Do you work for a public transit agency now and w

ant to move up the career ladder, maybe even to the top position?

I'm Paul Comfort, and on this episode of Transit Unplugged,

we talk with Holly Arnold.

She is the administrator of the Maryland Transit Administration, a

statewide agency which also oversees the Baltimore City Transit System.

And Holly describes her move up the career ladder at the MTA through

various positions, from the budget and planning department, grants, up through

overseeing engineering and then to the top job as administrator of the MTA.

I think you'll find it a great career path to study and look at as

you look at your own career path.

She also describes the agency itself.

It's a massive multimodal agency with six modes, bus, light rail, a

subway system, commuter train service, commuter bus service, and paratransit.

She describes some of the big projects they're working on, including the

nation's largest still, public private partnership with the Purple Line, a

16 mile light rail line being built on the outskirts of Washington D.

C.

that the MTA is overseeing.

Plus, some big work being done on their subway, the B& O Tunnel, and

the brand new Red Line coming back.

All that, a great interview with Holly Arnold, Administrator of the Maryland

Transit Administration in Baltimore.

Great to have Holly Arnold with us today on the podcast.

Holly is Administrator of the MTA, the Maryland Transit

Administration in Baltimore.

Holly, thanks for being with us.

Yeah.

Thanks for having me.

I appreciate it.

Yeah.

Holly was on one of our, uh, Transit Unplugged live events,

uh, within the last year or so.

And so great to have you now with, uh, with your own episode of the

podcast on Transit Unplugged.

first off, Holly, why don't you just describe the MTA itself?

I think it's so unique, uh, these statewide agencies.

there's a few of them, especially in the Northeast Corridor.

that aren't standalone authorities like WMATA or SEPTA or whatever, but they

actually work for the state government.

Tell us about the agency some there and your role.

Yeah, absolutely.

So yeah, as you noted, MTA is um, a state, part of the state DOT.

So we report up to the Secretary of Transportation here in Maryland.

And we are fairly unique as one of the larger agencies,

um, being part of a state DOT.

so that means that we're responsible for essentially being

the transit provider in Baltimore.

So here in Baltimore City, we pro in the Baltimore region.

We provide, um, our light rail, uh, metro subway, our core

bus and paratransit service.

and then statewide, we have a fairly comprehensive and large

commuter bus network, as well as three, um, MARC commuter rail

lines that we provide service to.

And then outside of that, because we're part of the state DOT and we're the

federally designated recipient, for funds, we provide technical support

and assistance to all of the locally operated transit systems in each of

Maryland's 23 counties and Baltimore City.

it's a lot on the plate.

I mean, uh, when I was there, I think it was the 11th largest

transit system in America.

Do you know where you rank now on ridership and that kind of stuff yet?

I know we're still pretty high up there.

I think we're at the top 15.

Um, and yeah, and one thing I actually didn't even mention is

we're also building the Purple Line.

So the, still the largest transit, uh, public private partnership.

partnership project in the country outside of Washington, D.

C.

Between Montgomery and Prince George's County.

So yeah, it's a huge portfolio, but we've got a great team and all working

together to deliver that service.

a couple little notes, I'd want to mention is, uh, you're,

you've got a great new Secretary of Transportation here in Maryland.

You want to say anything about him?

So, uh, Secretary Wiedefeld, uh, we're so lucky to have him.

Uh, he has experience working at MTA.

He was in my role at MTA actually back when I very first started, uh, in 2009.

Um, he has a great experience at, uh, Washington Metro.

Um, and then outside of that, he worked at the airport.

Um, so he has a, uh, Tremendous amount of knowledge and experience here in Maryland.

So I'm lucky to bounce things off of him.

Yeah.

Paul Wiedefeld is just an amazing guy and was the right guy at the right time,

I think for this new administration.

Uh, and so happy he's there because you know, he really knows Maryland

as well as knows his subject matter.

So that's great.

talk about your responsibilities some, Holly.

I mean, you've just painted a really large portfolio.

I mean, basically, you're the administrator of a state agency,

but you're also general manager of the Baltimore City Transit System.

and you have other responsibilities as well.

Talk about what you, kind of like, what your day is like and what you oversee.

Yes, absolutely.

I mean, so the, I think the largest part that takes a lot of time is the

kind of general manager of the day to day here in Baltimore City, right?

Like we have, uh, you know, operations, we have 800 buses, we have over

a hundred rail cars that are out providing service every day and

making sure that we're supporting the employees who are out doing that.

Um, we have, you know, uh, close to 300, 000 riders every day.

So again, making sure that they have the support and the service that they

need, uh, to get where they're going.

there's also the policy aspect, right?

So thinking about that, that statewide, piece, right?

So thinking about, you know, uh, bus rapid transit in the counties.

What does that look like?

What is MTA's level of support on that?

we're considering, uh, working with, uh, Charles and Prince George's

Counties to build a rapid transit line down in Southern Maryland, right?

And so what is MTA's role there?

How are we going to interact and engage, um, with a, a rail line that's so,

or a, a bus line that's so far from kind of where our core service is.

Um, same thing with, you know, Purple Line, uh, is a, a tremendous,

uh, amount of responsibility.

We have a fantastic team down there.

You know, we spent the past year really making some changes, uh, in

our team and the consultant team.

And we brought in that new design builder in 2022.

And so just really kind of gearing up.

We've got the fantastic team down there that's leading things, but I still need

to kind of help out with like the budget piece and the tying and endeavor and

everything else that we have going on.

Yeah.

Let's, let's unpack that just a little bit because it is so unique, I think.

And this is the way a lot of large agencies operate is they'll have a

separate kind of group or department handling this, these massive big projects.

Tell us about how that's organized.

The purple line.

Yeah, so we have a we do kind of have a separate arms.

We have our transit development delivery group that is set

up to deliver mega projects.

So right for a long time, it's only had the Purple Line.

Recently, we hired our senior project director for the Red Line.

We'll be bringing someone on for Southern Maryland Rapid Transit as well.

So excited to kind of really build that out.

Um, but yeah, so the Purple Line team, uh, it's a small, but mighty team

that works down there to get things going supported by, uh, consultants.

So we have a PMC and GEC consultant that really make up the bulk of the staff to

oversee the work and because it is a P3.

So we have our concessionaire partner that is responsible for delivering

the project and underneath them, they have a design build contractor.

Who's mostly who we're working with right now.

Um, but we're also, there's the operations piece, right?

Like we.

Not just building this, we have to have an operations component long term.

And so we've really started to dive in with Purple Line Transit operators and

thinking about how they're going to be operating and how they're making those

decisions, you know, nitty gritty stuff.

Like what is the horn and bell policy as they go through a tunnel?

But Hey, that's what, that's what, uh, the communities care about.

And so making sure that we, you know, we're addressing those things

now and starting to think about it.

And is it still a 16.

2 light rail line around the suburbs of D.

C.

connecting into Washington Metro?

Yes.

Yeah.

So it makes connections at multiple Metro stations, all three MARC

lines, Amtrak, commuter bus, and the local transit services.

So it's a huge connector in that region.

Public private partnerships really had their

heyday, I think, in the last decade.

And through the pandemic, of course, like everything else,

there was issues with them.

Do you still think it's a good way to handle megaprojects like this?

I think you've got to take each project individually

and think them through.

Um, you know, I was at MTA when the decision was made, but I

wasn't part of that discussion.

You know, I understand why that was the choice that was made for this project.

I think right hindsight's always 20 20.

We've had some issues with it, but you know, we've got a good design build

partner and a concessionaire on board now.

And I think we're in a really good place with all the changes

we've made over the past couple of years to get the project done.

And that's really what we care about, right?

Like, let's get the project done.

Let's get some people riding it because it will be such a fantastic connector

for the communities that need it in Montgomery and Prince George's.

Yeah.

I'm super excited about it.

I always, always believe in that project.

So, um, you mentioned you were at MTA, but you weren't part

of the, uh, part of the team.

So let's, let's dive into your career path a little bit,

because I think it's fascinating.

I remember, uh, when I got there, I don't know what, I think

it was 2016 as administrator.

And you were at the time, I think the director of capital budgets and

one of the very first meetings I had.

I'd never run a large transit agency before, but I tell the story a lot.

I remember, you know, all these folks coming in and you would

set this meeting up because you were head of capital budgets.

Uh, and they were, we had like 145 capital projects going on, I think at the time.

So you brought in the top 50 projects.

And I think it took two days to sit in a room with all

these folks and listen to them.

Pitch their, you know, project, where it's at, and then at the end, you and

Kevin Quinn, uh, who was ahead of plenty of time, came up to me and said, okay,

Paul, so as you saw today, we've wrapped up, you know, this project, that project,

and that project, and there, uh, there's some money left over in their budgets.

It's like 10 million dollars.

What would you like to do with that?

And I was like, Well, how about a big party?

That didn't seem to fly.

So, but instead, you know, you would kind of rank what the other projects were

that didn't make the budget that year.

And we could, we could then go ahead and fund some of those.

Walk us through what I want you to do, if you don't mind is walk us through

your, your career path and how you chose what you were going to do next.

And then maybe delve into a couple of those, You know, responsibilities,

because a lot of folks that listen to this are looking to grow their career.

They're currently mid level managers or staff at transit agencies.

You've kind of been through, uh, a number of positions at the same agency

and grown, you know, just like it should be done in my opinion, right?

By the time you were, you were MTA administrator, I mean, you probably

knew the agency better than anybody.

Uh, and so it made sense to have you in that role just for that.

Not, not even talking about your leadership abilities, et cetera, but

walk us through that if you would.

Yeah, absolutely.

So I started at MTA actually as a contract employee back in 2009 under,

uh, then Administrator Wiedefeld, um, and I started out, I was a Grants

Administrator, and so my job was we would get these ginormous paper invoices and

go through page by page, put a stamp on it, and identify what grant was

supposed to be funded, what product was supposed to be funded by what grant.

so yeah, I very much did Very low level starting out kind

of working, uh, on day to day.

It was a great experience, though, because I get to understand the federal process,

what the Federal Transit Administration was looking for, understanding what

projects could be funded by what grants, and I loved what I got to put

together when I became the Capital Program Manager after a couple years.

The it was almost like a puzzle being able to identify these are the

different funding sources that we have.

These are the different projects.

This is when it's going to be spending and identify how do we make this work?

How do we get the most bang for our buck as we're as we're

moving our projects forward?

And how do we advance the agency?

and that job was also fantastic too, because.

You really do get to know the entire agency, right?

Like at a transit agency, the capital budget is involved in everything, right?

Like you're not buying or building anything without

the capital group involved.

And you know, one of the things that I did, and I really recommend to anyone

going forward is just, I asked a lot of questions and took advantage of like,

hey, I want to see this project like we're building this thing and it's really cool.

Can I come out and see it while it's under construction?

And so I did that.

I remember, um, when our, it was MARC locomotives that were coming in at

the time and I, um, asked the team, like, Hey, can I come see these?

And there's a picture of me, you know, way back when, uh, sitting in a MARC

locomotive, like, pretending to drive it.

Um, but it was really awesome because I get to know the projects, I get to

know the importance of the projects.

I got to understand timelines, um, right?

So, like, you know, utilities, anytime that's gonna, where you have to deal

with a utility, it's gonna take a little bit of extra time and understand

the impacts of some of those things.

so I spent a lot of time in the capital program group, again, really getting to

know the agency and how the agency worked.

I became, uh, the director of planning in, um, 2017.

And so that was, again, a really pivotal time.

You know, we were launching BaltimoreLink, the bus network redesign.

Um, work closely with Kevin and was able to, um, take on kind of the student

outreach before school started, right?

So we basically had kind of two launches for BaltimoreLink.

One was the summer launch where we changed everything.

And then that fall students were coming back and they may not

have ridden the system before.

And so we had to make sure that they knew where they were going.

They knew what bus route to get on.

And so I spent a lot of time working through that as well.

I was a director planning for about two years.

Um, my biggest kind of most exciting project that I did there outside of

Baltimore link was, um, the Central Maryland regional transit plan.

So this was a legislatively mandated plan to look at, uh, 25 years,

um, 5 counties and Baltimore City.

Um, like what is our goal and desire for the region and

where do we want to be going?

Um, so it was really fun to work with, uh, with there's a commission that

was established with the local elected officials to identify, you know, what

are we looking at to move forward?

And, you know, we identified a number of corridors.

Um, we did a corridor study, which was the East West corridor study, which has

now kind of been revamped as the revived red line, um, and then a North South one,

uh, from Towson to downtown Baltimore, both of which are moving forward.

We also looked at additional dedicated bus lanes, additional TSP,

um, shelters, and then a big one for me is, uh, accessible stops.

Um, so one of the things that I learned in that report is only, I think it

was 19 percent of bus stops in this Baltimore region were accessible, right?

So that is, that is not a good number.

Um, and so we've been working with Baltimore city on that.

Um, but we've also been putting our, our money where our mouth is and MTA is

investing about 20 million in making, um, over 200 bus stops, um, ADA accessible.

Um, cause we want to make sure that everyone can use transit.

Yeah, that's great.

so then after I was a director of planning for

a little bit, um, our deputy administrator position came open.

And so that one was responsible for planning, engineering, uh, real estate

and our local transit support group.

Um, and so that one was definitely a tough choice for me to say like,

yes, I want to go for this role.

I'm not an engineer and overseeing engineering and construction

was a little intimidating.

Um, but, you know, I said like, hey, I want to take this on.

I want to do it.

You know, there's a number of things I get frustrated with engineers, right?

Like, I love engineers.

They're fantastic, but they're engineers.

And so I was like, let me let me see what I can do to kind of change some

of those things and work with them.

And so I took on the deputy administrator role in 2019 and did that for.

a couple years before, um, throughout the pandemic, which was, which was very

interesting to see how things changed and, and that some of the challenges

that the team was going through with the supply chain and how do you do

construction when you can't have a morning safety briefing because you can't have

everyone in the room together, right?

Like a lot of things that really came up with the team that we had to work through.

Um, but you know, challenges that were overcome and the team did a great job on.

Um, and then in 2021, um, I was asked to take on the role of acting

administrator, um, here at MTA.

And so, um, that was very exciting.

I was seven months pregnant at the time.

So, uh, I think it was, you know, during the pandemic, a lot of people didn't

realize cause they only saw me from, uh, you know, neck up on the screen.

And then I went out and was meeting operators and kind of waddling around.

But I will say, uh, It's a, it's a good way to get to know people and

get to know people as a person, right?

They see me, yes, I'm the administrator, but also I'm like, I'm, I'm a person.

I'm a mom.

And so, you know, we still, people always ask how, um, how my daughter's doing

. Paul Comfort: Yeah.

It humanizes you or something.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's really fantastic.

That's pretty cool.

Can we take one quick step back on the engineering job?

Uh, and then we'll dive into some of your current projects.

I was hoping you could kind of unpack.

What engineering departments do at transit agencies?

We haven't really covered that a lot on the podcast, but they're so important.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

I mean, so we, you know, we need engineers to do the designs for,

for kind of get all those major capital projects that we're doing.

so at MTA, uh, we have multiple groups within our engineering department.

Um, so we have a systems engineering group that basically handles our

vehicles and all of the systems, right?

The signal systems and the, a lot of the IT network, the phone network, things

that kind of talk to each other there.

Um, we have a civil group, uh, kind of civil and ADA that does really

what you would think in terms of kind of civil construction.

So they do our roofs and our parking lots, different projects like that.

And then we have a track and structures group that is responsible for, uh,

you know, ensuring that the track is maintained and then that the

structure is like our, our bridges and the stations and everything else.

Um, we also have a construction team, so they oversee, we don't do any of our

own construction, but they oversee the contractors that come in and ensure that.

You know, they're doing the right things in the right places,

submitting everything correctly.

Um, we have a QA QC team that kind of oversees all of that to make sure we're

following our, our processes throughout.

yeah, I mean, the engineers really are key to ensuring that we're

able to deliver our projects.

They, um, write the design documents.

They kind of oversee the procurement.

And then even once it's under construction, they're still involved with

the project to ensure that it's, it's being, you know, done in the way that

was, was originally designed and planned.

And does MTA, like most agencies, uh, have contracts with

some of the big engineering firms?

Yes, yeah, you name the, the firm, I think we've got

them on contract here, so yeah, we, we appreciate the support of

all of our, you know, consultant, uh, employees that help us out.

It's such a, uh, important but behind the scenes part

of any large agency that I wanted to give you a chance to talk about

it since you had overseen that.

Thank you.

And speaking of the big projects that, uh, that the engineering department

works on, let's talk about a couple of those that you're working on now.

Let's start off with the B& O Tunnel.

Uh, this is such an important project.

Yeah.

So this is the, um, within partnership with Amtrak.

So it's Amtrak owns the tunnel.

Uh, it is, uh, over 150 years old.

Um, the oldest tunnel that they inherited when they, when they became Amtrak.

and, the one stat that I love is that I think when it was built, uh, Ulysses S.

Grant was president, right?

Yeah, that's right.

He takes it back a little bit.

Civil war era.

Yes, uh, exactly.

So it is a very old tunnel.

still safe to operate today, but definitely a lot of issues with it

doesn't have obviously any sort of modern kind of life safety features.

Uh, there's a lot of issues with flooding.

so very much needs to be replaced.

What about the roof height?

Are they still going to go up with that some?

no.

So we're, but so we are looking at kind of replacing the tunnel

with a new tunnel that will.

Oh.

Change the curve, right?

So it's a pretty quick curve right now.

So like, but with a more gradual curve, we'll allow for faster travel time.

Again, it has water and life safety.

And, you know, thank you to the, the Biden Harris administration.

Uh, the Federal Railroad Administration awarded, you know, more than $4

billion to Amtrak, uh, for the tunnel.

MTAs, uh, contributing 450 million to that . Okay.

Um, and the other big piece of that project, which I'm very excited

about, uh, again, going back to accessibility, we're gonna get a new.

Finally, ADA accessible West Baltimore Mark Station, uh, which is something that

we've been talking about for a really long time, um, and so that will be fantastic

for the communities there, um, we're looking at, you know, the Red Line would

also come in there, so a great opportunity for transit oriented development, and

just, I think it could be, it should be a game changer for the communities.

And you've got a subway there.

Um, and, uh, talk, talk to us about what's happening there.

We do.

Yeah.

A lot of people forget that Baltimore has a subway, including folks who live here.

And so that's one of the best kept secrets that I'm trying

to make sure is not a secret.

That folks have a really fantastic way to get around town.

But yeah, so we have on our subway system, it is 40 years old.

And so we are in the process of replacing the vehicles and the signal system.

Um, you know, they're just kind of aged out.

The vehicles themselves need to be replaced.

And so we received, uh, so we have a contract for, for both of those.

Um, the signal system installation has been in the works for

the past couple of years.

Uh, they're about ready to kind of flip the switch on that.

And we're also receiving the new vehicles.

The first test vehicle came last, uh, last year, going through the

testing now on the test track and should be going into service in 2025

. Paul Comfort: Awesome.

Now let's switch to the future.

So you got some other big things coming up.

talk to us about, the light rail vehicles that you're, so you were

just finished up a midlife recycle or rehab, and now you're, you got money

to go forward with brand new vehicles.

Well, we hope so.

We applied for a federal grant for that as well.

Yeah.

So, uh, fairly similarly, I mean, the, the light rail is 30 years old.

The vehicles themselves are pretty close to that and that is essentially

useful life for a light rail vehicle.

And so we've started the process to replace those.

And so, um, it's a big undertaking, right?

Like we're one of the last agencies that has kind of like those monstrous

high floor vehicles with a high block that you have to, if you want to use

a wheelchair that you have to get on.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And so we're looking at modern, low floor, smaller profile, um, more

obviously more context sensitive, right?

Like they will fit within the the urban environment way better

than our current vehicles do.

and so very excited to do that.

Outside of that, because it's a smaller footprint, it's not as wide, it's not as

high, we have to rebuild the stations.

Uh, to make sure that you can actually get on the train.

So that's going to be a big undertaking, um, but an exciting one because it allows

us, you know, I mentioned Howard Street before, um, Howard Street needs a lot

of work and improvements and it gives us that opportunity to work with the

city, work with developers to reimagine Howard Street and make it a much more

enjoyable, uh, place for folks to be.

That's great.

And then also on that one too, signal system, right?

So again, that behind the scenes stuff, like you don't see the signal system,

but if it doesn't work, it's problematic.

And so we're looking at a signal system replacement as

part of that effort as well.

Okay.

And tell us what we're at on the Red Line.

Yeah.

So Governor Moore in June, uh, relaunched the Baltimore red line, uh, which

is, um, still in the kind of early, planning stage is project development

at this point, but we have the ability to use 13 years worth of work and

documents and engineering from before.

so we brought on a senior project director to lead that effort.

We're working closely with the city and the county.

Um, and so we're, we've done all.

ton of engagement with the communities over the past year.

I will say the number one thing that we've heard is, uh,

get the shovel in the ground.

We want the Red Line now, um, which is great, um, and we're working with the

Federal Transit Administration to kind of brush off the environmental documentation.

Uh, we should have in 2024 an announcement of, of mode, so we're looking at, uh,

light rail or bus rapid transit, so which mode it will be, um, and then

beginning to move forward with that.

And we talked light rail earlier, so one exciting potential piece is, um,

it, the timing may work out that we're able to purchase a fleet of vehicles

for the existing light rail system if light rail is the chosen mode that

would match up with a red line vehicle, which would really be fantastic, um,

for being able to kind of like just that continuity of having the mechanics

understand, right, it's not two different fleets you have to train on, they can

actually be able to work, uh, on one.

And the red, the red line is the east west corridor.

Do you have something going on in your north south corridor?

We do.

So one of the, uh, in the Central Maryland Regional Transit Plan that I

mentioned previously, uh, one of the corridors identified was a north south

one from Towson into downtown Baltimore.

And so the team worked over the past 18 months to do a feasibility study there,

um, looking at potential ridership, what modes, what alignments would work.

Um, so that got published in December and so we're looking to kind of re

kick off that public conversation for the next steps, um, this year.

And so excited to, you know, again, Pretty closely mirrors our CityLink

Red, which is one of our bus routes.

Um, and that is our highest ridership bus route, uh, that honestly rivals,

uh, a lot of rail in other cities.

Um, so definitely a corridor that can use some investment.

Um, and so we're looking forward to that.

Holly, thanks so much for sharing with us your career path and

the big projects you've got going on at one of the largest agencies in America.

Yeah, absolutely.

Thank you so much for having me.

Hi, this is Tris Hussey editor of the transit unplugged podcast.

Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Transit Unplugged

with our special guest Holly Arnold.

Administrator of the Maryland MTA.

Next week, we have another special feed swap episode.

This time, we're swapping episodes with APTAs Transit Authority podcast, where

our VP for mobility initiatives in public policy Art Guzzetti is talking

with Amtrak CEO, Stephen Gardener.

We're excited to announce a special Transit Unplugged live CEO round table.

Hosted by Dr.

Kaan Yildizgöz at UITP MENA Transport Congress and Exhibition on February

the 29th at the Trapeze booth.

We'll have guests, including UITP President, Renee Amilcar and the

Director General of the Integrated Transport Center in Abu Dhabi.

Abdula Al Marzooqi Look for more information and links in the show notes.

The MENA transport Congress and exhibition 2024 is the event focusing

on sustainable urban mobility solutions in the MENA region.

It takes place in Dubai from February 28th to March 1st, the event is

co-organized by UITP and Dubai's RTA.

The MENA of Transport Congress and exhibition has been a premier

platform for showcasing advancements in public transport since 2007.

If you have a question comment or would like to be a guest on the show.

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