Janice Porter: Hello, everyone, and welcome to this week's
episode of relationships rule. This This week we have an
international guest Jocelyn Tong is with with me today from all
the way from Melbourne, Australia. I hope I said that
right. And welcome to the show, Jocelyn.
Jocelyn Chong: Well, thank you so much for having me on this
show. It's been a pleasure. And I had a great time having a chat
with few journalists. And oh, we learned so much from you. So
yeah, glad to be on this show, as well.
Janice Porter: Awesome. Well, now I know your story is really
interesting. And for me, when I was reading about you, what I
found fascinating, I would love you to share with my audience is
how you go from, first of all, your Malaysian background to in
and then in financial planning, and city sales, and then
financial planning, and then to this wonderful career as a as an
entrepreneur, and a coach and a speaker, etc, etc. So please let
my audience have a little inkling into that.
Jocelyn Chong: Right, I will share the shorter version. So I
was born and raised in Malaysia, at the age of 17, I left home to
pursue my further education now Australia, and I did a double
degree in commerce in accounting. And so it was a
natural path to work for the big four, which is an young at the
time. And in there, I became an auditor. So I did a lot of
audits for the top leading companies in Australia. And one
of that company invited me to join them as the internal
auditors. So I got that job. And within four months, or within
four weeks, I relocated from Adelaide to Melbourne. One day,
I went around the whole country because he was a national role.
So I traveled so much. And I realized that I wanted a job in
the banking sector, because finance is something that I love
doing. And I love the numbers. I love investing, I love working
with money. And so I decided that was the appropriate time
for me to switch career, taking all my accounting background
skill sets, and then move into banking. So I landed on a
banking role. And I was in retail banking for two years.
And throughout that whole process, you know, I learned so
much about people, because banking is all about people, you
talk to them about the issues, your problems with money, and
you help them solve it. I then was excelling in that role. So
the state manager asked me to step into a financial planning
role, which is far more senior and is heavily regulated in my
country. So I need to do further studies to get the certification
and the license to practice. And I did that. So I excelled in
that role as well. And they invited me to actually lead a
team and then a national team. And so I progressed throughout
that rank and really did so well. But equally, I was working
so hard. I was selling my soul to my organization. And I
reached a point whereby this is not the kind of life that I
dreamt off. Even though the money was good. The lifestyle
was not what I wanted, I had to compromise a lot of things. And
you know, friendships and time because I was in the office all
the time, I realized that I have always loved business, I've got
so many skills around sales, speaking coaching, that I can
really set up my own practice to help others who are in the same
shoes who needed that kind of support, and who needed that
kind of coaching as well, because I noticed that there was
a gap in the industry that nobody is coaching in a
practical way, a lot of the method of coaching is true
information through reading things through following
template. But what is missing is the practical component that I
can share stories that can help them pinpoint exactly where they
need the support and tweak that for them. And that can really
speed up their success because I witnessed that when I coach my
team members, many of them had been in the job maybe 1015 years
and they still in the same old pattern. And when I led the team
and I noticed that by sitting in their meetings and giving them
coaching without permission, they are like oh my God, nobody
has actually told me that. And you know when we say one thing
and some Analysis assessing is very different, especially when
you're in the same room together, for sure. And that's
where the magic again. And so I noticed that that is the power
because my coaching style is very practical. And I'm a very
practical person, I'm, you know, as much as I am listening, I'm
also a very visual person. And so when I coach and when I
support others, I actually need to witness that and see that for
myself, because sometimes what we see, we're able to tweak a
little bit, and that significant change is wildly amazing. So
that's what I do for my clients. Well,
Janice Porter: I know that you, you went in the traditional path
to start with, right and got your degrees and went in the
corporate world, and you did all of those things, probably to
please your parents as much as anything else. Right? And yeah,
and and I don't know, I'm curious, though, if it has
anything to do with the, the generation, like, when we in
your generation, which is younger than mine, in your
generation, do you? Do you come to the conclusion or the
realization faster, that the corporate world is just, you
know, it's just not for me? Like, you know what I mean, like
a lot of people my age, they never got to question that they
got to just go, they there wasn't the there weren't the
options then. So do you find that with the people that you
work with now that they're doing what you did, or, you know what
I'm saying.
Jocelyn Chong: In the corporate world, if someone is very
ambitious, they can navigate through different roles within
the organization. But as you progress further, like for me,
the next role I apply is one out of six for a role that has got
35,000 people. So there's very little opportunities for me to
explore even further, because there is that much competition.
And it's getting harder as you progress further, because
there's less role. And it is more consuming to actually, you
know, work harder, like your work, you you will literally be
working, there's no life outside of work on Sunday.
Janice Porter: And you're then working for the company, the
company's making the money, you know what I mean? So, yeah,
that's the way I see it anyway. So would you say what? Well, let
me ask you this, because when you shifted, I know that you you
had an impetus that forced to kind of, I think that their
vision in the company you were working for closed down in the
financial planning part, right. And so now was the time to make
the move correct.
Jocelyn Chong: So right, so at the time where it happened, we
had a Royal Commission in Australia. And so all the banks
decided to shut down their financial planning arm because
it was not viable for them to support that business arm. So
all the banking sector decided to spin off shut down
transgender clients outside. And so I was impacted by that I had
two options. I could go out and set up my own financial
planning, practice more, I could, you know, do something
else. And I was close to buy a practice. But then I thought,
you know, I've done this for over 15 years, there's so much
more beyond just, you know, being in this industry, there's
so much more than I want to explore. And so I decided to
explore more than the financial planning world that I was part
of, which was very grateful. I learned so much from the world
of banking and finance, I met 1000s and 1000s of people set on
so many meetings and stories that people would share with me,
they will never share with someone else in your family is
so privileged, you know, I had executed Allah wills because
financial planning, obviously, once they pass away, we will go
to their will and we will distribute their investments
based on what they have told us, of course, working in alignment
with their estate planning lawyer. But it was just, you
know, a lot of events that, you know, taught me so much about
life that I don't think I would get that kind of personal
experience, if I have been in another role. So
Janice Porter: would you say what role would you say
relationships played in navigating you towards your new
challenge your new business, you know, the relationships in
business relationships moving forward to help you start your
entrepreneur practice.
Jocelyn Chong: Yes, no, I think it the business is very
relationship driven. And we have to love people, we have to want
to help people. And that's the key part, which I know a lot of
entrepreneurs tend to skip that, maybe because they are an
introvert, maybe because they have never been taught about the
relationship piece of the work, because they could be very
strong, technically in the aspect that they want to
deliver. And I noticed that with a lot of my clients that they're
so good in the strategies, the tools, the product that they
want someone else to use, but they don't have the skill to
communicate that product benefits to someone else. And so
that's a skill that we can all learn. So yeah,
Janice Porter: so one of the biggest challenges then that
that your clients face when they come to you for help? Is it? Is
it what it's mindset? Or is it the lack is just not mindset?
Always, but I know that's a big one for you. Is it confidence?
Is it not knowing how to get through to people? Is it they
just need a tweak? Or is it a whole big deal for somebody?
Jocelyn Chong: I mean, it's different in the major part that
I noticed the commonly wants is mindset. Because a lot of us
have been conditioned for a while of how we do things in a
set way. So it's challenging to think beyond that, because your
brain is so wired to operate that way. And that pattern
becomes a way of life. And so if someone is willing to explore
differently, they will go through that period of
discomfort, because the discomfort is actually teaching
them how to step out of the old patterns that got them the
results they were looking for. But those patterns no longer can
deliver the new results they were expecting. And I will help
them identify exactly where it is. So to give you an example,
I've got a commercial broker coming from another bank that
decided the setup, this person had been in the bank for 14
years, knew exactly what they need to do. And so when she came
to coach with me, she needed to know how to connect with people,
and how to market herself. Because she is the CEO, now she
is helping someone get the results. And in the banking
sector, the leads come to you, you don't need to go and find
the leads, I say that is a huge component of helping her step
out and how to network effectively. So a lot of people
go out, I go to networking events and hope that I'm there
the leads will come to me. Not so because you actually need to
break it down to really different areas. Number one, you
need to get to know someone they need to trust you know, you and
know that you can deliver something for their clients. If
you're asking for an introduction. Number two,
doesn't mean you meet someone, the leads will come to you
immediately. Sometimes lead comes in 45 days, 100 days, two
years. And so patience is absolutely necessary. And to be
very strategic, because when you go to a networking event, you
never know who you will meet. So it's important not to judge
people just because they might not be someone that you think
will refer to you. You never know what connections they might
have. You don't know who? Yeah, exactly. And so it's all these
things that it's not taught in school or in books, right. But
it is actually learn to what you're caught and what you
witness and for me is helping her navigate through that. And
then the other aspect is her branding. Because when you work
for brand, you'd have got the company's brand on your business
card. But when you are running your own organization, now you
are the brand you are the company brand. So what do you
represent? Do you need to dress more professionally? Do you need
to change your posture when you speak to someone? Do you have
your I help statement, how you say it and how you follow
through with it. And so it's not just doing the I help statement
and hope that someone would send you leads and the leads will fly
in. It's actually a Got more than that. So? And also what I
noticed in I mean, it sounds like we're doing her case study,
but because I want to give a
Janice Porter: perfect Yeah, is
Jocelyn Chong: that it is so important also to not give up
easily. Because in the brain always go, I tried it already
and it didn't work the first time. And it might not work that
time because you're using that method. And sorry, the coaching
sessions is, what if we apply this method, but you can get
more results? So how do you show up in the 40 seconds that say,
in a networking event, how you show up and what you say, and
how you use that time to say hello to someone building like a
trust, but there's no like in trust look like for you help her
redefine that. So we did a lot of work. It's so soft, skills
driven. Because technically, from a technical aspect, she
knew what she needed, or as is the soft skill that we could
help her apply, gain her confidence, right? She goes on.
A lot of people have been doing this role in the marketplace
already. So why would they choose me? And so why not? Yes,
yeah. Like those people who started, they have to start from
somewhere to that, because they started 10 years ago, but that
was their starting point, just your is your starting point. So
it's helping understand that, you know, it needs to start
somewhere helping her apply the right methods that applies to
her business, getting the system simplify the system stay very
positive, because she had encountered a lot of obstacles
along the way. Because, you know, relationship with
stakeholders, sometimes people can be manipulative. And they
might, you know, use her materials, but not hire her. And
so the how to process those hurdles, to move forward. And it
was a huge, you know, accomplishment, because today
she made, you know, in revenue, income 200,000. But it's to
really guide her through step by step. And to also teach her on
helping to value her pricing strategy. So her pricing
strategy helped her to more how to position herself, so that she
knows how to talk about her pricing in a confident way.
People attach themselves when they actually show up for their
own business, because they think that they are not worthy, or the
need to under charge to get more deals coming in. But when you
under charge, people actually don't perceive the value that
you're offering to them. So we get a lot of work around that
aspect as well on the mindset about worthiness, your money,
beliefs, and how to actually trust in yourself even more.
Janice Porter: Absolutely, there is so much to to, to think about
from what you just said. So from the beginning of someone
starting their own business, and coming from an in a corporate
environment where the leads come directly to them, I was in that
position, I was a corporate trainer for many years, and they
would just send us out to train and so I never had to find my
own clients. And when I went out on my own, I experienced that
very same thing. The thing that I found is that there was a lot
I didn't know about running a business. And so you've
incorporated all of those things as well into your, your
coaching. But you have to walk into those networking events
with intention, knowing what your your what your goal is at
that particular event. And the piece that I that I think you
didn't say, but I'm sure you'll agree with me is that because
you said some of them take time, it's not everybody will come at
the when you're expecting them to come and do business with
you. But what you must do is follow up and stay connected to
people because they all have their own timeline. Right? So
you keep going out there you keep doing what you're doing if
it's working, but you keep doing it and you follow up with the
people from the past the ones that you think are prospects
because no doesn't always mean No, right? It just means not
right now, and unless you clarify otherwise, right. So
there's that and then talking about the money, the pricing. I
totally understand where you're coming from there too. I think
when it's when we first speak our pricing, if it's
uncomfortable, we can tell because it doesn't roll off our
tongue very well. But it doesn't take long. Once you practice and
you do that you grow into it. And by then, it's time to do it
again, right to up your prices again. But I know I just had
that experience myself, where somebody just said to me, Oh, is
that for all three sessions. And right away, I knew I could have
charged her more. So, you know, it is what what I, you start to
find those signals and, and build that confidence yourself.
So I love what the work that you're doing, I think it must be
really gratifying as well, to see them go from there to you
know, success, a successful career.
Jocelyn Chong: Yes, and also, because I watched Dell personal
transformation, yes, they become more confident, yes, they'll be
able to articulate what they want to offer, with clarity. And
I witnessed that in their growth, because they think
strategically, because a lot of times you have an idea in your
head. But the ideas are just you know, all flowing and flooding
in the thoughts. But when you actually put it down pen to
paper, the sequence, and the step by step to get the results
is great getting clear each time when I coach her and she goes
away and create that process for her client as well. Fantastic is
sometimes you work in the organization, they direct you to
the next step, and you have systems directing you from
workflow, one to workflow two, when you're operating your
business, you effectively will need to create that workflow in
order to move yourself forward. And you don't have anyone
guiding you unless you have got a coach to guide you to step
forward as well. So that was also another very, very fun
thing that I witnessed, which was amazing, because those are
skill sets. Once you have got those skill sets, they stay with
you and you gain mastery and you can move forward with you know,
bigger and better things.
Janice Porter: Mm hmm. So do you also I think, um, do you teach
people how to sell from the stage how to speak to sell? Is
that part of do? Yeah. So yes. What would you say the three
biggest mistakes are that people make when they're trying to do
that.
Jocelyn Chong: So number one, selling one to one and selling
from the stage is very different skill sets. And so you will need
to have a proven product to sell from the stage because you're
selling one to many. And you will need additional skills on
speaking to a group. Because when you speak one on one, you
got one person, you are able to address one objection at a time.
But when you actually address the group, let's say a group of
15, a group of 50 a group to 1000 your message and the way
you move your body across the stage is a whole nother level.
So my recommendation is when someone wants to sell from the
stage is to just learn to speak to a crowd first before you
start selling from the stage. Because selling from the stage
has got a whole nother level technique. And there is a way to
move the audience. So is a very different level of skill set
that you will need to add on to your repertoire of selling from
the stage and knowing how to overcome their objections
knowing how to look after the crowd. Because when when you're
doing any form of selling, you are actually caring for the
crowd. You're looking after them. And if you don't look
after yourself, you can look after the group. Well, I
Janice Porter: like Sorry, that's me after that. I like
that. I like that because there are audiences that I'm very
comfortable speaking in front of I was a teacher. I don't mind
getting up in front of people and speaking, but if I have to
sell, I feel completely different. If I'm training, I'm
good, because I'm teaching, right if I'm if I'm presenting
to sell, it feels different. So I understand, you know what
you're saying? And I'm not always as comfortable doing
that. So I see people who are masters at it and I watch you
know, they're great storytellers usually, and they have a way of
drawing the audience in And I bet I haven't seen you on a
stage. But I bet you do that too.
Jocelyn Chong: Yes. And you can see me on the stage in my master
classes virtually that I do. Oh, yeah, monthly basis.
Janice Porter: That's right, tell me about.
Jocelyn Chong: And so I do host a monthly master classes that I
welcome people in, and they can actually come and learn. And
then at the end, I make an offer to help them advance so that
they can implement that. So I like the point where you really
help our audience, identify the speaker that just speak from the
stage about your story. And then there's speaker that teach which
is corporate training, right. So when we teach is very different
method again, because it is for them to learn. So how to
implement how to apply the principles, the concepts, the
methods that we deliver. And then selling from the stage is a
whole nother level, like you said, because there is
storytelling, there is different methods that I can go into
another session, but to help people identify speaking is
there's so many segments to it. And you know, people who jump on
the stage does not necessarily know how to deliver a sales
pitch as well. Because, you know, for example, a lot of
people that gives presentation, they are just disseminating
information to the people so that they are informed is a very
different level of presentation skills. It
Janice Porter: is it so yeah, so of the work that you do, which
piece Do you like the best? Do you like the one I love? Like
the speaking what do you like the best.
Jocelyn Chong: So one on one and speaking my gym, because they
come hand in hand. Both requires us to speak into their lives, to
encourage them to empower them, and to actually leave them with
some level inspiration to take action. And so they can get
better themselves. So minds fulfillment is that people who
are in my orbit, I call them my environment, they walk away
taking something that they are improving, either their skills,
or their mindset have been shifted, so that they are going
to contribute to the industry, they'll segment they'll roll
their business even better. So that is my mission every single
day. That's
Janice Porter: beautiful. That's really beautiful. So what would
you say your your best business tip would be for my audience of
entrepreneurs and small business owners to take away from this
conversation today.
Jocelyn Chong: I've got a lot of favorite ones. But today, I'm
going to actually invite everyone. We are coming into the
end of the year. And I want to invite everyone to reflect on
what you have accomplished this year. And to list them down all
the wonderful things that you've accomplished and celebrate
yourself hard. Because I noticed that a lot of people don't take
the time to celebrate their own progress or accomplishment. And
if we don't celebrate it ourselves, we are not going to
do good to ourselves. Right? We are our people expect other
people to celebrate them. But we have to bet on ourselves and
celebrate ourselves. And that is part of self care strategy to
move into the next year. And you take with you what you did
really well. And you continue to refine you continue to upgrade.
I speak for myself, I'm a lifelong learner, I continue to
learn I continue to go oh, you know what else I can learn more?
You know, before this recording, I was part of a mastermind
group. And today we're learning how can we you know, deliver a
lot of things that we do speak to market with a lot of AI tools
that is already available and how can we integrate them to
actually bring things and results quicker and better for
our clients. So it's learn and be fast in willing to learn
rather than not and pushing them away. So it's really important
to think differently about that as well.
Janice Porter: Right? Your video? Yeah, your video just
went strange on me here.
Jocelyn Chong: Okay. i Okay, is that
Janice Porter: I'm still here, according Okay. All right, so I
can hear you. So this is all been amazing. And I know that
you do a
A webinar every month, right? And people can find on your
website. Yes, yes. And it just Oh, my
Jocelyn Chong: next one. And you can always find that on the
website. So it allows you to know which one is next. And I
welcome you all to come and join me on a live masterclass. And,
yeah, let's have some fun. And so, Jenny, thank you so much for
this time together.
Janice Porter: You're very welcome. I've enjoyed it. I
think you're a gem and I, at what time will I be able to lie
be awake when you do your masterclass?
Jocelyn Chong: Absolutely. So it is ideal time for you and I
because I accommodate to all my friends and colleagues and
clients in the US. So I will send you the link and yeah,
let's have some fun.
Janice Porter: Yeah, that sounds like like fun for sure. So thank
you so much for being here. Jocelyn. Much appreciated, and
people can find you I know at Jocelyn chong.com.au Or on
LinkedIn. Correct?
Jocelyn Chong: Absolutely.
Janice Porter: Thank you so much for being here and for sharing
your wisdom with my audience. And remember to my audience,
thank you for being here and remember to stay connected and
be remembered