1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,550 G'day everyone, it's Michelle J Raymond and we are back again, listeners, 2 00:00:03,550 --> 00:00:07,829 talking about my favorite topic which is all things LinkedIn Company Pages. 3 00:00:08,129 --> 00:00:12,829 And listeners, I've got a very special guest who has been part of a project 4 00:00:13,190 --> 00:00:21,320 that has grown a LinkedIn Company Page to 500,000 followers since 2023. 5 00:00:21,679 --> 00:00:25,449 Holly Kerr, I can't wait to have this conversation with you. 6 00:00:25,769 --> 00:00:29,090 Thanks for coming and sharing the secret to your success. 7 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:31,169 Oh, no, thank you so much for having me. 8 00:00:31,169 --> 00:00:34,779 I'm, yeah, I'm always, um, excited to talk about LinkedIn and especially when 9 00:00:34,779 --> 00:00:38,430 it's, um, about Company Pages, which I think at the moment are getting a bit of 10 00:00:38,430 --> 00:00:41,990 bad press and, people are saying they're not very effective and I disagree. 11 00:00:42,333 --> 00:00:46,903 Look, and that is exactly why I have you on here, and I heard you on 12 00:00:47,073 --> 00:00:52,213 another podcast and I was listening going, "Yes, it can be successful." 13 00:00:52,213 --> 00:00:54,723 Like, there isn't all bad news listeners. 14 00:00:54,723 --> 00:00:59,283 There are shining examples out there which I'm gonna have more of people like 15 00:00:59,283 --> 00:01:03,793 you, Holly, onto the podcast so that we can actually show people what's possible. 16 00:01:04,063 --> 00:01:07,443 And just because everyone bags out LinkedIn Company Pages and says 17 00:01:07,443 --> 00:01:11,673 they're a waste of time, yeah, that's great if that's still your corporate 18 00:01:11,673 --> 00:01:13,403 job and you're responsible for it. 19 00:01:13,663 --> 00:01:17,863 But Holly, like for people who haven't come across you, can you just tell us, 20 00:01:18,183 --> 00:01:24,683 like what is your role at Atkins Realis and what is it that actually you do 21 00:01:24,683 --> 00:01:26,343 and what are your responsibilities? 22 00:01:26,343 --> 00:01:30,683 Because something tells me that you're not just sitting there just doing LinkedIn. 23 00:01:31,563 --> 00:01:31,783 No. 24 00:01:31,783 --> 00:01:34,333 And, and sure, I, I can kind of give a bit of insight. 25 00:01:34,333 --> 00:01:39,153 So I've worked for Atkins Realis for coming on nine years in July. 26 00:01:39,563 --> 00:01:45,230 I've been in a social media focused role for two years and 27 00:01:45,510 --> 00:01:48,210 that was kind of when I stepped into focusing only on social media. 28 00:01:48,210 --> 00:01:50,000 So I have a marketing background before that. 29 00:01:50,670 --> 00:01:53,380 And for anyone who doesn't know, Atkins Realis is an engineering 30 00:01:53,380 --> 00:01:56,090 and nuclear services Company, so it's in the B2B space. 31 00:01:56,710 --> 00:01:58,350 We don't have a product that we're selling. 32 00:01:58,350 --> 00:02:04,040 We have our people, their expertise, and the solutions that we're trying to, um, 33 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,430 bring to clients and kind of communities in, in these projects that we deliver. 34 00:02:08,029 --> 00:02:10,499 So what does that mean for social media? 35 00:02:10,959 --> 00:02:14,489 My responsibilities kind of cover all of the channels that we're on, and 36 00:02:14,489 --> 00:02:17,459 that is the ones you would probably expect we're, we're kind of there. 37 00:02:17,459 --> 00:02:20,229 So, LinkedIn is our primary. 38 00:02:20,269 --> 00:02:23,889 We find that most of our audience are there, and it's, 39 00:02:23,929 --> 00:02:25,289 uh, it's a key focus for us. 40 00:02:26,159 --> 00:02:31,579 But outside the kind of day-to-day posting on the Company Page, that strategy has 41 00:02:31,579 --> 00:02:35,659 evolved, especially over the last kind of five years as LinkedIn has grown 42 00:02:35,659 --> 00:02:40,674 and kind of morphed into what it is now So we look at the paid approach. 43 00:02:40,784 --> 00:02:45,814 We also look at leader-led social media, so what are the execs and 44 00:02:45,814 --> 00:02:49,224 kind of leaders from the business out there posting, if anything. 45 00:02:49,724 --> 00:02:54,714 And then our people, we have a 40,000 strong employee workforce, and we've, 46 00:02:54,744 --> 00:02:58,724 I think, all heard now the impact employee advo- advocacy can have. 47 00:02:59,414 --> 00:03:02,854 Um, so our LinkedIn strategy is kind of, has kind of got those four 48 00:03:02,854 --> 00:03:07,491 prongs, and we try and move away from sometimes the business comes to us and 49 00:03:07,491 --> 00:03:09,421 says, "Can we get this on LinkedIn?" 50 00:03:09,811 --> 00:03:13,421 And I think we were in a place before where the knee-jerk was like, "Yes, 51 00:03:13,421 --> 00:03:16,698 we'll do a Company Page post. Let's get that sorted." We try and take a 52 00:03:16,698 --> 00:03:21,828 step back and we try and offer insights into what might be the best lever 53 00:03:21,828 --> 00:03:25,328 to pull, and sometimes it's one of them, sometimes it's all of them, and 54 00:03:25,328 --> 00:03:26,798 sometimes it's gonna be a mixture. 55 00:03:27,378 --> 00:03:31,468 But so outside of kind of that day-to-day, we look after the, the governance, 56 00:03:31,538 --> 00:03:35,748 the strategy and then the training of uh, all of our people and kind of 57 00:03:36,058 --> 00:03:37,528 at various different levels as well. 58 00:03:38,091 --> 00:03:40,731 So you're sitting round twiddling your thumbs is what I hear. 59 00:03:40,731 --> 00:03:40,931 Yes. 60 00:03:40,931 --> 00:03:42,821 So much free time on your hands. 61 00:03:42,821 --> 00:03:46,821 Like, that is the thing that I think, I just got back from Social Media Marketing 62 00:03:46,821 --> 00:03:51,331 World, got to speak to lots of great marketers there, and I, I shared it on 63 00:03:51,331 --> 00:03:56,061 last week's episode, but the thing that blew me away is just how many things 64 00:03:56,061 --> 00:04:01,241 marketing teams, social media teams are juggling in day-to-day life in corporate. 65 00:04:01,281 --> 00:04:03,331 It, it is just mind-blowing. 66 00:04:03,371 --> 00:04:03,971 I'm lucky. 67 00:04:03,971 --> 00:04:07,131 I just get to be an expert on LinkedIn, and specifically, you 68 00:04:07,131 --> 00:04:08,991 know, Pages and employee advocacy. 69 00:04:08,991 --> 00:04:10,261 Mm. I don't even touch paid. 70 00:04:10,261 --> 00:04:14,351 So, you know, for me, it's quite a challenge to keep up with all the 71 00:04:14,351 --> 00:04:19,001 changes, so I can only imagine even with all of your experience, you know, 72 00:04:19,001 --> 00:04:23,551 trying to convey the latest, greatest tips of what's going on, align it still 73 00:04:23,551 --> 00:04:27,291 with your strategy, achieve the business goals, and I'm imagining that there's 74 00:04:27,291 --> 00:04:30,121 a lot of people that have a lot of opinions on what you guys are doing- Yeah 75 00:04:30,121 --> 00:04:31,111 and what you should be doing. 76 00:04:31,111 --> 00:04:34,891 And we will talk about that later, because I think that's probably the 77 00:04:34,891 --> 00:04:39,021 biggest challenge that internal teams have is trying to fend off- Mm ... all 78 00:04:39,021 --> 00:04:40,611 of the requests that come through. 79 00:04:40,691 --> 00:04:44,984 But I did tease the audience, and it is actually true, that you guys 80 00:04:44,984 --> 00:04:50,144 crossed over 500,000 followers, most of which have grown since 2023. 81 00:04:50,204 --> 00:04:55,354 I know that that number's even higher now since we booked to have this conversation. 82 00:04:55,464 --> 00:05:01,624 But why do you think in a world where organic Company Page reach 83 00:05:01,624 --> 00:05:05,341 is next to nothing, why do you think the Page grew so much? 84 00:05:05,341 --> 00:05:08,051 Because there are people out there that have access to all of those 85 00:05:08,051 --> 00:05:11,691 things that you have, employee advocacy or paid strategies or, 86 00:05:11,751 --> 00:05:13,201 all, all the things that you said. 87 00:05:13,671 --> 00:05:16,241 What do you think has been the secret to your success? 88 00:05:16,744 --> 00:05:17,224 Sure. 89 00:05:17,304 --> 00:05:21,254 I had to think about this and I wanted to kind of make sure my answer wasn't, 90 00:05:21,254 --> 00:05:23,863 you know- It wasn't kind of wishy-washy. 91 00:05:24,093 --> 00:05:28,079 So I've, I've really tried to, um, sit and, and, and stew on it. 92 00:05:28,079 --> 00:05:31,619 So I think the first thing I have to acknowledge is it's an established 93 00:05:31,619 --> 00:05:35,099 brand within its category, and that is a big boost, right? 94 00:05:35,099 --> 00:05:35,979 That's a big help. 95 00:05:36,069 --> 00:05:41,406 We rebranded in 2023 in September, so we had to start a new Page, and there was 96 00:05:41,406 --> 00:05:45,176 obviously legacy understanding of this brand and where it was moving, and exci- 97 00:05:45,206 --> 00:05:47,016 excitement after the initial rebrand. 98 00:05:47,366 --> 00:05:49,356 So I think that got us started. 99 00:05:50,076 --> 00:05:54,406 Outside of that, I think acknowledging that this was a huge team effort. 100 00:05:54,406 --> 00:05:58,326 This was not going to happen with the three people that work 101 00:05:58,326 --> 00:05:59,886 in my team, so including me. 102 00:05:59,916 --> 00:06:03,756 So there's three of us who work on the 13 channels that we run globally. 103 00:06:03,756 --> 00:06:08,753 Um, we were never going to have, um, the ability to reach kind of ambitious 104 00:06:08,753 --> 00:06:09,813 goals just working on our own. 105 00:06:09,813 --> 00:06:14,553 And I think we had to kind of take a step back and look at what was 106 00:06:14,553 --> 00:06:17,703 our goal, and it was initially growth, and it was brand awareness. 107 00:06:18,139 --> 00:06:22,303 So we broadened the net in terms of who can help us, what ideas can 108 00:06:22,303 --> 00:06:25,966 we throw into the mix, and that took us into a space where we were 109 00:06:25,966 --> 00:06:28,856 testing, and we were failing fast. 110 00:06:28,906 --> 00:06:31,736 I know people say that a lot and it- and sometimes it's really hard to get into a 111 00:06:31,736 --> 00:06:35,806 space where you feel you can do that on a stage that is so visible, like, uh, social 112 00:06:35,806 --> 00:06:37,996 media accounts because people can see it. 113 00:06:38,106 --> 00:06:42,806 But we tried different things, whether that was formats, whether it was 114 00:06:43,206 --> 00:06:47,706 recurring items, whether we, you know, we ran for a while a meet our experts, 115 00:06:47,706 --> 00:06:51,126 where we would share employee profiles and see, you know, how do people relate 116 00:06:51,126 --> 00:06:52,596 to this and how are they responding. 117 00:06:53,206 --> 00:06:57,496 We tested different types of video and all the while kind of contesting 118 00:06:57,496 --> 00:07:01,696 with the algorithmic changes that kind of, appear, um, and kind 119 00:07:01,696 --> 00:07:03,866 of throw chaos into your plans. 120 00:07:04,836 --> 00:07:08,086 I think as well, we, we spoke about this before, but we 121 00:07:08,086 --> 00:07:09,656 reduced down the number of posts. 122 00:07:09,656 --> 00:07:12,776 So when I first came into this role, we were posting upwards of 123 00:07:12,776 --> 00:07:15,276 six times a day in a 24-hour period. 124 00:07:15,276 --> 00:07:16,116 That's just a lot. 125 00:07:16,406 --> 00:07:20,253 And if you're acknowledging Company Page posts are already competing with 126 00:07:20,253 --> 00:07:24,493 the rest of the feed and boosted posts and ads, why compete with yourself was 127 00:07:24,493 --> 00:07:28,113 kind of what we were, we were trying to put forward to our stakeholders. 128 00:07:28,113 --> 00:07:32,933 So we now post twice within a 24-hour period, and I think bringing a bit 129 00:07:32,933 --> 00:07:35,283 of balance and control has helped. 130 00:07:35,313 --> 00:07:40,313 It's helped us redirect some of the content to come out via individual 131 00:07:40,313 --> 00:07:42,223 accounts or leader accounts as well. 132 00:07:42,526 --> 00:07:46,636 But we really said, "What do we want people to follow us for? 133 00:07:46,766 --> 00:07:50,219 Like, why would they follow this Page?" And we really defined that. 134 00:07:50,219 --> 00:07:55,039 So we break news, we share stories of what the brand is doing, but we 135 00:07:55,039 --> 00:07:58,679 try and really put the lens over of like how ... Why does this matter 136 00:07:58,679 --> 00:08:00,269 to anyone kind of just scrolling? 137 00:08:00,676 --> 00:08:03,216 How does this impact the communities that we're serving? 138 00:08:03,559 --> 00:08:09,479 Put that at the core of the post and the story so we're not talking about all the 139 00:08:09,479 --> 00:08:12,229 time, "Oh, Atkins Realis- is doing this." 140 00:08:12,519 --> 00:08:17,579 A lot of the time we're trying to either educate or inform or kind of energise 141 00:08:17,709 --> 00:08:22,129 people behind the industry that we're working in or the, the impact that, uh, 142 00:08:22,129 --> 00:08:26,399 projects can have that often, I, I find out something new every week that we do, 143 00:08:26,399 --> 00:08:28,459 and, and other people won't know either. 144 00:08:28,459 --> 00:08:34,416 So we really tried to consider why someone would want to follow us, and 145 00:08:34,416 --> 00:08:40,376 then try and keep that in mind among all of the other things we have to consider 146 00:08:40,436 --> 00:08:43,166 in, in a plan for our Company Page. 147 00:08:43,619 --> 00:08:48,326 I know, listeners, that Holly has just shared so many cool things, 148 00:08:48,326 --> 00:08:50,416 and I could talk about this all day. 149 00:08:50,416 --> 00:08:53,556 And I appreciate your honesty in thinking about this answer because, 150 00:08:54,016 --> 00:08:57,726 yes, there have been some advantages that you have from the size of the 151 00:08:57,726 --> 00:09:01,856 brand that you have, and the resources, and the legacy of that brand. 152 00:09:02,516 --> 00:09:06,346 But I think that the actual winning piece of what you've just shared 153 00:09:06,346 --> 00:09:10,696 there is creating something worth following for your industry. 154 00:09:11,026 --> 00:09:14,976 And, uh, if I could have that on T-shirts and sell it to everybody 155 00:09:14,976 --> 00:09:20,126 and say, "Do what Holly says," like create a Page worth following, I'm 156 00:09:20,126 --> 00:09:24,236 gonna say that algorithm aside and all the other crazy that comes into the 157 00:09:24,236 --> 00:09:29,716 platform, I actually think that is the most simple way to define the success 158 00:09:29,716 --> 00:09:31,186 that would come with a Company Page. 159 00:09:31,186 --> 00:09:36,133 And I 100% agree with you is why are we actually putting 160 00:09:36,133 --> 00:09:37,613 all of this effort into Pages? 161 00:09:37,643 --> 00:09:39,223 Is it just to talk about ourselves? 162 00:09:39,223 --> 00:09:42,923 And I did a podcast episode recently where I was talking about a lot of 163 00:09:42,923 --> 00:09:47,073 Pages turn into the internal newsletter or bulletin board- Mm-hmm ... where we 164 00:09:47,073 --> 00:09:51,653 talk about what's coming up, what we're gonna do, here's what we've been doing. 165 00:09:51,703 --> 00:09:54,873 You know, we, we, we, we, we, and nothing about the industry. 166 00:09:54,873 --> 00:09:59,126 So I have a very happy heart listening to what you're sharing here, and 167 00:09:59,126 --> 00:10:02,006 no doubt that that's been, you know, a part of the big success. 168 00:10:02,056 --> 00:10:06,546 But I, I think it's also interesting that, as you said, there's lots of 169 00:10:06,546 --> 00:10:11,516 pieces to this puzzle, and some of it is acknowledging that when you try stuff, 170 00:10:12,056 --> 00:10:16,746 you're not necessarily gonna break a whole brand because a post fails. 171 00:10:16,746 --> 00:10:18,416 Can we just talk about that one more time? 172 00:10:18,646 --> 00:10:23,226 Because I think being scared that you're gonna break a brand stops people 173 00:10:23,226 --> 00:10:25,206 from trying things to see what works. 174 00:10:25,236 --> 00:10:29,236 Is that something you had to go through in the beginning- Yes ... and come 175 00:10:29,236 --> 00:10:31,236 to terms with what that actually was? 176 00:10:31,686 --> 00:10:33,926 Yes, and I think we could all relate. 177 00:10:33,986 --> 00:10:35,186 We hear it all the time, you know. 178 00:10:35,466 --> 00:10:40,016 The thing I put the most love and energy into and think, "This is gonna be the 179 00:10:40,056 --> 00:10:44,506 post. We'll talk about this for years to come, and this will be the defining moment 180 00:10:44,506 --> 00:10:49,816 of my social media career," is the post that gets, vanity metrics are terrible, 181 00:10:49,996 --> 00:10:54,823 the impressions are not what I wanted, and it just passes by without anyone caring. 182 00:10:55,343 --> 00:10:59,789 And the thing that you whip up quickly and get out there in a rush with 183 00:10:59,789 --> 00:11:03,469 none of your governance and none of your strategy, it does really well. 184 00:11:03,649 --> 00:11:09,179 And I think there's a lesson in that which is sometimes we can overcomplicate 185 00:11:09,519 --> 00:11:14,299 what we're doing, and at the core, if we come back to that piece that you 186 00:11:14,299 --> 00:11:18,029 just pulled out which is, i- is this something that I care about if I'm 187 00:11:18,029 --> 00:11:20,659 scrolling past tens of posts a day? 188 00:11:20,989 --> 00:11:23,806 And if the answer's yes, then you're, you're onto a good thing. 189 00:11:23,806 --> 00:11:27,883 I think we have had lots of failures in terms of things 190 00:11:27,883 --> 00:11:28,953 we've tried and it hasn't worked. 191 00:11:29,373 --> 00:11:33,223 One of the biggest obstacles we had when we first rebranded was this new brand we 192 00:11:33,223 --> 00:11:37,963 have is way more vibrant than the... We were kind of blue and grey before, and 193 00:11:37,963 --> 00:11:42,899 we're now, we've got four key colours, and they're bold, and we have this, 194 00:11:42,929 --> 00:11:46,339 um, brilliance as kind of the effect of, uh, the way the brand is applied. 195 00:11:46,339 --> 00:11:51,729 And it's a learning curve to learn how to apply it in a way that isn't garish and 196 00:11:51,729 --> 00:11:56,469 isn't standing out and looking clunky, and I still don't get that right all the time. 197 00:11:56,499 --> 00:11:59,083 But we... You have to try things, and you have to kind of see 198 00:11:59,083 --> 00:12:00,673 how it looks and it goes over. 199 00:12:01,093 --> 00:12:05,243 I think, though, that is part of the joy I find in this role. 200 00:12:05,243 --> 00:12:09,589 It, it's the thing that brings me the most annoyance and the most happiness. 201 00:12:09,619 --> 00:12:14,609 It, it's that kind of, um, dual- duality of it where I'm happy when something 202 00:12:15,079 --> 00:12:18,279 works really well and, and I also then feel, really gutted when it doesn't. 203 00:12:18,279 --> 00:12:20,114 But- That's what keeps it interesting. 204 00:12:20,284 --> 00:12:21,788 That's what keeps me coming back. 205 00:12:22,108 --> 00:12:23,168 Oh, welcome to my world. 206 00:12:23,168 --> 00:12:27,258 I spent the last three months of last year rocking in a corner going, "Do I 207 00:12:27,258 --> 00:12:29,258 even wanna do this LinkedIn stuff anymore? 208 00:12:29,258 --> 00:12:33,058 Where have all my impressions gone?" On the other hand, posting everyone, 209 00:12:33,098 --> 00:12:36,658 it's all about relative" "... and it's not about impressions, it's not about 210 00:12:36,658 --> 00:12:41,388 reach." And so on one hand, I knew what it was, but my inside, the honest truth, 211 00:12:41,388 --> 00:12:46,538 listeners, is that I was shattered and I did not know how to respond to 212 00:12:46,538 --> 00:12:51,858 something that had worked consistently in my personal content for 10 years. 213 00:12:51,948 --> 00:12:55,918 I could ... I knew if I did this, this would be the outcome every 214 00:12:55,918 --> 00:12:57,698 single time, day after day for that. 215 00:12:57,958 --> 00:13:01,108 And then as times goes on, and then LinkedIn wake up one day and they 216 00:13:01,108 --> 00:13:05,548 say, "Okay, it's about relevancy and not reach now. Uh, we're changing 217 00:13:05,548 --> 00:13:07,998 the whole game" and it felt awful. 218 00:13:08,058 --> 00:13:10,658 You know, a- and I'm not going to sugarcoat that. 219 00:13:11,108 --> 00:13:17,694 I actually think Pages have been shielded from this impact on such a level because 220 00:13:18,104 --> 00:13:22,324 realistically, most Pages were never in the feed for the last six years that 221 00:13:22,324 --> 00:13:23,894 I've been focused on Company Pages. 222 00:13:24,254 --> 00:13:27,094 We were never showing in the home feed, so w- I don't think any Page 223 00:13:27,094 --> 00:13:30,474 admins really noticed the bump from this side of things, and it'll be 224 00:13:30,474 --> 00:13:31,834 interesting to see where it goes. 225 00:13:31,834 --> 00:13:36,804 I, I literally spent an hour on a call today with an, a, a friend of mine who's 226 00:13:36,904 --> 00:13:40,884 part of the engineering team for the Pages team, and there's some fundamental shifts 227 00:13:40,884 --> 00:13:44,974 that I'm excited about where they're going and I'd love to tell you, but I 228 00:13:44,974 --> 00:13:46,974 can't, uh, otherwise I'll get cut off. 229 00:13:47,114 --> 00:13:51,574 But what I love is that they're open to where the next evolution of Pages 230 00:13:51,624 --> 00:13:54,814 is, and that's something that excites me 'cause it means they're putting 231 00:13:54,814 --> 00:14:00,254 money into it, and that means that they still value Pages like we all should. 232 00:14:00,674 --> 00:14:06,728 Now, when you did your celebration post for this big achievement, I was 233 00:14:06,728 --> 00:14:11,088 so glad that you did stop for a minute and actually acknowledge the work that 234 00:14:11,088 --> 00:14:17,198 had gone into this massive achievement 'cause I just wanna say, I know how hard 235 00:14:17,238 --> 00:14:21,038 it is to grow a Page regardless of all of those things that you had behind you. 236 00:14:21,518 --> 00:14:25,318 You have to show up and do the work and be in service of your audience. 237 00:14:25,318 --> 00:14:29,741 But there was one line that stood out from that post and it caught 238 00:14:29,741 --> 00:14:35,391 my attention, which is, "Employee advocacy isn't a tactic for us, it's 239 00:14:35,461 --> 00:14:40,161 a behaviour." What does that actually mean and look like inside your business? 240 00:14:40,468 --> 00:14:40,888 Sure. 241 00:14:40,928 --> 00:14:44,814 I think we've been working with our talent attraction team, and I wanna shout 242 00:14:44,814 --> 00:14:49,548 them out because they do an incredible amount of this work with us and we, we 243 00:14:49,548 --> 00:14:51,078 wouldn't be able to do this without them. 244 00:14:51,698 --> 00:14:53,328 And they were the pioneers of this. 245 00:14:53,328 --> 00:14:55,668 Before I came into this role, you know, they were kind of working 246 00:14:55,668 --> 00:14:59,754 almost underground delivering this and they didn't maybe have the 247 00:14:59,874 --> 00:15:02,954 inroads that I did in some of the places I now do, so we kind of work 248 00:15:02,954 --> 00:15:04,524 together to do this as best we can. 249 00:15:04,524 --> 00:15:08,348 But what it really means for us is we've- We've all heard, I think, 250 00:15:08,748 --> 00:15:12,258 h- the impact that employees talking about their experience at 251 00:15:12,258 --> 00:15:14,388 a brand, good, bad, ugly can have. 252 00:15:14,528 --> 00:15:19,318 And obviously I want people to talk about the reality, but I'd like that to be 253 00:15:19,678 --> 00:15:23,868 you know, authentic, as much as we can say, like, authentic in social world. 254 00:15:24,758 --> 00:15:27,818 And what we have recognised is it's a cultural behavioural 255 00:15:27,838 --> 00:15:28,968 change that we're asking. 256 00:15:29,088 --> 00:15:33,238 We want people to feel proud, and if they do, we'd like them 257 00:15:33,238 --> 00:15:37,128 to maybe, you know, externalise that and share their experience. 258 00:15:37,558 --> 00:15:39,681 But that doesn't just happen. 259 00:15:39,944 --> 00:15:43,154 There's a few things that you need to do to enable it. 260 00:15:43,284 --> 00:15:46,714 So for us, it looks at role modeling that behaviour. 261 00:15:46,864 --> 00:15:50,494 So you need role models from all walks of life and every kind of role 262 00:15:50,494 --> 00:15:54,144 in the business, whether that is the leaders, but, most people now 263 00:15:54,154 --> 00:15:56,974 recognise that leaders have a team around them helping them do that. 264 00:15:56,974 --> 00:16:01,251 So they're not necessarily the people I wanna put up on a, a pedestal. 265 00:16:01,484 --> 00:16:04,844 Within our business we've always had people that have energetically done 266 00:16:04,844 --> 00:16:09,254 this themselves, and I champion those people, and we really try and make them 267 00:16:09,324 --> 00:16:11,594 as visible as we can and celebrate them. 268 00:16:11,901 --> 00:16:15,071 I also started role modeling the behaviour myself so that 269 00:16:15,071 --> 00:16:16,301 I had a bit of a case study. 270 00:16:16,641 --> 00:16:18,301 And my goal is that by the end of this year, you know, 271 00:16:18,301 --> 00:16:19,621 I'm no longer the case study. 272 00:16:19,621 --> 00:16:21,231 I don't want to be the case study. 273 00:16:21,271 --> 00:16:23,591 I want it to be people from the business. 274 00:16:23,701 --> 00:16:27,141 So that role modeling piece is really important though, because you know, if 275 00:16:27,141 --> 00:16:30,751 you see someone in your team doing it and getting recognition, the likelihood is 276 00:16:30,751 --> 00:16:34,651 other people catch on and they recognise it could be good for them to do as well. 277 00:16:34,978 --> 00:16:38,388 But beyond that, you need to make it easy for people to do. 278 00:16:38,644 --> 00:16:42,418 So what tools and training are you able to provide? 279 00:16:42,418 --> 00:16:46,421 And we've worked really hard over the last year to create on our intranet 280 00:16:47,471 --> 00:16:52,521 a social media hub that's got all of the governance and code of conduct and 281 00:16:52,521 --> 00:16:55,924 all of the things I need to have on there, but goes well beyond that now 282 00:16:55,924 --> 00:16:59,688 into, you know, if you're just getting started, here's the deck for you. 283 00:16:59,688 --> 00:17:03,078 If you're, you think you know kind of what to do, but you wanna take it to the 284 00:17:03,078 --> 00:17:05,018 next level, here's how you can upskill. 285 00:17:05,298 --> 00:17:08,918 Okay, you're really good and you're consistent, what else are you missing? 286 00:17:08,918 --> 00:17:11,238 Here's all of the latest tips and tricks. 287 00:17:11,238 --> 00:17:15,738 And that, it, it's hard work to keep that up to date and to make sure it's 288 00:17:15,738 --> 00:17:18,108 accessible and kind of not overwhelming. 289 00:17:18,281 --> 00:17:22,388 So we've got lots of kind of ways that people can access, you know, 290 00:17:22,388 --> 00:17:24,088 the advice and, and the training. 291 00:17:24,504 --> 00:17:28,431 Myself and my team, in a targeted way, because we couldn't possibly train 292 00:17:28,431 --> 00:17:32,671 40,000 people if we wanted to, we'll get out there and we'll run sessions in 293 00:17:32,671 --> 00:17:37,801 person, we'll do webinars, we'll make sure that we're available to kind of 294 00:17:37,831 --> 00:17:42,841 ease people into this world But I think the fundamental piece is I want our 295 00:17:42,841 --> 00:17:47,831 people to know that we trust them to do this, and we trust them to do it well. 296 00:17:48,361 --> 00:17:51,971 And that doesn't mean that everyone is going to become a brand parrot. 297 00:17:52,011 --> 00:17:56,968 And actually, that's my hardest thing with all of this, is that people want 298 00:17:57,338 --> 00:18:01,198 branded assets and they want you know, the line to take, and they want to 299 00:18:01,198 --> 00:18:02,698 just, you know, take what we give them. 300 00:18:02,698 --> 00:18:07,051 And getting them unwedded from that is, is a challenge, and that's what 301 00:18:07,051 --> 00:18:10,654 I'm determined to kind of encourage our people to do, is to feel they 302 00:18:10,654 --> 00:18:15,191 can post as themselves with their opinions, and that's what we want. 303 00:18:15,191 --> 00:18:17,241 That's what's real, that's what's gonna cut through. 304 00:18:17,421 --> 00:18:21,774 So it, it is a big undertaking, and it's, and it shouldn't be underestimated, 305 00:18:21,844 --> 00:18:25,794 the, the, the effort that gets, you know, into, behind these programs. 306 00:18:26,334 --> 00:18:30,404 But the payoff is huge, not only for the individuals and building their own 307 00:18:30,404 --> 00:18:34,854 personal brands, but the ripple effect for the Company and the reputation 308 00:18:34,854 --> 00:18:37,281 and, um, you know, amplifying messages. 309 00:18:37,331 --> 00:18:38,101 It's enormous. 310 00:18:38,728 --> 00:18:43,878 I am laughing because, Holly, isn't it just as simple as all of the gurus 311 00:18:43,878 --> 00:18:47,548 and the bros and the hackers out there on LinkedIn that say, "Just get your 312 00:18:47,548 --> 00:18:51,138 employees active. You'll get, you know, 10 times more reach," blah, blah, blah. 313 00:18:51,478 --> 00:18:52,988 Didn't you just flick a switch? 314 00:18:52,988 --> 00:18:56,918 Wasn't it that simple, that everybody was lining up saying, "Holly, let me 315 00:18:56,918 --> 00:18:58,948 do whatever you, it is that you need. 316 00:18:58,948 --> 00:19:02,708 I can't wait." You know, again, thank you for your honesty that these things 317 00:19:02,798 --> 00:19:08,998 aren't easy, but they are worth it if we invest time and resources into it. 318 00:19:09,078 --> 00:19:13,308 And I think, like you said, sometimes starting off small and then working our 319 00:19:13,308 --> 00:19:17,638 way up bit by bit over time, so this has taken you a few years to implement. 320 00:19:17,868 --> 00:19:21,378 And I think- It's been ... the lesson is to be realistic, you know, with 321 00:19:21,438 --> 00:19:23,538 these implementation timeframes. 322 00:19:23,788 --> 00:19:27,078 It won't happen overnight, but it will happen, as, as 323 00:19:27,078 --> 00:19:28,728 the ads say here in Australia. 324 00:19:29,418 --> 00:19:29,598 Yeah. 325 00:19:29,628 --> 00:19:34,798 There was something that we alluded to earlier, and you and I were talking about 326 00:19:34,918 --> 00:19:37,198 the joys of working in big corporations. 327 00:19:37,198 --> 00:19:41,038 They come with their own unique sets of challenges, and one of 328 00:19:41,038 --> 00:19:45,708 yours was obviously everybody has something that they wanna post. 329 00:19:45,708 --> 00:19:49,858 You've got one main key Page, you know, across you know, 40,000 330 00:19:49,858 --> 00:19:53,458 employees, all the different business units, all the cool stuff that your 331 00:19:53,458 --> 00:19:55,788 business is up to on a daily basis. 332 00:19:56,174 --> 00:20:02,934 How do you decide what content deserves a place on the Page versus 333 00:20:02,934 --> 00:20:04,824 what probably shouldn't be posted? 334 00:20:04,854 --> 00:20:10,421 I mean, going from six back to two a day, you had to probably make some pretty 335 00:20:10,631 --> 00:20:12,741 tough and strong decisions, I'm thinking. 336 00:20:12,771 --> 00:20:15,501 How did the business receive that, and where are you at now? 337 00:20:16,151 --> 00:20:16,481 Yeah. 338 00:20:16,601 --> 00:20:21,471 So I would say this is the hardest bit of the job, genuinely. 339 00:20:21,861 --> 00:20:25,556 And that doesn't mean it's- Not worthwhile and interesting. 340 00:20:25,556 --> 00:20:27,556 It just means it's, it's really challenging. 341 00:20:27,556 --> 00:20:31,956 And when I did kind of come in and say, "We shouldn't be posting six times in 342 00:20:31,956 --> 00:20:35,926 a 24-hour period," we're gonna ... At first we capped it to three and that 343 00:20:35,926 --> 00:20:37,876 was, you know, kind of groundbreaking. 344 00:20:37,976 --> 00:20:43,036 And it made me unpopular for a while, but I was comfortable to be unpopular 345 00:20:43,036 --> 00:20:45,713 because I believed in where we were going. 346 00:20:45,866 --> 00:20:51,486 And my job was to guide people through that and keep them on track with the plan. 347 00:20:51,783 --> 00:20:55,596 I think the best way I could probably talk about this is with a real-life example 348 00:20:55,596 --> 00:20:57,136 and something we're working through now. 349 00:20:57,136 --> 00:20:59,926 So we attend a lot of events as a Company. 350 00:21:00,326 --> 00:21:04,376 So if I posted every single event that Atkins Realis may show up at, whether 351 00:21:04,376 --> 00:21:10,866 it's with a delegate or whether a full stand sponsorship, I would be posting 352 00:21:10,906 --> 00:21:15,196 numerous times a day, and nobody would ever want to follow the Page because 353 00:21:15,453 --> 00:21:17,573 it's just an event promotion Page. 354 00:21:17,903 --> 00:21:21,843 And so we, when I first came into this role and when we were first kind of 355 00:21:21,843 --> 00:21:25,653 grappling with this, we said, "We're not posting these events." And we went 356 00:21:25,963 --> 00:21:28,840 we're not gonna do it." So we kind of wound it down, and we said, No more. 357 00:21:29,003 --> 00:21:31,313 We'll have our individuals post. 358 00:21:31,373 --> 00:21:33,863 They'll say, 'We're going to this event.' They'll talk about it. 359 00:21:34,113 --> 00:21:38,163 And if we want to talk about an event we're going to, let's talk about something 360 00:21:38,430 --> 00:21:40,100 we're gonna speak about at the event. 361 00:21:40,380 --> 00:21:43,910 And we'll use that, and at the end of the post we can say, you 362 00:21:43,910 --> 00:21:44,670 know, 'We're going to this event. 363 00:21:44,670 --> 00:21:45,210 See you there. 364 00:21:45,210 --> 00:21:51,403 And that was working for a while, but actually in this example, we then heard 365 00:21:51,403 --> 00:21:55,813 feedback from different parts of the Company, places where brand awareness 366 00:21:55,813 --> 00:21:59,793 maybe wasn't as strong or where, four or five of these events they attend in 367 00:21:59,793 --> 00:22:01,823 a year are key moments in time for them. 368 00:22:02,120 --> 00:22:07,063 And what that's led us to now is almost a hybrid of where we'd been, where we have a 369 00:22:07,063 --> 00:22:09,603 rough framework that has a tiered system. 370 00:22:10,073 --> 00:22:15,163 And I work with our directors of marketing in the kind of two key parts of our 371 00:22:15,163 --> 00:22:21,813 business to understand in which region which events are really mega for us and 372 00:22:21,813 --> 00:22:25,513 where we have put a sizable amount of investment, whether it's monetary or 373 00:22:25,513 --> 00:22:29,116 whether it's people's time and, what the goals are and what we're hoping to 374 00:22:29,116 --> 00:22:31,536 achieve connected to the business's plans. 375 00:22:31,913 --> 00:22:34,963 And that helps us know whether we're gonna announce our attendance on the 376 00:22:34,963 --> 00:22:38,973 Company Page, whether we're gonna do a kind of event activation and, and 377 00:22:38,973 --> 00:22:43,413 involve social in that plan, or whether it's kind of a bit less prominent but 378 00:22:43,413 --> 00:22:48,103 will still support individual delegates and kind of get them posting ahead 379 00:22:48,103 --> 00:22:51,400 of that event, or whether it's not something we need to worry about at all. 380 00:22:51,646 --> 00:22:54,731 And what I would say with these frameworks is- Be brave, put one 381 00:22:54,731 --> 00:22:59,621 together, be prepared for the first iteration of that, that you put forward. 382 00:22:59,951 --> 00:23:03,571 It's gonna need lots of suggestions, and have the humility 383 00:23:03,571 --> 00:23:05,471 to have people feed into it. 384 00:23:05,911 --> 00:23:06,991 I find this really hard. 385 00:23:07,031 --> 00:23:11,521 I like to work on something and finish it that day and move on to the next thing. 386 00:23:11,991 --> 00:23:13,531 So I find- Done ... this really challenging. 387 00:23:13,571 --> 00:23:14,671 Exactly, I wanna tick it off. 388 00:23:14,671 --> 00:23:19,791 But actually, this event framework, we'll probably finalise it in the next two 389 00:23:19,791 --> 00:23:25,261 months, and we've been, um, working on this in some type of way for probably over 390 00:23:25,261 --> 00:23:27,681 a year, and you have to be okay with that. 391 00:23:28,011 --> 00:23:29,141 Things evolve and change. 392 00:23:29,171 --> 00:23:33,581 And also, in two months' time I'll go final, and then we'll have to consider 393 00:23:33,581 --> 00:23:36,571 something else, and we'll make it, you know, we'll change it again. 394 00:23:37,141 --> 00:23:42,761 So put these frameworks in place, but know that it has to be responsive in real time. 395 00:23:43,091 --> 00:23:47,201 So it's not realistic to post everything, it's not realistic to 396 00:23:47,471 --> 00:23:51,801 have someone chuck something at you and get it up that same day, until it 397 00:23:51,801 --> 00:23:53,411 is, until it's newsworthy, you know? 398 00:23:53,411 --> 00:23:56,941 And, and it's, it's a really difficult... I kind of... We don't have a map for it. 399 00:23:56,971 --> 00:24:02,211 But try to put a framework in place, and back your strategy, and really 400 00:24:02,451 --> 00:24:08,541 explain to people why we wouldn't wanna be sharing absolutely everything, and 401 00:24:08,541 --> 00:24:11,061 redirect them to what we can do instead. 402 00:24:11,231 --> 00:24:15,335 I think that's a vital lesson I've had from this, is, so it's not gonna 403 00:24:15,335 --> 00:24:19,695 go here, but it could go there, and explain, how that could work as well. 404 00:24:20,235 --> 00:24:21,475 I love it. 405 00:24:21,515 --> 00:24:26,785 I literally stood on stage at Social Media Marketing World and pretty much 406 00:24:26,785 --> 00:24:31,565 begged the audience to stop filling up our feeds with we're at this event posts. 407 00:24:31,565 --> 00:24:31,695 Yeah. 408 00:24:31,835 --> 00:24:32,825 No one cares. 409 00:24:32,825 --> 00:24:35,035 Like, honestly, no one cares. 410 00:24:35,035 --> 00:24:37,495 Give them a reason to come and see your team there. 411 00:24:37,805 --> 00:24:40,025 Let them see the faces of the people that are there. 412 00:24:40,025 --> 00:24:43,955 So I, uh, listeners that are, catching this on the podcast, I'm sitting here 413 00:24:43,955 --> 00:24:48,815 high-fiving Holly, going, "This is, like, the best. I want everybody to 414 00:24:48,815 --> 00:24:51,105 follow that." But I'm also a realist. 415 00:24:51,105 --> 00:24:55,365 I know that you can't just throw things out because that's what works on social 416 00:24:55,365 --> 00:24:56,985 or that's what works on LinkedIn. 417 00:24:57,035 --> 00:24:58,775 You are part of a greater team. 418 00:24:59,125 --> 00:25:03,415 You have colleagues that you need to work with ongoing, and not just, you know, 419 00:25:03,415 --> 00:25:05,515 bad luck, it's my way or the highway. 420 00:25:05,515 --> 00:25:09,725 So I, I love hearing about the practical side of this, that 421 00:25:09,785 --> 00:25:11,445 it isn't just black and white. 422 00:25:11,475 --> 00:25:16,105 It isn't just a one-way, one-size-fits-everyone, because 423 00:25:16,105 --> 00:25:18,525 that is not the reality, listeners. 424 00:25:18,575 --> 00:25:24,175 If you are having trouble trying to negotiate and align your social media 425 00:25:24,175 --> 00:25:27,715 strategy with business goals, and it feels like people are always trying to 426 00:25:27,715 --> 00:25:32,005 send you off course, that is a day in the life of a Page admin or a social 427 00:25:32,005 --> 00:25:36,788 media manager or a marketing manager And the reason, as I said, that I, I love 428 00:25:36,788 --> 00:25:41,128 having you to have this conversation, Holly, is the fact that's the reality, 429 00:25:41,158 --> 00:25:46,108 not this glorified vision of people on YouTube that do videos that say, "Just 430 00:25:46,108 --> 00:25:49,688 post this and it'll all be magic, and we're all gonna make billions of dollars." 431 00:25:49,688 --> 00:25:53,598 Like, it doesn't work like that in a business setting with, you 432 00:25:53,598 --> 00:25:55,628 know, uh, Company Pages especially. 433 00:25:56,028 --> 00:26:00,628 But looking back on the journey, and you've shared so much, to get to 434 00:26:00,658 --> 00:26:07,671 500,000-plus followers now, what's the biggest lesson that you've learned, 435 00:26:07,711 --> 00:26:13,151 either personally or professionally, about growing the Company Page today that 436 00:26:13,151 --> 00:26:15,091 you wish you'd known a few years ago? 437 00:26:15,665 --> 00:26:16,945 It's a really good question. 438 00:26:17,181 --> 00:26:22,398 And I think for me, I come from a background where I did a drama 439 00:26:22,398 --> 00:26:26,538 degree at university, and the way that manifests in my day-to-day 440 00:26:26,538 --> 00:26:28,298 is I have a flair for dramatics. 441 00:26:28,328 --> 00:26:33,605 But outside of that, I love connecting with people, and I'm, uh, the 442 00:26:33,605 --> 00:26:36,818 h- the, the core of that kind of dramaturgy is that communication. 443 00:26:36,818 --> 00:26:41,048 So what are you conveying to an audience, and how do you wanna make them feel? 444 00:26:41,688 --> 00:26:47,178 And I think if we can bring more of that into our why and when we're 445 00:26:47,511 --> 00:26:51,985 devising a strategy or whether we're focusing on an individual post, of 446 00:26:51,985 --> 00:26:55,235 course we have back-to-back calls and there's lots to distract us 447 00:26:55,235 --> 00:26:58,138 from our why or the Page's why. 448 00:26:58,138 --> 00:27:01,375 But I think if I could've, if I could go back to myself then, I'd 449 00:27:01,375 --> 00:27:06,468 say know what we want people to feel when they're interacting with 450 00:27:06,468 --> 00:27:08,438 our content, and let that guide us. 451 00:27:08,998 --> 00:27:11,628 And whether that's our people, we want them to feel proud and 452 00:27:11,628 --> 00:27:15,218 we want them to feel a sense of ownership behind the brand as well. 453 00:27:15,508 --> 00:27:19,548 And if it's people that we're reaching out to, we wanna inspire the next 454 00:27:19,548 --> 00:27:22,725 generation of people to join our industry. 455 00:27:23,121 --> 00:27:26,001 And if it's our clients and our communities, we want them to feel, 456 00:27:26,255 --> 00:27:29,365 you know, excited by what's happening in their community and, and by 457 00:27:29,528 --> 00:27:31,138 the problems that we're solving. 458 00:27:31,281 --> 00:27:36,265 So really lead with feeling, and that kind of sets, you know, it's a really 459 00:27:36,265 --> 00:27:39,305 good barometer for where you should be going and how you should be showing up. 460 00:27:39,755 --> 00:27:40,415 I love it. 461 00:27:40,515 --> 00:27:42,715 What, actually care about your audience? 462 00:27:42,905 --> 00:27:46,515 Is this the secret, to actually give a damn about the people on the other side? 463 00:27:46,815 --> 00:27:48,015 Who would've thought, Holly? 464 00:27:48,135 --> 00:27:50,355 Who would've thought that's the secret, is that it's not 465 00:27:50,355 --> 00:27:52,285 all about you, it's about them? 466 00:27:52,395 --> 00:27:56,205 And I'm gonna throw one very quick last question in there. 467 00:27:56,515 --> 00:28:01,315 If I was the LinkedIn gods of Company Pages, which I'm just the Company Page 468 00:28:01,315 --> 00:28:02,865 queen, so I'm not quite there yet. 469 00:28:03,205 --> 00:28:07,445 But if I was the gods that could grant you one Company Page wish for 470 00:28:07,445 --> 00:28:09,770 one feature, what would you choose? 471 00:28:10,030 --> 00:28:12,326 Ooh, what a good question. 472 00:28:12,586 --> 00:28:16,606 You just never know who's listening to this podcast No And I know that we do have 473 00:28:16,736 --> 00:28:18,846 a LinkedIn team that do listen in- Yeah 474 00:28:18,846 --> 00:28:20,836 especially on the Pages episodes. 475 00:28:21,046 --> 00:28:23,576 So I didn't wanna miss this one, 'cause it's top of mind 476 00:28:23,576 --> 00:28:25,246 after my conversation today. 477 00:28:25,596 --> 00:28:26,446 But what would you pick? 478 00:28:26,476 --> 00:28:29,126 And don't ask for organic impressions, 'cause I'm not that good. 479 00:28:29,126 --> 00:28:29,286 No. 480 00:28:29,286 --> 00:28:30,436 It's never gonna happen. 481 00:28:30,610 --> 00:28:31,673 Do you know what? 482 00:28:31,673 --> 00:28:36,730 So we've recently, we've got a newsletter that we're running, and for us- 483 00:28:37,090 --> 00:28:37,350 Love it 484 00:28:37,350 --> 00:28:39,700 that newsletter's doing, it's doing really well. 485 00:28:40,010 --> 00:28:44,130 But I wish I could see more detailed analytics of my newsletter. 486 00:28:44,570 --> 00:28:50,360 Um, I have some, and it's great, but to really get all of the data that I want, 487 00:28:50,410 --> 00:28:55,926 I have to be really, um, disciplined about every week going in and, like, 488 00:28:55,926 --> 00:29:00,210 pulling data and then adding it to a different spreadsheet and analysing it. 489 00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:04,296 And I wish that they would level up that, because we're about to 490 00:29:04,336 --> 00:29:08,326 launch a second newsletter because we've seen it be so successful. 491 00:29:08,580 --> 00:29:10,910 But the thing that's holding me back from being able to you know, 492 00:29:11,340 --> 00:29:15,220 grow it even more is I can't always tell the story and tell the success 493 00:29:15,220 --> 00:29:17,270 because the data's not always there. 494 00:29:17,370 --> 00:29:18,600 Great minds think alike. 495 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:22,610 It was on my shopping list today because I love newsletters. 496 00:29:22,650 --> 00:29:26,560 I think every Company Page of a reasonable size should have one, 497 00:29:26,890 --> 00:29:29,250 and that, for me, was it as well. 498 00:29:29,370 --> 00:29:33,730 It, you know, it's all about being able to almost justify what 499 00:29:33,730 --> 00:29:35,130 you're trying to do out there. 500 00:29:35,130 --> 00:29:37,850 For me, previously it was about commenting as your Page and 501 00:29:37,850 --> 00:29:38,830 being able to analyze- Mm-hmm 502 00:29:38,830 --> 00:29:41,800 the impressions, and that stuff's coming, as far as I know. 503 00:29:42,150 --> 00:29:45,390 Uh, so there's some cool things coming, but yeah, I, I'm right there. 504 00:29:45,390 --> 00:29:47,340 So thank you for answering that one off the cuff. 505 00:29:47,340 --> 00:29:50,260 Like I said, I know that there are LinkedIn employees that listen 506 00:29:50,260 --> 00:29:54,360 to this podcast, and my next guest is from the B2B Institute. 507 00:29:54,470 --> 00:29:58,500 Vita Molis is on next week, so I can't wait to talk to her and see 508 00:29:58,780 --> 00:30:00,080 what's coming out of the institute. 509 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,570 But Holly, thank you so much for your honesty. 510 00:30:02,610 --> 00:30:05,580 Thank you for sharing the realities of what it's like to grow a 511 00:30:05,580 --> 00:30:08,260 Page to 500,000 followers plus. 512 00:30:08,390 --> 00:30:12,640 I am absolutely cheering you on in all of the success, because I know that 513 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:16,500 the amount of effort that's gone in by you, your team, your colleagues, 514 00:30:16,500 --> 00:30:20,050 to make this happen, uh, I wish you every success in the future, and 515 00:30:20,050 --> 00:30:21,470 thanks for coming on and sharing. 516 00:30:21,876 --> 00:30:22,426 Oh, amazing. 517 00:30:22,426 --> 00:30:23,836 No, thank you so much for having me. 518 00:30:23,836 --> 00:30:24,756 It's been a real pleasure. 519 00:30:25,366 --> 00:30:28,896 It has, and any time you wanna talk Company Pages, you know where to find me. 520 00:30:28,896 --> 00:30:31,426 But until next week, listeners, cheers.