>> Steve Palmer: All right, here we are. Lawyer Talk podcast.com Q&A stands for question and answer. Uh, what does that mean? That means you guys ask questions. I try to answer. I'm a lawyer. Steve Palmer here. For those who have followed the podcast, you know, this Q and A series is taking off like wildfire. And we have the podcast broken up into several different segments. This, of course, is one of them. And generally speaking, I take questions online. So people post questions, uh, at my website, LawyerTalkPodcast.com or in the socials, uh, in the comments. Everywhere else you can type, uh, something. I will take your questions and do my best to answer. And there's been a few that have come in, uh, lately, just in the comments. But look, today I'm going to do something a little different because for those who don't know, I actually have a real job. I'm m actually a criminal defense lawyer. You can check me out@palmerlegaldefense.com and you might imagine that one of the things that I deal with day in and day out are people calling with legal questions and they're actually seeking full blown advice. And um, I help lots and lots of people when they get in trouble. Uh, that said, so here's what I'm going to do today. I'm going to do something a little bit different. I'm going to tell you about, uh, a question I received actually twice this week in my law practice. And it has to do with the, uh, attorney client privilege and initial, uh, phone calls to a law office. And I get this a lot, right? I have people that call me with quite sensitive things. Maybe their loved one is in trouble. Uh, maybe this person or whoever's calling is in trouble. And they're asking, the folks ask, well, look, do, uh, I need to retain you, uh, in order to have an attorney client relationship? And I've done this long enough to know what they're really asking. What they're really asking is if they tell me what they did wrong, if they share with me, uh, their deepest secrets, are those privileged? In other words, m, can I ever be or would I ever want to, uh, divulge that, tell somebody else what I learned in the context of an initial phone call to my law office. The short answer is, uh, it is privileged. I cannot and would not and will not repeat what somebody tells me during an initial call. Um, I'm going to talk generally about the rules of ethics. So lawyers have rules of play. We call them the rules of ethics or the rules of professional conduct. And almost, in fact all states have them. There are model rules for, ah, the nation, but generally all states have them. In all states, in my. At least I believe all states include this, where you are on the phone talking to a lawyer, actually seeking legal advice before you actually pay the lawyer a dime. You know, there's a movie, I think it was, um, it was based on a Grisham novel where the kid goes into the law office and gives the gives. I think it was Susan Sarandon. A dollar or something to retain Susan, uh, Sarandon, who is the lawyer for the juvenile. Uh, I forget the name of the movie. But at any rate, uh, the premise was there has to be some consideration to invoke the privilege. That is not true. Um, it wouldn't make any sense otherwise. People would never be encouraged to tell their lawyers, uh, what the lawyers need to know to even evaluate an initial call like that. So the answer is it is privileged. Now it's a little more complicated. Like most things in law. Um, what if you're not the client, but you're calling for your loved one? Who would be the client? Uh, is that conversation privileged? Well, that gets a little trickier because privilege means I can't divulge whether in, uh, the context of an attorney client relationship, a priest, uh, parishioner. Is that the right word? Parishioner relationship, or a doctor patient relationship. Those are things that are said. Privilege means things that are said. It means communication. And it can be verbal communication, it can be typed communication. It could even be smoke signals, um, or, uh, any other kind of communication you would want. Uh, but it has to be with the individual that is, uh, seeking the advice. It doesn't mean that the information I learned during the course and scope of my representation, even the initial call, is not confidential. So lawyers have two things. We have privilege. Things that are told, uh, to us, things our clients tell us, uh, and then we have things that are confidential. We call these secrets things that we learn during the course and scope of our representation. Meaning, all right, I learned something from a family member, uh, as part of my representation. That becomes a confidential bit of information that I can't share. It's different than the privilege. Uh, it has different connotations. It's enforced differently at times. But generally speaking, the things I learn during my representation of a client, I can't tell anybody about and I won't tell anybody about unless it helps my client. Uh, and how would it help my client? Well, look, during plea negotiations, for instance, with prosecutors, I talk to prosecutors all the Time, and I might share things Sometimes, uh, even in the context my client told me that, uh, and whatever bit of information, I would only do that, though, if it helps my client. I would never do that if I'm disclosing something that would be, um, uh, uh, incriminating for my client. So, literally, if somebody tells me where the body is buried, I take that secret to my grave. Now, there are exceptions. Um, and most of these exceptions, though, do not force, uh, me as a lawyer to tell somebody. Uh, but they might permit me as a lawyer to tell somebody. Um, and you would think, like, extreme emergencies, where the movie scenario, for instance, this has never happened to me, but, hey, I've buried a body and the oxygen is running out. Uh, this person's going to die. Uh, that might give me, as a lawyer, some basis to justify disclosing it. I knock on wood. I've never had to deal with that scenario. I pray that I never will. Um, that would be one where, see, even lawyers, we get advice. I would call up, I have an ethics lawyer, literally on speed dial, uh, who I have worked with now for a number of years. And I call him up and I say, john, I got a hot one for you, man. What do I do here? And he, uh, will research it and give me the answer. And sometimes it gets quite complex, but, um, look, and even then, it is about whether I would choose to violate the privilege or not choose to violate the privilege. Uh, violates, not the right word. Choose to disclose the information or not choose disclose the information. There are very, very few things as solid as the attorney client privilege. I take that very seriously. I take it to my grave. There are things that even my Family asks about, cases that have been national news. What's going on with this? And I just look at him. You see the awkward silence. Eventually, they get the message. I say nothing. Or even better, I have friends who refer their friends to me, or mothers who refer their sons to me. Or, uh, that happens all the Time. Mom comes in, her son's in trouble. Uh, and she says, well, I'm paying the fee, darn it, I deserve to know what's happening. And I just say, look, no, you don't. Your son has told me information. I'm not going to disclose that to you. And I'm not even going to tell you what I've learned in the course and scope of my representation unless he tells me I can. Um, and then there are things. Even when the son tells me he wants me to tell Mom, I tell him, no, I'm not telling your mom. Because now I've destroyed the privilege, or at least I've disclosed it to your mom. And she doesn't have a privilege. So now, mom, in theory, could be, uh, placed under subpoena to come into a grand jury and provide testimony. And if you think that can happen, uh, it can. And, uh, it does at times, particularly in serious cases. Anyway, uh, it's probably a topic I could spend hours on. In fact, I have in seminars and such. But, uh, if you've got questions, if this, uh, is of interest to you, please like and share. It's, uh, apparently of interest to lots of people because it's getting a lot of interest, um, online, in these socials. Uh, but check us out. Lawyer Talk podcast dot com. Check out the website for the law firm Palmer Legal Defense. I've been doing this for almost 30 years. I know a thing or two. I've learned a thing or two. I'm not the best, not the worst, but I can certainly help you out. Uh, this is Lawyer Talk Podcast. Off The Record, on the air, at least until now.