3 counties. It is in 11 of the 16 school districts in Franklin County that Columbus has really taken the moral And the business responsibility to house the region's, low income workers and residents. And as a citizen of Columbus, I say That's not Columbus's responsibility. It's all of our responsibility to ensure that there is adequate housing In all of our communities so that if we want someone to cut our hair, to take care of our lawns, and to educate our children, But we should also want those people to live within our communities. And when you think about the housing ecosystem, what we've created in this country is this unfortunate situation And where you can't live in the neighborhood that you love during all of your different lifespans As a single individual, as a young married couple, as a young family, as an established family, or as an empty nester, You literally have to leave your neighborhood multiple times and aligned with Union County. United Way of Central Ohio has a, relationship now with United Way of Union County. If you look at Union County, very few people who Live in Union County, also work in Union County. And the kind of housing being built in Union County doesn't align with the population demographics. If you're a young single person, you've grown up in Union County, and now you're in your twenties, there's nowhere for you to live in Union County. And if you're a senior citizen And you have now wanna move away from that larger single family home. There's really no senior housing in Union County. So they're losing their young people, and they're losing their seniors Because they don't have that kind of housing. What I would like to see is a zoning code and a taxing infrastructure and an investment opportunity that says, We wanna create neighborhoods in all communities where people can stay in that community during those different life cycles, and that just doesn't exist, Presley.

Carlie Boos [00:51:36]:

One of

Carol Ventresca [00:51:37]:

the things that we haven't really we've we've sort of touched on, not really focused on here, people think of housing And then everybody run into their old clunker car and driving 20 miles to a job. Housing, transportation, and employment really need to be discussed together. Individuals have to ask themselves, how far can I afford to drive To a new job? I can remember when the whole Rickenbacker stuff changed over and all of those mega warehouses went down there, and We suffered because people couldn't get down there to to work, and there was no place to live down that way. Carly, how does that fit in?

Carlie Boos [00:52:16]:

Yeah. Transportation and housing are absolutely interdependent. There's no way you can look at 1 without looking at the other. I think one of the things that has me so excited about this region is The Link US project, where we are looking at how our housing complements our workforce, complicates our transit infrastructure, it's something that's gonna be a huge part of the conversation. And I wanna underscore too that that isn't just something that workers are looking at, But that's something that employers are looking at too. If you go to Site Selection Magazine, it's the the trade association for big, big employers who want to bring big, big jobs to a place. And you go to that magazine and you type in housing. Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of posts. Because the consultants that are helping these big businesses figure out where to go and create a headquarters, One of the first things they look at is quality of life, and a big part of that is the cost of housing for those employees that they're gonna bring. We did, about 2 years ago, a survey of employers. Folks who work in housing, they've got that competency, but really, they're big HR teams. They have lots of employees. And we said, how is today in Central Ohio? How is our housing shortage affecting you as an employer? 80% of them said that their employees come to work Less ready to work. They have lower productivity, and they have lower morale because what happens at home absolutely follows you in the door at the job. And that same group, half of them said that they are seeing increased employee turnover and higher hiring costs and higher retention costs Because the housing shortage is affecting their bottom line. And that's not at all surprising because if you get evicted on a Tuesday, very, very difficult to go into work on a Wednesday morning. Right. So we know this is essential, and you can tell. Michael and I love data. We're good numbers folks over here. We have only been creating 1 house For every two and a half jobs that we are creating in this community. To say that differently, for every 1,000 jobs we're bringing in, only 400 homes are being built. So unless you're expecting 3 full time employees under every single roof, we are going to continue to have affordability issues, and we're going to have quality issues Until we get serious about building, and that is entirely a question about public support and commitment, we know Central Ohio is better positioned than absolutely lead

Brett Johnson [00:54:32]:

anybody in the

Carlie Boos [00:54:32]:

world to get ahead of it. I think mayor Ginther. I think the Franklin County commissioners. I think so many of our suburban partners and leaders truly understand the opportunity that's at our doorstep. What they need is for us to come and say we got your back. We believe in this. We want this, and we support you as you are putting Central Ohio first. Wonderful. Good.

Brett Johnson [00:54:55]:

Yeah. Well, yeah, we're gonna have you back, for sure because

Carol Ventresca [00:54:59]:

Way too much to talk about.

Brett Johnson [00:55:00]:

And that's why we had you come to the table because you're the experts on this. Know, we could have dug forever for these numbers, and these numbers, you guys call us very well in understanding where we're coming from. And I hopefully, the listener doesn't go, the hand's up. We've lost. We've lost. We can't. I think, like you mentioned, we're at we're at the we're at the doorstep that we can make a difference. It's never, never, never too late, but we have to do something. And and and let's leave the listener with some words of wisdom, if you would, as we do with all our guests. What do you want them to take away from this hour conversation we've had?

Michael Wilkos [00:55:35]:

Well, I want to do, I'll let Carl, I think about that kind of words of wisdom, but I wanna plug 2 things that I wanna encourage your listeners to act on. Because part of this is, How can we change our future and make more of Central Ohio able to participate in the economic progress that lies before us? Carla mentioned link us. That will be on the ballot next fall. It is a $9,000,000,000 transportation plan that Franklin County voters will be asked to support. I would encourage everybody to support that. It will be a sales tax. And when we say link us, what does that mean? It's gonna link us with our feet, link us on bicycles, and link us with transit. So it is bike lanes. It is bike paths. It is sidewalk connectivity, but it would be 3 bus rapid transit lines. 1 from downtown Columbus on West Broad Street out to Hollywood Casino. The other 1 on East Main out to Reynoldsburg from downtown, and the third one would be rebuilding Olentangy River Road. Real bus rapid transit. I mean, Cleveland Avenue's, route is kind of bus rapid transit light. Bus rapid transit would be a 2 buses with that kind of accordion connector in between. There would be permanent stations, so when that bus pulls into a station. People have already made their financial transaction when they got onto the platform, so all 4 doors of the bus will open. People can Exit all 4 doors. They can enter all 4 doors, so it'll have the efficiency of, say, a light rail or a subway, but it will be in the street on tires. That kind of fixed platform system also provides developers the, confidence that there is this physical infrastructure. Sure. And then with the zoning code update, we'll get higher density housing where people can choose to live where they don't have to have 2 cars. So link us is gonna be very important. The other thing that, Carly and United Way of Central Ohio have advocated for with great success would be source of income ordinances or SOI. In September of 2020 was the 1st Central Ohio community to pass that ordinance, and it simply states That landlords must include all legal sources of income to qualify that person for their housing. What do I mean by that? So Social Security, disability, veteran's benefit Retirement. Retirement, child support, where previously a landlord would only look at your earned income, say, on a w two. This is looking at those government supports. After Bexley showed leadership by, passing that ordinance, Columbus, Whitehall, Worthington, Westerville, and Gahanna have all followed suit. If you live, listeners, in Dublin or Arlington or Grandview, Hilliard, Grove City, I would encourage you to go to your city council, members and advocate and say, can we follow the leadership of Westerville and Whitehall in Worthington and Columbus? It might be the fastest way to get to a housing justice platform. In Columbus, we went a little bit further because of council member Shayla Favor who also did the following. Landlords must give somebody a receipt when they pay their rent, so there's none of this, I said, you said, when it comes to eviction court, right, you have to have a receipt. And then the other thing would be if you think about this, given the high cost of apartments and security deposits, people must be given 90 day Security deposits. People must be given 90 days in order to, pay that, deposit Because a lot of times you're waiting to get your deposit back on the old place, and you need that revenue. So it's 90 days to pay the rent. You get a receipt And legal sources of income, we have to do housing policy while we're investing in, transportation infrastructure And rewriting the zoning code and having advocacy organizations like what Carly runs to change policies and Systems beyond Central Ohio as well as leverage dollars to create a more robust housing ecosystem.

Carol Ventresca [00:59:51]:

Wow. Okay. Carly, Yeah. Wisdom.

Carlie Boos [00:59:55]:

You can't beat that. I want I wanna finish out on the high note, and it's that we absolutely can't do this.

Carol Ventresca [01:00:01]:

Mhmm.

Carlie Boos [01:00:01]:

This isn't a crisis. This isn't a storm that hit the shore, and now we're just cleaning up the damage. That's not where we are. We are standing on a cliff, and it is a long way down. But we are going to decide whether we jump or whether we step back. And when Michael and I say things like, well, we need to build more housing to meet the growth that we are experiencing. We're not talking about something that we haven't done before. We're talking about going back to the 19 seventies and saying, remember what we did then? Let's try it again. Remember how we dealt with the population boom that came out of World War 2? We've got this in our blood.

Michael Wilkos [01:00:34]:

Mhmm.

Carlie Boos [01:00:35]:

We've just lost the practice. And it's absolutely entirely doable, and I am beyond confident That Central Ohio is gonna be the 1st, and we're gonna continue to be a leader on this. And other folks are gonna continue to turn to us because we know how to do it, and we know how to do it fairly.

Carol Ventresca [01:00:50]:

Central Ohioans and and listeners, we we do have we've got the resources. We have the education. We have the motivation. It's just that the make the decision to support those in office and those in Agencies like Carly's and like Michael's to to know that we are behind you in your efforts. Thank you both so much. This has been phenomenal, and, yes, we would love to have you come back. But many thanks, you know, to you and to your organizations for all that you do. Listeners, thank you for joining us, and do not forget to check out our show notes. We're gonna have a 2 page list of resources For anyone who has information or or concerns about housing, anything that we've discussed today, you can find all that information on looking forward our way dot come, and we're looking forward to hearing your feedback on this and any of our podcast episodes.