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Janice Porter: Hello, everyone,
and welcome to this week's

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episode of relationships rule.
This This week we have an

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international guest Jocelyn Tong
is with with me today from all

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the way from Melbourne,
Australia. I hope I said that

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right. And welcome to the show,
Jocelyn.

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Jocelyn Chong: Well, thank you
so much for having me on this

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show. It's been a pleasure. And
I had a great time having a chat

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with few journalists. And oh, we
learned so much from you. So

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yeah, glad to be on this show,
as well.

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Janice Porter: Awesome. Well,
now I know your story is really

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interesting. And for me, when I
was reading about you, what I

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found fascinating, I would love
you to share with my audience is

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how you go from, first of all,
your Malaysian background to in

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and then in financial planning,
and city sales, and then

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financial planning, and then to
this wonderful career as a as an

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entrepreneur, and a coach and a
speaker, etc, etc. So please let

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my audience have a little
inkling into that.

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Jocelyn Chong: Right, I will
share the shorter version. So I

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was born and raised in Malaysia,
at the age of 17, I left home to

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pursue my further education now
Australia, and I did a double

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degree in commerce in
accounting. And so it was a

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natural path to work for the big
four, which is an young at the

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time. And in there, I became an
auditor. So I did a lot of

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audits for the top leading
companies in Australia. And one

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of that company invited me to
join them as the internal

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auditors. So I got that job. And
within four months, or within

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four weeks, I relocated from
Adelaide to Melbourne. One day,

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I went around the whole country
because he was a national role.

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So I traveled so much. And I
realized that I wanted a job in

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the banking sector, because
finance is something that I love

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doing. And I love the numbers. I
love investing, I love working

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with money. And so I decided
that was the appropriate time

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for me to switch career, taking
all my accounting background

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skill sets, and then move into
banking. So I landed on a

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banking role. And I was in
retail banking for two years.

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And throughout that whole
process, you know, I learned so

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much about people, because
banking is all about people, you

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talk to them about the issues,
your problems with money, and

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you help them solve it. I then
was excelling in that role. So

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the state manager asked me to
step into a financial planning

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role, which is far more senior
and is heavily regulated in my

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country. So I need to do further
studies to get the certification

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and the license to practice. And
I did that. So I excelled in

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that role as well. And they
invited me to actually lead a

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team and then a national team.
And so I progressed throughout

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that rank and really did so
well. But equally, I was working

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so hard. I was selling my soul
to my organization. And I

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reached a point whereby this is
not the kind of life that I

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dreamt off. Even though the
money was good. The lifestyle

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was not what I wanted, I had to
compromise a lot of things. And

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you know, friendships and time
because I was in the office all

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the time, I realized that I have
always loved business, I've got

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so many skills around sales,
speaking coaching, that I can

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really set up my own practice to
help others who are in the same

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shoes who needed that kind of
support, and who needed that

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kind of coaching as well,
because I noticed that there was

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a gap in the industry that
nobody is coaching in a

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practical way, a lot of the
method of coaching is true

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information through reading
things through following

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template. But what is missing is
the practical component that I

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can share stories that can help
them pinpoint exactly where they

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need the support and tweak that
for them. And that can really

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speed up their success because I
witnessed that when I coach my

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team members, many of them had
been in the job maybe 1015 years

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and they still in the same old
pattern. And when I led the team

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and I noticed that by sitting in
their meetings and giving them

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coaching without permission,
they are like oh my God, nobody

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has actually told me that. And
you know when we say one thing

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and some Analysis assessing is
very different, especially when

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you're in the same room
together, for sure. And that's

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where the magic again. And so I
noticed that that is the power

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because my coaching style is
very practical. And I'm a very

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practical person, I'm, you know,
as much as I am listening, I'm

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also a very visual person. And
so when I coach and when I

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support others, I actually need
to witness that and see that for

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myself, because sometimes what
we see, we're able to tweak a

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little bit, and that significant
change is wildly amazing. So

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that's what I do for my clients.
Well,

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Janice Porter: I know that you,
you went in the traditional path

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to start with, right and got
your degrees and went in the

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corporate world, and you did all
of those things, probably to

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please your parents as much as
anything else. Right? And yeah,

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and and I don't know, I'm
curious, though, if it has

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anything to do with the, the
generation, like, when we in

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your generation, which is
younger than mine, in your

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generation, do you? Do you come
to the conclusion or the

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realization faster, that the
corporate world is just, you

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know, it's just not for me?
Like, you know what I mean, like

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a lot of people my age, they
never got to question that they

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got to just go, they there
wasn't the there weren't the

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options then. So do you find
that with the people that you

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work with now that they're doing
what you did, or, you know what

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I'm saying.

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Jocelyn Chong: In the corporate
world, if someone is very

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ambitious, they can navigate
through different roles within

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the organization. But as you
progress further, like for me,

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the next role I apply is one out
of six for a role that has got

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35,000 people. So there's very
little opportunities for me to

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explore even further, because
there is that much competition.

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And it's getting harder as you
progress further, because

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there's less role. And it is
more consuming to actually, you

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know, work harder, like your
work, you you will literally be

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working, there's no life outside
of work on Sunday.

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Janice Porter: And you're then
working for the company, the

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company's making the money, you
know what I mean? So, yeah,

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that's the way I see it anyway.
So would you say what? Well, let

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me ask you this, because when
you shifted, I know that you you

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had an impetus that forced to
kind of, I think that their

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vision in the company you were
working for closed down in the

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financial planning part, right.
And so now was the time to make

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the move correct.

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Jocelyn Chong: So right, so at
the time where it happened, we

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had a Royal Commission in
Australia. And so all the banks

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decided to shut down their
financial planning arm because

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it was not viable for them to
support that business arm. So

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all the banking sector decided
to spin off shut down

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transgender clients outside. And
so I was impacted by that I had

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two options. I could go out and
set up my own financial

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planning, practice more, I
could, you know, do something

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else. And I was close to buy a
practice. But then I thought,

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you know, I've done this for
over 15 years, there's so much

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more beyond just, you know,
being in this industry, there's

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so much more than I want to
explore. And so I decided to

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explore more than the financial
planning world that I was part

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of, which was very grateful. I
learned so much from the world

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of banking and finance, I met
1000s and 1000s of people set on

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so many meetings and stories
that people would share with me,

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they will never share with
someone else in your family is

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so privileged, you know, I had
executed Allah wills because

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financial planning, obviously,
once they pass away, we will go

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to their will and we will
distribute their investments

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based on what they have told us,
of course, working in alignment

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with their estate planning
lawyer. But it was just, you

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know, a lot of events that, you
know, taught me so much about

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life that I don't think I would
get that kind of personal

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experience, if I have been in
another role. So

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Janice Porter: would you say
what role would you say

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relationships played in
navigating you towards your new

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challenge your new business, you
know, the relationships in

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business relationships moving
forward to help you start your

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entrepreneur practice.

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Jocelyn Chong: Yes, no, I think
it the business is very

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relationship driven. And we have
to love people, we have to want

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to help people. And that's the
key part, which I know a lot of

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entrepreneurs tend to skip that,
maybe because they are an

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introvert, maybe because they
have never been taught about the

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relationship piece of the work,
because they could be very

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strong, technically in the
aspect that they want to

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deliver. And I noticed that with
a lot of my clients that they're

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so good in the strategies, the
tools, the product that they

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want someone else to use, but
they don't have the skill to

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communicate that product
benefits to someone else. And so

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that's a skill that we can all
learn. So yeah,

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Janice Porter: so one of the
biggest challenges then that

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that your clients face when they
come to you for help? Is it? Is

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it what it's mindset? Or is it
the lack is just not mindset?

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Always, but I know that's a big
one for you. Is it confidence?

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Is it not knowing how to get
through to people? Is it they

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just need a tweak? Or is it a
whole big deal for somebody?

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Jocelyn Chong: I mean, it's
different in the major part that

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I noticed the commonly wants is
mindset. Because a lot of us

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have been conditioned for a
while of how we do things in a

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set way. So it's challenging to
think beyond that, because your

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brain is so wired to operate
that way. And that pattern

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becomes a way of life. And so if
someone is willing to explore

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differently, they will go
through that period of

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discomfort, because the
discomfort is actually teaching

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them how to step out of the old
patterns that got them the

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results they were looking for.
But those patterns no longer can

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deliver the new results they
were expecting. And I will help

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them identify exactly where it
is. So to give you an example,

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I've got a commercial broker
coming from another bank that

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decided the setup, this person
had been in the bank for 14

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years, knew exactly what they
need to do. And so when she came

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to coach with me, she needed to
know how to connect with people,

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and how to market herself.
Because she is the CEO, now she

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is helping someone get the
results. And in the banking

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sector, the leads come to you,
you don't need to go and find

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the leads, I say that is a huge
component of helping her step

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out and how to network
effectively. So a lot of people

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go out, I go to networking
events and hope that I'm there

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the leads will come to me. Not
so because you actually need to

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break it down to really
different areas. Number one, you

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need to get to know someone they
need to trust you know, you and

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know that you can deliver
something for their clients. If

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you're asking for an
introduction. Number two,

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doesn't mean you meet someone,
the leads will come to you

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immediately. Sometimes lead
comes in 45 days, 100 days, two

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years. And so patience is
absolutely necessary. And to be

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very strategic, because when you
go to a networking event, you

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never know who you will meet. So
it's important not to judge

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people just because they might
not be someone that you think

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will refer to you. You never
know what connections they might

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have. You don't know who? Yeah,
exactly. And so it's all these

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things that it's not taught in
school or in books, right. But

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it is actually learn to what
you're caught and what you

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witness and for me is helping
her navigate through that. And

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then the other aspect is her
branding. Because when you work

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for brand, you'd have got the
company's brand on your business

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card. But when you are running
your own organization, now you

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are the brand you are the
company brand. So what do you

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represent? Do you need to dress
more professionally? Do you need

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to change your posture when you
speak to someone? Do you have

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your I help statement, how you
say it and how you follow

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through with it. And so it's not
just doing the I help statement

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and hope that someone would send
you leads and the leads will fly

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in. It's actually a Got more
than that. So? And also what I

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noticed in I mean, it sounds
like we're doing her case study,

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but because I want to give a

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Janice Porter: perfect Yeah, is

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Jocelyn Chong: that it is so
important also to not give up

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easily. Because in the brain
always go, I tried it already

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and it didn't work the first
time. And it might not work that

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time because you're using that
method. And sorry, the coaching

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sessions is, what if we apply
this method, but you can get

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more results? So how do you show
up in the 40 seconds that say,

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in a networking event, how you
show up and what you say, and

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how you use that time to say
hello to someone building like a

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trust, but there's no like in
trust look like for you help her

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redefine that. So we did a lot
of work. It's so soft, skills

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driven. Because technically,
from a technical aspect, she

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knew what she needed, or as is
the soft skill that we could

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help her apply, gain her
confidence, right? She goes on.

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A lot of people have been doing
this role in the marketplace

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already. So why would they
choose me? And so why not? Yes,

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yeah. Like those people who
started, they have to start from

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somewhere to that, because they
started 10 years ago, but that

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was their starting point, just
your is your starting point. So

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it's helping understand that,
you know, it needs to start

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somewhere helping her apply the
right methods that applies to

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her business, getting the system
simplify the system stay very

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positive, because she had
encountered a lot of obstacles

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along the way. Because, you
know, relationship with

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stakeholders, sometimes people
can be manipulative. And they

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might, you know, use her
materials, but not hire her. And

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so the how to process those
hurdles, to move forward. And it

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was a huge, you know,
accomplishment, because today

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she made, you know, in revenue,
income 200,000. But it's to

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really guide her through step by
step. And to also teach her on

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helping to value her pricing
strategy. So her pricing

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strategy helped her to more how
to position herself, so that she

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knows how to talk about her
pricing in a confident way.

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People attach themselves when
they actually show up for their

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own business, because they think
that they are not worthy, or the

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need to under charge to get more
deals coming in. But when you

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under charge, people actually
don't perceive the value that

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you're offering to them. So we
get a lot of work around that

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aspect as well on the mindset
about worthiness, your money,

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beliefs, and how to actually
trust in yourself even more.

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Janice Porter: Absolutely, there
is so much to to, to think about

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from what you just said. So from
the beginning of someone

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starting their own business, and
coming from an in a corporate

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environment where the leads come
directly to them, I was in that

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position, I was a corporate
trainer for many years, and they

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would just send us out to train
and so I never had to find my

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own clients. And when I went out
on my own, I experienced that

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very same thing. The thing that
I found is that there was a lot

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I didn't know about running a
business. And so you've

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incorporated all of those things
as well into your, your

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coaching. But you have to walk
into those networking events

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with intention, knowing what
your your what your goal is at

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that particular event. And the
piece that I that I think you

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didn't say, but I'm sure you'll
agree with me is that because

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you said some of them take time,
it's not everybody will come at

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the when you're expecting them
to come and do business with

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you. But what you must do is
follow up and stay connected to

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people because they all have
their own timeline. Right? So

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you keep going out there you
keep doing what you're doing if

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it's working, but you keep doing
it and you follow up with the

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people from the past the ones
that you think are prospects

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because no doesn't always mean
No, right? It just means not

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right now, and unless you
clarify otherwise, right. So

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there's that and then talking
about the money, the pricing. I

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totally understand where you're
coming from there too. I think

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when it's when we first speak
our pricing, if it's

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uncomfortable, we can tell
because it doesn't roll off our

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tongue very well. But it doesn't
take long. Once you practice and

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you do that you grow into it.
And by then, it's time to do it

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again, right to up your prices
again. But I know I just had

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that experience myself, where
somebody just said to me, Oh, is

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that for all three sessions. And
right away, I knew I could have

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charged her more. So, you know,
it is what what I, you start to

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find those signals and, and
build that confidence yourself.

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So I love what the work that
you're doing, I think it must be

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really gratifying as well, to
see them go from there to you

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know, success, a successful
career.

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Jocelyn Chong: Yes, and also,
because I watched Dell personal

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transformation, yes, they become
more confident, yes, they'll be

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able to articulate what they
want to offer, with clarity. And

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I witnessed that in their
growth, because they think

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strategically, because a lot of
times you have an idea in your

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head. But the ideas are just you
know, all flowing and flooding

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in the thoughts. But when you
actually put it down pen to

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paper, the sequence, and the
step by step to get the results

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is great getting clear each time
when I coach her and she goes

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away and create that process for
her client as well. Fantastic is

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sometimes you work in the
organization, they direct you to

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the next step, and you have
systems directing you from

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workflow, one to workflow two,
when you're operating your

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business, you effectively will
need to create that workflow in

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order to move yourself forward.
And you don't have anyone

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guiding you unless you have got
a coach to guide you to step

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forward as well. So that was
also another very, very fun

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thing that I witnessed, which
was amazing, because those are

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skill sets. Once you have got
those skill sets, they stay with

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you and you gain mastery and you
can move forward with you know,

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bigger and better things.

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Janice Porter: Mm hmm. So do you
also I think, um, do you teach

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people how to sell from the
stage how to speak to sell? Is

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that part of do? Yeah. So yes.
What would you say the three

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biggest mistakes are that people
make when they're trying to do

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that.

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Jocelyn Chong: So number one,
selling one to one and selling

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from the stage is very different
skill sets. And so you will need

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to have a proven product to sell
from the stage because you're

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selling one to many. And you
will need additional skills on

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speaking to a group. Because
when you speak one on one, you

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got one person, you are able to
address one objection at a time.

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But when you actually address
the group, let's say a group of

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15, a group of 50 a group to
1000 your message and the way

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you move your body across the
stage is a whole nother level.

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So my recommendation is when
someone wants to sell from the

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stage is to just learn to speak
to a crowd first before you

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start selling from the stage.
Because selling from the stage

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has got a whole nother level
technique. And there is a way to

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move the audience. So is a very
different level of skill set

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that you will need to add on to
your repertoire of selling from

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the stage and knowing how to
overcome their objections

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knowing how to look after the
crowd. Because when when you're

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doing any form of selling, you
are actually caring for the

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crowd. You're looking after
them. And if you don't look

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after yourself, you can look
after the group. Well, I

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Janice Porter: like Sorry,
that's me after that. I like

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that. I like that because there
are audiences that I'm very

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comfortable speaking in front of
I was a teacher. I don't mind

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getting up in front of people
and speaking, but if I have to

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sell, I feel completely
different. If I'm training, I'm

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good, because I'm teaching,
right if I'm if I'm presenting

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to sell, it feels different. So
I understand, you know what

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you're saying? And I'm not
always as comfortable doing

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that. So I see people who are
masters at it and I watch you

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know, they're great storytellers
usually, and they have a way of

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drawing the audience in And I
bet I haven't seen you on a

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stage. But I bet you do that
too.

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Jocelyn Chong: Yes. And you can
see me on the stage in my master

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classes virtually that I do. Oh,
yeah, monthly basis.

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Janice Porter: That's right,
tell me about.

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Jocelyn Chong: And so I do host
a monthly master classes that I

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welcome people in, and they can
actually come and learn. And

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then at the end, I make an offer
to help them advance so that

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they can implement that. So I
like the point where you really

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help our audience, identify the
speaker that just speak from the

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stage about your story. And then
there's speaker that teach which

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is corporate training, right. So
when we teach is very different

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method again, because it is for
them to learn. So how to

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implement how to apply the
principles, the concepts, the

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methods that we deliver. And
then selling from the stage is a

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whole nother level, like you
said, because there is

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storytelling, there is different
methods that I can go into

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another session, but to help
people identify speaking is

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there's so many segments to it.
And you know, people who jump on

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the stage does not necessarily
know how to deliver a sales

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pitch as well. Because, you
know, for example, a lot of

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people that gives presentation,
they are just disseminating

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information to the people so
that they are informed is a very

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different level of presentation
skills. It

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Janice Porter: is it so yeah, so
of the work that you do, which

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piece Do you like the best? Do
you like the one I love? Like

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the speaking what do you like
the best.

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Jocelyn Chong: So one on one and
speaking my gym, because they

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come hand in hand. Both requires
us to speak into their lives, to

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encourage them to empower them,
and to actually leave them with

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some level inspiration to take
action. And so they can get

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better themselves. So minds
fulfillment is that people who

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are in my orbit, I call them my
environment, they walk away

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taking something that they are
improving, either their skills,

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or their mindset have been
shifted, so that they are going

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to contribute to the industry,
they'll segment they'll roll

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their business even better. So
that is my mission every single

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day. That's

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Janice Porter: beautiful. That's
really beautiful. So what would

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you say your your best business
tip would be for my audience of

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entrepreneurs and small business
owners to take away from this

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conversation today.

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Jocelyn Chong: I've got a lot of
favorite ones. But today, I'm

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going to actually invite
everyone. We are coming into the

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end of the year. And I want to
invite everyone to reflect on

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what you have accomplished this
year. And to list them down all

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the wonderful things that you've
accomplished and celebrate

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yourself hard. Because I noticed
that a lot of people don't take

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the time to celebrate their own
progress or accomplishment. And

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if we don't celebrate it
ourselves, we are not going to

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do good to ourselves. Right? We
are our people expect other

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people to celebrate them. But we
have to bet on ourselves and

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celebrate ourselves. And that is
part of self care strategy to

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move into the next year. And you
take with you what you did

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really well. And you continue to
refine you continue to upgrade.

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I speak for myself, I'm a
lifelong learner, I continue to

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learn I continue to go oh, you
know what else I can learn more?

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You know, before this recording,
I was part of a mastermind

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group. And today we're learning
how can we you know, deliver a

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lot of things that we do speak
to market with a lot of AI tools

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00:29:15,540 --> 00:29:20,460
that is already available and
how can we integrate them to

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actually bring things and
results quicker and better for

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our clients. So it's learn and
be fast in willing to learn

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rather than not and pushing them
away. So it's really important

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to think differently about that
as well.

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Janice Porter: Right? Your
video? Yeah, your video just

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went strange on me here.

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Jocelyn Chong: Okay. i Okay, is
that

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Janice Porter: I'm still here,
according Okay. All right, so I

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can hear you. So this is all
been amazing. And I know that

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you do a

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A webinar every month, right?
And people can find on your

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website. Yes, yes. And it just
Oh, my

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Jocelyn Chong: next one. And you
can always find that on the

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00:30:13,710 --> 00:30:18,960
website. So it allows you to
know which one is next. And I

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welcome you all to come and join
me on a live masterclass. And,

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00:30:24,270 --> 00:30:29,820
yeah, let's have some fun. And
so, Jenny, thank you so much for

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00:30:29,820 --> 00:30:30,990
this time together.

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Janice Porter: You're very
welcome. I've enjoyed it. I

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00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,290
think you're a gem and I, at
what time will I be able to lie

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be awake when you do your
masterclass?

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Jocelyn Chong: Absolutely. So it
is ideal time for you and I

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because I accommodate to all my
friends and colleagues and

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00:30:49,140 --> 00:30:53,580
clients in the US. So I will
send you the link and yeah,

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let's have some fun.

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Janice Porter: Yeah, that sounds
like like fun for sure. So thank

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you so much for being here.
Jocelyn. Much appreciated, and

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00:31:01,860 --> 00:31:06,690
people can find you I know at
Jocelyn chong.com.au Or on

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00:31:06,690 --> 00:31:07,860
LinkedIn. Correct?

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Jocelyn Chong: Absolutely.

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Janice Porter: Thank you so much
for being here and for sharing

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00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:17,490
your wisdom with my audience.
And remember to my audience,

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00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:21,090
thank you for being here and
remember to stay connected and

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00:31:21,090 --> 00:31:21,930
be remembered