And on this episode, we are doing a studio tour of some really cool

podcasting setups. And joining us today is Steven Robles, he is a video and

podcast creator. He is the video producer and podcast producer

at Riverside.fm, which, coincidentally, we are using to record

this podcast. He's also the host and creator of the primary technology

podcast. He does a bunch of tech videos, you know, talking about

Apple devices, mobile technology, smart home devices, and then some.

So definitely encourage you to go check out his content on social media and on

YouTube. Steven, thank you so much for joining us today. Thanks for having me. It's

fun to be here. So, Steven, how did you get into creating

the primary technology podcast? What was kind of the impetus to start that?

Know, I've been podcasting for 13 plus years, back when you had to

hand roll your own XML feed in like a text file, and I've

always Done some kind of technology podcast. I'm just kind of a nerd at heart,

you know, I love doing those kinds of shows, and so I was the host

of the Apple Insider Podcasting for about 4 years. I

got to start it actually in 2015 and then returned in

2020, did that for a number of years, and recently just left there and

wanted to kind of do my own thing, really make push on the video podcasting

front, and so we launched primary technology at the beginning of this year,

January 2024. We hit the Top 18 shows in

Apple Podcasts for the tech category in our 2nd week of launch, then

we just talk about, you know, all technology. There's a little bit of an Apple

slant because we're both kind of Apple guys, but, we try to cover the whole

technology landscape. And, yeah, it's a lot of fun. And I

noticed as I was looking over your stuff, you've been, talking a lot about the

VisionPRO, which at the time of this recording is gonna be hitting people's

doorsteps, and I think yours, this week. Right? I'll be, should be getting it

Friday, February 2nd, on launch day, and I have some videos

planned for it, of course. And then on the Riverside channel, I wanna, You know,

see what implications it has for podcasting. Obviously, right

away, not much because, you know, there's not really a lot of

apps stuff, but you can listen to Podcasting Vision Pro, and who knows with

spatial video and other ways to capture that media, how it might affect

podcasting in the future, especially as Podcasting really leaning into video

nowadays, especially on YouTube and such. So, yeah, we'll see. Yeah.

I I agree with you. I mean, I can't imagine how it's gonna impact just

the audio only podcasting universe other than being able to consume that

content while Doing a bunch of other things that you can do on those glasses,

but I'm sure there are some really interesting and creative ideas coming down the pipe

for people who do video podcasts and other video content. So We'll be

excited to check that out. So let's talk a little bit about

your tech stack. What do you typically use when you are recording your well,

we'll call it Podcasting. We're talking about video and audio in this case. For sure.

Well, I'm sorry I must share my screen. I could show a photo, kind of

a wide shot of my editing area.

And this is my desk. This is where I record all

my content, Podcast, video content. And at the heart

of it, of course, is the Mac Studio that runs everything. And when it comes

to audio, I have a Rodecaster Pro Two of to the

side is my main audio interface. Going into that, I have, this

microphone that I'm talking into now, which is the Earthworks Ethos. It's just

my favorite mic for for podcasting. Also into that, I have

a shotgun microphone, the Sennheiser MKH 416,

which I use for all of my video content. So both of that going into

the Rodecaster Pro 2, into the Mac Studio. And then video

wise, I use a Sony a74 with a

Sigma 35 millimeter F1.4 lens, and that's what I'm

using right now to record this video podcast, and then also

All my video content, I record on that as well. And I also have a

Sony a6400. It was one of my, kind of, first mirrorless

cameras And I use it as a B roll camera, so it's kinda top down.

And I have a Sigma 24 to 70 lens on that, which just makes it

easy to do those top down shots. Sony autofocus is rock solid, and so

I never have to worry about that kind of stuff. Eye tracking on this main

camera and, you know, center focus on the, B roll camera, and it it works

out really well. And I see you're running all that through the, ?

Blackmagic, Mini there? Yes. The ATEM, Blackmagic ATEM

Mini Pro is the switcher. You know, it has 4 HDMI HDMI

input. So I have the 2 cameras, input there. I also have an Apple

TV, sometimes just to either screen record an Apple

if there's a software update, I have that. And I also have my Mac Studio

Tech display going to that, which I really use when I'm recording a video

podcast. Sometimes I want to, like, Switch over if I'm doing a live stream,

like, I'll be doing a live stream unboxing of the Apple Vision Pro, and I

actually use The, top down camera and the screen share, all

of it, while I live stream through the the switcher. And you'll also

see on the desk on the far left side, There's a Stream

Deck and so I use that strictly to control the ATEM

because the ATEM is kind of far away from where I'm sitting to record. So

I have this Stream Deck to adjust the switcher, but I also have the

Stream Deck Pedal, which is really useful for switching because I

can switch between my camera 1 and my camera 2, my top down

shot, and I can use a 3rd button on the Stream Deck pedal with

my foot to enable picture in picture. So I can quickly

switch between my camera angles and put myself in picture picture, all

with my foot. So I can do all the unboxing, do the live

stream, and really then it looks like a finished edit,

just with my foot pedal and all the the switchers. So,

Wow. Like, fantastic setup, and and this picture looks very clean,

very nice. One question I one, I had never even heard of

the stream deck Foot pedal, that has gotta be valuable for video,

producers, especially who are doing lots of different things and, you know, might be holding

a product while they're talking about and doing a live stream or something like that.

Right. Exactly. Yes. I noticed the 2nd mic, though, in your setup

there off, right behind the one that you're using right now looks like a Shure

7 b. I have a Shure SM7B,

mostly to tell people not to buy it, for the most Tech. No, I'm just

kidding. I did have a video on the Riverside channel that said overhyped. I have

a few microphones as you'll see in this, photo, and, you know,

the Shure MV 7, is a great microphone. That's actually what I use

when I travel. I have to record. I'll throw that in my backpack. It's a

great mic for that. The Shure SM seven b, obviously, it's iconic. You know,

every major podcast that you see with celebrities, they're using the SM7B, usually.

I just find that for most people, even

intermediate podcasters, as they're trying to get into podcasting,

It it's so finicky of a microphone and takes so

much other equipment. You know, most people might have a Scarlett 2I2 audio interface.

They try to plug in the Shure Samson b, and they wonder why

they can't hear themselves or why the volume is so low, and people just are

not aware of the gain needs for the SM7B. And you

really need a cloud lifter or a Fed head or you need a powerful enough

audio interface like a Rodecaster Pro 2 or something like that. Or that MixPre

3 I see in the bottom left corner of this picture. Yeah. I have a

MixPre 3 as well, which was my audio interface before the The Rodecaster Pro

2. And both of those can run the SM7B no problem. But

then I also find, like, the dip switches are finicky on the back of that

and a lot of people's voices, including my own, if they're a little lower and

timbre, that you don't get a lot of clarity or enough clarity for

me, and you have to do a lot of EQ ing and post processing with

it, and so I actually steer people to other microphones more more

of the time. I am the exact same way. When I was working with clients

all the time. A lot of them wanted that s m seven b because they

saw, you know, the Joe Rogans of the world using it and, right, every podcaster

who had a video channel was a big deal had it. And, yeah, we just

found that It was it it became so

much, one, more expensive than what they expected

and Cause a lot of problems, because once you add that Cloudlifter, once you add

that Fed head, now it's becoming a super sensitive mic. It's picking up all sorts

of background noise, whereas As a dynamic mic, it really should be

a little bit tighter. Right? It shouldn't be picking up as much. I I I

try to get people to avoid that as well. I agree that m v 7,

though, is a is a Great, great, entry level Shure

mic not even entry level. I mean, it's a it's a high quality microphone, but

it's good for entry level as well. For sure. For sure. I also highly

recommend the, Audio Technica ATR 21 100X as a

USB mic. It's usually 60 or $70 on Samson,

And for a lot of people, I mean, it could take you years into podcasting.

Like, it really does sound great, and it has USB C connection as

opposed to the Samsung Q2 U, which still has the mini USB. And

I'm like, just give me USB c everywhere. I got all under that. You know

what? That's a really because I I Typically recommend the Samson as well, because

I like the q nine u, which I'm not even

sure if they're still selling anymore. Every time I go to look for it, it

looks like they're they're out of stock. But good to know that 2100 x has

the USB C, so I'll I'll update my recommendations as well because I I was

a fan of that 2100 originally too. You know, I

have a podcast host. I do a movie Podcasting, and he's been using that

microphone for, like, the last 6 years, and he sounds great and it's, you know,

really forgive me. He's recorded in hotel rooms. He travels a lot, and it does

great at a lot of room noise rejection. And now there's just so many tools,

like AI tools to to make audio better. You can

almost use those if you don't have the great setup yet, and it's a lot

cheaper. There's some even free tools out there. So Yeah. 100%. In fact,

when I was traveling a little bit more for work, I always kept the

2100 in my laptop bag because, right, you just plug it in, Throw on some

headphones, hold it up, and you're ready to go. I've done a few Podcasting hotel

rooms and, you know, non ideal locations, and it

came out sounding great. So I agree. If you're just getting started and you

don't wanna I mean, everybody wants to invest $1,000 or so into their

setup. But for 60, $70, you know, Maybe a

couple more dollars for a good stand and and a, you know, cheap pair of

earbuds to put in it. You can't go wrong with those 2100 or or the

Samson. Depending on how much your setup is. For sure, and you know,

a lot of times, something like a mic arm is going to be a better

investment at first than buying, like, rather than buying a $250 microphone, Buy

the $70 mic and get a mic arm, buy yourself

a light if you're gonna do a video podcast, and that's probably gonna give

you a better Product upfront because, you know, for a long

time, like, holding a USB microphone, not only is it tiring if you do a

long podcast, but you're getting little clicks and pops, like in the USB cable. Like,

it is you're gonna have all those things, and they're hard to edit out, and

that's something the AI tools to give a bunch of pops and clicks, like, it's

just not gonna do well. So, you know, get invest in a cheap microphone. Get,

not a cheap, but get the ATR 2100 x. It's a good

microphone. Get it in its expensive mic arm, then it'll limit, like, Shocks

and taps on your desk, and you can get a have a much better setup

right away. I couldn't agree with you more. You're you're giving me a little

PTSD from clients that I used to edit who would try handheld or, you know,

all sorts of crazy setups without without a good mic armor or even, truthfully, even

just a good mic stand. Right? That ATR comes with its own little tripod stand.

But, truthfully, you put that on your desk mic's pointing at your belly button, which

doesn't really do you much good. Right? You need to get it nice up and

close and personal for it to, for it to work well. I wonder, do you

remember the 1st mic you ever used in podcasting since you've been

doing this for a while? Oh, goodness. The 1st

microphone, It was probably

I had a Shure Beta 87 A as one of my earliest

microphones. I got it because Marco Arment, he's a host on the,

ATP.fm Podcasting know, he also, runs Overcast, right? He

built the app, Overcast. He's the sole developer there. Great podcast app.

But he recommended that as, like, his number one pick for the

Balance of cost versus quality, and there's still a lot of

professional podcasters that use that microphone, like Jon Gruber, who does the talk show, another

big Apple Podcasting uses the Shure Beta 878, and so

I invested in that, and I think I used that for many years. And

from there, I actually went to the ATR 2100X just for ease

of a USB mic, and then I don't even I have so many mics

after that. I'm not sure what the progress was, but that short beta 87 a,

I would still recommend for a lot of people. Solid mic, but XLR only.

So you need an audio interface, and then you get into that whole world too.

Yeah. I remember when I first got started, the audio interface game was, Tech

quite as generous. It could Tech quite as easy as it is today with all

the various RODE products or just the mics with their own built in,

interface, essentially. So, yeah, that's a fantastic

setup. When it comes to video, right,

you have very nice expensive cameras there.

You know, we had great recommendations for that 1st time mic usage. What would you

say to folks who were thinking about jumping into video who cannot invest

the kind of money that, You know, folks like yourself can into those, you know,

high-tech Sony cameras. I mean, nowadays, like if

you have an iPhone And most modern Android phones, like,

that's the best video quality you're gonna get before you

jump to a mirrorless camera. I've tried many, many webcams,

including the nice webcams that are several $100, that

are 4 ks, and none of them perform as

good as an iPhone. And with Continuity Camera, you

can use your iPhone as a webcam with no third party app required

and it looks great and you can do it with Riverside. So honestly,

I tell most people, like, when you think about your budget

and what you're gonna invest in, If you have a modern iPhone, like iPhone 11

or newer, that's your camera until you're ready to spend

about $1,000. Now after the iPhone, I think

the Sony ZVE 10. Which that's

a you know, the camera's around 800, $900. Buy refurbished.

You know, that's another thing too. If you're starting out with equipment, don't shy

away from buying, like, good refurbished, you know, from trusted brands. Amazon

sells refurbished products, B and H photo. Buy refurbished.

Like, it's okay. And the Sony ZV E10 is sub $1,000,

But what's key is it has that Sony autofocus, which

is on point, and it has an interchangeable lens. So

you can upgrade your lens later if you want kind of that Blurry

background or bokeh Tech, you can buy a nicer lens. I would

recommend the Sigma 16 millimeter f1.4, which is about 3

or $400 with that camera. And you can have video that

looks very similar to what I have right now for about $1100.

And so I would do iPhone until you're ready to invest about that in the

Sony ZV E Tech. You know, I I know iPhone does the continuity

camera, and I just I've had my Logitech BRIO just

Set up. It's so easy. It's it's right here.

And I know it doesn't always work optimally

with Riverside and some other platforms. Right? It claims 4

k, but it it never really produces that when you're using some of these online

platforms. So I might actually give that a try. I might go continuity camera and

see, how easy it is and and what the difference is.

Those Sony, by the way, CV e tens, we were doing a Studio build. And

we

were messing around with a bunch of cameras. We went up settling on those, and,

yeah, could not be happier with the quality you get for the Price, the

flexibility, the versatility. I would also recommend getting, one

of those battery like, plug in battery pass so

you don't have to worry about Running out of power with that, that'll make all

the difference. And a few setting tweaks there, and it really is just the perfect

camera for podcasting, especially when you're 1st getting started out

now. Don't take it on the road with you. Don't move around with it. It

does not handle movement very well. But as a stationary streaming camera,

Chef's kiss right there. And and I

would say, you know, to the continuity camera iPhone thing, continuity camera

maxes out at 1080p. It's not 4 k, But your listeners and

viewers have to realize, like, 4 ks is not everything. You can have 4

k resolution, but not good white balance, not good low

light performance, You know, unable to focus on your face

quickly and 4 k, but having all of those problems, like,

I've tested a lot of 4 k webcams and they have those issues, It's not

gonna have a good end product. And the reason why I suggest things like

continuity cameras, the iPhone is great in in an unideal

lighting conditions. It's great at focus and it's great at white balance,

and then you just don't even have to think about it. And if you want

to add that little blur portrait effect, It's not perfect, also depending on

your hair and background and all kind of stuff, but it does really well.

So yeah. Nice. Yeah. That's That's, all solid points of the

iPhone does, well, and even the, the Android cameras too. They all do a really

nice job of just making it Easy. Right? Just

user friendly. Don't have to think too much about it.

Well, this is great. I I mean, you have a fantastic Set up some great

equipment there, some fantastic suggestions for folks who are trying to

move into a more professional level, but also those just getting started. So really appreciate

that. Before we let you go, let me fire a few quick questions

at you that we're gonna be asking everybody. So one is, is

there any tech On your wish list right now,

like, is there a microphone? Is there a camera? Is there something out there

that you just you wanna get? You're like, Maybe it's out of

budget. Maybe it's not available or or whatnot. Just but it's

something that you definitely wanna get your hands on.

There's, there's 3 things, that I'd really like.

1 doesn't exist, but I want it, which is a Blackmagic ATEM

pro video switcher like I have, but 4 k. So Okay. Probably just

at about 10 Tech p versus 4 k. I would love a 4 k version

of that video switcher. I don't know why it's taking them Yeah, I don't know

why it's taking them so long, but I'm hoping for that. That's 1.

Number 2 00:17:53

Elgato just came out with a teleprompter That looks

Number 2 00:17:56

amazing. It's basically a tiny screen with a little teleprompter,

Number 2 00:18:00

but you can use it as a secondary display And, basically,

Number 2 00:18:04

like, drag your Riverside window over onto that teleprompter and look

Number 2 00:18:08

directly at your guest, but also be seeing, but looking

Number 2 00:18:11

into the camera, and so you're not looking off to the side when you look

Number 2 00:18:14

at your guest. And I don't have a great teleprompter set up right now, and

Number 2 00:18:18

so I would love that, that that Elgato teleprompter. You know, I

Number 2 00:18:22

actually have 1 sitting in a box I gotta open up. Maybe I'll do that,

Number 2 00:18:24

do a little review, and, and and show everyone what it looks like, in a

Number 2 00:18:27

future video. See, that's wonderful. Yeah. I gotta get 1. I gotta get one of

Number 2 00:18:30

those. And and thirdly, I would like to add a 3rd camera to

Number 2 00:18:34

my setup for things like live streaming, And even when I just record

Number 2 00:18:37

videos, I record all the cameras simultaneously and then

Number 2 00:18:41

use multi cam clips in Final Cut because it really cuts down on editing if

Number 2 00:18:44

I can just switch, you know, between the different angles. And I would love a

Number 2 00:18:48

3rd angle that's, kind of, like, desk level at my hands for talking

Number 2 00:18:52

about a product or whatever. So I would have the overshot, which is great most

Number 2 00:18:55

times, but having that kind of like desk height shot of a

Number 2 00:18:59

product, that's really close-up, and to do that I would need another camera. And

Number 2 00:19:02

so, would like another camera. It's it's too much of a luxury right now to

Number 2 00:19:06

say, like, yeah, I'm gonna get it. I got the Vision Pro, so, you know,

Number 2 00:19:09

that's my budget for a while. And, we'll see, maybe in the near

Number 2 00:19:12

future. On the on the podcasting front itself,

Number 2 00:19:16

are there is there any place that you would like to see improvement

Number 2 00:19:20

in just Podcasting general. Not equipment necessarily, but just

Number 2 00:19:24

how it impacts creators or even how it impacts users.

Number 2 00:19:29

For sure. Two two big things there. Number 1, I would love

Number 2 00:19:32

to see a community aspect

Number 2 00:19:37

where you can interact with your listeners that's closer to the

Number 2 00:19:41

listening experience. And what I mean by that is, as a podcast creator,

Number 2 00:19:45

You can have, like, membership programs or or have Discord communities where you

Number 2 00:19:48

invite people to a Discord channel. So I'm just not crazy about Discord. You can

Number 2 00:19:52

try to set up a Slack. You can try to set up, you know, an

Number 2 00:19:55

actual community through something like Circle, but there's just not

Number 2 00:19:58

a great way for your listeners to directly interact with you.

Number 2 00:20:02

Again, they can go to social media, you know, if you're there, but Spotify has

Number 2 00:20:06

come the closest where they actually have, like, a Q and A feature, where if

Number 2 00:20:09

you listen in the Spotify app, as a listener, you can actually shoot a

Number 2 00:20:12

question and the podcast creators can see it and answer

Number 2 00:20:16

it via text in the Spotify creator dashboard. But I would love

Number 2 00:20:20

to see some kind of engagement, like and YouTube is gonna be

Number 2 00:20:24

ahead of the game, because as podcasts are more coming to YouTube, YouTube has

Number 2 00:20:28

the comments and the likes and the engagement and interaction already locked

Number 2 00:20:31

down, because of the video platform. So I would love to

Number 2 00:20:35

see Apple Podcasts and Spotify Figure out how to engage

Number 2 00:20:39

more with your listeners more closely on it.

Number 2 00:20:43

And secondly, Monetization for mid to

Number 2 00:20:46

smaller podcasters, and there's a lot of platforms that are working on this. Spotify

Number 2 00:20:50

for Podcasting, you can have, you know, ads dynamically inserted. Buzzsprout

Number 2 00:20:54

does a great thing where you can have ads inserted just through your podcast

Number 2 00:20:57

host, but I would love, you know, when you get to a certain size, like

Number 2 00:21:01

10,000 downloads an episode and higher, you You can work with an ad agency and

Number 2 00:21:05

they'll book ads for you. But until you're that size, most

Number 2 00:21:08

ad agencies don't wanna talk to you. And it's really the only

Number 2 00:21:12

way to have, like, consistent advertising, and it's a lot of work to reach

Number 2 00:21:16

out to sponsors directly as a podcast host and have those regular sponsorships. So

Number 2 00:21:20

I would love for podcast, in general, to figure out how

Number 2 00:21:23

can those mid to smaller podcasts monetize that's not

Number 2 00:21:28

a ton of work, that's repeatable, it can be ongoing, and

Number 2 00:21:31

that brands would be more open to it and so

Number 2 00:21:35

that brands would start supporting And I'm not sure how it can be done

Number 2 00:21:38

aside from, like, you know, an ad agency type organization. I don't know the answer,

Number 2 00:21:42

but I would love for there to be advancement in that area.

Number 2 00:21:46

Yeah. I mean, I think it would have to be somewhat similar to, like, the

Number 2 00:21:49

megaphone model, which is you get a company that says, I wanna buy, you know,

Number 2 00:21:52

a 1000000 impressions, and then they just disperse them out a bunch Across a bunch

Number 2 00:21:56

of different podcasts, but now brands have to be comfortable with

Number 2 00:22:00

any podcast, right, being where their content shows up. And

Number 2 00:22:04

then, Similarly, I think the content creators have to be okay with any ad

Number 2 00:22:07

showing up and having a little bit less control over it for that for that

Number 2 00:22:11

model to work. But that's that's a really That's a really good thought. And, you

Number 2 00:22:14

know, going back to the other thing you were talking about, that social aspect of

Number 2 00:22:17

podcast consumption, I really thought Facebook or

Number 2 00:22:21

then Twitter, was really gonna grab that one and

Number 2 00:22:25

and take it for a ride, but neither one of them can really sink their

Number 2 00:22:28

teeth into it and figure it out. Now in, you know, Apple Podcasts, you can

Number 2 00:22:32

leave reviews, you know, 5 star reviews, and I actually do this thing on my

Number 2 00:22:35

shows where I give shout outs To anyone who left a 5 star

Number 2 00:22:39

review on the Podcasting Apple Podcasts, we do it at the top of the show

Number 2 00:22:42

for Primary Technology, and it's kinda great because I tell people, leave your

Number 2 00:22:46

name and where you listen from, because a lot of times the Apple Podcasts reviews

Number 2 00:22:49

just has their username, and a lot of times it's not even, like, a real

Number 2 00:22:52

name, it's just a random string or something they made up, and so that's almost

Number 2 00:22:56

a way to my listeners, they've they've really enjoyed hearing their

Number 2 00:23:00

name said, like, hey. Thanks, Chris, listening from Germany

Number 2 00:23:03

or whatever. And just that little bit of interaction goes

Number 2 00:23:07

a long way, but to take it even further to maybe there's comments,

Number 2 00:23:10

and I understand there's a whole moderation thing there. Apple probably avoids

Number 2 00:23:14

things like comments being able to be left on content on its

Number 2 00:23:18

platforms. I totally understand there's a bunch of moderation questions there, but some

Number 2 00:23:22

mechanism, would be nice for more engagement. Yeah.

Number 2 00:23:26

Some sort of direct communication tool. And then, I mean, there third party ones, but,

Number 2 00:23:29

yeah, it would be nice for it to be a little bit more centralized. I

Number 2 00:23:32

think that's drove a lot of the the podcasting space.

Number 2 00:23:36

Fantastic. And even from Members too, you know, I do Apple

Number 2 00:23:39

Podcasts subscriptions for my 2 shows, Primer

Number 2 00:23:43

Technology and Movies on the Side, I have people like supporting the shows directly, paying

Number 2 00:23:47

monthly or even annually, but I get no data on who that

Number 2 00:23:50

is. And I understand that's a privacy and security thing that Apple

Number 2 00:23:54

promises, but when you do get members on things like

Number 2 00:23:57

Patreon or Memberful, you can ask for names and Addresses,

Number 2 00:24:01

and then you can support your your supporters, people who are paying to listen to

Number 2 00:24:05

your content, by sending free merch, stickers, anything.

Number 2 00:24:09

And that's the, like, I don't get that data from Apple

Number 2 00:24:12

Podcasts. There's no way for me to send a free t shirt to

Number 2 00:24:16

someone who supports me on Apple Podcasts, And so, again, it would be nice

Number 2 00:24:20

if there was some way, even for that level of communication, where

Number 2 00:24:24

I can send a message To everyone who supports the show, even if they you

Number 2 00:24:27

know, I don't get their email addresses, like, I totally get the Apple, but it

Number 2 00:24:31

would be nice to, like, have that open ability to

Number 2 00:24:34

reward the people that are literally paying to listen to the show. Yeah. And

Number 2 00:24:38

and Supercast is another one that does really good job with, private podcast

Number 2 00:24:41

feeds and, you know, supplying that information. So I agree with

Number 2 00:24:45

you there. It would be nice to have a a nice direct connection to those

Number 2 00:24:48

listeners, especially ones who have who are so invested in the show they're willing to

Number 2 00:24:51

pay for access to it. They're not just tripping over a

Number 2 00:24:55

podcast one day and being like, oh, no. Leave me alone, Stephen. I didn't ask

Number 2 00:24:58

for this. You know, that's Very, very different story. Last

Number 2 00:25:02

thing we always wanna ask everybody is what is currently your favorite podcast that you

Number 2 00:25:05

were listening to besides your own? Oh my goodness. I mean, I listen to so

Number 2 00:25:09

many Techy podcasts, and so that would be, my initial reaction. I actually have

Number 2 00:25:13

enjoyed Smartless, which, you know, it's a celebrity Podcast actors,

Number 2 00:25:16

and and typically, I shy away from celebrity driven

Number 2 00:25:20

shows, but I actually really enjoy Smartless. I think it's it's enjoyable.

Number 2 00:25:24

It's fun to listen to. I enjoy a lot of

Number 2 00:25:27

Decoder episodes with Nilay Patel, and, I'll do

Number 2 00:25:31

2 more real quick, and then I'll I'll say, my favorite recent one. But

Number 2 00:25:35

Omnibus is a fun podcast. It's kind of like obscure history.

Number 2 00:25:39

They go in-depth on, like, random historical events. That's with Ken Jennings,

Number 2 00:25:42

who, Jeopardy! Famed. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's a co host there,

Number 2 00:25:46

and John Roderick, and they talk about interesting stuff, and if you're a

Number 2 00:25:50

creator, podcast or video, YouTube, whatever,

Number 2 00:25:54

Creator Science by Jay Clouse. It is an incredible

Number 2 00:25:58

resource. He has amazing guests on that show. I've been listening to

Number 2 00:26:01

every episode recently, and if you're trying to grow as a creator

Number 2 00:26:05

or video, podcast, whatever, just listen to his show. I mean, it's

Number 2 00:26:09

just Incredible advice for free, and

Number 2 00:26:13

he has these huge names on there that talks about success in in their

Number 2 00:26:16

fields, including podcasting. So, Yeah. Highly recommend. Excellent. Well,

Number 2 00:26:20

we'll make sure to provide links to, those shows as well as,

Number 2 00:26:24

again, links to everything that Steven does. He is A video

Number 2 00:26:28

and podcast producer at Riverside FM, the platform that we are

Number 2 00:26:31

using to host this conversation to record it. And he's also the

Number 2 00:26:35

host Of the Primary Technology podcast, you can find

Number 2 00:26:39

it at PrimaryTech.fm. We'll include a link there so you can find it very easily.

Number 2 00:26:42

Stephen, thanks for, taking us into your studio and for joining us.

Number 2 00:26:47

Thanks so much, Mathew. It's been a pleasure.