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We've got a controversial topic today, and that is, well, Heath,
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fill us in on what the controversial topic is.
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Well, I've recently gone back into the Instagram world, and over the last few days,
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our erstwhile companion and team member, Adam McAtee, what is he,
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evidence-based Pilates,
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caused something of a rupture in the matrix by calling out a large-scale education provider.
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Oh, Bassie. The remaining name is Bassie.
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Yep. But the Body Arts and Science, who put a post up.
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To be fair, or to be clear, it was a post from their equipment manufacturing
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page as opposed to their education page.
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And they... made some comments, which the posts now have been taken down together,
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but they were talking about the importance of little muscles having their time
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in the sun and that Pilates was great for, um,
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Pilates was powerful because it allowed little muscles to be developed and big
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muscles to be downregulated.
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Well, yeah, sorry to interrupt. I've got the post here in front of me.
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It hasn't been taken down.
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Um, so yeah, look, I'm going to read it out. It's a little bit on the lengthy
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side, but bear with me, dear listener, because then we'll all have the context.
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So this is from Adam McAtee Pilates. God bless Adam.
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A lot of claims in the Pilates, and I'm just reading verbatim from Adam's post
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now, a lot of claims in the Pilates space sound scientific, but there's a reason
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many of them don't include citations.
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The evidence simply isn't there. And when education is built on shaky explanations,
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it doesn't just confuse instructors, it affects how clients move, train, and trust us.
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Take the idea of, quote, tiny stabilizers. They don't exist.
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The human body has larger and smaller muscles, and they can act as movers or
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stabilizers depending on the task.
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Smaller muscles often move joints directly, like the infraspinatus during shoulder rotation.
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Larger muscles can act as stabilizers too, like the quadriceps helping control
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the patella during knee extension.
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Small muscles aren't being ignored or shut off during movement.
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What usually happens is this. During bigger, dynamic exercises,
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we feel the effort of larger muscles more.
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That sensory feedback tells our brain this is working, but feeling something
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more doesn't mean the other muscles are inactive.
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For example, during push-ups, it's common to feel fatigue in the chest,
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shoulders, or triceps. It's rare to feel burning near the back of the shoulder
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blade where the infraspinatus sits.
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Yet research shows the infraspinatus is working hard during push-ups,
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and it works even more as load increases.
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It does not turn off. It ramps up, and it gives a PMID, which is a PubMed.
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That's an academic database ID, so basically he's giving a citation there.
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Back to the post. This is why real science matters.
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Science keeps us honest, it keeps us accountable, and it requires us to update
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our beliefs when new research emerges.
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That means changing explanations, refining cues, and sometimes updating manuals.
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Unfortunately, many Pilates education companies don't do this.
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It's easier not to, but easier doesn't mean better.
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You deserve education that respects your intelligence. Your clients deserve
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teaching ground in reality, not myths.
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At Evidence-Based Pilates, we constantly update our content and we're not going to do this.
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To reflect current research and show you exactly how to apply it to Pilates.
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Right, so that's the copy.
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And so here's the carousel. Basically, he says, Pilates instructors deserve
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better education than this.
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And he basically shares a BASI post, which basically the BASI post says,
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Fun Friday fracked, your large muscles love to take over.
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Pilates uses instability to quiet them, forcing the tiny, often neglected stabilizers
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to do the work. This is how we fix imbalances.
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And then Adam says Bassey claims that Pilates targets
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smaller muscles by quieting larger muscles to correct muscle imbalances
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this is not true they provide zero data if they did it would look something
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like this for starters tiny stabilizers don't exist the body has both larger
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and smaller muscles they can act as prime movers or stabilizers depending on
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the demands of a specific movement and smaller muscles are not neglected here's what the data shows,
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this paper and he provides a citation reviewed shoulder muscle activity during
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common rehabilitation exercises.
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Oh, that's the one we looked at in the diploma by Escamilla et al.
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They found that both small and large muscles work during all exercises.
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When you add more load, they all work more.
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Unlike Bassi's claim, the data shows that big muscles don't take over and,
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quote, shut off the smaller ones.
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Smaller muscles increase activity when load increases.
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For example, as you progressively load a standard push-up, the rotator cuff
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increases in activity. just like the pectoralis major and anterior deltoid.
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This isn't just true for the shoulder. This other paper, and he provides another
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citation, found that deep hip rotators are active during squats.
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This is why companies like BASI don't provide citations when making these claims,
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because they don't exist.
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Real science matters. It keeps you accountable to support the narratives you
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spread, and it's the ethical thing to do.
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Okay, that's Adam's post. So now you have the context, dear listener.
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And so, yeah, what's going through your mind about that, Heath?
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Well, I was,
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I guess it was timely for me because having gone back into the Instagram universe,
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I was just, my head was spinning with the amount of horse shit that I was saying.
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I mean, I say that slightly tongue-in-cheek because everyone's coming at it
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with the best of intentions and I'm aware of that,
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but just the amount of posts that are associated with things that are not supported,
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But, you know, just this stuff about little muscles and stability and pelvic stability.
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I just, you know, it's just that same thing again. It's like,
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oh, we haven't moved on. He's still now in 1998.
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Yeah. So I was refreshed to see, it was refreshing to see Adam calling that
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out and people getting involved and people not being afraid to say,
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yeah, bummer, you know, trained there.
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Just a pity they haven't moved on you know good people old
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information which i think that's i think that's my
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kind of take it's like so much of what i see is like good people with the best
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of intentions just function operating on old information yeah it's it's intriguing
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to me you know i used to find it kind
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of like frustrating and you know infuriating i guess the the amount of,
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bs in the pilates world and you know dear listener it's not exclusive to pilates
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world i mean there's It's the same in personal training, fitness,
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even exercise physiology and physiotherapy.
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I forget it. Don't even talk to me about yoga, you know.
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But it doesn't – I just find it more kind of interesting now.
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I mean, there's a very large amount of misinformation.
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And I have to just think that I think most people in the fitness and Pilates
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world, and in the Pilates world, I think in particular, just don't have the.
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I guess the mental map, the epistemology of like how you learn stuff,
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of to know like how to judge good quality, you know, what's true and what's
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not, you know, in the realm of exercise science.
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And, you know, so I think a lot of people I think can be forgiven for that,
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but not educators. I think once you put yourself out there as an educator,
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I think it's like if you're a doctor and you don't know how to wash your hands
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properly, it's like, that's on you, dude. Like, you know.
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Yes. Yeah. So, you know, I think good on Adam for speaking the truth.
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What's, you know, I guess what are your, I've always had kind of mixed feelings
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about directly calling people out like that.
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Like on one hand, I feel like it's really, if someone has to do it,
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right? I mean, if someone's just saying something, it's just plain fucking bullshit, right?
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And they've got it, like, that needs to be corrected.
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And then on the other hand, it's like, well, it doesn't actually do anything,
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and all it does is cause ill will, you know?
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So, yeah, so like, where do you sit on that?
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Uh, well, I'm, I'm, I'm a fairly non-confrontational person by nature.
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So, um, and I also assume best, I'd like to think I assume best.
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It's funny considering you're a bouncer for all those years.
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Yeah, yeah. Maybe that's why I was able to do it. Um,
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and I, it's, again, I, you know, props to Adam. I think he does a good job of it.
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I think when he does do it, he does it in a, an even, even handed way.
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And he presents an evidence-based position.
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You know, he doesn't slander people.
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He's not acrimonious about it. No, he attacked the argument, not the people.
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But, I mean, it's... It's not the person. And it's... What he said is,
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I mean, what Adam said is pretty much incontrovertible. You know, like...
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You know, the post from Bassey was 100% misaligned with... You know,
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it wasn't just a little bit wrong. It was like...
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180 degrees rock, you know, on the exercise science.
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The thing, one of the things that it made me think about, slightly off your
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question, is, you know, we ran the diploma for a long time, and the further
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along we went, the more evidence-based it became.
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And I don't mean that we weren't evidence-based at the beginning, but the more,
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in fact, really, when we went online,
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you started to build lectures that
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were directly referencing the evidence on a topic it wasn't sort of squeezed
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in around repertoire like it was when we were doing all the the apparatus stuff
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and you know what we saw was that.
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Your, when I say your, I mean RAF, your appetite and propensity for working
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your way through research, which in order to do that, you've got to work your
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way through Google Scholar.
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Some students really took to it, but a lot of students just,
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you know, one reason or another didn't take on that skill. And frankly,
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I'm, you know, I don't read science for relaxation quite the way you do.
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And a huge part of how we've worked well together is that you,
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you have that appetite and skill.
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And I've been able to apply that in my teaching where I'm busily running a studio
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and there's been a kind of virtuous loop there. Well, I mean,
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I don't, I don't teach high bridge for fun, you know, the way you do.
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Yeah, right. We've got a complimentary. So part of why we make a great team. um.
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And yeah, so where I was going with that was that the thought I'd had is when
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the little muscle, big muscle thing is a really compelling story.
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Just like the disc bulge popping out the side on your plastic skeleton is a compelling narrative.
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And so it's a sticky narrative.
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And I've just quite literally just finished filming the last video for our new
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version of our certification. and that video was things that people say in Pilates land.
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And it was, you know, addressing the fact that there are things that people
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will say that we don't teach. Yeah, yeah.
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And what I was thinking on this thing was that, you know, the narratives are
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sticky and often the evidence is not.
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And so I suppose the one thing I thought was,
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you know, So what we can do well as educators is put evidence into a narrative
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that sticks because what we've seen is that, as an example,
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so the osteoarthritis story,
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inverted commas, that you told in the lecture about the sponge in the water.
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That's a sticky narrative and you tell that to instructors
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it sticks and they tell their clients and it sticks and it
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helps to replace bone on bone you know because
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bone on bone is a sticky narrative so i guess
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what i was sort of ruminating on is that one of the
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things that we can do well as educators is
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one use good information and
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then find good sticky ways of of of
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sharing that with people and i guess i suppose i
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feel like i'd love to see more of that in in you you
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asked me what i think about calling out and i think
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you know i don't know how you do that when you're calling someone out but at
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least in terms of education making things work for people's learning is maybe
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the long what's it's the long cycle version of calling out the stickier we can make good information,
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that the long tail result would be people don't get caught up in these narratives
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around small muscles, big muscles.
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Disbulges popping out on skin, bone on bone and all of that.
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They were my thoughts about it. I think, you know, for a company like Bassie,
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and I don't know thing number one about Bassie. I've only seen their public stuff.
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I've never met Rayel or talked to him or been involved in that in any way.
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But, you know, I can only imagine that,
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you know, when you've created a whole brand and certified probably tens of thousands
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of instructors and taught seminars and workshops and whatever,
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for decades, you know, founded in these concepts of, you know,
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small stabilizer muscles and using instability to correct imbalances.
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And all of these other essentially made-up dysfunctions that aren't real things.
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It's really hard to suddenly change. You know, like it's hard on a logistical
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level because you've got tens of thousands of copies of your printed manual,
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your DVDs, your course materials.
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Like, I mean, we've just finished updating our Pilates set, right?
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You just didn't film the last video today.
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That's a, how long did it take?
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Like how many hours do you think it took collectively for our team to rebuild
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that program with new content?
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Hundreds hundreds right yeah and
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and we've got an organization
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organized around doing that right right we've got a small team that is you know
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agile and you know and a content 100 digital and we all work you know essentially
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um so we don't have like you know 2 000 certified trainers around the world
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in different time zones speaking different languages,
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not connecting on the internet just using paper materials whatever
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so just logistically very very hard to
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turn the ship when you've got you know that volume of stuff out there but also
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just like from a brand perspective if your whole brand is built on you know
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you must stabilize um and correct muscle imbalances and all of that and then
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at some point 25 years in you're like i actually sorry that.
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Wasn't really a thing and we're not going to do it anymore.
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It's like, it's really hard to switch your position.
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So, you know, I mean, I can see how the incentive, you know,
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like they're not incentivized to actually, you know, to change.
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Like what's the benefit of them changing? It's like, great, now they get to
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spend, you know, a million dollars on rebuilding their entire curriculum from
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the ground up, and they have to go to everybody they've trained and say, we trained you wrong.
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I mean, I guess the good thing would be they could then say,
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and now you have to retrain in the new way, you know, and do our new course,
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because you're all by the time.
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Yeah, here's our updated course at a discounted rate. You can all retrain. Yeah.
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Well, there you go. We just solved world peace.
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We just pass it on to them. I'm going to suggest that in the thread in Adam's post.
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Um yeah but i think for educators it's really difficult and i think the thing
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that has that we've been that has really enabled us to continue to update without it being a problem,
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is and turning it into a feature not a bug really has been that we took the
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position that we don't have a position that our position is based on whatever
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best evidence is and we just do that And so when that changes,
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we just do whatever the next, you know, what the current guidelines say.
00:17:47.101 --> 00:17:52.581
So that's like, it's no big deal whatsoever from a cultural perspective when we change.
00:17:52.841 --> 00:17:55.761
Although there was a little bit of a cultural change when we changed their motor
00:17:55.761 --> 00:18:00.121
queuing, you know, external queuing thing a year or two back.
00:18:01.221 --> 00:18:04.701
But, you know, it was pretty low, low amount of hassle, really.
00:18:08.041 --> 00:18:12.081
Yeah, I don't know. Like I haven't read the comments on that,
00:18:12.181 --> 00:18:15.741
that post, like what, what were the, did you read through the threads?
00:18:17.401 --> 00:18:24.921
Uh, I stopped after a couple of days, but yeah, um, was, um, um, um, um, um, um, um,
00:18:27.443 --> 00:18:31.403
Yeah, there wasn't a lot of back and forth. It was mainly, what I read was mostly
00:18:31.403 --> 00:18:33.723
in support of Adam, Adam's response.
00:18:34.063 --> 00:18:39.663
And I don't remember reading much in support of the position.
00:18:39.663 --> 00:18:44.203
And I think that probably reflects the fact that it wasn't the education page,
00:18:44.203 --> 00:18:47.383
it was the equipment's page.
00:18:49.283 --> 00:18:54.223
Maybe. I mean, that's just what I, that was my assumption. um well it's funny
00:18:54.223 --> 00:19:00.883
because he i think he tagged um bassy in the post oh yeah,
00:19:02.063 --> 00:19:06.703
um i mean i but having said that i completely agree with what you said earlier that,
00:19:07.683 --> 00:19:13.503
you know as an educator and or a company a company associated with the educator
00:19:13.503 --> 00:19:18.183
it's you know behooves us to do better yeah.
00:19:23.456 --> 00:19:25.276
Yeah, it's interesting.
00:19:27.496 --> 00:19:31.976
So, yeah, I guess, I mean, I don't know, like, you know, every now and then
00:19:31.976 --> 00:19:34.816
I sort of feel like, yeah, maybe I should sort of call out some of the bullshit,
00:19:34.976 --> 00:19:42.836
but then, like, there's actually a few people I follow because they post that kind of stuff,
00:19:43.076 --> 00:19:45.156
like the stuff that is not true.
00:19:46.656 --> 00:19:51.976
And it's kind of like wobbling a loose tooth or something, you know, or scratching a scab.
00:19:52.716 --> 00:19:58.216
When I watch it. And I sometimes use it for inspiration for these episodes that
00:19:58.216 --> 00:20:02.936
I'm like, okay, I'm never going to mention that person, but we're going to talk
00:20:02.936 --> 00:20:04.816
about this and here's how it works.
00:20:04.976 --> 00:20:07.376
And yeah, that's not what I saw in the post.
00:20:08.536 --> 00:20:11.816
But every now and then, like once every couple of years, I think,
00:20:11.916 --> 00:20:15.616
I just can't let this one go. It's just total crap.
00:20:16.316 --> 00:20:20.976
But it hasn't been enough to tip you over the edge to become like,
00:20:21.416 --> 00:20:24.336
bless his soul, Pa O'Dwyer.
00:20:25.096 --> 00:20:28.876
Pa O'Dwyer, yeah, no. I don't think the Pilates world's ready for Pa O'Dwyer.
00:20:30.056 --> 00:20:33.856
Did you hear he passed away? Sad day. It was a sad day. I followed him.
00:20:34.216 --> 00:20:37.516
He was a funny guy. Yeah. Yeah.
00:20:39.552 --> 00:20:47.132
Yeah, I think, I don't know, Heath, like, you know, in my more optimistic moments, I feel like,
00:20:47.392 --> 00:20:50.212
well, it's just inevitable, you know, in a thousand years, we're not still going
00:20:50.212 --> 00:20:53.212
to be saying small muscles, you know, stabilize and balance,
00:20:53.372 --> 00:20:56.532
you know, it's like at some point it's going to change, you know,
00:20:56.572 --> 00:20:57.412
the narrative's going to change.
00:20:57.712 --> 00:20:59.912
So it's just a matter of like, what do they say?
00:21:01.172 --> 00:21:04.992
Science proceeds, you know, one death at a time. And that's basically,
00:21:05.172 --> 00:21:08.432
I'm just paraphrasing there, but basically it's like, as the old,
00:21:10.032 --> 00:21:15.712
guard of academics, you know, retire and die, and the new generation come in,
00:21:15.912 --> 00:21:18.292
that's how the beliefs change.
00:21:18.432 --> 00:21:21.992
Like, you don't actually change people's minds, you just wait till they retire.
00:21:22.912 --> 00:21:26.532
Till the old minds die. Yeah. So, you know, maybe that's it.
00:21:26.632 --> 00:21:30.552
And it's like, okay, we've got to measure progress in decades, not weeks, you know.
00:21:30.752 --> 00:21:33.492
Oh, great, I put out a post. Why are people still saying this bullshit?
00:21:33.672 --> 00:21:34.952
You know, I posted about this last week.
00:21:38.332 --> 00:21:51.372
Well I mean while we're on the topic I think I'd love to think and chew a little bit on why,
00:21:53.572 --> 00:22:01.092
in this particular topic is compelling it's fascinating for instructors and,
00:22:04.389 --> 00:22:07.429
It's something that I find we have to explain a lot.
00:22:07.729 --> 00:22:13.169
So, you know, let's use some of our time to sort of think.
00:22:13.269 --> 00:22:16.169
So Adams explained it really nicely, and he referred to the paper,
00:22:16.269 --> 00:22:22.789
which explained it really clearly, that the muscles all work more according to load.
00:22:23.409 --> 00:22:30.529
And then where I think a lot of instructors have questions and need to think
00:22:30.529 --> 00:22:37.509
on is the nuance that you can work an individual muscle more by lining,
00:22:37.729 --> 00:22:41.349
you know, lining the bones up against the load in a particular way.
00:22:42.909 --> 00:22:46.809
Or you can work, so you can work the entire rotator cuff and the pecs,
00:22:46.929 --> 00:22:53.049
et cetera, to push up and all of the muscles contraction increases as the load
00:22:53.049 --> 00:22:57.629
increases and the load is distributed through that team of muscles.
00:22:58.289 --> 00:23:05.769
And if, if, if all else remains the same at the same distribution and you can do a movement that.
00:23:07.801 --> 00:23:14.721
Roughly isolates infraspinatus or subscapularis or anterior fibers of deltoid.
00:23:14.801 --> 00:23:18.561
Like you can pick on muscles or sections of muscles.
00:23:19.081 --> 00:23:22.301
So those two things are true at the same time.
00:23:23.141 --> 00:23:26.401
I would say, I don't 100% agree with that.
00:23:26.861 --> 00:23:31.841
I would say that you can't ever really isolate a muscle.
00:23:32.321 --> 00:23:37.641
You can, like if you do so. Right, so you're not shutting everything else down.
00:23:37.641 --> 00:23:41.641
No, no, it's not possible to isolate a muscle. You know, I can say that like unequivocally.
00:23:42.441 --> 00:23:44.561
I don't think that's at all controversial in exercise science.
00:23:44.721 --> 00:23:47.461
You know, everyone would be like, yeah, do. Like, of course you can isolate a muscle.
00:23:48.061 --> 00:23:53.241
You can put a muscle in a, you can put the body in a, you know,
00:23:53.301 --> 00:23:56.861
an alignment and create a movement, you know, with a resistance on a particular
00:23:56.861 --> 00:24:01.501
angle that will preferentially load that muscle.
00:24:01.661 --> 00:24:05.321
You know, so that muscle will have more load than if you turned the arm a slightly different way.
00:24:06.361 --> 00:24:09.841
And you can turn a muscle from a stabilizer into a mobilizer,
00:24:09.921 --> 00:24:10.901
depending on the action.
00:24:11.001 --> 00:24:18.281
So for example, if we think about, say, the anterior deltoid and the infraspinatus,
00:24:18.661 --> 00:24:20.761
you know, so the anterior deltoid's in the front of the shoulder,
00:24:20.821 --> 00:24:23.821
it's one of the big front shoulder muscles if you do like a push-up or something,
00:24:23.901 --> 00:24:25.821
it's one of the major prime movers in that movement.
00:24:27.001 --> 00:24:30.521
Whereas the infraspinatus, which is on your scapula, which is one of the four
00:24:30.521 --> 00:24:36.841
rotator cuff muscles, when you do a push-up, the deltoid is the prime mover
00:24:36.841 --> 00:24:39.021
and the infraspinatus is the stabilizer.
00:24:39.441 --> 00:24:46.021
And what that means is the deltoid bends, you know, changes the angle of the
00:24:46.021 --> 00:24:48.581
joint. It flexes the shoulder, right?
00:24:48.761 --> 00:24:55.361
And in doing that, it actually creates a force vector that essentially pulls
00:24:55.361 --> 00:24:57.401
the arm bone out of the shoulder socket.
00:24:59.339 --> 00:25:02.559
And so in order to keep the arm bone in the shoulder socket,
00:25:02.799 --> 00:25:08.939
you use the infraspinatus and the other rotator cuff to suck it back into the shoulder socket.
00:25:09.079 --> 00:25:13.079
So the harder you activate your deltoid, the more it tries to pull the arm bone
00:25:13.079 --> 00:25:16.959
out of the socket, and therefore the more you have to activate your rotator
00:25:16.959 --> 00:25:21.299
cuff, including your infraspinatus, in order to not have your shoulder dislocate
00:25:21.299 --> 00:25:22.799
every time you do a push-up.
00:25:23.439 --> 00:25:30.239
So anything that trains the deltoid also trains the infraspinatus commensurately.
00:25:30.319 --> 00:25:33.079
And the more you load the deltoid, the more it pulls the arm bone,
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:35.039
so the more the infraspinatus has to compensate, right?
00:25:35.279 --> 00:25:38.539
But in that role, the infraspinatus is a stabilizer and the deltoid is a mobilizer.
00:25:44.099 --> 00:25:52.259
And when we switch to something like a rotation, like a typical rotator cuff
00:25:52.259 --> 00:25:55.999
move, like with a flex band where you're doing external rotations of the shoulder,
00:25:56.699 --> 00:25:57.879
well, then the infraspinatus,
00:25:59.739 --> 00:26:06.299
along with the teres minor, becomes the mobilizer, the prime remover,
00:26:06.479 --> 00:26:08.179
and the deltoid becomes a stabilizer.
00:26:08.319 --> 00:26:11.679
So the infraspinatus wants to pull the arm bone out of the socket,
00:26:11.859 --> 00:26:13.919
and now the deltoid has to stabilize and prevent that happening.
00:26:14.099 --> 00:26:18.119
So both, and then the harder you work the rotator cuff, the more you're going
00:26:18.119 --> 00:26:20.439
to work the deltoid to stabilize. But here's the thing.
00:26:20.759 --> 00:26:25.379
The deltoid is like, you know, six times the size of the infraspinatus,
00:26:25.559 --> 00:26:29.419
right? So if your infraspinatus is working in your like shoulder external rotation,
00:26:30.119 --> 00:26:34.759
okay, the amount of force that it produces relative to how big the deltoid is, is pretty small.
00:26:35.419 --> 00:26:39.139
Right? So it's going to, you know, imagine like a, you know,
00:26:39.279 --> 00:26:43.619
tiny kitten trying to, you know, rip your shoulder out of its socket and a huge
00:26:43.619 --> 00:26:46.039
polar bear trying to keep it in there. It's like, okay, the polar bear's not
00:26:46.039 --> 00:26:46.959
going to be working that hard.
00:26:47.319 --> 00:26:50.519
Okay. But if the polar bear's trying to rip it out and the kitten's trying to
00:26:50.519 --> 00:26:52.579
keep it in, well, the kitten's going to be working really freaking hard.
00:26:54.039 --> 00:26:58.519
So I would say that in a push-up, it's a great deltoid exercise.
00:26:58.519 --> 00:27:00.919
It's also a great infraspinatus exercise.
00:27:01.459 --> 00:27:05.519
Whereas in a shoulder external rotation, it's a great infraspinatus exercise,
00:27:05.859 --> 00:27:07.379
pretty lame deltoid exercise. Okay.
00:27:09.575 --> 00:27:15.535
And just catch that, Raph, because what you did there is you used the terms
00:27:15.535 --> 00:27:18.975
stabilizers and mobilizer or stabilizer and prime mover.
00:27:20.595 --> 00:27:25.355
And, you know, dear listener, that's an important thing to understand,
00:27:25.695 --> 00:27:28.075
I think, and Raph could probably say it more clearly than I am,
00:27:28.515 --> 00:27:35.675
is making a movement wobbly and then trying to not wobble, which is what so
00:27:35.675 --> 00:27:38.775
much of what we talk about in terms of stability in Pilates,
00:27:38.775 --> 00:27:40.915
is not what Raph is talking about.
00:27:41.135 --> 00:27:46.255
The stabilizer in this instance is creating an equal and opposite force in a
00:27:46.255 --> 00:27:49.315
movement that's being driven by another muscle.
00:27:49.435 --> 00:27:52.755
So the stabilizer is not the thing that stops you wobbly.
00:27:52.915 --> 00:27:59.255
The stabilizer is the thing that creates structural stability at the joint while you create force.
00:27:59.435 --> 00:28:04.255
And what a great and important key distinction there because we use the word
00:28:04.255 --> 00:28:08.675
stability and we think instability as in being on something wobbly, like a BOSU.
00:28:08.775 --> 00:28:11.615
Something is the opposite of stability and therefore you must
00:28:11.615 --> 00:28:15.375
use more stable stabilizing muscles it's it's not true uh
00:28:15.375 --> 00:28:18.235
and so you know when you are when when
00:28:18.235 --> 00:28:21.175
i use the term stabilizer muscle in the context of a push-up
00:28:21.175 --> 00:28:24.975
i mean what i said like literally preventing the
00:28:24.975 --> 00:28:29.835
humeral head the top of the arm bone from shearing out of the shoulder socket
00:28:29.835 --> 00:28:33.355
the glenoid fossa right so that's that's what i mean by stabilize when i say
00:28:33.355 --> 00:28:38.395
that you know the infraspinatus is a stabilizer in that movement and that is
00:28:38.395 --> 00:28:42.655
you know the biomechanical you know agreed meaning of what a stable what it
00:28:42.655 --> 00:28:44.355
means to stabilize a joint.
00:28:46.340 --> 00:28:50.340
If you have a frank instability of a joint, that means the joint dislocates
00:28:50.340 --> 00:28:54.320
easily. You know, someone who has repeated shoulder dislocations is said to be frankly unstable.
00:28:55.440 --> 00:29:00.280
But when we talk, we use the same word, stability, but we use it in reference
00:29:00.280 --> 00:29:03.880
to like, okay, doing a push-up with your hands on a BOSU, say,
00:29:05.080 --> 00:29:10.460
then the way we stabilize, so when your hands are on a BOSU,
00:29:10.580 --> 00:29:13.500
it does increase the amount of muscle activity that's.
00:29:14.724 --> 00:29:21.404
That you require, but it doesn't somehow magically target some set of stabilizer muscles.
00:29:21.664 --> 00:29:25.764
Because as we just saw in that example of a push-up versus a rotator cuff external
00:29:25.764 --> 00:29:33.144
rotation, different muscles become the prime mover or the stabilizer depending on the movement.
00:29:33.564 --> 00:29:37.124
You know, in a push-up, the deltoid's the prime mover, the rotator cuff is a stabilizer.
00:29:37.364 --> 00:29:41.024
In an external rotation movement, the rotator cuff's the prime mover,
00:29:41.104 --> 00:29:44.984
the deltoid's a stabilizer. So there's no such thing as a, quote, stabilizer muscle.
00:29:45.284 --> 00:29:48.984
There's just like muscles that stabilize in particular movements,
00:29:49.084 --> 00:29:51.704
and they're prime movers in other particular movements.
00:29:51.884 --> 00:29:54.204
And it's just they do whatever role is required.
00:29:54.884 --> 00:29:59.924
And so when you have your hands on a BOSU and you're trying to stabilize whilst
00:29:59.924 --> 00:30:05.424
you do your push-up, all you do is you require all of your muscles to be stabilizer
00:30:05.424 --> 00:30:08.444
muscles because every joint in that chain, you know, the wrist,
00:30:08.564 --> 00:30:09.444
the elbow, the shoulder,
00:30:09.924 --> 00:30:14.764
the scapular thoracic joint, they're all less stable, right?
00:30:14.904 --> 00:30:18.044
So what do you do there is you have to co-contract.
00:30:18.384 --> 00:30:21.804
You contract your biceps and your triceps around the elbow.
00:30:21.984 --> 00:30:27.704
You contract your anterior deltoids and your posterior deltoids and your triceps
00:30:27.704 --> 00:30:31.124
and your cricobrachialis and your pec minor and your pec major,
00:30:31.604 --> 00:30:34.264
et cetera, et cetera, around the scapula.
00:30:34.324 --> 00:30:38.064
So basically, you're contracting everything more. it's
00:30:38.064 --> 00:30:41.244
not selectively targeting somehow like
00:30:41.244 --> 00:30:45.564
the small muscles and this is like you know if if you went into an exercise
00:30:45.564 --> 00:30:52.364
science lab and told them this they'd be like yeah and like so it's like of
00:30:52.364 --> 00:30:57.604
course you know this is completely and utterly uncontroversial right when you
00:30:57.604 --> 00:31:00.764
are on an unstable surface.
00:31:02.311 --> 00:31:06.071
You know, think about it. You stand on a BOSU, what happens to your leg muscles?
00:31:06.291 --> 00:31:09.791
Like, you co-contract your quads and your hamstrings and your calves and your
00:31:09.791 --> 00:31:12.231
hip flexors and your reductors and you, like, everything's working harder,
00:31:12.471 --> 00:31:14.671
right? Everything's working harder.
00:31:16.171 --> 00:31:19.791
You're not magically just targeting something like your popliteus or something
00:31:19.791 --> 00:31:23.391
behind your knee, but, you know, or your VMO or something.
00:31:23.511 --> 00:31:26.311
It's like, it's just, that's what stabilizing is, is you brace,
00:31:26.411 --> 00:31:27.551
you co-contract, right?
00:31:27.711 --> 00:31:31.171
Because on a BOSU, whether it's your arms or your legs, you're more likely to
00:31:31.171 --> 00:31:34.471
move, right? It's like there's more wobble, right? It's harder to stay still.
00:31:34.991 --> 00:31:38.171
And so how do you make yourself stay still? Well, you co-contract.
00:31:38.371 --> 00:31:42.131
Like think about a plank, right? That's what a plank is. You co-contract.
00:31:42.831 --> 00:31:45.411
So it's like, well, the more unstable it is, the more you have to co-contract.
00:31:45.831 --> 00:31:49.091
And so that's just, and if you want to stabilize, if you're like,
00:31:49.171 --> 00:31:51.491
imagine you're on a BOSU and someone's like walks past and pushes,
00:31:51.731 --> 00:31:55.411
you know, the BOSU, wobbles, it's like, is your infraspinatus going to stop?
00:31:55.551 --> 00:31:58.771
No, you have to massively contract your triceps and your delts and your pecs
00:31:58.771 --> 00:32:01.571
and your lats and all of that in order to stay on the BOSU, right?
00:32:01.571 --> 00:32:04.091
It's like, it's heavy work.
00:32:04.551 --> 00:32:08.631
And so the more unstable it is, the more you're going to activate your big muscles.
00:32:09.491 --> 00:32:11.591
And then the more you activate your big muscles, the more you're going to activate
00:32:11.591 --> 00:32:14.391
your small muscles. So all the muscles are going to work. Oh my God.
00:32:14.951 --> 00:32:16.831
All right. See what you did? You got me on a soapbox.
00:32:20.801 --> 00:32:21.901
Yeah, that's what I was trying to do.
00:32:27.041 --> 00:32:32.761
So anyway, where does that leave us? There's no such thing as like small stabilizer muscles.
00:32:33.041 --> 00:32:36.121
There are big muscles and small muscles. There are muscles that stabilize in
00:32:36.121 --> 00:32:39.621
a given movement, but it's not always the small muscles.
00:32:39.841 --> 00:32:43.661
And anyway, you can't target the small muscles and there's no point in targeting
00:32:43.661 --> 00:32:45.581
small muscles. I mean, oh my God.
00:32:46.081 --> 00:32:49.801
Just like, think about it, people. Think about it, Bassey.
00:32:50.541 --> 00:32:58.481
Like, if the job of the small muscles is to stabilize when the big muscles work,
00:32:59.401 --> 00:33:02.561
well, wouldn't the small muscles work when the big muscles work?
00:33:04.141 --> 00:33:08.721
Like, so then wouldn't working the big muscles also work the small muscles?
00:33:08.821 --> 00:33:12.641
I mean, it's like, I can't see how that's not obvious.
00:33:16.281 --> 00:33:19.421
Well that that brings me back i guess to you know
00:33:19.421 --> 00:33:22.121
that's the curse of your knowledge and i feel like that's the
00:33:22.121 --> 00:33:31.081
thing that when we do a good job of educating on this stuff we are we we we
00:33:31.081 --> 00:33:37.621
provide accurate and alternative metaphors is often the case i mean doxy like
00:33:37.621 --> 00:33:41.661
the story that you tell rather than the information, is what sticks.
00:33:42.181 --> 00:33:45.821
I can't remember who said it, or some YouTube thing, someone probably famous,
00:33:45.941 --> 00:33:50.561
and I don't know who, but the thing was that humans are problem-solving storytelling
00:33:50.561 --> 00:33:54.941
monkeys, and I just think, I just love that.
00:33:55.261 --> 00:34:01.101
When something's got a story, it sticks more. So something can be true and.
00:34:03.283 --> 00:34:08.163
Uncompelling as a narrative and not stick as well as something that's untrue
00:34:08.163 --> 00:34:10.103
that is compelling as a narrative.
00:34:10.283 --> 00:34:15.723
And I think that's, it's, you know, it would be nice to think that we all filter
00:34:15.723 --> 00:34:20.263
for accuracy, but clearly that's not true.
00:34:20.423 --> 00:34:23.843
And our Pilates internet space sort of confirms that.
00:34:24.843 --> 00:34:30.863
I, you know, something that's been on my mind a fair bit of the last few weeks
00:34:30.863 --> 00:34:36.003
is, I think there's a broader kind of chunked-up concept behind this,
00:34:36.023 --> 00:34:42.583
and it applies in every realm that I've sort of bent my thought onto in this.
00:34:42.683 --> 00:34:50.203
So I follow a lot of exercise science, you know, people on YouTube and social media and stuff.
00:34:51.643 --> 00:34:58.783
But I also notice this for sure in Pilates, not in the science side of Pilates,
00:34:58.883 --> 00:35:01.143
but just in Pilates in general.
00:35:01.143 --> 00:35:08.463
I noticed it in so many different areas of life that people just over-optimize, okay?
00:35:08.863 --> 00:35:12.283
And this is like when you become a connoisseur.
00:35:12.843 --> 00:35:18.563
So for example, coffee's an example, right?
00:35:18.783 --> 00:35:20.883
Like there are people out there that spend time.
00:35:22.377 --> 00:35:28.937
Half an hour, you know, grinding the exact 73 beans, you know,
00:35:29.037 --> 00:35:31.497
and setting the grind temperature and whatever.
00:35:31.977 --> 00:35:35.337
I don't even know all the words for it, right? But then they make this like
00:35:35.337 --> 00:35:38.137
super artisanal coffee.
00:35:38.497 --> 00:35:42.537
And it's like, honestly, I reckon 99% of people couldn't even taste the difference.
00:35:43.197 --> 00:35:49.597
You know, when you go from like weak dishwater to like a half decent coffee,
00:35:49.857 --> 00:35:52.137
it's like, okay, you're 99% of the people who are like, great.
00:35:52.377 --> 00:35:55.057
That's awesome. I can notice the difference. But then when you go from a half-decent
00:35:55.057 --> 00:36:00.617
coffee to a $500 a cup coffee, it's like most people, I just think if you gave
00:36:00.617 --> 00:36:02.437
them a blind test, they couldn't tell the difference.
00:36:02.637 --> 00:36:05.497
And in fact, we know this from wine research, and I presented a bunch of this
00:36:05.497 --> 00:36:10.557
in the diploma, that when you put the same wine in an expensive bottle, it tastes better.
00:36:10.657 --> 00:36:14.737
And when you put white wine in an expensive bottle and put red food dye in it
00:36:14.737 --> 00:36:18.517
and feed to wine critics they give you they tell you it smells like cigar box
00:36:18.517 --> 00:36:22.637
and you know uh blackberries.
00:36:24.097 --> 00:36:26.997
Um you know so so like we
00:36:26.997 --> 00:36:29.897
over optimize and we do this in exercise science as well
00:36:29.897 --> 00:36:32.597
and so it's like well if you
00:36:32.597 --> 00:36:36.157
want to get stronger like just lift
00:36:36.157 --> 00:36:41.957
heavy shit you know a couple times a week to the point of near failure right
00:36:41.957 --> 00:36:46.857
do a push a pull and a squat okay great now you know 75% of everything that
00:36:46.857 --> 00:36:53.597
you need to know in that 10-second statement, almost everything you need to know.
00:36:53.777 --> 00:37:02.597
And the other 5 billion gigabytes of data that you could learn on this topic is going to add 25% more.
00:37:04.589 --> 00:37:08.269
And so I think we just weigh the fuck over-optimize.
00:37:08.649 --> 00:37:11.869
And there are people arguing about which angle your elbow should be in when
00:37:11.869 --> 00:37:13.809
you're bench pressing to maximize the activation.
00:37:13.929 --> 00:37:18.509
It's like, for fuck's sake, just like get another plate on the bar and you'll
00:37:18.509 --> 00:37:21.889
10x your results, you know, compared
00:37:21.889 --> 00:37:24.829
to like worrying about the freaking angle of your elbow, you know,
00:37:25.049 --> 00:37:28.689
or where your mind is in your muscle compared to, it's like,
00:37:28.789 --> 00:37:31.389
just push the damn bar up, you know.
00:37:31.809 --> 00:37:38.489
And I think it's the same in Pilates. We just obsess over, it's like the rotator fucking cuff.
00:37:38.609 --> 00:37:40.609
It's like, whatever, just do a push-up. It's all going to work.
00:37:40.749 --> 00:37:41.849
Like, it's all going to work.
00:37:42.189 --> 00:37:46.529
Like, we're just, we're way overthinking this shit. We're just way overthinking it.
00:37:47.229 --> 00:37:52.509
Like, just do a push-up. And I know this aligns 100% with the way that you teach.
00:37:52.689 --> 00:37:57.129
And, you know, that's another reason we get on like a house on fire is because,
00:37:57.309 --> 00:38:00.829
you know, I love your cues. I'll just like lift your hips as high as possible.
00:38:01.389 --> 00:38:05.049
Great. That just says, like, if you do that, you're going to,
00:38:05.169 --> 00:38:08.689
like, it all works, right? There's nothing else you need to do.
00:38:08.809 --> 00:38:11.749
Like, don't tell me which fucking muscle to activate, because if I'm lifting
00:38:11.749 --> 00:38:14.909
my hips as high as possible, I'm already doing it, you know?
00:38:15.049 --> 00:38:16.209
Like, you can't not do it.
00:38:16.689 --> 00:38:19.529
I mean, dear listener, jump on a reformer, put on two springs,
00:38:19.789 --> 00:38:22.649
put your heels on the bar, lie on the carriage, put the headrest all the way
00:38:22.649 --> 00:38:25.989
up if you want, lift your hip up as high as you can, keep the carriage on the
00:38:25.989 --> 00:38:28.409
stopper. I dare you to not feel your hamstrings.
00:38:29.529 --> 00:38:34.209
You know like try like try and relax your hamstrings in that position,
00:38:35.169 --> 00:38:40.349
i challenge you you know it's like you can't so it's like you don't need to
00:38:40.349 --> 00:38:47.929
cue you don't need to cue like just yeah anyway sorry another another like i
00:38:47.929 --> 00:38:51.789
just i just think we overthink it we just overthink it like it's not important
00:38:51.789 --> 00:38:54.609
you know like just cue the movement you want.
00:38:56.129 --> 00:39:02.709
Yeah and my sort of little bit that I'd throw into that,
00:39:05.039 --> 00:39:08.019
is as you're yeah we over optimize
00:39:08.019 --> 00:39:11.079
the way i think of that is so often what i see people doing my brain
00:39:11.079 --> 00:39:15.819
says you're gilding the lily so you're going to spend three hours talking about
00:39:15.819 --> 00:39:22.199
the activation of this that and the other when you do a roll-up and what what
00:39:22.199 --> 00:39:26.519
the position i would push back on with that is well when your clients can do
00:39:26.519 --> 00:39:28.379
x number of roll-ups that are smooth.
00:39:29.921 --> 00:39:33.761
Make it harder. Don't just make it harder by thinking about things,
00:39:33.881 --> 00:39:37.301
actually change the, add load or change the movement so that it's heavier.
00:39:37.741 --> 00:39:41.821
Right. So go to teaser, which just brings us back to this thing that we're always
00:39:41.821 --> 00:39:46.241
on about, but where does it go rather than how, what muscles are working? Look, all right.
00:39:46.461 --> 00:39:51.261
And this, this is, cause I've been thinking about this, this a lot actually about the skill thing.
00:39:51.641 --> 00:39:54.581
Right. And so I think this is a whole other episode, but I just want to sort
00:39:54.581 --> 00:39:57.521
of flag it here so that we can sort of bookmark it and remember it,
00:39:57.681 --> 00:39:59.101
because I really want to talk about this in more depth.
00:39:59.901 --> 00:40:03.521
So in Pilates, we talk about, you know, a lot on this show that there's only
00:40:03.521 --> 00:40:06.701
three sort of fundamental aspects of movement that we can work on,
00:40:06.841 --> 00:40:09.101
strength, range of motion, and skill, right?
00:40:09.181 --> 00:40:12.041
And it's like everything else is some version of one of those, right?
00:40:12.061 --> 00:40:14.821
And we could say, like, if you want to be really pedantic, you could say within
00:40:14.821 --> 00:40:17.521
strength, okay, there's speed, power, endurance, blah, blah, blah.
00:40:17.701 --> 00:40:21.801
But it's like all of those are like some component of strength, right?
00:40:22.081 --> 00:40:24.681
And so basically there's strength, there's range of motion, there's skill.
00:40:25.301 --> 00:40:28.101
And i think two things that we agree
00:40:28.101 --> 00:40:31.121
on is number one in a pilates we way over optimize
00:40:31.121 --> 00:40:34.081
on the skill part right it's like at you know at the
00:40:34.081 --> 00:40:36.841
expense of strength and you know drastically and range
00:40:36.841 --> 00:40:40.101
of motion to a large extent as well especially when you think about something like you
00:40:40.101 --> 00:40:43.061
know bent knee fallouts you know where you're lying on your back you know knees bent
00:40:43.061 --> 00:40:45.901
feet on the floor you know letting your knee fold out you know six inches
00:40:45.901 --> 00:40:49.101
keep your pelvis still it's like oh for fuck's sake you know like you
00:40:49.101 --> 00:40:52.881
know do a side split um but i think
00:40:52.881 --> 00:40:55.901
even within the skill domain i think we just we
00:40:55.901 --> 00:41:00.301
we don't we actually don't do that very well either because i think what happens
00:41:00.301 --> 00:41:06.741
in is we actually we don't understand that doing teaser is a skill now you need
00:41:06.741 --> 00:41:12.501
strength and range of motion to be able to do that skill right but it is a skill
00:41:12.501 --> 00:41:14.861
right even if you have the strength than the range,
00:41:15.001 --> 00:41:17.101
you can still suck at teaser, right?
00:41:17.181 --> 00:41:19.241
If you've never practiced teaser, right?
00:41:19.521 --> 00:41:21.481
And so doing teaser well, smoothly.
00:41:22.747 --> 00:41:25.767
Is a skill but and so that's where
00:41:25.767 --> 00:41:28.907
the skill comes in making the teaser look easy right now
00:41:28.907 --> 00:41:31.627
you have to have strength and range of motion in order to be able to
00:41:31.627 --> 00:41:36.027
access that skill to learn that skill but like where i think we get super confused
00:41:36.027 --> 00:41:40.647
a lot in pilates is we just we optimize for the skill component by just adding
00:41:40.647 --> 00:41:43.787
weird fucking shit that we saw on the internet like squeeze a ball behind your
00:41:43.787 --> 00:41:47.427
knee or do it now with a flex band wrapped around your torso so it's mimicking
00:41:47.427 --> 00:41:51.187
some fucking bullshit fascial line or something that doesn't exist, right?
00:41:52.567 --> 00:41:57.927
Like that's not actually systematically building skill towards the skill of doing teaser.
00:41:58.507 --> 00:42:02.267
You're just now doing footwork with some fucking thing wrapped around your leg, right?
00:42:02.367 --> 00:42:05.807
That's not actually, like it makes it harder because it's like you've got an
00:42:05.807 --> 00:42:09.027
extra thing to concentrate on and don't let the ball fall from behind your knee or whatever.
00:42:09.367 --> 00:42:13.127
So like, I guess that's a skill, but it's like, it's a dead end.
00:42:13.227 --> 00:42:17.147
You're not building towards something. You're not actually building skill.
00:42:17.967 --> 00:42:20.887
You know, in a systematic way. Yeah.
00:42:22.667 --> 00:42:25.687
So we need to do an episode on that because I think we talk a lot about strength.
00:42:27.067 --> 00:42:30.147
But I mean, and I know that we've talked before and, you know,
00:42:30.207 --> 00:42:32.107
people have said to you like, oh, why don't you cue alignment?
00:42:32.167 --> 00:42:34.887
It's like, what the fuck do you think I am cue? It's like, lift your hips as high as possible.
00:42:35.007 --> 00:42:37.927
What about that isn't aligning your body differently?
00:42:38.267 --> 00:42:41.567
You know, pull the carriage onto the stopper.
00:42:41.827 --> 00:42:46.447
Like, well, that's creating this particular alignment that you want to see in that move.
00:42:47.087 --> 00:42:51.747
And so teaching this skill. I mean, we've done that episode where we talked about that.
00:42:51.887 --> 00:42:56.047
But when I teach a shoulder bridge, almost always I'm using the heels.
00:42:56.147 --> 00:42:58.827
And some people say, is that because you're trying to bias to the hamstrings?
00:43:00.269 --> 00:43:04.149
Don't get that's a red herring i'm using the heels because if i ever get you
00:43:04.149 --> 00:43:07.449
to high bridge you're going to be pulling like crap to get the bed in against
00:43:07.449 --> 00:43:13.529
the stopper so we're practicing that pulling in and and you get you know like
00:43:13.529 --> 00:43:16.269
that's why i do it because it's not to get.
00:43:17.149 --> 00:43:21.209
Optimized for hamstrings it's because when you pull the bed in and you go to
00:43:21.209 --> 00:43:23.749
high bridge you don't want to be on your tiptoes because just about everyone
00:43:23.749 --> 00:43:26.709
cramps you're going to be in your midfoot and we're practicing.
00:43:26.909 --> 00:43:29.669
So it's the skill that's going to scale up. Right.
00:43:29.949 --> 00:43:32.329
But I'm not going to tell you that because we're just doing shoulder bridge.
00:43:32.429 --> 00:43:35.389
Right. Well, you're building the skill of high bridge and some people in the
00:43:35.389 --> 00:43:40.349
room will never get there, but they'll get some part of the way there.
00:43:40.589 --> 00:43:43.669
You know, they'll improve their shoulder bridge to some level.
00:43:44.429 --> 00:43:48.249
And maybe semicircle and maybe head back as you progress along.
00:43:48.809 --> 00:43:52.889
And so the skill scales up as the strength and range of motion scale up.
00:43:53.409 --> 00:43:58.789
Right. But only if you actually practice the skills in a mindful way, right?
00:43:58.809 --> 00:44:01.949
Not just add some fucking crazy shit that you saw on Instagram. Yeah, yeah.
00:44:02.169 --> 00:44:04.409
So the skill's got to be the skill.
00:44:05.249 --> 00:44:10.009
I mean, and all of this stuff that I talk about, what I clicked to,
00:44:10.089 --> 00:44:13.089
it was watching nine-year-olds do gymnastics training.
00:44:13.829 --> 00:44:18.029
You know, when they do little funny things with huge big cushions and they flop
00:44:18.029 --> 00:44:22.189
onto their dish position, it's like, oh, that's how they do it in midair.
00:44:22.189 --> 00:44:26.869
Like I said, they're learning, it's the skill is there, it's like the closest
00:44:26.869 --> 00:44:32.309
possible representation of the final thing allowing for your current physical
00:44:32.309 --> 00:44:37.049
capacity, as opposed to just complicate the thing and make it confusing. Right.
00:44:39.449 --> 00:44:41.929
All right, so that was kind of a….
00:44:45.109 --> 00:44:48.449
What's the word eclectic one today?
00:44:48.769 --> 00:44:51.989
We kind of just meanded here and there. But that was a good talk.
00:44:52.049 --> 00:44:54.769
And I think we should bookmark to have a conversation about skill,
00:44:55.089 --> 00:45:00.649
you know, because we don't really talk about that a lot, but it is integral to the way that we teach.
00:45:01.749 --> 00:45:09.849
Yeah. And progressing a skill towards a big, complicated, heavy movement that
00:45:09.849 --> 00:45:11.549
your client can't do now,
00:45:12.029 --> 00:45:14.809
you know that that's i think that's a huge when you
00:45:14.809 --> 00:45:19.249
unlock that people are not interested in rubber bands anymore so
00:45:19.249 --> 00:45:21.909
it's like when you understand that paradigm you're like i don't want to
00:45:21.909 --> 00:45:25.009
use the bosu anymore i want to get on with doing things that
00:45:25.009 --> 00:45:28.669
build towards big strong complicated movements on
00:45:28.669 --> 00:45:32.569
the reformer rather than fiddly fiddly adding lots
00:45:32.569 --> 00:45:35.449
of little things to make it more complicated just sort of i've seen
00:45:35.449 --> 00:45:38.469
it just sort of evaporates people come back and say not interested anymore
00:45:38.469 --> 00:45:41.349
just want to keep moving my clients towards those bigger things
00:45:41.349 --> 00:45:44.169
well because they're just way more fucking fun and cool
00:45:44.169 --> 00:45:47.889
you know yeah and and i
00:45:47.889 --> 00:45:52.149
mean there's a yeah it puts people in a different kind of flow state right it's
00:45:52.149 --> 00:45:56.169
not it's not like a frustration state where you're trying to not fall over it's
00:45:56.169 --> 00:46:01.829
like you're working really hard and seeing progress towards something yeah and
00:46:01.829 --> 00:46:05.089
that's that feeling of when you develop a skill and you do something that you
00:46:05.089 --> 00:46:06.689
couldn't previously do, and you're like, fuck,
00:46:07.229 --> 00:46:11.649
my body's doing this, and I don't even know how it's happening.
00:46:12.789 --> 00:46:14.389
Yeah. Good talk.
00:46:15.949 --> 00:46:16.729
See you next time.