Let's get you mastering your sales conversations.

Hi, I'm Katie McManus, business strategist and money mindset coach.

And welcome to the Weapon.

Even my clients who come from a sales background need to be retrained on how to sell their own services.

This is because selling your own services is like selling your own expertise, your own time.

It's like selling your soul.

In some instances, it's very different to sell your service than it is to sell a house or a luxury car or a fancy handbag or software.

As a service, they are worlds apart.

Mainly because when someone rejects you, when you're selling an object or something that's separate from you, well, you can rationalize that they're not rejecting you, they're rejecting the thing.

You know, if you're a real estate agent and you're showing someone houses, like, no, I don't want this house because it only has three bedrooms and I wanted four.

Cool.

That has nothing to do with me as a human being.

That has to do with the house not having enough bedrooms.

Got it.

Or maybe you wanted a craftsman instead of a mid century modern.

Okay, cool.

That has to do with the quality of the house, not me.

But when you're selling your service, when you're on the phone with someone or on Zoom and you're explaining what you do and you're just being yourself and they say, no, I don't want this, there's no external object that you can point at to say, oh, well, it was just this they didn't want.

It feels like a personal rejection.

And there's a reason why we have so many love stories in movies and in books.

Because the stakes are really high.

The stakes are heartbreak.

Being rejected, not being wanted.

That is really hard for the human spirit to deal with.

It's hard in romance, and it's hard in business.

If you are starting your business, growing your business, and sales is still really hard for you, it feels like a massive emotional lift and you feel zero confidence doing it.

Know that you're not alone.

This happens for most people.

Like I said, even my clients who come from a sales background, I have to retrain them on how to sell their own services.

It's hard.

And there are a few things a lot of people do that actually makes it harder to a get the sale and to feel good about it.

So in this episode, I'm going to break down what those things are that are making selling difficult.

And I'm going to talk you through the simple shifts you can make to feel far more grounded in your sales call to understand the rejection is not about you and to get more clients right off the bat, we got to ditch the pitch.

Pitches don't work.

When you're doing a service, you jump into a sales conversation with someone and then immediately whip out your slide deck.

What did you think I was going to say?

To go through what your offer is, you're going to have a much lower yes rate, meaning fewer people are going to say yes to working with you.

Pitches are dead.

There are a few reasons for this.

Number one, watching a slideshow about a thing is boring.

As f.

Have you ever gone over to someone's house for dinner and had them tell you, oh, yeah, I did this huge presentation for work this week and then been like, oh, my God, can I see the slides that you did?

Oh, my God, can you do it for me?

No, of course not.

That sounds awful.

That sounds like going through a meeting, like a bad meeting where you don't really understand what they're talking about.

And I know as the person who's selling the thing, it feels like something that makes you look credible.

It feels like something that facilitates you convincing this person to buy your stuff, to buy your program, your service, whatever.

And it feels like a checklist, right?

So you don't miss anything.

They might care about all of it.

And what if you forget to mention it?

But it's boring.

I have never in my life sat through a slide presentation and walked away, remembering even a fraction of what was just presented to me.

Most of the time, my eyes are glazed over, and I'm just nodding when I sense it's the right time to nod, because I don't want to be rude and leave the meeting or end the call early, but I can't wait to get away from it.

The other side of it is when we present slides, when we have a PowerPoint presentation and we're pointing to something other than us, we actually create distance.

And so it makes sense that folks who are just starting to sell their service or who are trying to branch out into bigger deals will try to use a slide deck because it makes it feel less vulnerable.

It's almost like this armor that you put up.

It's like this wall, like, oh, cool, here's the thing that you're going to reject.

Just like you rejected that house and that car in that handbag, you can reject this instead of me.

But when you're selling a service, that wall, that armor, that distance, all it does is kills connection.

And there's this huge question that I get all the time from clients who work with me who are just starting their business to clients who have been running their business for five years and who want to scale.

And it's.

How do I describe what I do?

And I truly believe it comes from the fact that we've just figured out at some level that, like, what we do, the service we provide, the work we do.

That's so intellectual.

It's so in our head.

It's so innate to us.

We've just kind of figured out that not everyone thinks this way.

We've just figured out that this is, like, unique to us.

We have this way of doing this thing that is useful to other people.

And because we've gone through our whole life just assuming everyone knows how to do this thing, it seems so weird to try to describe what it is that's valuable to someone who doesn't think that way.

And especially when you end up in a conversation where someone has come to you and they're saying, hey, I'm interested in that thing you do.

We think, oh, God.

Well, I have to tell them what it is.

It's like someone saying, hey, I know you have a device that helps you go from one point to the other.

I'd like to buy it.

And you're like, oh, God, well, it's a bike.

Do they know how to ride a bike?

I have to describe what the bike is, right?

It's the wrong question.

Especially when you're selling a service, because people don't give a F what you do.

If you were a magic belly dancer and people paid you $7,000 to just do a magic belly dance, and they got the result that they wanted.

Do you know how many people you'd have lined around the block just telling you to dance?

God, your abs would be so sore.

Your neighbors would be complaining about the music and the jingling from your little jingle belt.

I think that's the technical word for them.

I don't know the word, but we're just going to say jingle belt because it sounds good.

People actually don't care what you do.

They care that you solve the problem that they have and that you help them reach their goal.

And all these things that we do to try to get clients using these kinds of practices, where we're describing our process, they're all manifestations of the same thing.

Convincing them.

We feel like we have to convince this person to buy from us.

And it's the furthest thing from the truth.

And to shift away from this, I want you to remember this acronym that I just Made up.

That sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture.

This acronym is AD coeffle A D K O F L.

And step one, the A is I want you to assume.

I know that saying.

When you assume, you make an ass of you and me.

Go ahead and make an ass of yourself.

Full permission to be the ass.

Because think about it.

Do you just willy nilly go and book sales calls with everyone and their mother for things that you don't even want?

Do you do that for fun?

Do you go to car lots when you don't want a car and go through the whole sales process?

Do you go on tours of homes and start drafting up offers with real estate agents when you don't want something?

Do you go to the appliance store and check out refrigerators when you're not actually looking for a refrigerator?

Probably not.

People don't do that.

At least normal people.

If you're not.

If you're one of those weirdos who does this and we have to have a different conversation.

So you have full permission to assume that this person came here because they want to say yes.

That this person booked a call with you because they believe that hiring you will solve their problem, will help them reach their goal.

Why would someone take a half hour out of their day to have, let's be honest, an uncomfortable conversation with you where they may need to tell you no?

Because people don't like saying no to other people if they didn't want your thing?

When I book a sales call with someone, it's because I believe that I want the thing.

Now, sometimes in the sales call, I realize the thing is not actually what I thought it was, or it's not a good fit for me, or it requires too much time or effort on my part and I need to find something else.

And that's okay.

That's absolutely okay.

But I walk into it fully believing I want to buy this thing.

The main key to confidence in a sales call is just simply assuming everyone who books a sales call with you wants to buy your service or your program.

So that's a D.

Don't convince.

Listen, you know how we were talking about the slideshow and how it doesn't work?

The reason it doesn't work is because you're usually blasting them with a ton of information that they don't give a fuck about.

Okay?

When I buy a car, the last thing I care about is the engine.

I could not give a flying F about the upholstery, the sound system.

I don't care about how special the tires Are.

I don't even know all the things that I do not care about.

But if a salesperson tries to tell me all this stuff, I will be bored out of my mind.

Do you know I do care about?

Is there room for my dog?

Will she be comfortable in the backseat?

Will she be able to safely jump from the backseat into the front seat?

Because that's where she actually likes to sit no matter how much I want her in the backseat.

Do the headlights work?

Are there buttons?

I really like a good button.

I don't like this like, screen thing.

There was a conversation on LinkedIn a few days ago where someone was talking about their son and how their son really liked flying planes.

Like being a passenger in a plane.

And the dad is like, oh my God, you could be a pilot and you could do this and you could do this and you could do this.

And the kid's like, okay, yeah, uh huh.

And he's like, but are there buttons?

Would I be able to press buttons?

And I so connected with this because the one time I drove a Porsche Macan, it was a friend's Porsche Macan.

The thing I loved most about this car was not how cool it was, wasn't how expensive it was or fancy or any of the features.

It was the fact that there are so many buttons.

It was like a control center.

And while you're driving it, it was so intuitive that the first time I drove it, I didn't even have to look.

I could just go and feel around all these buttons and press a button and the air conditioning went off.

Magic.

Oh my God.

I still like.

It was one of the best driving experiences in my life because of that one thing.

That's what I care about.

Not this touchscreen crap, okay?

That requires me to take my eyes off the road.

I don't like that.

The other thing I care about, trunk space and is it going to be covered up?

You know, because I'm sorry, I'm very disorganized and I like to leave a lot of crap in the car because I know I'm going to forget and I don't want people thinking that, you know, there's valuable things in the car because there's usually not.

But I also don't want to take it out and put it back in and take it out and put it back in.

So I need, I need the trunk space to be covered so people won't try to break into my car.

You're never going to find that out.

These weird things about your clients, the things they care about, the questions they have, are there buttons?

Unless you listen.

So you need to stop trying to convince them of all the cool features of working with you and all the interesting things that you do.

Because chances are they do not give a fuck about most of it.

They care about the things that they care about.

And the only way for you to figure out what those things are is to listen to them.

So ad coeffle ad k know that no isn't bad.

A lot of the anxiety we get when we get on a sales call is around the fear that they might say no.

Because again, like we've already discussed, it feels like a very deep rejection of who we are and all the gifts we have.

It's like you were dating for 30 minutes and then they broke up with you because they didn't like you.

Oh, so sad.

But actually, hearing no is a really healthy thing to hear as a business person.

Right?

Not everyone who comes to you is going to be your ideal client or can afford to work with you.

In fact, if you have a solid offer that sells really well, chances are you're only hearing yes 25 to 50% of the time.

That's a really strong yes no ratio.

So out of every four people, two to three of them should say no to working with you.

That's a good sign.

Now, if your yes rate drops below 25%, we need to look at some things and it might be that we need to look at your sales process, we might need to redesign your offer, we might need to tweak your marketing, but it's just information.

It's just data.

It doesn't mean that you're not good at this.

It doesn't mean that your business is going to fail.

Our brains are these beautiful meaning making machines, right?

And that's the source of some of the most beautiful poetry and stories and art and music that we've had as a species.

Think of that part of your brain that sees something random throughout the day and it's like, oh my God, this is a sign I have to do the thing.

And then it completely changes your life.

That is one of the most beautiful things about humans.

It's also one of the most destructive things about us because we take raw data that someone said no to us and we make it all about us.

We make it mean something about how we're not good enough, we're not smart enough, we're not articulate enough, we weren't convincing enough, all the things.

And then we spiral into this is never going to work.

Babes, slow the down.

It Just means a part of the process isn't working.

And that part of the process, now that you're getting the data that something is not working, we can go and start tweaking things.

We can change your marketing a little bit and see if that changes it.

We can update your offer or your pricing and see if that changes it.

We can adjust your sales process and see if that helps it.

You have to know that no is not bad.

It's just data and related to this.

Ed Coeffle.

Oh, objections aren't rejections.

And let me.

Let me break this down, because a lot of people don't know what this word actually means.

An objection.

Right.

So back to the example of me going and buying a car.

An objection might be, I don't like the touchscreen.

Doesn't mean that you're not going to sell me a car, because I hate this touchscreen.

That's not a rejection.

It's information.

If I'm saying I'm rejecting this model of this car because I don't like the touchscreen, I prefer buttons.

You as a salesperson, like, oh, I'm so glad you said that.

Because we actually have a model of this that doesn't have a touchscreen.

And it's actually less expensive because most people do want the touchscreen.

Cause it's fancy.

You're obviously not a very fancy person, so we'll give you some buttons.

Like, I want you to think about the last time you went and bought clothes and you got a bunch of stuff and you went into the fitting room and you tried them on.

You didn't stand there in front of the mirror in a shirt that you liked the idea of, but it didn't quite fit your chest very well.

Or pants that, like, were maybe just a little too baggy in the thigh.

This whole brand sucks.

I hate them.

Who's the designer?

I want to go and burn their house down.

No, of course not.

You're just like, oh, bummer.

Like, okay, I need a shirt that has a little more give here.

Or I need pants that are a little tighter in the thigh.

Or this color.

I like it, but it just doesn't do anything for my complexion.

Do you have it in a different color?

When people raise objections, they're helping you find the better option for them.

And in the moment, it feels like a rejection because they're saying, I don't like this.

This is the part that I don't like.

And when it's a service you're providing, it feels like they're saying they don't like your service.

No, no, no, no, no, no.

They're saying there's a part of this service that just doesn't fit me.

And sometimes there's no adjustment to be made.

That is the service, that is the program.

And if it doesn't fit them, it helps you sort for are they the right client for you.

Right?

This is a two way street.

It's not just a one way interview where they're sitting here judging you, seeing if you're the right person for them.

You are also sorting for are they the right client for you.

Because let me tell you, there's nothing worse than having the like a business full of your wrong clients.

It's maddening.

Everyone feels like a pain in the ass.

You're going to feel like you're changing gears so many times in a day you can't get into a groove and you're always going to feel like you can't make anyone happy.

No one wants that.

So remember that objections are not rejections.

Next f the follow up, freak out.

I had this coworker when I worked at Equinox and her name was Emily.

We actually ended up being roommates and it was so much fun.

But she had this very quirky way of looking at the world.

She told the, the funniest stories that usually had her being in the wrong, but like, you know, in a charming way.

She always had this way of looking at follow up, right?

Because people would come into the gym and inquire about what membership was, how much it was, they'd get a tour and then if they didn't say yes or no, we would follow up with them.

Right.

Reasonably.

That's what salespeople do.

You follow up until you get a clear answer either way.

And we do these little pow wows where we'd meet as a sales team with our manager and she'd talk about how she'd call someone after they did a tour of the club and she designed with them that she was going to call them to follow up and they'd get upset that she was calling because some people are weird like that.

And her whole philosophy is like, listen, you came into my house, you asked for my time, you came into my sphere and wanted the things from me.

What is unreasonable about me calling you like you agreed to and me asking for an answer either way?

Now obviously she wouldn't say this to people in that way, but as she's, you know, debriefing it with us, this was her perspective on it.

And when you say it like that, it Sounds so reasonable to follow up with people.

If you're a consultant or a coach, chances are you charge anywhere from 200 to $3,000 an hour, depending on what you do.

If someone came in and booked a half hour of your time, took it away from, like, other paid work you could potentially do, other promotional work you could potentially do, and then refused to give you an offer and then got weird about you following up with them, like, what an asshole.

It's not unreasonable for you to follow up with someone to find out if they're a yes or a no.

And most of the time, when people want to sign up for the thing, when they're a yes, and they just haven't gotten around to saying yes yet, when you follow up, they see it as, oh, my God, thank you.

I've been meaning to call you.

You saved me time and energy.

And now I get to have this thing that I want or this service or this program.

Yay.

Following up is part of the sales process.

Now, one of the things I train in my programs is how do you follow up in a way that you're basically guaranteed to get an answer either way, there's practically no such thing as getting ghosted in holistic selling.

And if you're curious about those programs, then I want you to go to weenycast.com strategycall and book a call with me and we can talk all about it.

But for right now, in the process, the sales process that you have, give yourself full permission to follow up.

There's nothing wrong with it.

What's wrong with it is their reaction.

If they get upset because they came into your house and asked you for information about your thing and said, yes, I want you to follow up with me.

And for the final letter in our weird acronym, our weird IKEA acronym, AD coeffle.

Elle Learn.

Do you know that there is no college degree that covers selling in the United States?

There are no college programs that are focused on sales.

And yet 50% of people who graduate college will end up in a sales role at some point in their career.

How insane is that?

We look down on sales.

We look down on people who are sales professionals because we see it as something that is, for some reason, not noble.

And when we get into these situations where we have to sell, we have this weird expectation of ourselves that we should know how to do this naturally, which is complete bull.

You have to learn.

There's nothing wrong with admitting you don't know something.

I mean, you know this.

You offer a service.

You teach people things.

You help them with stuff that's beyond their scope.

Why is it okay for your clients to hire you to learn from you and not okay for you to learn yourself?

What makes you so different?

As with anything, learning to sell, it's a skill building process.

By the way you've been doing it this whole episode.

You've been learning about how to be more confident in your sales.

Figure out a process that feels good to you and go and learn it.

Go hire someone who teaches it or read a book, whatever.

Because the only way to get better at anything is to learn and then practice.

But you can't not know how to do it and then practice not knowing how to do it.

I mean, you can and a lot of people do.

Let me tell you.

It doesn't go well for them.

That's usually when they call me freaking out that it's not working and then bring me in a little too late.

Not, not irredeemably too late, but just, they could have, they could have saved themselves a lot of time and energy and made a lot more money if they just brought me in earlier.

So go and invest in learning how to sell.

It'll make a world of difference.

And think about it.

If you bought a bike and you didn't know how to ride a bike, how confident would you be hopping on the bike and riding it to the store?

Not very.

You need someone to show you.

You need someone to keep an eye on how you're holding onto the brakes and how you're pedaling and how you're turning.

And you know you have to watch where you're going.

Be careful of the bush.

So when in doubt, just remember, add coffee and that'll help you be better at sales.

This acronym that I just made up, that sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture, I think it would be a bedside table.

Like one of those unfinished ones that like, is raw wood that you could like add a stain or paint little designs on or whatever.

Maybe, maybe use some wallpaper on the top that would be kind of fancy with some, whatever the applique is that seals it in.

Obviously very handy.