Welcome to the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.

I'm Kate Moore Youssef and I'm a wellbeing and lifestyle coach, EFT practitioner, mum to four kids and passionate about helping more women to understand and accept their amazing ADHD brains.

After speaking to many women just like me and probably you, I know there is a need for more health and lifestyle support for women newly diagnosed with adhd.

In these conversations, you'll learn from insightful guests, hear new findings, and discover powerful perspectives and lifestyle tools to enable you to live your most fulfilled, calm and purposeful life wherever you are on your ADHD journey.

Here's today's episode.

So hi everyone.

Welcome back to yet another episode of the ADHD Women's Wellbeing Podcast.

I'm Kate Moore Youssef.

I'm your host here, as always, and I am absolutely delighted to welcome a true ADHD stalwart.

She has been around in this industry understanding ADHD for 25 years and her name is Terry Matlin.

And Terry is an internationally recognized expert on ADHD in women and is a psychotherapist, author, consultant and coach.

She is also the author of the award winning book the Queen of Distraction and Survival Tips for Women with ADHD and runs the addconsults.com an international online resource serving women with ADHD and offering one to one consults and much more.

And her latest project is a one of a kind online community called Powerful Women with ADHD where women can connect worldwide, gain skills and get things done.

I absolutely love this, Terry.

It's an absolute honor to have you on the podcast.

Thank you for being here.

Oh, thank you.

So nice to meet you, Kate.

Thanks for having me.

Yeah, likewise.

And you know, to know that I'm speaking To someone with 25 years of experience of understanding ADHD women for so long and I know that you must kind of be looking and watching the way it's become so topical over the past few years and just thinking, I've known this for decades and just thinking, like, why is everyone just catching up?

You know, you've probably just been so ahead of this curve and I wonder, I'm so interested to know about 25 years ago, when you began this journey and understanding it, you know, in yourself, in others, what were you noticing at the very beginning of women, you know, presenting with adhd?

That's a really good question.

And I think back then we didn't have what we have now in social media, we didn't have magazines, we didn't have all these organizations.

So Women were feeling very, very isolated and were hungry as I was when I first learned of my diagnosis, back when I was in my early 40s.

We were so hungry for information and there was not much out there.

There were only a couple of books, actually maybe one or two when I started out.

And that would be Sarah Soldin's book, which is my bible and many women's Bible, and Kate Kelly, who the late Kate Kelly and then Peggy Ramunda was her co writer.

There was just so little information.

And I started going to these large conferences, so.

And thousands of people, Kate, were at these early conferences in the, you know, 90s, and it was just amazing to finally be around people who were like ourselves, who were losing our keys to the hotel room, who were getting lost in the hallway, who, you know, the.

Our purses were just open and pouring out.

It was just great.

So back then it was all brand, brand new.

And I know that from my own diagnosis and treatment early on.

How great my life changed.

So I was one of those that soared with it.

Many, many women will talk about depression once they get the diagnosis.

And grieving over the last years of their lives not knowing what is wrong with me, what is wrong with me.

In my case, maybe because of my background as a therapist.

I took that information and I thought, if this is helping me think of all the people that it could help.

And that's what really drove me to want to jump in with both feet and help women with adhd.

And my goodness, seeing what you've achieved and what you continue to achieve just shows, isn't it, that you have used it to your advantage.

You don't have to disclose your age, but I'm interested.

When you were diagnosed, you said in your 40s, what led to that diagnosis and who was talking about it to allow you to start having, you know, thinking, have I got adhd?

But I'm a woman, like, can I even have adhd?

I'm just interested to know what went on around your diagnosis.

Well, like many women and men, it started off with my daughter.

So my daughter, who wasn't, probably wasn't born with adhd.

So her story is pretty different than most in that she became very ill after a vaccine, baby vaccine.

And it's a long and very sad story.

She made it through.

She didn't come all the way back to where she was.

And part of the residual of this vaccine injury or this brain injury was severe.

And I've seen a lot of people with ADHD who present with a lot of hyperactivity and Impulsivity.

And in her case.

So I didn't know anything about adhd.

In my training, my clinical training, maybe one sentence was mentioned about adhd, and in those days, which was a long time ago, was called minimum minimal brain disorder or something like that.

So anyhow, in trying to help my daughter, again, reaching out for help, there were so few books in those days, but I connected with her therapist, her doctors and tried to learn.

And as I was reading a few books, we had computers back then, but not a lot of information.

So as I was reading about how to help my daughter, I thought it was just a fluke.

I just happened to hear about this one book back then that was written A Clinical Perspective of ADHD in Adults.

It was just a fluke.

I bought it and read it and I was stunned because I recognized family members.

That's how it started.

I recognized family.

Oh, now that explains so and so.

Now that explains so and so.

And as I continued to read, I had a real aha moment where it sounds like me.

Yeah.

I mean, it's so relatable, isn't it?

Yeah.

And so my, my issues were similar to probably many women who have.

I have the inattentive subtype.

So I'm not hyperactive.

I'm not really impulsive.

I am in certain areas a little bit.

But, you know, my problems were typical for a lot of women that I work with and that you.

You work with.

And that is, how do I keep it together?

What really made it difficult for me is when the children, I have two children now, are adults, young adults.

When the kids came, it was no longer just taking care of me, taking care of my husband.

It was, as a lot of you out there know, now you have little ones, then they grow up to be school age.

How do you manage all of that?

Nowadays, most women are working moms.

I was lucky in that I could stay home with my kids.

But even so, and in some ways it's harder to be.

And that's a really important point for your viewers, your listeners, is that many women who are at home, I think that that's harder for them than being at work, because at work, there's the structure.

You have to be somewhere at a certain time.

You have a project you have to finish, you know what's expected of you and you get feedback.

So there's structure within that environment.

When you're home, what are you going to do?

You're going to organize your spice cabinet and that makes you feel better?

No.

You're bombarded with taking care of children and communicating with the school.

And if you're not diagnosed and treated for your adhd, and even if you are, it becomes so overwhelming.

And my heart goes out to young moms because I went through it.

I get it.

I really get it.

I don't know how I got through it.

Especially if you have a kid or two or more with adhd.

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

I mean, I know that there's a lot of people found that everything unraveled during the pandemic because we were at home homeschooling.

And I know that's exact what happened with me.

I had four kids at home homeschooling them, one of them being my daughter who I got diagnosed during the pandemic, which, you know, sparked me getting diagnosed.

But this lack of structure and just like a free for all and just not being able to have any routine and not quite know what's going to come and all of that, there's so much unknown.

That is for when I definitely noticed my ADHD just get go completely out of control.

And I know a lot of other people as well.

And that's why there was this huge kind of surge in assessments.

I mean, what's interesting, you discuss all of this.

And back then, like, technology wasn't the way it was right now.

We went, you didn't have the podcast, we didn't have social media, we didn't have TikTok.

Like everything that is created this boom of awareness, which is fantastic, wasn't there.

And you were clearly, you know, you couldn't just go on Amazon and find a book.

If you wanted to get a book, maybe you'd have to go to the library, we'd have to go to the local bookshop.

It was so difficult, this barrier to understanding yourself.

And my heart goes out to so many women who back then didn't have the answers and who were just so desperate to know what was wrong with them and were just not not getting any answers.

And I'm interested to know a little bit about the community that you served back then, 20, 25 years ago of could they believe that they could have ADHD and must have felt very difficult to get the understanding, but then be so limited with the information that was out there.

I think that's a good point.

What a lot of my work back then, and it still happens now, but more so back then was what I heard was, oh, no, I don't have adhd, I'm just lazy, or I have a personality disorder, or it's a character flaw, there's something wrong with me, I don't know what it is.

Oh, no.

Only kids have ADHD.

We had a long way to go back 25, 30 years ago when I started, because that was what people believed.

There's something wrong with me and I'm unlikable and I can't get things done.

I'm stupid.

I heard that a lot.

I'm just stupid.

If you walk around with that kind of self image, people are going to pick up on it and treat you that way.

So a lot of the work was working on self esteem, working on acceptance, working on finding help, which is very difficult even today in many areas of the world.

Yeah, where do I go for help?

That's one of the number one questions I get from people.

Where can I go?

Where can I go?

I live in a rural area.

I live in a country where we don't.

People don't even believe in adhd.

In adults, we still see that.

We still see that.

So my job was a lot of educational kinds of things and supporting people with their self esteem and breaking out of that, a lot of work with couples and in helping the partner understand that this is what's going on.

This is neurobiological condition.

This is not a character flaw.

I know that we still have that issue now, but I believe way more so back in those days when we didn't have what you just described, all of these resources at our fingertips.

Yeah, it's so sad, isn't it?

When you hear that, you hear that relayed back of all the negative self talk and the narrative that so many of us have lived with for so, so long.

And then if you're only just understanding this in your 50s, 60s, 70s, that's a lot of unpacking and relearning and rewiring your brain to think differently and to treat yourself differently, you must get this question asked a lot of like, do you think it's too late?

I personally never think it's too late.

I've had amazing women in my programs who are in their 70s who bring the most incredible wisdom, who share what they've done in their life.

And yes, it's been very challenging, very difficult, but also the glimmers and all the goodness that ADHD has brought, you know, they're still so full of youthfulness and fun and a belief that they can live a better life.

And I just wonder what, I guess what you're noticing in your community right now as well, are you noticing that people are a bit more hopeful?

Yeah, I think there is less of a stigma I think it's still there, but I think the other big piece to this is a lot of these women who are late diagnosed have a longer period of time of being on this earth where they have heard negative things about themselves and have internalized those messages all these years, and look what happened.

So you asked earlier, you know, is it worth it to get diagnosed and treated?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

It's never too late to be happy.

I think that's an important message.

It's never too late.

So, you know, there's that baggage that.

And our colleagues and just peers need to work with each other.

I don't want to come off as thought therapist peers.

When you go to the Facebook groups, when you're, you know, going to these different programs with other people as a group, we need to encourage our peers, our friends, you know, our new friends, that life doesn't end at 35 or 40 or 45.

There's a whole lot of years after that, and we can still follow our dreams.

Maybe before we were identified and treated for our adhd, it would have been way too difficult to go to college or to finish a book.

I can't tell you how many men and women have said to me, I couldn't read a book until I started medication.

And then their lives broaden.

I remember a client that I worked with, a younger man who wanted to go to graduate school and become a social worker.

Like, that's what I've done.

And he says, I can't do it.

How can I?

How can I get through college if I can't focus on the textbook or the professor?

He got evaluated.

I encouraged him to keep going, keep going, keep going.

He got on medication, and his entire life changed.

He got through grad school, he became a psychotherapist, got married, had children.

His life turned around.

The same thing can happen for a woman of any age or a male, you know, a man who's watching.

It's for both men and women, late diagnosis, late treatment is phenomenal.

The only thing that we have to be careful with is the cardiovascular possibility that if as we age, you know, we get more often get more and more medical issues to deal with.

And for many.

I'm just going to go with women right now.

Many women who are having some cardiovascular issues and are on medication need to be careful.

But from what I'm reading, we're learning that many women can still be on stimulant medication even if they have a heart condition and are on medications.

Don't take my word for it.

You need to talk to your physician, don't go by me.

I'm just saying what I'm hearing and.

What I'm seeing, I've heard the same as well.

And I had a conversation with Dr.

Ned Halliwell a few months ago and he said that he was treating someone in I think his late 80s and he put them on stimulant medication.

So it just shows.

And listen, I'm not, I'm saying that medication is incredible if it works for you.

And I know that medication sometimes doesn't work or it's not a long term solution or some people just need the medication for a certain period of their life or to get them through college exams, you know, big work commitments.

I like to kind of talk about medication in that you can try it and if it works for certain things and great.

But if not, there's so many other ways as well to manage your adhd.

And that is, you know, first of all, through the awareness, through understanding, through the psycho education, like you say, the Facebook group, you know, if you find your community, you find your tribe and you're able to ask questions and finally, like drop the mask, be more authentic, find out from other women what, know what's worked for them.

That's what I love about ADHD is that there's so much curiosity.

And these are the women, they're so resourceful and so incredible.

And what I love about what you're doing, and we're going to talk about it, is what you're, this new community that you've created.

Was it something wonderful?

Women with adhd, you.

Because I feel that, you know, as we've been talking about as we get older and you don't, you don't even have to be older.

Any woman who's grown up as an adult and has heard negative messages in school, negative messages from their parents, negative messages from their peers.

Well, I wanted to develop something that celebrated women with ADHD and focus on the power we have within, the ability we have to grow and to change.

It's there.

I've lived it.

I've worked with so many women.

I love people with ADHD because of the things that you described.

We are problem solvers.

We had to be because, you know, things were difficult.

We had to come up with our own strategies.

The women that I work with are incredibly creative.

There's been just few studies that show creativity, the correlation, and we need a lot more work on that because it seems like every woman I've ever known with ADHD is I can almost be in a room and Feel it now or just, you know, notice someone I'm talking to.

I bet.

I bet there's something about.

There's a spark in them if they're not clobbered by depression or substance abuse because they haven't been adequately treated, which kills me, which is what keeps me in this field for so long, is I see how powerful the proper treatment can be.

But, yeah, I think that this is why I stay, because of the qualities.

And this program that I'm developing is all online and it's affordable because I strongly believe a lot of women still to this day are underemployed, even if they don't have adhd, you know, but add to it.

I try to make it affordable to most people.

And it's another community where people, especially women who are away from a lot of women who do have adhd, and I'm just.

I'm lucky.

I mean, that's my life, is being around women with adhd.

But not everyone has that opportunity that I have.

So this is a way to connect.

But the thing that's different about my program is that women will be learning skills, so they'll be going into zoom rooms, and I'll have different categories, body doubling, getting things done, what to do with all the millions of photographs sitting in your boxes, in their closet gathering dust, what to make for dinner.

And then I'll have communities, you know, many communities by age group.

So 18 to.

I can't remember now, 18 to 25, you know, 30 to 40, whatever, up until whatever.

So I wanted to make something available for everybody's needs as best that I could.

Talking about newly diagnosed women.

These are things that over the years kept coming back to me, like, what do I do?

What's wrong with me?

How can I get help?

Where do I get help?

So I wanted to kind of combine it.

And I'm going to have guest speakers, too, because one of the things that have been really helpful to me as a professional and being so involved in these conferences, national conferences that I usually present at and was very involved with and still am, is I met some wonderful people like you.

You know, I hope that you'll be one of my guests and run a group one day, you know, and I have access to all of these wonderful people.

So I'm really, really going on and on.

I'm really excited.

We should be launching shortly, I hope.

Sounds like an absolute gift, and I love that you've considered all these different parts of it.

And, you know, when you talk about the women, they've got sparks and creativity.

And then you said about the other.

On the flip side, they've not been blighted with depression and substance abuse.

And fortunately that has been a big part of my family story, you know, family members that has happened.

ADHD is all over my family and it's.

Some are undiagnosed, unaware, some people are, it was just they're so far down the line and all, all different things.

And thankfully there's a lot of awareness as well in my family.

But it makes me incredibly sad that women have got to that point where they've not fulfilled their potential.

Like you say, they are working, they're underpaid, they've not believed in themselves enough to sort of open their expansiveness and put themselves forward, all these different things.

But for me, it's 100% when I see that women have been blighted by mental health challenges and crises and the substance abuse has been a big part because they've not had any other way of quietening their mind and their bodies and their nervous systems and not understanding what's been going on.

And that's why these conversations are so important, because we can talk all about the amazing part of ADHD and you know, but we never, ever, ever diminish.

Unfortunately, I think the challenges do outweigh the goodness of adhd.

But what I would love to see, now that there's so much awareness, I would love to see a balance and I would love women, especially for them to say, yes, I am more prone to anxiety, depression, overthinking, hyper vigilance, all these different things, but see it as, as an awareness and have lots of tools and strategies so they can say I've not got to that point anymore because I know I've got to prioritize myself, I have to prioritize my well being and I've got to think how I can sleep better, move my body, stress relief, all these different things that just so many of us just haven't considered at all.

And we get to a point, you know, we talk about cardiovascular issues, talk about a lot of other health issues and so much of it has been connected to undiagnosed ADHD and not prioritizing or not even understanding how important it is that we need to be looking after ourselves.

I wonder, like what, what you, what you've seen as well in your community.

I agree with everything you say.

And one of the biggest challenges that I've been facing throughout my career, even now, is educating the medical community, this mental health community of professionals that women especially are still being Misdiagnosed.

And this is my message.

I hope there's clinicians listening.

Women are still being, as you know very well, Kate, misdiagnosed, mainly with depression.

That's the number one thing I hear, substance abuse, you know, go into substance abuse treatment.

So, so my challenge is educating the professionals because so many of us are still being misdiagnosed or we're.

They're catching parts of it, but not the whole story.

Yeah.

As you know.

And then getting back a little bit to what you were saying about self care.

Now if someone is not diagnosed, treated for their ADHD and they fall into a depression or they have a comorbidity, which is a co.

You know, existing condition of depression and anxiety, and if that depression is still leveling somebody down, how are they going to have the interest, the energy, the willingness, the ability to go to the gym, to take a walk every day, to, you know, dance, whatever it is, to make themselves healthy, to eat healthy foods?

This is a real dilemma which ties into the professionals.

Again, if the professionals are missing it, they're treating the depression, but they're not feeling any better because the ADHD is not being addressed.

So you can still be depressed because of your adhd.

You know, you're not getting things done.

Your life is a mess.

So these women can't self, you know, get involved with any kind of self care activities if they're too depressed to do it.

Yeah, it goes around and around.

I'm presuming that your program is open for women who may have not got an official diagnosis, but strongly suspect that ADHD has been there with them their whole life.

Because I personally think that no one actively wants adhd.

So if you strongly suspect and you read about it, you go, my God, that's my life.

A lot of people do want that validation and I do think a diagnosis is very helpful for lots of things, including medication.

But if a diagnosis is a not possible financially or you're on a waiting list and, and I personally, you, the minute you have that realization, start helping yourself, start listening to the podcasts, reading the books.

Can they join your program if it's just sort of self identified?

Oh, of course, of course.

Anyone who thinks that they may have it come.

As a matter of fact, you've given me a great idea and that could be a zoom room just for women like what you're describing.

Do I have a.

What should I do?

This is what I'm challenged with.

And I'll be popping in and out.

And as a clinician, you know, I can Help guide that person to, well, what's your next step?

What, what can we do to help you figure out what's going on with you?

So, yeah, absolutely.

And my free Facebook group for women with adhd, that's open to women too, who say, because I do screening there, I have a whole bunch of volunteers, I can't do it myself.

And one of the screening questions is, do you have or think you have adhd?

Then you're welcome, of course.

Yeah.

I wanted to ask you about.

Well, first of all, we know hormones now are completely interconnected with adhd.

So much of it, you know, especially for women when they are noticing whether ADHD particularly showed up in a very challenging way.

And we know, you know, the peaks of puberty, you know, pregnancy, post pregnancy, perimenopause, menopause.

And I'm interested to know what happens post menopause with adhd.

What are you noticing in women who have kind of navigated these very turbulent times and have kind of come out through menopause?

How is their ADHD presenting?

Well, a lot of this has to do with education.

Again, that now there is, I don't remember now if there's no, I believe there's a tiny bit of estrogen still going on in our systems as postmenopausal women.

And when you have low levels of estrogen, no matter what where you are in your hormonal life, if it's low, it often, not always, but it often causes an increase in ADHD symptomology.

So some women, no matter what their age, can help that problem.

Which means, you know, I'm still scattered, I'm still this, I'm having a tough time.

Some of them, as Dr.

Patricia Quinn talked about many years ago.

She's now retired, but she, her work was monumental.

Where you can improve your ADHD symptomology through hormone replacement therapy again and again, I am not a medical person.

Go to your doctor.

Now, here we go again with some problems.

Most doctors have no clue about ADHD symptomology and hormones, the connection.

So it often means educating the doctor.

I don't know of any woman that's ever said to me, maybe a couple who have said to me, I talked it over with my doctor, they knew all about it.

I'm on hormone replacement.

So there's one, there's educating the physician or the medical person, and two, your health.

Some people cannot take hormone replacement therapy.

I have to really throw that out there.

That's where you really have to have a good medical person on your team who can help you with yes or no.

If that's not an option and you're really struggling with your ADHD symptoms, then we have to go into things like, you know, ADHD medications.

We have to tweak that, we have to add something to it.

Coaching, I would say coaching would be way up there in how that will help women with ADHD who are still struggling.

Because especially, you know, for the hormones, are creating problems with your adhd.

Because our coaches, like you, our coaches are our executive functioning, our external executive functioning, meaning you help women and men, kids, teenagers with how to start, how to maintain what you're trying to do, how to accomplish what you need to do, all the planning that goes with it, all the things that go with getting from A to B and from B to C.

That's how I simplify it.

And we reach out to our coaches who can help us step by step with what to do and how to do it.

So if you're at that situation in your life where you're really struggling, even with younger women too, of course, and it's all ages, but specifying the older woman who's just really in a funk, depression may come in a little bit more is to work with an AD coach.

Yeah, I totally agree.

I don't think you can underestimate the power of working with someone who is in your corner, who wants to see you succeed.

And that is, you know, that is a coach.

Your coach should be your cheerleader.

It should be that person where that is helping you, suggesting, guiding you, giving you the confidence to trust in yourself and believe that you do have the resources within you and giving you that nudge forward.

Because so many of us have had the opposite.

We've had the criticisms, we've had the insults, we've had the snarky comments.

And it's just kind of brought our RSD to the forefront where we've just kind of got like a bit of a wall.

So we're too terrified to try anything.

We know we've got all this potential, but actually we've been told all our lives that we're not good enough or there's no way we could do that because we're not organized enough or we don't have the capability and all that.

And then we believe it.

So having coaching, you know, for me was 100%, like revolutionary.

And that's why I love, love, love working with like one to one clients because you see, you see that progress and you see them sort of stepping into a bit of empowerment and stepping into that like that self belief.

And I do, I agree with you.

I think coaching even in.

For older people as well, can be really, really empowering, especially when maybe their generation hasn't really sort of had that introduction to therapy or the sort of self development world.

And it's just a lovely way for them to start kind of believing that actually there are things I can still accomplish, there are things I can still achieve, or I can meet new people, or I can go out of my comfort zone a little bit and I can live a good life with adhd.

And that's all people want to do.

I mean, I've realized that now that everyone that comes to me, you know, whether they've got big aspirations, career aspirations, or they want to have a good relationship or anything, it's.

It's essentially just living peacefully with the knowledge of their ADHD and with the awareness and the understanding and working with their brains as opposed to sort of constantly being banging their heads against walls.

And you've.

It's so inspiring to hear how pivotal you've been in this growth.

And yeah, it's an honor to speak to you.

And I know that so many people will be interested in what you do and perhaps the newer generation of people who are just coming here with ADHD and kind of go, I need to check out Terry's work.

I need to read the book.

Tell me about the award winning book, Queen of Distract.

Is it Queen of Distraction?

Yeah, the Queen of Distraction my husband coined.

He coined that.

That's my nickname around here, the Queen of Distraction.

So when was that written?

I believe so.

It's.

It's older now.

I think it was 2015.

Okay.

But what, what I did with the book was each chapter has a different issue, so it might be relationships.

I have a whole thing about hypersensitivities that we talked about earlier off camera.

I'm very interested in that.

I talk about hormones, I talk about moms with adhd.

Another area of deep interest for me.

And I just go through the whole thing.

But I started off in a story of two women.

One who has the hyperactive impulsivity type of ADHD, and one woman who has inattentive.

And we follow their lives, how their ADHD symptoms unfold.

And then it goes straight into.

You don't have to read the whole book.

You just go into whatever cooking.

That's another one for me.

With small kids.

That was horrible.

And when you say about, when you talked about having someone in your corner, that really struck a chord in me because it's so true.

And I hope that the book, in my work and your work and people like us who are in the field who really want to help, will impart the message that you're not broken.

You happen to have an ADHD brain.

And no matter how old you are, life is still there for you to enjoy and to conquer.

Because as a woman gets older, I'm just kind of going backwards a little bit.

But as a woman gets older, she often has some freedom.

The children are now grown, maybe she's retired, she has some extra time, and that's when she can really dive into what her interests and wishes were as a younger person, but couldn't get there.

Now the doors are wide open, for the most part, for.

For you women who now are, you know, aging into a different phase of your life, which can be absolutely a wonderful time.

Yeah, I think it's a really nice, empowering way to end our conversation because I would hate anyone to feel despondent or feel like there's just no point in progressing with an ADHD diagnosis or anything, because it's always worth understanding ourselves better.

It's always worth having this knowledge and this acceptance and this compassion that we are brilliant.

And, yes, we might find life challenging in some places, but interesting.

And I spoke to someone the other day, and they explained ADHD as a neurodevelopmental difference with an imbalance in different hemispheres.

And that imbalance means that sometimes our challenges can override our strengths, and sometimes our strengths can override our challenges.

And that just made me see ADHD quite differently in the sense that it's kind of like having your foot on a brake and an accelerator and you sort of just like sometimes you've got your foot full down on the accelerator and it just feels great.

And sometimes it just feels like you're just constantly breaking.

And that feels like an easier way to understand ourselves, that it's.

There's ebbs and flows and like, some days are going to feel easier and some days are going to feel harder.

But if we are able to curate a way of living, that hopefully means we've got our foot on the accelerator a little bit more.

Unless slamming on the brake, life hopefully might feel a bit more effortless.

So, yeah, I like that a lot.

I love that.

Thank you for that.

Yeah, I liked it as well, which is why I'm happy to share it.

So tell.

Tell me where.

Where should people come and find you if people are interested in your new program?

Well, my main website is add consults.com.

i do.

I have a lot of resources there.

One of the main things I do is consultations on Zoom or an email.

So that's where you can find me.

Or you can email me at Terry T r r y dconsults.com the new program, once we launch it is actually open now.

You can jump in and put yourself on a waiting list to be informed when I open the doors.

And that's powerful women with ADHD.com so either of those ways and I'm just, you know, if I can help, I would love to connect with, with your, your attendees.

Well, thank you so much Terry.

It's been an absolute pleasure to meet you and yeah, I look forward to connecting and staying in touch.

Well, thank you for having me.

This was a delightful conversation.

Thanks.

If you've enjoyed today's episode, I invite you to check out my brand new subscription podcast called the Toolkit.

Now this is where I'm going to be opening up my entire library.

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Really hope to see you there.