Just really stay focused on that message that we

have for ideal clients, of that story, that we can tell of how

we can take them, which I think is such an empowering story,

even though, yeah, it starts from a fairly negative

beginning, in a way, because they're experiencing a problem,

but the story is a story of hope. Is the story of like this

can be done in a different way that works better for you,

that's going to bring you better results, and whenever you're

ready. I'm here. When you look at your marketing from that

perspective, it becomes, you know, more empowering and

exciting to do.

Hello and welcome to storytelling for business,

the podcast that helps you build better business relationships by

telling stories your clients and customers want to hear, and I'm

your host. Katie Flamman, after a decade reporting stories as a

broadcast journalist, I turned the microphone on myself and

became a voice actor, helping businesses tell their stories.

But what is business storytelling anyway? Why is it

so powerful, and how can you do more of it? I'm exploring those

questions and loads more. In this podcast, I talk to experts

who share tools and strategies to get you storytelling like a

pro, and to regular business owners too, who are doing all

the things, and they're going to inspire you to do the same.

Today, I've got a proper treat for you. So let's meet our

guest, jarda nizzoli from craftycopy.co.uk is a marketing

message mentor and strategist. That means she helps business

owners like you to connect with your ideal clients by telling

those clients, stories, clever stuff, eh? So let's jump in.

Giada,

welcome to the podcast. Thank you for having

me. It's

really good that you're here. I'm very excited,

but before we jump into it, did I actually describe your job

correctly?

Well, storytelling is definitely a big

part of what I do, so I love your definition. And the only

thing I would add is that I also help with people's positioning

and giving them clarity on what to focus on with the marketing

and how to say it. So in a nutshell, like how I usually

describe it, is that I give my clients, kind of like complete

clarity, a strategy and a repeatable process to

consistently market the services as the only logical choice.

Okay, okay, so that's a that is a lot. It's,

it's quite unusual. It's combining quite a few things.

There's, there's a sprinkle of marketing in there. There's, I

know your background is copywriting, but you're also

kind of helping people figure out their brand positioning, and

you're cheerleading them along the way as well. So how did you

get to this blend of kind of figuring out, this is exactly

the thing that I need to be doing?

Oh, well, it took. It took a while, like my

business evolved a lot throughout the throughout the

years, and it was always about, well, at first, to be completely

honest, I started out because, as you said, like My background

is as a copywriter, because I love, you know, I love writing,

I love words and so on. And so I started out like that, but I

started out as a very generic copywriter, because, to be

honest, I didn't really know what I was doing. I was like,

yeah, when I do this, but there's all these options. I

didn't know who I wanted to work with, what type of copy I wanted

to write. And I think sometimes you kind of do need to try

different things to find what you really enjoy, but also what

brings the best results to your clients. So I started out as a

very generic copywriter, and then I started like niching down

and realising, actually I like working with women. Actually, I

like working with women who run a service based business.

Actually, I write. I like writing their website copy and

so on. But then it was also about realising that sometimes

what I was doing for my clients, I mean, I was giving them the

best copy I could give them, but then I was realising it wasn't

enough for them to really get the most out of it with the rest

of the marketing. So for example, I realised, sure, like,

they have the website copy, but now the rest of the marketing is

focusing on completely different things, and their messaging is

over the place. So how I changed my business was by realising

what more can I do for my clients while still staying true

to what I actually enjoy doing, like that sweet spot. And so

that's when I realised that, okay, I need to give them some

more some more help with the brand messaging, and then

actually need to help them get confident with getting the

message out there consistently. And I actually love what you

said about being a cheerleader, because I never thought of it in

that specific way. But in a way, it kind of is like that,

because, as I said, Now, I mostly work with women, and

something that a lot of them struggle with is actually

promoting their services confidently without feeling

icky, without feeling like they're doing anything,

something bad. And so that's how I got to this blend where, like

I give them clarity on their messaging, but also helping them

feel like the one for their ideal clients, like helping them

do this consistently until it becomes a habit and until it

becomes normal, and then they don't need me anymore and they

can keep doing that. That with the same motivation, with the

same confidence and strategy for years to come.

Basically, it's, it's those are the two things,

aren't they? The confidence to have that self confidence to

say, actually, I'm not bothering you. I'm going to help you out

here. I'm going to solve whatever, whatever you know,

that thing. I can sort that out for you. And then, and and

coming at it from a position of, rather than being kind of

apologetic, and I'm so sorry to bother you know. I mean, you're

not British, but, but, you know, that's such a British position.

I'm so terribly sorry. I'm sure you're really busy. And thanks

so much for even deigning to open this email, but whatever it

is or to look at my website, but yeah, there's there's the

confidence, but there's also the strategy of, well, how on earth

do I do that? How do I make my website and my social media and

my whatever podcast appearances and and and all be consistent

and all be super clear. This is who I am. This is what you're

going to get. Because you're right. It's no good if they read

your website and it's saying one thing, but they read a social

media post and they're kind of, oh, hang on. I thought that they

were coming from there. So exactly is, I mean, what do

people have kind of specific or other regular issues that people

have when they when they first start working with you. Are you

like, Yeah, I've seen this before.

Yeah. Well, it's really like that lack of

clarity. Because I think some people, some business owners,

are aware that they think, actually, I know them. I offer,

I offer, like, such good services, and I can tell that

I'm not conveying it in a way that doesn't justice. Whereas

some others are not aware of that, and they think, you know,

why are people not getting it? You know, it should be clear

that what I'm doing is so beneficial. So it's either like

one of these two, but the core problem is the same, if they are

not clear on it, their their clients are not going to be

clear on it. And so, yeah, they have the best services, but

they're going to continue to be the best kept secret in their

industry. And we don't want that. We want I want people. I

want business owners with good services to reach the kind of

people who would genuinely benefit from those services. So

that has to be, like a common challenge, like conveying the

value of what they do in a way that really connects with their

real clients. And as we just said, as well, like the fact is,

like the importance of doing it consistently, because I think

consistency is talked about a lot in marketing, but people

misunderstand it as they're like, you know, oh, you just

have to show up every day, and that's all that matters. But

really, like, having a consistent message is just as

important, because if someone sees your face every day, but

you're always talking about different things, you're always

describing your services in different ways. Sure, people

will remember your face, but they won't feel compelled to

invest in your services. And so that's like, the kind of, like,

the key challenges that I solve, like with my clients, what we

work on is making sure that they're crystal clear on what to

say, how to say it, and that they can actually find a way of

doing that consistently that actually works for them, and

they can commit to that without trying to do everything

everywhere, or being on every single platform, but something

that they can commit to consistently, regularly, and

when their ideal clients are also like, engaging and so on,

so that they can, yeah, get, get into this habit until, as I

said, until it becomes second nature and they can commit to it

strategically on their

own. So you've got to be consistent with the

messaging, but you can't be saying the same thing over and

over again, otherwise it's boring. So is this where

storytelling comes in? Storytelling

definitely helps a lot with that. There's one

thing I will say, though, like I think people are really scared

about being a broken record with a marketing but I think to you

know, you should be a bit of a broken record, because we are

the only person who sees everything that we put out, like

people only see. You know, most people only see a few bits and

bobs. And if we're not repeating ourselves, then if we're not

repeating ourselves, they're not going to get our message.

They're not going to see it. You know, enough times, but what you

were saying about storytelling that is definitely so important,

because, yeah, it's not about saying the exact same thing

every single day. Is about repeating the same message. But

you can repeat the same message in lots of different ways. You

can package it, you know, you can attach stories to it, and

that's why, like, you know, with stories as well, it becomes more

varied, because you're not just stating facts, you are sharing

the same message as part of different stories. And what I

tend to do a bit differently from, you know, traditional

storytelling, because I think a lot of people think of

storytelling as in just telling their own story. I like to tell

my clients story as if it's already happening, as if you

know, I'm telling it to them and helping them see it, and then

showing them basically how they can go from their current

problem to their ideal outcome through my help. And I'm telling

this story consistently, so that the message is consistent, but

the content changes. You. Like and yeah, do repeat myself

sometimes, because, as I said, you kind of do need to be a bit

of a broken record, otherwise people are not going to remember

you. But you can do it in so many ways, and there's so many

different pieces of that story that you can tell.

So can you give us an example of maybe one of

your clients, if it's not breaking confidentiality and

stuff, to actually sort of explain, Well, this is a

particular message that they wanted to get across, and these

are a few different ways that we did it.

Yes, of course. So for example, as a client I

work with that she is a social media manager, and she's

brilliant at what she does, and she specifically works with

businesses in the baby and parenting niche. So most, most

of our competitors were just saying that, you know, to them,

Oh, you just need to do these things on socials, or, Oh, you

just need to do that. Here are five tips. Whereas we

implemented like, storytelling and strategic messaging. And now

what she's talking about is, I literally, she's telling the

story of these clients who work in the baby and parenting niche,

who need to reach, basically, parents, yeah, clients. But I

think, like, you know, because of what they do, they're really

trying to reach parents. So what she talks about is that. So she

said, like, you know, you are opening your social media. It's

Monday, for example, it's Monday morning. You're opening your

Instagram, and you're hoping to find some DMs from parents who

are excited about your services, but nothing is there like your

your inbox is quieter than a baby who's things like that. But

then she does it in a way that inspires, like, empathy she gets

She shows them that she gets them. She shows them why this is

happening, and she tells them what they can do to change that

so. And sometimes she tells the story, like, you know, the

opposite story, like, imagine this, you know, it's, you know,

it's the end of the week, and you don't have to worry about

what's happening next week, because, you know, you already

have these three parents that came in your inbox because they

connected what you were sharing. And you know, she tells a

positive story of what is possible for them. Or, for

example, she tells them why, what they've been doing so far,

has it been working for them? Or why, when she worked with a

different parent, with a different business in the baby

and parenting niche. Why? What did you differently? Help them

reach those parents and so on. So she's not just like sharing

those kind of, like, surface level tips that everyone else is

sharing and that, you know, really people now can just get,

not only on Google, but even chat GPT can give you. So, you

know, if we stick into facts and stats and things like that,

we're not going to make that connection with, you know, with

ideal client, when we're like wrapping that, you know, in a

packaging around the story, whether it's like, especially

like their story, or if it's like elements of our own story

that can feel relevant to them, or if it's part of the story of

client that we've already worked with that used to be in the same

shoes, and that actually overcame that problem and so on.

That's going to make it so much easier for our ideal clients

really connect with that stop their scrolling and help them

absorb our message, because it's wrapped around that story

basically.

So the story is kind of like fleshing out those

bullet points or those top tips or whatever, but taking them

rather than saying, Here's a list of five things you do, five

different stories and and each one is super, super specific,

but actually massively relevant to them.

Yeah, because that's the key thing. Like with

the with the storytelling, like I don't like tell stories that

are gonna make me go viral or they're gonna be popular with

like everyone online. I always tell stories that are relevant

for my specific ideal clients. So that's like the example I was

saying with my client, that she doesn't just talk about using

social media in general. She talks about using social media

as a baby and parenting business who is trying to reach parents.

So that is already not going to be relevant to, like, probably,

like, 99% if not more, of the people out there. But for that

person, they're going to see themselves in that story,

because it's so specific. It's like, you know, oh my God. She's

like, she's talking about me. He's like, she's talking to me.

She's painting a picture of my day. She's painting a picture of

what I want to get a water, what I want to achieve in like, two

months from now or whatever. And that's going to make it so much

easier for them to really connect with a message and, most

importantly, to remember it, so that when that person is ready

to take action, they're going to think of, you know, the one

who's been like planting and watering that seed with their

marketing consistently, rather than the person who was just,

you know, sharing generic tips, or just saying the same as

everyone, or only posting about themselves and showing up with

very generic marketing.

I think that's, I think that's super interesting.

What you said about, it's not about go trying to go viral,

because there's a lot of hype about, you know, I've had

however many million shares or views or clicks or whatever it

is, and actually, you're right. In business, you don't want to

appeal to everybody. You want to appeal to exactly the people who

are going to buy your service. Otherwise, you're just, you're

just, you're just showing

off nature. And you know, like, it's a good

thing you mentioned that, because I always talk about

Magnetic Messaging, and like a lot of people like talk about

being magnetic, but they're always talking about, yeah, you

need to be magnetic for your your clients. You need to

attract your ideal client. But what they don't tell you is that

magnets don't just attract, they repel too. So if you're not

doing that, if you're not doing that with your marketing, if

you're not repelling whilst you're also trying to attract,

you're not really going to attract anyone, because your

messaging is going to be so generic and vanilla that Sure,

it's easy to agree with, it's easy to drop a like, it's easy

to drop a comment. But those aren't the kind of things that

fuel your business. You know, you need clients at the end of

the day. So I always say like, rather than than, because the

other problem is a lot of people are getting distracted by

influencers and big accounts. Those people have a completely

different business model. Like they need the likes, they need

the engagement, they need the big following, because that's

what that's what their business depends on. But if you are

selling services to clients, that's what you need to focus

on. So it's much better to really stay on track with your

messaging and tell the story of those ideal clients, like talk

about what they need to hear from you, even if it doesn't

make you very popular online, even if it doesn't go viral,

because that is going to make it easier for you to connect with

them and for them to think of you when they're ready to

actually, you know, invest in the kind of services that you

offer, which is Literally what our business depends on, if we

are selling services?

Yes, yeah. And it's, it's sort of obvious,

isn't it? But the internet is like a massive box of chocolates

or or a brilliant box of biscuits with all the different

flavours and coloured silver foil and wrapping and stuff,

and, and you jump from one thing to the next to the next, and

it's very easy to get distracted and think, oh yes, I'll do this.

Or, oh, there's they did that. I could try that. And, and, I

mean, I think, I think I'm, like a lot of business owners, maybe

when it comes to, probably not the ones you work with when it

comes to to marketing. And I'm not that consistent, and I don't

stick to one strategy. And I do get distracted. I get bored

easily, and I get distracted, and then I think, Oh, I'll try a

bit of that, or I'll try a bit of this, and and then I get

demoralised when I haven't had that consistency and stuff. So I

think, I think maybe this comes back to the whole cheerleader

thing. How do you kind of pick up your clients and say, Come

on, we can do this. Never mind.

Obviously, really depends on what each person is

struggling with, but something that I can share, that hopefully

will be helpful to anyone who's listening, because then you can,

you get to take this and implementing the way that works

for you. I would start by really reconnecting with why you're

doing this. You know, why are you in business? And usually,

like, it goes back to two things, and one is like, what

why you're doing this for yourself? And I don't think

anyone should feel selfish about this. You know, because you

started your business, I'm sure, like you started because, you

know, you wanted more freedom. You wanted to do something you

enjoy. You want it to earn more than you earn in the corporate

world. You know, whatever it is that motivates you, reconnect

with that. And also, the other thing is, like, why are you

offering these types of services to your clients? You know, what?

What impact does it? Does it have for them? Like, you know,

why do they need these services? You know? Like, really reconnect

with that. And then, once you've done that, start looking at your

marketing from this different perspective, because when you're

reconnecting with those two things, your marketing is like

the kind of thing that will make it easier to do more of that,

more easily, easier for you to do more of like what you love

about your business, and easier for your clients to discover the

kinds of services that can really solve the problem for

them, that can make their life easier, that they can improve

their their business, or whatever it is you do, you know,

it's something positive, so it's like your marketing is a win,

win, because it helps you and it helps them. And the other thing

as well is that obviously this is about seeing your marketing

from a different perspective, that you know it matters and it

makes things easier for you, but also the kind of effort in a

way. And if anyone is listening to this and put, like, inverted

brackets for inverted commas for effort, because it's like, yeah,

it's effort in the sense that you need to do this

consistently, but like the effort that you put on a one to

many basis through your marketing, it means that you're

gonna have to put a lot less effort on a one to one basis.

Whenever you deal with a new inquiry, with a new lead, with a

discovery call, with a strategy session, because by the time

stuff exactly, they already know the stuff, and you've been

planting and watering to see that you are the one for them.

So you're going to attract less of those. You know, as we're

saying, repelling and attracting, you're going to

start repelling people who are just price shoppers who are not

committed with the kind of people who tell you, I'll think

about it and then ghost you. Your marketing is gonna repel

those and it's gonna attract more of those who by the time

they get in touch, you know, they pretty much already decided

that they want to work with you. They're not looking for a

copywriter, a designer, a business coach. They want to

work with you. So. So something you can do to motivate yourself

to do marketing is remembering, like, just the impact that it's

going to have when it comes to getting more of the right

clients and getting rid of time wasters at the same time. Like,

something I always tell my clients is, you know about being

very realistic with what you can do. And I always tell them that,

like, foundations aside, the best marketing strategy is the

one that you are actually going to commit to consistently. So,

you know, like, if you're Yeah, either way, yeah, you know, it's

got to be realistic. Because, like, if, you know, if someone

comes to me and they tell me, like, you I absolutely hate

videos and I hate tick tock, I'm not going to tell them to be,

you know, to roll in on TV, because it's not going to work.

But, you know, it's better to do less, but do it consistently on,

say, channels and platforms that you feel a bit more comfortable

with, where your clients are hanging out and things like

that, and get in the habit of doing that regularly and really

giving things time to stick. Because if we start throwing, I

say, like throwing marketed spaghetti at the wall. Maybe

because I'm Italian, I like that, that analogy, but if we

start doing that, we're not giving things time to stick. And

that is exactly when I think you get demoralised because you

think, Oh, that's not worked. But yeah, of course, it hasn't

worked because maybe we've only been doing that for a few weeks,

and then we focus on something else instead, and we have like,

kind of like jumping ships. Whereas, you know, when we just

pick fewer things, do it strategically, really focus on

what our ideal clients need to hear, without getting distracted

by what you know that big account is doing, or what the

person who went viral is doing, but what their competitors are

talking about. Just really stay focused on what on that message

that we have for ideal clients of that story that we can tell

of how we can take them, which I think is such an empowering

story, even though, yeah, it starts from a fairly negative

beginning, in a way, because they're experiencing a problem.

But the story is a story of hope. Is the story of like this

can be done in a different way that works better for you,

that's going to bring you better results. And whenever you're

ready, I'm here. So I think that is like, when you look at your

marketing from that perspective, it becomes like, I think I find

it like very, you know, more empowering and exciting to do

almost, of course, you know, there's always going to be

aspects of your marketing you might not enjoy particularly,

but like the the impact that it has it's so worth it when you

think you know about especially the opposite, like having to do

everything manually, and always be the one reaching out to

everyone and chasing people who just aren't really committed and

ending up on endless calls with, you know, those people who just

like, not really, don't really see the value in what you do. So

I hope that inspires more people to, yeah, be consistent with the

marketing and looking at it from that perspective of inviting

clients into to live that story, to make it happen.

Love it. Love it. Perspective is the word that

comes up quite a lot in this in this podcast, for a lot of

different reasons. And I really, I really love that. So we ought

to address your beautiful accent and the fact that you're not

native Brit, you are an Italian. So tell me a bit about your

story. Giada, how come you are living in the UK? And, and,

yeah, how did you how? Why did you come

so I was 19 when I moved to the UK, and for a few

years, it'd been my dream. And I think it started because I'm

very passionate about British literature and British music,

especially, like a massive fan of The Beatles, so I saw, like,

watching all the films and the interviews, and I was obviously

looking at things in the background as well. I was like,

Oh, that looks nice over there. And that's how I started out and

just moved here. And to be honest, like, you

know, the Beatles. The Beatles is what I

mean. I mean, yeah, no offence. But you're a very young woman.

How funny that that is, that that was, that was the driver. I

thought you were gonna say, like, you know, yeah, Oasis or

I do like Oasis as well. But okay, it started

out with the Beatles, yeah, okay. And

so, did you just travel

here independently? Your family

didn't come?

No. And I was saying, like, as well, like

this, yeah, the happy side of things, but also, like, I did

have a bit of a of a difficult situation at home, and I was

kind of looking forward to getting out of that situation.

So I was on my own. I started out as an au pair, and I started

out waitressing on the side. Then I focused on that, and I

had absolutely no clue what I wanted to do in my life. I was

like, 19, coming from a very small Italian village, and then

I found myself in London. So it was like this completely new

word. It's like I fell down the rabbit hole like Alice in

Wonderland, but I still didn't really know what I wanted to do.

And then it wasn't until, I think it was, like, about a year

later, that I caught chicken pox in my early 20s, okay, and I was

forced to basically, obviously, stay at home. I did a lockdown

before it was cool that. Like, back in 2014 and you know when I

couldn't do my very long shifts because you had to do very

intensive shifts as a waitress in London, and I was just at

home, and I was like, I started like, reading and writing, and

that's when I randomly had my epiphany. I was like, I want to

do something to do with writing and and then I slowly started,

like, looking into it. I started with, like, simple courses, and

then I went to university in Portsmouth. I did creative and

Media Writing. And then after university, I moved up north

with my boyfriend, and I now live in Chester, which is my

adoptive hometown, Roman town. So I think it was meant to be,

and I absolutely

love it here. Wow. So it was all down to

chicken pox, yeah. And that's and the Beatles. I mean, that's

the most bizarre origin story ever. I love

it for the Netflix adaptation of this.

And, and, you know, we've, we've for people

watching and not just listening. You have such a brilliant look

as well. I mean, tell us about your kind of your 80s passion.

Yeah,

it's so weird. Like, I feel like, when it comes

to style and music, I was born in the wrong decade, but I yeah,

like, the visuals is still my favourite band. But then I fell

more and more in love with the 80s, like my father used to be a

DJ in the 80s. So I really grew up with, you know, hearing that

music, and then I started to realise that I don't really know

how to explain it, but I only feel like my real self when I'm

dressed 80s. So if someone Yeah, people can't hear me. I have a

perm, I've got big loop earrings, I've got a pussy ball

blouse. I'm wearing a houndstooth pencil skirt, and I

have shoulder shoulder pads in some of my outfits and so on. I

got, you know, full on 80s makeup and everything, and it

just makes me feel like I'm expressing myself. And he told

me, I want to be honest, like I think people, people who already

know me and have been following me on LinkedIn might be

surprised, because I'm usually quite, you know, I show up in

videos and photos and everything, but it took me a

while to feel comfortable with really bringing that,

incorporating that into my business brand. I used to, I

used to show up with more. I used to tone it down, because I

thought, you know, people are not gonna think I'm

professional. People are gonna think my my strategies are

outdated, because I look like I'm from the 80s. I was like,

You know what? I feel like myself when I'm and I think

it's, I think it shows more because, because I feel

confident, I feel happier. And a lot of people, when I show up on

video calls the time like, You're glowing today. And I

think that only happens when I'm dressed 80s. So I'm not gonna,

I'm not gonna tone that down anymore.

And that's, I mean, that is so important for

everybody. Whatever you're doing, you have to feel like you

are being true to yourself, your authentic you and and if you

know who doesn't want to feel confident and happy and like

they're they're looking amazing and feeling amazing, that's

that's going to make you show up in a real positive way. It's

going to make you feel better about yourself, boost your self

confidence, all of that stuff. So I think, yeah, women in

business again, I mean, it's, it's not just a female thing,

but a lot of, perhaps just generally, people, human beings,

feel like they need to fit, perhaps, fit into a box or or

particularly, let's say LinkedIn, they have to show up

in a certain way because it is corporate. And I as a voiceover,

I record lots of corporate material, lots of corporate

videos and things, and I was working with a lovely client in

Germany last week. And they're, they, they're a big

pharmaceutical company, but the films I've made for them, for

their internal marketing and external actually are so

brilliant. They're so different. There there's a fantasy and

their personality, a bit of umph, there's there was

analogies about motor racing and and all kinds of different,

different things we've done because they're not stuffy and

corporate, and they understand that just because the word

business or the word corporate is in there, nobody necessarily

is going to connect with that. You have to be yourself, be, be

technicolour, rather than, rather than just black and white

or just the tones that you think are appropriate for that

particular platform or that particular client?

Yeah, I love that. And as well, I think, you

know, we are, I think it is more common amongst women. Are

hearing so much this, so much from my clients. You know that,

like, instinct to try and blend in and to be like everyone, so

that people aren't gonna judge you. But the thing is, like, if

we are trying to be like everyone, we're not gonna stand

out. And you know, how can we attract our ideal clients. How

can we impact more people if we are trying to sound and look

like everyone else? So I think you know whatever you know need

to do, you need to do to make it easier for yourself to you know,

to show up a bit more confident, be more boldly, and to say what

you you know, what your ideal clients need to hear from you,

and what you know. Getting on your onto your soapbox, what you

really want to talk about, whatever helps you, whatever

makes it easier for you, like, you know, dressing 80s for me,

you know, go and do that. And I think getting clarity on your

messaging makes it so much easier for so many people,

because you're no longer second guessing yourself. You know, you

know exactly what you're going to be talking about more and

more. But also is about giving yourself like, you know, having

that mindset shift that, you know, if I want to become the

one for my ideal client, it means that I'm gonna have to,

you know, I can't be for everyone, and I can't just say

the same things everyone else is saying. And yes, it is gonna

feel a bit uncomfortable at first, because it's different,

and it's not what we were kind of like, conditioned to do,

especially as women, but it's going to be so worth it. And the

more we do it, the easier is going to become, the more

natural is going to feel. So it's just about pushing past

that initial discomfort to, you know, to turn this into, like,

our, you know, something we do regularly and that helps us

connect with the people that we actually love working with.

Because, as you say, like you got to work with this client and

you love their kind of, like, marketing and so on. And so

hopefully that means you're gonna get to work with more of

those, rather than just those who are doing the same old,

boring kind of, like, you know, stuffy voiceovers, isn't it?

Yeah, yeah. Everybody's a winner, aren't

they, in this situation, yeah. And, and you also you're

fulfilling your true potential, and you're perhaps having that

freedom and that, that beautiful experience of being able to just

be yourself and do your thing confidently and clearly. And I

mean, I love that. You call it Magnetic Messaging, because it's

true, it's you want to attract those people who are your

people, and you want to ping away and massively repel and not

let get anywhere near you, but people who are your people, and

and then everybody's happy, yeah, exactly.

But also, like, saving each other's time, I

think, like, people know that way, but you know, yeah, we're

protecting our time, but no longer ended up on like all

these calls that don't lead to anything really, but we also sit

in their time because, you know, just because someone isn't the

right fit to work with us, it doesn't mean they're a bad

person. It just means that, you know, we have different values,

we have different priorities, and they might be the best kind

of client for someone else, but they're not for us. So if our

messaging, if our marketing, makes this clear for both

parties, as you're saying, everyone wins. We save each

other's time, and maybe we even help people. I find someone who

would be better for them, while at the same time really speaking

to the people who will 100% benefit from our services and

that we would love working with. So really, like literally,

everyone wins when we become clear on what we stand for, who

we're talking to, and what we're showing up with

love that I love that I was just thinking I've I

had an inquiry last week for it to for from a production company

in America who are making a wildlife documentary, and they

had already looked at my website. They'd already listened

to my demos. He I said, Would you like a demo? He said, No,

no, it's all right. I know exactly what you sound like.

It's going to be fine. He said, Great job on your website. And

he knew everything already. So by the time he sent me the

email, I haven't booked the job yet, but hey, let's all cross

our fingers, guys. I think, I think it really helps with ever

saving everybody time. He did that in his own time. He did a

little bit of research. Thought, yep, okay, this is one of my top

three, or whatever the shortlist is, and and by the time he came

to me, he wasn't asking me all the questions that, because

everything was answered right. There, there's case studies on

my website. There's the demo recordings, there's examples of

previous work, there's this, there's that the other and so I

think that's, that's a good example of what you're talking

about. Kind of like, I've had my time saved, and so is the

client, and we are a really good fit. So, so yeah, fingers

crossed. Okay, good enough about me. We are almost out of time. I

can't this is just rattled by but I always like to end these

chats by asking, what your story looks like. We've done kind of

your origin. What about your your next chapter? What's it

going to look like for you? Do you think if you have an idea

for the next couple of years, or maybe even up to five.

Oh, I just, I don't, I can't see anything

changes, but anything big changes. But at the same time,

as I was saying, like, my business changed a lot, and

sometimes you got to be open to into that happening. But

overall, regardless of whether or not I change direction,

whether or not I, you know, do more of the what I'm doing

exactly right now, I can only hope that I get to impact more

people and work with more of the kind of clients that I enjoy

working with, and at the same time that I hopefully inspire

more people, you know, people who are listening right now,

people find out about me, even those that don't become clients,

but they just, you know, kind of like, end up in my world, I

would inspire more people, and especially women, to really look

at the match for. A different way, from it, from different

perspective, and to show up and talk about their beautiful

services more confidently. And then, other than that, I think

one thing that I would really like to achieve, like, that's

not business related, but I am, as I say, like I write writing

in my passion. I do that in my spare time. It's my dream to

have at least one novel published traditionally and seed

in bookstores. So hopefully that will be one of the things that

happened to me over the next two to five years.

You're very you're very creative, aren't

you, right? You were just telling me before about doing a

dance show and things. So I think

you're never gonna guess in what decades my

novel is set

go on. You got to tell us now. Or is it top

secret? I thought you're gonna say it's mediaeval.

No, it's an 80s of course. It's very on brand.

Can you, can you tease the story? Or is it

really, is it? Is it? It's

a, it's a, let's just say it's a coming of age

story of a platonic friendship. That seems to be the only

constant in these two people's duties. Like young adults, life

was their life starts throwing more and more challenges at

them, and they try to find their own place in the world. And it's

set in 80s. Tuscany,

Oh, I love it. I love it. Well, you know, let's

not just set our sights on a book. Let's go book, screenplay,

feature film, let's do the whole bit. Oh, well, that's fabulous.

Well, Giada, thank you so so much for joining us. It's been

really brilliant. And I wish you the very best of luck with all

of those dreams. Before we go, how can people get in touch with

you?

So I'm very active on LinkedIn, and also the

best way is probably to sign up for my emails. You'll find them

at craftycopy.co.uk/newsletter, but yeah, bit of a warning. Only

sign up if you are willing to start looking at your marketing

from a different perspective. To start ditching the condition

that as women in particular, we need to kind of like, shrink, be

humble, be everything for everyone, and never, like, you

know, shop confidently and all of that. So if you're willing

to, you know, consider that, then you're probably gonna like

my emails, and there is a lot of storytelling

in there. Okay, well, there you go. Sign up for

Giada's emails, and of course, we will make sure all those

contact details are in the show notes. Thank you so much Giada

for joining us today.

Thank you for having me. It was a lovely

conversation. Really lovely.

See I told you you were in for a treat. Giada

shared so many helpful strategies and ideas, didn't

she? Here are my key takeaways. One, it's okay to be a broken

record. In fact, it's a great idea. Giada said that to be

effective in our marketing, we should be repeating the same

message over and over again, which demonstrates why we are

the only choice for our key clients, two but how do we do

that without being boring? By parcelling up the facts or tips

or bullet points into a story. Giada gave examples of little

stories starting Imagine if, or you know when, this technique

gets their imagination going and shows them that you get them,

making it really easy for them, who are, of course, your ideal

clients to feel seen by you three. Forget trying to go

viral. You don't want to appeal to everyone. Magnetic Messaging

means attracting the people who are going to buy your product or

service and repelling the rest. And four I love what Giada said

about getting a new perspective on your marketing, your message,

she said, is a story of hope. You're telling your ideal

clients that everything's going to be okay, and whenever they're

ready to work with you, you're right here. Love that. Wasn't it

great? Well, it is nearly time to go, but first coming up on

our next episode,

what I try and do as coaching is get underneath. How

do I speak in this meeting to what's the story that you're

telling yourself, and how can we change that story so you might

have a story that is, for example, I never get job

interviews. I'm never successful. Okay, well, I've not

been successful up until now. It's just that tiny shift. What

does that do to you? What does that allow if you just hold that

possibility and you intentionally play that story in

your head before you go into an

interview? Oh, I can't wait. But now it's time

for me to go and get a cup of tea. I'm Katie Flamen, and this

is. Storytelling for business until next time. Goodbye you.