1 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,280 Janice Porter: Music. Hello everyone, and welcome to this 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:09,540 week's episode of relationships rule. My guest this week is 3 00:00:09,540 --> 00:00:13,680 David Saxby, a fellow Canuck. I love it, and he's got a 4 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:17,400 beautiful background on be which you can't see, but a beautiful 5 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:21,260 background behind him of the the Rockies. I'm thinking because 6 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:25,760 David lives in Calgary, Alberta, so it's very pretty to see that 7 00:00:25,820 --> 00:00:28,040 scenery. Welcome to the show, David. 8 00:00:28,820 --> 00:00:30,860 David Saxby: Good to see you. Janice, thank you for the 9 00:00:30,860 --> 00:00:31,640 opportunity. 10 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:34,640 Janice Porter: Absolutely So. David calls himself an 11 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:39,260 unconventional thinker for unconventional times. I kind of 12 00:00:39,260 --> 00:00:41,320 like that. Can you explain that? 13 00:00:42,700 --> 00:00:46,540 David Saxby: Oh, I think that's been kind of my nature my entire 14 00:00:46,540 --> 00:00:51,460 life, is that I'm usually contrary to what the mainstream 15 00:00:51,460 --> 00:00:56,260 is. Even in business, I've done things that people in the same 16 00:00:56,260 --> 00:01:01,680 industry didn't do or weren't doing, and I think it's just 17 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:07,200 part of the creative mind is to be able to think beyond the 18 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:11,460 standard sort of thought process of most people. Well, 19 00:01:11,460 --> 00:01:14,580 Janice Porter: I interviewed a gentleman on my podcast a couple 20 00:01:14,580 --> 00:01:20,220 of years ago named Bill Troy, and he I just re aired that 21 00:01:20,220 --> 00:01:25,100 episode last month as one of my encore episodes, and he calls 22 00:01:25,100 --> 00:01:27,620 himself a contrarian, yes, 23 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:31,640 David Saxby: very similar. Yeah, where the idea came from? Okay, 24 00:01:31,700 --> 00:01:36,260 Janice Porter: okay, so, so, always thinking outside the box, 25 00:01:36,260 --> 00:01:43,000 perhaps, right, okay, so as a creative person, okay, so you've 26 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,960 actually kind of been in both worlds. I mean, I see that you 27 00:01:47,140 --> 00:01:50,560 you and from our conversations previous that you are in the 28 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:54,040 digital world very much. So a lot of your business is done 29 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:57,940 through digital platforms and so on. You've authored three books. 30 00:01:57,940 --> 00:02:03,540 That's the creative side you, but you and your newest book is 31 00:02:03,540 --> 00:02:06,960 coming out next spring, I think, called Ignite innovative 32 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:10,320 thinking. Is that correct? Yes, still on track to come out next 33 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:10,740 spring? 34 00:02:11,640 --> 00:02:15,600 David Saxby: Yes, exactly. And it's that came from the concept 35 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:20,040 that I always sort of took creativity for granted, ooh, 36 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:25,460 because I grew up being a creative kid, and I was always 37 00:02:25,460 --> 00:02:29,180 involved in art and music and all those sorts of things. So I 38 00:02:29,180 --> 00:02:32,900 took it for granted. When I got into the ad industry, I started 39 00:02:32,900 --> 00:02:38,060 to think, what happens if it stops what happens if one day I 40 00:02:38,060 --> 00:02:42,160 just walk in the advertising agency? I got no ideas. I can't 41 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:45,280 figure anything out. And so I started to really study 42 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:49,840 creativity, the brain, how we think up ideas, how we can 43 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:54,280 execute ideas, and that sort of thing. And it, it helped me with 44 00:02:54,460 --> 00:02:57,820 my business, because I started out in the creative side of the 45 00:02:57,820 --> 00:03:04,260 advertising industry, and then I Yeah. Mad Men, exactly, yeah. 46 00:03:04,920 --> 00:03:08,460 That's, that's more like a reality show for me. It's, I 47 00:03:08,460 --> 00:03:11,040 watch it, they go, Oh my God, yes. That's the 48 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:13,800 Janice Porter: world was like, yeah. It was brilliant, though, 49 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:15,300 that show, it was, it is, 50 00:03:15,300 --> 00:03:17,580 David Saxby: yeah. And you know, what's interesting is a lot of 51 00:03:17,580 --> 00:03:20,960 the ads that they put together on that show as part of the 52 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:24,740 program were actual ad campaigns. And 53 00:03:24,740 --> 00:03:27,440 Janice Porter: I think I read, I know we're going aside here, but 54 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:34,220 I love it, because Wasn't it a woman who was the actual I read 55 00:03:34,220 --> 00:03:38,120 somewhere, maybe in Vanity Fair, that this woman who was that a 56 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:41,440 big wig in the ad industry, which, by the way, was unheard 57 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:45,100 of really right back in season, whatever. But she was 58 00:03:45,100 --> 00:03:49,960 responsible for a lot of those big ads. I'm thinking in my 59 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:52,660 head, Alka Seltzer. I don't know why, but that might have been 60 00:03:52,660 --> 00:03:56,920 one of them, plot, plot, because, yeah, there were some 61 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:02,040 others. And I think they, they, they the the base of Mad Men, 62 00:04:02,040 --> 00:04:05,040 had some of those things in it. And, and the character, the 63 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:09,600 woman, character that Elizabeth Moss played, was based on this 64 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:13,200 woman. Yes, it was actually, I don't remember her name, but 65 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:15,960 David Saxby: do you she was? No, I don't remember her name 66 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:16,320 either. You 67 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,540 Janice Porter: know what I'm talking about. Then Absolutely. 68 00:04:18,660 --> 00:04:21,800 Ah, okay, okay. I'm sorry I sidetracked, but that, yeah, so 69 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:26,240 So you so in your study of the industry and of creativity, you 70 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:30,440 probably came across all of this. And so you said that it 71 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:34,880 helps you with your business. But did it? Did your did it help 72 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:40,300 you stay on track creatively and not, you know, thinking like 73 00:04:40,300 --> 00:04:44,260 feeling more confident that you weren't going to lose that. 74 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:45,520 Yeah, 75 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:50,680 David Saxby: and for me, it was like creativity when I was 76 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:55,480 growing up came pretty naturally, but I realized that 77 00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:59,200 there are ways of prompting creativity. There's ways of 78 00:04:59,260 --> 00:05:03,960 being able to. Feed creativity. And then as I got into business, 79 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:06,420 I started out on the creative side, like I mentioned, then I 80 00:05:06,420 --> 00:05:11,700 moved into an ad agency, so you had to have both the creative 81 00:05:11,700 --> 00:05:15,120 side, or the right brain thinking, along with the logical 82 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:18,420 linear side, which was being able to plan campaigns and 83 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,880 organize and all of that sort of thing. And then at that point, I 84 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:27,920 realized that there was a lot of creativity in the business of 85 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:33,200 advertising, but the challenge became, if it wasn't tied to 86 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:38,480 strategy, then it was just a great idea, but had no traction. 87 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:42,460 Janice Porter: Example, well, 88 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:46,600 David Saxby: yeah, I'm just trying to think of one. The 89 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:50,260 challenge, being, in a lot of cases, is, is that businesses 90 00:05:50,260 --> 00:05:53,740 came up with ideas that didn't gain traction. Actually, a good 91 00:05:53,740 --> 00:05:58,120 example, I don't know if you're familiar with Quiznos. They were 92 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:02,280 a sandwich maker, yes, and they came up with an idea based on 93 00:06:02,280 --> 00:06:09,480 the fact that they observed subway, right? And subway didn't 94 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:13,740 have ovens. So quiznus came along and said, Well, if we cook 95 00:06:13,740 --> 00:06:17,460 the sandwiches, if we toast the sandwiches, people buy it 96 00:06:17,460 --> 00:06:21,560 because they like warm meals, right? Great, creative idea, 97 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:22,100 right? 98 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:24,920 Janice Porter: Wasn't it? Wasn't it a Canadian company? 99 00:06:25,460 --> 00:06:29,060 David Saxby: I don't recall. I think it is an American company 100 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:33,800 franchised in Canada, okay, but what was interesting about that 101 00:06:33,860 --> 00:06:37,820 is they found a loophole that gave them a bit of traction in 102 00:06:37,820 --> 00:06:41,200 the industry. The challenge with it is they hadn't thought the 103 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:44,980 strategy out very well, because all subway had to do was supply 104 00:06:44,980 --> 00:06:50,980 all their franchisees with an oven, and kuznos was toast, no. 105 00:06:53,620 --> 00:06:58,360 And, and so in that circumstance, then they realized 106 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,440 that, oh, they're not getting the traction they expected in 107 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,560 the marketplace, subway was still the number one franchise. 108 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:08,460 So then they came along with these really wacky ad campaigns 109 00:07:08,460 --> 00:07:16,020 with his ugly looking character with a hat on. Oh, it. It was 110 00:07:16,020 --> 00:07:19,920 actually very like looking at the characters going, Oh my God, 111 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:24,800 that's ugly, yeah. So, yeah. So anybody thinking about getting a 112 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:31,100 sandwich, all they could think of is this character, yeah. And, 113 00:07:31,100 --> 00:07:35,900 and from there, they lost a lot of traction in the market. So 114 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,980 creative idea, you know, they found a loophole they could, you 115 00:07:39,980 --> 00:07:44,020 know, saturate the market for what they were trying to do. But 116 00:07:44,020 --> 00:07:47,080 they couldn't carry it out any further. And then they started 117 00:07:47,080 --> 00:07:52,000 doing really crazy ad campaigns that, you know, were, were not 118 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,320 well thought up. Let's 119 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:55,900 Janice Porter: put it that way, right? And so it didn't. So they 120 00:07:55,900 --> 00:07:58,240 died, basically, yeah, yeah. 121 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:01,380 David Saxby: Well, and one of the franchise when one of the 122 00:08:01,380 --> 00:08:05,700 franchisers who owned several stores actually got so 123 00:08:05,700 --> 00:08:10,140 frustrated with Quiznos and everything going on that he 124 00:08:10,140 --> 00:08:14,640 committed suicide. Oh, dear, yeah, so I mean sad story, and, 125 00:08:14,700 --> 00:08:18,300 you know, again, an example of creativity, but not being 126 00:08:18,300 --> 00:08:22,580 carried through thinking strategy. They weren't thinking, 127 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:27,320 Okay, interesting anyway, so a little bit of a Segway, but 128 00:08:27,860 --> 00:08:32,360 Janice Porter: that's interesting. So do you feel that 129 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:36,500 the work that you do in your company spark communications 130 00:08:37,460 --> 00:08:40,960 allows you to create, to be still the creative? 131 00:08:42,819 --> 00:08:48,159 David Saxby: Yeah, i i My focus is still coming up with 132 00:08:48,459 --> 00:08:51,939 innovative ideas, and that's another thing. I talk more about 133 00:08:51,939 --> 00:08:54,699 innovation than I do about creativity, because creativity 134 00:08:54,699 --> 00:09:00,039 is a component of innovation, but innovation is creative plus 135 00:09:00,039 --> 00:09:03,359 execution, okay for implementation. 136 00:09:03,540 --> 00:09:07,080 Janice Porter: So tell, tell my audience a little bit about 137 00:09:07,560 --> 00:09:11,820 Spark communications, because I have here in my notes that you 138 00:09:11,820 --> 00:09:16,200 help businesses create a strategic advantage over your 139 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:20,220 their competitors by developing in innovative marketing 140 00:09:20,220 --> 00:09:23,120 strategies which, which is basically what you just said, 141 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:31,940 and you have that that added advantage of having that 142 00:09:31,940 --> 00:09:34,580 creative background, I think, when you're talking to business 143 00:09:34,580 --> 00:09:37,940 owners about their marketing that a lot of marketers don't 144 00:09:37,940 --> 00:09:41,320 have, if that makes sense, because they're not All ad 145 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:43,900 people. They're not all people who've created those kinds of 146 00:09:43,900 --> 00:09:48,880 things. So tell me what your secret sauce is with with Spark 147 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,760 communications with your clients. 148 00:09:52,900 --> 00:09:56,260 David Saxby: Well, I think, as I mentioned to you while ago, we 149 00:09:56,260 --> 00:10:00,180 have a I have a formula that I kind of follow when it comes. To 150 00:10:00,180 --> 00:10:03,480 working with clients, so that the first part of the formula is 151 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:08,340 strategy first, not tactics. And a lot of businesses make the 152 00:10:08,340 --> 00:10:10,980 mistake is they go out and they do all these things, and then 153 00:10:10,980 --> 00:10:15,600 they go, oh, that didn't work, or this worked and that didn't 154 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:19,860 work. So if you have the right strategy, the tactics fall into 155 00:10:19,860 --> 00:10:23,120 place, and then the second part for a second. So 156 00:10:23,300 --> 00:10:25,400 Janice Porter: I want to make sure I understand it, because I 157 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:28,040 know we're building up the word spark with the things that you 158 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:33,380 do. So the strategy, and I'm just going to pull it a little 159 00:10:33,380 --> 00:10:37,640 bit for a second to relationships rule, okay, this, 160 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:44,020 I would think has, have you already got an idea, or are you 161 00:10:44,020 --> 00:10:48,100 thinking first, okay, this is the type of business it is, and 162 00:10:48,100 --> 00:10:53,980 so with it being, say, an online business or or a brick and 163 00:10:53,980 --> 00:10:58,120 mortar business, the strategy will be different as to how we 164 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:01,980 promote this business, or how we market this business, absolutely 165 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:06,000 okay. So strategy first, we haven't come up with the ideas 166 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:07,620 yet for you 167 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:11,100 David Saxby: and the strategy, strategy actually comes from me, 168 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:16,140 observing the industry, looking at, you know, the trends going 169 00:11:16,140 --> 00:11:19,260 on in the industry, the competitors that are in the 170 00:11:19,260 --> 00:11:24,800 industry, and literally looking for gaps, okay, looking at what 171 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:28,820 the competitors are doing, and going, Okay, where is the gap? 172 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:34,220 Okay? And so when I find the gap, that becomes an opportunity 173 00:11:34,220 --> 00:11:38,300 to strategically enter the industry. For the business, and 174 00:11:38,540 --> 00:11:42,400 for a lot of businesses, they're commodities. You know, you look 175 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,220 at Pizza joints, every corner you look on in the city is a 176 00:11:45,220 --> 00:11:48,820 pizza joint. So what makes one different from another one? 177 00:11:49,300 --> 00:11:51,520 Janice Porter: Okay? And so that's where you start. Okay 178 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,120 with strategy. Okay, go ahead. So 179 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:59,620 David Saxby: then the second part is positioning. And so 180 00:11:59,620 --> 00:12:03,300 there's an expression that came from the two fellows that first 181 00:12:03,300 --> 00:12:08,160 came up with the concept of positioning recent trout. And 182 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:12,420 what they basically say is that it's not what you do to the 183 00:12:12,420 --> 00:12:16,080 product or service. It's what you do in the mind of the 184 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:21,920 customer, sure, perception. It's the perception, exactly and 185 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:26,780 people, most of us, have preconceived notions of almost 186 00:12:26,780 --> 00:12:28,640 everything in the world. Can I 187 00:12:28,640 --> 00:12:30,380 Janice Porter: give you one that's on my mind right now, 188 00:12:30,380 --> 00:12:36,920 that yeah, Rogers and Shaw joined forces? Yeah, so to 189 00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:43,900 speak. Ever since Shaw has become Rogers. I have had the 190 00:12:43,900 --> 00:12:49,240 worst time with them. I cannot get through. I have an hour and 191 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:53,380 a half to get on, to wait on the phone, to get a customer service 192 00:12:53,380 --> 00:12:59,200 agent to help me with the bill that is wrong that I'm trying to 193 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:02,940 write because I'm being a good consumer, and I can't get 194 00:13:02,940 --> 00:13:07,620 through to them, and I'm ready to just tear my hair out. So my 195 00:13:07,620 --> 00:13:12,060 perception of this thing is so bad right now? 196 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:15,720 David Saxby: Yeah, well, here's an interesting story for letting 197 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:22,940 me vent. Here's an interesting story. Is before Shaw cable 198 00:13:22,940 --> 00:13:27,620 became Shaw cable, they were a little company called capital 199 00:13:27,620 --> 00:13:33,980 cable. They had eight stations in Western Canada, and I was 200 00:13:33,980 --> 00:13:36,560 connected with them through a fellow I knew, through a 201 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:41,440 volunteer organization, and I became their first kind of 202 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:46,060 marketing consultant, yeah. So they were launching their 203 00:13:46,060 --> 00:13:49,900 company and going public and becoming Shaw cable. 204 00:13:50,140 --> 00:13:52,780 Janice Porter: Oh, you were with Shaw, that's right, I forgot, 205 00:13:52,780 --> 00:13:54,100 yeah. So 206 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,160 David Saxby: when that happened, the first thing that they were 207 00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:59,800 going to do is they were going to put together their annual 208 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:04,140 report and send it out to potential investors, okay? And 209 00:14:04,140 --> 00:14:06,960 so I was put in touch with the accountant, and he said, Yeah, 210 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:10,440 we're just going to take the financial statement, we'll slap 211 00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:13,920 a cover on it and stick it in an envelope and mail it out. And I 212 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:19,500 said, No, do not do that, right? And so we went through a 213 00:14:19,500 --> 00:14:23,420 process, and I told them, you know, basically, I said to him, 214 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:27,500 what we need to do is we need to tell the story, and we need to 215 00:14:27,500 --> 00:14:30,740 package the story in the way that's going to get these high 216 00:14:30,740 --> 00:14:35,360 value investors intrigued and interested in investing in the 217 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,180 company. Oh, no, we're just going to send out financial 218 00:14:38,180 --> 00:14:42,400 statements. I got a budget of $2,000 yeah. That include 219 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,420 Bailey, yeah, yeah. So that started out, and the first thing 220 00:14:46,420 --> 00:14:49,540 that happened when we we built a proper Annual Report with a nice 221 00:14:49,540 --> 00:14:54,460 cover on it and background story and so on, is that some of these 222 00:14:54,460 --> 00:14:57,820 very high end investors, and we're talking, you know, 223 00:14:57,940 --> 00:15:01,440 millions and millions of dollars very well. A few people wrote a 224 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,640 note back to Jim Shaw and said, fantastic. This is great. 225 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,700 Congratulations on the launch of your company. We look forward to 226 00:15:08,700 --> 00:15:14,640 next year. And Jim and I had a conversation after that, and 227 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:18,840 every year after that, my would meet with the VP, and Jim would 228 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:21,620 pop into the meetings. And what are you planning for this year's 229 00:15:21,620 --> 00:15:26,660 annual report? And so we grew the company literally by telling 230 00:15:26,660 --> 00:15:28,640 the story of what was going on, 231 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:31,940 Janice Porter: so interesting that I would have to 232 00:15:32,060 --> 00:15:36,920 David Saxby: vote today. That's so and this, this is even more 233 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:39,800 interesting is that back when all the specialty channels 234 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:44,440 launched, this is the late 80s, early 90s. The specialty 235 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:46,900 channels weren't getting enough traction in the market, and 236 00:15:46,900 --> 00:15:49,780 there was a fear that they were all going to go broke. So the 237 00:15:49,780 --> 00:15:55,120 CRTC, the regulating body, said to the cable companies, you have 238 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:58,660 to take on these companies and sell them to your subscribers. 239 00:15:59,020 --> 00:16:03,360 So literally, they forced them to take over marketing, 240 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:07,860 especially companies. So we did a campaign for Shaw to launch 241 00:16:07,860 --> 00:16:11,340 this. And basically what we did was what was called a negative 242 00:16:11,340 --> 00:16:15,600 option campaign. And what that meant is, you got this package. 243 00:16:16,620 --> 00:16:20,540 We're sending out information about these specialty channels. 244 00:16:20,540 --> 00:16:23,360 If you're interested in having these specialty channels, you 245 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:24,860 don't need to do anything. I 246 00:16:24,860 --> 00:16:27,800 Janice Porter: hated that negative campaign. You don't 247 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,080 want them cancel them. Yeah. 248 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,980 David Saxby: So anyway that that gained great traction, we had a 249 00:16:33,980 --> 00:16:43,240 94% subscription rate by default. Rogers came along just 250 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,920 shortly after that with the same kind of campaign, and miserably 251 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:50,680 failed and had to restart their campaign. So 252 00:16:51,460 --> 00:16:52,480 Janice Porter: what was the difference? 253 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:57,760 David Saxby: Just how they approached it, the message and 254 00:16:58,060 --> 00:17:03,180 literally, how they strategized him. Okay, so we personalized. 255 00:17:03,180 --> 00:17:07,800 And this is, this is really something was quite unheard of 256 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:10,980 at the time. And this is kind of when my my brain, went into the 257 00:17:10,980 --> 00:17:15,120 innovative mode. Yes, was we personalized every single 258 00:17:15,120 --> 00:17:19,560 person's letter. And in those days, in the early 80s, that was 259 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:22,400 almost impossible. We went to Canada Post and said, Here's 260 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,220 what we want to do. And they said, we don't think we could do 261 00:17:25,220 --> 00:17:29,840 it. Mail Merge. Yes, exactly, yeah. And in those days, it was 262 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:33,800 done on a mainframe computer, I know. Oh my goodness. So we had 263 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:39,380 606 100 and some odd 1000 personalized letters went out. 264 00:17:39,380 --> 00:17:39,560 Okay, 265 00:17:40,279 --> 00:17:42,699 Janice Porter: so I'm going to come back to the Shaw Rogers 266 00:17:42,699 --> 00:17:47,259 thing later. Yeah, strategy, positioning, 267 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:50,500 David Saxby: positioning, yeah. So positioning is, it's, it's 268 00:17:50,500 --> 00:17:55,000 how we, in the mind of the customer, got them to buy into 269 00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:58,660 the concept. And the billboard advertising we had, and the 270 00:17:58,660 --> 00:18:04,680 other promotion we did, we had a picture of a silver platter, you 271 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:09,600 know, that they use for catering. And it said, think of 272 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:12,840 it as a smorgasbord. In other words, you've got all these 273 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:15,240 options. You don't have to eat everything at once. 274 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:18,300 Janice Porter: Okay, so perception was part of that 275 00:18:18,300 --> 00:18:22,520 positioning we come to attracting attention? I think, 276 00:18:22,759 --> 00:18:25,279 David Saxby: yeah, so an attracting attention is really 277 00:18:25,279 --> 00:18:29,119 about, you know, what's your message? What's the media that 278 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:34,219 you transfer your message through? And it has to be a 279 00:18:34,219 --> 00:18:38,239 place where your customers are. So the target market, and the 280 00:18:38,239 --> 00:18:44,319 concept behind that is that the media will kind of pop up or 281 00:18:44,319 --> 00:18:48,699 come up as you think of how you're going to communicate with 282 00:18:48,699 --> 00:18:53,019 your customers, because nowadays we can research where people go 283 00:18:53,019 --> 00:18:56,739 and find information, whether it's Google or they're going on 284 00:18:56,739 --> 00:19:02,039 to paid ads or they're on TV or radio or print, or whatever 285 00:19:02,039 --> 00:19:04,859 channel they're going through. So the the concept being, is 286 00:19:04,859 --> 00:19:08,219 that once you've done that, then it's a matter of figuring out, 287 00:19:08,219 --> 00:19:12,359 okay, how can we deliver a message effectively? So there's 288 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:15,599 a there's a rule in the billboard industry way back 289 00:19:15,599 --> 00:19:20,099 when, and that was basically an effective billboard with six to 290 00:19:20,099 --> 00:19:24,379 eight words and an image, that's all you had to work with. Now 291 00:19:24,379 --> 00:19:29,599 that's a slide. Yes, exactly, yeah. So the medium changes, but 292 00:19:29,599 --> 00:19:33,679 the message doesn't, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, and then at that 293 00:19:33,679 --> 00:19:36,919 point, it's a matter of moving to the next stage, which is the 294 00:19:36,919 --> 00:19:41,259 resources. And what that simply means is that you've got only a 295 00:19:41,259 --> 00:19:45,399 handful of resources. One is people, the other one was time, 296 00:19:46,659 --> 00:19:51,159 and the third one is your media selection. So if you have the 297 00:19:51,159 --> 00:19:54,279 people, you can do the work marketing wise, internally, but 298 00:19:54,279 --> 00:19:56,019 they need to know what they're doing, and they need to 299 00:19:56,019 --> 00:20:00,539 understand the whole concept of marketing. Uh. If you have the 300 00:20:00,539 --> 00:20:04,679 time, you can hire a consultant, or you can hire a marketing firm 301 00:20:05,399 --> 00:20:10,079 and pay them. But in a lot of cases, people do the opposite. 302 00:20:10,319 --> 00:20:12,899 They figure, oh, we got lots of people. We have no clue what 303 00:20:12,899 --> 00:20:17,519 we're doing, but we'll just use enough people to clobber the 304 00:20:17,519 --> 00:20:19,739 internet with messages, 305 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:27,680 Janice Porter: yes, yes, okay, the last one, okay, yeah, 306 00:20:27,980 --> 00:20:31,280 David Saxby: and that's about keeping the keeping your 307 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,040 competitive edge. What? What I mean by that is just simply 308 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:38,900 continuing to market. So some businesses are all year round. 309 00:20:38,900 --> 00:20:42,700 Some businesses are seasonal, so you need to be able to continue 310 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:46,780 being competitive in the market by, you know, adjusting your 311 00:20:46,780 --> 00:20:50,440 budget, adjusting your messaging, determining when the 312 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:53,980 biggest share of your market's available. So online as an 313 00:20:53,980 --> 00:20:58,420 example. And if you look at LinkedIn, a lot of businesses 314 00:20:58,420 --> 00:21:03,660 are online in the daytime, right? And, you know, generally, 315 00:21:03,660 --> 00:21:07,860 Tuesday, Wednesdays are the best dates of the week to put 316 00:21:07,860 --> 00:21:13,800 messages out on LinkedIn, right? Yeah. So the concept with that 317 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:17,220 is that, if you're doing marketing correctly, it's an 318 00:21:17,220 --> 00:21:20,960 investment, well, incorrectly, it's a cost, 319 00:21:22,039 --> 00:21:24,619 Janice Porter: Okay, fair enough. I do think, yeah, you're 320 00:21:24,619 --> 00:21:27,859 talking about paid ads on LinkedIn, as opposed to posting 321 00:21:27,859 --> 00:21:28,999 and things like that, right? 322 00:21:29,060 --> 00:21:31,220 David Saxby: Oh, no, same, same thing. Okay, 323 00:21:31,340 --> 00:21:36,080 Janice Porter: I think today, I really do think that there's 324 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:40,540 people online all the time, all around the world, so absolutely, 325 00:21:40,540 --> 00:21:44,500 yeah, it really does depend on your audience, and whether it's 326 00:21:44,500 --> 00:21:48,220 global or whether it's local, and so forth as well. Because I 327 00:21:48,220 --> 00:21:51,400 think we get a bit too hung up on that myself, but maybe bigger 328 00:21:51,460 --> 00:21:54,760 companies would have to pay more attention to that. I don't know. 329 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:55,540 Well, 330 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:58,720 David Saxby: yeah, and it's also, you know, what's your 331 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:02,340 industry doing? You take the construction industry, yeah, 332 00:22:02,340 --> 00:22:06,720 what are they doing the warm season? They're going 24/7, 333 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:10,500 right? They're trying to make as much money and do as much work 334 00:22:10,500 --> 00:22:13,860 as they can, right? So on the shoulder seasons, when they're 335 00:22:13,860 --> 00:22:17,160 ramping up particularly, I mean, you look at Alberta in BC they 336 00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,480 can pretty well work all year round. But in Alberta, there's 337 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:26,120 times of the year where deal with weather, yeah, so, so 338 00:22:26,120 --> 00:22:29,720 that's kind of the formula that I I work to when I'm working 339 00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:33,560 with clients. As I look at that formula and say, Okay, what's 340 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:38,180 going on in their industry? You know, what's their market doing? 341 00:22:38,300 --> 00:22:41,740 Yeah, and then where do we go from here? Where do we find the 342 00:22:41,740 --> 00:22:44,560 gap? And so 343 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,200 Janice Porter: do you think there's one or two common 344 00:22:47,260 --> 00:22:54,160 mistakes that that people make in like, what you ask people 345 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,760 what their biggest problem might be, or their you know, did? Did 346 00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,620 the same ones come up all the time? 347 00:23:00,940 --> 00:23:03,900 David Saxby: I would say generally, yeah. I mean, first 348 00:23:03,900 --> 00:23:07,020 one is they get the wrong target market and or a lot of 349 00:23:07,020 --> 00:23:09,540 businesses. So you ask them, who's your target market? They 350 00:23:09,540 --> 00:23:13,500 go, Oh, everybody, yeah. They have no, yeah, if you got lots 351 00:23:13,500 --> 00:23:16,680 of money, it could be a roof, yeah, yeah. But that's, that is 352 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:22,100 big, okay, yeah. So that's, I think, a big one, the second one 353 00:23:22,100 --> 00:23:27,320 is confusing messages and and I see this all the time. I work a 354 00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:31,760 lot with professionals, and I see this all the time that they 355 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:35,180 talk from a technical perspective, or they talk from 356 00:23:35,180 --> 00:23:38,660 industry speak, trying to reach their customers. And you know, 357 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:42,040 you look at computer technology, when computers became mainstream 358 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:45,100 and people were putting one in their house, you'd go to a 359 00:23:45,100 --> 00:23:48,880 computer store or a computer sales person, they'd start 360 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:52,480 talking bits and bytes and RAM and ROM and yeah, all sorts of 361 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,360 technical terms, the customers going, Well, can I type on it? 362 00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:02,640 Yeah, exactly. So that, I think the confusing message part is 363 00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:08,040 the second 1/3, one is they've got a confusing brand. You know, 364 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,860 a lot of businesses use their own personal name when they 365 00:24:10,860 --> 00:24:15,960 start up, you know, a name like Smith. Well, good luck with 366 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,380 marketing that, because there are hundreds of 1000s of Smiths 367 00:24:19,380 --> 00:24:24,200 around the world, so the brand isn't attractive. It does not 368 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,860 have the right message. It doesn't match the thinking and 369 00:24:27,860 --> 00:24:31,400 the mindset, the preconception of what a business should be. 370 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,960 They're not consistent. They don't have a process or a 371 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:40,600 system. So they're not doing it from a strategic point of view, 372 00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:44,980 they're just throwing things out and seeing what sticks, and then 373 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:49,900 even more so with digital media and technology. Now they're 374 00:24:49,900 --> 00:24:54,040 doing poor lead generation. They're not using like, you 375 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:58,120 know, you work on LinkedIn. They're not using the LinkedIn 376 00:24:58,120 --> 00:25:01,560 system to be able to generate good. Eves are just fishing. 377 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:07,319 Janice Porter: Yeah, a lot. Okay, here's a question for you. 378 00:25:08,099 --> 00:25:11,339 Many businesses focus on technology and automation in 379 00:25:11,339 --> 00:25:15,119 their marketing. How do you balance the use of technology 380 00:25:15,239 --> 00:25:18,719 with the need to build meaningful relationships with 381 00:25:18,719 --> 00:25:19,499 customers? 382 00:25:20,460 --> 00:25:27,680 David Saxby: Oh, yeah, that's an interesting one. I think the 383 00:25:27,980 --> 00:25:34,340 first thought should always be, what's my customer thinking? 384 00:25:34,340 --> 00:25:38,660 What's my customer doing? Where does my customer hang out? So 385 00:25:38,660 --> 00:25:44,200 the relationship part comes from understanding the psychology of 386 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:48,280 the customer, understanding that sociology, that's how the group 387 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:52,960 thinks the the segment of the market, yeah, and and then 388 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:57,400 figuring out the demographics behind that market. And there's 389 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:01,380 an interesting book came out called pre suasion. I don't know 390 00:26:01,380 --> 00:26:05,760 if you've ever read it, but titles cover, yeah, and it's all 391 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:10,920 about how we influence and persuade customers to buy. And 392 00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:15,180 the first book that it's Robert chial, chill, chill Dini, I 393 00:26:15,180 --> 00:26:15,840 think it is, 394 00:26:16,259 --> 00:26:19,619 Janice Porter: oh, C, I a, l, yeah. You wrote 395 00:26:19,620 --> 00:26:22,700 David Saxby: a book before that called influence, but what he 396 00:26:22,700 --> 00:26:28,640 realized was that when it comes to relationships and working 397 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,960 with people and trying to give people to buy into a concept or 398 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,320 a marketing campaign or whatever it is, it all begins with 399 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:44,080 preparing the audience's mind to receive the message. So the the 400 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:47,440 challenge there is that there's so much clutter going on in our 401 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:51,460 heads that, you know, how do we cut through? How do we cut 402 00:26:51,460 --> 00:26:54,760 through that clutter? So, it's about timing. It's about 403 00:26:54,760 --> 00:27:00,040 creating associations with pre, pre seed or perceptions. It's 404 00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:06,060 about framing the concept, the idea, it's about building trust 405 00:27:06,060 --> 00:27:07,200 and connection. 406 00:27:07,980 --> 00:27:11,100 Janice Porter: So do you think, though, that that's done better 407 00:27:11,100 --> 00:27:19,080 today, online or in person or face, face to face? Well, face 408 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:22,340 to face, like even if it's like this, not just, not necessarily 409 00:27:22,340 --> 00:27:26,240 in person, but telephone, I mean, that's it's an old 410 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:28,280 fashioned tool, but I think it's coming back. 411 00:27:29,420 --> 00:27:32,900 David Saxby: Well, yeah, and there's in the sales process, or 412 00:27:32,900 --> 00:27:37,940 in in selling, one of the things that's challenging for 413 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:44,200 salespeople is if they can't see the person. So on screen, we're 414 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:48,940 seeing about this much of us, so if they can't see the person, 415 00:27:48,940 --> 00:27:53,380 they don't know how to read, how the customers understanding the 416 00:27:53,380 --> 00:28:00,960 information. And so in language, using language, salespeople can 417 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,620 break through that lack of visual perception by 418 00:28:04,620 --> 00:28:07,680 understanding the language of the people and what they're 419 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:13,320 saying and the gaps in in the messaging so and a lot of that 420 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,840 has to do with what's called neuro linguistic program 421 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:20,720 program, right? And so most sales people, they just, you 422 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:23,300 know, they hear something, they take it for granted, or they 423 00:28:23,420 --> 00:28:27,980 take it literally. But in some cases, and if you're dealing 424 00:28:27,980 --> 00:28:31,520 with different personality styles, what people say and what 425 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:36,140 people are actually thinking and doing are different perceptions, 426 00:28:36,140 --> 00:28:43,420 different so in a relationship situation, the context is also a 427 00:28:43,420 --> 00:28:49,900 factor. Yes, yes, right. So it's and, you know, we even when we 428 00:28:49,900 --> 00:28:54,880 went from face to face selling to online doing zoom calls, 429 00:28:55,420 --> 00:28:58,300 again, we don't know. All we could see is this much of a 430 00:28:58,300 --> 00:29:00,600 person. We don't know what they're doing. They could be 431 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,000 sitting there in their underwear, and we have no clue, 432 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:04,320 but that's okay. 433 00:29:04,319 --> 00:29:06,599 Janice Porter: Who cares? Yeah, exactly. 434 00:29:06,719 --> 00:29:11,339 It's just, it's, how do you how are it's whether you have the 435 00:29:11,339 --> 00:29:15,779 ability to relate through the screen. That's exactly it, 436 00:29:16,019 --> 00:29:21,859 right? Yeah, and that has never bothered me, but I'm, always I 437 00:29:21,859 --> 00:29:27,799 guess I'm of the generation that the first tool that I would ever 438 00:29:27,799 --> 00:29:30,679 choose would be to pick up the phone, because that's how I grew 439 00:29:30,679 --> 00:29:34,219 up. And I had a funny story my little granddaughter, who's 440 00:29:34,219 --> 00:29:39,259 five, she called us the other night on FaceTime, or my my 441 00:29:39,259 --> 00:29:43,119 daughter called on FaceTime, and my granddaughter wanted to talk, 442 00:29:43,479 --> 00:29:47,799 but when we came and said, Hi, how are you, she had a play 443 00:29:47,799 --> 00:29:53,079 phone up to her ear, and she said, Could you call me back? 444 00:29:53,079 --> 00:29:54,279 I'm on another call. 445 00:29:54,519 --> 00:29:57,279 David Saxby: Yeah, that's funny. I 446 00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:00,600 Janice Porter: was like, what could you call me? Back. I'm on 447 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,720 another call, and then I just saw a picture of her. She got 448 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,540 herself dressed, and she has her phone in her pocket. 449 00:30:07,079 --> 00:30:08,339 David Saxby: Hilarious. Wow, 450 00:30:09,239 --> 00:30:13,319 Janice Porter: yeah, so it Yeah. Anyway, I want to switch gears 451 00:30:13,319 --> 00:30:20,159 for a second, because I feel that you are a a master speaker 452 00:30:20,999 --> 00:30:25,699 in that you were one of the founding members of your chapter 453 00:30:25,699 --> 00:30:30,559 of caps, which is the Canadian version of Canadian Association 454 00:30:30,559 --> 00:30:37,399 of Professional speakers. And I am in awe of people who have 455 00:30:37,399 --> 00:30:42,159 done a lot of speaking and have been part of that organization, 456 00:30:42,159 --> 00:30:45,759 because it takes a lot to do the kind of you know, to get paid 457 00:30:45,759 --> 00:30:49,719 for speaking and things like that. But are you still involved 458 00:30:49,719 --> 00:30:50,799 with them at all? 459 00:30:51,159 --> 00:30:54,699 David Saxby: Oh, very much. So yeah, I'm not on a board 460 00:30:54,699 --> 00:30:58,179 anymore, right? I probably spent about eight years in my my 461 00:30:58,179 --> 00:31:02,279 career as a board member in some level, okay, and became the 462 00:31:02,279 --> 00:31:04,259 president. And, yeah, yeah. 463 00:31:04,259 --> 00:31:07,919 Janice Porter: And so, how would that? How would you say that has 464 00:31:07,919 --> 00:31:11,339 been beneficial in your career? 465 00:31:12,539 --> 00:31:15,599 David Saxby: Oh, well, you know, it's interesting. I started out 466 00:31:16,199 --> 00:31:18,119 having a pure public speaking. 467 00:31:18,419 --> 00:31:20,099 Janice Porter: I was actually, Oh, you did okay. 468 00:31:20,099 --> 00:31:22,999 David Saxby: Oh yeah, yeah. When I was growing up, I had two 469 00:31:22,999 --> 00:31:26,599 thoughts about careers. One was advertising, yeah. The other one 470 00:31:26,599 --> 00:31:30,439 was being a professional musician. Mm, hmm. So I was 471 00:31:30,439 --> 00:31:34,279 literally going to music school, and I was I was signing up for 472 00:31:34,279 --> 00:31:37,879 college to learn about the advertising business in the 473 00:31:37,879 --> 00:31:42,639 industry, and I had a group of students I was teaching in 474 00:31:42,639 --> 00:31:46,539 music. We went to a festival like the Kiwanis festival. 475 00:31:47,619 --> 00:31:50,259 Janice Porter: What did you what instrument did you play? 476 00:31:50,740 --> 00:31:54,940 David Saxby: Guitar? Okay. Anyway, the night before the the 477 00:31:54,940 --> 00:32:01,200 competition, the band that I was training to perform the guitar 478 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,080 player phoned me up and said, we can't go. And I said, Why is 479 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:09,600 that our singers lost her voice, his voice, I should say. And I 480 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,380 said, Oh, well, that's going to be a problem. And they said, You 481 00:32:13,380 --> 00:32:17,820 have to sing for us. Ah, and I had never sung in front of 650 482 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:20,180 people in my life, but they 483 00:32:20,179 --> 00:32:22,399 Janice Porter: knew that you could sing like that was, that 484 00:32:22,399 --> 00:32:24,139 was, no, they didn't. I mean, 485 00:32:24,140 --> 00:32:26,720 David Saxby: I would sing, but it was just kind of in the 486 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:31,220 studio as we were teaching the kids. So the night before I went 487 00:32:31,220 --> 00:32:35,360 home, memorized the lyrics. We went up to the event. It was up 488 00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:41,500 in Edmonton. We got up on stage together and started singing. I 489 00:32:41,500 --> 00:32:44,500 started singing and playing. They they were playing guitar. I 490 00:32:44,500 --> 00:32:50,560 didn't play guitar for that, the power cut. All that was left was 491 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:55,240 my voice and a set of drums that we're doing back in the USSR by 492 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:59,860 the Beatles. When I walked off that stage and I said, Screw 493 00:32:59,860 --> 00:33:04,620 this music business I can't do. It's way too stressful. Oh, my 494 00:33:04,620 --> 00:33:08,520 goodness, would not get on a stage again. Then I got into 495 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:12,360 business, and I went, Okay every night before I have to do a 496 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:14,820 major presentation, I was talking to guys that were old 497 00:33:14,820 --> 00:33:18,720 enough to be my dad or granddad, about parting with millions of 498 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:23,060 dollars of ad campaigns and I would be sweating bullets a 499 00:33:23,060 --> 00:33:27,080 night before I'd show up and as best as I could present, and 500 00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:31,220 most of the time it went well, but I said, Okay, I can't deal 501 00:33:31,220 --> 00:33:35,540 with this. I I've got to learn how to do presentations. So I 502 00:33:35,540 --> 00:33:38,960 joined a group called The JCS Junior Chamber of Commerce. They 503 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:43,180 had an eight week program, yeah, and I went through that program 504 00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:46,060 and learned, you know, what it takes to put together 505 00:33:46,060 --> 00:33:50,380 professional presentations. And what was interesting is, when I 506 00:33:50,380 --> 00:33:53,500 first went in, I said, the guy leading the program, I said, I'm 507 00:33:53,500 --> 00:33:58,900 just sitting at the back here taking notes. And of course, 508 00:33:58,900 --> 00:34:02,880 who's the first guy he picked on? Yeah. And when we finished 509 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,000 the program, he said, I want you to lead the next one. And I 510 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,400 looked at him, I said, No, I got my notes. I'm good. I'm out of 511 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:11,280 here. He said, No, I'd like you to leave the next one. I said, 512 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,100 No, we're not doing it. And he said, How about you and I lead 513 00:34:14,100 --> 00:34:18,360 it together? So I said, Okay, well, yeah, we can do that. So 514 00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,140 we led the program together. The next year he came back and he 515 00:34:21,140 --> 00:34:25,040 said, I'd like you to lead the next program. Interesting. And I 516 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:29,120 said, we already had that conversation. Yeah, I got my 517 00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:32,180 notes. I tried it once I'm out of here, I'm good. And he says, 518 00:34:32,180 --> 00:34:37,520 Well, no, you have to. I mean, I have to. And he said, you're the 519 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:40,160 only guy that knows the program I'm leaving the country. And 520 00:34:41,420 --> 00:34:45,460 that was my introduction to speaking. So I did training for 521 00:34:45,460 --> 00:34:50,980 volunteers and and through the through the group. And then I 522 00:34:50,980 --> 00:34:53,500 got people asking me, would you come out and do a presentation 523 00:34:53,500 --> 00:34:58,480 for our business or not for profit organization? And started 524 00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,220 to do that. And. Then the next thing, one day, I woke up, just 525 00:35:02,340 --> 00:35:05,940 shortly after I had the marketing the advertising agency 526 00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:09,600 went, you know, I could probably get some clients if I went out 527 00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:13,800 and did presentations, right? So started doing that, and, of 528 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,040 course, attracting clients. And that's how I built the marketing 529 00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:18,300 firm. Sure, 530 00:35:18,660 --> 00:35:24,800 Janice Porter: interesting and and, of course, you're, you are 531 00:35:24,860 --> 00:35:29,000 a doer, obviously, because once you got involved, then you had 532 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:34,040 to get involved, right? Like, yeah, that was interesting. Um, 533 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:38,300 no, it's fascinating. I, I've dabbled a little bit early on in 534 00:35:39,380 --> 00:35:44,020 Toastmasters, and I have experienced a little bit of caps 535 00:35:44,020 --> 00:35:47,620 in Vancouver. They have a pretty strong group here, but yeah, and 536 00:35:47,620 --> 00:35:51,880 I have spoken on big on bigger stages, but I never had any 537 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,360 training. And so I think the piece that's missing for me is 538 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,960 how to tell a story properly, and that I know is is so 539 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:03,240 important in speaking on stage. So 540 00:36:03,300 --> 00:36:06,060 David Saxby: story is a big part of it. And actually, you know, 541 00:36:06,060 --> 00:36:08,820 flipping back to the whole aspect of marketing and 542 00:36:08,820 --> 00:36:13,620 advertising is used to be, if you had a catchy slogan and a 543 00:36:13,620 --> 00:36:16,620 brand, you could get traction in the market. People buy your 544 00:36:16,620 --> 00:36:20,220 product or service. But now it's more about telling the brand 545 00:36:20,220 --> 00:36:25,340 story. Yeah, you know Simon cynics, yeah. Why? Why? He's all 546 00:36:25,340 --> 00:36:29,060 about why are you in business? Why are you doing what you do? 547 00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:33,320 Yeah, why do you sell what you sell? And it's telling the story 548 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,700 of how that came about, or why your business does what it does. 549 00:36:37,820 --> 00:36:39,200 Mm, hmm, yeah, 550 00:36:39,620 --> 00:36:42,160 Janice Porter: yeah. Times have changed, but we also have a lot 551 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,040 more competition. There's a lot more information thrown at us 552 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,760 daily as well, and all this stuff. So we have to, we have to 553 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:54,760 be, I think, stand out from the crowd, being sincere and being 554 00:36:56,980 --> 00:37:01,620 caring. I really think that that, that, to me, is the major 555 00:37:01,620 --> 00:37:04,260 difference. I had it. I'm not going to go into it. I'll tell 556 00:37:04,260 --> 00:37:10,740 you another time, but I customer service, for me is so vital, and 557 00:37:10,740 --> 00:37:14,820 when I come across customer service that isn't they don't 558 00:37:14,820 --> 00:37:19,620 care, it drives me insane. We just had a 10 day vacation. We 559 00:37:19,620 --> 00:37:23,600 stayed at this really cool boutique hotel in North 560 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:28,160 Hollywood. And yes, it's a really cool hotel. And every 561 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:32,900 person that I came across there that worked at that hotel was so 562 00:37:32,900 --> 00:37:35,660 good they'd step out of the way if you were going to the 563 00:37:35,660 --> 00:37:38,660 elevator. They wouldn't get on with their big carts with you. 564 00:37:38,660 --> 00:37:41,860 They'd always wait. They'd say, how are you? They'd be it was 565 00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:45,460 all every single person was. Was that's what you want. You want 566 00:37:45,460 --> 00:37:49,300 that feeling absolutely that you're being cared for. Anyway, 567 00:37:49,300 --> 00:37:53,380 we talk for hours, and I have to wrap this up, because time is of 568 00:37:53,380 --> 00:37:59,080 the essence. Here, fabulous to speak to you today. You have a 569 00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:04,080 free ebook. I understand that people can access, and I need to 570 00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:06,720 make sure I have the link so I can put it in the show notes. 571 00:38:06,720 --> 00:38:08,520 You want to tell us about it? 572 00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,740 David Saxby: Sure? Yeah. The the ebook is really an overview of 573 00:38:13,740 --> 00:38:17,580 the things that I do marketing wise. It's called spark 574 00:38:17,580 --> 00:38:22,820 innovative marketing, yeah, and so it's it basically 575 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:27,020 encapsulates a lot of the things that need to be done in the 576 00:38:27,020 --> 00:38:30,560 process of of developing marketing strategy and then 577 00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:36,320 carrying it through. And I think the big thing, if I was to leave 578 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:40,540 people with anything, is that marketing is a process. It's not 579 00:38:40,540 --> 00:38:45,400 an event. Most people think, Oh, I did, did something. It's done 580 00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:52,180 like in Yeah, early on. So it is a process. And in that book, I 581 00:38:52,180 --> 00:38:56,260 talk about some of the different ways that you know you can be 582 00:38:56,260 --> 00:38:59,560 effective at marketing and advertising and all of the 583 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:02,940 different aspects of marketing. And I think the second thing, in 584 00:39:02,940 --> 00:39:06,960 conjunction with that is that marketing and sales need to work 585 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,440 together. I don't know how many businesses I go into, the 586 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:13,320 marketing departments one end of the hallway, the sales 587 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,540 departments at the other, and they pass each other in the 588 00:39:15,540 --> 00:39:17,100 hallway and don't even talk to each other, 589 00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:19,260 Janice Porter: and some people who think they're both the same. 590 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,220 So have another conversation about that. Another day. I'll 591 00:39:22,220 --> 00:39:25,700 bring you back, because I think that's very important. Yeah, 592 00:39:25,700 --> 00:39:26,480 yeah, they 593 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,520 David Saxby: cross over the words marketing and sales and 594 00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:32,720 branding and throw them all into a mix and understand any of 595 00:39:32,720 --> 00:39:32,960 them. 596 00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:38,360 Janice Porter: Yeah, exactly so. And you definitely have the 597 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:42,700 background, have the experience, have the wisdom to help people 598 00:39:42,700 --> 00:39:45,280 who are in business today. I know that from talking to you, I 599 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:50,740 know that from looking at your work, and I also feel the the 600 00:39:52,420 --> 00:39:55,660 caring that you have for what you do, the passion for what you 601 00:39:55,660 --> 00:39:58,840 what you do, and and I'm sure you've helped a lot of people 602 00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:02,700 along the way. So. That that will speak to that. 603 00:40:04,620 --> 00:40:08,640 David Saxby: I'm hoping so, yeah, I've, I've made some plans 604 00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:10,200 fairly rich. Let's put it that way. 605 00:40:11,700 --> 00:40:14,460 Janice Porter: Yeah, okay, so they can find you at Spark 606 00:40:14,460 --> 00:40:20,840 communications.com, on LinkedIn, on Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, 607 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,500 and your email, if I may, put in the show notes as well, if 608 00:40:24,500 --> 00:40:30,380 people are for sure, yeah, okay. And your free ebook is on your 609 00:40:30,380 --> 00:40:32,240 website, on a specific yes 610 00:40:32,240 --> 00:40:35,360 David Saxby: it is, yeah. And I think I sent you the link as 611 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:36,200 well in your 612 00:40:36,260 --> 00:40:38,180 Janice Porter: well, I'll double check with you after for sure. 613 00:40:38,180 --> 00:40:41,260 Yeah. Well, thank you, David. Thank you for being here, thank 614 00:40:41,260 --> 00:40:45,700 you for sharing and thank you to my audience again for being 615 00:40:45,700 --> 00:40:48,820 here. Remember to stay connected and be remembered. 616 00:40:50,740 --> 00:40:52,420 David Saxby: Thanks. Jess, you're welcome.