It's time for Barbecue Nation with JT So fire up your grill, light the charcoal, and get your smoker cooking.

Now from the Turn It, Don't Burn it studios in Portland.

Here's jt.

This is an encore.

Hey, everybody.

Welcome to the nation, this barbecue Nation.

I'm JT along with my co host and hall of famer, Leanne Whippen.

And we're coming to you from Turn It, Don't Burn it studios here in the Portland, Oregon area.

We'd like to thank the folks at Painted Hills Natural Beef Beef the way nature intended.

Well, it's a unique name for a unique company that's led by a unique guy, Richard Fergola from Fergolicious Barbecue over in Kansas.

And they're getting ready for the royal.

And Richard, welcome, buddy.

Hey, thanks for having me, guys.

Pleasure.

Yeah.

Leanne says good things about you.

Is that true?

I don't know, man.

I don't know.

She may not have seen the real me yet.

I don't know.

I've been around you quite a bit.

You have, you have, you have.

I appreciate that.

Thank you.

Huh.

So let's kind of start from the top.

How did you get started in this crazy business?

Oh, wow.

You know, well, you know, it's.

It's funny.

So the wife and I used to sit here on the couch at the house and, and watch barbecue pitmasters.

And of course, you know, Leanne was on those first couple season, so, you know, we got.

We got addicted to watching the show and, you know, watch those first few seasons and just never, you know, I was a college and high school wrestling coach.

I was a full time teacher.

And when I retired from.

Well, when I left teaching and went into the administrative.

Administrative role, my colleagues got me a.

A seat for a CBJ class to become a KCBS certified barbecue judge.

And so I went and did that and went and judged my first contest, and kind of the rest was history after that.

We kind of judged five contests to get things started and.

And where we were just blown away by how cool this.

This whole competition barbecue thing was.

We were kind of blown away by it and started Fergalicious.

And actually our son, our youngest son, he's a senior now, but when he was six years old, we were just driving by an empty restaurant here in town, and he just out of nowhere just kind of blurted out, you know, daddy, you should buy that place and call it Fergalicious Barbecue.

And I don't know how he knew what Fergalicious was at 6 years old, but we were like, we were like, that's our song or that's our name.

And, and then just a few short later years later, I'm, I'm on Barbecue Pitmasters myself for the first time.

So everything happened really fast.

I mean really, especially after being on Pitmasters, it just, everything kind of started to steamroll and we had our first rub come out and then, you know, a couple years later I was on Chopped and actually I think Leanne was on the same season of Chop that I was on, just a different episode.

And you know, then we were just recently on Food Network again on Barbecue usa and you know, we're, we're talking to some other people about some other shows.

So it's just all happened in a quick 10 year time Spanish.

And here we are, you know, it's 160 contests later and, and just running and gunning.

Well, that sounds truly like the American barbecue dream right there, buddy.

Yeah.

So, you know, it's a big step and I'm not going to say anything that you don't already know and Leanne can verify me a thousand percent of this, but it's a big step to jump into the restaurant business.

It's one thing to compete, but when you jump into the restaurant business, I'm sure there's times when you said maybe I'm out of my mind.

Well, I don't, we don't have a restaurant.

I never, I, yeah, we never did that.

So that was definitely one thing that I stayed away from.

Okay.

Just because I didn't want to do that.

So in 2018 I had the opportunity to start a brand new barbecue store here in Kansas City, actually in Olathe.

And, and I just, and actually the original idea of the store was going to be a Fergalicious barbecue restaurant and a barbecue store in one.

And I just told the people that I was going to do this with that I wasn't interested in the restaurant piece.

Just make the whole thing a barbecue store and I'll be the face of it and run it.

And so that's what we did.

So from 2018 till just this April, that's what I did.

And then I left there in April to kind of pursue Fergalicious full time.

And actually back in February I met, well, I didn't meet them, I already knew them.

But a couple of the owners from Proud Souls Barbecue in Denver came to take my, my class in February and we just started chatting and we decided that we wanted to partner up and so we are actually opening a new store.

In Kansas City, Missouri, up north, Proud Souls Barbecue, kc.

And so I'm.

I'm officially working for that crew now.

And.

And it's.

It's awesome.

They've got two stores in the Denver area, and we're going to open up a third location in Kansas City.

So it's been really.

A really exciting six months.

I had to keep that secret for quite some time, so I'm just glad we were finally able to.

Congratulations.

Yeah, that's awesome.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Yeah, thank you very much.

So, yeah, the restaurant business, I've got a lot of friends that have barbecue restaurants.

One of my really good friends is Mike Johnson from sugar fire in St.

Louis, and he's got sugar fires all over the country.

And even Mike's always like, ferg, do not.

Do not do that.

So I just didn't want to.

I just didn't want to put in the time for that.

And running a barbecue supply store is enough.

It's enough.

Billy and I told you he was a really sharp guy.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

So you're continually.

I mean, you're hitting the competition circuit pretty hard.

Are you going to continue to do so once the store opens in Kansas City?

I mean, for the first year, I probably won't hit it as hard, but that was one of the really attractive things with this partnership was Tony Roberts, the main.

One of the main owners of Proud Souls.

You know, he.

He brought me on the crew to do what I do best, and that's promote and market and do events and.

And go out and compete and put our name out there.

And so they want me to continue to do what I do, and that's competing.

And, you know, this year, when I left the other store in April, kind of when the season was just getting going, I decided to hit it hard.

So I think we just completed our 21st contest for this toy year, and we've got about 10 more to go.

And, you know, that includes both Royals and the Jack and some other big.

And the World Championships in November.

So, you know, I think we're number six in toy right now in team of the year.

So I'm just trying to, you know, try to see if I can sneak in one or two more GCs and see if we can finish up there in the top five, maybe top three.

Yeah.

That's great.

So we need to check something right now.

You're.

You're one of the judges, Leanne, at the World Food Championships.

Are we bribing you?

Are we bribing you today?

No, I'm looking forward to going there.

They're going to have, yeah.

A few of us out there.

It's going to be fun.

I was out there last year.

That's quite the event, I must say, as is the Jack and the Royal.

I'll see you at the Royal and you'll be at the Invitational and the Open out there.

I will be, yes.

And you made that.

You made the draw for the Jack, too.

Finally, after.

After 18 grand championships and seven years, I finally.

I finally got my name drawn.

That is amazing.

I mean, what are the odds of that?

That's just extreme.

I mean, I felt bad because I was like, in the draw three times and I didn't get it.

And I was like, you know, I finally made it in, but 18.

Well, good for you.

So good as well.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Your line of products, what are you carrying right now?

Like what.

How many rubs do you have?

Do you have any sauces?

Yeah, so we have six rubs on the market right now.

And we have the original, we have our sweet, we have our Red Hot, we have our spg, we have our American Pie, and our newest one is our Smoke Show Sauces.

My co packer that does my rubs, Old World spices, they weren't in the sauce business until now.

They kind of.

They bought out Head country, so they now have access to those.

To those.

The plant there where they.

Where they make their sauces.

So we are in discussions for 23 to come out with a couple sauces ourselves for fertilizer.

Fantastic.

Very good.

What's been the biggest part of your learning curve?

You're a retired teacher, so you obviously got a handle on that.

But, Rich, what's the.

What's been the toughest part for you in all this?

Probably being away from family.

You know, it's.

It's.

You're definitely.

You're definitely on the road a lot.

You know, when I was a college head wrestling coach, you know, I had to be out recruiting all the time and traveling and.

And our kids were young then, and so it was a little harder to do that then.

And just you're giving up a lot of time.

And, you know, I struggled with that.

It was.

It was tough.

It's tough on everybody.

And I think now that our kids are older, it's a little better.

And then just.

Just staying on top of everything.

I mean, sometimes I feel like, you know, like this week and next week, I can assure you that's how I'm going to feel is, you know, you're being pulled, you know, 30,000 different directions.

I mean, I think I've got four of these interviews just this week on top of preparing for a contest this weekend and getting ready for next weekend's, you know, because it's not.

It's not even next weekend.

It's all of next week.

The royal.

Pretty much the entire.

The entire week.

So, you know, that's kind of.

It's.

It's a lot.

It's a lot on your plate.

It's a lot to keep in your head and keep organized.

And on top of that, we're entering the party of the year, and so there's a lot happening, a lot going on there that you got to keep track of.

So you need a personal assistant.

Yeah, I mean, that would help.

I mean, my wife does help with a lot of that stuff since, you know, she.

She works with.

With Fergalicious full time, so she helps me with a lot of those side things and take some of that off my plate.

But, yeah, I mean, we.

I could use a few more.

Always.

An extra set of hands is always very helpful, you know, Very helpful.

I don't compete, but I do cook.

And whenever you can get, you know, free labor, it's always good.

That's exactly.

That's been my motto for a long time.

We are talking with Richard Fergalow from Fergalicious Barbecue in Kansas.

You said Olafy.

Olaf.

He's got a.

I don't know if they're still there, but I used to buy boots from the Leafy Boot company years ago.

So just a little trivia question there.

Our tidbit there.

They made great boots.

I don't know how they did with their barbecue, but they made great boots.

Anyway, we are gonna take.

We're gonna take a break.

We're gonna be back with Richard Fergaloa from Fergalicious Barbecue in Kansas right after this.

Please stay.

Hey, everybody, it's Jeff here.

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This is an encore.

Hey, everybody, it's JT from Barbecue Nation, and I've got a little update for you.

As you know, if you've been watching the news, Hurricane Ian is pounding Florida in various areas.

And I got a message from our friend Stan Hayes from Operation Barbecue Relief.

Stan's trucks are already up on The Tennessee Georgia Line ready to go down into Florida.

They expect to be there for two to three weeks.

And they have the capacity to serve up to 60,000 meals a day.

That's right, 60, 60,000 meals a day.

But they're going to need a little help.

So I'm letting all you folks know that listen to our show, that you can help them.

If you want to sign up as a volunteer or if you want to donate, just go to obr.org obr.org of course, that's Operation Barbecue Relief.

You can also share this out with your friends, family, maybe even your local media.

With the increased cost of fuel and food, this will be one of their most costly deployments down there.

So Stan Hayes and his crew at OBR are going to need a little support, and I encourage you all to reach out and help them.

Again, just go to OBR.org and you can volunteer or you can send them some money, or you can at least just wish them well.

We're talking with Richard Fragola today from Pergalicious Barbecue there in Kansas.

Tell us about your process, Rich, when you're getting ready to go, how you told us before we actually started recording today about you were, you know, going through selecting pork butts and different things like that.

Give our listeners an idea of what you do to get prepped to go to a competition.

Yeah, it's pretty extensive.

You know, I've got the probably the world's greatest pork sponsor in Pray Fresh.

And, you know, that's what I'm doing right now.

I'm literally standing out here with four cases of pork shoulders and I'm picking through them and, you know, finding out what I want to use for the royal.

And just, you know, I think, I think the lesson behind that piece is preparation, you know, barbecue contest.

Not saying that you can't just go pick something out of the grocery store and, you know, just show up and cook.

I mean, there's a lot of people that do that.

But when you're wanting to compete at a high level and you're wanting to do really well, preparation is key.

And if you are going to show up to a contest like the American Royal, where you're going to have, you know, not just the nations, but the world's best cooks there, you need to have.

You need to have something prepared, something ready, and you need to bring your A game.

And so that's, you know, that's what I'm doing right now as far as just a normal week of contest, you know, getting the trailer Clean, refilling it with supplies, making sure the smoker's clean and back and ready to go.

Getting all my meats in order.

Yesterday was Sunday, so I get all my butts and ribs and briskets out of the freezer and they're in the fridge, you know, getting ready.

Tomorrow we'll pick up chicken and our garnish and we'll get that home.

And then Wednesday morning we trim.

So Wednesday morning is my trim day.

Tuesdays we make sauces and then Thursdays we make injections and, and then Friday we hit the road and we're ready to roll.

So there's a whole plan in place.

Everything's got its, you know, got its place and we try to stick to that and stay in order and, and execute our, execute every mark.

So when we show up at a contest, you know, it's flawless and it's stress free.

That's always what I say to people is when you're at a contest, if you can remain stress free and stay consistent, then you've got a good chance of being successful.

You know, there's a lot of people that go to these contests and they strive to be the best and get their GCs like yourself, and you're very consistent.

You win a lot.

How did you get to that level?

How did you learn what sauces, rubs to use?

Methods, cookers, There had to be something that brought you to that next level.

Did you go to other cookers and have them help you out, give you tips?

Did you learn online?

Are you self taught?

Like, how did you get to the level that you're at?

Yeah, I've never officially taken a class.

Never done that.

You listen, you put your ear to the ground, you learn things.

You know, I had an opportunity to learn some things from Tim Grant from Truebud, probably one of the greatest teams of all time.

And other than that, just trial and error, you know, learning and you know, when I started developing my own rubs, I mean, I wanted to make sure that they were world class product that could go to these events and win.

And I think we've proven that.

And you know, you just gotta keep cooking.

You know, a lot of people that come and take my comp classes, you know, they'll say, oh, we cook, you know, three, three or four comps a year.

And I'm like, you know, then I'll ask them, what's your goal?

Is your, is your goal just to go do that and have fun?

If it is, that's fine.

But if your goal is to hear your name called and have people handing you checks and trophies and.

And to be one of the best teams in the world three or four times a year is not going to do it because you're not getting in a rhythm.

And I feel like that's an important thing, is getting in a rhythm, getting in a routine.

That's why, you know, people.

Some people ask me if I'm competing this weekend, the weekend before the row, and I go, absolutely.

I want to stay in my routine so that when I show up at the Royal, because when I'm at the Royal, as you will know, Leanne, it's a crazy.

It's a crazy place.

There's lots of distractions.

Absolutely.

You know, not just.

Not just from a party standpoint, but everybody's there.

And so there are people that want to see you while you're there, because they may not see you any other time of the year.

So, you know, when I'm doing my prep, I basically have to have my wife or somebody that's with me, you know, tell people to come back, you know, at this time, that's when I'll be done, so that I can just do that and not be bothered at all.

So, you know, that that's.

Those are all little steps that you take to, you know, make sure you can be successful at that level.

And consistent.

I go back to that same word.

You got to be consistent.

You got to.

You got to learn how not to chase your tail.

You know, if you're running.

Running a flavor profile and it's not hitting, you know, don't.

Don't change automatically.

You know, I mean, for example, my last four contests in chicken, I changed something four contests ago, and we went first place with a 180.

We went third place.

We were 19 from a 180.

We went second place.

We were 19 from 180.

And then this last weekend, I got 14th in chicken.

So that's a perfect example of how not to panic.

You know, I know my chicken profile hits three out of those four comps.

I'm not going to go and change anything.

I'm going to run it again this weekend.

You know, so just little things like that and understanding that psychology of competition, barbecue can really definitely help improve your game.

We're going to take a break.

Excuse me.

We're going to take a break here on Barbecue Nation on the USA Radio networks, and we're going to come back with Richard Fergalowa from Fergalicious Barbecue in just a couple of minutes.

Please stay with us.

Hey, everybody, it's JT and I have eaten.

If you've ever looked at me, you know that.

But I have eaten seafood all over the world, and I can tell you there's no place better than here in Oregon and our Dungeness crab.

If you want to learn more about Oregon Dungeness crab, just go to oregondungeness.org find out how to cook it, how to catch it, where to buy it, and the sustainability of what they're doing there in the Oregon Crab Commission.

Check it out.

This is an encore.

Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.

And the name is Forgola.

How's that?

I got.

There you go.

We got it out there.

We'd like to thank the folks at Painted Hills Natural Beef, as always for supporting this show.

And some of the actual best beef in the country is Painted Hills Natural Beef, just like your grandfather used to raise.

If you raised cattle, you can check them out online at painted hills natural beef.com and also guenter Wilhelm knives.

Excellent knives, Great efficiency.

They hold an edge.

They're well balanced.

They work for me, they work for Leanne, they work meathead.

They work for a lot of people.

So you can check them out online@gunterwilhelm.com and of course, one time really quickly here before we get back to Rich.

You can find us on most all platforms.

Whether you use Apple products or you got a Android or whatever, we're out there.

You can find us.

All you got to do is, is if you're going to search, just do Barbecue Nation, BBQ Nation, jt, and that'll bring it up.

Anyway, we are talking with Rich Vergola.

See, I got it twice in a row now, buddy.

And there you go.

You got it.

You're on a roll now.

I'm on a roll.

Watch out, world from Fergalicious Barbecue.

When you're, when you're prepping, and I know we don't get too much down into the real minutiae of this very often, but I'm really curious because of your success, walk us through the trim process.

Now, if somebody doesn't know what that is and they're flipping channels right now, Rich is going to tell us how he preps his.

Well, let's just take brisket.

He might not tell us.

He might not.

Well, when I'm talking about trimming, you know, no secret ingredients here, but give us the overview of that.

Yeah, sure.

You know, it's when you're trimming, when you're trimming for a barbecue competition, it's important to, that you are always aware of what exactly you're.

What is your end result?

What is it that you are trying to achieve with that.

With that trend method that you're going for?

You know, for chicken example, I'm looking for similarity in size.

I'm looking for similarity in weight.

I'm looking to take off the stuff that I don't necessarily want, that I don't want the judges to have, you know, so I'm looking for uniformity is what I'm really going for.

And then with ribs, it's kind of the same thing.

I'm looking for uniformity in that rib.

You know, a lot of people, when they're coming to my class for the first time, they always kind of freak out because they're, like, watching me trim all this stuff off, and I'm like, well, I want it to cook evenly, and I'm only concerned about the parts that I want.

So I really have to take my ribs, those slabs, down to the parts that I want to turn in for a barbecue contest.

Sure.

And so that's.

That's.

That's an important thing.

And you really got to know the anatomy of your ribs to get.

To get that where you want it through the marbling, through the thickness, all those things come into play.

They're all very variables for that.

So when I'm trimming that, I'm trying to get any surface fat off that's visible.

You know, that's gonna.

That's gonna make the appearance look difference.

I try to get rid of that and get down to the brass packs of the rib that I want.

And I do four slabs of ribs for a contest, and, you know, it's pretty.

I don't know.

It's pretty.

Ribs are pretty easy.

And same thing with butts.

You know, a lot of.

A lot of teams out there that do butts, they take the bone out.

Now, with the way the new KCBS rule is on pork now, a lot of guys are just hacking off with money, muscle and just cooking that by itself, which I've done this year, and I will do a couple of those at the Royal, too, just to have some extra money on hand.

But you're exposing that money.

You're exposing the piece.

The pieces that you want to get to get smoke to and get color to.

And then with brisket, I'm trimming down.

I'm separating the flat in the point, and I'm trimming that flat down to box width for me.

And I don't really cook the point anymore.

I only cook the flat and turn in slices I have a whole philosophy on that, too.

But, you know, it's all about cleaning it up, looking, making sure that when you put that on the pit, it's going to cook clean.

It's going to cook even.

You're going to get smoke and color and flavor on all the parts that you want.

So then you turn that in, the judges, they get the best.

Well, I saw on your website that you work with Green Mountain Grills.

They're a great grill.

Is that what you're using in comp now is a pellet smoker, or what are you using?

No, I am an ambassador for Green Mountain.

I do a lot of that stuff in the backyard here at home.

But I've been competing on the same type of pit for.

Oh, this is probably my seventh season.

Now I compete on a Meyer Nixon gravity feed smoker.

So it's charcoal.

It's charcoal and wood.

And it's also a water cooker, but it's.

It feeds itself.

So I've got like a barbecue guru fan system because it's a fully insulated smoker and I love it.

It's won me a world championship.

It's won me a lot of every grand championship I've won has been on.

On that poker.

So I love it.

It's mounted to the back of our.

Of our porch on our trailer, and I set my temperature on that guru, and it just does its thing, you know, just.

And the water pan is phenomenal.

Really makes a huge difference in a lot of areas.

Heat, balance, moisture, the color, everything.

Fantastic.

Cool.

Well, you said you don't cook the points.

So are you.

When you're.

When you're looking at briskets and I'm to take with you, how many are you taking?

And are you.

Go ahead.

And are you trimming the flat off before you go?

And then are you just taking the whole thing and cutting it there so you know exactly what you want, how it looks and feels that day?

Oh, I do.

I do all trimming at my house.

I don't trim anything on site.

So like I said earlier, on Wednesday mornings is when I do my trimming.

So on Wednesday mornings, that's when I have all my meats laid out and I'm ready to roll.

For example, for the next month or so, I've already trimmed all my brisket.

So all my briskets for the royal are trimmed.

All my brisket for the jack is trimmed.

And so I basically got a freezer full of Cryovac Snakeware Farms Gold Wagyu points.

But I've just I think we've gotten to a point now where, no pun intended, that I think the Snake River Farms gold briskets are so good, their points are so good, they're so well marbled that you can turn in six of the best burnt ends in the world.

And I think we still have some judges that struggle with that.

With that texture.

I don't think they understand, like, when it's melting in your mouth like that, but that's a good thing.

I think sometimes it gets interpreted as fatty, but that's just kind of what I've noticed.

The trend over the last couple years is I think some judges struggle to judge really good burn in, so I just decided just to leave them out.

So I'm just giving them, you know, six, seven, eight, nine of the best slices I can turn in.

And it's really fared well for me.

So I think right now in brisket, I think I moved into the number 10 brisket team in the world, so.

Well, something's to be said for that, certainly.

Yeah.

I mean, it's just, you know, you just got to pay attention to the trends, and.

And I mean, I.

I love cooking the burnt ends, and I think they're fantastic.

I just think that.

I just think it's harder for them to judge.

So how does it differ from what you cook at home?

I mean, just Tuesday night, you're not going out this week to a comp or anything.

So how.

How does that.

How does that balance with each other?

Are you doing the exact same thing at home for your family, or are you toning down the seasoning?

Are you.

Are you shortening the cook times?

I mean, what are you doing there?

Because that's something that people that listen to this show, Rich, have asked me.

You know, they're like, well, you talk to a lot of competition people, but we're never going to do that.

So, you know, what are we doing at home type thing?

Sure, sure.

Yeah.

When I cook at home, no, I different.

I'm not being as aggressive on my trimming.

I'm not.

I'm not using all the different flavor profiles.

I simplify it.

I cook in the smoke a little bit longer than I do, you know, before I wrap than I would in a competition, so.

And I'll push the temps a little further, a little harder than I would in the competition because, you know, I don't have to worry about my family taking one bite and writing the score down.

So.

Right.

You know, I'm giving them.

I'm giving them some really, really, really good backyard Barbecue.

And.

And typically when I'm at home, I'm cooking on my drum or I'm cooking on my GMG pellet grill.

So different flavor profiles there than what my competition pit does.

Sure.

So your competition pit.

I find this interesting because I bring a whole bunch of different cookers to comps because I like certain meats on certain cookers.

And you can vary your temperatures, whatever.

So you're cooking all of your meat on one cooker?

Yep.

And are you using, like, a key temp or like 275 or are you.

What are you doing?

What are you doing?

I cook everything at 275.

My smoker is running at 275 for the entire competition.

And like I said, it is a water cooker.

So it has a water pan in the bottom, which is a huge.

It's a huge factor in that cook.

And I use pecan wood only.

It's.

And I is very aged.

So I have a.

I mentioned my.

My pork sponsor earlier, Vaughn Wood Products out of Missouri.

They give me all my wood.

And so what I do is I have wood like I have wood in my garage right now that I will use for next season.

And so it's aging right now.

So the wood I'm using now I got over a year ago and let it age.

So I get good smoke, I get good color.

But the thing about pecan is it's not.

It's not overly smoky.

It's not like it's from the same family as hickory, but hickory is a lot more bold.

So I use pecan and, you know, and I use royal oak lump charcoal.

So I don't really.

I don't push the smoke super hard.

I mean, I'm using little tiny chunks, maybe the width of my two fingers.

And I'm giving it.

I'm giving it the color it needs, and I'm giving it the little blast of smoke that it needs, but I'm not overpowering it.

And I think that's where sometimes people that are getting into competition barbecue make their first mistake is they feel like they got to be, you know, tossing tons of wood in this fire.

And fire management is probably one of the main things I talk about in my comp classes or any class backyard or comp, you know, because whether you're cooking in your backyard for your family or cooking at the American Royal for a world championship, I mean, you still got to know how to run proper fire and make sure that you're, you know, it's getting oxygen that it needs.

So.

So that you're not seeing any smoke coming out of your.

Out of your stack, you know, and that means you're running clean.

And, you know your food is going to be banging.

We're going to take a break.

We're going to be back with Richard Fergola.

Let's see.

You got it.

I did it that time from Fergalicious Barbecue down Rich lives a little ways down, kind of south and west from Kansas City, but he is all over the map.

So we'll be right back on Barbecue Nation.

Please stay with us.

Hey, everybody, it's jt.

You know, I talk about painted hills all the time, and we always say beef the way nature intended.

But it's more than that because each bite of painted hills will make your taste buds explode.

Put a big, bright smile on your face, and whoever's at your dinner table will have a big, bright smile on their face.

And you can thank me for that later.

Just go to painted hillsbeef.com and find out more.

You won't regret it.

Hey, everybody, J.T.

Here.

I want to tell you about Hammerstahl knives.

Hammer Stahl combines German steel with beautiful and functioning designs.

They're part of the Heritage Steel Group, which also does their pots and pans.

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Check out the Hammer Stahl knives.

If you're really into cooking, I think you're really gonna like them.

This is an encore.

Hey, everybody, I wanted to let you know that we've added another feature here on Barbecue Nation.

Our good friend Kel Phelps from Barbecue News magazine and the NBBQA will be sharing with us here on the show.

Twice a month, update stories, news features, and upcoming events from both NBBQA and the Barbecue magazine.

So without any further ado, here's Kel Phelps.

Hey, welcome, y'all.

I'm Kel Phelps, publisher of Barbecue News magazine and managing partner of the National Barbecue and Grilling Association.

Thanks for listening.

And here's what's smoking now.

The American Royal Barbecue hall of fame inducted their 2022 class on October 1st.

John Marcus of Manhattan, New York, Ed Mitchell from Wilson, North Carolina, Joe Traeger from Mount Angel, Oregon, and Leanne Whippen from Tampa, Florida, were all inducted in recognition of their notable impact on the barbecue craft through achievement.

And additionally, Bobby Mueller from Taylor, Texas, Karen Putman from Kansas City, Missouri, and Adam Scott, Goldsboro, North Carolina, have all been selected as legacy members to the hall of Fame as well.

Congrats to each and every one of you on this monumental achievement.

The National Barbecue and Grilling association has released details about their 2023 upcoming National Conference and Expo.

Orlando, Florida will be the location for the February 15th through the 18th event.

And you can find more details on this event at the website mbbqa.org sure to have lots more information coming about this event as well.

Are you serious about your barbecue and grilling game, but looking to dive a little deeper?

Man, we'd love to have you join up with us at the national barbecue and Grilling Association.

Learn more now@mbbqa.org hey, thanks as always for listening.

And until next time, you guys, keep it smoking.

If you would like more information regarding either barbecue news magazine or the NBBQA, just go to barbecue news.com or nbbqa.org simple as that.

Welcome back to Barbecue Nation.

I'm JT along with hall of Famer Ms.

Leanne Whippen.

And if all you folks are headed to Kansas City here in a week or so, and you're gonna run into Leanne, probably, and you're gonna run into Richard, probably, and you won't run into me because I won't be there this year.

But we'll miss you.

You'll miss me.

I know you say that to me once in a while.

You know.

I do.

Yeah.

Miss my, My charm and my.

Debonair.

Yes.

Is that the right word for me?

Debonair?

Anyway, Rich, you were talking about, you know, no bark on your, on the, The.

Your wooden stuff and that you use a, A lump charcoal from.

I think you said Kingsford.

No.

Royal.

Excuse me.

Sorry.

Bad Jeff, how long did it take you to really figure out your fire management?

Is a question I wanted to follow up on from the last segment, because what I've seen is sometimes people hit it right on the money, and then other times, no pun intended, they're kind of all over the map.

So how long did it take you to kind of get that nailed down?

It's not something that you learn overnight, for sure.

It probably took me a few years to really get settled in and understand the airflow and the oxygen and running the dampers and, you know, looking for that clean.

And also just tasting things, you know, and tasting what too much smoke tastes like and what, you know, the, the mild tastes like, and just getting that.

That palate formed and understanding, you know, what.

What it's supposed to be like.

And so it took a few years.

Was that a big job for you?

And.

Let me finish that question.

You just said something that I found very indicative of palate.

Right.

You know, when somebody walks in off the street, and they.

You hand them a rib from a competition, that's probably not what they're used to if they've never done it before.

So how much palate exercise, meaning how much did you have to eat to get this nailed down to where you.

You thought you had it?

You know, again, it's probably a few years.

You know, you just gotta.

You gotta keep playing with it.

You gotta.

And that's cooking all meats, you know, whether it's chicken wings or.

Or pork loins or pork butts or ribs or briskets or whatever.

You really got to put that time in to kind of understand, you know, what that is that you're looking for.

And I think.

I think that palate is definitely something you have to get.

And, you know, people always ask me, what's your favorite, you know, what's your favorite barbecue to eat?

And I'm like, I really don't go eat barbecue that often just because I'm around it so much, you know, and I don't.

And when you've got your face buried in a.

In a smoker as much as.

As much as I do, you kind of just, you know, you want to go eat tacos or you want to go eat, you know, pizza.

Yeah.

Chinese food.

Yeah, I love Chinese food.

So, you know, just trying to.

Trying to stay on top of all that.

You know, I think we're at.

I'm at a point now where, I mean, I've got a pretty good understanding of what.

What I'm trying to hit, what I'm looking for.

And, you know, I know when I.

When I do hit it, and I know when I don't hit it, so.

It gets a little easier, I think.

Yeah, for sure.

I mean, you know, it's like anything, you know, the more you do it, the more.

The more time you put into it.

I mean, I think it goes back to what we were talking about at the beginning of the conversation is, you know, everybody talks about practice.

For me, it's not really practice because I don't.

I don't really practice competition at home.

I think when you're in a contest, that's your learning ground right there, you know, because you got.

You're under the gun.

You got.

You got time frames you got to meet, and, you know, you still got to be able to attack and hit every mark that you set forth for yourself for that contest.

And I think that's where it's the hardest place to do.

When you're at home, you don't have any of those pressures And I don't think you can.

You can learn as much.

You know, anything you can learn at home is okay.

It's going to take me approximately this much time to do this profile that I've been working on and whatnot.

And.

But when you're under the gun, that's when you're really learning.

That's the, the best.

That's the best learning place.

Obviously, you've never been to my house because I always seem to be under time constraints, especially around the holidays.

Family pressure, timeline, family pressure, time, you know, and they're all sitting in the kitchen.

Yeah.

Richard, you've taught some classes.

I know.

Do you have any upcoming classes that you're going to be teaching?

Yes, I just, just at the end of the week.

Last week, I just announced my three dates for my competition.

Class is going to be at our new store here in Kansas City, Missouri.

All that you can find on my website@sugarliciousbbq.com it's on all my social media.

But we'll be doing a date in December, a date in January, and a date in February.

So like I said, all that can be found on our website and all the registration can be.

Can be handled there, too.

Isn't it a little cold in Kansas City, then?

Yeah, but that's the best time for comp classes, you know, because you can, you know, you're basically the off season.

So people have, you know, they have the time to go do that where we're not, you know, messing with contests or anything like that.

Real quick, Rich, where can people find you, find out about you if they need to contact you or they want to.

How do they do that?

So on social media platforms, we are on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter are under Fergalicious bbq, and that is Fergalicious with an O.

And we also have our website@fergaliciousbbq.com you can order all of our products from there as well as find out anything else that's going on.

There you go.

Rich, thanks for being on the show.

Today and best of luck at the Royal, at the Jack, at the Worlds.

I'll see you two out of the three.

So awesome.

Awesome.

Best of luck.

It's all good.

All right.

Thank you very much.

You bet.

We'll be back next week with another edition of Barbecue Nation with Leanne and myself.

Until then, remember our motto here.

Turn it, don't burn it.

Take care, everybody.

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