Okay the kids having a temper tantrum, and if

a parent or caregiver meets it in a way where it's like, don't

have the temper tantrum, like, Get over yourself, like, you

know, distract or shaming, or whatever it is that's imprinting

in their system. It's not okay to have feelings. It's not okay

to be an expression of my lack of needs that are being met, and

it's either entangling shame into it or again, like, oh, the

distraction just makes me never actually move through what I'm

experiencing and recognizing I'm okay. And that's the difference

in between nervous system regulation versus dysregulation.

If we're constantly taught from an early age to feel a certain

way, to be a certain way, to be shamed when we are feeling that

instantly is teaching us to become dysregulated in how we

experience ourselves or how we're ultimately being human.

Hello, beautiful. I am so excited for you to hear

this incredibly just healing episode you will be transformed.

Nicole Laos is just absolutely a hugely brilliant Somatic

Experiencing practitioner. She's trained in Feldenkrais in

internal family systems. Nicole bridges, science, spirituality

and lived experience, and she is so in alignment on the path. She

even does a little session with me in this episode, she's just

so walking the talk, helping women humans, but all humans who

are stuck in their survival patterns, really get to know

their survival patterns and get to understand the nuances of

where our patterns come from and the deeper traumas they're

trying to protect in such a beautiful, compassionate,

honoring way, like she helps you have so much compassion for

these parts of yourself, and shows you how to start Living

more from your wholeness. And her work is incredibly embodied.

It's incredibly powerful. She's so brilliant and such a love and

such a magical like, like Earth fairy earth being. She's so, so

grounded, so heart centered, and just Yeah, has a lot of wisdom

to share. And this episode is, it's a workshop, it really and

she does take me through a process. So get out your

notebook. Get out your journal. Um, enjoy the episode. Spread

all the word or spread the word to all your all your friends.

Share this episode with anyone you know who you think could

benefit and enjoy.

Hello. Beautiful. Welcome to the new truth podcast. Hi Nicole, Hi

Kate.

I'm so I'm so excited to do this. Have this

chat with you, and I first have to share the hilarious moment

that just happened where I said, Do you want to ground? So just

for some context, every every episode Catherine and I have

done over the last, obviously, Catherine's not here anymore,

but over the last four and a half years, almost five years,

we always ground before every episode. And when we have guests

on, we ground, we do this little it's actually psychosomatic, and

it's a three part thing to to get, you know, present and

connected to our bodies and connected to each other. And I

said to Nicole, do you want to ground before we recorded? And

she goes, You know me, I don't need grounding. I got five, I

got five planets in Taurus. And I'm like, oh yeah. And I have

three so I think we're grounded enough. Let's go. We don't need

more grounding. We need more fire. So let's light the fire.

And I love it. It's funny too, because I, you

know, I often don't do much grounding, and even in my

programs, when I'm working with my clients, it's not something I

guide people into because, not just because, you know, it's

easy for me to be in that space, but also because what I teach is

more how can we be with our experience, instead of always

trying to change our experience? And I think people are really

caught up in resourcing themselves. And, you know,

having these strategies, these grounding practices, and all

these things, the list of toolboxes, which, of course, is

important. I'm not saying it's not important, but I really want

to invite people to recognize the difference of like, I'm I'm

doing something to change my experience, versus how do I

pause and actually just acknowledge what it is I'm

experiencing

totally because it's, it's like, that's what

people have done to us our whole lives. Is like, change how your

feet, like a little kid's having a temper tantrum. And it's like,

there people are just trying to change the experience to, like,

be happy. Look you got ice cream. Like, look over here.

And. Can drag you from feeling, yeah, instead of

actually just being with, you know,

totally like, what you're when the sunset is there,

you're just, like, with it. No matter what the sunset is,

you're with the sunset. Can you be with? I love that. And, and,

yeah, I just, I think there's a lot of a lot of things in

healing that then get taken like, it will really, like, the

ego gets a hold of it, and then it becomes this thing that we

use against ourselves or that we're in instead of actually

something to support you.

Yeah, we can even use that kid with the ice cream

as an example, right? It's like, okay, the kid's having a temper

tantrum. And if a parent or caregiver meets it in a way

where it's like, don't have the temper tantrum, like, Get over

yourself, like, you know, distract or shaming, or whatever

it is that's imprinting in their system. It's not okay to have

feelings. It's not okay to be an expression of my lack of needs

that are being met, and it's either entangling shame into it

or again, like, oh, the distraction just makes me never

actually move through what I'm experiencing and recognizing I'm

okay. And that's the difference in between nervous system

regulation versus dysregulation. If we're constantly taught from

an early age to feel a certain way, to be a certain way, to be

shamed when we are feeling that instantly is teaching us to

become dysregulated in how we experience ourselves, or how

we're ultimately being human, versus if the kid with an ice

cream is having a tantrum, and we meet them in that like, Hey,

I see you're upset. And of course, easier said than done

when we're in our own dysregulation. But I'm just

going to hold this, yeah, example. But you know, if we

hold that space of like I see you're upset, I acknowledge what

you're experiencing, if we can hold our own sense of space and

our own sense of presence with what is for this little kid, we

are holding a coherent field, a field of safety and connection.

We are in our own regulation, and we're inviting them to move

through whatever they're experiencing back into

realizing, like, yeah, actually, this is what I'm missing. This

is why I'm upset. Of course, depending on the age. They can't

necessarily vocalize what they actually need in that moment,

but you're at least holding this resonant field for them to

attune, to to realize that it's safe. They can have their

experience. They can move through their experience. And

we're there for them. That's very different, and that's what

actually teaches them to through our CO regulation, they are

learning how to self regulate themselves. And this is, you

know, it actually makes me quite frustrated how these words, like

regulating the nervous system are being thrown around, because

I think we're missing a little education around that, because

people think like, oh, to regulate my nervous system, I

just need to settle and what actually needs to happen is we

actually need to create space for what it is we're

experiencing, to move through it and realize we're okay. And

again, depending on our upbringing, our developmental

trauma, there's lots that can impact our ability to do that.

But regulating your nervous system isn't just about calming

yourself down a regulating, ready? Regulating your nervous

system is moving through what you're experiencing and realize

you're okay. You belong. You know, we're here for you,

yeah, and even the example you just gave that that

that like that little kids naturally knows how to do that,

right? Because that's what they're doing totally and we we

only don't know how to do that because when we were little, we,

like all those examples you gave, we were shut down from our

feeling, our feelings fully, and actually, from and having

someone be able to just hold the space and witness it and be with

it and allow it to be okay. So that's

holding a presence, right? Exactly. We're

in our own dysregulation and in our own chaos, then there's

nothing to attune to. But when we can hold that presence and

that, yes, I got you, I see you, it's such a different

experience.

And that's what you know, I think of all the parents

who have a hard time doing that and sending love to all the

moms. I was looked after my niece without my brother for

well, my parents were there, but, but I was the primary

caregiver for five days. And she's a manifesting she's a

manifesting generator. And a three year old, oh my, she has

almost all her centers defined, and she has a Leo in the inside.

She's like a Leo. Oh my, and a Leo rising Leo moon. I looked up

her chart, and I'm like, Oh, I get you girl. Like, at the end

of the week, it was such a special experience. But, man, I

just want to shout out to all the moms out there, like, whoa.

You. What you're doing is like, next level. It is next level

human. Because, I mean, how many moms? It's pretty rare that. Mom

goes into parenting with a really regulated or with a

regulated system, with the awareness, with the ability to

actually be with her own feelings, because that's what

the mom needs to is, right? If you're holding the space for

your kids, you also need to hold the space for yourself, and

that's how you come in. What's the word you used? Co? Was it co

regulation?

CO regulation? To co regulate? Yeah, we have to be

in have regular, a regulated nervous system. So let's define

regulated a regulated nervous system, because that can be

helpful to have a regulated nervous system means that you

have the ability to be flexible, you have stability, but you also

have flexibility to navigate whatever changes are happening

within your environment. So it doesn't mean that you're always

just calm and settled. And it's about being fluid, being

flexible, being able to adapt relative to the present moment.

So another way we can speak to it is the window of tolerance,

or your window of capacity. How much capacity do you have to

navigate the given moment? Do you move into dysregulation

pretty quickly? Then your window is pretty small. You're not

alone. Most of the world has a pretty damn small window, or

they live in the faux window

where, well, the ones that live in America, we're

more we're more chill over here. Yeah. Good point. Good point.

Um, yeah. Right. So the more capacity we have,

the bigger, bigger window we have, the bigger sign of nervous

system regulation that that's what that indicates, yeah.

So you keep saying Calm down, and it makes me every

time you say it, I'm like, the reason so we do it to ourselves

now, like, I just need to calm down and do meditation. But

like, well, how many times as a kid did you get here, hit, did

you hear the term, the term phrase, calm down, calm down,

just calm down, just calm down, just calm down. Just got and

then, like, our

spouses say neither of us have spouses, but people spouses say

it, you know, because

why we don't have spouses? Because if someone told

us to calm down exactly, you

know, I have five Taurus planets. Get out of my

way. Don't tell me what to do. But, but calm down. You hear it

everywhere, right? And then, and then everything is about, like,

oh, you feel bad. Just like, breathe deeper. Calm down. Like,

do it. Like, I used to do that to myself, where I'd be in bed,

spinning my wheels with anxiety, and I try and do, like, a

hypnotherapy thing, and I would, like, get worse, yeah, and I

didn't understand it. And actually, the game changer tool

for me, that I that I teach a lot of women, or I do with women

at the immersion or share it with my clients, is, do you

know? Michaela Boehm, no nonlinear movement. Okay, it's a

I studied for a year, or not a year. I did her level one

training nonlinear movement. You would love it. It's I'll send

her, I'll send you her stuff after but nonlinear movement is

based on somatic experiencing, and you get on your hands and

knees. That's where you start. With your eyes closed, and you

put on non linear movement music which is non lyrical, like no

words, just music to to facilitate the journey. You

close your eyes and you just notice what you feel, and then

you move as that feeling. And then you and then you let your

body do the rest, and she does guided ones. But it's really,

really powerful, because it the feelings, of course, change, but

you're not doing it to change the feelings. You're doing it to

actually, and sometimes, like, I'll, I'll be feeling one

feeling, and then all of a sudden I'm screaming, and then

I'm crying, and then I or, like, sometimes I'm not, it's more

like joyful or pleasurable, but it's, it's like letting it work

itself out, rather than your mind trying to do it.

Yeah, it's more bottom up versus top down. So

top down has that that agenda, whether it's calm down or change

the experience, or, I'm sure we'll dive deeper into all the

ways we can top down, our way out of things, versus bottom up,

is learning to listen to what's happening on the inside or

what's happening in the experience, and how do we follow

that? So there's, there's, again, acknowledging what is and

letting it take shape, and however it wants to take shape,

is what you're describing. And I do want to name for some people

that can be really hard. So you know, for some people, they

might not at all like non linear movement or even being asked the

question like, What are you noticing on the inside? Are What

are you feeling? Yeah,

because listening is too scary, is too much. So

just acknowledging that, as well as if you grew up in a childhood

home, or through your childhood, grew up in a way where you

weren't supported to listen right? You weren't supported in

your yeses and nos and in your curiosities and finding your own

edges. Is of what's okay and not okay for you, if you were always

told how you had to be, what was okay not okay, you didn't get to

listen to yourself. You had the external world telling you what

you needed to be or and you probably still seek the external

validation and are needing the guidance, because you never got

taught or supported to guide yourself into your own

discovery, right? So I just want to name that, because I know a

lot of people have a hard time going inward or knowing how to

listen or being with and acknowledging what they're

experiencing. And it's like this, the starting point is just

acknowledge you don't know. And it makes sense that you don't

know because you grew up in a way where it wasn't you weren't

in an environment where it was supported. You had to ship shape

shift, or you had to be something that you were expected

to be, because your life depended on it.

Yes, yeah, absolutely. Thank you for that.

So what? So what would you suggest for people like that,

where it's they try, you know, different tools to actually feel

whatever's there but they can't access it. What? What do you

what would you suggest?

I'm a big fan of the practice of acknowledgement,

so pausing and noticing what we're experiencing and

acknowledging like this is what it is. So when someone asks me

to go inward, I feel nothing. Great. I'm acknowledging I feel

nothing. It's really hard for me to go inward. When someone asks

me what I want for dinner, and I don't know I can acknowledge

that, yeah, I have a hard time making decisions, but I also

don't know, because I've never had the opportunity to really

listen and discover what I want. Like, just the acknowledgement,

to me is one of the richest practices. Like, yeah, I need

external validation. Great. There's a reason why. Right?

Okay, perfect. Can I then, through that acknowledgement,

start to get curious on what happens when I inquire inward?

It's probably really scary, and that's why you're kept out of

your experience, because it's so unknown, unfamiliar, and in the

past, there would have been consequences if you were just

yourself, right? So it's starting to hold these different

layers that are at play, the trauma and the survival pattern.

The trauma being, you know, it wasn't okay to be yourself,

because something, anything could have happened, whether a

raised voice ignored abuse, you know, the list can go on shame

Exactly. So it's kind of like that's the trauma, and we can

speak a little bit more to what trauma actually is in a moment,

but it's like, there's the trauma, but then we have the

survival patterns we've developed as a result of our

trauma. Because we don't want to feel that pain, we don't want to

feel the shame, we don't want to feel the terror, whatever is at

the core of that, right? And those brilliant survival

patterns are like, Oh, I'm going to shape shift. I'm going to

people please. I'm going to stay small, I'm going to be overly

confident, you know, and be really good at all the sports

and and activities that I do, and we can have endless survival

patterns, and you have some great archetypes that you speak

to is in ways to categorize survival patterns, right? And

it's like, okay, there's a reason why we did that. We're

doing these survival patterns. We're existing in the world, and

these survival patterns to help us not feel our trauma,

something that was too much, or something that was missing, or

there's so many layers to again, what trauma is, yeah, then

there's, there's more. I'll just map out everything, yeah, yeah,

yeah. Go the way I like to see it,

right? I love how you I just want to acknowledge

you. I love how you articulate everything, you're just such a

it's so clear. It feels Yeah, it's amazing. Anyways, carry on.

So how I see the world or ourself and our

patterns is Yeah, at the core, we've got our trauma, then we

have these survival patterns that were needed. We had to

adapt, yeah. Do not feel the pain, the shame, the terror,

then we have how we feel towards our survival patterns, and this

is where I find we get so stuck, and this is how we get in our

way, right? So me, for example, I am still navigating layers of

being seen, and I am frustrated with it. I am over it. I just

want it to be different. It's like, what do I need to do to

fix this pattern of mine that's rooted in being seen right? And

this is where I really invite you all to notice, like in this

present day, how do you feel about these survival patterns

that have. Played a really important role in your life,

because that's a really huge nugget to pay attention to. So

if I take my being seen piece, for example, my fear of being

seen, you know, I can feel I can inquire into it. I feel myself

get smaller. I feel my eyes darting around a little bit more

and paying attention to what happens in my physiology,

because it's easy for me, but some of you might not

necessarily notice what's happening in your body and your

physiology, but you know what it feels like to be small, like,

you know what it feels like to be still, to hide, right? So

it's like, okay, yeah, you can relate to this pattern. That's

really important. It serves purpose, and then I've have my

frustration towards it, and I like to differentiate it as the

pattern is usually stuck in time. It's a fragmented piece of

me that's looping in this experience that's relative to my

trauma. And it's, you know, it's not the here and now version of

me, it's a fragmented piece of me. But then I have the present

me who is frustrated and annoyed and just wants it to be

different, and I'm signing up for all these courses. I'm not

because now I'm a bit stubborn with who I work with, but you're

a hermit, kind of a hermit, but you know, I'm looking for all

the answers. I'm I'm booking this session. I'm booking that

session. I just want to work with this piece, but I'm in

conflict with the survival pattern that's like, No, I have

to stay small. I can't be seen, or else I'm going to die. And I

know, because of the layers of work I've done with this piece,

it is intergenerational. It goes back generations, and it's

understandable that previous generations had to conform, had

to stay silent, couldn't be seen, because they'd be

outcasted, they'd be shunned, they'd be ostracized, they'd be

killed, right? So when I can hold the awareness of my

intergenerational thread here, it instantly gives me a bit more

space and understanding. And then I have a little more

compassion for the ways I need to stay small and I'm separate

from it now, and I see it as a fragmentation, whereas when I am

in the conflict or in the frustration, I'm just butting

heads with the thing that feels like it has to do that right?

I'm not going to get anywhere. If I'm continuously trying to

find the answer, if I'm continuously trying to fix this

part, if I'm continuously signing up for a million courses

and reading all the books and listening to all the podcasts,

it's like no what actually needs to happen is I have to see the

different layers that are at play, my trauma,

intergenerational past life, whatever the trauma, the

survival pattern that has been adapted to help me not feel

that, the shame, the pain, the terror, how I feel towards the

pattern, because it's also understandable. I have

frustration, but I can pan out, and I can hold it with more

grace. I can hold it with with and I I'm I want to be clear. I

can hold it because I can see the layers, and I understand the

trauma. For some people, it's like I can see the layers, but I

still have an agenda. I still want it to be different. And

that's it's really hard to find grace from that place, yes, so

it takes,

it's also really hard for the shift to occur from

that place, like the transformation to occur if

you're attached to the result,

yes, exactly. So the practice here is starting to

untangle and see the layers at play, because then we can pan

out and hold it from more of a sense of self, place of

wholeness, a place of coherence, where we get to be the empathic

witness for these layers that are at play, just like the kid

that you know is having a meltdown with his ice cream, a

temper tantrum, it's lacking the kids lacking the empathic

witness. So how do we become the empathic witness for our

fragmented pieces so we can have more grace and understanding for

all the different ways we show up in the world, and we start to

live more from this place of grace and compassion and ease,

instead of the chaos and constantly trying to fix. And

you know, I'm doing that again, giving yourself hard time. It

makes sense you do that, and can you pan out and acknowledge that

you're doing that?

Yeah, I love that. I love your language, the

empathic witness. I forgot that terminology I I took a year

program with Nicole. It was so incredible. And we were really

just being the empathic witnesses for ourselves and each

other. It was such an incredible container. And I love that, even

even the whole map in the picture, because it it for

everyone listening who's just stuck in the pattern side, and

in the trauma and in the the judge, and then the feelings

about the thing, and just. Stuck. It's like a foop fucking

loop where you just, like, stuck. I didn't invent it, but I

love it too. Fucking loop, foop. I always say foop. And people

like, what's a foop? But you're like, stuck in that foop and,

and isn't it nice? Because even just by us having this

conversation. It's a moment of panning out and realizing, Oh,

there's another part of you and that that's there. I call it

your hair when you call it The Empathic witness, like that part

has always been there and it never left, and it's just

waiting for you exactly,

yeah. So let's, let's even map one out. Let's,

are you open to mapping one of yours out? Kate, and that way

other people can kind of practice mapping, mapping, yeah.

So what's one of your patterns that you're working with?

Oh, oh, gosh. What am I working with?

Or anything you're wanting to be different,

frustrated with? Maybe you're not

the big, I'd say the biggest thing I'm noticing,

or I'm experiencing right now is the all the stuff that keeps

coming up about going to Kenya, even though, and I keep saying

I'm moving to Kenya, I'm going for six months. I don't know how

long I'm staying. It's totally open. It's an experience. I

spent four and a half months there last year, but it's

actually happened every time I've gone where my mind is like,

what are you doing? So right now I've got my apartment, and my

mind is like, set like, you should need to stay here. Like,

this is so good. Grease has been so good for you. You've changed

so much. Like, as if, like, goodbye, Grace forever. I'm

never gonna see you again. Like it, yeah. And so that's, that's

the thing that I'm working with the most right now,

perfect, great. So we can call that a survival

pattern. There's a part of you that's trying to hold on to, I'm

hearing security, familiarity, maybe, right? So there, it's

really set on, like, keeping you there. It wants to have you. You

know? Why would you change? Things are good here. You're

part of the community. Everyone loves you, and you love them

back. There's just such a beautiful exchange there. And

this kind of, also sense of, potentially it ending like this,

is it with you leaving right? There's some sort of experience

within that. So we'll call that your survival pattern and and

I'll invite those listening like the way I like to map it out is

with circles. So if you're listening, you could even just

draw on a piece of paper a little circle at the core, which

represents the trauma. We don't know what Kate's is yet, and

then we have the circle around it, which is the survival

pattern. So in Kate's situation here that we're talking about,

if there's some sort of part that wants to hold on to

security, the familiar, so a part that a survival pattern

that loves the familiar and security

and my soul does not so

experiences there

unscripted woman does not

get me out of here. Yes, kind of fun that you

have this part. I don't know if I've ever seen this part of you.

Yeah. So for me, just for those you know that might not relate

to Kate's, maybe you relate to staying small or a fear of being

seen. Well, the fear is being seen, but the survival pattern

would be staying small, hiding. You can put any survival pattern

there, right? Or a survival strategy, whatever words you

want to use. So then draw a third circle. So first is a

trauma. Second is the survival pattern. The third circle is how

you feel towards your pattern. So, Kate, how do you feel

towards we've already heard about, the soul piece. Soul

piece is like, No way, let me be free. So that's how you feel.

One part of you feels that way,

how I feel towards it. I mean, I'm more surprised

than anything, I think, because, because the other part of me is

so, so solid and clear that every time I follow my heart and

my body, and it's a yes that like there's so much growth and

magic on the other side of that and like that. So I'm so solid

in that. So I think I feel more than anything. I don't feel

judgmental towards it, and I navigated. I not I don't listen

to it. I work, I work. I have lots of practices that I work

with it and let it out and let it speak and but it's more just

surprising, and it's like, you know, it's, it's sort of like

it's been for a few months, but it's kind of maybe once a week

where I'll wake up in the night and be like, What if you get

murdered? What if you like, would it like you or like you

can't just walk down the street like it's just like all you

know, what if irrational? Yeah, yeah,

yeah, yeah. Would you say that you have certain

practices that try to change it in any way, like settle it down

south? Soothe it, anything like that,

I'd say maybe in the middle of the night. Yeah? I

do. I do, like, talk to it like it's a child and like, just love

it and soothe it in the middle of the night, just because that

helps me. Not, I don't want to, like, amplify it, but then

usually in the day, I'll just, like, go, let it go. And I

usually through writing or movement, just let my, let

myself, like, fully go into the feeling.

Yeah, great, perfect. So you know, for those

listening, you might have more experiences towards your

patterns that are more about agenda based. Like I it's

amazing what can have an agenda like, even the compassion. I

mean, in the middle of the night, it's understandable,

because you want to get back to sleep. But compassion can be a

tricky one, because I can have compassion for these patterns I

have, but I still have this flavor of wanting it to be

different,

calming it down. Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, so

do

to really notice the ways that you feel towards

your patterns that have some sort of agenda, want it to be

different or trying to fix it, you know, like, yeah, kind of

like being sneaky with it even. I mean, this is my own way of

practicing. It's not that it's right or wrong, but even

parenting parts, I find we've got an agenda there, you know,

like, Yeah, and again, there's lots of incredible modalities

that parent parts that definitely have massive impact.

So I'm not saying that it's a right or a wrong there. That's

more agenda based, versus really getting to know why that part

exists,

unless you're the parent that you described at the

beginning of the episode that just sits with

Yeah. Well, the agenda is presence, I guess,

yeah, yeah, yeah. It's really holding space for what is which?

Yeah, empathic witness and, yeah,

I can think of the old pattern that I can think of

that was the strongest that I dealt with for so many years

that I know a lot of women deal with, is was jealousy. I had it

in my, like, 20s and early 30s, so severely. Like, I mean, it

was really intense and, and I remember, like, spending 1000s

of dollars going to like, workshop after workshop after

coach after healer, after hypnotherapist after like, can I

delete this part of my brain? Like it was just like I had so

much shame and so much and I was so hard on myself about it, and

I tried so hard to get rid of it, or to fix it, or to to set

my actually might be an even better example, because it was

like it was I, I judged it, I shamed it, I I just felt so many

her I was embarrassed of it. I wanted to hide it, but it like

when it was when jealousy would rear her head. I was like,

literally nothing could stop. Like one time I kicked a door

and was like, yeah. Another story like

the jealousy pieces, yeah. I'm sure we can

all Yeah. So again, if people can relate to that, map it out,

right? The jealousy is some sort of survival pattern, and then

you have how you feel towards it, the embarrassment, the

shame, the wanting it to be different, trying all the

things, throwing all the money and trying to fix it, right?

Yeah. So, so far, we've got three circles, the trauma, the

survival pattern, and how we feel towards it, and, and again,

what we're doing here is we're pausing and noticing the layers

that are at play and, and this is where, you know, yes, I'm a

somatic experiencing practitioner, and I'm, my

background is in Feldenkrais and yoga, and I'm very body based,

but I find we can actually step away from, like, what are you

noticing in that, or what are you experiencing in that, and

instead, just like, have some fun with it and see these

different layers that are at play. We don't have to always go

into the depths of it. If I'm working towards healing the

trauma, then, yeah, we have to go a little more inward to ride

the waves of whatever we're trying to avoid feeling or

protecting ourselves from feeling, but to also, like, have

fun and map out our experiences and understand ourselves a

little bit more, right? And that's where the fourth circle

comes into play. The circle around the other three is when

we can pan out and hold awareness of the judgments, the

frustrations, the even the curiosities, but still wanting

to fix it or the compassion, but have an agenda to make our

patterns be different, these patterns that have been there

for a really long time, that are ultimately just a fragmented

part of us as a result of some trauma. So from that panned out

circle, that's where we can we're going to come back to this

in a sec, but that's where we can have more space and grace

around our experience. For those of you that have a hard time

recognizing that you're already whole, and you have these

fragmented pieces being able to pan out outside of the judgment,

the frustrations, the trying to fix. It's really hard, and we're

going to go inward first to see if that can help you understand

more of what it feels like to be whole, because it is felt.

Experience. It's very much like, Oh, there I am in that. And if,

if by the end of this podcast, you experience that awesome, but

if you don't, and you just like, well, I know I'm whole, I kind

of congrats the concept, but I don't have a felt experience of

it. No, you're not alone. But what I would invite you to

really

notice, I do want to sing Michael Jackson right

now. What is it really bad you are not alone.

So I just channeled MJ. I love it. Love it. My voice is a

little under the weather, so it didn't sound as good as him.

You need your offer lessons again. Okay, carry

on. Sorry for interrupting. So let's so to at least hold

awareness of the layers can be helpful, because we start to see

more of what's at play, right? So let's go inward again with

your little piece, Kate, we can, we can pendulate in between the

jealousy, or shift in between the jealousy and this other

piece. But let's, let's see what this part of you that wants

stability, wants familiar, what it's afraid will happen if it's

so there Kate just made a barfing and barfing earlier, so

that barfing is how you feel towards it. Oh,

isn't that interesting?

Cool, right? There something that is annoying

part of me that loves the freedom and loves the

unscriptedness and loves the not knowing what's coming and where

I'm going, in

conflict judges this piece and like is making fun of it. Yeah,

interesting,

right? They're definitely in conflict with each

other, yeah. So let's see if we can find out what that part of

you that wants stability is afraid will happen if you don't

have stability. So see, and this is what I do in my sessions and

guide people through in my programs. So it's we're just

going quick. This, the answers don't necessarily come right

away, for those of you listening and inquiring, but ultimately,

what we're doing is we're looking at the survival pattern,

and we're trying to understand what what its job is, what its

purpose is, what it's afraid will happen if it's not there.

So first, do you want me to share? What just came

up? What just came up actually is, is the fear, and I don't

know if it's connected to stability, but when you ask the

question, what came what I I could feel was this fear of

fear, because I love Kenya so much, the fear of like, not like

it, not not loving it. There's something the fear of it

changing my view of Kenya, or something like that.

So it's like, the fear of the unknown, really,

yeah, the fear of the unknown. And if I go there

and I don't like it, like, what if it changes how I feel about

it?

Yeah, yeah. So there's something that wants to

hold on to, the stability and the familiarity, yeah, fear of

the unknown, being not what you expected or

what you want to be, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So for those of you listening, if you look at

your survival pattern, sometimes an answer will come quickly,

like Cates does, and it doesn't need to always make sense, but

you're starting to get inside information, inside information

about insider information, insider on why that part exists,

right? So. So when we're asking these questions from a place of

an agenda, wanting it to be different, trying to fix it, we

are less likely to get the information just naming that.

But sometimes something will come through and it's like, oh,

now I have a different understanding of it, and it's

easier for me to pan out and understand like, of course, that

pattern exists because it's afraid of the unknown, afraid of

my expectations not being what I expected, and for me to

potentially, I'm making an assumption here, we can dig a

little deeper, but for there to be disappointment, or for there

to be grief of losing something, or, you know, my guess is

there's some more layers there. So even as I'm naming that Kate,

see if you can again, we're acknowledging this part that

wants stability, wants familiarity, in fear of not the

unknown and not getting what you expect. And is there anything

else coming through around what might happen if that happens?

Yeah, I guess the only thing is okay, then what do

I come back here? It's just like, and yeah, the unknown, and

then that doesn't happen. And I think also that a lot of it with

Africa is primal, like, it's like, actual Primal Fear and

like, also the collective stories, like, when I'm there,

I'm not afraid at all, like, I feel so safe and I and I, it's a

very different experience. But when I'm not there, this is when

the fear it never it doesn't come. When I'm there, it comes

up when I'm not there.

Can you feel there's something that it's

coming through for me that I'm curious about? Can you feel

anything about when something doesn't work out? Like, when

something doesn't work out, what shows up?

Oh, like, what's meant to work out works out.

Like it it gets better. It just, I might get redirected. But is

that your mind saying that, or that part saying, I mean,

that's, I feel that higher tell, but it feels like it just coming

like from the ground up, whatever you said, bottom,

bottom up, yeah.

Okay, so, yeah, it just feels like that,

yeah, yeah. So there's a knowing, it'll just

work out. There's no trust. Yeah, my guess is that's more

from higher self, from this more expanded space. Yeah, I want to

do a little more digging into the stability piece. Okay, okay,

so notice that part of me that is hesitant and wants to stay

and is kind of holding on to the familiar. Does it know that

experience, the trust in the flow and the unknown and the

that part? Yeah, no, no, yeah, exactly, yeah. So that's

important to differentiate, right? Yes, yeah, no, right. It

it's still stuck in this experience where, where the fear

exists of the unknown? Yes, okay, so see if you can. And I'm

trying not to do a full session here, because then we could do

more parts work, and we can really start to explore more,

but see if you can see that as a fragmented piece that's kind of

looping in some sort of fear, yeah, fear of the unknown, fear

of things not working out as expected. But I'm wondering if

there's anything else in this moment that wants to come

through, and I'm just doing this as a demonstration of like you

can see the difference, right? This fragmented piece is still

continuously going to be in conflict with you until we see

it in whatever the core piece,

yes, yeah, whatever I think it's the other one.

Yeah, yeah.

So you think, which makes me think that you're

saying it versus the part saying it, Okay, interesting. Can you

see the difference? Yeah, right. It's like we're trying to figure

it out and what we're working towards. And again, this isn't

easy, and if we were doing a session, I would drop in more,

but I also want to use it as an education to help people

differentiate, like the traumas in this part that's stuck in

time, that's fragmented, that fears the unknown, that that has

a story to share. And my guess is, honestly, that this feels

ancestral, like it's bigger than you. Yeah, yeah. So we can kind

of hold this piece for now with awareness that there's something

deeper to heal and transform, so that this fragmented piece no

longer lives and exists in this story that it believes, right?

Yeah, so we can do a session around that, and this is what I

work with with in my programs too is like really starting to

understand the trauma for today. What I want to invite people

into is to really see these different layers, the fragmented

piece that no matter what you try, it's not going to change

until you listen and support it bottom up to take shape and find

its way through whatever its fears are. And this is my

intuitive guess is, the more we pay attention to this piece of

yours, it feels like it's linked to something not working out.

And like, devastation, yeah, destruction because something

didn't work out. Yes. It's like, how do we let it tell the story

so that it can move through whatever it's looping in, right?

And we're doing that by by inquiring from this spacious

Space Place, instead of trying to figure it out, trying to

solve it, trying to Yeah,

so someone's, if someone's following this, or for

everyone following this, right now, and they were trying to let

that part tell the story. How would you what? What would you

suggest, like, that writing, or like, just Yeah, out loud, or

mirror work, or what? How would you suggest they

Yeah, there's a number of different ways. So

first, obviously, sessions with you,

we'll get to that.

The first piece would always be continue to

check in with the parts of you that are trying to fix these

survival patterns, right? Because as soon as that flavor

is there, you're getting in your own way, which is totally

understandable. It takes a lot of practice to start to identify

these flavors.

Is the title of this episode.

This is how you get you're continuously getting

it, believe me, I do it all the time, but we need to catch

ourselves in it, yeah, acknowledge like, of course I'm

trying to find the answer. Of course I'm frustrated, and of

course I want this to be different. It's understandable,

and that pattern exists for a reason. And so let's shift to

jealousy. The jealousy exists for a reason, right? You can

even hear, as I'm acknowledging these two different reason

layers, there's already a softening, like, yeah, it makes

sense that there's frustration. You're over it, and it makes

sense the jealousy exists, yeah, now when you're exploring the

jealousy is the survival pattern and then the traumas at the

core. And you might not necessarily know what's there.

So you can first start by with these circles, even seeing them

as two different things, how you feel towards the pattern and

your survival pattern. Don't even need to know about the

trauma yet. And it's like, okay, these are different characters.

If I were to act out the because I know you love, you know,

acting out and and performing my how I feel towards it, it feels

this way. This is what I experienced when I'm like that

and when I just want it to be different. I'm so frustrated,

I'm so annoyed. And then when I'm the jealous piece, it feels

like this. And you know, it takes on this personality and

this character, and it feels like this in my body, or this is

what it looks like, right? So that you can start

differentiating these two as different things, then you can

start to explore the jealousy piece, like if you were either

observing the jealousy piece, or you are the jealousy piece. What

are you afraid? One of my favorite questions is, comes

from ifs internal family systems. One of my favorite

questions I ask is like, what is the jealousy afraid will happen

if it's not there? And a quick answer comes, I'll be alone,

abandonment, right? Maybe that's your answer. Maybe something

else

comes out. When I was jealous, like, I think

someone asked me that, and it was that my boyfriend will

cheat, like the jealousy was like keeping him from cheating,

which, I mean, it ruined our sex life in our relationship, but we

it was when I was in my 20s and I had a five year relationship,

but there, but I, someone asked me that one of my someone, I

think this guy did persona therapy with and I and this, the

fear was that he would cheat on me if I wasn't jealous, right?

So that's, I love, that you're naming that, because

that's like the first bit of information you get. And then

ultimately, we're kind of doing some digging to see what's the

core wound here, right? So it's like he's gonna cheat on me.

Well, what are you afraid will happen if he cheats on me? No,

there's layers here, until we reach the point of the trauma

and and to me, the trauma exists usually as well. Shames a whole

other story, because shames this intergenerational, passed down

thing. Can talk about that in a sec, but usually there's some

sort of terror involved there, right? The abandonment, it's

like complete terror, aloneness, shock, confusion, not knowing

what's going on. Usually, whatever's at the core of it, we

can map on what I what's called the threat response cycle, where

we're stuck in this moment where there was a perceived threat,

and we from then on, perceive that that threat is still

happening, and we can get stuck. I'll just keep it really simple

for now. But in the threat response cycle, we can be stuck

in the startle. We can be stuck in the shock. We can be stuck in

the preparatory state, where we're like on alert, like, wait,

what? What's happening? What, what's there's a change, and I

can't grasp what's happening in the change. And we can be stuck

in the defensiveness, which is usually the incomplete fight or

flee response, where I'm either stuck always in in fight mode,

or I'm stuck in always escaping, fleeing, difficult, challenging

situations. I can be stuck in the collapse. I can be stuck in

a rigid freeze where I'm holding all this tone all the time and

can't feel a thing. I can be stuck, yeah, lots of different

places. So usually when we do some inquiring into what's at

the core of it. So this abandonment, there's more of a

physiological response that's entangled in it, and the story

of abandonment, in this case, that's entangled in it. So the

more we can see what's at the core of the fragmented piece,

the easier it is to understand why the jealousy exists. Of

course, the jealousy exists. I don't want to feel the pain of

of abandonment and the terror that comes with abandonment,

like, Hello. I'd way rather be jealous, because that gives me a

sense of false power and, you

know, torture every day.

So again, the more we understand the core, which,

you know, that's, that's where we do the deep work of healing

the trauma, the more we can also pan out and have more grace for

the many different ways we show up in the world. So by, yeah,

kind of getting to know the jealous part in this context and

acting it out, or. Writing it out, like, get let it take

character, let it show you. What is it there for? What is it

afraid will happen? What's its job? What's its duty? How long

has it been doing this? One of my favorite questions is like,

What year do you think it is? And a lot of times it's like,

1840 and it's like, yeah, exactly. We're working

intergenerational peace, and it's like, yeah, like past life

or past life exactly. And it's like lifetimes of having to have

lived in this because we're fragmented. Our soul has been

fragmented. Part of us is stuck, looping in this existence, and

our job is to hold that space, coherent space, this place of

grace, this place where we're the empathic witness, or the

what do you call it? Again here the heroine, the heroine, right?

We hold that to welcome that piece back home, to heal that

fragmented piece, to transform whatever it's stuck in, so that

it can be integrated back into the whole

I love I love it so beautiful, and I love how

nuanced it is. Like, it's just like subtle and nuanced, subtle

and

nuance. And we will say sometimes our patterns

for them is extremely entangled and messy, and we have a lot of

teasing it apart before we actually get to the trauma

right, where it's like, let's just practice seeing the circles

and panning out whenever we can be like, of course, I'm

frustrated right now. Of course, I'm, you know, signing up for

another course, because I just want the answer, you know,

except my course, you're welcome to sign up for my course.

But, I mean, obviously everyone needs that

first.

Wow, yeah, the more we can see those layers,

the more we can have grace for ourselves, instead of be in

conflict with ourselves all

the time. That's amazing. So, so if you were to,

if you were to name how we're getting in our own way,

to say, use anything with an agenda and

yeah, wants to be different is how we get in our own way. The

frustrations

during the checklist, let go. Him

proposing, well,

don't even burn it. Just acknowledge, oh, that

you want an agenda, right? Exactly, right. The practice of

acknowledgement is so valuable and so impactful. And then

again, we're just holding the layers. It's like It all exists

for a reason.

Yeah, it does. It's amazing. Wow. It's, I just,

yeah, I just love how you articulate everything. It's so

clear and so concrete, like, it just feels digestible. Thank

you. There's a lot of noise. There's a lot of noise out

there. Yeah, it's like, you're like, the brush of breath of

fresh air, like, at the top of the mountain, like, Thank you,

clear skies,

yeah, yeah, yeah. It's been cool in my own

journey, because, especially with us afraid of being seen

peace, right? It's, there's been a lot of hesitation to be on

social media and to, you know, play the marketing games and to

do this and to do that, and as a hermit, as you would call me,

the need to go inward and make sense of things myself is so

important before I'm teaching it, yes, and I'm definitely well

on the journey with you all as well. Like I continue to have my

own survival patterns and deep layers of trauma that I'm

ongoingly healing, and I'm happy to report that as I continue to

do my work, it becomes easier. It's not always easy, but it

becomes easier because I'm coming at it with more

coherence, more spaciousness, more ability to hold what is

instead of just like bouncing around from one pattern to the

other pattern, and just in conflict with myself trying to

make it all be different. It's like, oh, wait, I can exist in

grace, and I can exist within that spaciousness and hold off

for being human and and I want to also name that I'm not just

doing that for myself, but I'm doing that for everyone on this

planet. And that's the that's the other practice here is, how

can we pause and notice how we're experiencing other people?

Are we in conflict with their survival patterns? You know,

yes, most people are existing in their survival patterns, and

here we are having judgment towards them. You know,

projecting on them, and in that third circle, really, really

unable to see them as a whole human being that is fragmented

and showing up in the world in these ways, where they're just

trying to survive, they're just stuck, looping, perceiving the.

Looping to get them looping, looping, or looping, looping,

loop. I mean, you could call it looping. Even made

it better. It was born here on the new truth. There we

go. We're shipping a looping,

yeah, that allows you to practice compassionate,

more compassionately, and how much time I mean, it blows my

mind. It feels like it's amplified right now. And maybe

it's just because everyone's voices are amplified right now.

I realized, as I said, that that's probably why, because

everyone you know has always from their survival patterns in

the third circle, gossips complaint. Talked about other

people behind their back, but now they're doing it publicly on

Facebook and like, oh my god, some billionaire guy had an

affair at the Coldplay concert. Next thing you know, everybody's

posting about, like, Who gives a shit?

And why is it yours to post? Yeah, and this is

where it's like, we can have, we can have compassion for their

need to post, right? It's like, do I have judgment for their

need to post? Or can I have compassion but also be in the

disgust and be like, That's not okay, right? So I do want to

point out, when we're we can hold space for people's survival

patterns. It doesn't mean that we just are like, You do

whatever you want, like, walk all over me because it's your

survival pattern. It's like, I see you in that and here's my

boundary. That's not okay, yes, that's disgusting, that's

doesn't meet my values. What's important to me. And I don't

want to engage with this dynamic anymore, but it's coming from a

clear place, instead of a survival pattern, just, you

know, being cheeky or being a jerk towards their survival

patterns. And I want to name it's a practice like, what I'm

inviting into is an ongoing practice and way of life. It's

not easy, but it's we're catching these layers that are

at play. And, you know, my principles are pause and notice.

Like I'm constantly pausing and noticing. Am I in a survival

pattern? Am I in these qualities of how I feel towards my

survival patterns trying to fix having the agenda? How can I

continue to pause and notice my experiences? Can I connect back

into that sense of wholeness? So am I pausing and noticing? Do I

have awareness of what layers are at play. Can I bring

curiosity to them when I have the space to Can I recognize

that there's nothing to fix and I'm already whole, as is

everyone else, right? And like, how do I continue to integrate

that into my everyday life? This is an ongoing practice, yes,

yeah,

which is why you shared that you're on the path

too, and the greatest teachers are because the path never ends

and it's and the work only deepens at the more you the

deeper you go into your own journey, and the more expanded

you go exactly. I Oh, I had a question from the last thing

you're saying, and now, where is it? What was the last thing you

said?

Was talking about my principles, pausing and

noticing, awareness and curiosity. Nothing to fix

already.

Oh, yeah, yeah. What would be? What would you

say? Would be cues? Or how would someone know if they're in

their wholeness. Hmm, good question. Do you want

to answer first?

No, so you answer, okay, so I'll first pose it as a question, and

then I'll share my experience. So when I'm in the third circle,

I have more tension. I'm trying to fix. I'm having conflict. And

you know, want it to be different when I'm in the second

circle, in my survival pattern, I also have an experience,

depending on what the survival pattern is. Let's stay with my

usual one of staying small, right? I feel my shoulders go

down and my voice, oops, I'm even quieter with my voice,

right? I'm my I can't even find my words right now as I'm

entering that pattern. And if I pan out and acknowledge this

part of me that feels small or needs to still stay small, if I

acknowledge how I feel towards it, if I acknowledge why I need

to stay small, with the awareness of my ancestral line

and what happened in the past, I can breathe more. You can even

hear my voice. My voice is very different right now than when I

was in my survival pattern. I I feel an expansive state around

me. Time feels to me, seems to move slower. There's the sense

of grace and ease and love, and I feel very present in my in

this state of wholeness. I'm so I can feel the differences in

between all the layers. And for me, that's what I'm constantly

pausing and noticing, Oh, there I am in my hiding. Oh, there I

am in my judgment towards it. Oh, right, there.

Love it. You can literally, physically, I mean,

when you were moving back a little bit, this will be on

YouTube eventually, but the you can actually see yourself going

through the circles

totally, right? Like my body changes, and that's

where, you know, all these stories lie within your energy

field. They lie within your cells, you know? And that's what

I love about the intergenerational pieces is we

have the science has proven seven generations stories exist

within our cells, within our DNA. So you know, there's our

what we're doing here is we're rewriting the stories that lie

within ourselves way our nervous system has been programmed and

wired. We are rewriting that programming right, and we're

remembering that we are this coherence. We are this state of

flow. We are this place of flexibility, of regulation, of

stability, yet fluidity, right? Like we are, that we just tend

to exist within our fragmented pieces instead of remembering

that we are this.

I love that. Yeah. So clear. So if someone wants to

rewrite the program in their cells or whatever you said, I

can't remember the exact phrase, how do they work with you? How

do you how? What do you do?

I will, I'll say, I do have a podcast that I

stopped doing because I needed to take some time to go inward

and continue to evolve my own experiences. But there that's a

great resource. It's called the experiential podcast, so I

welcome you to check that out. We never got to do an episode,

which is mind blowing, but I was saving you for a certain topic,

and when I never got there. So one day, I'll start one day. So

that's a great resource. And then on my website, you'll also

find, we'll find a downloadable, free resource that goes great

with the podcast, which can help you map this out, just like we

did today. And then, program wise, I have a few offerings.

One is a study group. It's a low commitment offering where we

meet once a month for four months, and you have some

content to go through, and our conversations together as a

group allow deeper understanding of the content you're going

through, the self explorations you're doing. And then if you

want to book one on ones for me while you're doing the study

group, you can. And then I also, in the fall, run my bigger

program, which is discover. And I'm in the midst of trying to

decide if I want to do the usual four months or actually make it

a larger commitment, but stay tuned at discover is we meet on

a weekly basis. There's eight modules, there's tons of content

to support you in understanding more of these layers that are at

play, connecting you more with your internal and external

experiences, and just understanding more of the

complexity of what it means to be human and how to have again

grace in it all as well. So, yeah, the best thing to do is

book a call with me, and then we can chat about what's what's the

right fit, and we can go from there.

Amazing is your website, Nicole laos.com, it

sure is okay. So we'll link that below, and we'll also link the

link to book a call. Can we do that below the episode? Yeah,

and, and then all the freebie stuff you talked about, we'll

just link that all below the episode. And, yeah, amazing. So

beautiful. I mean, I've done lots of work with you over the

years, and I mean, it's life it's life changing, really,

because it's like, it's, it's getting intimate with your own

blueprint. And it's so beautiful, so and powerful.

Thanks. So highly recommend Nicole for those of you who are

ready to change your story and to sit with out of your own way,

sit with all your parts and get out of your own way, yeah, if

you're really ready to get out of your own way and book a call

with Nicole, and also you're just such a love just to meet

you and have a conversation with you. Are there any final words

you have for our new truthers?

Just invite you to also remember again hard if play

was never a part of your experience growing up, but how

can you find more play? How can you find more creativity? How

can you play with the edges that are uncomfortable? Role within

those realms of play and creativity to notice both the

discomfort and the fear as well as what's possible when you

start to tap into those dynamics. Because, yeah, so much

can happen when we allow those layers to come online, beautiful

and again, they're not online because of trauma. Understand

that, and then, yeah, you can map that out. But yeah, how do

we have more fun with this, all of this?

You know that? Yeah, that's good at that.

Goals, yeah, it's just like, why are we taking this so serious?

Come on. Like, exactly, yeah, yeah. Love it. Love you so much.

Thank you for sharing all your brilliance and wisdom and your

heart, yes, my pleasure, yeah. All right. And for those of you

listening, I think this is probably going to be an episode

you listen to many times, but definitely share it with all

your sisters out there who you know are operating from their

fragmented parts and beating themselves up for operating

their fragmented parts, who need to hear this message, and we'll

see you next week. You.