Welcome to the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.

I'm Kate Moore Youssef and I'm a wellbeing and lifestyle coach, EFT practitioner, mum to four kids and passionate about helping more women to understand and accept their amazing ADHD brains.

After speaking to many women just like me and probably you, I know there is a need for more health and lifestyle support for women newly diagnosed with adhd.

In these conversations, you'll learn from insightful guests, hear new findings and discover powerful perspectives and lifestyle tools to enable you to live your most fulfilled, calm and purposeful life wherever you are on your ADHD journey.

Here's today's episode.

So.

Hi, everyone.

Welcome back.

Today we are talking ADHD and productivity activity, but don't worry, we're not going to be talking about hacks or all the.

All the dry stuff.

We're really going to go into the nitty gritty because we've got an amazing expert with us today and his name is Ari Tuckman.

Now, Ari is a psychologist, he's an international presenter and an ADHD thought leader.

You may have heard of him, he's written lots of amazing articles and he's also written lots of brilliant books.

And his fifth book is called the ADHD Productivity Manual, and we're going to be delving into that.

So, Ari, welcome to the podcast.

It's great to have you here.

It is great to be here.

I'm really.

I've been looking forward to this for a long time.

Yeah, I mean, I was just saying before, just before we started recording is thank you so much for your contribution to the ADHD world, because I followed you for a really long time.

I know that you've written articles on Attitude magazine, you've got lots of books, and you've been working in this space for how many years now?

Like 25.

More than 25.

So, yeah, you're one of the stalwarts in this area.

And you know what, that's really fascinating for me because you've seen this topic of conversation kind of go crazy over the past five years, but you were working right in the grains of ADHD when people were not wanting to talk about it or being dismissive.

And can you tell me a little bit about what started your interest in adhd?

Yeah.

So when I came out of grad school in the late 90s, like most people, I was trying to find my place in the world.

What am I doing here?

And the truth of it is I sort of stumbled into adult adhd, and at that time there was Nobody focused on adult adhd.

I mean, maybe some were focused on kids, but hardly anyone was talking about adults, by which I mean mostly men, but.

But eventually we figured out, like, whoa, women and girls also have adhd.

Crazy.

But I don't know, it was just this kind of mission to sort of increase awareness about adhd, not only among the public, but really among the clinicians out there that they were just sort of.

They're just missing it.

Like they weren't looking for it.

And, you know, you can't find what you don't look for.

So people were being treated, but not for the right thing.

Sort of treated for the anxiety and depression, but not the ADHD itself.

That's like driving the anxiety and depression.

I don't know.

Like, it's sort of been a mission for all these years to just like increase awareness about ADHD and all the ways that it can impact somebody's life.

Yeah.

And so does it impact your life from a personal perspective in your family?

Where does ADHD show up?

You know, it's one of those funny things that I just sort of, like I said, I sort of stumbled into it.

But since then, you know, looking back at all the stages of my life in terms of the friends I had and stuff, I would bet $1 million that there are certain people in my past who absolutely had adhd.

And then I connected with some high school friends and like, two of them acknowledged that they had adhd.

You know, like, now they know kind of thing.

I'm like, oh, that's why you guys were always late when we got together.

Right.

So there's definitely a resonance there.

Like, I'm attracted to that ADHD energy.

There's definitely some ADHD in my family as well.

So, yeah, it's not entirely accidental that this is the corner of the world I found myself in.

Yeah, I always think there has to be a personal interest, whether it is ourselves or we're helping someone in our family, because it is such a nuanced, complex, multi layered condition.

You know, it's fair to say that ADHD touches every single part of our life.

And, you know, I love how this conversation is going to go.

Maybe we'll talk about relationships, but also the productivity and work and academia and friendships, you know, with RSD and, you know, our relationships in that respect, it literally, there's not a part in our life where ADHD doesn't have a touch point.

And that's why people find it so challenging and so debilitating.

When we don't understand it, we don't know about it.

We've lived undiagnosed.

There's so much grief around, you know, especially when you're talking about people finding out much later on in life how impactful a condition can be in so many different ways.

And I love that you have, you know, a huge grounding in relationships and sex therapy.

But also talk about productivity.

Maybe we can talk about the relationship side and why that has been such a meaningful part of your career, I guess.

And maybe you can explain how you see ADHD show up in relationships.

This was another sort of one of those places where there wasn't enough, like, the information wasn't traveling.

So you had your couples therapy people over here, and they were doing couples therapy, and you had your ADHD people over here, and they were seeing individuals with adhd, but there wasn't enough sort of blending between them of how does ADHD affect your relationship?

Because it absolutely does.

And, you know, if it's harder to do the things that you need to do, harder to do the things you intend to do, as frustrating as that is for you as an adult in the world, it also affects your partner.

Right.

Because, like, if we are a team, we have a certain amount of things that need to be done right.

We need to go to the grocery store, we need to do laundry, we need to pay bills, we need to make sure the kids survive the day and hopefully brush their teeth at the end and all the million other things that need to happen.

And if one person isn't able to do do what they intend to do, obviously it begins to fall to the other person.

And every relationship has this tug of war, you know, about, like, what are we doing?

And that's more important.

No, this is.

I prefer it this way.

But this especially untreated ADHD part can really, really imbalance the relationship.

And like anything that imbalances relationship, once it goes far enough, we're bringing our worse and worse coping skills to it, and then it becomes its own kind of thorny mess that the couple has to deal with.

So on the one hand, it can really make things harder for both people, and neither one of them knows how to get out of it.

On the other hand, and this is what I think is so kind of great about being involved in this area, is once you understand the adhd, it gives you so many more options for how to deal with it and how to create a better life for both partners.

Yeah, I think that's so important, isn't it?

Is that the not knowing and then the knowing and then feeling Empowered.

And couples, I guess, making a choice say they're at that crux point of their relationship and then they find out, you know, it's ADHD and this is what we've been dealing with.

Then they're at that kind of point where like, okay, we can, we can now make informed decisions or we can, you know, the person with ADHD can go and get coaching and help and the person without ADHD can also get help to support them.

And this responsibility that people can take.

I'm interested to know, what do you see in relationships, I guess when you're going through this therapy and they have that understanding, what's that turning point?

Do you notice in a relationship where we expose the ADHD and we see it for what it is and you know, it's not there as an excuse, but it's an explanation, I guess.

Yeah.

And it is indeed an explanation.

And here's the difference.

Excuses depend on the other person being willing to excuse.

Right?

Meaning, okay, fine, you're late all the time.

Just show up when you can.

Oh, you forgot to get milk.

Okay, I'll run out and get the milk instead.

And that's fine as long as it's fine.

Except of course, the problem is at some point it isn't fine.

Right?

Life is too complicated.

I've got too much going on.

But it's a great explanation.

And an explanation tells you what's happening and therefore what you can do about it.

And any relationship is a two person job.

So it's not just, oh, you have adhd, well, you know, you go and deal with that and let me know how it works out, as if you're like going to get a haircut or something.

But rather both partners have a part to play to do things differently.

Obviously, the person with ADHD has to do their thing, but the non ADHD partner also has things they can do.

And I really kind of emphasize that because if you frame the problem as this is all you, you have to do the things differently, then it means I have nothing to do.

Right.

And I better just cross my fingers and hope that you then do all those better things versus no, there are like how I approach you has an effect on what happens, right?

I can do things in different ways that make them more likely to get what I want.

So that's actually a very empowering position to take.

So I think both partners need to understand the impact that ADHD is having on the relationship and on how each of them respond and how that influences what the other person then does next.

And on and on and on.

Yeah, it's all information is power, isn't it?

It's just really utilizing what we know and how to help people and then moving forward.

Because we know in relationships, resentment is huge breeding ground for separation or divorce.

And the resentment I've seen in different relationships, I know where there's ADHD that can be the final straw until the person, maybe who hasn't got ADHD starts empowering the person with adhd.

But the person with ADHD also takes that responsibility and says, you know what?

You didn't need to be scaffolding everything all the time now.

And, you know, the little things like, okay, I know I've got adhd and my memory, my working memory is a challenge.

Instead of saying, right, well, that's just not my.

That's not my thing.

I can't remember to pick the kids up.

I can't remember, you know, to put the bins out or all of that, it's that person then saying, right, I'm going to find ways, you know, apps and tools and reminders and all of that.

And that is when I get really excited because it's adhd.

Awareness is so, so vital because the chaos that people within undiagnosed families, the sadness, the grief, the impact of broken families that has on generations when all we needed to know was, okay, we've got different kind of neurological neurodevelopment makeups here, and this is how we can work.

And I guess the.

The combination of what you do with relationships and moving into the productivity, what makes you kind of almost be part of those two worlds and how do you see them coming together to help create more cohesion, I guess, and collaboration between people.

Yeah.

We could almost say in a couple, my productivity is your productivity in the sense that, again, there's a certain amount of stuff that just needs to be done now.

Okay, fine.

We can debate about certain things, like, do we have to make the bed?

And how often do we need to vacuum anyway?

But.

But still, like, you know, what one does affects the other and vice versa.

So, you know, so the goal of being more productive, and we sort of touched on this.

I think we both feel the same way about these sort of annoying hacks.

Right?

Like these simple solutions that are going to revolutionize your life.

Spoiler alert.

They won't.

They don't.

Like, if it's as simple as a hack.

Like, come on, man, you're not that simple.

Right.

And your life isn't that simple.

So the whole point of productivity is doing the things that are going to help you be more effective in a general sense, are going to make you a better partner and give both of you a bit more breathing room in your life.

Right?

So it's not just productivity for the sake of productivity, but rather it's productivity in order to live a better life, whatever it is that, that means we have more time together.

We, we each have more time for individual pursuits.

We each have more time to, I don't know, get more sleep, maybe go to the gym, maybe bit more time preparing healthy foods rather than grabbing unhealthy stuff.

So when I was writing the ADHD productivity manual, I kept coming back to this idea that if you're not managing your ADHD well, too much of your productivity challenges are about avoiding problems.

Right?

I didn't do that thing.

And now someone's mad, which is, I mean, it's a terrible motivator, right?

Avoiding negatives is a terrible way to go through life as opposed to being more productive, you know, with the right things actually adds more positives.

Right.

For you as an individual and for the two of you as a couple.

And that, that I think is much more motivating.

Right.

This is why it's worth investing the effort to get on top of your ADHD or as the spouse to learn about your partner's adhd and, you know, vice versa.

We all got our things so that you can pursue the things that are actually more interesting and meaningful and important.

And that, that is part of the conversation.

Right?

What are we doing here?

Right.

What are we working towards?

What do we want more of?

Yeah, I love that you said that because I've just written down, it's essentially about having a more meaningful, fulfilled life.

You know what you're saying?

Yeah.

You're breaking it down and you're doing the steps and it's like, how can it be more helpful?

How can we be more productive?

But essentially this is all about meaning, you know, having more time to do the things that are important to myself, to my family, thriving and living a better life.

Because we do know, you know, anecdotally and from research that people with ADHD maybe who have lived undiagnosed for a long time, they have a poorer quality of life.

And there's something like seven or eight years difference between longevity and we know that there's more chronic health conditions, mental health problems, unfortunately, suicide, like this is a much bigger conversation.

And then what you're bringing down is like, okay, how can we make the day to day sustainable?

How can we make the day to day Easier, you know, just like easier, I would say.

Yeah.

And that's absolutely it in that, you know, when it comes to things like exercise and eating better, I think the least convincing sales pitch is.

So, yeah, if you do this hard thing, most days for three to six months, then you might see some change in your weight and how you look, which is a terrible sales pitch.

Right.

Like, nobody does well with vague, far off benefits, but especially people with adhd.

So the reason to do these things that we're talking about is that today or tomorrow I will have a better day, I will feel better, I will get more done, I will be more fun to hang out with.

Right?

Like that's the reason to go to the gym, that's the reason to eat a bit healthier, to get into bed earlier.

Right.

So that right now, in a much more immediate way, I will have a better day.

And you know, lo and behold, you stack up enough of those days and you know, if you are looking to get into better shape or to, I don't know, bring down certain blood work numbers, so cholesterol or whatever.

Right.

Like that will probably also follow.

But you know, it's not going to motivate you today, right now if you don't feel like going to the gym.

Yeah, it's.

It's funny I always say that adhd, it's so many contradictions.

And like you said just before, we're not, this is not simple.

We're not simple beings.

And our life and our brains and our makeup and our nervous system and our energy and our moods, like everything is constantly being recalculated and everything's different on different days, especially with women with our hormones.

And we know that our hormones are so, you know, intersected.

And I'm writing down as I listen you, the things that really, really help us are sleep, nutrition, movement.

I would say things like mindfulness and calm and decompression and just time out.

And the things that work for us are things like consistency, structure, a kind of a flexible routine where we feel like we've got autonomy, but there's some structure and boundaries there for us.

But what would you use instead?

If people don't want to be like, we are busy already, we've got lots of plates, we're spinning.

What would the word be if we want to bring in some of the tools and interventions that you talk about just to help make life easier and calmer?

I guess.

I mean, I think it comes down to choice really, in the sense of, you know, in terms of the hyper curiosity and Everything that takes effort to resist the pull of distractions and random thoughts and to make ourselves focus on the thing that's more important to focus on.

Right.

That is an effortful process.

And it's even more effortful when you have adhd.

That's not being well managed.

Right.

And one of the ways of thinking about ADHD is that you have a more direct connection to the world around you.

Like, the things around you slip into your attention, sort of hijack your attention more easily.

And.

And it takes more effort to say, no, I'm not going to look into why the Celts, you know, something blah, blah, blah.

And, you know, 1300.

So it's not that it isn't interesting, because it is.

I mean, that's the problem, but it's also.

This is not the thing I should be doing right now.

So it's like, push it away, okay?

And then there's this.

Push it away.

And there's a.

What's that sound over there?

Okay, push it away.

That's not what I'm doing.

And it is more exhausting.

Like, at the end of the day, you have emptied your tank.

So when I talk about choice, it's about managing your life in a way that gives you a bit more choice along the way.

But also at the end of the day, right?

In that if you want to just like go down random rabbit holes that you have the space in your day to do it, or you just want to veg out and watch stupid tv, that's silly and ridiculous.

Like that you can, because you have that space or to just go for a walk or whatever the thing is.

But to have that extra time in your day, to have that extra mental energy in your day does mean, I don't know, like, you got to pay the piper at some point, right?

So being intentional about how you set up your day, having the routines that work well for you, right.

Not so rigid that they feel constraining, but not so loose that you wander off of them too easily.

You know, when you are trying to focus, getting rid of the distractions that pull at you in the wrong kind of ways.

Or an unhelpful.

I won't say wrong, I'll say unhelpful ways, right?

So being intentional about how you set things up so that you have a little bit extra for yourself at some points along the way.

Yeah, I love that.

Intentional and choice.

Because again, going back to like, this sense of autonomy that we like to have, that we do like to create that structure of how our, you know, our life is.

And maybe without the awareness, we've created a structure that hadn't worked for us or didn't work for us.

And now it's like, okay, now that we have the understanding and the awareness.

And I hope, you know, so many people listening to this podcast continually say that it's helped them because they didn't understand any of this before.

And I get messages all the time saying, I've just binged your podcast, and now I understand so many different threads of my life.

I understand, like, different people in my life.

I understand my behavior, my emotions.

And, you know, even just that, that epiphany moment of saying, like, what's this RSD that people are talking about?

Oh, my God, like, I didn't know that was a thing.

And so then it is.

It's the intentionality changes of, okay, how can I make different choices?

And I do think it is a bit of a lifelong game here, you know, whether however old we are when we find out about our ADHD is a daily thing that we have to step into.

This is your fifth book.

Am I right?

Are you constantly learning about adhd?

I mean, I am, right, because there continues to be new things, but it's also like we've been saying, just understanding how certain pieces fit together or, you know, listening to a podcast or reading an article or seeing a presenter and just sort of in the angle that they put on something or the way they tie some things together or the perspective they bring, there are those little epiphany moments where you're like, oh, right, okay.

Yeah, that.

Yep, that makes sense.

That's kind of cool.

So, yeah, I mean, absolutely.

This is, you know, like, we've been saying there's a lot to learn here, and I think initially, it can feel overwhelming, but I think, you know, and it is.

And that's fine.

It's okay to be overwhelmed, but just, you know, have faith in yourself.

Have faith in the process that as you continue to expose yourself to it, it will begin to fall into place and you'll begin to understand it, and you'll land on something that feels a bit more kind of sustainable and useful.

Yeah, I think so.

I think many of us, once we've done this information gathering, and I'll speak for myself, I was very overwhelmed when I.

You know, it's been nearly.

I don't know, over five years since I was diagnosed.

I felt very overwhelmed by, even then, the amount of information that was out there.

It was more the Facebook groups that I found.

There was a few books that I got Obviously articles.

But I did still feel like there wasn't enough out there, hence the reason why I started this podcast.

And I felt overwhelmed by the negativity, the noise of.

In the Facebook groups of this despair and this sadness and grief and anger and reading such negative experiences from people, I found that very, very overwhelming.

And I had to take a step back from that.

And I've realized who I speak to.

Everyone does their ADHD a little bit differently now that they have their awareness.

There's crossovers and we all kind of get.

Yeah, that really works for me.

And I always hear the same things many times from women that a dog walk of time in nature, decompression time, you know, doing something creative or having.

Doing something meaningful or that kind of thing.

There's a lot of commonality there.

But we do have to find, even in our relationships, we have to carve out what works individually for us because, you know, our neurodivergence presents so differently.

And especially now that I guess you're seeing people, couples coming in and there's a crossover with autism and adhd.

And maybe.

Were you aware of that when you first started out, maybe in your couples therapy?

Yeah.

No, I mean that again, speaking about how the field is evolving, there used to be these two silos, right?

There was this ADHD camp and there was the autism camp, and everybody did their own thing.

And now we're like, oh, wait a second.

There's this overlap within couples where you have one partner with ADHD and the other one with autism.

And on the one hand you'd be like, yeah, I could see how that would fit together.

And of course, now there's the whole Audi hd, right?

That now we recognize that one can have both.

And as much as it seems like they are a contradiction, but they're not entirely.

So.

So, yeah, I mean, it's just.

It's kind of more complexity, but that's okay, right?

It just means you need to spend a bit longer figuring out how all these pieces fit together and figure out what you're going to do with it.

And I think that, like, that is very much sort of a stage of life thing, right.

If you're a single adult, your life looks one kind of a way.

Once you're coupled up and then you're living together, life looks different.

And then if you have a, you know, a young child or two, right?

Young, young kids, that's different.

And then they get a bit older and then that's different.

And then teenagers and then empty nest and like different stages of Life, we need different things.

And so where you are in your journey depends on that as well.

And I think it's sometimes helpful, especially during really tough times.

So I'm thinking about like my couples who have young, young kids and they're just getting beaten to death every night, you know, that just, you know, to just keep in mind, like this is not forever, right?

There will come a different time and I will have different situations and perhaps the next part will be a little bit easier than where I'm at right now.

Yeah, I have heard about couples who one is had that awareness kind of situation and they've gone down the diagnosis and they've had a partner who isn't wanting to be part of that journey or they don't believe in it, or they think it's a label or they, they don't want to be brought into this kind of like stigma or whatever.

You know, they think and there's a bit of a head splitting of one partner wanting to do the growth and the evolution and the other partner.

And again, sometimes we see like you say about the ADHD and the autism coming together, that one partner is just refusing to see their neurodivergence.

And we do see this a lot more now.

We're understanding that we are attracted to each other in many ways and sometimes it shows up differently.

But it's quite often that neurodivergent people come together and they get married and they don't realize they're neurodivergent, but it shows up differently.

What would you say?

Because I have this a lot with people in my community that say to me, well, I'm doing this journey, but my husband's not interested or my wife's not interested and I really want to kind of bring them in and get them know, part of this.

And we, or I'm getting my kids diagnosed, but my partner doesn't want to be part of, you know, this.

Have you got any advice for people who find themselves in that situation?

Yeah, my first advice is ask a bunch of questions.

What is your hesitation about this?

What is it about this that you don't want to engage?

Like, what are you concerned about here?

Or what part of this just doesn't stop it?

Well, so, you know, you ask some questions and it might be, don't take the first answer where they're like, I don't know, it just everybody is getting diagnosed, I don't know, whatever, right.

Some sort of, don't sort of say like, okay, great, good conversation.

But you know, kind of dig in A little bit more.

Like, what's your concern about that?

Like, I'm really, I'm trying to understand this.

Like, where are you coming from?

And I think often when we get stuck in an argument with our partner, it's because we're both making our points.

We're not really listening to the other person and knowing how to respond.

So we're talking past each other.

So find out, like, where is your partner with this?

What is it that they're concerned about?

I think then maybe you can pivot and say, so for me, this is what has been helpful about this.

Like, this is how it has affected me, which does not mean it has to affect you the same way.

Right.

I'm not mandating you also feel this, but I'm just telling you, like, for me, this is how it's been helpful.

And then maybe the third part is, and I think perhaps this is how it could be helpful for you, right?

That if you do a bit of research on my ADHD or kids ADHD or whatever, I think this is how it could benefit you.

Right.

So in other words, fewer times where you feel frustrated that I'm not doing what you hoped I would do, whatever it is, right?

Make your sales pitch based on what is going to appeal to them or maybe even ask them, if things are better between us, how would they be?

What would be better?

And then you find a way to somehow connect that back to, here's how you could learn more about adhd.

And that would be helpful, except when it isn't.

Some things, it's just not actually about adhd.

So don't stretch it to make it feel fit, but you know, to see it as not a one conversation thing, but maybe across a few conversations.

It's a process.

Yeah, it is a process.

And I think, you know, therapy is so helpful.

It's, it's so helpful for so many people.

But when you don't know about the adhd, then it's, it's really hard because you go round and round in circles and it's kind of like, why don't you get this?

Or why do you fly off the handle all the time?

Why are you so irritable or impatient or I don't know what mood I'm gonna get.

All the different things that we can now understand correlate to emotional regulation with ADHD and RSD and all, lots of different ways.

So would you say to people how important it is to find a neuroaffirming or ADHD affirming couples therapist?

Because I feel like, can it be more damaging if you're not, if you're not seeing someone who doesn't understand this condition?

I mean, absolutely can be.

And you know, with only good intentions on the part of the couple's therapist.

But they're gonna, you know, they're gonna wind up in the same ditches that you do.

You're gonna have the same problems that you can't solve, and you keep getting stuck and everybody's unhappy.

And that is not just sort of frustrating, like, we're not making progress here, but it can also, it can kind of reinforce this idea of like, wow, I'm really screwed up, because even this couple's therapist can't help me or can't help us.

Right.

So it can really, it can be kind of demoralizing about oneself or one's partner or the relationship.

And I mean, the thing about it is an ADHD affirming couples therapist or individual therapist doesn't say, oh, you have adhd.

Well, you don't.

You shouldn't have to be on time or remember to do things like, that's not how it works.

It doesn't mean you're off the hook.

What it means is they understand better the dynamics in the individual and in the couple, and from that are better able to work with it in a way that both partners can come to a happier place.

Because if only one partner is happy with the situation, it's not going to last.

Right.

Somebody unhappy is inherently going to push things in a different direction.

So even if you're in the doghouse and you're like, okay, I'll work really hard at this, that only lasts a little while and then you're back to the same problem.

So, you know, so it's a good therapist who understands ADHD or whatever you got going on is going to be better able to help the two of you come to something that you can both be good with.

Yeah, I think it's like, it's that compassion thing, isn't it?

Moving from resentment to an understanding to, you know, the person taking accountability.

Both of you working together and then having more compassion.

But maybe a sense of humor or like so many different ways.

Like I, I feel so sad when I look back and I see people that have split up or heard about people whose marriages just couldn't continue because it was just, just.

It was like you're working on a different playing field and how are you meant to make a ma?

You know, marriage is hard work at the best of times, but when you don't know about adhd, you're working to a different language.

And that is why I think it's so important that people, you know, don't give up and try and find that ADHD affirming therapist that can help them.

And, and then if they have it, if it doesn't help, then, then, you know, okay, it's best to, you know, to, to finish things.

But at least if we.

There's a new language being spoken, it gives people an opportunity to move forward.

And, you know, all the things that we've spoken about today with regards to either productivity or understanding or breaking it down and making life just easier, moving from that effortful to finding ways that it can just feel a little bit more meaningful or where we have fulfillment in areas that we didn't previously have that fulfillment.

Who did you write your book for?

This book that you've just brought out recently.

You know, if you had an avatar of a person, who, who would it be that you wrote that book for?

It's really for folks who are, let's say, 30s, 40s, 50s, and you know, maybe they're new to the diagnosis, but maybe they're not.

I mean, there's definitely enough depth there that it's not like I've seen this all before.

So.

So it's not sort of an ADHD 101 kind of a book.

But it's for anyone who just wants to get more done, right?

They want to be more on top of the things in their life so that they have more breathing room for the other things in their life that matter more, right?

The other good stuff that they're not getting to.

And I cover.

So it's got 36 chapters.

I cover all sorts of different things.

You know, everything from the obvious stuff of like, skills, schedules and to do lists and alarms.

But beyond just, you should have one.

But in, you know, what makes it so complicated to use one.

The bad feelings that come up when you see your to do list exploding and you're not getting things done off of it.

And you know, how to think about getting rid of stuff off of your to do list.

So getting into things like that, the environment that you work in, you know, sleep, diet and exercise.

I get into, you know, kind of mindset stuff of like, what do you do when you feel overwhelmed or when the task is ambiguous, where you're like, I need to do this, but I don't know exactly what I'm supposed to do.

I get into kind of what's procrastivity.

So kind of like doing easy things like scrolling through your inbox rather than working on that big hard report that you need to get done.

And, you know, like, I cover all sorts of different areas because it's not just one thing.

Right.

As we said before, there's no simple hack.

It's not like, oh, I started, I could put a brown noise app on my phone, and now all my problems are solved and I'm taller also.

Right.

So really getting into all the different areas so readers can sort of jump to the parts that seem most relevant for them at this point in their life.

Yeah, I really like that.

Just remind me the title so people can go and look it up.

Yeah, so it's the ADHD Productivity manual.

So easy.

Yeah, I'll put that in the show notes and people can find it.

And I think it sounds like a really, really helpful tool.

And listen, you know, like you say we can take what we want out of it and there's going to be certain things.

But what you just said then about the procast procrastivity, that kind of hit me quite hard because I, I do that for sure.

Yeah.

I mean, we all do.

I mean, that's the thing, you know, like, I, I could do like a find and replace and just delete ADHD out of the.

The whole manuscript.

And I mean, most of it is stuff that almost anybody could benefit from, but when you have adhd, it's just that much more important.

So, yeah, I mean, there's a lot in there.

You know, like we said in the beginning, I've been doing this for more than 25 years.

I've seen more than 40,000 client hours.

So, like, all of that has been kind of poured into this.

And, and also I think it is a book that is much more fun than you would think it is for a productivity book.

And that is very intentional.

I want it to be fun.

I want you to feel like, yeah, there's good ideas here, but also no pressure and that we can sort of, we can laugh at our sort of common struggles and that kind of.

We're all in this together.

So I think that is also really important.

So you don't feel like, you know, great, I'm failing at life.

I'm also failing at adhd, and I'm failing at this book too.

You know what I mean?

So it's okay to struggle and it's okay to get knocked down, and then you just get back up and let's see what we can do here.

Yeah, I love that.

Thank you so much.

And do you see clients anymore or you still working one to one with clients.

Yeah.

How can people find you?

So I've got a couple ways.

One, so my books and presenting website is Adult ADHD book dot com.

That's really probably the best to sort of get information about me.

But no, I still see people all day.

I mean, that's really actually what I do in real life when I'm not hanging out with fun people like you and talking some shop and then, you know, conferences and other fun things.

So it's all good stuff, right?

We got good things going on in this corner of the world.

It is.

It's fun and it's fascinating and I just want to say thank you so much for being here, Ari, and I'll put all the information information in the show notes and hopefully we'll speak again very soon.

Yeah, absolutely.

This is great.

If this episode has been helpful for you and you're looking for more tools and more guidance, my brand new book, the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Toolkit is out now.

You can find it wherever you buy your books from.

You can also check out the audiobook if you do prefer to listen to me.

I have narrated it all myself.

Thank you so much for being here and I will see you for the next episode.