Hello, human collective.

Welcome to the Upside to Grief.

My name is Story, and I am your host.

And my name is Erica and I'm your co host.

And today, as you can see, Sheri is here with us finally.

We're very excited to have her on the podcast.

Yes.

We said she was coming and she's here.

Yes.

Sheri is one of our sponsors for the podcast with Azadi Healing, and you will hear more about that later.

But thank you so much for coming on.

We're super excited to have you on here.

Thank you for having me.

Super honored.

We are super excited.

We also want to express a very gentle trigger warning because part of Sheri's story has to do with suicide and suicide survivors.

So if that is too much for you or a trigger, then please still follow along.

You can read the description to this chapter or you can follow along next week because Sheri will also be doing a segment with us that we're very excited.

So, yeah, we're really, really excited.

And who are you going to be talking about today?

My dad.

Ugh, your dad?

My dad.

Okay.

Yes.

Who was your dad?

Well, my dad was born Skandar Saber Hanavar, so he went by Alex.

He was born in 1938 in Iran, and he was the first of our family to the United States, and he never went back to Iran and slowly but surely brought our family over.

Wow, that's so cool.

Yeah, it's so trailblazer.

Standar.

See where you get it from?

Oh, yeah, there's that very on brand.

Yeah.

So he loved to play soccer.

He was a champion wrestler.

He wrestled in Iran.

He wrestled when he moved here.

He did some college wrestling, but his first love was soccer, so that was, like, his obsessive passion.

And, yeah, my parents were married for 20 years.

How old was your dad when he came here?

He was 20.

Early 20s.

Early 20s.

But you know what?

My dad told me this story that one time that he went to the movie theater in town and rushed and played, paid like 5 cents or 25 cents for a movie, and he watched a movie with Clark Gable.

He was like, that's it.

I. I need to go to America for real.

That was like his.

His, like, inspiration.

And my dad, if, you know, I think you've both seen pictures of my dad when he was young.

He literally looked like a movie star.

Yeah.

So, yeah, that was his dream, to come be in the United States.

And he did it.

And he did.

He did.

Yeah.

He was a very handsome man.

Very strong jawline.

Aquiline.

I think that's the word.

Aquiline nose.

Just very beautiful brown eyes.

Sherry, for those of you watching, check it out.

Yeah.

You guys have the most perfect of noses.

Those were, like.

Those are coveted.

But, yeah, Sherry looks like her dad.

It's a.

It's beautiful.

I love it.

Now, I used to judge my nose so hard when I was young and even almost did surgery.

Oh, my goodness.

I know.

Can you believe it?

So, yeah, I'm grateful for my nose now.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

So what was life like growing up with dad?

So my dad, before he owned his wrought iron business, was a bartender.

And so he worked at, like, the Disneyland Hotel.

And he would work with, like, famous people, and they would come to the bar and he had, like, really late nights.

So growing up, I didn't get to see him a lot.

He was working a lot.

So life with my dad would be him coming home at like, 2 in the morning from work and waking me up because he wanted to see me.

And my poor mom would be like, don't wake her up.

And he would come in and wake me up and tickle me.

And I would be so excited to see him.

Like, it was.

He was just like everything to me.

And then he'd go to sleep and my poor mom would be left with, you know, and life with my dad was.

He never wanted to see me in pain.

So whatever he had to do to keep me away from any type of pain, emotional, physical, you know, if harm ever come, came towards me, he was very passionate about keeping me safe, like, in a.

Pretty.

Well, like a.

Kind of like a lion, really.

And so, yeah, I always felt loved by him.

He never, Never raised a hand to me.

I mean, he never spanked me one time in my entire life, which may have been bad or good, I don't know, but never caused me pain.

Emotional, physical.

He was the most supportive, inspirational, uplifting human being I've ever known.

So that's what it was like with him.

And for those of you who don't know Sherry personally, she's a California girl.

So when he worked at Disneyland and, you know, around famous people is because you lived, like, in the greater LA area, right?

Yeah.

So I was actually Orange County.

Yeah.

I was born in Westminster, So it's like LA County.

Ish.

Lived there till I was probably maybe 4 or 5.

And then we moved to Upland, where Betsy's memorial was.

Yeah, in that vicinity.

So he would drive from Upland to LA to go to work.

Where is Upland?

San Bernardino.

Yeah, San Bernardino County.

Like the base of Mount Baldy.

That's where I lived.

Okay.

Yeah.

Really pretty big commute in order to do stuff that he was having fun with.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And then my parents got divorced when I was nine and he moved to Laguna beach.

And so I'd go visit him on the weekends and get to be around my whole Persian side of the family, which was so amazing.

You know, my brother had, or my dad had nine brothers and sisters, so huge family.

That's a big family.

A lot of parties, a lot of love, a lot of good food.

Yeah.

But he got them all to come over here.

How do you think he did that?

Just by telling them how awesome it was in the States or.

What do you think?

I'm not sure.

You know, my mom will probably know, but there's.

I'm sure that my uncles started coming over one by one, and then I have one aunt that's still in Iran.

So all my.

My family's here now, except for my aunt and a couple of my cousins still live there.

Yeah.

I feel like the answer is kind of obvious, like with you describing your dad's personality a little bit, but it's just kind of interesting.

Like, you got.

He got his big ass family.

A lot of.

That's a lot of people.

And then like straight up too, right into like LA Disneyland, famous people.

Like, he's like, American dream, let's go.

And like, most of them stayed with my parents when they first came to the US like my grandparents getting acclimated.

Yeah.

And then they would, you know, it was like their stopping point.

And then they would get their own places and.

Yeah.

It's just life with them was so much.

It's just fun.

It's a great.

A great childhood in that way.

That's awesome.

Yeah.

And my mom and dad met on a blind date.

Really?

How did they get hooked up?

They got hooked up by my mom's.

Two of my mom's friends.

I can't remember their names.

She'll listen to this and be like, how could you not remember?

But it was.

It was their.

They were.

He was friends with my dad and she was friends with my mom, and they took him on a blind date.

They went to Long beach to the Pike.

That was their first date.

Cool.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then they.

So then you're going to your dad's every other weekend or.

Every weekend and every other weekend.

Yep.

My parents would meet halfway from Upland to Laguna and I would.

I would just go and run amok at my dad's house.

Okay.

No.

No discipline, no rules.

That's like the other Side of the.

The coin with how your relationship was, huh?

Oh, yeah.

Never.

I mean, I just was running amok in the neighborhoods and hanging out with friends and toilet papering houses, and this is like 10 years old, you know, I mean, lighting fires at school, down the street, just.

Just all kind.

All manner of stuff.

Yeah.

Sherry, the mini arsonist.

Yes.

It really was.

Can I, like, look.

Look back at things like that?

I'm like, wow, I just had.

No, it explains a lot.

So tons of freedom.

He would take me to his soccer trips.

Like, most of the traveling I did when I was young, you know, he would take me, like, to Canada and Hawaii, and we would go hang out with the Phoenix Club, the guys at the.

You know, all the German guys, the European guys.

Yep.

What is the Phoenix Club?

It's like a German soccer club in Anaheim.

Okay.

And my dad was.

Used to play with the Germans.

I mean, that was like, you know, during that time when he was younger, I would go to his games and travel with him, you know, soccer tournaments.

And at the time, I didn't appreciate it as much as I do now.

Like, looking back, the memories of it are just so sweet and like, man, what a time.

You know, those.

Those times with all the guys and they would be so happy to see me when I'd come visit and go on the soccer fields and.

Yeah, it was cool.

That is cool.

It was cool.

He would take me, you know, to work with him.

I'd love.

This is so lame, but he owned a wrought iron shop with my uncle, and so I would go with him to job sites and help him measure the fence.

I would just be so excited to visit my dad.

And then I'd have to come home on the, you know, on Sunday and be, like, bummed out and a brat for my mom.

Yeah, she had to.

She had to rewire Aftermath.

Yeah.

So tons of freedom, tons of love.

And then we moved to Oregon, my mom and I.

Right.

So then I'm like 15 going into high school, and that's when I started to really go downhill, you know, with my life choices and stuff.

And my dad would come.

Oh, here's another good one.

This is.

This is a snapshot of my dad for you.

Okay.

So I'm, like, not doing well.

Okay.

Doing all kinds of bad stuff.

How old are you?

15, 16.

I just got a car, you know, parents bought me a car, and I told my mom, I'm gonna go camping.

I was living in Oregon at the time.

And she's like, no.

She told me I couldn't Go.

And I said, oh, I'm going.

And I left anyway.

And I came home on Monday morning and my car was gone.

She had sold her car and my car and bought a new car for herself.

Oh, shit.

It's like a punishment, you know?

And so I called my dad and that week he brought a brand new Jetta Volkswagen up, drove it to Oregon, dropped it off, and then flew back home.

Mom was probably pissed.

She was so pissed.

Oh, shit.

Dad's be doing that.

So total.

Just.

What's the word when you just throw someone?

Like when your mom's trying to discipline you and he comes in and just takes the tablecloth off the table and just, you know.

Yeah.

So, I mean, it's a good memory for you.

Maybe your mom feels different, but I.

Think she probably laughs about it now.

Cool.

Just not then.

Oh, no.

Yeah, Yeah.

I have some things like that.

And in my childhood growing up where it was dad that came in and was like.

For me, I was like, yes.

My mom's like, what the fuck are you doing?

Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Just completely.

He just couldn't see me in pain.

It literally killed him if, like, when I started getting tattoos, he was so not mad because of the tattoos, but the pain it causes your body.

That's so funny.

He would literally freak out about it.

Like, doesn't that hurt?

Like, you know, he's just so passionate, so.

That's cute.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So he played soccer till he was 82.

Wow.

So a lot of the guys he, you know, none of them played soccer anymore.

So he started playing with a group of guys and it was co ed down here in Encinitas.

They would go off Santa Fe, where his memorial was, and play.

But yeah, he kept playing till he was 82.

So what was your guys's relationship like?

You know, 20s and 30s and, you know, right when you were 4.

How long were you in Oregon for?

Yeah.

When did you come back down?

So I lived in Oregon until I was just about to turn 19.

I was 18.

Right after high school.

Right.

I moved back down to California.

He lived in Oceanside.

I got clean.

Right.

So about that time, he.

I was living with my dad, my uncle, two of my cousins.

We lived in this huge house in Oceanside.

And life was so good.

Like, he.

He was so supportive and he accepted my new recovery community.

Like, it was the most amazing thing.

We had all the parties at my house.

You know how people have the party house for a while and then it moves to the next house?

Well, mine was like, the house we'd have permanent.

Oh, yeah.

Every.

I mean, we had no furniture guys.

Zero furniture.

My house was a bachelor pad with no couches.

Anyone who's listening who was there 30 years ago know this is the truth.

No couches, no chairs.

Finally he got maybe one couch, but we would just sit on the floor at my house.

And it was a huge, beautiful 3,000 square foot house.

3,000 square foot beds in the rooms.

That was it.

No furniture.

We did have a dining table, but.

That'S all you need.

Yeah.

So he was just really supportive.

He would take me to meetings because I didn't have a car yet until, you know, I got a car and supported me, you know, encouraged me to go back to school and didn't want me hanging out with boys, which didn't work out.

Yeah, come on, I'm 19.

Yeah.

He's just gotta have some fun.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We.

We would eat dinner together at the table.

At the table.

He made dinner.

He would make oatmeal for breakfast.

Was he a cook?

He cooked very specific things.

Okay.

This is my dad.

He would come to a party with a Ziploc bag with lamb chops.

Marinated lamb chops.

Marinated lamb chops.

Okay.

Like, let's say like, you know, Lisa and Dana are having a barbecue and they invite us over.

He would bring a bag of lamb chops, like random.

It's my dad.

Lamb chops are good, though.

They are, yeah.

You know, really good.

So.

Yeah.

So Middle Eastern too.

Yes.

A bag of lamb chops.

Yep.

So it was like a bachelor pad.

And me, they gave me the.

The master bedroom.

So I was like the princess of the house.

When I moved down, they all moved, you know, have the master bedroom.

I was like, wow, okay.

It was so neat.

It was such a great time in life.

And so my 20s, like, when I met.

I met the kid's dad and started dating him.

And I remember I was still living with my dad and Eric tried to like hunt my dad down to ask for my hand in marriage.

Right.

And my dad kept hiding from him.

My dad, Eric would call him on the phone, say, alex, I'm going to stop by.

And my dad would leave.

He was like a Houdini.

My dad is like, he would like disappear.

He wouldn't deal with stuff.

He's like, he didn't want to face that.

That part, you know, so that was fun.

And then, and then when I had the kids, he just like, he's the best grandpa.

He would pick my kids up from school every day.

He would get there like an Hour and a half early.

The school called one time and they said there's a gentleman waiting at the fence every day for the.

You know, is this okay?

I'm like, yeah, that's just my dad.

He's okay.

He just.

He's here every day for a long time.

Yeah.

At the fence, staring, you know, that was just him.

You know, he just wanted to make sure he was there on time and present for them and.

Best grandpa ever.

That's beautiful.

I know.

That's so awesome.

And they have memories of that.

Oh yeah.

Their grandpa picking them up every day for sure.

He would take him to ice cream, play soccer, you know, do the whole thing.

Yeah.

So it's good grandpa stuff.

Yes.

Yeah.

So he started.

He like started to have healthy.

My dad was like, obviously very healthy.

You know, 82 playing soccer.

Still gotta be.

Yeah.

And incredible shape.

I mean, going to the gym.

Yeah, going to the gym.

My friends would see him at the gym all the time.

And he was mentally sharp, really smart.

And he started to get like pain in his ankles right to where he could, like, couldn't walk really.

And it would like debilitate him.

So he started going to the doctors and they were like, there's a language barrier.

I mean, obviously.

Well, I'm not gonna say most men, but like, for sure.

My dad, the translation from the doctor to then me and asking what did the doctor say?

You know, it's like a whole different story.

So I'm like, I think I'm gonna go to the doctor with you next time.

Yeah.

See what the doctor.

See what's going on.

Yeah.

You know, because the pain was just excruciating.

I mean, it was like really bad.

He couldn't play for like months.

This was going on for like months.

And so I go to the doctor, it's an orthopedic specialist.

And we were sitting there in the.

And my dad said.

He's like telling my dad, like, you have arthritis in your subtalar joint.

This is a really excruciating type of arthritis where you can't walk.

It's like really bad.

And my dad said, okay, great.

Well, yeah, okay, so when can I play soccer again?

You know.

And the doctor said, oh, Alex, you're not gonna, you're not gonna play soccer again.

You have to ride a bike or swim or something that has less impact on your body.

And I don't know if you guys know soccer players, but it's a pretty proud sport.

I know one and she's very die hard lifestyle soccer.

Yeah.

Like, like I bet she's not swimming laps.

No.

Right?

No.

Yeah.

She's not gonna take that.

You're not doing soccer thing.

Yeah.

Like, that's the whole thing.

I mean, growing up in Germany, like, that's the sport.

That is the only sport.

That's it.

I mean, sure, you could try doing other stuff, but, like, you're.

Yeah.

And then it's a lifestyle.

At some point, anything else is lame to them, which is great.

I mean, it's like, he's so disciplined.

Passion, you know.

He literally went to the soccer field the day I was born.

My mom was like, go.

Go play soccer.

But so, yeah, the doctor said, you're not going to play soccer.

And I saw, like, his eyes just shift.

Moment of knowing.

Right?

That's for the other segment.

But it's a moment when you know something's going down.

Right.

And then he had told me, like, like, my whole life.

And my dad's sense of humor was very.

It's.

It doesn't translate well because it sometimes can be kind of dark.

But I always thought he was so damn funny.

And he would say stuff like, if there's a day I can't play soccer, I'm gonna jump off the highest mountain I can find.

Or, if there's a day I can't play soccer, I'm gonna take my motorcycle and go off a cliff.

Like, he would talk like that all growing up.

So this is, like, you know, it seemed like normal.

Yeah.

Like, you know, he's not gonna be happy.

No.

If he can't actively help or, you know, take care of his body and play soccer.

Yeah.

So he decided to.

Yeah.

He chose suicide.

12 days after that doctor's appointment.

12 days.

It was so crazy how I saw, like, the switch, you know?

And then he just decided to.

To, you know, hang himself.

And what's crazy is the night I had tried to call him, like, three times.

Right.

And I'm like, that's so weird.

My dad's not answering the phone.

I'm like, whatever.

You know, maybe he's busy.

So I went with Evan to the grocery store, and my mom called, and the kids had just got Strike Promotions at Jiu Jitsu that night.

I'll never forget, because it was like, hi.

Hi.

And then, you know, so crazy.

But Evan was in the car, and my mom said, you need to come over.

There's something going.

Something wrong with your dad.

And I'm too afraid to go look.

And I'm like, oh, shit.

Okay.

So I tried to stay calm.

I'm like, evan, I gotta go over to Papa and Nana's house.

I'm gonna take you home.

And so I dropped him off.

And then it was just sunset.

You know how when someone passes, you remember every detail you can remember, like what the sky looked like, what was happening, what you were doing, probably what you were wearing even.

But I remember pulling into her mobile home park, my parents mobile home park, and it.

The sun was setting.

It was like dusk.

So, you know, like just twice, like the sky was just a little bit of light still.

And I could see his silhouette.

He hung himself between the two mobile homes and I could see his silhouette.

And I was like.

That was that moment.

Moment of like, oh, shit, everything's gonna change now.

My life was never gonna be the same.

So I got out and ran over to him and.

Was anybody outside at this point?

No, my mom.

Your mom was still inside the house?

Yeah, I screamed pretty loud and she came out.

She wanted to call the, you know, first responders, but I told her, just give me.

Give me some time.

So I'm really grateful that I took a moment because in Western society.

But I don't know if it's a thing that we've created for the business of death or what, but the sacredness of a moment like that, like we have the sovereignty to take a moment.

You don't have to do anything.

If it's like a medical emergency and the person's still breathing, that's a totally different story.

Okay, but I'm talking.

When someone is like, you know, they're lifeless and they have passed.

Right.

We don't realize that we can take a moment.

We don't need to go into immediate panic and call somebody to come and do something.

Yeah.

Or like, it's a problem to solve or something.

It's not.

You just need to be in that moment.

Exactly.

And I don't know what created that moment for me to say, no, just give me a minute.

Because I was able to say some things to him that I needed to say.

One being, I'm so proud of you, like, and not many people are going to understand that.

And I've had to explain myself and I'm not.

I decided I'm not going to explain that anymore because it's such a personal thing.

Like to be proud of somebody in a moment like that isn't something you can explain.

Yeah, it's a personal thing between my father and I, you know, and I honored his choice.

I honor the right to die.

You know, obviously this is a little bit different.

There's not Like a life threatening illness happening that someone can choose.

Right.

But to him it was.

So that was his choice, you know.

So in that moment, I'll never forget my friends came because my, my friend Vanessa and her ex, you know, at the time I had called her and said, I think I'm walking into something pretty heavy right now, so I don't know what it's going to happen in the morning at work.

And she came, right.

She didn't even wait a moment, she came.

So she was there when I, you know, like 20 minutes later.

And they called the police when I was ready and the first responders came and they start doing their deal.

And I'll never forget the firefighters.

The fire chief was crying, he had tears in his eyes.

And I was like watching him just thinking, wow, this is so crazy surreal.

Like you're not watching your own life.

Yeah, you really are completely disconnected from like reality in a moment like that.

I think it's your body's way of protecting itself.

Right, right.

It protects itself in a way that you can kind of move, keep functioning, just keep functioning.

And then it takes like what it takes.

But boy did it.

It was a weird, a weird couple of days for sure.

And they sent a volunteer.

That's how I met the organization that I volunteered for for four years.

I'm on a leave right now, school, you know.

But yeah, that, that organization changed everything for me.

Like she helped walk through everything.

The police, the investigation, the medical examiner, what they're gonna do next.

And this is just a regular person, not like a firefighter or policeman.

It's just somebody who volunteered to walk you through that.

Yep.

And that person, you know, I ended up volunteering with them later on, like nine months later.

But you go to the scene of death and you are with the family until the mortuary or the medical examiner comes and removes the body and you stay with them and just you're.

It's like first aid, emotional first aid for the family.

I feel like it's so important that that was available to you and you know, that path that you took by volunteering because like, that's something that we don't get a lot is being able to witness.

I feel like that's such an important thing.

Oh God, I'm gonna cry because you did that for me.

But like being able to witness, just witness and like guide to the next steps.

Because that's like what that organization's job is.

Like, it's not to give advice or like say like this is what you need to do emotionally or spiritually or something.

But, like, this is what's gonna happen with, like, you know, legal or not necessarily legal.

Sorry.

But, like, next steps.

The next steps with authority, like the EMTs or the morgue or whatever, and you're just there with them, and you just witness.

Yeah.

It's incredible.

And I remember when I was going through that training, I thought, Like, I really thought intellectually I knew how to listen to people and hold space, but I had no clue, like, I had to relearn and rewire how to hold space for somebody.

And it's actually a lot less than what you think it is.

We think it's all these solutions and saying all these things.

But the quiet and the presence of your being just with them is, like, the heaviest thing.

It's the most impactful thing you can do for a family.

And she was there with me till, like, midnight, you know, because when it's a suicide, they don't just quickly remove the body, you know, they have to do an investigation and make sure there's no foul play.

And so the other thing that.

That was amazing.

And I know the word amazing.

Do you need tissue?

My eyes just keep running.

The other thing that was so incredible that my dad did for us as a family was there was no stone left unturned as far as, like, guessing what he did.

So he left the receipts for all of the supplies he bought to hang himself.

He left the receipt from Home Depot.

He wrote a note.

He left a note for us with instructions.

He left his gold chain in a bag for me.

Very specific instructions, which to some might seem really crazy, but to me, it was like, okay, this is thought out.

And not only that, but the universe showed me a friend, you know, Mark and Chrissy.

So Mark, I can't remember, he came to the house shortly after that, maybe the next day or the day after.

And I was telling him, like, everything that was happening, and he said, oh, my God.

He goes, I saw your dad at Home Depot.

I saw your dad at Home Depot, Sherry.

And he was, like, bawling, and he said, I saw all the stuff in his car.

And he.

I asked him, are you going to the gym, Alex?

And my dad said, no, not today, buddy.

And the way he said it, like, it just.

It was like this string of just strength throughout the whole thing, you know?

Like, your friend saw me.

I decided to do this.

I took the time.

There was no question.

It was like I. I knew.

And then the final thing that led me to the path of this was he was of sound mind.

When he made this choice.

Right.

Is that he used a step stool to hang himself.

But he was hanging right next to the step stool.

So it was like right here next to him, within a foot.

If he wanted to, he could have stood up.

He didn't kick it out from under him.

It was like.

Yeah.

So no question.

I didn't think he regretted it.

I never have felt anger like that.

You know, there's the stages of grief, which we can loosely.

You know, there's just so much to it.

It's really not linear.

There's no 1, 2, 3, this is how it goes.

We all know this, but you sometimes don't feel some of them at all.

Yeah, like, I've never felt anger.

You know, I have family members who've been.

Who got angry at him and angry at certain circumstances surrounding finding him and stuff.

But yeah, I've never felt it.

I don't know.

I'm really grateful for that.

You know what's really interesting too, is I never got to meet your dad.

I wish I had.

But I think about him a lot and I love to get to know him through you.

And it's interesting because, like, maybe it's just cause I'm empathic, but I don't get angry about it either.

I think that's interesting because, like, for example, like with other people, maybe we just attach to other people's emotions.

Like if somebody does feel like, angry about a loss or I don't know.

That you kind of feel that with them.

Yeah, well.

And you know what is interesting too about that is you and I are so close that if someone hurts you or someone hurts me, we're.

We're feeling that.

Yeah.

Like we have this protectiveness where we're.

Like, yeah, we come back to love.

We all the time.

So it's like, interesting that you don't feel anger as well.

Right.

Because I've tried to think about it, you know, like, I really try to put myself in other people's shoes.

Like with you, for example, there's a little bit of anger.

Like sometimes I get a little bit of anger.

Like, just like, for example, like when you describe like your last phone call with Ken, like, there's like that tinge of like, anger I feel.

Like, not at him or anything, but.

Just like, I think I feel anger towards myself when I talk about that.

Yeah, maybe.

Maybe that's what I feel.

But I mean, I did feel.

Yeah, I was yelling at him, I was angry at him.

But I think now it's like when I think about that I feel angry at myself for being angry with him at that time.

So, like, there's a.

There's anger in that situation.

You're very right.

Yeah, there's anger there, but, like, I feel that, like, and I feel like I try and put myself, like, in your shoes, and I definitely feel that.

And, you know, I feel that switch too, from, like, angry at him to angry at yourself.

And, you know, it's like a little bit of a cycle too, but for sure, I've tried to put myself, like, in your shoes or at least, like, what if I did know you at the time and there's still, like, there's no anger.

And I feel like that's because, like, you've literally not felt, like, anger about it.

Like, just.

There's so much peace around that.

I know that's not everybody's story, but, like, I feel like that's really powerful for somebody's.

Somebody else's sovereignty and autonomy over their own life and death.

Yes, that's super important.

And I'm such an advocate for.

There's so many layers, right?

There's what I want to do at the end of my life, and then there's what my family member or loved one wants to do, and I don't get to decide.

As a matter of fact, you're probably not going to hear my opinion if you're telling me what your end of life plan is or goal.

Right.

I'm not going to tell you this or that, but, yeah, it's definitely not.

I had to do EMDR therapy for the visuals because that.

That part, I didn't even feel angry anger then, but I knew it was affecting me in a way that was gonna start to really fuck with me.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Trauma is trauma.

And trauma doesn't always.

Look, I feel like when we say the word trauma, sometimes it feels like it's supposed to be a certain way.

But, like, for example, me seeing my dad dead, I don't feel traumatized by that, but I know my body holds it, so therefore it's trauma.

Yes.

Yeah.

The body heals for.

And it really does.

I mean, I would for the next.

So 24 hours.

48 hours.

He died on a Tuesday night, so it was like 48 hours.

So I did not.

When the sun would start to set, I would freak out.

Like, it was a visceral response in my body.

Right.

And I'm like, am I gonna feel this way forever?

I don't know, maybe something, you know, something's wrong with me now.

And I would dream and I'd wake up screaming.

And, like, Tony had to, like, put his arm on me and say, it's okay, you know?

And then my best friend Lisa, she said, I'm gonna pick you up.

I made an appointment with her.

EMDR therapist came and got me, drove me to the therapy.

Lisa's her best friend.

One of them.

Yeah, that's my best.

It's like a bestie.

Bestie.

Yeah.

So she took me and waited in the waiting room.

And.

And I'll never forget the weird ass thing, you know, the back and forth buzzer and the lights, and I was, like, talking about it, and then it went into some other subject that I wasn't ready to talk about.

And I was like, wait, hold up.

She's like, well, we don't get to do that.

We kind of goes where it goes.

So however I was able to sleep that night, I got home, I slept the whole night.

And then I said, you wake up.

And you were like, oh, yeah, okay, 100%.

So then I went again.

I think I went, like, four days in a row, maybe four times, maybe three.

And I was able to, like, almost come back into my body.

So I'm an advocate for EMDR because it really does refile those memories and the attachments to whatever's happening in that moment of the trauma.

Right?

Yeah.

So, yeah.

And the days after, I mean, you know, we had his memorial maybe like two weeks later.

We had to wait till my uncle came home from another country.

There was, like, 250 people at his memorial.

My goodness.

It was insane.

So beautiful.

I got to greet every single person as they came in.

It was overwhelming, the love our community showed, you know?

Yeah, it was beautiful.

Hard.

Really hard.

And dealing with, you know, the other thing about death that.

That I see is you have to repeat your story a thousand times.

Okay.

You're.

You're the main Griever.

We call it.

With the.

That organization, they call it the Griever.

The main Griever, the person that it happened to.

And then you.

Layers of people outside of it.

Right.

And if you're a point person or your immediate family, like, of course my children, that no one asked them questions, you know, they were young.

Yeah.

But, man, I had to repeat that story again and again.

Especially someone like my dad, who was just so impactful to any community he touched.

That's such an interesting thing.

Right.

Having to repeat.

You feel almost a responsibility to do it when you really don't have.

It's a lot.

It is a lot.

It's a lot.

And I think that there's a lack of boundaries and time with that specific thing.

And agreed.

I don't know how I feel about that repeating it again and again.

Like, you're already front row.

Like, you don't need to be in repetition mode about it the whole entire time.

Like, let's just take a second, please.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I had one family member ask me the next day.

There was, like, 60 people at my house.

It was wild, loud, obnoxious, and I loved it.

Like, it was so good to have that many voices going in my house.

My friends kept checking on me.

Do you want us to have people leave?

I'm like, nope, just keep it coming.

Yeah.

You know?

But a family member showed up, and she said, weren't you watching him?

Weren't you?

Right.

And I said, I don't.

This is another knowing.

Like, something came over me.

Right.

And I said, I'm sorry that you weren't here to witness or to know what was going on with him, but I can't fix that for you.

So.

Because that's getting to the root of what she was saying, even though she wasn't saying it exactly.

I mean, to watch your loved ones suffer for months and months and months, you know?

And then someone comes in, like, once this happens, and they're like, wait, what's going on?

It's.

It's a lot in that moment.

Yeah.

But she ended up being my biggest supporter after that.

After that boundary was set, which was neat.

A sweet surprise, right?

Yeah.

When you want to punch someone in the face and then all of a.

Sudden, it makes you closer.

Yeah.

So.

So, yeah.

So it's been almost six years.

November 5th will be six years already.

Yeah.

I will always remember that day because that's the date that Jim and I met.

Not the same year, but the same day.

That's right.

Wait, so it was the anniversary of my father's death, and we were at bingo.

What a cool night that was.

Yeah.

And we were there for Sylvia.

Yeah.

I feel like they all just had a hand in that night, just hanging.

Out together, Sylvia and Alex.

And then my dad joined them, and they're like, let's.

Let's play with our loved ones, y'.

All.

Never forget.

Total side note, but we're at bingo for all the listeners, and I'm there with Jim.

Right.

And my husband.

Her husband.

Now, as we've talked about.

Thank God.

Just in case you don't know.

Thank God you're his wife.

I love it.

But we were sitting there, and Erica comes walking in, and, you know, Obviously, she's beautiful and, like a commanding presence.

Walking in a room.

And she walks in, she goes, is there a seat here?

And he's all, yep, I think.

I mean, I don't even know if there was a chair.

Maybe he went.

There wasn't a chair.

There wasn't a chair.

He probably grabbed one.

Kick someone else out of the chair.

Did you guys know each other at this point?

No, no, no.

We've.

I. I mean, I saw you at.

A meeting and without knowing who you were, I remember seeing you at Sylvia's memorial service.

I remember you speaking and I remember Jade speaking and, like, a couple other people speaking, but that's.

I didn't know you, but yeah.

So you, like, met.

Met Sherry and Jim on the same night?

Mm, pretty much.

That's rad.

Yeah, it's.

It was a good night.

Yeah.

Yeah, it was a really good night.

Yeah.

I'll never forget it.

Fortuitous.

Were you guys inseparable after that?

Yes.

I love that so much.

Didn't spend one day not talking to each other.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I love that, man.

But this episode isn't about him.

Even though I. I mean, we could talk for days about lots of stuff, right?

Yeah.

But.

Yeah, so that was the story of that situation.

And foreign.

Such a journey after that.

Yeah.

So what happened after?

Yeah.

What is life?

What is life like now?

Yeah.

Yeah.

What year was it again?

Sorry?

You said 2019.

2019.

Because this year will be six years.

Yep.

So I.

After that, a lot of relationships shifted.

Oh, yeah.

I wanna.

I wanna hear about your shift, because that was a huge part of what you were saying at the very beginning.

Or maybe.

Maybe it was another time, but there's a shift that happened.

Yeah.

The shift was that I wasn't afraid to be alone anymore.

And it was pretty instantaneous.

Like, relationships that were not, like, serving me, not in a, you know, selfish way, but, you know, not the healthiest of relationships.

I mean, they fizzled pretty quick.

My bullshit levels detector.

Yeah, it was like.

That was like, no, you're not taking any shit anymore from anybody.

And it dismantled some pretty significant relationships in my life pretty quickly.

So I'm sure the community, not my close friends, because my close friends already walk with me every step.

But the outer circles of community were probably like, what the hell is going on with this chick?

I mean, I, you know, got into an open relationship, my marriage ended.

All kinds of, like, shifts happened.

I, you know, I stepped away from significant friendships that were unhealthy for me.

Yeah.

Everything changed, you know, And I don't regret a minute of it.

I'm so grateful for all that because it really did.

It was like my filter just completely removed, which was awesome.

So then in the mail came a survey and it was like, how did our volunteer do you know the volunteer from.

The volunteer from the night?

And I'm looking at this piece of paper and it's like, you know, there's a few questions and then there's like, write what you, you know, write something about your volunteer if you want.

I'm like, well, how do you, how do you explain on a piece of paper how somebody literally changed your life?

I mean, it's kind of hard to put in a paragraph, you know.

And then there was the website.

And so I look on the website, like, if you'd like to volunteer.

So I thought, huh, that would be kind of a cool way to give back to the community.

And it had not.

It was October, so it was not even a year since my dad had passed.

And I started the training and it was like the first night they show a video, they're.

They're weeding out people pretty quick.

I mean, I don't want to say weeding out in a bad way, but like, if you, you can handle it.

Or you gotta be.

Yeah, exactly.

You have to be a kind of person to be able to handle that intense situation.

Sure.

And so the first video, I was literally sobbing.

I'm like, oh, God, this is going to be.

I don't know if I can handle this.

I'm pretty raw still, you know?

Yeah.

Day two of the training, day three of the training, and then we go into role play where you're like, you know, role playing give you live situations and how are you going to handle it?

They have a whole training manual that you have to follow loosely because you really need to have your personality involved in it too.

And I just went up to the.

One of the main trainers and I said, I don't know if I can do this.

And he was like, what do you mean?

I said, well, it's not a year yet since my dad passed, and I just feel like it might be a little too soon.

And he's like, no, I've been watching you, you're fine.

And he just walked away.

He's like, I know if people can handle this or not, you're fine.

I'm like, okay, all right, well, what am I gonna do, right?

And you know what the crazy thing is, is that this organization gets suicide calls a lot.

Overdose, suicide, natural causes, all kinds, you know, whatever.

Sometimes car accidents.

I did not get a suicide call for, like, two and a half years, which is unheard of.

People get them all the time.

Yeah.

And I'll never forget, our director called, and she said, honey, I have a suicide call for you.

Are you ready for this?

And I was like, wow.

Yes.

Well, we'll see.

We're gonna find out.

Find out.

So I got on the scene, and it was a daughter whose father had chose suicide.

Shit.

Oh, my God.

Chills.

And I just walked in, and I was just fine.

It was.

It was incredible to be present for her.

And you never.

You never say, like, oh, my God, I've been through the same thing.

It's not.

You don't roll like that.

No.

However, if somebody asks me directly, why do you do this?

Like, because some people do want to know, is this free?

Why are you here?

How do you do this?

I could never do this.

How did you get here?

Yeah, I mean, people say all the time, I could never do this.

And she asked me.

The daughter.

Yeah, she did.

She asked me, what made you do this?

And I said, same situation as you right now.

I'm just giving back.

That's all I said.

And so it was really cool to be able.

That was my first suicide call.

You know.

I feel like that's a moment of knowing for sure.

We had one of the teen volunteers with me, and she gave me a big hug afterwards.

You know, it was just.

It was really beautiful.

Yeah.

And this is why I. I do things that scare me because I don't know if I'm ready.

How are you?

You know, how do you know if you're ready for something?

Yeah.

Ready isn't like a time.

Ready's like something.

Ready's an action.

Ready.

It's not like a point in time.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Right.

Yeah.

So you just go for it.

Just do it.

Just do it.

So, you know, that's.

And then the.

The.

I went.

You know, I had a couple calls that were really tough.

That one specifically, that rocked my world.

That was a teen death.

It was like he was 15, and he got hit by a car on an E bike.

And that.

I'm not going to go into detail because, you know, that's a really personal thing for the family.

But it was.

It was rough.

We had to give, you know, stand there when they gave notification that he wasn't going to survive.

And that rocked my world.

So shortly after that, I started school, and I was like, you know what?

I'm gonna take a little break.

I'm gonna take a Little break.

So it's been about a year.

I'll be back.

You know, volunteers always come and go.

Yeah.

Take a little time.

Go back.

So now I'm doing, like, hospice volunteering.

Yeah, tell us about that.

I know the timeline won't really match up with us airing this, but Sherry does a lot of volunteer work for this organization.

She had a really awesome one last night.

Yeah, it was cool.

Yeah.

So I own Azadi Healing, and Azadi means freedom and Farsi, by the way.

Azadi.

And so the name Azadi comes from when I got my motorcycle.

Right.

My dad hated my motorcycle, by the way.

Even though he rode one.

Yeah, he rode one.

A midnight special.

Okay.

Which.

I wish I still had that bike.

I looked it up.

You can buy them still the same bike.

Anyway, so he hated my bike.

I have a picture of him mad dogging this bike.

I will find it for you guys.

He's, like, staring at it in my driveway.

And I asked my dad, I'm all, hey, dad, how do you say freedom in barsi?

He said, azadi.

I'm like, oh, that's what I'm gonna name my bike.

And he was like, kid, you know?

So I decided once I started my healing practice and I was trying to figure out a name, I'm like, there's.

It just was no.

A no brainer.

No question.

No question.

So I started that.

I bought my first set of sound bowls with some money my dad left me.

Right.

He left me a little bit of money.

It was just enough to.

To start my healing practice.

So it literally was born from my dad.

What is a Zadi healing?

What do you do?

Just for those who don't know who you are or know what a Zadi healing is?

So I am a 501c3 nonprofit, and I provide healing services for the community.

I do sound healing.

I do reiki.

I do breath work.

I facilitate and workshops.

So we do inner child workshops.

We do, you know, emotional regulation workshops.

Anything that comes to me, I create a workshop for it.

You know, it's just divine inspiration, basically.

But I take sound bath into communities, like, you know, transitional housing for prison inmates and hospice clients.

But not only the clients.

I do it for their medical staff as well and their employees.

I take.

I do private sound baths for families, family reunions, retreats, all kinds of events.

And it's.

It's just a beautiful way to give back to the community.

And, yeah, I mean, I wouldn't have probably been able to do it without the transition of my dad because I, again, was really insecure.

And like, I didn't.

Who wants to teach in front of people?

You know, like, I had this thing where if I had to talk in front of people, I mean, I could speak at meetings and stuff, but like to take someone through a meditation or take someone through breath work or teach them how to regulate their emotions, it's like, for some reason I was hesitant.

It's like this weird thing.

And I had someone tell me one time, once I facilitated the workshop, that I was nervous and they looked at me, they're like, are you kidding?

You are so good at this.

And I just will never forget the guy telling me that.

Because I. I think we don't realize the gifts we have.

I think fear sometimes overshadows the power of our gifts.

Like we're second guessing, right?

And once we step into our power as whatever it is that you're supposed to be doing in your divine purpose, it's like that moment, right?

That moment of like knowing, like when you were in the rain.

Mm.

It's that.

That same feeling.

And so now I'm like super comfortable teaching, super comfortable guiding people, you know, and I'm going to school for that exact thing.

So hopefully if my goal, you know, comes to fruition, I'll be a clinical psychologist.

And I. I don't know though, I'm a Pisces, so I'm like, whatever, man.

If I'm supposed to pivot and do something else, I'll do that too.

But that's a Zadi healing.

It's like created itself, really.

And it's still forming.

I mean, yeah, it's still growing and growing.

So the thing I did last night was for Elizabeth or for the hospice community.

And it was a love and loss story night.

And so instead of focusing on like trauma or grieving, it was telling stories about your loved ones, happy memories and funny memories and describing them and yeah, it was so beautiful.

Giving space to do that.

Hearing the laughter in the room was really cool.

And then I started and ended with a sound bath.

That's amazing.

Yeah, it was neat.

Ah, man, I wish I could have been there for that work.

The nine to five.

Well, 9:30 to six.

Oh, we were recording.

We were doing other grief things.

It was before that.

It was before that was from 4 to 6, but still.

Yeah, there'll be other ones.

Yeah, yeah, there'll be other ones.

It was funny.

Nevermind, I don't need to share that.

It's just all we'll play to pin in that.

But I. I love Azadi healing personally.

Because it just.

I feel like it also kind of laid the foundation for my own process with my grief.

I am definitely going to give myself a lot of credit because I did a lot of work.

Yes.

To, I don't know, be present for my dad.

If you guys have listened to my chapter, that was like my thing.

I wanted to be there, I wanted to be present, I wanted to say the things, I wanted to do the things I wanted to learn.

Everything.

Y.

And part of.

Part of why I like to either educate or do sound healing is literally this woman right here.

My dad went to one of her sound baths and it just changed his life.

It was really.

He loved it.

Awesome.

So much.

Yeah.

He had his eyes open the whole time.

Yeah.

He was watching her, which brought me so much joy.

Yeah.

But I just think that that's so him and so interesting too.

And what he described to us in the car after and just like how he felt and how he got moments of relief like that.

That's what that kind of work does for people.

And not just people who, like my dad, were actively dying, but like the people who you help.

Both of us have had you as a facilitator and I'm sure.

Different ways.

Many different ways.

And.

Duh.

Yeah, I'm gonna cry again.

That's okay.

I just love you both.

Yeah, that.

Just.

Just seeing my dad have that peace and also joy.

He was so fascinated, so fascinated and open.

Just open to it.

Do you think, do you think he would have been as open if he was 100% healthy?

I think so.

I mean, it's hard to say.

Right.

Because he has.

Had.

He had had cancer like for years.

So my relationship with him was only just starting, like by the time that he was getting sick again.

So it's kind of hard to know for sure, but I feel like, yes.

Simply because of who he was becoming in his retirement, in his faith, because he was an avid Christian and was very involved in his church and.

And just that transformation, like his faith with like his life experience and his openness was changing.

And I feel like part of that was because he was very stubborn.

He just wanted to question everything or experience.

I love that about him.

That's a good trait.

Question everything.

Yeah, question everything.

Even the stuff that you think is truth.

Right.

That's what you say.

I always tell my kids that.

Uh huh.

And yeah, I'd like to think yes, because he was trying a lot of new things with me, even having like different conversations with me than in the past because I would question him.

I'D be like, well, what about this?

That's where you get it from.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

But, yeah, it just.

It changed my life.

And I've been there when you've had some pretty profound moments with Sherry, too, which is just like, exactly what Azadi healing brings and what Sherry brings, like, she just.

Just.

I've tried to explain it to you before, but you give that space for people, and it's incredible.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Yeah.

I'm grateful.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

I don't know.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's magical.

It's just a fear thing walking on the other side of it.

I swear, we're all capable of it.

Dude, you're badass.

You hear me?

You, like, step into that now.

You're great.

I love you, too.

So much.

You guys are rad.

So.

Yeah.

So one other thing was I had my dad cremated, right?

And.

Okay, no, I'm not gonna share that.

But anyway, so I had my dad cremated, right?

And he was.

And you know when you have a plan and then the thing happens and you're like, wait, no, never mind.

I don't want to do that.

So I cremated.

We cremated him.

And then I was just gonna, like, go scatter his ashes right away, but I just couldn't.

I did not want to.

I kept his ashes for, like, I want to say, maybe a year and a half to two years.

And then one morning, I woke up, and I'm like, today's the day.

I'm gonna get on my motorcycle, put him in my backpack, and take him to the top of Palomar Mountain.

And so I asked a few family members, you want ashes?

And they're like, yeah.

Yes.

No.

Yes.

No.

So I divvied some up for them, and then I rode to the top of Palomar Mountain by myself, right?

And I'm standing up there on this overlook, and I put his ashes in the flowers.

And it was.

I'll never forget, it was spring, and the flowers were coming up, and there was bees.

And I was thinking, oh, my God, these bees are going to pollinate with my dad's ashes.

Like, he's going to be here forever, you know?

And this motorcycle pulls up behind me.

One single guy.

It was a weekday.

There was nobody riding.

And he walks up and he's like, hey, how's it going?

I said, good.

I don't know why I shared this with him, but I said, I just spread my dad's ashes.

It took me a year and a half to do it.

And he goes, well, it takes what it takes.

Doesn't takes what it takes.

It was the weirdest, surreal moment.

I'm like, wow, this is so crazy.

Okay.

Yeah.

That is the truth, you know, because it does take what it takes.

Yeah.

And then I got on my motorcycle and.

And took off.

And so I get to go up there to visit him.

Like, it's so beautiful where I put him.

And we've put some of other people's ashes up there too, little bits of our family, you know, and so it's a really sacred place for me up there.

And it was just.

It was a moment like, you know, you have to really follow your heart with stuff like that if you're not ready to do stuff.

Yeah, yeah.

It takes what it takes.

The time is what it takes.

The time will show itself.

Exactly.

Sorry.

I'm just crying thinking about those memories.

I had at one point, fully gotten into the ocean with Ken's ashes and then got the fuck out.

Yeah.

Because I was like, nope, I got in there.

Yeah, like you had that intention of.

I had the encounter.

I had.

I got.

I got.

I got back.

I left.

Yeah.

So do you still have his ashes?

Mm.

He's over there.

And so I sprinkle out little bits.

Of him in the wood box.

He's in the wood box?

Yeah.

Okay, so is it.

Tell me you sprinkle him around?

Oh, yeah, yeah.

So.

Well, like.

Well, the one.

The one story that I talk about where I was like, he was inside of me, that was.

That was the first time that I was able to do it.

And I have went back to the ocean.

It was on my 18 months clean, actually, that I went back.

And it's wild.

It was a Saturday and there was nobody at the beach.

I was there for like an hour and a half in California, in Ocean Beach.

I'm dead ass serious.

I believe you.

On Santa Cruz, where we got married, there was nobody there the whole entire time.

I have a whole video of the whole.

Of the whole entire thing.

I'm like.

I'm just gonna keep this beach clear for you.

Yeah, it's wild.

But now I take them, like, I have like a little necklace that.

That Roseanne actually got for me.

And I take him with me whenever I go anywhere.

It hangs in my jeep, which.

My jeep is named Ken.

So he's always with me.

If I'm at home, he's there.

If I go anywhere, he's in my jeep.

Nice.

But then when I go on trips, I take him with me.

And then if it feels right, I will dump him out places.

So like, I've dumped him out over a waterfall because I wanted to make sure he was still having fun.

Yes.

And things like that.

I just recently dumped him out on the set of a concert.

Like on the grass.

Yeah, yeah.

Did I tell you about this?

No.

Can I side quest?

Yeah.

Okay, so on our.

What would have been our 10 year anniversary, just in August, August 31st, I was in Chicago with my brother and we went to a music festival.

And I knew I was going to dump them out at some point somewhere.

And I was like, I'll probably do it during the posh.

He said, it's the sunset during the set, all that, like, I'll know when I get there.

And so me and my brother get up to the front row, like right in the front, so like we can reach over the railing.

And when you reached over the railing, it like it was grass, like on the set.

And I was like.

You know what I mean?

And so I'm like, in my head, I'm like, I would want him to dump me on the set.

Like, this is fucking.

The sun was setting.

It was like a 360 rotating DJ set.

The DJ was amazing.

And I was like, yep, this is it.

And so my brother and I were right in front of a speaker and I was trying to tell him, like, I'm gonna like, I'm gonna dump Ken on the set.

And he's like, I can't hear you.

And I'm like pointing at the necklace.

He's like, you know, and so finally, like, I take him out, I dump him in my hand and I'm looking at my brother and I'm like, ken.

And I'm pointing at my hand and I'm like, Ken is in my hand.

And I, I see the one 8 clicked for him because he got this look of like, concern, like, you know.

My brother, like, are you sure?

Like, he hasn't like experienced like a really close death.

So it was very much just like, are you okay?

You know, and I'm like, I'm fine.

You're like, I'm really good.

That's why I'm doing this.

You're great.

You know what I mean?

And so he's like, okay.

He's looking at me all wild and so I'm like, okay, I'll know when it's the right time.

I have one hand closed and one hand open.

And I'm just like dancing and like doing my thing.

And then like, I got to this point.

I mean, we were right in front of the speaker.

And so, like, the frequencies were, like, going through my body.

And I got to this point where it's just like.

It wasn't even one of the songs.

It was just like some transition he had from one to the next.

But it's so good.

And I swear to God, I saw, like, patterns, like shapes.

One of my eyes closed, and I was like, yep, this is it.

Yep.

And I.

And so I dumped him out.

And then when my brother and I were walking away from the set, I was like, I was trying to tell you that I think Ken would want me to dump him on the set because I would want that too.

And like, you know, and he was like, yeah, I don't know.

I figured out what you were doing.

And he's like, but I didn't realize when you did, like, did it.

I just looked over at some point, your hand was open.

And I was like, oh, shit, she did it.

He was like, but there's a fog machine in front of us.

And I was like, oh, yeah.

There was like.

It was like blowing smoke straight into our face.

But I wasn't thinking about that.

And so he was like, ken's ashes probably got all over us.

And I was like, oh, my God.

I didn't think about that.

And I was like, I'm so sorry.

He's like, no, no, no, it's totally fine.

Like, Ken's great.

Ken.

And I was like, okay, cool.

So, yeah, he's like, it's all good.

He's like, it's fine.

Yeah.

Like, I love Ken.

I love Ken.

I'm fine with that.

He's my homie.

That's awesome.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know.

You know, so.

Yeah, I just like to sprinkle them places.

Yeah.

I haven't.

I have to kept a little bit of my dad's.

Yeah, I have a little tiny bit, too.

I didn't know how much was too much.

Cause we were, you know, placing my dad, or actually we opened his urn before his internment.

And yeah, a couple of us grabbed ashes.

And I was like, I.

How much is too much?

I think I just want them all.

Oh, yeah.

I feel like I hoard the ashes a little bit.

I got a pretty big box still.

Yeah.

I feel like eventually.

I feel like eventually I am just going to have like a.

Maybe just.

Yeah.

I don't know what it'll look like.

I'll know exactly when the time comes.

Yep.

Yeah.

That's the whole.

Yeah.

The journey.

The journey.

Yeah.

Yep.

So that's my dad.

That's Alex.

Mm.

So one last question for you.

Yes.

Do you want to ask it.

Sherry of Azadi Healing.

Yes.

Why do I feel like this is.

A marriage, like a proposal?

Is there an upside to grief?

Oh, my God, yes.

Okay, so there's a million upsides to grief.

And you can just, like we talked about earlier, keep going back, and if you don't feel the upside at the moment, just stop.

Just.

It's okay.

We can go back and reframe a moment.

Go back and do the thing that you want to do that you didn't do in that moment.

That's the upside to me, is that we can create it.

Yeah.

Oh, I love that so much.

Just gonna cry again.

That is the upside, that we are responsible for creating it.

Yes, we are.

Yeah.

Thank you so much for taking the time to be with us.

And we're super excited for your segment, too, because.

Yeah, you just have some really cool moments of knowing.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Thank you so much for taking the time and sharing space.

Of course.

And sharing your dad.

Yeah.

Thank you.

He would.

He would love you guys.

Trust me.

He would be so funny.

Thank you for inviting me.

Of course.

Yeah.

And if you guys feel like her story resonated with you, please tune in next week as Sheri will be doing our segment, Moments of Knowing.

So, yeah, we're pretty.

Pretty good stuff in there.

You might want to check it out.

Little nugs.

Awesome.

All right, guys, well, comment, like, subscribe.

Do all the things.

Share it with your homies.

Yeah, share it if you feel like somebody might relate to this story.

But, yeah, we'll definitely see you next week.

Okay, Bye.

Bye.