DJ Sir Daniel: Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast.
I'm DJ Sir Daniel.
Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government
as Johnnie Ray Kornegay the third.
And real quick, Sir Daniel, I want to send love and a shout out to Phi
Beta Sigma Fraternity Incorporated.
Today is our founder's day, 111 years.
So shout out to all the brothers of Sigma.
Love y'all and we hear sir.
Daniel.
This is our first public live of 2025 We did a live but it was a private one last.
DJ Sir Daniel: Oh, yes.
Yes.
You like wait a
Jay Ray: minute.
DJ Sir Daniel: We was
Jay Ray: live
DJ Sir Daniel: last week No, but you're absolutely correct.
Um, yes, this is our first live and because we are the the podcast dropping
the needle on black music history, you know, we You know Gotta keep shout.
We gotta a shout out to, to the Divine.
So shout out to you and your brothers.
Yes.
Um, it was nothing but blue and white all on my timeline today.
Yes.
So I was like, it gotta be, it gotta be Founder's Day for the brothers . And
um, also before we get started, um, we want to give, to send Massive love.
Yes.
And um, and just prayers to the people in Los Angeles.
Right now, who are, you know, fighting for their lives, basically making sure
that they evacuate, um, if they have to evacuate because of those ongoing
fires, I heard something very important today that needed to be said, um, a lot
of us who are outside of Los Angeles looking in might believe that it.
These fires are only affecting rich people.
Jay Ray: That is not
DJ Sir Daniel: true.
That's not the case.
There are a lot of people who are low income, middle income,
middle class, um, who are just being disenfranchised as we speak.
So I think we need to, you know, turn up the empathy.
Jay Ray: Absolutely.
I think it's really every time there is A natural disaster.
Literally my reflex is if a person is poor, what do they do?
Like when they need to evacuate, like, how do they evacuate?
If you are an individual that does not have a mode of transportation and
they're like, you need to leave your area and you need to go somewhere.
Like, where do you go?
And this is where, when we talk about, um, Public resources and all of that
that this is why voting is really important like we have to be able to
do it Because this is devastating.
I have seen so many images Um, we've seen video i've actually talked to
people so i've reached out to some of our people Um to make sure that they
were good now that was yesterday.
I got to check in with people today Yeah, because it's a day by day thing.
And so Listen empathy turn up the empathy because I can't imagine So
Daniel, I literally was like, I've never seen anything like this before.
I can't imagine what I would do in this situation.
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah.
Same, same over here.
Um, also thinking about us here in Georgia, you know, we're keeping
our fingers crossed here in Georgia.
Cause mother nature is about is doing her big one right now.
Yes.
All across the nation.
And, um, yeah, just everybody just be safe.
And, um, And keep in contact with your loved ones, whether they're on
the East Coast or the West Coast.
And just, you know, key points we wanted to show our love to you guys and
just make sure that you're doing good.
And just, of course, letting us know if we need to amplify a
signal for you, if you need help.
Let us know and we'll do what we can to, on our end, as far as our
resources to help amplify the word.
Jay Ray: Yeah.
So definitely want to send, um, we just put that up from Mark McPherson.
Shout out to Mark.
Thank you so much for, for joining us, Mark, um, as always.
And Mark was just saying, um, the fire has impacted his family.
Uh, a cousin lost her home and a husband and a, and another doesn't
know if his home is still there.
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah.
Jay Ray: My goodness.
DJ Sir Daniel: That see, those are the types of things that, We just don't
think about, we don't think about those things and until they happen to you.
Yep.
So what we like to do here, you know, at Queue Points, um, you know, maybe
this, you're not listening to this while we're broadcasting live, but
you're listening to this at another time and it's giving you some, some joy.
That's cause that's what we want to do.
So we, J.
Ray and I, you know, we get, sometimes we don't eat these topics
literally just fall into our laps.
Jay Ray: Yes.
DJ Sir Daniel: Because a lot of people, you know, you got
to love social media for this.
A lot of people have a lot of hot takes.
I mean really hot takes and let's see.
Let's start.
Do we want to start off with the tweet?
Let's
Jay Ray: let's start with it.
Let's start with the tweet.
This is so you saw this.
Sir, Daniel, I have a question.
Well, first of all, we're going to read the tweet And so Daniel,
please what is this tweet?
And what was your first thought when you read it because you
shared it with me and I was like,
DJ Sir Daniel: huh?
so apparently, um Sade x goddess on december 29th Had an epiphany That r
kelly wrote michael jackson's you were not alone and she went to x and tweeted it.
Yes You So Mr.
WizArab10 responded, quote tweeted, um, Sade, quote tweeted her and said,
There is no better writer in the history of American music than R.
Kelly.
And of course, that set off quite the sandstorm of, you know,
Tweets, replies, clapbacks, um, videos, it just, it went viral.
Of course, as you can see down there, that, that tweet alone has gotten what?
Jay Ray: What is this right here?
3.
1 million views.
DJ Sir Daniel: That just to let you, that just lets you know how polarizing R.
Kelly.
Is even when we're not talking about the, you know, the behaviors that landed
him in prison, you know, people are making these hot takes about him being
the best American songwriter ever.
And then to top it all.
On top of all of that, you know, Teedra Moses has been in the news.
She's, you know, her tiny, since her tiny desk, she's been popping up on
interviews and whatnot, and she made a stop at the R&B Money podcast.
She did podcast, uh, with tank and, um, I forget the other hosts, but
she made a comment regarding R Kelly that set Twitter on fire as well.
And I believe we have a clip of that.
Jay Ray: We do have a clip
of that.
Adore you by Prince.
Greatest Sex, R.
Kelly.
What a song!
You can close your eyes and see everything he's saying.
I was so angry when I heard that song.
How did you get to anger?
Because in my mind, I was always competing against him, even
though I wasn't at that time.
Space yet.
And I was like, he's still so much better.
The honest
here inside my what do you say here on inside this bed of mine?
I see ceiling fans and you on top of me.
If you close your eyes, you can see it.
Everything's in inside these walls.
There was well a Capricorn top 5 RB songs.
DJ Sir Daniel: Huh?
So I believe okay.
So Jay Ray, what is your reaction to that?
And I'll let you know how come back to you.
Jay Ray: Um, so
I think two things can be true at the same time.
DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.
Jay Ray: Um, As someone who has liked a lot of R.
Kelly songs over the years, right?
Um, I, I rebuke myself for, for liking R Kelly for longer than I should have.
And I think I've talked about that on this show, right?
I think two things can be true at the same time.
I, um, I, I, I do not think that R Kelly is the greatest American songwriter.
The reason why, by the way, I hovered over Sir Dixon's name is because I
was like, is this person like a troll?
And then I'm like, Oh, he has like 500 and he has like half a million followers.
So he's not a troll.
Right.
So I Tiedra and tank are not off with the greatest sex, especially when you
like jump into like lyrics like that.
And you're like, yeah, like that is.
Well crafted and interesting and I can see all the things and I
get where they're coming from.
I don't think it was worth.
I don't think all of the vitriol that Tidra got.
After that was worth it.
I also don't think Teidra's responses were worth it either stuff.
Many things can be true at the same time.
Like, I feel like there's a lot of mess to go around.
There's some mess with how she responded.
There's some mess with the fact that we're talking about R Kelly and
having to, at this point, and I feel like we have to do this reckon with
his legacy, which is huge and vast.
Um, And the fact that I think people be crazy on Twitter when they say stuff
like he's the greatest songwriter I don't think that that's true, but I
don't necessarily I don't think t dra and tank are wrong But I do think some
of the tweets that t dra made were wrong.
It's a lot going on with it.
It's a lot
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah, I think so Basically, I think that Tidra became the
target of a lot of women specifically became the target because a lot of
women feel like what happened in the R.
Kelly situation as a woman, you should be as bothered and troubled by, um, The
things that happen to these other young women and that you as a woman should
have want nothing to do with this and then speaking out and still calling
his name and giving him, you know, accolades about his talents is somehow
cheapening and lessening the, um, what happened to these people, the victims,
the people that had these experiences.
And so.
Yes, I think all of that people, sometimes it does, it just takes
one person to become a target and to become a focal point for all of
those thoughts that people have.
And so that day just happened to be Teedra Moses.
And now they've been whacking tank about, cause tank, this ain't the
first time tank is, has been called R Kelly's name on their podcast.
And they've been whacking the people who've been whacking
tank about that for a while too.
So it's like, there's just, so then it makes me think.
Like, okay, is it worth it?
Is R.
Kelly's music that good to be calling out his name constantly
and to risk, you know, the vitriol of the public coming down on you?
So that's a question that popped up in my mind.
And then when I got to thinking about it, I started thinking, Oh, I think.
I understand why R Kelly's music still has a chokehold on black people.
Jay Ray: But let us have it.
The DJ.
So Daniel, we need a, we need a sound for this.
DJ.
So Daniel theory,
DJ Sir Daniel: you know, guys, I have, I have a theory.
I have thoughts.
Okay.
So
It's threefold.
So I believe R Kelly, I believe.
I believe I can
fly.
DJ Sir Daniel: R Kelly came along at a very specific time.
And he was able to master the R& B bad boy trope with a mix
of sensitivity and sensuality.
I believe.
He came at the right time.
He came on the coat on the coattails of Jodeci and Bobby Brown and I'll be sure
and he took that trope of bad boy and just turn it up like he he turned it up
bit by bit just to see how much we could take and and and the public was loving it.
You know, women specifically, women specifically loved what R Kelly was
giving, what he presented, what he rep, what he was presenting to them
physically, you know, he's at that time.
Um, you know, male R& B singers really had to, not only did you have
to sound good, you had to look good.
So you know, he had the body.
He was, um, he had at every chance he could, you know, give you like somebody
who may or may not have been in prison at one point, you know, and was giving you.
Kind of, I just got out of prison fashions, but I'm, I'm singing to you
at the same time and I want to make you feel safe and I'm, I'm going to sex
you up and down and all around and just make you feel, you feel really good.
So he met, but he was able to do other songs where he was able to, you know,
sprinkle sensitivity in there and, you know, I want to, you know, make you feel
like he's about to cry and, and we ate that, excuse me, we ate that stuff up.
We ate it up.
Women ate it up.
And so he endeared himself to the public using that bad boy trope
and fusing it with sensitivity.
Second part.
The black community, we have continuously had this back and
forth conversation or this back and forth about The idea of masculinity
and
DJ Sir Daniel: how it should look and be performed.
And R.
Kelly just happened to come along and fulfill that and be like, Hey,
that's something I can point to.
That's what a real man does.
I can feel by proxy, I can talk to my woman through R Kelly and exhibit
maleness, masculineness, and, you know, take you down just by singing and take
you down with these lyrics and, you know, You know, that's something that we held
on to, you know, that's a good black man.
That's a, you know, he's a sensual black man.
We, he's our, he's our generations, Teddy Pendergrass and Marvin Gaye all
rolled into one and, you know, and he looked like a man, man, you know?
So.
And those are things that the black community is constantly grasping for.
Sure.
Whether we want to admit it or not, we are constantly grasping for
it, we are constantly pointing to examples to show what is, and now
more than ever, what is not considered masculine or manly in the community.
And so that, so that, those things keep us in a chokehold, kept, R.
Kelly kept us in a chokehold.
And last but not least.
Jay Ray, R.
Kelly's music is directly associated with good times and nostalgia.
Jay Ray: Yes.
Point
DJ Sir Daniel: blank period.
Jay Ray: Yeah.
DJ Sir Daniel: There's no, like, if you're a certain age, I believe
I Can Fly was sung at your, at your high school graduation.
It was sung at your kindergarten graduation.
Yes, it was.
Okay, yeah, he did what all singers do when they want to make people cry and
feel emotions He brings out a black choir To sing behind him and sing.
I believe I can fly Um same thing with you are not alone.
Yeah You know, those are, those are things that we hold on to that
meant something to us that are, um, that was sung at our baptism.
You are not alone because I'm walking, you know, um, Jesus is walking with me.
R Kelly made me feel that and let's not, we popping, popping bottles in the club
and having fun and, you know, grinding on each other to the, to the remix.
And this is the remix to ignition.
It was a, it was a good time.
Those were like the gold.
They refer to that as the golden era for a reason.
Yeah, it was some good times.
I R Kelly was just coming out of every speaker and we just cannot let that go.
Jay Ray: You are absolutely correct.
I think the other layer to it as well.
In addition to all of those three things is that R Kelly.
And I think because of.
Some of his own limitations, right?
And, and, and in the way that he, um, you know, his education and
all of those things communicated to people was in kind of a way that
there was no ambiguity about what R.
Kelly was talking about, right?
So when we think about Some of the R& B music is so funny, like how it took
us years to figure out that they was talking about like, Oh, they're talking
about like, I know that's what you are.
My Starship was about until you got, you started to understand nuance.
You started to understand like, Oh, this is a euphemism
for this other thing, right?
Because as you grow, you get more education and you realize how
to communicate with some nuance.
You know what I mean?
R Kelly didn't do nuance.
DJ Sir Daniel: No.
Not at all.
You
Jay Ray: just didn't do.
And I will tell you, I will tell you when I, um, as a former R Kelly fan, I'm
going to keep repeating that because I want to be clear that I made a choice.
Oh, in the early two thousands, really, um, to not be an R Kelly fan.
Right.
So just like I stepped in the name of love, unfortunately, just like with
the best of us, you couldn't avoid it.
It was a feel good song, but whatever, I digress.
The thing that was so dope to me in the nineties, when R Kelly, when in
particular, when 12 play came out.
Was how unfiltered it was.
So I was a kid, right?
I wanted somebody to say they doing the thing that they doing, right?
That was edgy and cool to me at the time, right?
Um, it was like, Prince unfiltered, you know what I'm saying?
Cause Prince, it was like Prince, whereas, you know, Prince was,
Prince was a songwriter, right?
So he could write with nuance.
He could also be unfiltered, right?
But that wasn't the lane.
You know what I mean?
Whereas I felt like R.
Kelly was like saying the thing.
And that was really cool to me at the time.
Why is that important?
I think that is important because We're now at a place
where I wish we had more nuance.
Like, I wish, I wish that folks read more.
I wish that there were more words used.
I wish that folks could learn like new vocabulary words from music.
We not there anymore.
I think that R.
Kelly didn't force us to think about it too hard.
We felt he allowed us to just feel it and experience it.
Those are very valid.
Right.
Sure.
Jay Ray: I also would like to be engaged up here.
R.
Kelly, to the point, it was feel good.
You felt it here.
You felt it in your groin.
You felt it wherever you was going feeling.
It wasn't necessarily that you had to think about it.
You was just feeling it.
And I, and I think.
That is also a thing that made folks love the music that he was making at the time.
Um, and is also a thing.
It's the, it's the, it's the good and the bad of it.
I think people saw that
That he was able to do this right now.
Not keep not even recognizing that he had all these other talents to write.
So it wasn't just, you know, the lyrics.
It was like the music and the composition and all those other things,
which were natural talents for him, but I think that everybody saw that
and was like, I want to do that.
That's great.
I want to do that.
It kind of left the other stuff alone and I'm like, yeah, that was cool.
But this other thing is cool too.
Like everything don't got to sound like 12 play or the R.
Kelly album.
I remember Sir Daniel and I'm going to stop in a minute, but I remember when.
You remind me of something came out I thought that song was riveting that dude
was literally singing y'all They this is who the brother said was the greatest
American songwriter that dude literally wrote the lyrics you remind me of my Jeep
Something like my bank accounts I want to spend it.
What, what, what's happening?
DJ Sir Daniel: And let's not forget the, the yodeling at the end,
Jay Ray: right?
DJ Sir Daniel: The yodeling
we sometimes when the, when the young people, um, Make fun of us and talk
about y'all are, we are cri uh, uh, talk about our criticism of their music today.
And they point out certain things.
That's what they think.
That's moment that they point out.
And I'm just like, you got us there.
Yeah,
Jay Ray: we, you got us.
We did that.
DJ Sir Daniel: He yodel.
Yeah, you got us there.
You right, you right.
That was, that was crazy.
You sounded crazy back then.
And to it's, I think you are, you're onto something here.
It's like, there is, there's room.
There's room, there's definitely room for the un, the unserious.
There's room for camp.
That's it really is.
I, I think there, I really think we need more campiness.
Mm-hmm . We need more camp in you love camp.
Our culture.
Uh oh.
I love camp.
And, and I think there's, there should be room for that only because.
I think we are leaning more on the more destructive things that, whatever, for
whatever reason, people are finding solace and finding, you know, Amusement in the
things that are destructive, um, to not only to ourselves, but to each other.
Um, but yes, I, you're right.
We don't have to think hard when it comes to listening to a, uh, uh, R Kelly
song and the sons of R Kelly that have come along and the grand, the grandsons
that he have now that don't even sing.
They, they do this melodic stuff, but they're all, they're all part
of his lineage of saying things.
And then, you know, it's funny when we had that conversation
with, um, Leo, for our girl Leo.
And I think she's over, she's over on,
Jay Ray: yeah, she's over there on IG.
What's up
DJ Sir Daniel: Leo?
You know, we had that conversation about women's, um, Reactions getting less
and less, um, anti whatever the women becoming more acclimated to the way
a lot of the singers and rappers were talking to them and even finding joy.
In the music, you know, we had a whole episode about that and it's got
to be said, you know, I think that the more we get things and we accept
them, the less abrasive they may sound and the less crazy they may sound.
But, you know, if you came up in a time like we did where We can tell a
distinct difference when things change.
Jay Ray: Yeah,
DJ Sir Daniel: it still kind of raises an eyebrow and then looking back.
We're like Was he really the greatest songwriter and we're going to stay
on that because that's what the topic is That's what the topic is is like
does he was he really the greatest songwriter because now what he was good
at What that is That rascal was good at, was good at making songs that the
radio, that radio programmers had no problem putting into heavy rotation.
J.
Ray, right here, right now, back in 2005, I remember when the program
director that out at the radio station that I was working at told us, and
I was producing a show called Loving Relationships with Joyce Letell on V103.
Our program director came to us and said, Hey guys, you
know, it would be a great idea.
And this is when somebody's, um, They're not telling you what to do,
Jay Ray: but they're telling you what to do,
DJ Sir Daniel: but they're, they're suggesting, suggesting really
heavily that you guys do a show and string all the episodes of R.
Kelly's Trapped in the Closet and do a whole love and relationships.
Show around trapped in the closet, and I was like what sure okay?
We can do that But it was it was literally a no brainer the phone lines
were lit up all night people had all kinds of things to say It was It, he,
he did his, R Kelly did his big one with that because it got people talking.
It got people trying to guess what was going to happen next.
The songs, each one was less than a, if I can remember was less
than a minute and 30 seconds.
Which is, which is again is to his point is genius because it keeps people wanting
to hear more and then for radio that was absolutely, that was a gold mine for
radio because it keeps people tuning in.
So that's what his genius is.
He's good at getting us horny, good at getting us, you know, turned up.
And, um, and we're nosy.
So, of course, we want to hear, you know, want to hear what the, uh, what's going to
happen next when he opens up the closet.
Jay Ray: So, okay, y'all let us know.
Drop it in the chat.
If you want to join us, we are planning to watch trapped in the closet.
I've never seen.
Any of them except of except if i've caught a clip, but it's been very few
and far between Literally r kelly does not trend in my algorithm really so
I don't really see a lot of r kelly stuff But so i've never seen them.
So sir.
Daniel and I are probably going to get together And we want to invite you and
for those of y'all that came to our live show Let them know how crunk it is
when you come and hang out with Queue Points Outside of here because we really
get to we really get to talk mess Um, but I want to watch the trapped in the
closet with sir Daniel and we might as well invite all of y'all because y'all
will want to watch it too We should all watch it together like a family.
I want to see trapped in the closet
DJ Sir Daniel: I see Shaniqua in the chat on IG.
Shaniqua and I were working at the, um, at HMV Record Store during the height of R.
Kelly's superpowers.
So we saw plenty of those CDs walking out of the store because he,
I don't know, he, I really believe whatever magic is associated with the
mythology of the, um, the Pied Piper.
Him him linking himself to that mythology of the Pied Piper was Was very smart on
his point on his part because he really did that there was just something and
this could be said about cult leaders You know, there was something that was
very Magnetic about him and the things that he was doing that people just ate up
Jay Ray: I think I think okay.
So this is the perfect timing to talk about the pop music formula.
Yes, I think this is the perfect timing.
So I'm actually going to pull in there was a study that came out this year.
Hold on.
I'm gonna put the screen share back up.
There was a study that came out this year.
This is not the study.
This is scientific scientific American did kind of a recap of it.
So I'm gonna read a couple of pieces of this 'cause I think it's really important.
So, when comparing today's hit tunes with the top 40 of the past decades, strong
opinions are never in short supply.
Every generation seems to lament its successors, musical tastes, and
listening, listening habits, right?
We, we get into the habit of doing that.
What it's saying though is new research suggests.
Popular music has indeed undergone some measurable and significant shifts
over the past 50 years, with popular song lyrics becoming simpler, And more
repetitive, according to a study published on Thursday in Scientific Reports.
Here's a quick quote.
There's more rhyming lines and also more chorus, says the study's senior author,
Eva Zangarelli, a computer scientist at Austria's University of Innsbruck.
We basically found that lyrics have gotten easier to comprehend.
This trend observed across five of the most popular English language music
genres, including rap rock R& B and country since 1970 hints at how shifts
in music listening habits Platforms and production may be shaping pop culture.
Here's why I wanted to mention this Because that's the thing that R.
Kelly figured out.
Yes,
DJ Sir Daniel: so Sir,
Jay Ray: sir, Daniel and I before as we were kind of preparing for this show
Um Um pulled the lyrics to you are not alone, which I always thought was just
like a beautiful song and then i'm like Oh, this song only has like two
two verses like the song is all verse.
That's it It's like some lyrics, but the lyrics are real pedestrian.
Like there's like a verse.
Let me pull up.
I'm pulling it up.
Please do you are not alone.
We are going to read the lyrics to you are not alone together and you will understand
exactly what we're talking about here.
DJ Sir Daniel: Program directors all that what they're looking
for is there they they need what we're talking about that era.
What was attractive to a program director is whether the song was going to keep
people tuned into their radio station.
Um, for the amount of time that the song was on so that they could sell
you stuff after the song was played.
Yep, and then and then they will program it so it can be played
again long enough so you can stay.
And listen to, for the song to be played again so they can sell you more stuff.
That's why it's called programming.
And so the music had to fit into that in order for them to sell more stuff,
they had to have so short enough to play put in rotation so they can have more
commercials put in to sell you stuff.
And so, as we see here, go ahead with the, I'm going to
Jay Ray: just, I want people to understand.
All right.
So.
This is You Are Not Alone.
When you go through and you read the lyrics, I'm just
going to read the first verse.
Another day has gone.
I'm still all alone.
How could this be?
You are not here with me.
You never said goodbye.
Someone tell me why did you have to go and leave my world so cold?
And then, We go and we slip into the, the, the, the, uh, the chorus every day.
I sit and ask myself how they love sip away.
Something whispers in my ears and says, you are not alone.
And then we go through the, you're a lot alone, lone, lone.
Then we have.
A verse which makes sense.
We got a second verse.
Okay, cool So then we do a little bit of that.
All right, that's the second verse I'm not gonna read it all the way through Okay,
then we hop back into that chorus, right?
Then we're gonna give you a little A little bit we're gonna give you
like a vamp then we're gonna hop right back into that chorus, right?
And we just ride that course out for the rest of the song, right?
Now
DJ Sir Daniel: michael jackson do what michael jackson michael jackson
Jay Ray: does right now This is not i'm not saying that this is unlike other
songs that other songs don't have similar structures That's not what i'm saying.
What i'm saying is r kelly very early figured out that I only
need to give them a little bit.
I need to give them a I don't need to overthink these
verses I need to make them.
I need to make them clear and concise Give them some hot vamps
and a great hook and a great chorus.
And we're going to ride that thing out four minutes.
DJ Sir Daniel: And less than that, and shout out to Shaniqua to, um, bringing
up Mariah Carey and her 5 words.
Yes.
I love a good Mariah Carey, 5 word.
I love the fact that she could put, she could fit incessantly.
Into a song lyric, I'm all for it, but even Mariah Carey, you know, she,
she's going to give you a thoughtful lyric, but all artists after a while,
they figured out, Oh, we've got to, in order for our songs to make it.
To um, to airplay, we've gotta, we've gotta um, make it concise.
We've gotta dumb it down a little bit and even take out bridges.
And that's what a lot of people are complaining about now is that
songs don't have bridges anymore.
Jay Ray: I want a bridge!
Listen, we need to campaign.
Queue Points has always been campaigning for the bridge.
Bring back the bridge.
We want to understand the song.
We need time to get into this thing.
So baby, I need you to bridge me and to tell me what we need to know.
DJ Sir Daniel: That's why here at Queue Points, we always speak Michelle
Williams, the black Michelle Williams.
We always speak her name because she is the queen of bridge.
You know, Beyonce
Jay Ray: was in the studio.
Michelle, Go in and do your thing.
Go and handle
DJ Sir Daniel: that.
Go and handle that for me.
Jay Ray: Okay, but I do want to, the beauty, I'm so glad you mentioned Mariah.
We also, Laura Hill put the word reciprocity into a song.
DJ Sir Daniel: Reciprocity.
Stop it now.
Jay Ray: Stop it.
I'm just I'm just
That's a five syllable word
DJ Sir Daniel: that you
Jay Ray: have to
DJ Sir Daniel: sing real quick.
Jay Ray are we haven't chatted with our buddy in a long time, but Daryl.
Darryl is in the chat on Instagram.
We gotta shout out our friend Darryl.
We, we are praying for you out there on the West Coast.
I hope you're all good.
I saw you post earlier that you're good and I want to make sure that
you're still staying good out there.
And we, you know, we're thinking about you and the whole West and the
whole Los Angeles in this moment.
Jay Ray: Yes.
So y'all and you know, it's so funny.
So Instagram is over here.
So I can't even read like what's happening I see y'all is popping
over on IG But yes, and I see it.
Everybody is like yo to the bridge bring bridges back We playing with these
people by not giving them a bridge so that we can really get into these songs.
Okay and so R.
Kelly back to R.
Kelly is Has R.
Kelly proven himself over the years to be Um, he's a good crafter of songs.
You know what I'm saying?
It's undeniable like you can't even undeny that we are not talking about
R Kelly the person and all that other stuff that we absolutely disagree with.
We have been very clear about where we stand on that stuff
with him as a songwriter.
We get it.
We get that.
Is he the greatest American songwriter ahead of a head of
like Smokey Robinson ahead of?
I.
There are so many I cut carol king a pair There are so many songwriters
DJ Sir Daniel: so many and I think Yes.
Okay.
So here's the thing.
We understand that people get on x or twitter And they talk greasy they
hot takes or call hot takes just for that Sometimes you just throw it
out there just to get people riled up and this and the that twitter
user did just that With his 3.
5 million views on this one tweet But I think, so here's a question.
If R.
Kelly never got into trouble or never, or his, um, antics never got brought into
the light, do you think in a few years, J.
Ray, that we could have possibly seen R.
Kelly inducted into like a Kennedy Honors as a, um, American songwriter,
like alongside the likes of Carole King and, you know, Aretha
Franklin and, and those people?
Jay Ray: I, I don't actually, I don't, I don't, and not because I think he,
those spaces, I think you have to have more cachet in white world.
Not to say that white people didn't love R.
Kelly too, because white people definitely did.
You can't sell as many records as he did.
And I have white people loving you too.
But I do think Our Kelly was much more of a black famous star and he
would have gotten whatever accolades in black culture that we would have
given him at the highest level.
Our Kelly would have definitely gotten those awards.
I don't think you can write the lyrics that are make the
songs that are Kelly made.
I don't think you can make like an ignition and get like a Kennedy honor.
DJ Sir Daniel: This is not going to happen, right?
Yeah, I mean,
Jay Ray: correct me if I'm wrong, y'all.
Let me know in the chat, like IG.
I mean, can.
Can you, can you
DJ Sir Daniel: do your, yes, you all there in the IG chat, all, all of the chats.
Can you see R.
Kelly if he hadn't, if all of that stuff had not come into the, into the light.
Could R.
Kelly have been inducted into like the Kennedy honors as a American of the great,
one of the greatest American songwriters.
Now to your point, Jay Ray, I do think he was knocking on becoming white
people famous when he did, when he made a duet with That duet with, um, Lady
Gaga, Lady Gaga, and I'm going to tell you, I thoroughly enjoyed that song.
Jay Ray: What was it?
Do what you want to my body.
Do what you want with my body.
DJ Sir Daniel: Which in retrospect, you know.
It's a
Jay Ray: whole mess.
DJ Sir Daniel: It's a whole mess.
But I, listen.
That thing I used to that I used to bump that that R.
Kelly and Lady Gaga something serious I even made my own my own mashup.
Did you?
did.
I
Jay Ray: want to hear your mashup of do what you want
DJ Sir Daniel: Is do what you want the the acapella?
Well, I made I did filtered out my own acapella and um And partnered it
with the, the yin yang twins whisper.
Jay Ray: That is an appropriate combination.
DJ Sir Daniel: Oh, yes, absolutely.
Jay Ray: So check this.
Look at the, look at the chat.
Let's talk about what the people are saying.
Yeah.
No.
So the people are like, nah, son.
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah, it looks like a big, a big fat.
No.
So I don't know.
Maybe it's just the people that watch that watch and listen to this podcast.
So they're just like, not going to happen.
Or there are, but there's a segment.
We cannot ignore that segment of the community that is not letting go.
Of R Kelly.
It's like that picture of black Jesus and JFK in every black home
in the sixties and seventies.
Some black people just aren't going to let it go.
They are not going to let, let go of that picture of Martin Jay,
JFK and black Jesus in their home.
They're just not going to let it go.
Despite everything that has come to light.
Jay Ray: I think we are far enough removed from.
R.
Kelly's imprisonment.
That folks.
I think these are all personal decisions.
You know what?
This is a personal decisions.
Jay Ray has long decided to not be an R Kelly fan.
So I don't got I don't got nothing.
I'm always weird.
When an R Kelly song that was the R Kelly and Jay Fiesta came on and on the
radio the other day and I'm like, oh, we're playing songs with R Kelly in it.
Now, is that what we're doing?
I don't like it.
DJ Sir Daniel: And I think, you know, I'm one of those DJs where
I'm not, I'm just going to be controversial to be controversial.
I am going to put on this R Kelly song and I dare one of y'all
to come say something to me.
That's not that that's not my bag.
I there's plenty of music around that.
I can play old and new.
in a set.
I don't have to make that a part of my repertoire.
Why?
Because it just has an ick factor to it to me.
Jay Ray: You said something earlier that I think is really important.
People have to decide what hills they want to like make their thing.
This R.
Kelly thing is not worth it to me.
First of all, The despicable things that that man has done.
I don't even want that type of energy, even though I don't know.
No R Kelly.
I never met.
No R Kelly.
I don't want that kind of energy.
Nowhere near me, even though it's just coming through the speaker.
I don't want none of it.
I don't want none of it near me.
And so I do think.
That people get to make choices about we decided to have this
conversation because we were very confused about somebody saying that R.
Kelly was the greatest American songwriter.
I mean ever ever that's wild.
That is a wild statement to make.
That's the reason why we wanted to have this discussion.
I if it was not this conversation, if we do, if we did not see that tweet, we
probably wouldn't be talking about R.
Kelly.
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah, so Nick, Nick fresh, just use the, uh, a quote on
the timeline saying called, um, the people that are keeping like R Kelly
alive, like, is there still their theme?
Theme music are like the hotel uncles and he's, and this is a segment of, of
black men that specifically feel like R.
Kelly is a victim of a system trying to take him out systematically
because he is a black man and R.
Kelly was about to buy Jive Records
and
DJ Sir Daniel: he wasn't, well, he, but he, he's, he was, he, he's a victim
of systematic racism, which is not.
Which is not far.
He's a victim of a very bad educational system.
He's a victim of a lot of child abuse,
Jay Ray: child abuse and assault and all
DJ Sir Daniel: of those things.
That man has been victimized throughout his whole life.
And what and what do victims do?
They tend to victimize other people.
That's not always in R.
Kelly's case.
This is what happened.
You're absolutely right.
Now, trying to Put him up on nail him to a cross and make him
and make him the savior of R& B.
You know, again, like Jay Ray said, if that's the hill you want to die
on, if that's the, if that's the, the, the road to Calvary for you,
that's what you want to carry on your back by all means do that.
But I, but back to the topic, back to the topic, I
Jay Ray: want to share something.
This is the man That y'all want to raise up.
This is him.
Here's what he said.
You remind me of my Jeep.
I want to ride it.
Something like my sound.
I want to pump it girl.
You look just like my cars.
I want to wax it.
What?
And something like my bank accounts.
I want to spend it.
And he repeated it.
Okay.
This, this is not worth it.
It's not worth it.
I don't
DJ Sir Daniel: know.
I don't know.
I don't think this is, but I don't think this is an episode where we're
definitively trying to say that R Kelly can't be the greatest American
songwriter because clearly there's a lot of people who still ride for him.
I'm saying that , but what we're saying over here, as for me and my house, as
for me about house, it's not flying.
No, that's the bull.
That's cap.
And that kids, what
Jay Ray: they say, that's cat.
That's the young people
DJ Sir Daniel: say it's cap.
That's not, that's cap.
It's a skull.
Scully.
It's a hoodie.
It's all of the things.
It's not the truth over here, . So I don't know.
Try again.
Try
Jay Ray: again.
DJ Sir Daniel: I mean, you got, Oh, no, I don't.
I almost brought up another name, but I don't want to go off into that tangent
because he's definitely a son of R Kelly.
And I'm not going to, I'm not going to bring that up.
Do we
Jay Ray: want, who?
Who?
DJ Sir Daniel: Maybe this should be like a, a paper.
Should this be a Patriot conversation?
I don't know what I'm now.
Jay Ray: Oh, I mean, we could do that.
Y'all want to come and hang out with us again.
Well, apparently we got to have another conversation.
I don't even know who's there.
Daniel's about to mention.
I do not know this
DJ Sir Daniel: person was on the verge of being in trouble
also, but that quietly went away.
That's all I'm going to say.
Jay Ray: Okay.
DJ Sir Daniel: That accusation came and went and went quietly away.
Jay Ray: Okay.
Okay.
These are, these are things more to come.
So here's what y'all need to do.
Here's what y'all need to do to stay up.
You see what just happened?
There's like a cliffhanger.
So Please y'all.
Thank y'all so much For I see the chat It is going crazy on ig and I love it Y'all
thank y'all so much for rocking with us.
We appreciate it.
It is a new year um, if you Subscribe to Queue Points.
You will notice that we do have new artwork.
DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah, you know what?
We got to post it on our IG.
We got to
Jay Ray: post it on our IG because we haven't done that yet, but we have a
new artwork done by James Dillenbeck.
Thank you so much, James, for that.
And we're kicking off.
You don't see we have a new look.
We got a look.
Here, you know, we doing some things, you know, moving and shaking So thank
you all so much for just rocking with us We really appreciate it.
If you can see our faces or hear our voices, please subscribe wherever you
are I want to do a quick shout out tree was over and I don't a tree what's
happening You say a good evening and we want to make sure that we acknowledge
you um over on youtube, but Thank you.
Subscribe wherever you are.
Visit our website at Queue Points.
com.
You can check out our blog.
You can listen to all of our old episodes of Queue Points and
you can shop our store at store.
Queue Points.
com.
We love y'all.
We appreciate y'all.
DJ Sir Daniel: We sure do.
And Jay Ray, what do I say at the end of every episode?
My, my eyes.
And let me stop this life.
You have a choice.
You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play.
I'm DJ Sir Daniel.
My name is Jay Ray, y'all.
And this is Queue Points podcast, dropping the needle on black music history.
We will see you all in the next go round.