I wanted to figure out a way to, to bring order to my external world, but I knew that in order to do that, I had to first bring order to my internal world. And. There's a variety of ways and tactics and things that I've done to be able to be able to focus and dial in.

So a few months back I met today's guest at a mutual friend's wedding. We sat across from each other at dinner and within five minutes I knew that there was something special and unique about him, not because of what he did, but because of how he showed up. Now, Preston Woody is a peak performance and men's coach. He's an author, he's the co-creator of the Massive Action Planner, and he's a dedicated husband and father who leads his own men's group. He spent the last decade helping men get out of their own way and get clear of what they actually want and start living with real intention. You are gonna love today's show. Now let's go.

So the official launch was, was it yesterday,

Yeah. Yeah. Yesterday just released on Amazon.

and how long have you been working on this?

Man, this is probably brother, 10 years of thinking, like the thinking process started of getting the sucker kicked off and it finally came to to life this year, and yeah. Yeah, brother.

What was it about your process that, like, why did it take 10 years or what was it, what, how would you, uh, relate to that?

Man, 10, 10 years ago, my mentors and leaders, I, I would try to learn how to organize my life. 'cause I was leading an organization. Uh, I had four direct reports and to them, I think a hundred other. reports to them and I'm, I'm not able to organize my thoughts, my life, and I couldn't figure out a good system. And my, my boss gave me a book called Getting Things Done, and I started going through that process, but it felt super cumbersome, not sustainable, and I couldn't find a sustainable model. And so me, like ever since I was young, I struggled in school. Why? Because I couldn't keep, get things organized. Organize my priorities, like I felt like the other kids could, and I just thought to myself, there has to be a better way. And so I devoted. The n next few years of just focusing on what's, what's the best possible way to not just organize my business but also my life. And that's began this process where we developed what's called the Core nine System. The Core nine framework where all nine areas of life, your spirit, your soul, your body, your love life, your family, your community, your wealth, contribution, and career are all clearly laid out. Where we can instead of, try to find, balance in those areas, which I don't think that there's such thing as a balanced life, but I do think there is such thing as an intentional life. And I wanted to live an intentional life and have an intent of where I wanted to go in all of these directions. And so I started building that out and writing out the, this planning process, after learning from all my different me mentors, I feel like I finally locked it in. The, the year that I really locked it in was when my business took off. My family really got organized. My relationship with my wife blew up. Some of my dreams started freaking coming true. Once I got all of these pieces in order in a method that is not complicated, it's so stinking simple. So now, and I, and I came across my friend Jim Bob, who has. Six kids, he has, uh, five or six different businesses, and I'm asking him, how does he do it all? He's a, he's a mentor in front of mine. And so we joined forces to develop a system that can help take anybody, not just in business, but anybody from gaining massive clarity on exactly what they want to, taking massive levels of action. So that's kinda like the birth of it.

Dude, I love that. And one of the first things that comes up, so I wanna backtrack for a moment. when you had said like, growing up you had a. Difficult time. I think you said like organizing, you know, your thoughts like organizing and at least in my experience, sometimes the longer that we've been doing this work, it can be difficult to connect. With what we were experiencing way back when, when we didn't have it together, when we didn't have, the map like this planning, this what you're, what you're creating now. Can you go back within your own experience and feel into like what do you think was contributing to why you felt or why you had the experience of being disorganized? Was it what was going on with like, was it diet? You were scattered. No one ever showed you. Because I'm curious, what are most people experiencing? I can speak from my experience, but what was contributing to that lack of organization that you had growing up?

Yeah, I, I wanna, I wanna jump in on that before we get much further in. I wanna first say I, I'm so excited to be chatting with you. This is the stinking highlight of my day, and I knew that Mike, whenever I met you, I met you at a mutual friend's wedding, and I remember I'm sitting across a table from you at, at a dinner. And within five minutes of our conversation, I made more ground with you in five minutes than I could with most people in maybe five weeks. And I thought, this guy, he's at a new level, not just because of the way that you could play all out with me, but most men, they project something. But you, Mike, you reflect something. And I could see that not just in the way that. I felt after talking to you, but in the way that I noticed your wife respond to you. And I, I believe you can tell the measure of a man based on how their wife feels in response to, to their man. that let me know that there's something of integrity about you, something that I want to be close to, to learn and glean from, and something that I deeply respect and admire. So. Uh, I just wanna acknowledge that as we begin our journey today.

Yeah, I, I'm gonna want to comment, man. So first off, thank you. I truly thank you because the, the feeling was and is mutual. Big time. It's like there is something when you, or I'm just, I'll speak for myself when I meet someone and it's a feeling, right? It's what I felt from you. It's how you carry yourself. Like your posture, your presence, direct eye contact. Like also, oh dude, it's taken me back to that, to just our homie's wedding, Justin. And I remember like, uh. One of the most memorable notes that night, and I told Lauren, I was like, this dude's gonna be in my life for a long time. And, uh, you said a prayer for me about the projects that I'm going through or working on and what I'm trying to create for myself and my family. And to have someone who I've never met, we didn't know each other at all, to take a genuine interest, like truly fucking genuine interest in me, what I care about, what I'm creating in the world. And to go there for another man and to be an advocate and to celebrate him and wanna see him succeed. That is the energy that I was like bro. What are you creating as well, and how can I give to you? And so I'm just so again, grateful as well that you are here and that, uh. I, I, I, I, we ought to give some credit to Justin. 'cause somehow he knew that, uh, when we were sitting next to each other in places there. And, uh, it's really mutual man. And so to see you shine, to see you get, like you being excited makes me excited.

Yeah.

And, um, yeah. So dude, it's, it's so mutual Preston, and, um, yeah, I,

Yeah, shout out to to Justin Peters for making that possible. And I think, I think, uh, when I told him, he's like, have you connected with the guys? I'm like, yeah, so many of these guys I connected, but there's this one guy. name's Mike Slimy, and he's like, I knew it. And, and what you, what you were just saying is so stinking true. Like, as, as leaders and, and as men, we project what's on the inside of us. So if we're operating in, in guilt, what do we spill around? People guilt. They feel guilty around us. If we're operating in shame, we emit frequencies of shame. If we're operating in pride. Right. What we're gonna do is induce either induce pride in people, you know, someone who's really full of themself. They can go to someone who operates in pride and stoke that ego. However, when there's someone that operates in courage and presence and love, you feel that on a deep level that you can hardly articulate, and I remember parting ways with you, feeling a greater love for life, a depth of presence. My mind just expanded. So I wanna, I wanna acknowledge that brother. Um, my, my, my mission in life is, my daily mission is I pray that if nothing else happens today, that everyone I cross, I cross paths with, that their life is better just because we cross paths. And I wanna say that my life is better just because we crossed paths for that one moment, Mike.

Thank you brother. Hell yeah, man. Yeah, I'm so, and I'm excited to dive in today, bro. So how this went down for those listening is, well, one, I've wanted to have Preston on the show, I mean, since we met. And then today we were scheduled to do a catch-up conversation. And, uh, I just, I, and, and this is, this is also what I appreciate about you and, and the people I hold close. You're a gamer, bro. I said. Hey, how would you feel about, let's catch up and let's record together. Let's make it happen. And you're like, I forget what you put, but you're like, I'm game. Let's go. Let's do it.

Yeah. It's a healthy idea.

it's, so yeah, brother man, thank you for being here and, uh, for sharing your passion and your wisdom with me and the listeners and, yeah, just super grateful. So, going back to, you know, that piece on. You mentioned earlier that you've had a difficulty in organizing, you know, growing up, and so many people can relate to that, uh, in part, myself included. And what do you think were some of the contributors to that state or some of that challenge?

Man, that's an awesome question. I'll, I'll tell you some of the things that I, I felt as a kid, like when I, ever since I can remember, I feel like I was in a mental battle that nobody else seemed to be in. I was analyzing things at a level. Or people, and I had this awareness that I didn't, I didn't know if anybody else really had. So I would see things, I would feel at a high level. Um, I think, I think I would at the time, like feel more deeply than the common kid or man would or should. And I used to wonder if there's something was wrong with me or I was maybe perhaps overly uh, emotional. And so I, I felt at a high level and so therefore. The only thing that attacked that, that could direct my attention is the thing that drew the most emotional energy. If it didn't stimulate me emotionally, um, I, I wasn't quite interested it. And when I got a little older, I got diagnosed for A DHD, like, and, you know, do we even know, like if that's, is that a thing? It's a thing that we made up. Is that a thing that we've been conditioned into? Who really knows for sure. what I think that caused it was I had so many different things and priorities that I felt like I was supposed to be focusing on, and they were other people's priorities, but I didn't have really a way to organize my own priorities. So internally, I was filled with chaos externally. I couldn't quite keep anything organized. And so, to answer your question, I wanted to figure out a way to, to bring order to my external world, but I knew that in order to do that, I had to first bring order to my internal world. And. There's a variety of ways and tactics and things that I've done to be able to be able to focus and dial in. Um, in fact, people will come to me and because they feel cared about and listened to because I wanted to master the craft or the art of hyper focus, of listening, of caring. but it didn't come naturally.

Hmm. There's a few things that come up. Let me see. So you said something that I really resonate with, and it's that most people, I'll use my words. Because most people are operating under someone else's scoreboard or someone else's goals, what mom or dad wants for them or what society wants for 'em. We look outside first before we gain the clarity insight with your work and what you've created with map the massive action planner. And I wanna get into, 'cause I know you do a lot of vision work and clarity work. If someone is questioning like, I've got this goal or these goals. How do I really know, or what advice can you give to figure out, like, is that, is that the one for me or is that actually something that I'm just acting out because I feel like it's what I'm supposed to do because I'll just speak briefly on this like myself, like I'll fucking take action. Like I will, like I love, like I love execution and what I've realized in my life, part of what has led me astray is exactly that. I'll go head down, crush, do all the productivity things, but then I didn't even realize to lift my head and be like, wow, is this something that I actually want? Or am I just doing this to make other people happy? So have you found that, and if you can go into like, how can someone get clarity on like, what's, what's the goal for them or what's that vision? What, what's really gonna light them up inside?

That's a beautiful question. I was just sitting down with someone yesterday who's really transformed their lives in a lot of ways, and I, and I'm asking, and I'm going through what's called these, these three, these three Ps as an evaluating system. And I asked 'em on the scale of one to 10, are you on the right path? Right? Because we can overcome a lot of hardship in life if we know that it's the right path. Some people don't know if it is the right path. People aren't. Some people aren't, don't know what they want. Most people know what they don't want, and so they set goals trying to avoid the thing that they don't want, however. Sometimes in context of finding out what you do actually want, you actually have to go and run toward a thi a few things that you think that you want, but you realize you didn't really want it. So sometimes it's going down that path and that trajectory to finding it out. So the, but as far as the three Ps, you wanna know, are you on the right path? And you can sit with yourself and reflect is am I on the right path? Is this the path set out for me? Is this somebody else's path or is this my own? Is this my mentors or is this mine? Is this my father's or is this mine? Is this my wife's, or is this mine? And you, if you sit with it long enough, you can get this deep knowing of whether or not you are on the right path. However, there's another layer to it is, am I on the right path with the right purpose, which is the reason why I am walking down this path. Now I, I won't set a goal unless I can articulate a compelling reason for why I do this. 'cause ultimately, we don't do things for outcomes. We do things for reasons of who you're going to become, what will happen if you do, what will happen if you don't what's possible. That becomes the leverage. But number three, first one is. Path. Second is the purpose, but number three, this is the one I think that answers the question best is the right people.

Hmm.

you have the right people in your life that you can articulate your goals, dreams, desires, the things you're moving toward, they will help bring alignment. They'll help bring correction where there needs to be correction. And they will bring challenge to your perspective and the perspective and even the path that you're going down. Uh, I'll tell you, having the right people in my life, I know you do so much work with men's groups and man, even with the rise of ai, that's the rise of the hive mind. People aren't gonna get more clear on what they want with ai. What people will get more clear on is not the Hive mind, but the Mastermind, which is getting around high value men or women based on your context, that have a similar set of values that are heading in the same direction. When you can have that human experience of articulating where you're going, there's been no greater refining process to. Goals, streams, desires, knowing that I'm on the right path, then articulating and I with the people that I'm around. In fact, in our men's group, one that I, that I host, uh, monthly, every single, every single week, we have to come and we have to share what's called our chief aim. And we have to share what's our chief aim and what's getting in the way, and we have to articulate it. And, uh, that becomes the conditioning mechanism. For making sure our goals are authentic.

That's brilliant dude. What have you seen in. Like a guy. Let's say a guy just starts and isn't used to that, like that's a beau. What a beautiful practice. What have you seen as someone from day one to, let's say six months in with that specific thing, the ability to articulate that and express that? What does that do for a man even more?

Dude, that's a, that's a great question. Now you're like, as far as maybe someone who's not used to that setting and maybe doesn't exactly know what a chief aim is anchored to a a, a driving purpose. These guys are used to doing this on a consistent basis every single month. But there'll be times where through referrals, uh, someone can come in as a guest. And anyone that's new, I ask them during this process to perform it even though you may not even have a chief aim. If you did have one, what would it be? And they're forced to articulate it to typically a stranger and give a reason for the direction that they're going, all for the sake of producing. Producing clarity, and I'll ask the, the whole group collectively, do you feel better about life after doing that? Or worse, everyone says better. Do you feel more confused or more clear? I feel more clear. I said, does your testosterone feel lower or higher? Everybody says higher, right? Because clarity gives you power, but we, we typically don't get clarity unless we're in a space where we can articulate it to someone who's willing to listen.

Hmm.

through the process, what are the, some of the results that we've, we've seen or ac see even through this massive action process, what takes 12 months can, is typically taking about 12 weeks. So we're, we're cutting down, um, result time by 75%.

Wow, that's awesome. what would you say, 'cause there's, you know, I've got, you know, I'm just thinking back to when I was a kid, man, I went to school. Uh, middle school, at least like five minutes from this home. This is the home that I, I grew up in. My parents, first home, my parents bought, and then my brother and I bought it from them. A lot of memories here, a lot of nostalgia, and I remember when I was in middle school and they gave us a planner. Now everybody's different, but speaking for me personally, I was so excited. Every year they gave us a new planner and a new planner, and a new planner because me personally, I just love. Checking off boxes and having that clarity. 'cause I think, and I'll speak for myself, but I also have worked with enough guys that I do really believe in people. To your point, that clarity is a superpower.

Mm

True clarity. I feel like I put my Superman suit on and I'm like, now I'm ready to go. I'm ready to serve my family. I'm ready to serve the people I love. I'm ready to serve, you know, my heart parts of myself. So, and I remember always looking forward to that. So I've worked with a lot of planners over the years and the act of, you know, pen to paper and that kinesthetic process, I just love that. So. I'd love to hear from you, like, what are some of the things that makes what you've created or co-created, uh, even like different, unique, how does it differentiate from how most people have experienced working with the planner? And so please unpack that for me.

Dude, that, that's a beautiful question because I have, I have over here in my office like. 10 different planner types stacked up, as you know, that are at like 30 to 70% completion ratio. And like our, we wanted to create the, the, the planner with the high, like our, our initial goal is the planner with the highest completion ratio.

Hell yeah.

and what does that mean for us? Do not just that they are completing our planner, but that means that they're seeing it through the commitment that they made to themselves, that their dreams are freaking coming to life. that was the initial goal. And what it, what it turned into, which was a, a passion project for me with my men's group is making a generation of men AI proof. What do I mean by

speaking my language. Let's go.

we we're, we're in the, as you know, we're in the age of ai. It's not going away. So we have a couple options on how we're gonna actually face this monstrosity, this sucker. Now, I don't think, I will say, I don't think that AI is the enemy. I think it can be a helpful tool. However, based on your worldview, I do believe that totalitarianism is the enemy and totalitarianism thrives. When men stop doing a few specific things, there are a couple things that you can do to keep you AI proof. For the next generation. I'm not sure what's gonna happen with our kids' generation, but I'm pretty sure that these, these couple things are going to be the skills and factors that you're gonna need to walk into it. In creating the This planner, one of my biggest desires is to cultivate these two, these two pieces. Number one is the capacity to think critically. Critical thinking will make you AI proof. Most people don't think very deeply before they look something up, before they scroll, before they sh they divert their pain into entertainment. And what happens is our capacity to hold a tension and think is getting smaller and smaller and to even think for ourselves. My prayer is I want to help expand that in the lives of men who are gonna be the leaders of the next generation. Those that have retained the capacity to think critically, to practice compound thinking. those are gonna be the ones that aren't run by ai, but rather running it. Uh.

What's compound thinking, brother?

Compound thinking is to be able to take a thought, like a, like a branch or a or a tree, and to be able to continue branching out from another thought and then to link it back to your original thought. So most people cannot compound think anymore. They can kind of go up the trunk a little bit and then they get distracted. or have a craving for stimulation before they can go out deeper into the branch. And the further you go into the branch and down your branches of thinking, the closer you actually get to fruit.

Hmm.

So most people don't get fruit in their life because they haven't, they stop themselves from thinking critically. Does this make sense?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Keep going. Yep.

this, this planner is designed to be the most simple. D operating system or mechanism for you to be able to think about every single area of your life with very, very little time, but producing high, high, high output. And so we have in here, and I learned a lot of this from a lot of a, like my framing from Jim Rohn, I'm not sure if you're familiar with his teachings. Um, but the RPM method, where I set goals in a very, very simple way, but it's the most productive way I coach all my clients through it. It's called RPM. It's with anything that we do with every single meeting, meeting. We have a R, we have a result, which is what's our outcome? PA purpose, which is why we're doing it. We have to have a good, strong reason. And then m is for massive action. What are we going to do because of it? What, what we're doing with the R, with the massive action planner is helping people RPM, their entire stinking life. So, so, yeah.

if you're open to it, I'd love for you to, can you give an example or two of each one of those, like the RPM, like for a man who's coming in the group, what would be, uh. Because I'd love for people if you're li if you're listening to this right now, at any level, I mean, I want to go through it. So, 'cause I, I've, I've heard of Jim Rome, but I'm not familiar with his work. Or maybe I am, but I don't know. So can you give us some examples of what that could look like? And then someone listening could, you know, play along as well?

That's awesome. That's an awesome question. So I had a, a client the other day that I was working with who owns a general construction company, and four we, we, RPM, we have a big three, big three things that he accomplishes every single quarter. One of them is he wanted to generate, you know, 2 million in revenue, okay. During that quarter. And so great. That's the result. That's the result that you want. However, we don't have the leverage. To get this 2 million in new business unless we have a clearly defined purpose. So the R is the 2 million. The R is, I wanna lose a hundred pounds, which we've had someone be able to do. The R is to propose to the person that I love, right? The R is the result. It's the outcome that actually happens. The purpose is the reason why you want it. So I want, I don't just want to do 2 million in new business, but if I do, I will be able to hire three new people, including a new. Admin that's gonna enable me to focus more on what I love to do, which is leading and selling. So I'm going to go home to my wife more excited about life. I'll have more energy for my kids. I'll be making more money to be able to delegate things that drain the heck out of me, and I'll feel more alive. So it's not. 2 million a new business. It's about that purpose. It's about the look on your wife's face when you come home and you're excited to see her instead of like coming in with your shoulders, Dr. Like down, you're, she's, she's over there. She's had a rough day with the kids. You're picking her up, you're kissing her, you're flooding through the dishes, the kids are hanging on you, and you're loving every minute of it, right? Like that's the, that's the reason. And the massive action is what are you going to do? Now to set it in motion. So we never set a result without taking an action within five minutes. Otherwise, like it starts to,

Repeat that again, please?

we never set a result. Okay. Or an RPM without taking an action within five minutes of setting it. So do what does that look

go, bro. Let's

does that, because action is what, it starts to snowball effect. So we'll have people setting. These sort of goals that, that seem huge and outrageous. What could I do right now? So, one thing that this client actually did, or I did have a client that wanted to lose 150 pounds so he could do a, a backpacking trek with me. Okay. With, with my men's group, and, okay. That's the result. We got really clear on the reason why he wanted it. He was moved. He, we even moved him to a point of tears of getting so clear on why he wanted it. The next move is what? Okay. So anything that you can do that takes five minutes or less, you can set a, set a text message that's gonna lock you in. So the trainer that you've been putting off and has been reaching out to you, that's when you say, Hey, I'm game. Let's lock down a time. Boom. That's your action. It sets it in motion. It's when you log onto Amazon and you buy your backpacking bag. It's already coming. It's set in motion. Not just spiritually, but physically, like the movement has begun, and we found some of the hardest part is people just getting to that point where they're just acting. Once the action starts, then the result becomes more and more tangible, and the results, Mike, are explosive.

I can feel that man, and, and one piece of that. And this goes back to what I heard you say, like you used the word intentionally. Intentionally, like a big part of what differentiates your work. And even what I felt you as a man, which I would imagine this is also an expression of you or part of an expression of you. How you see yourself, how you see the world, how you see people in your work. And what I loved hearing of, I mean, 'cause I, I, I mean it's one of those things I've met you for a short duration and the impact that you've made on me has been. Substantial. And so part of this is projection and part of this is just truly my experience of you is you genuinely effing care. And when I just heard you say like you, you helped you know that that man brought up or expressed emotionality, like was crying 'cause he felt it so deeply. So really helping a man or a woman not only get clear but uncover. You know, maybe it's five levels. I don't know of why. Why do you want this? Maybe I would imagine some people might say something superficial like, why do you wanna lose a hundred pounds? Oh, 'cause I don't know, I want to fit my jeans or something like that, right? And then you dig and you dig and you really get to the heart of it. Because, especially as a, for most of my life as a competitive athlete, what I've really seen in myself and in other athletes, if the Y wasn't big enough. Then when it got really effing hard, it would be so easy to, to, to just put it away or, it's so easy to, and I think that piece, I, I just love that you said that, 'cause it, it really feels like you're helping people help themselves to get to the core of what it is. Like what do you really want?

Hmm.

I just wanted to comment on if anything else comes up with that, please share it. Just really, I think it's one of those things that is so needed and also so missing is helping a person dig deep enough.

brother. That's it. And, and going back to one of your questions is how do you know if the result of the thing you're going for is really for you? That's where you find it

Hmm.

Can you articulate a compelling reason for why. Or is it just because your dad thinks you should do it or you think your dad thinks you should do it? And when you have a why that's compelling enough, that can even produce emotion. Or if you're willing to go there, that's how you know you're locking in. That's how you know. what I'm obsessed with in life is. Being present with the people I love, like that's why I do this stuff. Like I love being present with the people I love, and I believe, Mike, that the measure of a man is ultimately his depth of presence, his capacity to hold space, to be in a moment of tension and to hang there, to lead there, to joke there, to cry there, but to be there. And what this planner does, you know, like what I wanted to do through this process is help guys get outta their head and into the present moment. So once you package and you export all that, you set it in motion like you've already set it in motion in the world. Now you can be at peace with just being in the moment that you're in fully giving your gift to this podcast to. My kids downstairs when I go see 'em in just a little bit. When you get to think about the place that you are, when you are where you are, you're not easily given into entertainment or distractions. You look a little deeper in the eyes of the people that you're with. Something begins to happen and you begin to experience life at a deeper level, and that's what I pray. Ultimately gets to happen for, for people is, yeah, we make plans, but what are all these plans for so that we can enjoy and be in the moments, the moments that matter.

And would you say that is uncovered in that Y section? Is that where that lives or is it also somewhere else? Um, yeah. Where does that come through the most?

you know, I think it comes in. So I go through this process where I, I. You know, every single day you, you won't be able to really see it here, but, um, I go through every hour of the day. This takes about five minutes, and I write down exactly what I'm doing, who I'm doing it with, and what I desire. The outcome for that to be. For that meeting, for that session. I do that all the way from breakfast to every meeting, uh, for lunch. Like I know what I'm gonna have, have for lunch. I know what I want, the outcome of every meeting or interaction to be, uh, even to the evening. Like my outcome for, this meeting would be to add value to Mike. So let me and his audience, the outcome for. lunch today was to enjoy lunch with my wife. My outcome for family time, which I have written down today, is to see my kids smile. That's the outcome that we're driving toward. And what happens is I don't even hardly have to look at it again. Once I write it and articulate it and block it out, I can be present in each segment of the day, like and I, 'cause I know the outcome I'm driving toward. It's even subconscious at that time. And I can be present. I don't have to worry, feel like I should be doing that or should be doing this or should be thinking about that. Just end up shoulding all over myself, right? I get to be, get to be there and have fun that's one of the greatest gifts of it. Taking that five minute practice of articulating and slowing down enough to write and think through your day, takes five minutes, articulate your outcomes, and then you run. It's kinda like laying before you go onto the battlefield, you're the general laying battle plans. You hardly go back to those battle plans once the battle begins, but you've kind of etched 'em onto your heart, so know the play.

You know what I'm hearing there too is what, and I, and I've seen this in my own way in different contexts, but it seems. Like structure creates a degree of freedom, like with the structure that you've created within yourself, it'll, like some people might think, and I guess it depends how they approach it, but structure can be re like restrictive. And what I'm hearing is you found a structure and a framework and created such that the structure you do live by actually allows you to relax more deeply into what you're talking about, which is the present moment to connect So I love that and I really resonate with that, um, because I really do believe that, I mean if you think about, uh, a river, right? The structure of the banks. Create the flow of the water. It's the masculine component. So what you are helping people do is to create a structure that they define why, what it means to them that they define, like you're give. You're empowering them to choose what they want, how they, why they want it, and how they want to get there. But you're giving them the structures that they can relax more deeply within themselves.

Mm-hmm.

What have you found for those people who find, um, resistance to whether it's. MAP or other things, if you find someone or a guy who's continually sabotaging, like they say they want these things, like, Hey, I want to, I'm just thinking of, of one of the guys, I've wanted to change jobs for years. I've wanted to change jobs. That's my goal, and yet they still stay stuck in the same job. What would you say for someone who has resistance to taking action or how might you What questions or what thing can you offer for them to support, support themselves in terms of making some shifts? If they know that they keep staying in the same pattern, the same cycle?

Yes. Hmm. That's a beautiful question. You know, I was just meeting with a a client yesterday who. he's a great man. He's a great young man, and he's going incredible places in life, even politically. However, this, this person has a challenge with stretching the truth, and he's aware of it. Okay. he can embellish the truth. And the reason why he does it is for external validation. Okay? 'cause his deepest human need is significance.

Hmm.

Okay? So when we sit down together, he realizes there's some short term consequences to embellishing the truth, such as having to cover up over and over again. Not massive. Dynamic lies, but small embellishments saying 20,000 when it's really 17,000. Okay.

Hmm.

And, What he isn't aware of is how the subtle act of lying or embellishment, even at the most small level, is a slow erosion of a man's character, and not only his character, but his confidence and it produces inner conflicts on the inside of him. And he's gonna get out there one day on the battlefield and feel like an imposter, not because of one major thing he did, but a hundred little things that he's done year after year. How do we like get him to shift and change? Okay, so what, what I had to do was, I need is we wrote out two different versions of yourself, the version of yourself that does this embellishment and the version of yourself that's honorable. And we looked at the the lying version. Okay? So what has this gotten you in life? Today? Like in the past, has this been productive or unproductive? Say, not. Not productive. Has it gained respect of people Or lost respect? Lost respect. Has it made you more relaxed or more tense? More tense. Okay. Right, so we're pro, we're we're asking direct questions, providing a contrast so he can lock into the truth of what has caused him in the past. How about the present? Right. He has, like, what does it cost you? He's like, well, I have to, I mean, I'm here in this session having to sort out all of these hours wasted. Okay, what's it's cost you time? Uh, um, what about financially? It's cost me money about relationally and his head drops. He's like, man, my relationship with some of the people that I love the most, that a person that I could have had a future with, I lost trust with her. Because of something I embellished and covered up again and again. Now you see we're getting leverage, okay? Because we're attaching emotions to an action. I said, okay, let me ask you this. What will your life look like in five years if you stayed the same? I said, where will you be? His face drops, he said. When I look into the future with this same pattern, I don't even see myself being alive now. I've gone through this process of you in, you know, 5, 10, 20 years. 'cause people have a sense and a knowing of what will happen if they continue a specific pattern. You don't have to tell people, Hey dude, if you, if you don't stop lying, people aren't gonna trust you. Like you can't tell. What you have to do is ask and pull it out of them. 'cause people won't be committed to what you tell them. They'll be committed to what you helped lead them to. Right. And that's my job as, as a, as a coach is. I'm not here to give the answers. I'm here to uncover them with you. And when Ian uncovers all of these answers, and he, and I said, okay, I want you to sit with that, what life is gonna be like, you've lost out on politics. People one day have found out that you're a fraud and he's, he's named all this stuff. Your kids think that you're, uh, think that you're a liar. Your wife left you. I, so I want you to look in the mirror, like all those years in the future and look at yourself. Are you happy with what you see? No. He's like, what do you see? I see a droopy face. He, I see sadness and sorrow. I said, when you look in the eyes of that man, is that someone you would wanna follow? He said, no. I said, are you ready? Are you ready to change? He said, yeah, I'm ready. So we had to link in this, in this case, we had to link enough pain to this action for it to, uh, lose its hold That way when he thinks about, just kinda like a shock collar on a dog, you know, but when he thinks about, or he is tempted to, to embellish, he's not thinking about, oh man, I'm gonna look a little cooler. He's like, oh no, I'm actually destroying my destiny and my kids and my wife's life in the future.

Hmm.

sense? All of that emotion floods in. So the question, the question would be attaching emotion to it. Like our life, we don't do things because of thoughts or really actions. We do things because of the way things make us feel, and the enjoyment of life. That's what separates us from, bots or really animals, is the depth of human emotion. So. It would be getting leverage and anybody can get leverage, right? You may, you may have to sit with a specialist to work with something that's deep rooted. But even if you were to think to yourself, okay, maybe I'm, I'm stopping an stopping this act. I wanna stop this action. But really think to yourself, what will life look like five years later if I continue to do this? Or if I don't make a shift? And two, like we talked about before, critically think through it. And when you do, you'll get leverage to really break or change any behavior.

Bro, that is, uh, so I wanna reflect back what I heard because I think one, it's incredibly valuable. So part of what I heard is, uh, and I'm, I'm even again, reflecting in my own life. So when I was, uh, about 30, that was a. One of the most significant rites of passage for me. I was in the marbling granite industry, still coaching on the side since I was a kid, since I was 18, but I was in the marbling grand industry in my family's business, and the decision to exit out of that and really follow my dream. was one of the most significant, uh, growth moments and initiation moments in my life. It was my major moment of individuation as a man,

Hmm.

and there were benefits and consequences of that decision, you know, beautiful benefits of freedom and doing what I'm meant to be doing here and so many benefits. And there was also some, some painful consequences.

Hmm.

But the question that my mentor at the time had asked me that really. Woke me up and you hit it and you've added some key points that I really want, again, to reiterate because I think it's so valuable. He had asked me, he goes, Mike, and he was full presence, like mentor, you know, elder. 'cause what I, what I had heard you say is, you know, it's a helpful to sit with it.

Hmm.

Really sit with yourself and especially if you can in the presence of someone else, a loving witness, a loving fucking advocate who can challenge you, who can like literally just once, I just got chills. Nothing but love for you. And so an elder mentor teacher had asked me, he goes, Mike, if you envision your life, I think he said one year, 'cause I was in such pain, but maybe, I think maybe he said three years, but at the end he like a crystal ball. What's gonna happen? And immediately, like it was literally, I, I actually even thinking back, can't even believe that it had come out so automatic. And I was like, I'm gonna get sick. If I stay in this, I'm gonna get sick, like legit sick. And that was a major shift for me. And what I'm hearing you do too is I think that's incredible that you invite the man to reflect on the benefits and consequences of the past, the benefits and consequences of the behavior and pattern in the present, and then the benefits and consequences of the behavior in the future. That's brilliant. And what you're doing from my perspective is you're helping him step into maturity and adulthood

Hmm.

to be able to, as opposed to to be his own functional parent, to re-parent himself. So man, I appreciate that so much, man. And it brought up stuff for me and, uh. So I'd love that. Um, I wish we had more time, but, uh, I would love as we transition, you know, as we close first off, thank you. we'll definitely be doing this again. And as we close, we'll definitely include the link for people to get the MAP And any closing thoughts, man, anything you would love to leave those listening with as we, uh, in our brief time, um, you know, close off today.

Yeah. Well, well first off, if you've ever, you know, we're just coming off Christmas. You know, my family loves Christmas and one of our favorite movies and books to read is, uh, A Christmas Carol, the Story of Ebenezer Scrooge. And, um, what's what I love so much about that, that movie, that book, that story, is the hope that it brings. That just about anybody can change if they have enough leverage. You know, the ghost of Christmas past took him into the past. Therapy didn't work. He looked at why he was the way he was, how his dad left him into boarding school, all the pain of the past. He revisited it, but. It didn't give him leverage to ch, he saw the pain of the future, the ghost of Christmas present, uh, of the present and the pain that his life was causing in the present. But he didn't have enough leverage to change. But it wasn't until he saw the gravestone of Tiny Tim, the son of his underpaid employee, and he looked over and saw his own gravestone and the fact that he would be dying alone, then he had enough leverage. To change, and I believe that anyone can change. I believe that you can too. You just have to get around people that will help you find that leverage. So I just wanna remind you it's possible and if Scrooge can change, so can you.

Oh, let's go Bro Preston, thank you so much, brother. Once again man, um, I'll be sure to connect everybody with your work and uh, I've already got the planner too, so I've got it now and uh, yeah. I love you my man. Thank you again.

Yeah, this is a gift, Mike.

Hell yeah. Have a great one buddy.

Talk to you soon.