Is there manopause?

I think that men generally may not be aware of. That's what's happening.

I was like, wait a minute, I'm not old enough to be in midlife, am I? And then I was like, oh, do the math, bro. That was a great segue. And you didn't even do that on purpose. We'd like to introduce our product, Ascension Daily supplement by Ted Gibson. Beauty, wellness, science.

In order to get the great, you got to get rid of the good.

And then he got off the phone and he was like, could you go through three days to make that call? And then he started bawling.

Don't you cry.

I know it's making me teary, but that's. This is where we're at.

You know that old tale about brushing your hair 100 times before you go to bed, right? Is truthful.

Oh, Joan Rivers told us this story one time.

Joan love Joan, right?

I've only been to one Seder dinner in my life.

You went to Joan Sader dinner.

And we thought it would be like a big dinner. There was like eight people. I mean, she was hosting it with a staff of 15 people.

But still.

But still, as one does.

As one does, it could even be just a pair of shoes. It could be that top that you've had for the last 15 years that doesn't really serve you anymore.

Wait, are you talking about a guy that top?

Yeah.

Never a bottom, always a top.

Today's guests are not just beauty legends. They're visionaries, disruptors, and the kind of couple that makes you believe in reinvention at any age. Ted Gibson is the celebrity stylist behind some of the most iconic red carpet looks. From Angelina Jolie to Lupita Nyong'. O. Jason back is a colorist powerhouse with a Hollywood roster all his own. Together, they're industry trailblazers, married in life and in business. And now stepping into the wellness world with a bold new mushroom based line that's all about mind, body, beauty, beauty from the inside out. In this episode, we talk about the real secrets behind confidence, aging, hair, identity, starting over in midlife, and what it's really like to work, live and launch with your partner. If you've ever wondered how to age fabulously, feel your best, and still say fuck it to the rules, this is your episode. Follow the iconic midlife and share this one with someone who knows that beauty has no expiration dates. So welcome to the iconic midlife. Jason and Ted. I'm so excited to have you guys here.

Thank you very much.

We're so excited. You know, before we started rolling, we were talking about your guys love story of how you guys met. So give me a little scoop, like how did you guys meet each other?

Ted was my teacher in beauty school. Scandal.

Scandal.

Oh, my God. He was not for teacher. That's all I'm gonna say.

Hi, babe. Hello.

I was hot for a few teachers, but this one st.

There's something about a teacher right at the head of the class. You're like, so 31 years together, huh?

31 years together, guys.

Oh, my God.

31 years. Three cities, businesses in four states, hundreds of employees, 48 different products created so far.

Wow.

Business together for 26 years. Probably 25 years. Something like that.

See, that's really interesting to me because, like, how do you. What is the magic sauce? Because you guys work together, you live together, you've been married for this long. What is the magic sauce?

What's the magic sauce? Jason.

He lets me be me, and I let him be him. And we know that the things that. This is what I tell like my niece and nephews when they're dating. I'm like, the things that make you crazy and want to, like, punch the person in the throat when you're together for the first six months, never change. They're gonna bug you for the rest of your life. So you either can deal with those or you can't. And then that's when you should not be in the relationship.

Yeah.

Because those things don't change, right? Yes, they're morally. That's who that person is. And you know, I. After all this length of time, I still try not to make him me, because I can't imagine me being in a relationship with myself.

Cause, you know, things are like the two of you.

Right? See, I totally agree with that. And I feel the same way. If there were like two of me, like, if I had a carbon copy of like, myself in male form, that would be too much.

Way too much.

Way too much. You have to have the yin and the yang, Right?

And he's a visionary, okay. He's always got really big ideas. And I always say, like, if I never met Ted, I'd probably still be working at the same salon in Minneapolis. Very happy.

Okay?

I never thought that I would. I never thought I would leave. Like, my big move was from northern Minnesota to Minneapolis. That was like me escaping my small town, okay? Even though I love my small town, I don't want to live there. And then I never imagined that I would move to New York, let alone have A salon on Fifth Avenue in New York. I never thought that I would move to la, let alone open a business in la. And I never imagined that I'd be living in Palm Springs now. And I think a lot of that is, like, Ted is always thinking about what's next, what's gonna keep us moving forward, what's gonna, you know, inspire us. And through all of those things, we've really become sort of addicted to change. Like, we embrace change, we love change. It keeps everything fresh and new and exciting.

Yeah. It doesn't scare you, right? You're ready to take the next leap, at least from my point of view. When I look at you guys, I'm like, wow. They're like, constantly, you know, like, reinventing and coming up with new ideas.

Thank you.

So. So that part of it probably excites you guys, right?

It is exciting.

You know, we'd like to turn that rough diamond into, you know, that rough piece of rock, if you will, into something really beautiful. And we love her project.

And a makeover.

And a makeover. And I think that, you know, having us on the iconic midlife is really kind of profound at this moment because I'm a little past what they say midlife is.

I was like, wait a minute, I'm not old enough to be in midlife, am I? And then I was like, do the math, bro.

We never think we're there. Right?

I'm a little past the midlife situation. But at the same time, I think it's really important for us as entrepreneurs, as moms, as dads, to embrace the fact that things change and that when you get into your 50s, there's things that happen that you have to embrace, because if you don't embrace it, you'll go crazy.

I was just having a conversation with a client yesterday, which is a really interesting transition in and of itself. I've been a salon owner with Ted for the last 20 plus years. And when we moved to Palm Springs, I decided just to rent a chair instead of opening our own place. So I'm working in somebody else's business where I'm not the boss for the first time in a really long time. And it's a whole different learning curve. That's been really fun and exciting. But anyway, I was talking with this client about all these people that are like, oh, getting older sucks. Like, aging sucks. And I'm just not that person. Like, I'm really enjoying the way that my life has evolved and is changing. And there's so much to look forward to. There's Just so many things that are so fantastic to me about getting older that the things that are less fantastic. Like, you know, do I get results after a week at the gym? No, I have to go to the gym every day to try and maintain the results that I've had. You know, like, there's changes like that. Are certain things more sore? Do I have to wear my glasses more? Like, yeah, all that stuff. But that's just the part of it, you know, the rest of it is so fun and inspiring and exciting, and the people that I'm meeting are so interesting, you know, and when someone says.

Oh, those were the good old days, I'm like, those were good days, but I'm gonna have more good days.

The best is yet to come.

The best is yet to come. That is because I have so much experience.

Yes. That's the thing. Wait, let me ask you guys this. You guys did the reality show. What was that like? I mean, were you just.

It was so fun.

It was so much fun.

Was it fun?

It was so fun.

We had a great time.

Okay.

Didn't get a second season. It took forever to come to the.

US but it is airing on Tubi.

But you can see it streaming free on tv. Blowing la. But it was like. It was. And let me tell you, there's no better sense of false importance than being followed around by a camera crew. Yeah.

Put your beck and call.

Yeah, totally. We need you. We need you.

How does he. How do you keep the ego in check when you're, like, doing something like that?

Well, he had me.

Well, it didn't help. He should have been busier.

You're like, I need my things.

Okay, well, you know, I've been a celebrity here, justice, for a really long time, and I have been in so many of those camps. And I would say that if someone is a. A hole before they were famous, they're still an a hole.

And it's exaggerated.

It's exaggerated and it's exaggerated.

And if they're a good guy, then that might be exaggerated, too.

Sure.

Right. You know, that's an interesting point, too, because like you said, you guys have this celebrity kind of Hollywood background. I mean, you've done Lupita Nyong', O, Anne Hathaway, Angelina Jolie. So when you're in the chair with these people, was there ever, like, a crazy, crazy moment before? Let's say like a big red carpet event, Like a wild and crazy thing that ever happened that you could share with us?

Always.

There's a lot.

Let's hear it. Let's hear it.

Always. Well, you know, I think that if you think about the times, not so much now, because on your phone, you get to. As a celebrity, you are showing pretty much everything because everybody wants to see that. Right. That's part of your brand. But back then, you didn't have that access. Right.

There was no bts.

No. There was the access.

No social media.

No, not at all. So when you think about if Angie or Lupita or Annie or Sandra, any of these women that I've had the opportunity to work with, that you get them ready for a red carpet, you're in the hotel room, you're in their mansion, you're in their apartment or wherever you are. And just think about the pressure of getting ready to leave after you're dressed, getting ready to leave. And as you walk outside the door, there could be at this moment, hundreds of photographers that are taking your picture before you even get to where you're going for the red carpet. That. That's a lot of pressure.

That was one of the moments for me, actually. Ted was working with Ashley Green during the whole Twilight frenzy, and she was going, I think was her first met gala.

Yes.

To her first met gala. And I tagged along with Ted because I was coloring Ashley's hair. So we had a friendly relationship, and she. I was there. The glam squad. That. That wasn't called that then either, but they were all there. Fashion stylist, makeup artist, hairdresser, manager, publicist, whatever, and me and getting set up and getting ready. And Ashley came in off the street with, I think, like, jeans and a leather bike, like, motorcycle jacket, and her hair just in a ponytail. And she just looked like a regular pretty girl from Florida. You know, you'd see her on the street and think, well, that's a pretty girl. But, you know, and watching this team of experts turn her into a freaking movie star, you know, it was like. It was really. And to see her confidence growing, like, there's so much more to it than just doing hair and makeup and putting a dress on.

Absolutely.

This group of people are so intimately involved in that moment that they're constantly being like, you look amazing. That's perfect. Yes. You look gorgeous. Yeah. So by the time she steps out, she's. That's her armor, that hair and makeup. And what she's wearing is like, what's protecting her. To be judged by the entire world.

Yeah. Never to be underestimated.

Never to be underestimated.

Oh, no.

I mean, there's one moment. Well, several moments of someone who I'm not going to mention her name.

Did I see her vagina?

No, you did, because I did.

Does her name rhyme with a certain word?

But her nerves, right? Her nerves would be so bad that after her hair and makeup, we would be sitting there waiting for her as she got dressed. And you would hear the water running in the bathroom that she would go in. And her nerves would be so crazy that she would wet her face and wet her hair.

And you're like, we just did.

And then we would have to redo it.

Oh, you're kidding.

And like that. But I'll tell you that when you have the opportunity to work with a beauty with experience, I've been able to make that beauty into beautiful. And that's the goal. So being able to be in those kind of environments is really kind of my specialty.

Yes.

In high pressure and high pressure, high streets. Cause I make people feel really good. I'm a calm presence anyway. So being in those kind of environments is really good for me.

It's really good, right? I mean, it's funny to think that these, especially these actresses who are out in front of the camera, you know, so well known, big names that they get so turned out, every single one of them. That's crazy to me.

It doesn't matter who they are. Every single one of them. And again, you have to think about the pressure. The pressure of it, you know, I mean, it can. You can relate it to. If you are going to a PTA meeting, are you going to a bar mitzvah? Or your bride or your bride, or you're going to your 25th high school reunion, your 30th high school reunion. That same kind of pressure is. It's. It's pretty much the same.

Wow. So was there anybody that really surprised you as to being really down to earth or even the opposite, like not being so grounded?

Renee Zelliger really surprised me. Yeah. She came to our salon on Fifth Avenue for Color and Hair with Ted. And.

She.

Went up to almost everyone in the salon and introduced herself.

Because we had a private room.

We had a private room, but none of the celebrities wanted to be in there.

They didn't want to be in there. Diane Sawyer really was the only one that really wanted to be in that room.

But everyone else preferred to be.

Yes, for sure.

Maybe you had a good clientele that were more like the grounded girls that were just okay with it.

And the ones that weren't, they don't see me again.

Yep.

I can see there's been a few of those.

Okay.

Yeah.

How do you deal when you got somebody like that?

Well, you know, it's.

You know, a lot of times it's kind of mutual.

Yeah.

A lot of times if you just don't click.

Right.

You know, but sometimes it can be where you clicked and then you didn't click the next time.

Yeah.

For whatever reason, there's always something that's.

Going on, and then there's always a publicist.

Yes.

And if you don't click with the publicist, then you might not never see the celebrity again.

Yes. AKA the gatekeeper.

I was gonna say the gatekeeper, but that's changed so much in these days and times also.

Right. You've more access to these people now. Right. It's a different.

It's just a dm.

Yeah, it is. It is. There's something so nice about that. So do you like that about social media for, like, especially for your businesses? There is that accessibility, like we didn't have before.

I love social media.

I do go through phases of loving it. I loved it really hard for a long time.

Yeah.

And now I'm. I'm feeling pressured to be more involved because we're launching this new brand.

Right.

And so I'm trying.

Yeah, we launched.

It did launch.

It launched. It's out there.

And it's interesting because kind of like what we were talking about before, about how things change as we get older, a lot of these things that we've done. We just had an experience this week that was really profound for Ted. Last. We've done 40 seasons of new York Fashion Week, and it was. It's always been so fun to build a team and to do five or six shows and to see how inspired these people are that got to come with us and to share that moment, because it's not easy to get that moment. And last season, we decided it was our last season because we're shifting directions. Our brand is different now. We're different now. We have different goals. It was easy to do New York Fashion Week when we lived there, but living on the west coast, it's way more work, way more expensive. We got to put the dogs in daycare for a week. We got to get a. All of it, you know, and so we decided we're done. Well, there's a designer who we love who reached out to Ted and said, you know, we're doing a show in September, and we'd love for you to lead the team in the hair. And do you want to finish telling it?

No, go ahead.

Oh, okay. And we decided no, that we weren't going to do it. But yesterday was the day that Ted called El Torren. He's the stylist for the. For the designer who, if you need some inspiration and some humor to follow on Instagram, Altoran's amazing. But anyway, Ted called him and said, you know, we're not going to do it. There was a more conversation around it, but whatever. And then he got off the phone and he was like, it took me three days to make that call. And then he started bawling. Because it's one of those things where it's like, there's so many things that defined who we were.

Right.

During a certain part of our life or a certain part of our career. And having that moment where you're ready to let that go, don't you cry. I know it's making me teary, but that's. This is where we're at. Like, being able to let that go and move on to whatever's next, even if you don't know what it is, is really profound. It's so easy.

And it could be just. It could even be just a pair of shoes. You know what I mean? It could be that top that you've had for the last 15 years that doesn't really serve you anymore.

It could be talking about a guy.

That top? Yeah.

Never a bottom, Always a top.

Oh, my God.

He's getting a little serious there.

It's always good to like.

No, I'm not talking about the top. But yeah, I mean, just to think about how that works.

Right? Even changing your hair.

I mean, that was exactly what I was gonna say.

Even changing your hair can be so monumental. Right.

Life changing. Life changing.

And there is something about sitting in that chair. Like when you're like a person going to get your hair. Your hair person is like your therapist.

Sure.

You are spending an hour or more with them talking about, you know, things that you don't talk about, even with friends.

Sometimes that relationship is like no other relationship in a woman's life. It really is. Because, you know, I always. When we do a lot of educational seminars where we talk to hairdressers and help business and technique and everything. And one of the things that I always say is that sometimes what happens with the client that sits in your chair that you haven't seen for six weeks or eight weeks. Right. And the last time that she was in, maybe she divulged some information to you, and there's a possibility that she hasn't been touched since the last time that she was in the salon because her husband hasn't touched her, her kids haven't given her a hug. She's not getting a hug at work. No one's listened to her. Her husband's too busy, the kids are on their phone. There's so many things. So when she has that time, hour and a half to three hours in the salon, when she's with that hairdresser, she is a changed woman. She's able to divulge and share and really be who she is sitting in that chair. And it's a moment that I think is really important.

You know, I've never thought about that, about not being touched.

Not being touched. Because we don't think about it, that we hairdressers, that's what we do. That's what we do. And there's so much power in that.

Right. And it's, you know, it's, it's so relaxing. It's like all the emotions come out.

It's very like if your hair is.

Part of your armor, right. And you're surrendering that to somebody else and sitting there in your less than pretty state in front of other people.

Yeah.

That'S true.

I think that's why, that's why the whole story of Steel Magnolia is the stage production takes place in the salon.

Right, right.

That's where relationships. There's so many people that if you're on the same appointment schedule every six weeks, on Wednesday at 10.

Right.

You know, like you get to see the same people all of the time and that becomes its own little community that doesn't happen anywhere else.

That's such a good point. My grandmother, I'm also, you know, from Texas like you and my grandmother, that's what she'd do every Friday morning at 10 o'. Clock. You know, they'd all meet at what they call the beauty parlor and get their hair set. And it became like a social thing for them. Right. I mean, it's a community. It's a community.

And men have that too at the barbershop. So it's the same, it's the same kind of idea of really being able to take care of yourself, about self care and being able to be in those moments and relax and feel good about yourself and, and, and change.

And it's such a safe environment most of the time that there's actually organizations that go to barbershops to talk about high blood pressure, to talk about men's health issues, to go to salons that are predominantly women and have a safe way to talk about domestic violence or all of these things that really help to let people become more educated in different ways in their life that they don't think about or that they don't feel safe to talk about in other places.

And they're away from all their stimulus, like the everyday, you know, mundane stuff that they're going through. And so they're in a, like, you're saying, a safe place where they can listen. That's such a great idea.

Yeah.

Okay.

And it works, right?

It works, right?

It works.

So for the women out there that are listening, because you guys have all this great experience with a lot of the women that they see on TV and in movies, what are three things that women at home can do to kind of achieve elevated look, you know, or kind of like that Hollywood kind of feel? What are three things that they can do at home?

Well, for one thing is that you need to make sure that you have the right tools. The tools are gonna really be have a set of hot rollers.

Right? Hot rollers go a long way, don't they?

Go a long way? Absolutely. And, you know, when I think we're all kind of in the same way influenced because we do have social. So we're seeing what stars are wearing, their hair, their makeup. So we're influenced by that. And it doesn't necessarily only have to be a celebrity that makes $12 million a movie. It could be someone that's in your hometown that has a little bit of influence, that has showed you maybe something this lip color that you really. That they love, and you see it, and maybe you go try it out. So I think it's hot rollers is number one. What would be number two?

I would say I see a lot of women who probably are wearing the same makeup and hair that they wore in high school and college. So find a new hairdresser and get their professional opinion. Someone who doesn't know anything about you and see what they say. Go to the department store cosmetics section and have someone make recommendations about, you know, the way that you wear your eyeliner, you know, or your lip color or whatever. Because as. As we change, we need to address things differently. And if we're doing things the same way, then we're not going to get the same results as we did then, because we're different, you know, And I think a lot of times less is maybe more, you know, instead of, like, you know, putting the black eyeliner all the way around your eye with the. With the heavy mascara that looked awesome when you were 23, now you look sort of like, I Don't know, maybe the lady at the grocery store that needs to. I'm thinking of this woman in my hometown you're visualizing. And she used to. She dyed her hair jet black and had a full beat and was. I was a child, so she was maybe 60 and I thought she was a hundred, you know, but she would shoplift and her husband would follow her around and pay.

You're kidding.

Yeah.

Oh my God.

But she definitely had a look.

Okay.

That dated her. And I think that that's with our, with our fashion and with our, the way that we take care of our skin, our hair, our makeup, whatever, is to really think about what's fresh.

Right. That's a good point. Like, how do we update, especially at this time in our lives? Like, what do you think is the best way? Should we be getting inspiration from certain places or what's the best way to update?

I love seeing men who are my age or older that are looking like amazing and trying to emulate what they do. Like when I go to the gym, I'm not looking at the 35 year old guys in my head. 35, 38 is like where men peak at their most manly before everything starts to drop, including balls.

Right.

Low hangers.

That's another, another.

Another gift.

Along with my pro.

Totally.

I'm so good.

But I have to remind myself that I'm not, I'm not trying to be them.

Yeah.

I want to be 75 and be able to put my own carry on, bag up.

Yeah.

I want to be 85 and not have mobility issues. So the reason that I'm going to the gym, I mean, of course I still want to look hot. As hot as I can look.

Right.

And that never goes away.

I feel like right away.

And if it does, I feel bad for those people.

Right.

They've lost their, their umph, you know, like their thing that makes them want that.

Yeah. But you know, when I. We just came back from Greece, we were in Greece and on the plane, you see all of these guys that just came from Turkey that just had all of their hair transplants. I'm like, do it right, do it, do it right. If you want your eyes done, do it. If you want to facelift or neck lift, do it.

If you want to go on the fat shot, absolutely.

If you want to go on the shot, do it. Absolutely.

Do what makes you happy and feel good.

Feel good about yourself.

Right. As long as you're doing it truly for yourself.

For yourself.

Right.

Which is really a distinction. Right. Between the distinction or you want to make sure that people, I mean, of course we want to make people look, think we're attractive. Absolutely. But knowing within yourself the reason why you're doing it is to really for self care and making sure that, that you feel good about yourself.

Yeah. How do you guys do self care? Oh, that's a good point. Like, do you guys take the time? I mean, you obviously travel and everything, but like, what else does self care look like for you guys?

What does self care look like for you?

Well, we got up really early. Okay, we got up like around 5:30, between 5:30 and 6. And especially now in the desert when it's 115, it's a little toasty out.

There.

But I'll tell you, I'll take 115 in the desert. Over 95 in humid in New York.

City are 45 below.45 below in Minnesota.

No, thank you.

But it's really gorgeous in the morning. It's like 80, you know, and we can walk the dogs and I usually sit up side by the pool and Ted usually sits inside and we do our morning rituals. You know, we make sure to take time. I need to have at least two hours before I'm meeting people. You know, I need that. I've recognized that in myself that I really honor that time to myself in the morning, to have my coffee, to listen to my inspirational podcast or whatever it is I'm listening to, to have a little time to just be still and then I can get ready for my day, you know, so that's one of the things that's really important. Going to the gym is really important. I love being able to. I just started a, a year ago, I just started a raised garden beds. I have to raised garden beds. And that's been surprisingly satisfying.

Wow.

You know, when it's time to pick my carrots or my beets or whatever. And those are all things that incorporated into my life very easy. I didn't have to make big changes. The biggest change was going to bed at 10 o' clock instead of midnight.

That's hard.

That's really a big one, you know, because I, you know, my self care, when I think about self care for me is something that I've done for a really long time. And that is my morning practice is vital for my relationship, for my career, for my public image. All of that is really important for me that, that morning practice and then my morning practice consists of meditation, reading and writing and listening to some kind of spirituality, which really helps me get centered to who I am and Who I want to be every single day. And I know that when I miss that, I'm a little different because I need to hear something that will not only move my spirit, but also kind of give me a jolt of inspiration and. And love. And since we actually adopted mushrooms into I'll speak for me, since I've adopted mushrooms into my morning practice, it has completely changed everything for me.

Do you feel clearer?

I feel clearer. I feel more present. I feel like that I am hearing my being is more open, which I think is really important. I think that we, as a human race at the moment, or especially since really, since COVID we're looking for things that can be stress relieving. We're looking for community. We're looking for inspiration. We're looking for things that will help us to feel good. Because if you're scrolling on your phone, like I scroll on my phone, there are some challenging information that is coming through my phone. So I think it's important. If I can have something that's gonna make me feel good, that's what it's really about for me. And that is every single day. And feeling good every single day is important.

It's how you start the day. Right.

Start today.

That was a. That was a big self care thing too. Is like, when it's time for bed, I leave my phone in the living room.

That's what I hear. That's like a big tip that people are doing, like, leave it in a different room so you're not tempted, Right. To scroll.

Because otherwise I wake up in the morning and it's the first thing I look at.

I know.

It's true.

So bad.

And that was a time that, you know, my mom, who, like we said, recently passed, but there was a time that I would have to have my phone and that would be the first thing that I would do because that I needed to make sure that she was okay if her facility called or something. That I needed to make sure that I had my phone there. But it isn't as important as it was. Like I said, Jason, I'm like, I left my phone in the living room. And it feels really good to be able to do that.

Yeah. And you were taking care of your mom for a long time. Right. So, like, you know, that's also an interesting part of this time of our lives. It's the sandwich generation, right?

Like, absolutely.

We're taking care of our aging parents.

And it's almost like being in your 20s again.

Right.

Because it's a whole new learning curve. There's nothing to prepare. There was nothing to prepare me for my dad getting sick and dying. You know, there was nothing. It's like a whole new. And then how that changed my relationship with my mom, you know, and how just so many different things that we don't have any practical experience for. And then all of a sudden we're in our 50s and it's like, oh, wow, wow, what the fuck am I gonna do?

Life is lifing right now, right?

Yeah. There isn't anything. And it happens so quickly that you can't prepare for it. You know, I think it's really important to have a sense of community and people that support you and that really, that you can have conversations with and reach out to maybe people that have experienced already that can give you some pointers. And that's what I did. So it was extremely helpful that I had a community of people that I knew that I could rely on to help me through this process of taking care of my mom for the last decade.

Oh my gosh. Wow. And like you're saying it's so important to build community. So if somebody out there is listening and they feel like they don't have community, how do they start to even build community? Like if they feel alone and isolated and they can't rely on anyone, I.

Would say if you don't have a job, get a part time job. You'll always meet people there. If you have time, volunteer. You'll meet like minded people there. Some people find it at church, some people find it at yoga. Some people find it at your local coffee shop. Just hanging out at the coffee shop.

Or the hair salon.

Right, Hair salon.

Right.

There's a lot of different ways and I think that the biggest thing is just don't be afraid to do it.

Yeah, that's.

And speak up. And speak up. And not be afraid to just say how you're feeling and not be afraid to just say I'm lonely or I need some help or anything like that. Because we all do join a club.

Yeah, there's a million different clubs that, you know, each community advertises on Facebook or different chat groups or Reddit or like whatever that you can, you know, if you like to hike, find a hiking group. Then you'll find other people that like to hike. You know, if it's a. If in Palm Springs, there's a poodle club. Anyone that has a poodle can join the club.

Oh, that's such a good club. That's such a good club.

So there's a lot of different Ways. I think that we just have to not be afraid to try.

Yeah, that's. I think it's the fear that holds people back a lot of the time. And I feel like we all have some type of fear in us. So how do you guys deal with the fear? Because there's times, you know, for example, there's times I wake up in the morning, I'm like, it's a low day. Right. So I'm like. I'm feeling it. Insecure. I'm looking at my phone. I'm comparing myself on social media, you know. So how do you guys get through those days?

Well, I would say one thing is the. My morning practice.

The morning practice, for sure.

It really does.

It's the one thing that you can do that I can do that sets the tone for the day. And then whatever happens after that, at least I've had that moment where I'm completely in control of everything and I'm not worried about anything. I know that. But in that moment, everything is taken care of. I might have bill collectors calling me all day, but in that moment when I don't have my phone and I'm silent, I know that I have a roof over my head, that I'm fed, that I am confident in my relationship, and I love my dogs, and I have a great relationship with my mom and my sister. I know that all of those things are real. And I think that's a really great way to, like, if you're feeling crappy, start your day that way.

Yeah.

Just think about all of the things that are real.

It's like the gratitude. Right. Just really being no matter what is going on in the rest of your life is like taking those moments of gratitude. It's hard to do sometimes.

It is hard to do.

You have to make a conscious choice.

You have to make if you're making it a practice.

Right.

You know, every day.

And I try to live by, you know, everything is for my good. Even when it may appear to not look like maybe to other people, that it may not be good, but I try to live it as everything is for my good. I mean, we've owned four salons in four different states. We don't have a salon now. So what that meant was that we had to close all these salons. And some people are like, oh, I'm so sorry your salon closed. I'm like, I'm not sorry.

Yeah, it was for the good.

It was for the good that it's closed, that I've moved on to something else. Because you in Order to get the great, you got to get rid of the good.

That's a good point.

To make room for the better.

Yes. If it have to, isn't really serving you as well as it did before. Right.

And it's recognizing. Right. It's recognizing. Just like Jason told that story about us doing fashion week for 40 seasons. And what that means is that's. How many years was that?

20 years.

Are like dog years, right?

You're like, how Many?

How many? 65.

You know, how crazy it is backstage and how nuts it is with models and the designer and, I mean, so many people and the team and everything. And, you know, that was such a huge part of my career, and I just recognized that it wasn't serving me anymore. I had recognized it a while ago, but I hadn't really decided until this last season that, you know, this is my last season of doing fashion because it doesn't serve me anymore. And it's not the same. You know, I don't get the same kind of tingle that I did from the bottom of my feet all the way to the top of my head. And how incredible and influential. You know, the movie Devil Wears Prada, when she talks about the cerulean blue and how those things is not quite. It's not the same any longer.

They lose their luster. Right?

They lose their luster.

And once you've been on the inside and you see the inner workings, you know, it doesn't have that appeal like it did, you know, to somebody. Maybe that's gone going for the first time for sure.

And that's what I said to Ted when he was. When we were having that conversation yesterday, I was like, there's a million kids that are dying for that opportunity that you just let them have.

Yeah.

Yep, yep. You're actually kind of paying it forward in a way for them. But does it feel at the same time, does it feel like a loss at all or like a loss of identity? Or is it hard to let go of in any way? Like, is there. Are those feelings there, too?

Yes, for sure, to be honest. But, you know, I would say that that's the important piece of it, because I don't want to be the same person I was yesterday. I don't want to be the same person that I was five years ago, because if I am, then I haven't progressed as an artist. I haven't progressed as a human being. I haven't progressed as an entrepreneur. If I stay in the same place, then there's no growth. And where we have the money, the freedom, the love, the excitement is from the growth and the change. Even though that can be the hardest thing in the world to do.

Yeah, it really can be.

But it can really be really hard, clearly.

Yeah. But you guys have this thing, though, like I was saying at the beginning, like, where you can step into change. It seems pretty easy, you know, like the reinvention, I mean, easy, because I know there's always work behind it, but it's like you're not. It's almost like you don't seem afraid to take those steps, you know?

Well, you know, I think there. There are times where you're forced to make the step. Right, right. But it's important not to be in the place where you're forced to make the step that the. The idea of. Of. I'm an opportunist. I always say that I'm an opportunist, so if I see an opportunity, I'm going to take the opportunity. I was trained very well by my mentors who told me that the opportunity doesn't. But when it does, you take it.

And don't feel bad about it.

And don't feel bad about it. Because if you can live by everything is for your good, then you know that it was for your good to get you to the next place.

Right, right.

To get me to the next place.

Joan Rivers told us a story one time.

Joan, love Joan. Right.

I've only been to one Seder dinner in my life.

You went to Joan Sader dinner?

We're really good friends with. We're really good friends with Melissa.

And we thought it would be like a big dinner. There was like eight people.

It was.

It was insane.

Wait, okay, tell me. At the mansion, start to finish, everything.

At the mansion that I think Melissa just sold, right? Just recently sold it.

Yeah. In New York.

In New York.

Okay, tell me you guys get there. Is she, like, already Joaning Right at.

The beginning, you know, it was really interesting because we're in her safe place. And so she was being grandma.

Yes.

And she was hosting dinner. I mean, she was hosting it with a staff of 15 people.

But still.

But still. As one does. As one does. And she had a friend there who was a writer for the Carol Burnett show. And so they just kept doing bits back and forth all through the whole thing.

I was like, is this serious? Are they serious?

When we were leaving, we were at the elevator, which was in her apartment, Right. And the friend came over, and he was, like, going to give her a hug and thanking her, and when he opened his arms, all of these tchotchkes fell out of his coat.

But it was a joke.

You know what I mean?

I forgot what she said. She said something because she was at the door with us.

Yeah, she said something. And then we got in the elevator and it was closing. And he goes, well, she's not much of a personality.

Oh, my God. How?

It was amazing.

It was amazing.

But she told this story of being blacklisted in Hollywood after she went to Fox and left Johnny Carson.

I can't. I'm sorry to interrupt you, but I cannot wait to see Natasha Leon play Joan Rivers. Joan Rivers. Sorry.

It's gonna be amazing.

It's gonna be amazing.

It's gonna be amazing.

And she talked about how she needed a job. She couldn't work anywhere in the industry. And she said she was opening every door that everyone was walking past. And she said yes when QVC asked her to sell nail polish. And that changed everything. That made her a fashion and beauty expert. And that's when she created Live from the Red Carpet. There was no Live from the Red Carpet before Joan Rivers and Melissa. You know what I mean? Like, they changed. They introduced bts, Right? For sure. You know?

Right. And the whole red carpet glam, talking about it.

Who are you wearing?

Right.

Who are you wearing?

Who did your hair? Who did your makeup? Like, all the things. Wow. She's like. She was such a game changer, right?

Changer on so many levels. And funny and hysterical.

So funny. Like, she seems to me like she would be one of those people where it just comes natural. Like she can't help but open her mouth.

Yes.

And something hilarious comes totally. Much like Robin Williams, who has. I had the opportunity of interviewing one time, just. Just handed the mic to him and he just went. And I'm like, I don't need to say anything. It's like one of those things where it just is, you know, that's such a gift to have that comedic timing.

For sure.

Wow.

Were you guys doing her hair? Is that how you guys knew her?

Or Melissa.

Wow.

Good friends with Melissa. And she said, I'm having say to her at my mom's. You guys want to come? We're like, what?

So I'm calling all my Jewish friends. I'm like, what do I bring? What do I bring? What do I bring? They're like, you have to go to Brooklyn to this one deli and get this. I'm like, okay.

You have to get all the things because you can't show up empty handed.

I don't want to be that gentile.

Yeah. And the department was incredible.

Oh, I bet. It was, like, to the T. Just amazing, right?

She had incredible taste, so. Of course.

Okay, do you guys have any other favorite celebrity clients? Ones that you really kind of got on with like that?

I mean. Yes. I mean, there's so many. There's a lot, you know, in my career, I would say that I'm so lucky because I have been able to be with so many different ones. Like, I'm not just known for maybe just one kind of thing. I went from Angie to Lupita to Annie to Natasha to Sandra o to Melissa McCarthy. I mean. I mean, the list goes on and on and on. And for me, it was always really about the hair. It wasn't about the color of the skin. And I knew that if I could do beautiful hair. Cause I say I'm a classic with a twist. That I'm very. I love old movies. Like, in the hallway, there's this poster of Gilda Jason. As we're walking up the stairs, Jason's like, oh, there's your favorite movie. I love Rita Hayworth. I love old movies. I got so much inspiration from them. But to be honest, I didn't even know that I was gonna be a hairdresser.

Really?

No.

What did you think you were gonna be?

I was gonna be a veterinarian. I was gonna play football for the Dallas Cowboys. I was gonna do. Yeah.

You play football?

I was high school football.

No way. Now, were you, like, out at that time? No. Cause that's a big.

I was out at that time.

Oh, so you were fully out and playing football in Texas?

I was.

And I know this growing up in Texas. It's a big deal.

It's a big deal.

Wow. And so were people accepting right away, or.

I think that they didn't really have a choice.

Okay. You're like, I'm doing this.

Yeah. I don't think they really had a choice. I think that I've always been kind of who I am, you know, my mom and dad. I'm an only kid. And I think that my mom and dad wanted me. Of course, you know, they wanted me to be somebody else, but I wasn't anyone else. That I was who I was. And I wasn't at any time, in any age feeling bad about that.

Wow.

Ever.

We're both lucky in that way.

Yeah.

Okay.

I came out to my parents. I think I was in 11th grade.

Yeah.

Oh, wow. So early on.

Early on.

And they were all accepting all the parents, like.

Yeah. I mean, there Was there was challenges and hurdles.

Okay.

You know, Sure.

I think my mom's biggest fear was that I wanted to be a girl. Like, she didn't really understand.

They're so old school. Right.

Like, they don't think. They think that if you're gay that you want to be in women's clothes and you want to dress. That's not the truth. I mean, the spectrum.

I mean, hopefully that's not what parents think today, but.

Well, I don't know.

Yes, it's true.

You know, I don't know. I think that it's not that way. That every kid that's gay that wants to be in women's clothes and wants to be a drag queen or even trans, like, it's a whole different thing. And, you know, I was never one of those kids that really accepted what anyone had to say.

That's great that you came from. Such support. Like, you guys both had really strong families. Probably made a lot of the difference.

It did.

For what you achieved later on in life, I would assume. Right.

And it's funny, because my sister is so the opposite. Like, she's had a fantastic career as a dietitian, and she's the one that's worked with the same organization and worked her way up and had the family and The.

The.

The 401k and the whatever. And I'm like, I'm gonna work till I'm 100. Because we get rich and then we get broke.

Right?

And then we get rich, and then.

We get broke, and we won't do that anymore. It's just me getting rich now.

Rich.

We're gonna stay rich.

Well, that's the life of an entrepreneur. Right. I feel the same. It's ups and downs, ups and downs.

But look, you reinvented, like, how incredible it is. You know what I mean?

Congratulations to you, too.

Thank you.

Such a journey.

Yeah.

Such a journey. And it's like, when you have that entrepreneurial spirit, you cannot put it out. Like, we wouldn't feel the same not doing what we're doing. Right.

And you wouldn't be able to inspire the people that you talk to, the people that are part of your community that really want to listen to something that you have to say and that your guests that bring. That you bring on. Like, it's tremendous to hear how important it is to think about yourself in your 50s and 60s, your 40s and 50s and 60s. Like, people didn't have access to the. My mom didn't have access to that.

No. And think about what that meant. Right. And they suffered in silence, right?

In silence.

And also, like, we're. We're more fit.

Yes.

We're more worldly.

Yes.

We're like. If I think about my grandma when she was 50, she was an old lady, right?

With like the hair, the short hair.

Like, I love the, the mashups of showing the olden girls and then taking like JLO and you know, saying, this is them now.

I know, it's like, it's so funny. I had this group chat with my girlfriends and we put up those pictures of like the Golden Girls. And we're like, guys, we are the that age now.

Yeah.

Like, how crazy. It has changed, you know, Changed.

It's really thought provoking how we've come as a society and as a community. And I love the idea. I mean, now we have AI, right? And it's a discussion that I think people are like, I hate AI and I don't want it to. Especially in our business, which is creative and people are a little nervous about it. But I think it's such a unique opportunity to change the dynamic and the way that we visualize things. Because it's not gonna go. It was the same thing from when I became first in the fashion business. It was about models that were on covers of magazines and that it started to turn into celebrity. And I know that all of the fashion people were like, no way, it's not gonna last. Not gonna be celebrities on the covers of magazines. And it still was for a really long time that we still had celebrities on covers. And it's the same kind of idea. When retouching happened, people were like, oh no, retouching. It's the same kind of idea. Our eye changes. Remember when it was went from high def on TV and everyone was freaking.

Out about it changes everything, right?

It changes everything.

And I think that's one of the things about getting older too is like we have to be conscious when we say, oh, it's changed. I would rather say I've changed because my niece and nephews that are in their late teens and mid up to mid twenties, everything is new to them and exciting and different. And I want to acknowledge that I've had a whole bunch of experience that makes me different than I was when I first did something. But there's still a lot of really exciting things. And as soon as we start saying, oh, it's changed, or I. I'm not thinking of another example off the top of my head, but knowing that we've changed and that that's the reason that I Don't want to do the same thing. Like, could we still go to Fashion Week and have a great time? Yes. Would we leave inspired? Yes. But is it serving the purpose that we're doing now? No, because we've changed.

You know what would be fun is to actually go to Fashion Week as just a spectator. Because we've all only ever worked it.

Sit in the front row. Yeah. The whole bed. Enjoy.

And not have to like write anything or take pictures. Just be there for the, like for the looks and for the clothes and for the hair and the makeup and that experience. Right. And just have a completely just creative experience where you're just taking it all in. We've never had that.

We've always been working in the trenches. Yeah.

Always in the trenches.

It is kind of like work.

It is.

Right.

And that's the thing. People, you know from the outside, they look at it, they're like, it's so glamorous.

And it's like, yeah, you have no idea.

Only you knew. Right. The inner workings of all of it.

Takes in order to get that show. That's three minutes.

Yes.

Five minutes. And the amount of money that goes in along.

Oh my God, totally. Okay, so advice. What would you advise your 25 year old selves? What would you tell that person?

Start investing in your retirement. My brother in law is a great example. 30% of every paycheck he's ever got since he was 18 years old, he saved.

How old is he now?

Now?

58, I think.

Oh. So he probably has some great savings, great investments.

He doesn't know this, but he is my retirement plan.

You're like, hey bro, where are we moving to?

Trailer on your lot. A trailer I just plug into your.

Oh my God.

I would say that. I would say, you know, I'm a kid that was like the last one picked for the team and the guys would be like, we want a boy on our team, not a girl like Jason. You know, like that kind of stuff. So I had a lot of. I didn't recognize it actually until recently that it was traumatic and I didn't want to go to the gym and I didn't want to be fit. So I would tell 25 year old me like, just go start your fitness earlier. And also stop caring so much what other people think.

That's a big one. That's how I feel too about that. What would you tell your 25 year old self?

I would tell my 25 year old self that you were so damn hot and how could you not think that you Weren't.

Isn't that crazy? We look back and we're like, oh my God, why didn't I just.

I was so fit and I had dreadlocks and I used to body build and I would have a. A gallon of water in my hand and wear clogs and I was so cool and did not think that I was that hot. I had the opportunity. I was working for a company called Aveda and I lived in Minneapolis and we were in New York shooting a campaign. And it was in the campaign, it was Paulina Portzykova, her mom, and all these other kind of influential celebrity, up and coming celebrities at the moment. And Horst Rekelbacher, who was a creator of Aveda, this famous photographer, world renowned photographer named Arthur Elgort, he said, and Horst was from. Was it Vienna?

Austria?

Austria. Austria, from Vienna. And he had this accent and he said, ted, Arthur wants to shoot you. You should take your clothes off. And he wants to shoot you. And I'm like, no, I'm too shy. And that's. I would tell you that I should have done it because looking now and having a picture of me nude with my body, that was like insane.

And it was photographed by Arthur Elgore.

And in such like a tasteful way, right?

Yes, for sure.

Have you seen that Schitt's Creek episode?

No.

Where Moira is like, take as many nude pictures of yourself as you can because one day you'll look back with much softer eyes.

She's so fucking good on that show.

She's so good.

So good.

She's so good. So, yes, I would have told myself that you're really hot and not to worry, you know, And I. Similar to what Jason said about how to not really care what other people say.

That's a hard one though, even still.

Yeah, it is. Especially in the business that we're all in. You know, it's so forward, public facing. It's like, how do you not. But that does come with age too though, right? And life experience.

Sure. And life experience. And my morning practice. I'll tell you what, you know, it does, it does make a difference for me and how I feel and my skin, my hair. And because we launched this mushroom product that I think is really, really, really good and effective.

We often talk as women, we talk about perimenopause and menopause and how our bodies change. Is there manopause?

Oh, for sure. I just found out that my prostate's the size of a grapefruit. So I've got a. I'm looking Forward to being able to pee.

Again, not a grapefruit.

Ted, can you confirm or deny this information?

Listen, for those inquiring minds want to know. Yes.

The size of a grape.

Oh, my gosh. Well, that is good to know because oftentimes I will walk into a room and I don't know if you guys experience this, but I'm like, why did I walk into this room? What am I getting? Or I'm grabbing for words, I'm forgetting, like, you know, what is the next word that I'm trying to say? So does that happen to men too?

Yes, I think it does. You know, I think there are things that we, we can do in order to kind of. I can't say because I'm not a doctor. So I can't say that a supplement in particular that can help with memory, that can help with brain fog, that can help with clarity is really important.

That was a great segue. And you didn't even do that on purpose. We'd like to introduce our product, Ascension, the daily supplement by Ted Gibson, Beauty Wellness.

But it's true, though. You know, it's true. And you know, just to give you a little bit of history about that, you know. Yes. I think that men go through all sorts of kind of things. I think that men generally may not be aware of. That's what's happening.

Men don't talk about that because they.

Don'T talk about our denial.

Our denial, Our denial. So I think that we do go through those things. Absolutely. But I think that there are ways in order to take things that we ingest in our body that can help help with the brain fog and the clarity and the skin and the hair and the health that I think is really vital in these times that we live in now because we're not getting the nutrients that we really need from our food like we used to. Everything is so manufactured in a way. And I'm not condoning that you need to eat organic or no GMO or 100% vegan, because I'm not those things. But what I do do do is I do take something that can help me with offset that, those kinds of things. Which I think is important.

Yeah, that is important. And you know, you guys really developed an amazing line, you know, coming out of COVID pretty much. Right. Like, and it, it's a mushroom based line. And you know, mushrooms are like kind of the hot ingredient right now.

Right.

We're learning so much, right.

Like the adaptogens and like all the health benefits. So what kind of prompted you Guys from, you know, doing what you were doing to really starting this line.

Well, a lot of it was.

You.

Know, when we left LA and moved out to the desert two years ago, almost exactly two years ago, we found ourselves in a very similar place where we, you know, we do this over and over and we're trying not to do that this time, but we, we build something and it becomes very successful and then we don't really know what to do and it sort of falls apart. And then. So we did that in New York and then we were like, okay, we've done New York, let's go to la. And when we moved to la, we did it again in la. And when we decided to end everything in la, we got to Palm Springs and we took a breather to think about, okay, who are we now? Who do we want to be when we grow up? And that's when we started thinking about it's important for us to do another product. We've been really focusing on external beauty. And I don't want to take anything away from that because I know when I look good on the outside, it makes me feel better on the inside. But I also know through several years now of having a morning ritual that we meditate, we read, we write to taking supplements that are beneficial for that. We see a difference that I feel a difference in myself taking and recognizing that if I am feeling good and healthy on the inside, it makes it a lot easier to feel good on the outside. So that was one of the things.

And the other thing is that, you know, over a decade, my mom was diagnosed with dementia.

Oh, I saw that she recently passed away.

She recently passed away. And I can say that in our quest to make sure that we can take care of her, we're thinking about, okay, so even our own health, our own mental health and what that really means for us also. And mushrooms came about and how incredible the ways of mushrooms that can build neural pathways in the brain that they can't say. I don't think that it is that it can prevent dementia or Alzheimer's, but I know that there are cases that it has really made a huge difference. A huge difference.

That's amazing.

Yeah.

How are you guys living iconically right now? Oh, at this stage?

Well, we have a lovely home with a 14,000 square foot backyard and a huge pool that's so gorgeous, like on Instagram.

Your guys house is like decorated. It's so nice.

Thank you.

Gorge.

Thank you very much.

And so that makes me just every, anytime I'm floating in my Pool. And, you know, it's kind of like my ritual to like, get dinner ready and then get in the pool with a glass of wine and just float around. And that always makes me feel super iconic. We started doing trade shows again because of this new brand. And it's fun to go and be reminded that our hairdressing community really loves us. And that's really nice. That makes me feel kind of iconic. What about you? You're way more iconic than me.

Am I? Yeah. Oh, thanks.

I'm iconic adjacent.

Well, it's worked for both of us. I always tell this is my Michelle Obama.

You need to get. My husband will listen to.

I know. Things to say.

You know, I, I, I just feel iconic being able to wake up every single day. Like, I think that being the age that I am with really no body issues, really, except for my sinuses or. But yeah, I think having health is wealth. And that is the thing for me that is iconic.

That is a good point. We, you know that it changes right. When you're 20s and 30s.

Sure.

You're not thinking in that way now. In 50s, it's like grateful to literally wake up.

Absolutely.

You know, get out of bed and not feel like that. I can't walk.

Right.

Not feel like that. I can't drink a glass of water. Whatever it is that as we age, there's things that happen that we really have no control over. So I think that that's iconic to be able to have that health as wealth.

You know, I just thought of something back to when you guys were talking about tools and I forgot to ask you guys this. What is the best brush that we should get? The best hairbrush? Because I think there's so many out there. You never know what to get.

Yes.

Okay. Tell.

Okay. So I have three. You have three. Three brushes? Three. Yeah. Okay. Do you want to go first?

Sure.

Mason Pearson.

Are you. So am I. I knew you were.

You let me. I gave you the opportunity and then you gave it back.

So you don't know which one.

I don't know the name of it, but it's a great mix of nylon and boar bristles.

Here we go.

And then if that, That's a flat brush.

Okay.

I love the YS park round brushes. Again, boar bristle and nylon bristle combination. They're not cheap. Mason pearsons are around 100 bucks. And these round brushes are probably 60 to 85 bucks, depending on the size of the barrel. And the third. I love a Denman. A nine row Denman.

Okay. These brushes should last Forever.

They'll last forever.

You're investing in it. But yeah, yeah, you'll have this brush for 10, 20 years even sometimes good for your hair.

Throw away those metal brushes.

I hate a metal brush.

Okay. Metal brushes are no go.

They're the worst.

Okay.

Especially if you want to maintain the cuticle and you want to maintain your hair. Don't use a metal brush because the metal brush is heating up so hot.

It's getting hot. As hot as your blow dryer.

As hot as your blow dryer, which is going to really destroy your hair.

Maybe they're okay, like if your hair's already dry and you're using it to set a curl pattern or something. But.

And as Jason was talking about, Mason Pearson, my favorite brush of all time, the reason why is because it is dual bristled. It has the nylon, which is, I say for detangling, and then the boar for, for, for smoothing. It's an investment. But let me just tell you something. For your scalp, that old tale about brushing your hair 100 times before you go to bed.

Right.

Is truthful. Oh, you should brush your hair and your scalp a hundred times before you go to bed.

That stimulation, really, that stimulation of your scalp.

Okay.

That taking those natural oils that are in your scalp through your hair, there's nothing better. Better for it. And then also it's going to really relax you and soothe you.

It's another ritual.

It's another ritual.

Bedtime ritual.

It's another ritual.

Should we be washing our hair every day? No, no, no. Right. Oil training. Is that a thing? Like, apparently the, like you train your hair to not wash it. Like, you try to go as long as possible. And I think it's called oil training because it gets really dirty.

But it's for the scalp, it's not for the hair. So oil train is really about the scalp. It's not about the hair.

Oh, okay. So it's more about.

Which is really important to know. And the scalp is skin. So when you're thinking about addressing what your hair is going through, internal is going to be number one.

Okay.

External is going to be number two.

Okay.

So whatever you put in your body is going to show up on the outside of your body.

That's, that's a good point. Because I know as we get older, hair can start drying out and like, you know, you're dealing with all these things.

Absolutely.

So should women be taking certain supplements or using certain products for their hair?

Yes. I mean, that's part of the reason why. Also with my mom having Dementia, Yes. But also part of the reason why we decided to launch an ingestible first, a supplement first in this new line is because we've heard forever, as long as we've been hairdressers combined experience over 60 years, whatever you put on your.

Body, you have to do that all of the time.

I do.

Just aged.

You guys should just say me, because, you know, you look like you're still 34. Thank you.

Just a baby babe in the woods.

I know the right things to say. I'm not gonna say what I wanted to say that, you know, we heard for years and years and years about whatever you put in your body shows up on the outside of your body. And I think that us as beauty professionals, we don't necessarily always think of about that because we're thinking about just what surface beauty, if you will. But that's the reason why we decided to launch an ingestible first. And the reason why we decided to use mushrooms is because mushrooms are the new era in beauty. For thousands of centuries, they've been using them in Asian cultures, putting them in teas, putting them in food, all of that and supplements. But here in the west, we haven't adopted it as much.

We were kind of brought up, don't touch it in the woods because you might die.

Right, right. Like, stay away from mushrooms. Especially wild mushrooms.

Yes.

And people say that they don't like mushrooms, but really, most of the mushrooms we get in the grocery store now are the same mushroom at different stages of their growth cycle.

Yes, that's it.

So when you say I don't like mushrooms, you've really only had one.

Yeah. You've only had one kind of mushroom?

I just discovered one. Sorry I interrupted you.

It's okay. I'm used to it. You.

I said that to him yesterday or two days ago. I'm like. I'm used to interrupting me. So he just got me back. It's called Candy Cap, and when it's dried, it has a maple syrup flavor. Ooh, okay. And I can't wait to get some to make a simple syrup for cocktails.

Ooh, that's a good point. Huh?

Or to mix it up, make a syrup for putting in desserts. There's so many things. There's. It's. We're just at the tip of the iceberg of one.

And we're writing a beauty book.

And we're writing a book. Oh, really?

Oh, like. So when is that coming out?

Probably 2020. Yeah. Oh, no. Excuse me. It's 2026.

Probably fall of 2026 that incorporates the mushrooms and everything.

And we're gonna do like 35 to 50 different recipes.

Okay.

To do different things, like make people think differently about the whole fungi kingdom.

Right.

Along with beauty, wellness, and science. So that's our brand. Ted Gibson, Beauty, wellness, and Science. So we're combining all three of those things into a book based on the idea of my mushrooms.

Oh, wow. So that's coming in fall 2026.

Yes.

Tell people where they can find you and find the company.

You can find us on all social platforms. Ted is Ted Gibson. I am Jason Bakke.

B, A, C, K, D. Love it. Little branding.

Little branding, Little branding. And you can find ascension@tedgibson.com.

Okay. And before you guys leave, we like to play a little game on the iconic midlife.

Okay. Okay.

So here's our rapid fire boys.

Rapid fire.

Ready?

I gotta get ready.

It's called snip or sip. Okay, so snip. Cut it. Done. You're over it. Sip. We're into it. Keep it coming.

Okay. I love it.

Is this snip because we're hairdressers or is that every time?

No, that's just for you guys. Tailored just for you. Okay. Glass hair. Assuming, like glass skin. Like, that's kind of the trend where it's like that kind of very dewy, shiny look.

Yes.

So what do you think? Glass hair.

I would say sip when appropriate. Sip when it doesn't look greasy. Yeah.

Oh, yeah, that's. That's big.

Because I don't know that the consumer. Right. I don't know if she's going to be able to create that same look without it looking greasy.

Right. That's the trick. You can.

That's the trick.

Right. Because try to recreate it at home.

That's really hard sometimes it being greasy and then you're gonna be pissed off and you're like, oh, my God, yes.

Like, what did I do?

And that's kind of like stuff you see in magazines across the board. It's created to last for the moment the picture's being taken. Absolutely not to go to work eight hours in the office.

Yes, that's true. Because it's a different. You're doing two different looks.

But I do say that a woman should. Should know what the trend is, but not be a slave to it. So she can adopt this glass hair into something that works for her. Right. She doesn't have to do exactly the same way.

Right.

She can create it how it works for her and say that I'm on trend. And she's on trend.

She's on trend. She can make it her own and.

Make it her own.

We're not making this rapid fire.

Oh no, sorry. I know. We love all the explanation tips.

Okay, good.

Number two, over lined lips.

Snip it, sip it, you'll like.

One likes it, one doesn't.

Okay, okay. So the reason why is because I.

Just, it has to be done so well.

Well, I just worked with this young actress who has seven movies coming out within the next year. She's the new face of the Hunger Games. And this is a little backstage goss.

Yes, tell.

But she wanted her lip to be just a slightly bit over, over line. So if a 19 year old girl is thinking about that as a trend, I know that it's back on track.

That's true. Those Gen Z. Gen Z, right, yeah, yeah. They're in the know with that kind of stuff. Right.

That kind of stuff.

And also like you gotta be careful as we reach a certain age that a heavy lip.

Yeah.

Might not be so friendly to any kind of creasing that we have around our lip area or.

Well tell that to Debra Messing because Deborah Messing always loves her lip to be a little enlarged. And she still looks amazing.

She looks, yeah, she's gorgeous.

She does.

But she doesn't smoke. So if you smoke, you may have that thing a little bit more crepe.

Yeah, little crepey. Yeah, the skin and everything. Good point. Botox in your 20s. Snip it or sip it?

Snippet.

Sip it.

I love it. You're like one here and one there.

I had botox in my 20s and I felt like. Can we say filler?

Yeah.

And not Botox.

So if it's filler I might be into it in my 20s.

Okay. For the volume.

For the volume.

I mean I've been a big fan of Botox and a little, I mean a little filler since I was probably 35.

Okay.

And I think that. But it's made everything look better now that I'm not 35. I think that there was some preventative stuff because of having the muscles not move as much. So maybe there's a little bit of sip, but I think, you know.

Listen, let me just tell you something about her. Her.

This girl over here, this girl to.

My right would have had Botox if it was accessible and she could have done it.

That's true.

Absolutely.

Uh huh. Absolutely right. You don't want it to get any worse than. It doesn't have to be, you know.

And we're so influenced by. We're so influenced by the Hailey Biebers and the, you know, the. What's her name? Lori Harvey.

Right.

You know what I mean? We're so influenced by these girls. And These girls are 25 years old and they are tweaking their faces. I mean, can we just talk about Lizzy Lohan's face for a moment?

Oh, my God. You know what, though? She looks great.

That's what I'm saying.

Right?

And what a bounce back.

What a bounce back. Right? She looks amazing. Anne Hathaway and ridiculous. Yes, girl. So gorgeous. Give me more of that.

Do it. I mean, it's so different than it used to be. You remember. I don't know if you remember when Jessica Lange had her, you know, back in the 80s, whatever, 90s, when Jessica Lange had her facelift and everyone was like, horrified. Oh, my God, who is this one? Even Renee Zellweger when they had their work done that. It was so jarring.

Right?

I was not jarred by. No, I was not judged by Kris Jenner. Jarred. When she had just. You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Like, we're not.

It's just come a long way.

It's just come a long way.

I love this. It's like. It's like work. That looks like you've not had anything done. Just like a refresh.

A refresh.

Looks amazing. Kris Jenner is another one that looks. Wow.

Unbelievable.

She looks the youngest out of all of them now. I mean, it's crazy, right? Looks great, though. I'm like, I want what she's having.

Absolutely.

We look amazing even if we don't do it.

Yes. Right? It's true. It's a choice.

Get that Botox, get that filler, that facelift. Do you know how many you're looking at all these women in Hollywood, right? You're looking at all these women that are influential, and if you think that they have it on their second and their third facelift by the time they're 60 years old, you have another thing coming.

And the Dukes, too.

And the Dukes.

And the men, too.

Yep.

Or any of them over 45 that are being superheroes, like, there's some HGH happening there.

Bradley Cooper looks different too, doesn't he? There's something.

I've seen him lately.

Really?

He looks a little different. I'm not sure what he's done, but it kind of looks like something maybe. Maybe he's been done. Okay, last one. Sip it. Or snippet. Couples who work together.

Sip it, chug it.

Chug it. Sometimes you need to chug it when you work together.

You know, I, I think that if you can, I mean, I'll just speak from our experience. If we have different roles and that's the most important thing, you have a different role in any relationship that you're in and we have different roles and that's the reason why it's been able to work.

You guys kind of balance each other out, it seems like. Right?

Yep.

Yep. Like Ted's always wanted to be famous and I just want the famous people to know who I am and come to my parties.

Right. Totally works. Right?

Let's.

Another reason why you guys are great together.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Oh, well, thank you for coming on the Icon. I'm so excited.

This is worth getting up early and driving in.

Ted and Jason, Come on. Come on. I told you this would be good. From iconic red carpet stories to starting over with purpose, these two prove that midlife isn't the end of anything. It's the beginning of doing things your own damn way. Their new mushroom based wellness line is part of the next chapter and I can't wait to see where they take it. Be sure to follow them. TedGibson and Asenbach to stay plugged in. If this episode inspired you, made you laugh, or reminded you to own your magic, send it to a friend, leave us a review and tag us so we can repost you. Every single share helps the iconic midlife reach more women who deserve to feel powerful in this season. Follow the show, tell a friend, and remember, we're not doing midlife quietly. We're doing it on our own terms.