Welcome to the VP Life Podcast, the show

where we bring you actionable health

advice from leading minds.

I'm your host, Rob.

My guest today is Garret Saltpeter, an

engineer, neuroscientist,

and the founder of Newford.

Garret is best known as the inventor of

the newbie, an FDA-cleared device

designed to improve movement, recovery,

pain, and performance by directly

targeting the nervous system.

During today's conversation, expect to

learn how dysfunctional nervous system

signaling drives pain, weakness, and

movement dysfunction,

why direct current stimulation works

fundamentally differently to traditional

TENS and other AC-based devices, and how

the Newford method, mapping, resetting,

and retraining the nervous system, is

used in rehab, elite sport, and

neurological conditions.

And now, on to the

conversation with Garret Saltpeter.

So to everyone listening, well, hello.

This is the first of the VP Life Podcast,

as we've got two guests on today.

Garret Saltpeter, the owner of Newford

and the inventor of the newbie, which

we'll be getting into shortly.

We're also joined by a return guest and

now a newbie practitioner, Harry Warro.

I'll try and say that three times faster,

who's going to be my meringue and going

into today's episode.

Before we dig into everything newford

though, and newbie, I reckon intros are a

great place to start.

Garret, we have time aplenty, so would

you mind running us through your

backstory and how you went from being, I

think, an electrical

engineer for not much mistaken,

and well, then into this whole field of

neuroscience and then into the inventor

of what is arguably not to bust you up

completely, one of the greatest tools in

physical and neurological rehabilitation

currently on market.

Well, thank you for that.

So I feel very fortunate to have found a

way to sort of combine all of my

interests and passion

and academic background.

As you mentioned, I do have some academic

background in engineering, master's

degree in engineering.

I also was a physics major in college.

I did additional graduate school in

neuroscience as I got more and more

interested in this field.

And there was a really interesting

catalyst for me, which

was an experience I had.

I also was an athlete.

I got really passionate like Harry about

fitness and athletic performance.

And for me, it was really as a vehicle to

try to be the best athlete I could be.

So for me, my sport was ice hockey and I

had injuries along the way as well.

And I had a lot of experiences with

traditional physical therapy, traditional

orthopedic medicine.

And it was very disappointing,

disenfranchising, dare

I even say dehumanizing.

I mean, it was really, it's just, you

know, they were telling me to rely on

this brace, this anti-inflammatory, just

sort of masking the symptoms or working

around, not really getting at anything

close to what I perceived to be the root

cause of why the injury happened in the

first place or why it was taking so long

to recover or any of that sort of thing.

And I didn't have the, didn't have the

words for it at the time, but I just felt

that, you know, at one point I thought

about going pre-med and based on those

experiences, I just, I

just knew that wasn't for me.

And then I had this experience where I

was, I was playing

hockey, had a torn ligament.

I was told I was going

to need to have surgery.

And I met a doctor who was doing

functional neurology.

And this was my first real exposure to

the importance of the nervous system, the

role of the nervous system in healing,

and also my first

exposure to direct current.

So it was like an older analog device

with a bunch of dials at the time, more

like a microcurrent type of thing.

But I, I went through treatments focused

on the neurological response to injury

and using older

versions of direct current.

And that literally

helped me heal my ligaments,

avoid surgery.

And I was relieved.

I was excited as a hockey player to be

back out there sooner, but as a

pre-engineering student, as someone who

was really looking at this scientifically

from first principles, I was just, just,

you know, it's like it's

mind blowing eureka moment.

And going through that, I really felt a

calling within me to share this work.

It just resonated with me at such a deep

level that I felt this calling to share

that work with as many people as I could.

And that, that really sent me on this

journey, which led me to initially open a

clinic and, you know, get, get the 10,000

hours of work over seven or eight years

using older versions of electrical

stimulation technology, do the additional

work in neuroscience, you know,

academically, education wise.

And then I finally got to the point

where, you know, about seven or eight

years into that journey, where I was sort

of waiting for someone else to come out

with something that would, you know, I

could use it to maybe open more clinics

and just, you know, keep

doing this type of work.

I finally got to the point where I was

like, you know what, I just, I just feel

like I have to do it myself.

I didn't did not set out initially to,

you know, start a medical device business

or develop a product.

But it, it just felt like, you know, sort

of the necessary next

right step along the way.

And now that's been another seven or

eight years that we've

had the product out now.

And it's been, you know, really wonderful

to see it grow in the US.

And then now in, in the UK and other

regions of the world.

Yeah, no, it's

definitely picking up steam.

I think I initially first heard about you

on Ben Greenfield's podcast years back.

And I've just been, yeah, my medical

history side, that's a story for another

day, I've been sort of

itching to get on one for years.

And then, but anyway, yeah, your, your

background as a

engineer, I find fascinating.

I'm sure you're familiar with Dr.

Thomas Seager, the guy who invented,

well, he's, I suppose the guy who

invented the, the ice bath release,

initially commercialized that he owns a

company called Morosco Forge.

He's an engineer too.

And it's just fascinating to see how many

engineers are sort of finding their way,

whether they have a sort of a formal

background in biology

or not into this field.

It's like you said, it's this first

principles way of thinking, which I just

think really lends engineers to being

able to successfully, yeah, support what

is happening in this sort of, in this

world of functional

medicine, just very broadly speaking.

The physics is amazing too.

I must admit, I'm way

too dumb to study physics.

I did biochemistry,

neurophysiology, and that was it.

That was enough for me.

But anyway, right.

That counts.

Don't worry.

That definitely counts.

All right, sweet.

Okay, right.

Before we dive into it, I reckon we might

as well get an intro for Harry too.

Harry's a biomechanic specialist.

For those in audience who maybe are not

familiar with him, we did an episode a

few months back, which

we'll link to in the show notes.

It was a great intro to Harry's world

and, and how one can look into physical

rehabilitation from maybe a more of an

alternative viewpoint, just sort of

bypassing the standard physio sort of

approach that we're all indoctrinated

into believing is the one-stop shop.

But yeah, Harry, a quick intro from you

would be amazing, mate.

Just who you are, what

you do, all that good stuff.

Yeah, happy to.

So I like you two

really, really clever people.

I don't believe I'm as intelligent, but I

do believe myself as an engineer, but

more of from a body point of view.

So we're looking at moving the body.

What's that?

A squishy top, squishy engineer.

Yeah, exactly.

So looking at the human body as a

structure and trying to optimize how to

build it up again, if there is a

dysfunction or an injury, and looking

more at the body as one and treating it

as a unit rather than,

you know, in isolation.

You know, so what I do, I look at the

body as a structure and see where there

may be a dysfunction and how that is

affecting how the body moves through, you

know, the gait cycle, which is

essentially just, you know, walking.

And, and yeah, I'm definitely bringing

more from outside the box ideas in terms

of movements and how maybe sometimes a

lot of people come to me and they find

that the standard approach of, of

treatment is not working

as well as they'd like to.

And then they come to me and they find

that, you know, I'm looking at the body

from more of a systemic point of view.

So not just the muscular system, but how,

you know, how the cardiovascular system,

the respiratory system is actually

involved in lots of the processes of, you

know, of movement and how

that can affect posture.

And of course, if posture affects

function, function

can affect performance.

So I look at, I look at the body from a

whole, you know, a whole view rather than

just one holistic area.

Yeah.

And, but yeah, at the same time, I'm

extremely passionate

about helping people.

And there's not one fit,

you know, fits all in a way.

Once does fits all, it's very much

dealing with, you know, person at a time,

because we know, as you know, go, you

know, you're dealing with a human and

they come with emotions.

They come with different kinds of

traumatic experiences.

Maybe the injury wasn't

just football or ice hockey.

It might have been just falling over in

the house, you know.

So there's a lot of things that we need

to take into account when,

when looking at injuries.

Very excited to, of course, come at my

approach of more of a software approach

now, which of course we're going to speak

about today, which is exciting.

But, you know, dealing with the software

now, as well as the hardware approach is

going to probably give my, my future

clients and clients right now, you know,

some really, really great

progress and great results.

Perfect.

Thank you very much.

Thanks for that, gentlemen.

Before we get into the newbie, I think it

would be great if we could lay a basic

foundation of knowledge, as I know this

conversation might

get a little technical.

Hopefully we can keep it as high level as

possible, but I reckon you're

the guide to R-Scare, Garak.

So would you mind giving us a quick sort

of, I suppose, one-on-one in sort of

nervous system physiology, how the

nervous system operates and functions?

And yeah, and then we

can take it from there.

I think that's a great place to start.

And also, you know, circling back, you

both have mentioned,

you know, engineering.

Harry, I like you describing yourself as

an engineer of the body.

You know, I think

engineering really is problem solving.

It started with how do we get water from

up here to down there, right?

Build an aqueduct, build this pathway.

How do we, how do we solve problems given

certain constraints?

And so you have to understand what the

constraints are, what the system is or

the context is in which you're working.

And the nervous system is a big part of

the context of a human being.

You know, like Harry said, human beings

have emotions and they respond to

different stimuli in different ways.

And that response to stimulus happens

within the nervous system.

And I think the first point as we jump

off into this topic to understand is that

when we're talking about pain and injury,

like I talked about how

I had a torn ligament,

you know, people listening to this may

have experiences with sprained ankles or

herniated discs or rotator cuff injuries,

like these issues that are structural,

that are, you know, quote unquote

hardware of the body.

And I think one of the big breakthroughs

and the reason we're talking about the

nervous system, just to really establish

the high level, the reason we're talking

about the nervous system is that so much

of the reason why it takes a long time to

recover or why people get locked in a

cycle of chronic pain, even after the

injury has healed or why we can't do the

things that we wish to do, oftentimes the

issue is in the software, in the nervous

system, in the underlying system that's

sending the signals to the muscles that

influences the overall healing process

and the ability of the body to deliver

nutrients to an

injured area to help it heal.

So there's that sort of that relationship

in that context, I

think, is worth understanding.

And then, you know, overall, when we talk

about the nervous system, it's probably

worth defining what we mean by that.

So, you know, I think collectively we can

talk about the brain and the spinal cord,

which would be classically considered the

central nervous system, and then the

nerves that leave the spinal cord and go

out to the visceral organs, to the arms,

to the legs, you know, that would be

called the peripheral

nervous system, but all of that.

And it's an electrical signal, really an

electrochemical system that monitors

everything going on in the internal and

external environment and then creates

actions and responses based on that.

So it really is the

control system of the body.

And I like that hardware and software

distinction where, you know, I think

everyone knows the hardware, right?

Our bones, muscles, tendons, ligaments,

the connective tissues,

then our organs, right?

The liver, stomach, intestines, heart,

lungs, those are all the hardware.

And then the software is what controls

it, just the same as if you have your

computer, you know, your computer has a

screen, it has a processor, it has

memory, and then the software is what

actually sends the electrons in there and

calls from memory certain things into the

processor and creates images on the

screen and all that.

So the software, the operating system of

the computer is what makes it run.

You could have the hardware sitting

there, but without an operating system,

it's just going to be, you know, a piece

of metal sitting there.

Well, just like us, if we don't have our

operating system, our nervous system,

we're just going to be a, you know, a

piece of flesh, a puddle of flesh on the

floor sitting there.

So it's really the

operating system there.

And it's so relevant for how we heal, how

we recover, how we move.

It controls our organs.

So it's relevant for, you know, our heart

rate and respiration, which Harry was

talking about already, relevant to how we

digest food and eliminate waste, you

know, controls reproductive function, the

release of hormones, our stress response.

I think everyone listening to this likely

knows how, you know, chronic disease, you

know, so much of the issues, the health

issues that we have as a society are

really influenced by excessive amounts of

stress, chronic stress, and

poor ability to handle stress.

So it's all neurological, really.

Yeah, it is indeed.

And I just love the fact

that you bore up stress.

I mean, it's not a sexy

subject to talk about.

But ultimately,

it is, I mean, beyond the basic, what you

shovered on your throat is arguably one

of the biggest sort of driving factors of

what is driving sort of chronic disease.

I mean, I've sort of been in this

functional medicine space

for a number of years now.

And you work with practitioners and

everyone sort of got their,

fundamentally has their approach.

Some will go gut first, have a very gut

centric approach, as I'm sure you know,

others will start to sort of do a lot of

testing and look at hormones first, etc.

But ultimately,

it all comes back down to the

bioenergetics of the cell.

And that is fundamentally governed by the

nervous system at the end of the day.

Garrett, thank you.

That was a great answer.

Before we carry on, would you mind also

just sort of breaking down the

differences between the parasympathetic

and the sympathetic nervous system, those

being the two major branches of course.

Again, I just think for the listeners,

having a fairly sort of decent grasp of

that will allow them to sort of

understand some of the terminology and

concepts that we'll be

talking about in a minute.

Absolutely.

And you mentioned the

Roscoe Forge cold plunge.

And that's a good

context to look at this.

Because when someone is using that and

steps into that cold water, you know,

it's around 32 Fahrenheit or around zero

Celsius, you know, it's really literally

right around freezing, there's going to

be some ice floating in

that it's really cold.

And in response to that, the second that

our skin sensors, the nervous system

receptors perceive that cold, they think,

holy shit, we might freeze

to death, pardon my language.

But there, so there is a stress response.

And that's the sympathetic nervous

system, it doesn't have anything to do

anything to do with sympathy, that's the

sympathetic sometimes

called fight or flight.

And so that is this alarm response, this

that oh shit moment, something's

happening, we need to

mount some sort of response.

So there's a stress or in this case, cold

temperature, then there's a stress

response, which is what

happens inside the body.

And in that case, there's the release of

hormones like adrenaline or epinephrine,

you know, same hormone, different names.

And then changes in, for example, what

the nervous system controls in the the

vasculature of the blood vessels, right,

it constricts and

dilates, you know, controls that.

So it's going to constrict the blood

vessels in the limbs, it's going to it's

going to cause us to send blood away from

the arms and the legs in towards the core

of the body trying to preserve heat and

warmth in the visceral

organs as a survival mechanism.

So that is part of the sympathetic

nervous system stress response.

In that example, there's other times

where, you know, sometimes it's just,

gosh, I look at my calendar today, and

I've got meeting after meeting, and I've

emails to respond to.

And that creates a stress response, even

though I don't physically need the same

sort of, you know, adrenaline as if I and

movement capacity as if I was going to

run for my life or face a

physical life or death challenge.

You know, our biology, our bodies, our

operating systems, don't really know the

difference, because they use the same

mechanism for use the same mechanism for,

Oh, my gosh, I have a work deadline and

26 unread emails that I need to get to

today, the same mechanism for that as

they do for, Oh, my gosh, I need to run

for my life, because

there's a bear chasing me.

So all of that is the

sympathetic response.

And then ideally, whenever we meet a

stress or challenge, we come back down,

the adrenaline flows back to baseline

over a reasonable time course, not

staying elevated for too long.

And then we go into a more

parasympathetic dominant state, which is

sometimes called rest and digest, because

it has to do with, of course, being in a

more restful state, digesting food, so we

can rebuild, sometimes

called feed and breed.

Feeding, of course, is, you know, is

eating and digesting absorbing nutrients.

Again, breeding is because it, that's

where we can invest energy and longer

term growth and repair processes and

reproductive system, right?

So feed and breed.

And then also sleep, you know, is, is

kind of the ultimate

parasympathetic state there.

So there's, you know, those

are the two, the two branches.

And balancing that is really vitally

important for health, for longevity, for

sleep, for performance, for, you know,

reducing the risk of chronic disease, all

those, all those things.

It's really vital.

Yeah, definitely.

Well, I learned something there.

How are you got any

questions there, mate?

No, yeah, I mean, of course, got a

wonderful description of

the two nervous systems.

But I think it's interesting to use the

master reset that, you know, of course,

helps people go more into the

parasympathetic nervous system state.

And when I'm dealing with clients that

are coming in with chronic pain, or acute

pain, you're finding those people that

are, you know, they're in a stress state,

and they can't get out of it

because of the pain levels.

And it's wonderful to have, you know,

there's many approaches you can take to

getting somebody into a parasympathetic

nervous system state.

But, you know, one being the newbie of

the master reset of being able to use

that to help stimulate that to then allow

them the next step to be going into some,

you know, some, some drills, some

correctives, some exercises, but they

might not have responded as well to those

exercises if they just came straight in.

And you just, you know, placed up that

kind of stress on them.

So,

you know, the parasympathetic nervous

system state is just something that I

think more people need to realize that

they need to, they need to move in,

rather than how we traditionally look at

exercise is very, we need to work 100%

every single day, we need to, you know,

push our bodies to the max, but

realistically, from a longevity point of

view, us humans are a

species of longevity.

So we need to realize that, that that

parasympathetic nervous system state we

need, we must, we must be in that, even

when we start to move our bodies, we need

to make sure that we are in control and

we can breathe and, and, and yeah,

probably babbling, babbling

on a little bit, but 100%.

In

terms of that, you mentioned, Harry, the

master reset there, just for context, if

you're listening to this

and think, Oh, what is that?

So that's a, that's a technique or a

protocol that we have at Newfit that is

essentially our version of a

parasympathetic nervous system

stimulation technique or a vagus nerve.

If you may have heard of the Vegas, not

like Las Vegas, but VAGUS, the Vegas

nerve is the primary nerve pathway by

which the parasympathetic

nervous system acts on the body.

And it influences, it signals from and to

the, a lot of the visceral organs, it's

relevant and heart rate variability,

which, you know, we could

dive into more if we want to.

Yeah, we'd love to.

And so that's our, that's our, that's our

technique for, for doing that.

And it's essentially, you know, like,

like, like Harry said, if we're trying to

go, go, go all the time and we're stuck

in that sympathetic dominant state, being

able to have a tool that can help us get,

and there are many tools, you know,

things like techniques like meditation,

like, you know, deep breathing, like

there's all different things that can,

you know, going for a walk in nature can

help us shift more

towards the parasympathetic.

And this is one that just significantly

repeatedly, you know, consistently gets

people into that more

parasympathetic state too.

So it's another tool, a powerful tool

there to have in that toolbox.

Yeah, for sure.

And I think

what rarely beats meditation is that it

sort of, well, it

bypasses that, how do I say it?

It bypasses that not the impedance, yeah,

I suppose that's potentially a word of

the individual, you're directly

regulating the nervous system, opposed to

trying to get the individual in question,

perhaps, to try and regulate their own

nervous system, which when you throw

emotion into the picture, obviously gets

pretty can get pretty difficult anyway.

Anyway,

I think it would be a pretty decent time

to introduce the what the newbie is.

I know we sort of glanced over it a few

times now, but can you introduce the what

this contraption that you've designed

fundamentally is, and then, yeah, how it

operates, and we can

then take it from there.

The newbie is an acronym for neuro bio

electric, and it's the the product for

which we're best known.

And, you know, it's interesting, people

see wires and electrodes on the skin, and

they think, Oh, it's another TENS unit or

something like that.

But it's, it's a

different type of current.

So it is using electricity, but it's

using direct current instead of

alternating current.

And there's some really interesting

history there, there's several benefits

of direct current,

which we can talk about.

And those benefits have

been known for decades.

But there was always this problem where

you couldn't get high enough, you know,

therapeutic levels of direct current into

the body without

stinging and burning the skin.

And so the Soviets did some of this, you

know, back in the 1960s, when they were

trying to assert dominance.

And in sport, you know, they were trying

to show that their communist system was

superior, because they were able to

create, you know, produce the best

athletes and win Olympic gold medals.

And they they we have a lot of so many

things like periodization and

plyometrics, so many things that we

talked about in sports science today came

out of that Soviet era.

So there's, you know,

really, really good stuff there.

So they did some of this preliminary

work, and they would literally, you know,

have burn marks on their athletes when

they were doing some of these experiments

with direct current.

Of course, that didn't

work here in the West.

So direct, so direct current essentially

fell out of favor for decades.

And in its place, you know, filling that

void or that vacuum came all of the

alternating current modalities like the

10s units, what we call quote unquote,

Russian STEM, even

though the Russians used both.

But you know, traditional NMEs, FES,

interferential, these types of

electricity, electric stimulation

treatments that people

may be familiar with.

So all these all these, you know, came

came to be because the alternating

current as that signal goes back and

forth, it eliminates charge buildup,

because with direct current, you had

these benefits, but you had a problem

where eventually all the negative ions

would accumulate around the positive

electrode and vice versa.

And when those charges accumulate, they

create resistance, which blocks the flow

of current and causes it to be dissipated

as heat leading to the burning.

So you know, some of the

underlying physiology there.

So we found a way, I'll get to the

benefits and why that matters

momentarily, but we essentially found a

way in engineering breakthrough to be

able to get direct current into the body

while reducing that charge buildup, so

that we don't have the

stinging and burning.

So we get the benefits of direct current,

which again, I promise I'll get to with

the benefits of direct current with the

with the comfort of alternating current.

Okay, so why does that matter?

Well, with direct current, there's a

there's a few differences in how it

responds, how the body responds and how

it influences the body

when it's applied here.

So first, to understand, direct current

is basically creating an electric field

going in one direction.

So people listening, you can't see if you

can't, if you're watching, you can see,

I'm basically holding my hands in an

angle making a ramp.

So if I had a if I had a ball at the top

of a hill, it's going to roll down the

hill under the influence of gravity.

And so how steep that hill is, is

essentially how strong an electric field

is, where if there's a positive charge at

the top of that hill, it's going to roll

down towards the negative direction of

electric field, the more voltage there

is, the steeper it is, and

the faster it's going to roll.

And then how fast it rolls is essentially

the amount of current.

So a little bit of electricity 101 there.

So is it building up an

electrical gradient then?

Is that correct?

Correct.

Yeah, that's what it is.

That is, we even use the same

terminology, the gradient of an electric

field is the same as a grade, like

similar word or same word as a gradient

of a of a hill, how steep the hill is.

So, so the the difference then between

direct current and alternating current is

that with direct current, that gradient,

that slope, that hill is always pointing

in the same direction.

Whereas with alternating current, it

oscillates back and forth, positive,

negative, positive,

negative, positive, negative.

And so what happens

there is a couple things.

One is, as if you apply that to the body,

where there's a high enough power level,

great enough amount of power, it will

cause muscles to co contract and fight

against each other, because you're

signaling this positive,

negative, positive, negative.

So you get agonist,

antagonist co contraction.

So it's like bicep and tricep fighting

against each other, hamstring and quad,

fighting against each other.

And so it's sort of like, if you were

driving a car, and you were hitting the

throttle and the brake pedal at the same

time, you'd be wasting a lot of energy

because you'd be resisting your own

movement, creating a lot of undo, wear

and tear, unnecessary wear and tear on

the various parts of the body of the car,

on the engine, on the axles, on the

brakes, whatever it might be.

And that eventually can lead to some

breakdown and damage.

And if you use direct current, you get

that signal flowing in one direction

only, you bypass virtually all of that co

contraction, that internal resistance,

you get a lot more efficient signaling,

you can also get a lot more sensory and

afferent input into the nervous system,

because you're bypassing a lot of that,

especially that protective co

contraction, you get a lot more sensory

input into the nervous system.

Remember, we talked about how the nervous

system senses everything about the

environment, and also creates responses.

So, so the more you can target and create

specific sensory inputs where they're

needed, the more you can influence the

nervous system to work the processing in

the brain and output into the other side

of the nervous system, the

more you can influence those.

So it allows us to, to think more of the

nervous system as an operating system

like software and get more precise and

specific in terms of programming that for

more efficient mobility, stability,

movement, speed, power, or just being

able to move with less

pain, all these things.

So the precision there in terms of

nervous system, you

know, I'll say programming.

And then there's also another category of

benefit where the direct current allows

us to, to apply these electric fields

that can influence the body's own

internal healing processes.

So there is a little bit of

an overlap with the hardware.

So I don't know if you've read or heard

of a book called the body

electric by Robert Becker.

So, so really fascinating book.

I, I highly recommend the book.

It's one of my favorites and I've read it

several times and each time I do, I get

just really inspired.

So it's a book from, I believe the late

1980s Robert Becker was an orthopedic

surgeon and he did some of the research

and then also wrote and popularized

research that others had done.

One of the things that he really wrote a

lot about was the salamander because a

salamander is the most complex

animal that can regenerate entire limbs

and significant segments of its body.

And so if you look at, you know, we can

dive more into this if we, if we want to,

but the, the high level, the takeaway

message of this is that the reason the

salamander is able to do that is because

of the electric fields that its own body

creates that inform, that influence, that

guide the healing and

regenerative processes.

And there's a distinct difference.

Actually immediately after an injury, we

as humans have a same, have the same

electrical fields created in our own

bodies naturally that guide the healing

process, same as a salamander for the

first seven days, but then ours just goes

back to zero and we get scar tissue as

the salamanders electric field flips,

causes the

regenerative processes to happen.

And that's the big underlying difference

in the salamanders biology

and why they can regenerate.

So, so, you know, I'm not saying we're

using direct current, at least not yet to

regenerate limbs, but we are seeing that

by applying these direct current fields

to the body, we're able to tap into some

of that ability to influence and

accelerate and improve the

body's own healing processes.

So there's these two

main categories of benefits.

One is that, you know, signal into the

nervous system and then the other is the

ability to use direct current, use the

electric fields to help facilitate or

assist or support the

body's healing processes.

That's amazing.

So many questions.

Before I dive in,

Harry, you got anything?

Yeah, Garrett, what do you or have you

experienced using different types of, you

know, sensory inputs?

So, you know, newbie being one of them,

but have you found that

you've used different inputs,

visually, hearing visual,

sorry, audio, or taste or smell?

Have you used any of those types of

inputs with clients and has that helped?

So there's a few ways to,

you know, conceptualize this.

I mean, a lot of people may have the

experience of or may hear that and think

like, gosh, what are you talking about?

This is over my head.

But it's actually very simple.

Like, think about listening to, you know,

music to get pumped up.

Like, that's an audio input.

Exactly.

Causes you to have a

physiological response, right?

So this is very real, I think a lot

easier to understand than

one might initially think.

So, and there's cool things you can do,

like I've done, you know, experimentally,

you know, had people smell.

So you can actually, you can see

patterns, you know, a couple cool

examples, maybe a slight tangent, but you

can see patterns in people sometimes

where if you're trying to help someone

with, you know, they come to see you

because they have chronic pain, and the

pain is all right side.

It's like right elbow, right low back,

right hip, right knee.

It's like, huh, what's going on there?

Well, one of the things that our brains

do is, you know, the brain creates a

signal of pain as a

response to perceived threat.

And it also will

inhibit pain.

And that works in a part of the brain

called the PMRF, getting

down closer to the brainstem,

pons for ponto medullary reticular

formation, PMRF, pons and medulla.

So for the neuroscience nerds out there

like me that care about that, but you

don't need, not

important to remember that.

So, so the, the brain will will

essentially inhibit pain,

ipsilaterally, meaning

on the same side as that.

And so if one side if that if that

particular brain structure is weaker on

one side, because all you can infer that

because you hypothesize that might be the

case, because there's more pain on that

one side, you can think, okay, this

person has all right sided pain, perhaps

it's there that PMRF, perhaps it's a

deficit in the in the that lower part of

the right side of their brain.

And so maybe you could think you want to

stimulate the left cortex, which is going

to go across the lower right part of that

brain, or you can do something that's

going to stimulate directly that lower

part of the right brain.

And so you can start to think about like,

I'd want to provide newbie stimulation

and a certain side of the body,

you actually, so for this, you would want

to you'd want to stimulate on the left

side to bring so, so let me just go back

and correct something

that I said a moment ago.

So for this, we actually would not want

to stimulate the opposite cortex, we want

to stimulate the ipsilateral cortex.

So, so we may actually want to stimulate

more in a case like this, more, more of

the left side of the body

to get to get that sensory input to the

right sensory cortex, which is going to

going to stimulate the

right side of the brain.

So it's a little bit counterintuitive,

because if that particular imbalance is

an issue, and I'll bring this back to

answer your question, I promise, because

if that if that if that's an issue, then

you know, a lot of times you'll work on

the right side, because that's where the

person has pain, but then you actually

reinforce an imbalance where there's more

activity in the left side of the brain.

So doing things like, like sensory input

in the in the left ear to get into the

right brain, or, you know, covering for

just a moment, you don't do it for too

long covering the right eye to get more

visual input into the left brain, you

could do stuff like that.

Smell is the only sense that goes to the

same side of the brain

instead of crosses to the opposite.

So in this case, you'd smell

something in the right nostril.

So there's there's different examples

like that, you know, you

can you can provide input.

And this is sort of the functional

neurology approach approach where you'd

want to provide certain inputs to

preferentially bring up or down, you

know, either a side of the brain or a

certain part of the brain.

And there's there's people who are real

experts in this who

can map out the pathways.

And it's been a while since I've really

studied in depth the functional

neuroanatomy, but you can use very

precise stimulus and inputs to precisely

dial up or down certain parts of the

brain and, and create really

amazing results for people.

And where stuff like that often comes in

is, you know, post concussion symptoms,

or, you know, brain injury, or I mean,

stuff like that, where, where you really

want to get precise, but it's relevant

for performance, you know,

performance for elite athletes.

Also, it's just really amazing stuff.

Here's is is some interesting.

That's, that's why I love doing what I

do, because it's not just do

exercise and get this result.

There's so many ways you can

get somebody to to do something.

And it's just fascinating how you can use

those different types of

inputs to get a result.

And it's certainly something I'm looking

more and more into to use it with my

clients to, to speed up the progress.

Definitely.

Thanks for that, Harry.

I'd love to just sort of jump back

quickly and just talk about more of the

it's from a healing standpoint, you sort

of you touched on this idea that it's

sort of able we going back to the

salamander analogy

quickly, if you don't mind.

Do you think there's anything to be said

about sort of broadly speaking, a DC

therapy, maybe supporting stem cell, stem

cell proliferation or stem

cell output in that regard?

Or is that a bit of a stretch?

Do you think I'm

really excited about this.

I'm not prepared to make any claims that

you know, that we're

doing that right now.

We do have some some research actually

touch on real quickly at the beginning of

of this year, we actually released

published in the Journal of Diabetes

Research, the first study, first study of

its type, comparing in humans, head to

head alternating

current versus direct current.

So so this particular study was on

diabetic neuropathy

patients in their 70s.

When it's been written off that they

could ever actually

heal in any meaningful way.

And it's more about just managing

symptoms, reducing pain.

And so half the group is 150 patients, 75

of them got

alternating current 10s units.

And they did see some reductions in pain,

which is good, but that was it.

The other half, the other 75, who got the

direct current of the newbie, not only

did they see reductions in pain, but they

saw improvements in sensation, increased

functional abilities.

And we saw increases in EMG, actual

increases in the nerve, amount of nerve

electricity being conducted.

So we're actually seeing

some nerve regeneration there.

So there is some regenerative ability in

humans, whether that's guided by stem

cell proliferation or not, you know, we

have to do the

mechanistic studies to find out.

But I do think that in the next, you

know, gosh, I would have said 20 years,

but now with the rate at which AI is

accelerating medical understanding and

breakthroughs, you know, maybe it's in

the next five or 10, I think we'll be

able to use electric fields, technologies

like this to guide salamander like

regenerative abilities in humans.

I'm very bullish on that idea.

I've been fascinated by that for 15 years

since I read the Body Electric.

And every time I reread it, I just feel

like we're getting

closer and closer and closer.

It's, you know, science fiction is going

to become science fact.

And I do so.

So tying back to your question, Rob,

there is a connection between stem cells

and these electric fields and in

salamanders, which is

written about by Dr.

Becker in that book, The Body Electric,

he outlines the process, the mechanism of

how it actually works that these electric

fields and salamanders guide their

amazing regenerative abilities.

And it's fascinating what the electric

fields do is they actually cause cells to

de-differentiate back into stem cells.

So if you have a stem

cell, it's like a blank canvas.

It could become a liver cell, a kidney

cell, a muscle cell, a bone

cell, a brain cell, right?

Stem cell could become any of those.

But what the electric fields do is they

actually cause, and in this case, I

believe it was mostly red blood cells.

It would cause cells to de-differentiate

after they've differentiated into another

cell type to go back to being stem cells

so that they could then be a part of this

regenerative process becoming whatever

tissue they need to be to build that new

limb or that new part of the tail or

whatever the body segment.

And then the electric field guided that

stem cell into position and signaled it

to become whatever it needed to be.

So there is a strong

connection, Rob, to your point.

It's a great, great, great point.

There's a strong connection between

electric fields and the ability to

perhaps even create, but at least

influence, direct, and inform

what a stem cell would become.

Yeah, definitely.

And I think this whole sort of field of

what's, I suppose, this emerging field of

electric medicine is just fascinating.

I'll be honest, it's

completely beyond me.

I'm still trying to figure out how to

sort of properly interpret an

Oats test for the most part.

But yeah, no, it's just, it's incredible.

It just speaks really to the sort of the

innate sort of regenerative capacity of

the human body and this ability to find

homeostasis when the

conditions are right, ultimately.

I mean, this could go into a broader

discussion potentially

about things like EMF and Wi-Fi.

Actually, what the heck?

Let's ask the loaded question.

What do you think about

these non-native EMF fields like 5G, EMF,

Wi-Fi, things that are going to sort of

interfere with calcium gated voltage

channels, sort of upset calcium

regulation within cells, etc.

Do you, I mean, obviously, with your

background, and I suppose what is

essentially electrophysiology, do you

think that these fields are a cause to

concern very broadly

speaking, or is it a bit overblown?

There's part of me that's on

each side of this fence here.

So we're talking about Robert Becker.

So he actually, at the end of the book,

The Body Electric, he talks about the

perils of electro pollution.

And he writes a whole

second book on the topic.

And he's very concerned,

you know, for the reasons that you

described and alluded to, because of how

the electric fields, in the innate

electric fields that can be very subtle

in our bodies, control so many internal

processes, and how they can be hijacked

and interfered with by non-native

external artificial EMFs.

So there's definitely, it's definitely

real, it's worth talking about.

So the people who say, "Oh, they don't do

anything because of the frequency or the

power levels or stuff like

that," that's just not true.

There is clear mechanisms by which they

can interact with the body.

But then at the same time, there's

another part of me that looks at it like,

"Okay, there's this ambient stressor that

is going to be here.

So I want to make myself

as resilient as possible."

But at the same time, I would not want to

live right underneath a cell phone tower.

And I just, last week was out and off the

grid for a few days doing a

camping and kayaking trip.

So I'm very jealous.

I don't know if it was just because of

the absence of EMFs or just, I mean,

there's more time in nature there with

friends, change of pace, but I don't know

what degree of that was being away from

EMFs, but I definitely felt better and

had good heart rate variability in my

whoop and all that stuff too.

So I don't know, it's

definitely an area for concern.

I haven't dove in lately into the

literature on that, but I am curious.

So I may do a little bit of research as

soon as we hang out this call, actually

start looking, see if I can pull up.

Fair enough.

Yeah, no, I think where

there's smoke, there's fire.

And I do fundamentally agree with you.

I think, well, it's interesting to note

that people who are already sort of

compromised in terms of their health are

more likely to be sort of electrically

sensitive than those who maybe are in a

good state of health to begin with.

And I think that speaks potentially to

the way that there is sodium

potassium pump is operating.

You know what, this is going

to get very deep very quickly.

Let's bypass that.

Garrett, I'd love to sort of segue into

talking about the new

fit method a little more.

I know we've already touched on it,

courtesy of Harry's question earlier.

And this obviously takes this sort of

whole method sort of takes into account

that maybe the listener has access to a

newbie to begin with.

But I think it's important to sort of

help people to

understand how the process works.

I know, yeah, I know Harry, again,

Harry's obviously been through this with

me, he's he's given me

a few sponge baths now.

But but yeah, would you mind sort of,

sort of running us through what the

newbie method is just fundamentally and

some of the basic protocols there to sort

of an elaboration of what you

touched on earlier with Harry.

Absolutely.

So the the new fit method is our overall

approach for being able to find where the

nervous system is going to be delaying or

impeding the healing

process or limiting performance.

And one interesting tidbit on that is

that it often is doing that for a reason,

you know, we don't just wake up one day

and our brains say, Oh, I want to spend

extra energy, you know, keeping that part

of my body tight, just, you know, just

burning extra calories

for no reason, right?

It's doing it for a reason,

it's doing it to protect us.

And so sometimes I can feel like the

nervous system is working against us.

But really, it has, it

has noble intentions.

So, so I think it's important to have

that perspective going into it.

And what we're trying to do then is

figure out how we can get the nervous

system really to to work, you know, work

with us rather than

against us, so to speak.

And when we're talking about pain and

injury, you know, people are most

commonly first interacting with with new

fit in the context of either they had a

recent injury or surgery they're trying

to recover from, or they've had chronic

pain, something that's been around for a

while, you know, chronic back pain,

chronic knee pain

they're trying to work on.

And so one of the biggest things that we

want to do, first of all, is figure out,

okay, what, if it's chronic pain, what

what isn't working properly, that's,

that's allowing them to have this

vulnerability in the injured joint in the

first place, or what's going on with the

autonomic nervous system that's keeping

them locked in that cycle of perceived

threat and pain, right, there can be, you

know, that gets back into stress and

things that we talked about,

you know, many minutes ago.

So there's there's parts there.

So one of the things that we really like

to do first is this mapping process where

we'll take an electrode

and scan around on the body.

And the cool thing about that is that

we're actually because of these effects

of direct current that we talked about

earlier, we're actually

introducing load onto those tissues.

So if I, you know, if you're just

listening, you don't see this, but if

you're watching, you see like, I'm

dragging a pad over my bicep, and then

the front deltoid, and

then my PEC minor PEC major.

So when I stimulate those areas, I'm

actually sending the same signals as if

there's load or

challenge happening there.

And what we're trying to do, remember, we

talked about the nervous system, there's

the sensing of the environment, and

there's the reaction to it.

So what we're trying to do is basically

see where things are working well, and

where there's some sort

of deficit or limitation.

Because if we stimulate, if we challenge

an area that's working well, it can

contract and work through its full range

of motion and stretch and relax and

notice how to do all those things.

If we stimulate that area, you know, that

person's brain and nervous system is

going to see that signal and say, "Oh,

that's no big deal."

You know, if we're doing this to Harry,

you know, Harry's brain is going to say,

"Oh, yeah, there's no big deal.

That's within our current

capacity, no cause for alarm."

But if we then stimulate an area where he

hasn't been moving that recently, he's

been avoiding it, and

it's something new, right?

That novel stimulation is

threatening to the nervous system.

That brain is going to, his brain is

going to say, "Whoa,

whoa, whoa, that's new.

That's different.

Sound the alarm."

Or if we stimulate an area where he's

actively guarding or inhibiting that

because of a recent injury or bad habits

developed over time, we stimulate one of

those, his brain is going to say, "Whoa,

whoa, alarm, alarm."

You know, they're attacking us in a

vulnerable place where

we're trying to protect.

And so we're basically

trying to find those areas.

And then once we find them, we stimulate

them as the individual or as Harry or

whoever it is, goes through movement

patterns where they're compensating

because we want to basically teach them

to start reincorporating those areas

where there's deficits, reincorporating

those back into the various movement

patterns to improve function.

And it is interesting, like I talked

about how the nervous system

is doing this for a reason.

After an injury, the nervous system goes

into this protect mode where it's trying

to limit movement there, thinking like,

"Oh my gosh, we could get attacked again

or we could get hurt

again at any moment."

And that ends up being productive if

there is a threat, but if we're trying to

heal and it can actually stand in the way

because like tension, for example, could

reduce blood flow and impair the body's

ability to send nutrients

and raw materials there.

So what we're trying to do is, in that is

sort of restore natural baseline...

Homeostasis. ...movement and signal.

Yeah, homeostasis from a nervous system

function perspective, for sure.

And then that's working

locally on these areas.

Then we also like to do things globally.

We've already talked about the master

reset, which is sort of a global

parasympathetic rest and digest nervous

system activation technique.

That's super valuable.

And then we also like to do things like

the electric glove where

we can do manual therapy.

A lot of the physiotherapists out there

and other clinicians like to do manual

therapy where you're introducing pressure

onto certain areas of the body.

And people used to talk about how, "Oh,

I'm breaking up scar tissue with my

hands," or stuff like that.

And we now know

that's just not happening.

I mean, unless you have like an ice pick

and you're not breaking up scar tissue,

what you're doing is creating

neurological input to help the body

facilitate the change in tone or the

relaxation release of tissues in that

area and increasing blood flow and

different things like that.

So it really ultimately is interacting

and interaction with the nervous system.

And so we can do that.

We can actually hook the direct current

signal up to a glove or just run it

through your hands, but send it literally

through the tips of one's fingers.

And you can help accelerate those

neurological effects of

manual therapy with that too.

So there's a lot of

different ways to use it.

And then once we get through the initial

stages of working through pain, injury,

and dysfunction, then we can use it for

muscle hypertrophy, for example, to build

muscle or to work on

precise movement patterns.

You can work on contracting different

frequencies that contract one side of the

joint as you use another frequency on the

other side of the joint to lengthen.

So you can create more range of motion

and motor control and

strength and muscle building.

You can use it like

digital weight to amplify.

If you think about

just one final point here.

So we've gotten from pain and injury and

early stages of recovery now to exercise

fitness or performance or

for athletes return to play.

If we're talking about

strength, what is strength?

Well, really, I would say

it's a neurological skill.

And that's really informed by, you listen

to this, may have heard of Pavel

Satsulin, the Russian guy who came over

to America and had a lot of this

Russian-based education on the importance

of the nervous system

for creating strength.

So he was one of the first

to introduce me to this idea.

And it's really, really fascinating.

But the idea that strength really is a

neurological skill, and that leads to

techniques that he teaches like greasing

the groove and really these wonderful,

wonderful things that are

just really, really good.

But the take-home message is that

strength is the ability to contract more

motor units at any one

given moment in time.

And so you can actually use...

That's the reason we lift weight.

If I'm just curling my arm with no weight

at all, it might take 20% of my muscle

fibers and motor units.

But when I add weight, that feedback

forces me to contract

maybe 30%, 40%, 50%.

You can also then put the pads of the

newbie on there at certain frequencies to

get that same 30% or 40% or 50%

recruitment, but without

having to touch a weight.

So it can make it safer, less risk of

injury or re-injury.

You can use it like digital weight for

strength or building muscle too.

So there's all these

different ways to use it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's incredible.

I'm going to sort of break my oath and

ask one sort of technical question.

That being, what mechanistically is

happening when the newbie

finds a hotspot specifically?

I mean, like I said, during

my initial session with Harry,

we went over my QLs for the audience.

Those are hustles in your lower back.

My left one lit up like a Christmas tree

and it was a proper hotspot.

And then the right one was fine.

But fundamentally, can you sort of

elucidate as to what is sort of

physiologically or biochemically

happening to create that response when

that DC current is

thrown into the equation?

So there's some things that we know and

some things that we have yet to learn.

I do intend to learn more about what's

actually happening at a cellular

biochemical level, things like that.

What we do know neurologically is that

pain is a signal created by the brain in

a response to perceived threat.

It's the brain's way of saying, "Hey,

don't load that area.

Don't do that."

It's a signal to change your behavior, to

do or stop doing something.

So it's a signal

actively created by the brain.

And in this case, when Harry was mapping

you, Rob, your lower back, he went over a

side that was working well and your brain

saw that and said

again, no cause for alarm.

But when he stimulated the other side

where there was an issue,

he was stimulating that.

And for some reason, that load, that

signal, that challenge on that tissue was

going into a vulnerable area to where

your brain saw that and said, "Whoa,

whoa, whoa, alarm, alarm.

This is threatening."

And so in response to that perceived

threat, it created that output signal of

pain, which was your brain's way of

saying, "Hey, Rob, stop doing that.

Stop loading these muscles.

There's a problem here."

And so what that led Harry to do was to

ramp up, to start stimulating those

muscles and teach the brain to begin to

process that differently, to down

regulate that perception of threat, which

is another way of saying, allow you to

start using those muscles again.

Stop protecting, stop limiting, stop

imposing those patterns that are limiting

output in that area.

It takes time.

It's sort of like recalibrating.

And if there's actual damage there,

it'll take longer because what you're

doing is really presenting that

information and allowing the brain to

decide if it is, they

sort of test out the water.

Does it want to allow a little more,

allow a little more?

And if it's not safe, it won't.

If it is, then it will.

So you're accelerating that process of

reeducating, recalibrating, relearning

function in that area.

Got you.

Thank you.

That was perfect.

Like I said, technical

and just a long shot.

But yeah, thank you for that.

That really does help.

Garrett, I reckon it's a pretty, it would

be a great time to maybe start talking

about some specific

use cases for the newbie.

Now, there are obviously literally dozens

here, but what I'd really sort of like to

focus on, I suppose, the neurological or

the neurodegenerative side of things,

then really Harry's Wheelhouse, which

were the corrective postural pain side of

it, and then maybe

something of a selfish ask.

I'd love to discuss the areas in which

newbie is being used in a, what's

fundamentally my area of academic

research, which is in the CFS sort of

community, the chronic

fatigue, long COVID, etc.

To start off with, though, I'd love to

jump more into a discussion around how

the newbie can support people's

neurodegenerative issues, things like MS,

multiple sclerosis, etc.

I know, of course, you've

done some work with Terry Walls.

You had a great podcast with her, I think

it was a few years ago

now, but it was amazing.

And for those in the audience

who aren't familiar with Dr.

Walls,

she's a medical doctor, she

developed multiple sclerosis.

She was wheelchair wound at one point, I

believe, and then through the lifestyle

and dietary intervention side of things,

she was able to greatly reverse a large

number of symptoms

that she was experiencing.

Now, I mean, aside from, no, let me let

you all ask the question,

I'll ask you the question.

What do you think is happening

in these conditions?

Obviously, in multiple sclerosis, there's

this demyelination of nerves, or there's

this sort of loss of

insulation around nerves.

How is the newbie helping with a

condition like this or broadly speaking

condition, these sorts

of conditions in general?

I doubt it's helping

to remyelinate nerves.

Is it just, again, from a case of it

helping to modulate that

sympathetic tone, fine balance?

Or do you have a feeling as how it's

helping people with

these sorts of problems?

So there's a few parts to this.

I'm glad you mentioned Dr.

Walls.

For people listening, by

the way, it's Terry Walls.

It's spelled W-A-H-L-S.

And she's a fabulous practitioner.

She has a book called The Walls Protocol,

which would be my first recommendation

for anyone who gets a diagnosis of MS or

any similar autoimmune condition.

So in terms of how we work with MS

patients, there's a few

parts of this to consider.

First, we want to introduce the concept

of neuroplasticity, which is the way that

we adapt and respond and

learn based on the inputs.

And so there's a couple

ways to conceptualize this.

One is to think about neuroplasticity is

the window is most open or the process is

most active in childhood.

And so children who grow up in the UK or

the US are going to hear primarily the

English language spoken, perhaps with a

slightly different accent.

I know you think I have an accent.

You should try the Northeast of England.

It's horrendous.

I don't think people

actually speak English here.

It's just like Geordie.

What the hell is that?

I don't know.

Try being from South London

and living in the Northeast.

That's even different.

Try being from South London

and living in the Northeast.

Yeah, you tried me on that one.

So children who grow up in these regions

tend to develop that accent.

They hear the people around them and they

sort of adapt to that.

Whereas a child who grows up in South

America hearing Spanish or Portuguese or

a child who grows up in China hearing

Mandarin, they're going to adapt that

environment to the sound, the stimulus

that they're receiving.

And they're going to hear and understand

the intonations and be able to learn to

speak those types of

sounds and styles, etc.

Neuroplasticity is basically how we

adapt, how we learn.

If we're reading a textbook in school,

neuroplasticity is how the structure of

our brain changes to

consolidate those memories.

And depending on how interested we are

and how focused we are when we're reading

it, we'll have a much greater or lesser

response to learn it or how motivated we

are by grades or whatever it might be.

So neuroplasticity is important here.

And it's also interesting to understand

for any of us, regardless of even in the

absence of something like MS, there's

this use it or lose it phenomenon that is

very important to understand.

Our bodies want to conserve energy

because there might be a famine tomorrow.

We evolved over tens or hundreds of

thousands of years where early humans had

issues getting adequate food supply.

They didn't live in an era of abundance

like we have today, at

least in most of the world.

Not all, but our wiring is

to want to conserve energy.

And so it takes a lot of energy to build

and maintain new muscle.

It takes a lot of energy to build and

maintain new nerve pathways to activate

those sodium and potassium channels and

send electrical signals.

It takes quite a bit of energy.

And so with MS, especially,

this becomes more pronounced.

And there's also a dark side of

neuroplasticity where when one has a

neurodegenerative condition, it starts to

become more difficult to move the limbs,

to ambulate, to do certain activities.

And because it becomes more difficult,

they often can fall into the trap of

being less and less active.

And that accelerates the downward spiral,

the dark side of neuroplasticity called

learned disuse, where sometimes the

nervous system adapts to just down

regulating certain pathways.

And so for patients who have MS and

related conditions, it's important to do

some amount of physiotherapy just to

maintain wherever they are, let alone try

to build back and regain

function that's been lost.

So it's important to get some input, some

stimulus just to maintain that and

prevent the further decline,

so further downward spiral.

So there's the context there that we just

have to take very seriously.

And so a big part of the idea with

neuroplasticity is that we need stimulus

and input in order to drive adaptation,

change, any sort of learning, et cetera.

And that stimulus generally is, we're

talking about the neuromuscular system,

musculoskeletal system,

that stimulus is movement.

And what we can do with technology like

the newbie is create a lot more input so

that if they're doing one movement of a

corrective exercise, it could be the

equivalent input of doing, you know, five

or 10 repetitions in the

time they're doing one.

So you can amplify the effects and get

more stimulus and more input to drive

neuroplastic change faster and more

significantly than you would with just

traditional exercise approaches.

And that's one piece of it.

You know, the other piece of it is that

you have to drive, you have to create

enough input so that there's a reason for

the body to make a change, to make these

longer term neuroplastic adaptations.

But then you also have to have enough

nutrition and sleep and handling stress

and modulating

inflammation appropriately.

So there's enough resources because, you

know, the body, first and foremost, needs

resources just to

survive, to live through the day.

And then there has to be some sort of

surplus of energy and resources to

rebuild and repair and restore function

that has been lost to tap into the power

of neuroplasticity and cause healing and

regeneration or support

healing and regeneration.

So there's two parts to it.

There's the stimulus that you do, you

know, in the physio

clinic or in Harry's gym.

And then there's the sleep and the

nutrition and all the things

that have to go into it there.

And both are, you can't

have one without the other.

So they're both important.

But that's where the new fit piece comes

in is providing that stimulus and input

to accelerate, to, I'll say, maximize the

opportunity for neuroplasticity from a

stimulus perspective, make it easier to

reach that threshold to

drive neuroplasticity.

But then the other stuff has

to happen outside of there.

And so, you know, outside of

the gym or the physio clinic.

And then the master reset, things like

that can certainly help as well, because

of the the autonomic effects.

You know, we're talking about something

where there's an autoimmune condition,

there's sort of a runaway response.

Yeah, runaway response

in the immune system.

And so that there's a there's a direct

negative feedback loop between the vagus

nerve and the immune system, the thymus

and the spleen and the parasympathetic

system can help calm down that runaway

excess inflammation,

immune activity as well.

Yeah, drop those levels of

catecholamines, corticosteroid,

corticosteroid, cortisol, etc.

Definitely.

Do you I mean, just to speculate, just to

speculate, glucocorticoids, or

corticosteroids,

sorry, my mistake, platelet.

Just to speculate again, do you think

there's any chance that there's sort of

any neurogenesis happening there?

I mean, it sort of jumps on from what

we'll talk about earlier.

But would you speculate that anything is

happening there from this

perspective of the newbie?

Or is that a bit of a long shot?

Based on what we saw in the neuropathy

study that we talked about a while ago.

Based on that, I think there's reason to

believe that there can be some axon

growth, there could be

collateral sprouting.

In this, as you mentioned, MS is more of

a demyelinating condition.

And based on what we saw there, we saw

some remyelination happening in the

neuropathy patients who

were studied in that study.

So we have every reason to believe that

that can happen here.

And there is evidence for remyelination.

And so the fact that it would happen here

is supported by research.

The pathway has been established that

remyelination can happen,

given certain circumstances.

And this is those being the

things that we talked about.

You need to have enough stimulation,

enough recovery and time in the

parasympathetic nervous system and

resources and all that stuff.

So have every reason to believe that

there is some degree of that happening,

certainly more work to be done.

But yeah, it seems like, especially the

patients we've seen who have just made

transformational recoveries over time, of

course, but really gotten out of

wheelchairs and regained their autonomy

when they've been dealing with MS and had

become wheelchair bound, had to give up

the driver's license,

had to rely on a caregiver.

We've seen some amazing transformations.

So it seems like there's some functional

and some structural changes happening

there that can explain what's going on.

I can't say the ratio of each, but

there's definitely some positive changes

happening over time.

Yeah, definitely.

Fair enough.

Okay, next I'd love to discuss how the

newbie can be used in a supportive

context when it comes to injury recovery,

postural dysfunction,

pain management, etc.

Now I am so outside of my

wheelhouse now it's funny.

So I'm going to hand this one over to

Harry because this is his job.

So yeah, over to you, mate.

Garros, or yours?

Awesome.

Yes, very excited to