Alright. Welcome back to another episode of A a Calm

Mama. I'm your host. I'm Darlynn Childress. And today, we

have such a special treat for everyone

listening because I've invited my mother-in-law, Judy Childress,

onto the podcast to talk about, I don't know,

reflections on grandparenting, what it's like to watch someone parent in

this style, and also just so you get to know her because she's amazing.

So, Judy, welcome to the pod. Say hi.

Hi. Thank you, Darlene, for inviting me. This is a

real privilege. Yeah. And you you're a fan. You, like, listen

to the podcast sometimes. So that's why. I do.

I keep learning from you. Oh, that's

so sweet. Well, you can already tell, the listener can already tell that we have

a good relationship. And I know that's not true for every

mother-in-law and daughter-in-law. So we could probably do a whole

podcast episode on just that. Like, you know, what

you did to make a good relationship with me Become I think

you're a really good model of that, but we'll save that one for another

episode. So today we're gonna talk a little bit more about

parenting and grandparenting a how

those two worlds can collide a little bit and how you've

navigated some of those waters. But first, we have to say, why are you even

in town? Like, yeah, tell us what happened recently.

Well, we are in town because,

Sawyer graduated from high school on Thursday.

Yeah. Yeah. So that was a big day. And, because

he's your a and we have seen the

success of your parenting, and so it was quite a

celebration. Yeah. Yeah. He has been a wild calm

for sure. People who listen on the podcast know, like, if they're long

time listeners, they know, like, I had a lot of struggle with

Lincoln early on. We're a get into that. And then with Sawyer, it's

been it's a a lot of, like, adolescent

shenanigans and, you know, learning about how to

parent a teenager has come from him. So, yes, we

all breathed a big sigh of relief, didn't we?

Yes. And it was a moment for my husband

and myself because we're so proud of the job

that you have done. Mhmm. And so so

grateful that we could be part of being here and celebrating with

you. Yeah. Well, let's get into, like, quote,

unquote, the job that we have a. I can't remember. Okay.

Become, yeah, you know,

I often frame the way that we're parenting and, like, what I'm teaching on the

podcast as feelings first,

behavior second. That's one of the things that I think about

in how to describe this more connected parenting, this

emotional coaching, coaching parenting, you know, really using, looking

at behavior through this compassionate lens. And I

will juxtapose it to what I think of as traditional parenting

a how possibly maybe you grew you grew

up and how you raised Kevin. A were at

lunch yesterday a, you know, Doug, your husband said, well, we didn't know any

better. And I wondered if you wanted to share a little

bit just like, yeah, I don't know. You don't have to get all deep into

it, but, you know, how it what it was like

for you to be, like, traditional parenting and, maybe some

I don't wanna get all into, like, regrets and stuff Become we don't want you

to go all the way in there. But just I don't know. What are your

reflections on what you've seen in parenting and how it's changed

between the generations. Yeah. Well, that's really true. We did we didn't know any

better. We never had a class in how to parent.

Those things didn't seem to be that available in our

generation, and so we just parented the way that we

were parented. It's the only model that we had.

Mhmm. And I I think that calling it traditional parenting is a

good title because the tradition is just passed down

from generation to generation. And,

so I don't know,

when I saw well, the first time I saw

your material was when I went to a workshop with you. I think you

were first starting out, and I just I

was just blown away to realize, hey.

There's another way. A doesn't have to be the

way I was parented just because that's what

I've done and my parents did doesn't make it the best way.

And I had a couple

encounters early on with the kids when they your kids when they were

a, and it made a believer out of me because

my way was not working. And I don't

know if you want me to go into Yes. With that. A say today, they

say, spill the tea. You know? Give us all the tea. Yeah. Okay. Well, I

I remember this one incident in particular, which is

what really made me realize I was

deficient in my parenting abilities.

We were taking care of the boys, and it was

time for Sawyer to go to bed. And so

I, in my authoritative voice, announced that to him that it

was time for him to go to bed. And I can even remember where we

were standing in the stairway. And he yelled at me, and he

says, you can't tell me what to do. You're not my

parents. And I was just shocked. I I didn't even

know what to say, but I knew that I wasn't gonna win this battle.

And so I completely backed down, but then I realized,

well, I need to learn how how

to talk to Sawyer so that we wouldn't have these

explosive episodes.

A

and just would watch you a how you work through,

the steps of a dialing them down,

and and really just you stayed so

calm, and I thought, I wanna be like Darlene.

It's like, because I I would get

triggered, if if there was an explosion.

I had stuff in me that I hadn't worked

through. And so that was all very interesting to me Become

I'm I'm a licensed professional a, and so I

thought, wow. She's better at this than I am. I I

need to learn from her. So I took your

little, first booklet that you made that you said do not

photocopy this a, and I was just like, oh, this is

so good. You know, more people have to know about this.

So I'm always telling my, best

friend who has 4 children and 14 grandchildren,

and they're having some of those hurt kids are having problems with their

grandchildren. And I say, you gotta call Darlynn. You gotta call

Darlyn. And, I just think

that people mothers don't know there's

a better way. Mhmm. And there's it's nothing to be ashamed about.

It's just like, well, we just didn't we just didn't

know. Yeah. Yeah. And I think

there's a lot of fear that happens for a grandparent a

because, you know, for the most part, traditional

parenting, kids come out okay. Right?

Like, Kevin and Kristen, your children are lovely humans

and successful and all of those things. And

so there's a little bit, I think, for people listening Become they're

wanting their parents to understand

this a, and their parents are like, well, it worked

for you. Look at you. And what I think

about is that a lot of times it works on the outside. Like,

you get good at man at managing your behavior and

traditional parenting. You look it looks good. You know how to work through the

world and succeed and follow the rules and what's

expected of you. And on the inside, though, it can feel

like inauthentic, or you're not no one's

really listening to you. You don't have emotional awareness. You

cut off from parts of yourself. And people

who are attracted to this type of parenting, they want those

results and they want behavior modification

results. Right. Right. So

You know, we get those, a, and they don't

just evaporate. We they they get buried in us.

Yeah. And and they stay with us until we

can deal with them, or will it they come up somehow or

we acknowledge them. And, I think with traditional

parenting, I know in my own kids, I

can see where there's not always

a willingness to be a. And maybe that that

has a connection with that there's an awareness,

not a conscious awareness, but maybe a subconscious awareness that those feelings

are operating below the surface, and they don't want those feelings

to explode or they don't wanna become reactive, and they don't know what to do

with their big feelings Become nobody ever taught a what to do.

I didn't teach Kevin what to do with big feelings. So,

I mean, I've been grateful that he has this opportunity

to to learn this now as an adult. Yeah.

Yeah. We've done a lot together as a couple. Well, I mean, I had to

learn how to do it too. Right? Because I grew up, in a

traditional parenting model except no no fear. It

was, absenteeism, really. Like, we did a

podcast episode a couple weeks ago on the different parenting styles.

And there's like a neglectful parent and they're just

not a. And because of my mom's mental health

issues, she wasn't able to be present for me. And then my

dad was an absentee parent. So I

didn't grow up with anyone emotionally coaching me either.

No one was telling me what to do, nor were they helping me with my

feelings. And so as I heal and then I, you know, this long marriage with

your

son, you know, we talk through all of these things

a, really. And so he's what I like about Kevin

is that he's willing a like you are. I think you put that learner,

like, that value for learning and growth in both of your kids, which

is beautiful. Do you think that comes from

perfectionism a both perfectionists? Yeah. Like, a

there's a way there's there's a better way to do it? I better find out

how to do it. Exactly. Exactly. A,

which in this case, it's working for me in this one area.

Yeah. Well, so, yeah, I think that

that's what's happening for listeners and people that I work with,

moms, is that they are like, well, I don't know what to do with

my rage. I don't know what to do with my sadness. I don't know what

to do with my, overwhelm because the modern society

is so overwhelming. And then there's the perfectionistic

mother example as well as your kids not

only should be well behaved, which is what you grew up your model

was. Right? Everyone should, like, act the part. But now parents feel this

pressure that their kids should act the part, and they should be

emotionally coaching them. And it's like they're

like, well, I suck at both. My kids aren't listening to me nor are they

able to deal with their feelings, and it can feel really, really overwhelming.

So when a parent, like you said, on that staircase where

you were like, woah. This kid's like, you know, I don't have to listen to

you. Going back, you said you took a couple steps back

and, you know, a reset yourself and then figure out, oh, I need to talk

to him better differently, Sawyer. And

that is really what it is like. We're re parenting

in the process of parenting. And it's it's

definitely a labor of love of love. Yes.

Well, I think if, you know, as a mother,

you want your in laws or your parents to understand

this new way of parenting,

really, I'd say a my experience, the best thing to do is just to live

it out in front of them. Mhmm. And they will be so impressed

when they come over to see how you interact with your kids.

Yeah. That they'll want that. A and it'll

really, give them, open their eyes to see that there

is a better way. And it's okay to shift out of the

traditional box of parenting. I know in

the beginning, Doug and I used to talk

about, what you and Kevin were doing as a,

and we go, oh, consequences. You know?

That a just doesn't work that well. I mean, you've got to set

boundaries, and it's like, spare the rod, spoil the

child, you know, all the that those traditional things.

And, but we were at least

wise enough to know that

we were the grandparents, not the parents. And so we

just kept our mouth shut, fortunately.

A fortunately for our relationship, but, yeah,

it's I think that's the hardest thing and it's for the

grandparents to stop a, because it feels like

they need to parent their children to teach them how to a. Because as a

parent, you're always thinking a was my job to teach my kids how to be

and do and live. Exactly. And then they get they have

children and they're also, you know, maybe overwhelmed a they might be

seeking advice. But then if the advice is not

aligned in where their their value their current values are, it

can feel like you know, the grandparent might feel like they're being

disrespected or, you know, a the this parent is

too permissive Become that's what I think people see a

lot is that, oh, they're letting their kids get away with all this stuff. Like,

you don't talk to me like that. I would never ever allow your mother

to talk to me like that or whatever. And Yes. I had those

thoughts. I'm like, never win. Yes. Right?

Like It's like you're too permissive. Yeah. What are you guys doing?

Yes. Right. And that is really I think, really

challenging Become when you come from this traditional

lens, it is very focused on the external.

And so behavior modification, you know, rewards,

bribes, threats, fear, pain, punishment,

disconnection are the tools. A

there are other tools to use, but they're not

as immediate. They don't get

immediate compliance. It's a little bit of a slower,

longer game. Yeah. You're right. It's it's much

easier to parent traditionally because you just

yell, and you just exert your power and control

Become you're the adult and they're the kids. So, you

know, you're the boss. It's that idea. I'm the boss, so you have

to obey me. Mhmm. Mhmm. Don't work.

Well, it works some it works. That's the problem is that it is effective

on the outside, but it erodes the relationship inside.

Their child's relationship with themselves a then the child's relationship

with their parent. And then everybody spends a

lot of time in their twenties, like, repairing and trying trying to get to know

their kid again and, you know, seeing them from a

different side. It's just I I didn't wanna lose. I didn't wanna lose

7 to 10 years of my kids, young adulthood,

a, and young adulthood, and have them be so disconnected

from me that they lost my mentorship

and my voice. And then I lost that front row seat that I

love so much of being able to see them,

you know, become whoever they're supposed to become.

But it it is a it's a longer

game that you're playing. You know? It's like a

short term losses of, like Mhmm. You

know, look, let looks like your kid's getting away with something.

Right. When we're you know, a I'm teaching is always, like, looking for the

patterns. That means you haven't set stronger limits. Maybe you do need to pull in

some consequences here going through connection. What is

driving this behavior? Maybe your child has to, you know, work

through some big feelings, meet the emotional need, all those things.

When you do that, it takes time. And it might look

like the little kid is just, you know, tracking the

boxing and not going to bed. What

what I love about your way of parenting

is that it's so respectful a the person.

Yeah. And that is really communicated when you can

calm yourself and settle down and and listen

and try and maybe even question, like, what the

need is in the moment. And that's that's more

important to you than the behavior itself.

So it sort of trumps that behavior, I think. Mhmm. Yeah.

The feeling first and the behavior second. And permissive parenting is no

behavior. You don't you just never come back to it. Right.

I think I remember one summer when I was

exploring all of these new concepts, a, I

was like, we were at the you had a lake house. And

I remember getting a. And I said, so this summer, I'm trying something new. I'm

not gonna have any consequences. Consequence free,

which I had read in a book. And I

I just can only imagine what that must have been like for you and

Doug. Well, we

were just glad that you were parenting and not us.

Yeah. And I I I think that was, like,

it was very laborious for me to, like, constantly

having all these conversations and redirections. And the model

that I now teach is a delayed consequence model,

which I think was kind of birthed in that summer Become

just meeting their emotional needs did for my for my family and

for my model didn't prove

effective enough for me. But I I just

think to to your credit,

like what you said earlier, like, you just kept your mouth shut or

whatever. And I don't know what

what allowed you to do that Become I I haven't really made this

point is, like, as a grandparent, as a parent, you love

your children. You are worried about them. It's not that you need to

control me or Kevin, or control our children. It's

that you're like, this is what you're doing isn't good. Like, it's not

because you don't understand it. And it's short. It doesn't see you don't see the

results yet. And so the grandparent

feels really scared, I think. Of this. Yeah.

So what helped you

do let us do it? And what helped you not keep your

mouth not say anything? That's a good

question. I'm I'm not sure why we were able to do

that. I think

maybe, like you said, we cared more about the relationship

with you guys than whether or not our

parenting style was better than yours or right or

or whatever. It's like and, also, there was a trust

level. I mean, we trusted you and Kevin to figure it

out, even though, you know, we'd have Doug

and I would have conversations about we thought, no. That that's not gonna

work. But, you know, we were willing to let

you, try it and either

succeed or fail.

I think we were just blessed that we were able to do that.

I can't really credit with anything in particular.

Yeah. I was thinking about trust is so huge. Right? And the relationship

that's those are 2 huge factors. Right? I'm my this

my relationship with my daughter-in-law, my relationship with my son

or right vice versa is more important than

me, like, winning an argument or proving a point or

something like that. And then trusting.

Yeah. Just like, well, they're smart kids, and they're figuring

it a, and a they're present and, yeah, you know, like,

looking for evidence of, like, I can trust them. Yes.

Yeah. And then I think the conversations that that

would be something I would recommend to moms listening who are

in this conflict with their parent or or in laws

is that to have conversations. Like, when I

showed up that summer, I'm like, I read this book. It's like it a to

a free model. We're gonna do this, like, regulation tent thing

where, you know, Lincoln can go in and regroup. I'm gonna just put him in

there. He's a. I give you all this language.

And having that conversation so you knew

what was going on and there was intention behind it, I would imagine that would

be helpful. Yes. I think that's really good advice.

It was a. And I've always been grateful that you're such

a verbal person and it it just,

amazes me how important having those kinds

of interactions, conversations are. Yeah.

And, I know that's probably not everybody's giftedness,

but I know that as a person, I'm not extremely

verbal, but I can learn from you when you model that for

me. So you're modeling that for all

these, mama, and you have this

support group together. You you you know, you can interact on these

topics, and I think it's just wonderful. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think that's why I like to say the language, like, hey, parents

you know, my parents or my in laws.

Second. It might look like I'm being permissive, and I'm not.

I'm delaying consequences. Those are wonderful

statements to make to a a grandmother

or grandfather Become it just dials

them down because you're dealing with

their emotions and their fear. This is at the same time that

you're parenting your your kids. You're reparenting

the grandparents. Yes. Because they're really not connected to

their emotions a and didn't have a stop at all. Yeah.

Yeah. Not not as a, but, you know, love is

a is a powerful thing. And I think as long as,

you can keep loving, whether, you know, it's loving the

grandparents or loving the kids, it's like it's it's gonna work

because you're caring more about the relationship

than you are how it's a. And that

always communicates. Even if you're not, especially,

a person, I think it just it

communicates if if you're you're bringing this love from the

inside out. It's it's felt. It's a.

Yeah. And the benefit of the doubt for the grandparent. Right? Like, I

know you love me. I know you love my kids. I know you

want what's best for us, and

I'm taking everything you're suggesting in love. And I'm

switching gears a bit, and it's gonna look weird. Yeah.

It's like a really validating. Like, we are all together. We

have love and mutual respect here.

Mhmm. So good. Yeah. Well, I just wanna

say thank you for all your support that

you have given to Kevin and I for the last

20 years raising these kids. We you know,

I I did all this new parenting and learning and all these things, but

you were a big soundboard for me, and you were willing to listen and

listen to my cockamamie ideas sometimes and,

ask probing questions, but never, like, from a

place of skepticism, just curiosity. A,

yeah, I I'm very lucky. I'm one of the few daughter in

laws whose mother-in-law, like, really respects

them and trust them. And I I know that that's rare,

and I'm just really grateful to you. Well, thank you, Darlynn. I know you've

also been very patient with us. Well well, we made

the switch. Yeah. It's a journey, right, for all of

us. It is a a. Parenting is Good to be in

it with you. Yeah. Same. Well, thank you. Well, thanks for being on the

pod. This is so good. Yeah. Alright, everyone.

I will talk to you next week, and, have a great week. This week, your

a, I like to give everyone, like, an, little tip what to do. I I

would say if you're having trouble with your parents or your in laws

to relisten to this podcast episode, write down those a, and then just say the

sentences aloud to them or send an email. It can be an email.

If they're, you know, over 70, they'll read in their emails. So, you know,

you just send them send them an email.

Alright, mamas. Have a great week, and I will talk to you next

time.