Fear and faith have one thing in common and it's the future.

Fear thinks the future's bad.

Faith thinks the future's good.

And for me, I think about that phrase a lot, like, Hey, if I'm having bad

thoughts, that there, there's a fear piece into it as opposed to faith.

What if winning at work didn't have to come at the cost of your home life?

In this episode of Seek, go Create the Leadership journey.

We're joined by Cory Carlson, a former executive turned coach, speaker,

and founder of Rise, A faith-driven community, helping leaders integrate

purpose, family, and business.

As the author of Win At Home First and Rise and Go, Corey Equips leaders to

lead Well at Work and Thrive at home, explore what it means to build your

life on the rock, lead authentically and pursue impact that lasts for generations.

you're a CEO entrepreneur or simply someone seeking more alignment

in your life, this conversation will challenge encourage you.

Corey, welcome to Seek, go create.

Tim, thank you very much for having me, man.

I enjoyed our conversation before you even hit record, so I

have no idea where we're going.

It's gonna be fun.

It is gonna be fun.

It was kind of one of these deals that we go, man, we gotta get the recorder going.

'cause this is some good stuff here.

Yeah.

So, man, let's start with my man.

This isn't a icebreaker question.

This is like a deep

I.

pool question.

would you rather answer?

do you do?

Or who are you?

Go ahead and pick it and start answering.

What do I do?

Or who am I, man?

I, I don't know, maybe some days I'd answer it differently or I'd pick

the, the, the different one to answer.

The one I'm gonna go with is, who am I?

And, it's top of mind because of a call I had this morning.

I was talking to a prospect, does he want to engage in coaching or not?

And, you know, it's usually a fact finding question, Hey, what do they do?

Tell me about your business.

Tell me about your family.

Just, you know, the journey.

And one question I kinda always ask, is, you know, why now?

Why are you reaching out now to me to possibly hire me as a coach?

And that usually unfolds a a just a, a great depth of conversation.

And so when I said, why now?

His response was, well, about a year ago, I took six weeks

off 'cause I was burned out.

he goes on to explain the story that as he was leaving a kid's activity,

he felt he was having a heart attack, went to the hospital and threw it all.

Ended up taking four weeks off, plus two weeks of his vacation.

So a total of six weeks off and obviously says, oh wow, man, what?

And as we talk about it, I talk about the burnout.

Why the burnout?

We got to this point where his identity was in what he did.

His identity was being a successful business owner.

And even though it was a prospect call, and I may lose the prospect, who knows?

But I was like, this is an opportunity.

I need to talk to him and help him.

And so what we talked about is our identity can't be tied to temporary

things because they will go away.

His identity, was tied to his job, his success, his revenue, and that goes away.

And many listeners probably are familiar with this idea.

But just due to the demands of work, he drifted and he was

tying his identity to work.

Same thing.

If you tire your identity to your kids, what happens if your kids flunk outta

high school or, an unplanned pregnancy?

Does that mean you're a bad dad, a bad mom?

When we take our identity to temporary things that go away, so

to answer the question, who am I?

I'm a beloved son of God.

And from that, I then can be a husband.

I can then with confidence, be a parent.

I can then be a coach, a speaker, a writer, a friend, a community

leader, whatever it could be.

And years ago I learned this phrase that I still lean into a lot because, you

know, approval can be a challenge of mine.

I, I wanna be liked by others.

When I recognize my true identity as being a beloved son of God, then I know I can

then operate from a place of approval as opposed to for approval when I'm always

searching for other people's approval.

I mean, it's, it's a endless chase and therefore that is who I am.

I, I am a beloved son of God.

That's good.

one of the things that's part of the way I'm made up is the

need for significance, which is related to that need for approval.

Mm-hmm.

if they're not the same, they're definitely related.

Mm-hmm.

And, and it's not a bad thing to wanna be significant, I don't think it's a

bad thing to wanna be, to want approval.

I think it's bad when it starts to drive you and you become addicted to it and you

start striving for it in all that you do.

so many things around that beloved son of God that I think I want us to discuss

before we go further it's foundational.

and then I also want to come back to that identity because of the community

you have, the books you've written, I'm guessing that that identity issue

comes up time and time and time again.

Mm-hmm.

But before we get to all that, I'm kind of teasing the audience a little bit

and also trying to keep myself on track.

I love when someone answers.

I'm a beloved son of God, I.

Mm-hmm.

It sounds good, but I'm gonna be a bit cynical here and say, it

also sounds like church language,

Mm-hmm.

that some of us might say.

So first question is, when did you start recognizing and realizing that

you were that, and then secondly, give me a little bit more of what

that looks like in your life.

How does that translate into either actions or inaction or whatever?

Yeah, it totally does.

I'd fall in that camp too, of being cynical.

Beloved son of God.

Yeah.

Church language that's real, real, real great.

and I was that way for years.

I am 48 and I, I'd say my mid thirties is when I really started to embrace

it more and it's really been just more of a piling on of good information and

experiences and mentors and coaches,

Point me to the right scripture and helped me learn that it's just

gotten better and better since then.

and for me, you know, it, you know, dates, you know, kind of dates back to,

in my mid thirties of striving of kind of grinding and doing all these things

and realizing myself similar to that, that prospect story I said of burnout.

Luckily I never had to take a bunch of time off, but through a variety of

things in all areas of my life from, you know, low valleys in, in the marriage

to financial woes of almost having to file bankruptcy when a bunch of real

estate deals went bad to, just work.

And that endless pursuit of more and more, more through all of those, I realized that

they aren't working, they aren't bringing joy, they aren't bringing happiness.

Thinking about christiany things, they're all trying to fill that hole in your

heart that only God could fill, which I know sounds kind of cheesy, but I felt

it and I experienced it, that all those other things were endless pursuits.

And then if I spent time recognizing that, God is, you know, it, it,

and I, I, I'm, I didn't even master the praying, to God as my father.

Like some people are really good about that.

You know, sometimes I'm father, sometimes I'm God, you know, it kind

of depends on, the day where I'm at.

I mean, it's still a journey, but as a whole understanding that how much that,

you know, he loves me and he created me, and I'm uniquely and wonderfully

made as, you know, all the listeners are that, you know, I, I'm a beloved

son and so I need to step into it.

You know, I step into it through prayer, through quiet time, through

different verses to, you know, trying to make sure I'm pounding the nail

every day to put God first and paying attention to that as opposed to, you

know, drifting into, well emails and how many followers do I have and how many

books do I sold and what's the revenue?

All temptations I have, trust me.

And, there's a framework I use that I was taught years ago.

This was part of the process of me getting, better, is learning

what was called the five capitals.

the five capitals is, you know, first is spiritual, love, God seconds, relational,

love others, and what does that look like?

Third is physical.

It's about managing your time and energy.

Fourth is intellectual.

about insight and ideas.

And the fifth one is about is financial, and it's about stewardship, generosity,

but those are the five capitals.

I didn't create 'em.

My coach did, years ago, but I learned them in probably about 2012,

2013 when I hired my first coach.

And that is a framework I keep going back to, to recalibrate, to

make sure I'm not putting financial capital as my priority and to making

sure that I am going to spiritual.

So, long-winded answer there, but just to say it's been a journey.

I have some tools that help me because I, like anyone else, if I wake up, it's

like, oh, let's get right to email.

But I'm like, no, I need to make sure I am recalibrating against this

framework that I know to be true.

So you listed out the five, Ps, is that what you said?

Five.

Five capitals.

Five capitals.

The last one was financial.

But I think what often happens is many of us we'll call 'em high performers

sometimes I'm a little uncomfortable doing that because there's some people

that perform in the task that God's assigned them to and they do it well

and it's quiet and they go about it.

we've got an odd view I think, of high performers in our world today.

We won't go

Hmm.

that path.

But my guess is that you, Corey, one that, and I know a little bit of your background

'cause we've done some research.

You were always one that probably performed well.

when are out there doing your thing and pursuing, let's call it financial

success, would that be accurate?

absolutely man.

I am, stereotypical, you know, Enneagram fans.

I'm an Enneagram three.

I wanna be the achiever.

I'm a sales guy or I still am selling stuff, right?

You give me a goal or metric, I'm gonna go hustle and try to get it.

and I think the follow up to that, I don't think that's a bad superpower to have, but

that can real easily become kryptonite.

I think it's a superpower in, we'll call it the world system, but I think the

kingdom of God, when we start trying to function in that world, I think we realize

maybe there's some different rule there.

where's that transition for you?

when you mentioned some time periods and all, and some things that went on,

but when did you realize that maybe I'll refer to Matthew 6 33, you know,

seek you first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and then all

these things will be added unto you.

I recognize.

For me that up until about oh eight I was pursuing the things more than

the kingdom and his righteousness.

Was there a point that you went, Ooh, per, I got this verse flipped a little bit.

Oh man.

Yeah.

And that is a life verse for me too.

I love Matthew 6 33 and, and seek verse of kingdom.

And that's putting the five capitals in the right order, right?

It's spiritual, then it works its way down.

So yes.

that verse, the framework, those were all pieces that help me kind

of figure out, hey, there's more to life than just the sales award.

There's more to life than getting this particular revenue number, getting this

job title it went a step further when I went all into coaching March 1st, 2020.

So I left corporate.

my corporate career was civil engineer degree.

Got involved in the selling tech, construction, technical products

like bridges and Storm Sewer.

Did that in Kansas City, then Denver, and then eventually get to

Cincinnati, where led a division there.

And that's when I hired a coach, which.

Changed my life and the standpoint of I got better as a leader at home

and work, but then I wanted to do it and I do it now for a living.

So I left corporate America to then become full-time coach.

And I did it on March 1st, 2020, which, yeah, I mean the

worst time to launch something.

and for all the listeners I know, we all experience pain and some of

you maybe even experienced deaths.

I, you know, I get it.

and sorry for that, for, you know, me and my family, I'm the sole provider.

March 1st, 2020, we went all in.

Let's go.

Come on.

You know, this gonna be amazing.

March 13th, Friday, March 13th, which I'm not a superstitious guy,

but it is weird that Friday the 13th is when it all went down.

But that's when we all got emails, stay at home mask mandates.

On that day, I got emails canceling, speaking in workshops.

35% of my revenue on that day vanished.

And it was like, well, what's next?

Like, what about the other 65%?

Are they gonna terminate?

Are they gonna end it?

God took me on a journey because I, I was frustrated, I was angry.

I've got journal entries kind of saying that of like, Hey,

Hannah, I, I did my part.

I took the courageous, move and got outta the boat and left corporate to do this.

Entrepreneurial, like, where are you?

What happened?

And so, God takes me on this journey over the summer and, I put together a lot of my

findings and what God was sharing with me.

I put 'em in blogs to help really just kind of other people and

even a client would call and say, I'm kind of struggling with this.

I dunno, you know, resilience or perseverance.

I was like, Hey, I wrote this blog this morning, why don't you read it?

Well, when it was valuable to them, and I got enough positive feedback, I was

like, well, I guess he, here's a book.

I, I'll write a book.

So the book I wrote is called Rise and Go.

the main idea of Rise and Go is all leaders get knocked down.

It's just the great leaders get back up quicker.

what could it look like in your life for the next time you're knocked

down, you're able to get up quicker.

that's the idea of the book.

there was a piece in that journey to answer your question, Tim,

how do I balance ambition versus, godly ambition, selfless ambition?

How do I find what this looks like?

losing all the, revenue March 1st, 2020 as I'm cruising through that

summer of 2020 and on into 2021.

My whole typical response to that was, I'm working harder.

If I'm a solopreneur, then I gotta spend all my time on LinkedIn.

I gotta find leads and more clients and more podcast interviews and,

you know, more and more, more.

it was hard to shut it off.

Like I, I, I, I got better at the corporate world of figuring out how

to shut it off and realizing, I didn't have all this control, but when it

shifted in the solopreneur world, I didn't know how to shut it off

because it was all dependent on me.

If I wasn't doing anything well, I'm not gonna get any leads.

God pointed me to Psalm 1 27, 1 and two.

Unless the Lord builds the house, he who gets up early, labor's in vain.

And when I read that, and then the next verse is in, you know, talking

about the watchtower, unless he watches over, he labor's in vain.

On the Watchtower component.

As I'm reading both those verses, I start to think, I hear this kind of audible

voice of God's got the night shift.

If I work hard from eight to five,

I have to have trust.

I have to have faith that God's gonna take the rest of it.

That while I'm at family dinner, while I'm playing with my kids, and

even inside eight to five, if I'm traveling, I have to have faith that

while I am, you know, doing other activities, that God's softening a

prospect's heart to say yes, that God's got some potential clients talking

about having me come in for a workshop.

And same is true for you, Tim, and for the listeners.

It's just like, hey, if we do our part, bust our tail off during the

working hours, we have to have faith that God's got that night shift.

And so an additional phrase that I was hearing is I control the input

and God controls the impact that if I am doing my hard work, God's gonna

show up and provide that impact.

And so that's a boundary I have because of that phrase.

I've put things in place to do a digital Sabbath on Sundays to charge my phone

into the other room at night, as opposed to, you know, looking at it kind of when

I go to bed and first thing when I wake up, I've deleted social media off my

phone, or there's just different things I've done to help me, stay focused,

Sure.

You know, one of the things I think that Covid did for many

of us, oh eight did this for me.

So Covid was a little bit different, was that I realized that I just wasn't

as much control as I thought that I was

Mm-hmm.

Talking about that there is, is control something that you enjoy

having over your environment and has that been part of your struggle also?

Yes and no.

and I say no because there's other folks that I know have

a lot more control challenges.

I've kind of been more the thought process, the kind of freedom of the

framework when it comes to parenting, when it comes to other elements.

I don't like details.

I mean, I'm not a detailed guy, so there's a lot of times I've never had

control 'cause like I, you haven't ne ne necessarily studied it all.

But yeah, I mean, I do want an element of some control and with sales my whole

life, it's, if eat and kill, you know, you go hunt and it, it's yours to have.

If I know how many sales calls I need to make.

I know how many proposals I then need to send out, and then how

many prospects I'll get, right?

It's the funnel.

And so over my whole career, I've been able to figure out

this funnel for my business.

What I was overextending on as I stepped into coaching and speaking

full-time was, I'm gonna make the top of this funnels wide, is absolutely

possible by never turning it off.

But that's when I realized, hey, I'll work hard from eight to five,

make that funnel smaller and trust that well all my hit rate will go

up so I could have the prospect.

So I think that would be the way of control is there's many pieces I

couldn't control except what I did.

I think I've been okay with people what I can't control, but it's more

me and just working harder driving.

I had this weird season where I was really digging and spending a lot of time with

the Lord, and I think maybe this was a lesson for me, but appeared to be the less

that I did, I'm not against hard work.

This is not what I'm saying here.

The less that I did, the more financial resources I had coming into me, it

was this really, really odd season.

And, I don't know that I totally got the lesson, it was something that, was

trying to get me out of that entirely.

If it is to be, it's up to me

Mm-hmm.

mindset,

Yeah.

I'm guessing you see a lot of that your community.

Would that be correct?

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, uh, you know, I. Like generosity.

I mean, there's this kingdom math.

I mean, it seems like the, I, I have a very good friend who's a wealth

manager and he has made a comment that, the more generous people are,

it's almost like they have more money in savings than everything else.

And it's probably, both practical and spiritual.

The practical side is if you're generous with your money, you're probably budgeting

pretty well of what you're giving away.

This is what we're spending.

So there probably is a practical component of that, but there's also,

a spiritual component of it, of it's you're stewarding God's resources and

another resource God gives us is time and how are we stewarding his time?

And I think a big piece for me and for many listeners, maybe, or at

least leaders out there as a whole, is sometimes we forget or we think about

that our only job is here on Earth is.

Go crush it in the work world.

Let's be the best revenue generating person in our, you know, out there.

And let's go get the titles, let's go get the money, let's go get the

raises, then that's our function.

But no, it's also to be a father or, a mother, a father, a husband, a wife, a

community leader, like all those elements.

And so we wear many hats, not just the financial piece.

And I think that is a part that has helped me a lot to understand that there,

I wanna make sure I'm dating my wife.

I need to make sure I'm having one on time with my kids, meeting up

with my buddies, getting to the gym.

Like there's a lot I need to do other than just make sure I'm working all the time.

Yeah, and so there's one thing that's really intriguing for me before we

dive in a little bit more to kind of what all you have going on right now.

When I hear, I'm an engineer by training too.

I'm an industrial and systems engineer.

But yet here I am on a podcast and do coaching and stuff like that.

And then I heard you say that really sales is kind of your thing, but yet

I see the civil engineer the, on your

right.

And so I guess I wanna back up a little bit and maybe ask a little bit about.

what were you thinking you were going to do in life as you were younger?

what did the plans you have?

What did you think you were wired for?

Maybe even a little bit of, how you grew up, because I'm always intrigued.

I think all of that begins to layer into where we are today.

So, my first thing is how did one go from civil engineer to sales?

It could be technical sales and things, which is fine.

I get it.

Yeah.

really have, listen, if you and I were to bump in each other on the

street, I wouldn't be going, oh, look, Corey, he's, he's an engineer.

I can tell.

No, you know, you're, you know, the way you'd look and everything like that.

I don't know that people would say the same about me either.

so, what's up with that and tell me a little bit about, more about, to

kind of frame how you were raised.

yeah, go career raise first, right?

What's the right direction to go?

I guess we'll just, you know, I, from a career standpoint, I don't know if I ever

knew what I wanted to be when I grew up.

I mean, I don't know if I had anything burning.

two parts have come into mind right now as we're talking is kind of that

in the high school years of trying to decide what to go do, I knew

I loved development, like cities.

I loved going to cities and seeing skyscrapers and seeing just activity.

Like, it's just always something I've liked and I, and I still do.

and so that was an element that was the positive element.

I guess mixing one more in there of positive is, uh,

you know, I was good at math.

And so that was circulating of, hey, be an engineer.

I didn't know what to do and be an engineer.

They make good money, a negative vibe in all that was.

I remember, and I don't think this was for, bad purposes, she probably

was trying to protect me, but a counselor said, I don't think you're

smart enough to be an engineer.

I don't know if those were the exact words, but it's something along those

lines that, you know, maybe your scores aren't high enough to be an engineer.

I do think it was probably out.

I'm gonna assume the best.

I'm gonna assume it's outta love.

It was to Corey, you may be going down a bad path, it's gonna be a

disaster and whatever, however.

In college, I went civil engineering route.

And I think there are some days I'm like, this is gonna get me to the path of doing

development, whatever that looks like.

And I think there are other days it's like, I'm gonna prove this lady wrong.

I'm wanna show her that I'm smart enough.

So I don't know how much getting through college was, just

about proving this lady wrong.

I don't know if it was about pursuing this idea of what I would be, I don't know.

What I do know is, thank goodness for, yeah, I, I was able to graduate.

I, I then took a job at a great engineering firm, awesome firm,

burns McDonald, great firm and still in contact with them today.

But I'll just tell you it, I didn't love my job.

I mean, obviously that's why I left, but I just didn't love it.

and I've got buddies who stuck around.

They're still there and they love it.

But for me.

I was impatient.

I think that if I would've had some patience, it probably would've been great.

It would've stuck there.

But I just was impatient.

I was getting bored designing the thickness of airport pavement and

the elevations of all the different joints, on the concrete slabs

of the runway and the taxiways.

I was like, I don't know if I wanna do this for the rest of my life.

And, you know, so I was definitely wandering, I think, not only

professionally, but I was even kind of wandering personally.

and so that all factored into it.

Like, I need to do something and I need to be up into the right in

comparison And seeing other buddies get promoted and probably money there

making and cars, they were driving.

It just.

It all kind of came to, I need a new job.

So I did find a great next job where I did sales of civil engineering products,

storm sewer, bridges as I mentioned, and then that began the process of sales.

and so that's how I got in engineering, which then went from to sales and then

leadership roles, and now the coaching.

And so that's the career progression.

What's crazy, Tim, and this may come into your life as well, man,

it's God, nothing's ever accidental.

He uses it all, for good as the promise and Romans and, you know,

I mean, it's all for his glory.

And so for me, I mean, I've got clients in non-construction spaces for sure, but I

have clients that I can relate to because they're in the construction space and I

know what that's like and I can feel it.

So it didn't necessarily go to waste.

It's been fun to kind of see it come full circle.

so that part's pretty cool.

Yeah.

one of the

yeah.

you brought up that you were good at math.

my journey was very similar.

Yeah.

both my parents were educators.

I thought that's what I wanted to be teacher coach, until I found

out how much money they made.

I didn't know we were poor.

I wanted to make more money.

So I said, oh, engineer, you know, I'm down the road here from Georgia Tech.

Let me go there.

And so, and I was, I was good in math, but here's what I found out.

I wasn't as good as most of those others.

That's what I found out.

And it was just like, oh boy, the, they are getting together and I think

they're studying some of this calculus differential equation, stuff like that.

I think they're doing some stuff without me around because

they seem to know more than I

Yeah.

that was

And I think my counselor knew that.

And that's what, I, so I, I think it was, yeah, like I said, outta love

that she was trying to protect me.

but I, in my immaturity, I didn't take it as protection.

I took, took it as an insult.

yeah.

So any, anything we need to know about, growing up we're about to

dive into current stuff and all that.

Anything else about, did you grow up in a family of faith or,

Yeah.

was it a, was there money driven or was money just a thing or what was some of

those things that you had growing up?

Yeah.

So I did grow up in a Christian home, awesome home, loving home, present father,

which was amazing and incredible mom.

So all that was great.

the big part that affected me, and we'll talk about, you know, how it

affects me now is my mom passed away when I was 15 years old from cancer.

She had a seven year battle with cancer passed away when I'm 15, which

obviously was a big bummer for sure.

in all that I gotta see, you know, my dad

take care and love on a wife that was dying over a seven year period of time.

And we had, great moments, you know, I don't mean as a decline the

whole time, but obviously, she ends up passing, but great childhood.

So he was able to love and serve her.

So I gotta see what good marriage looks like.

I don't know how he did it, but he parented us three, with the help of my

mom, but eventually she passes and so he's single parenting us for a while.

And so when my mom passed away, I was 15.

My brother would've been 12 and Sister 11.

So, you know, he had, basically a bunch of people young and

their, you know, before 10.

And then he had me and my brother and sister, 15, 12, 11.

So you have this range of kids that he was taking care of.

A sick wife, still had a full-time job traveling, doing sales,

and loving and present for us.

what's wild is I don't remember him missing a game.

I know he did.

I know he missed games.

He traveled, but I don't remember him missing him because there felt to be such

a presence that he was always around.

So that, even though we never talked about the phrase, went a home first,

and I just gotta see it modeled, which is really, really cool.

And fast forward to now, I go back to a lot of that, that I learned,

you know, fortunately in the home.

That's the very good stuff about my childhood.

Yeah,

A yeah,

Go.

yeah.

the dark side of my childhood or the element that, I wrestled with for

numerous years is when my mom passed away.

My dad became unemployed for parts of the time before and after just typical sales.

Hey, we don't need you anymore.

We're downsizing or this or that.

Well, in that money had to be spent from college savings for chemo

and whatever the case would be.

the savings went down.

So when it was time to go to college, it was, all on me to

get loans or get a part-time job

And there's nothing wrong with that.

people do that, that happens.

They're successful For me, the devil got a hold of my mind

to say, listen, you see this?

If you're ever gonna make it in life, it's all on you.

your family's college savings gone.

You can't count on anybody else, you know, God or anything.

It's all on you from a provision standpoint.

And I believe that, and I think that was another factor.

Like, I gotta get this engineering degree.

I need to get the money.

And I think that's probably when I got into my twenties, I'm like,

this engineering job's too slow.

I need somewhere else to make more money.

Fast forward.

I think that's always kept been a reason for my drive.

I mean, I'm also competitive and so that there's a factor for my drive

at work, but a factor of it, for sure was the devil telling me I'm the

provider and God's not cool story.

Well, I was gonna say there, there's an element that we don't like to

admit, which there's fear there.

Yeah,

right.

yeah, yeah.

Fear of not having, and so fast forward, I'm, writing my second book.

I'm talking to my dad about all this and he's like, man, I

don't think you ever heard this?

I was like, well, what?

And he goes, man, you know, you're talking about this time where money was

tight and it was, but our church stepped up and paid for a year of our mortgage.

And I was like, what?

I had no idea.

So with limited, you know, with not all the full data, I was believing

this lie that the devil's getting in my ear that it's all on me.

And now come, you know, unfortunately decades later I

find out that that's not true.

And in fact, God showed up paid for our mortgage for a year.

That helped me break some remaining, chains that I had holding me back thinking

I'm the provider and now I've got.

this faith that, hey, God's my provider, and it kind of all plays in together.

If I control the input, God controls the impact, all those pieces.

And so that's, the great side of my childhood of understanding love and

marriage and parenting, all those pieces.

The bad side was that financial story that, I'm breaking free.

I'm still broken and not perfect, but it has been a step in

the right direction for sure.

So here's kind of a trick question.

do you think it really would've changed anything?

Had you had that data the time?

or is it something we just look back on now and say, oh, well maybe.

But, again, it's a trick question 'cause it's who knows?

Yeah.

I really just don't know,

Yeah.

you know, it kind of, all it comes down to it.

I don't know what I would've done differently.

even not knowing that story, there is a part of me that's, I still

got comparison, I still have envy.

So if I knew that whole story all along, it's still like, well, I want

the bigger house, I want the better car, I want the title I want the things.

so I'm sure the comparison monster was gonna show up, maybe even a

little bit more to fuel that ambition, to fuel that, approval of others.

I also think I've come to terms with the timeframe that I was

raised in, an impact on me.

I kind of came into age, you know, the late seventies, early eighties,

you know, the greed is good decade,

Mm-hmm.

I feel that fed my, you mentioned always wanted more.

I had an addiction to more, whatever was going on business, whatever, you

know, wasn't addicted to, you know, some of the vices that people would

say, I was addicted to the things.

That allow people to be successful

Mm-hmm.

in

Yeah,

system.

yeah,

brings my next question.

You mentioned you're 48, we were talking age and decades before we clicked record.

Maybe this is a good time to get into that, but I, I was just gonna ask how,

how are you defining success right now?

And I'm sure you're a vision and kind of a strategic guy.

How are you beginning to look at your next decade, which you're about to hit halfway

or whatever, you know, your fifties.

Talk about success, how you're defining it now, and then what are you doing

looking forward for the next few years?

yeah.

No, that's a great question.

Now I'm looking at success in a lot of different categories, like I think the

old me may have quickly defaulted to kind of a revenue number or a thought

on success from a work standpoint.

But as we even mentioned the five capitals earlier, I mean, success

for me is going to be able to be, the best version of my whole self.

I can be.

So, you know, things I'm paying attention to as far as what would make

me success is I, I'm working to grow closer in my, you know, walk with God.

When I started this year, it was, I wanna get better at prayer.

you know, so I ended up getting this, amazing five year prayer journal.

It's big and thick, and I'm holding up to the camera for

those listening to the podcast.

And you open it up and it's blank.

it basically, gives you the date.

August, I open it up to August and then you got five

different blanks for the years.

So I'm riding in that every morning.

I love it.

A company called Hosanna Revival.

I don't get paid for saying this, but Hosanna Revival made it.

I'm using this, I'm doing a, devotion every morning with my 12-year-old son.

daily Wisdom for Men, right?

Right there.

It's that one.

So I'm just trying to make sure I'm growing spiritually.

So that is, and there, there's other elements of it.

How, how can I grow closer to God, closer to my walk?

Success, you know, relationally.

I want, make sure I'm dating my wife, you know, two times a month I'm doing,

one-on-ones with my kids and making sure I'm doing time with friends, like paying

attention to where am I at relationally.

And what does the, the intention I look around that piece, you

know, moving over to work.

I track revenue and I wanna be successful there, but I'm also just tracking, impact.

I'm trying to pay attention to, how many people am I able to impact I

track it through, is it podcast?

Is it speaking audiences, is it book sold?

number of clients, podcast downloads.

But anyways, just trying to figure out, hey, you know, how, how can I help

share this message with more people?

and I know it's not all on my doing.

what's crazy, you know, Tim, is we can go grind as hard as we want, but one

person can open up a door that introduces you to 20 people that I would've taken

hours and hours and hours on LinkedIn to try to find those 20 people.

And I may never even found 'em.

And so there is this piece of it where it's like, I'm just gonna keep working

hard and, you know, I, I'm confident that God is going to control the impact.

You made the comment earlier about fear.

Fear and faith have one thing in common and it's the future.

Fear thinks the future's bad.

Faith thinks the future's good.

And for me, I think about that phrase a lot, like, Hey, if I'm having bad

thoughts, that there, there's a fear piece into it as opposed to faith.

And, and so I think about that a a lot.

So you excited then about crossing over into your fifties?

I am, before we hit record, I just shared, you know, we were talking

about, you and your age, and I mentioned this book, decade by Decade,

it's got some similarities to the book halftime by Bob Eufor, that

many people have read or familiar with, this book, decade by Decade.

It is different and it's, definitely worth reading.

It's thinner, it's easier, it talks generational.

It uses SS at every gener, every generation.

There's an S word, I think security is the zero to 10, and it's all about

yourself in your teenage years and kind of survival in your twenties.

Anyways, it's got all these s's, but the most fascinating piece is the

number one decade that this guy has put together that he believes that people

have based off on all of his clients and the research he did, that the number

one decade people have is their sixties.

And it's because they probably are confident in themselves.

They understand their identity relationally.

They got great relationships.

Financially they're in a good position 'cause they're not paying for all

kid youth sports or whatever it is.

And they're in, in their, in their high earning year.

So their sixties are there.

So when you ask the question, how I feel going in my fifties, I'm optimistic

because my sixties, if they're supposed to be my best decade, that

means I got a 10 year runway to that.

And so it's only gonna be better.

So I'm very optimistic and bullish about what can be from a family standpoint,

you know, kids, graduating college and high school and what that part looks like

and what our family grows and can be.

And then from a work standpoint, you know, I've got some books I'd

like to write or additional books get out there and just continue.

My mission to help, you know, connect people to greater performance at

work, at home, and into their purpose.

Yeah, that's good.

you know, when you brought it up, I'm sitting here going, man, I

am fired up here in my sixties.

There's a lot of

Yeah.

stuff going on.

One of the big things for me, and this, I don't know if this might sound

harsh, but kind of get to the point where there's a lot more of don't care,

Yes.

other people think.

Don't care what.

and that sounds negative, but some of our personalities need that.

Mm-hmm.

more of a don't care.

Mm-hmm.

I wanna back up one quick thing.

I dunno if you could hold up the daily devotions for men again,

Yeah.

we interviewed Dan and Jimmy while back, and I just want people.

On the video and all to note, 'cause we'll probably include that down in the links.

That is one of the most beautiful, well done devotionals that I have ever seen.

Just the leather, I mean, just the way it's done, isn't

Yep.

And

it's amazing.

really cool.

It's cool you're doing that with your son, so I wanted to give

I'll put one more.

been on the

Yeah,

been here.

yeah.

Now I'll put a plug for us.

I just told Jimmy this the other day.

He came inside.

Well, bill, uh, Dan did as well.

They spoke inside the Rise community.

So I lead a community of men who want to grow and home work and faith.

We have calls every Monday from 12 to one Eastern, and then once a

month we're bringing in speakers.

Uh, have the opportunity to have both Dan and Jimmy in there.

I have to get you in there as well.

and I told Jimmy, I think I told Dan this as well, but what I love

about this devotion for anyone listening to it and thinking about,

Hey, maybe I would do it, my.

Child as well, or son, it's simple enough like they're short one pagers, but

it's simple enough that my 12-year-old stays engaged, but they're deep and

profound enough that I stay engaged and I just, it is just been awesome.

It's been really, really cool.

And yeah, we've been doing it I guess four months now or

five months, whatever we're at.

My struggle and I could work through this.

My struggle is I keep getting them and giving them away, and

so I'm sure they hate that too.

I'm sure they hate that.

That's what I'm doing with it.

You brought up Rise.

We've got, we've got a little bit of time here.

I'd love to spend our time remaining to talk about your community Two

books we could spin off from that.

Let's go to Rise first.

Tell me about the formation of the community and let's, let's, let's

see what we could glean and what we could learn from bringing together

men, in, in a group like this.

'cause many times people are isolated.

They think that their situation is the only situation and they do not

understand all the other things that people are going through, and that

people are probably going through exactly what they're going through.

Maybe not, you know, maybe the names are different, but tell me how the community

developed and then we'll talk a little bit about what you're learning from it.

Not what you're teaching, but

Yeah.

learning from it.

Oh yeah.

Yeah.

Two elements, that how it developed is one.

In my one-on-one coaching calls.

So I do a lot of one-on-one coaching calls.

I, I, there would just be these moments where I like, oh man,

I wish you could do so and so, and sometimes I'd even make that

introduction, like a text introduction, like, these two know each other.

Maybe they're in the same state, or maybe they're in the same industry or kids

are the same age, or whatever it was.

I'm like, or they're battling the same issue.

But I just was like, oh, you two need to know each other.

And so that, that was a piece of it for sure.

That was kind of marinating that I, how do I do this?

And then in a quiet time, I just felt this big nudge to go build community

that I could impact more people.

One, I could get those one-on-ones to talk to each other, but also not

everyone can afford one-on-one coaching.

it's a higher price point than what, you know, rise Community is.

And so I, was just like, Hey, let's go for it.

let me just say it wasn't easy.

I had this idea, I went for it.

I battled a lot with the, we don't need another community out there.

There's too many communities.

Communities are popping up left and right, like it seems like podcasts used to pop

up left and right now it's communities and I wanna know what the next thing is.

I'm gonna go start that now so we can be ahead of it.

I don't know what it is.

Maybe it's a bunch of avatars hanging out.

But for me, it was enough nudges.

I did hear the head trash, you know, of too many communities,

but I pushed through it.

We launched it, and it is just, it's just, it's been awesome.

you know, as, as I mentioned, we, we do the weekly calls and then there's

just a group and it's pretty cool.

You asked the question, what have I learned from it?

Well, we mentioned some names.

Dan Britton, Jimmy Page, Dave spoke, Kent Shevalier, the

chaplain for Pittsburgh Steelers.

He was powerful.

Davin Ano who wrote, 12 Ths of Purpose, I'm leaving people off.

That doesn't mean they weren't impactful.

It just, at the moment, I won't rattle 'em off, but those are some highlights.

So what am I learning?

You know, Dan talked about the power of having vision, like we need to have

vision, and it was a reminder that I could get a little sloppy on that.

Or, you know, pulling up for air.

I can get so busy and just doing my work.

And like I said, let's go on LinkedIn or let's address these clients.

Sometimes I forget to lift my head up and what is the vision?

Where am I headed?

So that was a good reminder.

Ken Shevalier talking about doing it afraid.

This idea that there's times we just need to do it afraid.

And it was a much more robust talk than just that phrase, but it was kind of a

kick that I needed, that there were a few things that, you know, I needed to do.

Afraid, you know, one of it's, a distant family member to

have a conversation with them.

I'm gonna do, you know, I've started it, I'm doing it afraid.

I don't know the result.

So not all of it were, Hey, go, you know, start this or write this or launch this.

They weren't all business related, but there's some things in my

personal life I would want to go do afraid just to get it going.

I think those would be some of the elements I'm learning.

I think one thing I would just say to anybody listening is

getting a community of something.

Obviously I'd love to have you in Rise, but there's a

ton of communities out there.

I just watched the documentary Join or Die this past weekend.

It's on Netflix.

And it's based off this research, this, mandated, bill Putnam, I

think is his name, and he wrote a book called Bowling Alone.

the whole idea of this, doc book, bowling Alone, which led to documentary Join or

Die, is this idea that since the 1960s, community involvement has just decreased.

this is all before phones and screen time.

So we've only made it worse here in, the recent decade, two decades.

But since the sixties, there's data that has less involvement of PTA year after

year, Kiwanis Club, rotary Club, whatever, association, down, down, down, down.

And that's factoring into loneliness.

That's factoring into depression.

Now you're throwing phones and it just leads us more into, isolation.

in this documentary, there's this quote and he says, we spend more time watching

friends than being with our friends.

And I was like, oh, man, that's pretty good.

And so I think if you're a listener, look around in your community.

do you have community?

Are you spending time with community?

there was a book written years ago called Third Place.

We Have Home and Work.

Those are our two places, but everyone needs a third place.

For some people that's a bad thing.

Their third place is the bar.

do you have a place that you go, you're in community I just share that for, you know,

if there's a listener, it's like, you know what, I need community right now, man.

Go get it.

We were made for Community Iron sharpens iron.

We, we, we kind of know the taglines and the realness of it, but I'll just tell

you, I needed rise, as much as the, the, the members, because I've just enjoyed,

you know, we, we have an app and you'll, somebody will post something and I'll read

'em like, dude, this, this, this is Manna.

This is Manna for today that I needed.

'cause it's different postings than you get on LinkedIn.

I mean, I love LinkedIn, but these are just deeper people

are talking about, stuff.

They're not gonna publish on LinkedIn.

Well, and there's the connection there.

it's interesting when you said the research had shown less community

since the sixties and you commented that that was well before phones,

but it wasn't before screens.

That's really when we saw the rise of television I think our phones

are just TV on steroids truthfully.

You know what I mean?

They're just more screen for us the more that I would do it, I mean I'm one of

these, I could have sat in front of sports 24 7 and then you know what they did?

They started making it available 24 7.

Yep.

of the age where you remember when there was, well, I am, you're

probably not quite this old.

Well, there were just a couple of football games on Saturday and a

couple on Sunday, and that was it.

That's it.

Now.

Anytime.

Yeah.

anything anytime now, and I think that is really, uh, I think

it's devastating to a group.

Anything else that you observe with a community where a group

of men are attempting to do better that are coming together?

Anything else you observe that you can share before we talk

about a couple of books you've got and start wrapping up here.

Oh, yeah.

one accountability and I don't even mean accountability of, hey, you

know, bill, you said you're gonna do this or, you know, whatever.

Not that accountability.

The accountability of, you know, I got the call coming up on Monday,

and I either wrote down on a piece of paper, I didn't tell anybody,

but I wrote down a piece of paper.

I need to go on a date with my wife.

Or I said, verbally, I was gonna go on a date with my wife.

But there's this accountability that a community brings just even by the calendar

appointment being on your calendar, that people are like, Ooh, I need to do this.

What if they ask?

And so there's been some cool stories already of the accountability that

they're getting just because of the group.

Even if no one's calling 'em out to say, did you do it?

It's just, it's in the calendar.

There's this kind of desire to more, so accountability is one another.

Ideas, there's some crazy cool ideas that people do and, of just

the, the intentionality they'll have on a date, maybe what they're

doing with one of their kids.

it's like, oh, I like that idea.

I'm gonna do that with my kid.

you have a variety of ideas of how, how to work out different or whatever it is.

you just get ideas that, you may not, you know, get anywhere else.

you get inspiration.

You kind of see a guy in there.

He is like.

Like for me, I've got three kids, but when I hear somebody talking about

how they make time for this and this, and they got six kids and you know,

they lead a, you know, a $200 million division, it's like, well, if they got

time for it, what's my silly excuse?

And so I think between accountability, outside perspective, getting ideas and

then, you know, plus just encouragement, man, it's pretty darn, life giving.

I think maybe the enemy really wants us to be isolated and by ourselves.

the kingdom and God really desires for us to be connected.

And I like what you're doing there with Rise.

'cause it sounds like you're allowing to connect, which is good.

point along the way.

You wrote when At Home First and Inspirational Guide to Work Life Balance.

I've got it on my Kindle.

Hey, sweet.

have a copy there, but this is what it looks like on the Kindle

Inspirational Guide to Work Life balance.

you know, a lot of people do not believe that work life balance is possible.

Say a couple things about that.

Then I want to talk about Rise and Go as we finish up here.

Yeah,

life

well, a couple things on, went home first.

Yeah.

Well, let me just say, I, I was talking to the publishing consultant

when I wrote it and I was like, you know, I had my title went home first.

That, that was a no brainer.

The subtitle was different.

we'll talk about that.

But the subtitle went home first.

It was a phrase I just kept saying I was with clients and it was like, Hey,

you know, if we're gonna have success at work and we, we have to win home first.

And maybe it was applicable 'cause the person wasn't really dating their wife

or it was applicable 'cause they weren't working out or whatever the reason was.

I just kept saying this one phrase.

So that was like, that's it.

And then what kind of a nail in the coffin, for why I was like, I am

100% using this is I posted, Cover, like, Hey, here are my covers.

Which one do you like to use?

Or should I use, please vote.

I did something like that.

Somebody said, I don't like the title.

Win at home first.

'cause that means someone loses if you don't.

I'm like, absolutely, someone loses.

That's the whole point.

If we don't focus on it, someone's losing.

It'll be a broken marriage or a broken home.

So, yes.

So anyways, I, I was like, I'm doing it.

So went home first was the title, the subtitle?

I just told the publishing consultant that I was like, I do

not like the word work-life balance because I don't think it's balance.

You know, can I do like work-life harmony?

Can I do something different?

And the funny part was a publishing consultant said, listen, if you were

Jeff Bezos or somebody else, you could come up and make up a name

or a phrase and it would stick.

In a loving way.

She's like, you're, you're a nobody.

You, you gotta stick with the SEO.

You gotta search with, stick with balance.

So I, I, I stuck with balance and I'm fine with it.

You know what I would've to say about work-life balances?

No.

There is no balance.

I mean, you know, obviously just from a work standpoint, we are

at work just an hour standpoint.

We're at work more than we are at home, you know, and when you take away sleeping,

and so that's just odd in itself.

But how I view work life balance or this idea of working home is

being intentional, making sure you recalibrate when seasons get off.

My seasons can get off as well.

I travel at different times for work.

Maybe I've got a, a, a publishing deadline, maybe I've got, you

know, some other deadline.

So it's like work.

But then when I'm done hitting that deadline or I'm done traveling, then I

recalibrate, come back and I'm making sure I'm intentional with my home at home.

Get those one-on-one dates with my kids, make sure I get with, you know, my wife,

take some time off, whatever that is.

And so I, that's the only thing about the balance pieces.

It's, it's like this pendulum swing is, hey, are, are we, you know, have an

in, you know, intention eye with both,

Yeah.

And then so that book, which obviously I think has done extremely well,

you followed it up with Rise and Go, how to get back up with courage

and move forward with Confidence.

I actually really love the tagline on that one there.

But, give us a

Hey, that was before catchy.

BT too, man.

that was an inspired thought that I had, heard.

Did they let you go more with what you wanted there or was that more of

a, the publishing consultant kinda

Yeah, there.

No, that was, I was able to go with what I wanted.

I'm sure they helped tweak it, but, I had no big objection to

it, like I did the other one.

But yeah, so I mean, rise and Go is, 20 chapters, first 10 are, you know, the

courage to get back up and then the next 10 chapters of the comments go forward.

It's written like a devotion, not short ones, like we mentioned for daily Wisdom

for men, they're longer, but it opens up a scripture, then it has story,

whether it's mine, it's clients, it's somebody else's, followed by reflective

questions and application at the end.

And so some people read it like a devotion.

Their men's groups have used it and others have used it.

Some people use it as a resource guide, 'cause it, each chapter doesn't

necessarily build on each other.

So it's, you can look at the table of content and say, I need something on

hope, I need something on, you know, I. What, what, rejection, what whatever

that may be, and then hop to it.

And I know some guys do that and they'll send me notes, which is pretty sweet.

That's good that it is topical 'cause that, helps people go

Yeah.

they need it.

So that's a good thing.

I've got one more question, but before I do, where can people find you?

Where can they get all your stuff, rise or the books or whatever?

Mention it and we'll include it down in the notes.

Yeah.

The books are available on Amazon and, win Home First is on Audible.

I have not done.

Rise and Go on Audible.

but they are on Amazon.

as far as social media, I'm very active on LinkedIn.

That's how you and I met.

I am on all the other social media platforms, but I'm not

engaging like I do on LinkedIn.

So connect with me on LinkedIn.

That'd be fantastic.

Websites, corey m carlson.com.

And then I've got, blogs and podcasts and information on coaching and speaking.

But I'd love just reach out if anyone wants to talk about any of this.

this is how I like to help people and whether they turn into a client or not,

Yeah.

doesn't matter.

Listen a few episodes over on When at home on your podcast.

And I love the one where you interviewed your daughter who's in college.

That was the

Oh, cool.

Thank you.

I was drawn to too, doesn't it?

I'm getting all my kids on this podcast, my podcast, because

that's the most downloaded ones.

The most downloaded ones are for, at least some, for me, are

not some of the biggest names.

It's, it's been my, it's been my kids.

I've only done one kid twice.

I, a couple solo shows I did just me talking.

I think it's the heart.

I think people are looking for story and heart, and I think that's what that does.

Final question, I'm calling this my exclamation question.

I'd love you, Corey, to speak directly to a man may be struggling

with topic we've been talking about, and just encourage him, uplift him.

Or if you feel like you need to, you know, give him a swift kick or whatever,

whatever the Holy Spirit's leading you to do, just, take a few seconds

here and just give some encouragement a man and whatever age bracket that,

you know, he needs someone to speak some good into his life right now.

let's do that.

I'll finish this up and we'll be done.

what a fun assignment yet challenging assignment.

well, first of all, thank you for listening this long.

If you made it this far, thank you very much.

I appreciate it.

And, I pray that you found something valuable here.

Hearing a podcast like this can be intimidating.

I know for myself, when I hear it, IEE even to this day, I mean, I, there,

there's things I get intimidated by.

My encouragement for you is to grab one thing.

One thing I said or Tim said, or.

The Holy Spirit said during this conversation to prompt,

you to go do something.

to say, sorry, to say, I forgive you, to ask for forgiveness to maybe

make a bold move at work or go on a date or to spend time with a kid.

But my encouragement is to take that one step because nothing

changes unless something changes.

And so taking that one step can make a change.

The other thing I know to be true in my own life and working with a

lot of different clients is we start to make a move and the devil will

say, ha, you're gonna go on a date.

You've been a Dirtbag husband.

What are you talking about?

Or you're gonna do this with, your kid now.

you've been absent for the last few weeks, few months or whatever the thing is.

But whenever we step into something new to, be courageous,

the devil gets in our ear.

and my encouragement to you is there may be something of your past that

may have an element of truth to it.

Maybe you not been the best husband.

I haven't either.

Maybe you've not been the best parent.

I haven't either.

But there's this element that the devil wants to keep you right there and keep

dragging you down because he wins.

If you stay in the same place and he can keep playing the same old, soundtracks,

same head, trash, you'll stay there.

But what I, loved and encourage and remind myself of is to release that you are

not defined by how you were as a parent, as a husband, as a leader, as a friend.

You're not defined by that.

And starting today, you can live differently.

You can take a step in a new direction that leads you.

Into being that better father, that better husband, that better leader.

And so that's my encouragement to you Hopefully that, encourages at least

one person to step into who God has uniquely, wonderfully made them to be.

I think that is perfect.

Thank you for sharing that.

Corey Carlson, a beloved son of God, has joined us here and he just shared there

at the end that I think is powerful.

So I needed to hear that and probably a lot more.

I appreciate everybody joining in.

Make sure you get the resources that Corey mentioned.

Check out his books and the Rise community and go check out when at home.

If you're on a podcast player right now, you could jump over and check all

that out, so make sure you do all that.

We have new episodes here every Monday, just like this with cool

guests that are speaking things that I believe that we all need to hear.

I need to hear it.

That's why I have the conversations.

So I believe that you need to hear it too.

So I appreciate that.

Keep listening, liking and all that kind of stuff and we will see

everyone next week on Seek Go Create.