Washington Square. On air is the audio town square for the Washington Square Review. Lansing Community College's literary journal. Writers, readers, scholars, publishing professionals, citizens of the world, gather here and chat about all things writing. Hey, there. This is Melissa Ford Lucken. I'm here today with Nicole Hunt, LCC student and local writer. Hey, Nicole.

Hello, Melissa. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, for sure. Thanks for coming. So tell us, how did you come here to lcc?

So, once my youngest child started school, I realized I wanted to get back into the workforce, and I preferred to work in a local school district. And I realized that I wanted to have more knowledge and a foundation before getting into a position. So that is what prompted me to look into lcc.

Okay, so you were originally thinking that you were going to work in a school?

Yes, and I still would like to. I'm taking education classes, so I might just end up doing, like, a substitute kind of position or maybe something more permanent. I'm not really sure.

Okay. Are you drawn to a particular age group of kids?

I love elementary school kids.

Okay. All right. Why that age group?

Well, I did a temporary position in an office, and that's also what my mom did for over 20 years in Mason.

So she worked in an office?

Yes, in an elementary school. Okay. So I was drawn to that through her. And when I did the temporary position, I bonded with the children.

Yeah, the office is totally the hub of the school.

It is. And I love the multitasking that was required for it and trying to give each child or parent, like, attention and balance things, and I. I really actually enjoyed it a lot.

Did that surprise you?

I guess not, because watching my mom do it and how much she loved it, I had a feeling that I.

Also would give us a couple examples of specific things that stood out that you really liked.

Oh. In that position, it could be simple.

Stuff, like helping someone with their lunch money, anything.

I had an incident with a little girl who came in with curlers in her hair. Like the old kind, the foam ones? Yes. And she had been playing with it in class and tried to pull it out, and her hair got really, really tangled. And she came in, she was upset about it, and I ended up sitting next to her in a chair for about 20 minutes, just unraveling this thing and saving her beautiful hair from having to be cut. And that was a special memory for me.

Did she have all of her hair in rollers?

Yes.

And she managed to say, by the.

Time she came in, it was like, half okay. Yeah. And it was. It was bad, but we saved it okay.

And did you brush it out?

I didn't brush it out. I really just wanted to, like, get her, you know, good enough to go back to class.

Okay.

So. Yeah.

All right. That is. That's. That's a unique one. I've never heard that before.

She's a sweet girl. So, you know.

Okay. What other kind of stuff?

I loved interacting with parents and making sure that they knew that their family and that their child was important to me. And I'm not just in a hurry, hurry to take care of what they need, but I actually do care. And I follow up. I really enjoyed being there. They knew that they could count on me to do what needed to be done.

Like the humanity of it.

Yes.

Okay, that makes sense. So you came to LCC and what classes did you take first?

So I started with Composition one and Intro to Education. Intro to Education was online, and I've only done a couple online classes, and I really found out that I prefer being in person. I really need the interaction and the ability to have dialogue with anyone.

Well, that makes sense given what you were saying about the office, how you liked being with the humans and talking to them.

Yes, very much.

The composition class, was that in person?

It was. It was at LCC East.

Oh, okay.

Which was a nice kind of introduction for me because coming from a small town and then my first time coming to college, and it was just smaller, simple, and helped prepare me for coming downtown, which is like one of my favorite things to do now.

Okay, so coming down here feels different to you?

Yeah, it was very intimidating at first.

Okay.

Yeah.

Just all the streets and the lights and parking.

Yeah, it was just new and it was different. And I've been a stay at home mom for 17 years, so it was. It was a very different experience, but I just kind of threw myself into it and I love it.

Sure. And you come here and there's office. There's different offices and different buildings and processes and. Yeah, it's all really new.

It's a lot to learn, but everybody makes it really easy. There's so many services. There's a phone number to call for everything, anything you need. So everything is just so simple.

Mm, great. So how did you come to be into the creative writing?

Well, I was really excited to take creative writing because I've enjoyed writing since I was a kid, and I just decided to go for it. And I still wanted to continue with the education classes, but I thought, you know, now is my chance to do this and.

Yep. And which class did you take first?

I started With Creative One.

Okay.

And I did that online. I wish I had done it in person, but I still gained my footing there. And it was my first time sharing my work, which was. I always kept, like, very private.

Yeah. It's very different.

It is. So it really forced me to do it, and I guess maybe that was a good transition from not sharing to, you know, to, like, now where we workshop in groups and. Yeah.

How did it feel?

At first it was scary, but then again, it wasn't as bad as I thought because once I submitted something for maybe other people to view through discussions, there wasn't that immediate reaction where you could see what they were thinking. And so I think that was maybe somewhat of a good thing.

Okay. What was your first one that you workshopped? Was it a story? Do you remember?

You know, I feel like, because it was online, we didn't get to do a lot of workshop. There was. I think it would be considered flash memoir because it was short nonfiction, and the feedback was more like just a response. Like, we didn't have a dialogue like we do in person. So I don't. And I don't have, like, a great memory of that because it just wasn't as, like, impactful as what we do in person.

But it sounds like the experience of having other people read your work did stick with you and knowing that they'd read it.

Yes. And really, it was kind of. It was eye opening. And I realized that it doesn't matter to me so much what people think. Okay. And that it doesn't have to hit a certain way. It's really about what I want to say. And it is important to me what people are taking away from it. But I don't take it personally like, I thought I would.

Oh, okay.

Yeah. And I actually. I've grown so much from those critiques and started to understand how what I'm putting down, you know, could appear very differently to the reader from what I think in my head, because, as we've discussed, I think maybe I'm telling things a certain way. But that's because I have everything in here in my head, and my readers don't have that.

Okay, so by sharing it, you're able to not so much focus on, like, do they like it or dislike it? But how are they reading it? How are they thinking about it? How are they responding to it?

Yes. Yes.

Yeah, that's quite different because that way, when you think about it, that second way, it gives you feedback to take back to the work and make changes that you might want to Make.

Absolutely.

Yeah. Rather than worrying so much about, like I said, whether or not they like it or don't like it.

Yes. Because we all have different things that we like in writing. We have different genres and different styles and topics.

Yes.

So it's really. That's not what's important. Because the people you workshop with are not going to be your audience that's looking for your work ultimately.

Right. Yeah. So how does that carry over when you're thinking about offering comments to other people?

I kind of apply the feedback sandwich, which is something I learned a long time ago, where I like to say something positive and then maybe a little critique, and then I like to end with a positive. So I like to think that I'm, like, sensitive to other people's feelings when I'm giving them feedback.

Yeah, for sure. Mm. Yeah. When you think about reading other people's, like, poems and stories and essays, do you feel like it depends on what you're reading? Is the process different, like for a poem or for a short story? Do you think it's pretty similar?

I haven't done a lot with poetry.

Okay.

We did a little bit last semester in creative too, which it was fun and different, but I guess I can't really say if it's different. And maybe it is because I'm a little more reserved because it's not my comfort zone. But I found that now that I'm in practice doing workshop more often, I think that I kind of apply the same rules, no matter the genre that we're looking at.

That makes sense. So it sounds like your approach to reading and sharing work has evolved over time.

Yes, definitely.

What do you think is the biggest change in you, the way you approach it?

You know, I think just diving in.

Okay.

Just going for it because, you know, I can stand there with my toes on the edge forever. And I did. And once I just said, you know, I'm going for it, and I have family who really pushed me to do it. I think that I just started doing it and then I became more confident in it, and it doesn't bother me to share, it doesn't bother me to submit and, you know, wait for a yes or a no. So I don't. I don't know. It could be my age. Yeah.

It could be part of it. I'm thinking too, when I'm listening to what you're saying, is that knowing that you can offer someone that feedback that you're seeking, like, letting them know, this is. When I read your story, this is the way it came to me. And then you give that to them, and if they're able to use it to make their story stronger, that's rewarding for you.

It definitely is. I love when things click when you say something and somebody really appreciates it, either because you understood exactly as they meant it, or maybe they're like, wow, I didn't realize. And maybe they appreciate that feedback. And so that's a really exciting part of workshopping.

I was also thinking, as we're talking, like, the kind of workshopping and the kind of feedback we're talking about is not like this little word here or sentence or a comma. You know, it's more thematic and broad strokes.

Right. It's not, you know, those little edits that you're going to look over when you're polishing it.

Right.

It's, you know, how does. Does the theme come across? Is the character development good? Is the voice strong? Things like that?

Yeah. And there's also a lot of fun in finding where the piece is really strong and sharing that with somebody.

Yes.

How do you think this kind of experience with writing carries over into, like, composition or other types of writing?

So I think as far as just what I've taken away from the creative writing classes, I apply that to all writing. Now. What I've really focused on is making sure that every word, every sentence has impact and has purpose. So I do use that in everything. I find it probably to a ridiculous degree, but I really critique everything. And I think I got a lot of that from prose style that was very intense, but also I really enjoyed it.

I know you wrote a particular essay in prose style that you were really proud of.

Yes, I did. And I looked back and there's more things that I wrote that I really didn't do anything with. They were just exercises that now I'd like to do something with. But I did. I wrote it. It really was a tribute to my grandparents and my family, and it really, to me, helped me deal with some loss that I'd experienced and helped me to maybe understand myself and also learn. Let, like, my grandfather know what his role was in that. So. Because it was a very proud moment when I could give that to him and when he read it. So even though it was very difficult to get through some parts of it, I am so thankful that I finished that piece and I've submitted it. I haven't heard back yet.

Okay.

I've submitted it to a couple places.

So no news is always good news.

Yeah.

Yeah. I was wondering while you were talking about how Personal that piece was. How did it feel to have that read by other people? Because it sounded like that one was more emotional, much more emotional than maybe some of the other things.

I think that I shared it at the right time. I had been workshopping with the same people for a few months, and I was at the point where I felt like I could handle that I knew how, that they would treat it with respect, and that was important. Other situations I might not have been able to, but I was ready.

I think that it's really valuable to trust your own intuition about whether or not you're ready to share it and not share it.

Absolutely.

Especially when it's something really personal.

Yes.

Yeah. Because you're dealing with your own. Sorting out of your own emotions. And the other thing of making it meaningful for someone else to read. It's a really tricky balance.

It's really hard to do. It's hard to gauge how personal you want to get because you want it to have meaning and emotion and impact, but you don't need it to reveal everything. What I aim for is something more universal that others can relate to.

Yeah. Thematically, especially. Yeah. Well, let's talk a little bit about what you're working on now in writing the novel class.

It's very fun. It's so different from the creative nonfiction that I'm used to doing. So it's a novel, and I guess it's a bit of a mystery. I'm having a hard time classifying exactly what it is because it's still a mystery to me. As I'm going through it, I'm like, where is the this going? But I'm having so much fun with that.

With the discovery part.

Yes. When I think it's going to go one direction, and then it doesn't. And it turns out that the more I just type away.

Again, trusting your intuition.

Yes.

And letting the story go where it goes.

Yes. And building characters is really fun.

Talk a little bit about that. Tell us about your characters.

I'm really starting to get into that now because, like I said, creative nonfiction, things based on my life, I've done so much, and now creating characters is. It's. I guess I'm studying how to do it really well still. And I. I can see them in my head, you know, in this scene that I'm writing. But I really have to try to get onto the page so that the readers are also seeing at least something close to what I have in my head. So it comes down to a lot of showing, not telling.

Well, tell us about one of your main characters.

Let's see. One of my main characters for this book. She is close to her dad. Her dad has passed away. So she's kind of just a nervous wreck right now. And I don't have a lot for her. And that's what I'm realizing is that I don't have a ton on the page for her personality. Now people in workshop, they can see her, they feel it. But I want to work on her, making her more three dimensional.

The start of the novel is a really intriguing situation that she finds herself in.

Yes.

So tell us about that.

Okay, so it's very interesting because she's lost her dad and then she is contacted by somebody who claims to be. To be her half sister. And she has very little time to make a decision as to not she's going to meet this woman. And so she goes for it.

Because she gets an invitation. To a retreat.

Yes, to a retreat. And so she's taken to this retreat. She doesn't drive herself. So she's then left there without a way to leave.

She's isolated in the woods in northern Michigan.

Yes. And there are still places without reception, without self service. And that's where she happens to be.

With this woman who may or may not be her sister.

May or may not be, and some other strangers to kind of add to that, you know, mystery of what's going on and just build some drama there. And then the people that own the retreat, they're kind of strange too, and not being very helpful when she asks questions.

So. So she doesn't know who she can trust.

Exactly. Yeah.

Where did the idea for this come on?

So really I wanted to write something that takes place in the Manistee Forest because I spent a lot of time there and I always thought it's so beautiful, but it's also so mysterious and it'd be so dangerous.

For sure.

So I just thought what if. What if somebody is just contacted out of the blue and there is a sibling that they. They didn't know about.

Right.

And so that really, it's risky. But, you know, you're kind of fascinated. You want to know more. So I just thought, let's start a story and see where it goes.

Well, and she's in a really vulnerable situation because she's isolated.

Yes.

And she wants to believe it's her sister.

Right.

But you know, she doesn't know and she didn't even know she had a sister.

Right.

Which is really shocking, especially when her father had just passed away.

Right.

So she's like in this, like, emotional vortex.

Yes. So it. I just thought it would be interesting to explore that. And like I said, I don't really know where it's going yet. I thought it was when we did the plotting in class, I did plot it out, which was helpful, even if I don't stick to that, because it really made me dissect, you know, every scene, every chapter, and think about does it have the right components, you know, and is it gonna propel the story? So I think that that's a really important part. Even if you don't stick to maybe where you think you're going, just. Just understanding how you need to get.

There, and you may find that the middle of the book takes a different turn, and that's fine because, again, just trusting your intuition about where it goes. But like you're saying, if you understand the plot structure, then you'll know how to. To realign what's already happened and what's going to happen.

Right.

And I think, yeah, for me, it's very normal to redirect the plot in the middle of the book because you think it's going to go one way and it just goes a completely different way. And that's. That's okay.

That's very helpful to know. To know that an experienced writer also deals with that. Oh, for sure.

Yeah. It's quite a different process than writing a shorter piece.

It is. I feel like I am, you know, I'm out of my depths a bit when I do it, but I still want to continue, and I'm.

That feeling will never go away. Yeah, you'll always feel out of your depth.

Yeah. That's also maybe good to know.

Yeah, for sure.

But, you know, I find a different challenge in writing, like flash fiction or micro fiction, and I find that really compelling. And so I like to actually look for calls for micro fiction.

Calls for submissions.

Yes. Because it's so fun to try to tell a story in, you know, 50 words or 100 words. I just think it's such an interesting concept. Now that I have began studying creative writing and learning, I guess, these different formats and styles, it's. I just like challenging myself.

You just gave me an idea for an assignment. Have take the novel and rewrite that into a flash piece.

I love that. I absolutely love that. That would be great. Yeah.

Well, you can do that. Let me know how it turns out.

I definitely am going to try that now. Yeah.

All right. I'll try it with one of mine and then we'll compare notes. So tell us a Little bit about your writing practice. Where do you write?

So I write at home. I usually sit at my dining room table or in my kitchen. And. And while my kids are at school, my husband's at work. And I can sometimes spend, like, six hours sitting there writing. Sometimes I might only be able to do it for an hour or something, but it's really best when the house is quiet. And I just. I usually keep it quiet. Sometimes I'll play music, but I just. I like it to be quiet. I just like to stay focused.

You do your homework the same way.

For other classes I do? Yes.

No. Do you listen to music that doesn't have any lyrics? Sometimes. Or just. Sometimes just the wind.

Usually pretty quiet. My dog barks at me sometimes, you know, but that's the normal interruption. I was listening to music a lot last semester when I was writing, and I think that that was more when I needed a mood for it, and that was really helpful. But most of the time, it's just quiet, and I am very productive that way.

Okay, so as you think back on your creative writing journey the past couple years, what surprises you the most?

That I just am ready to share?

Okay.

I love talking with people about writing, and I don't feel like I have to guard anything.

Okay, lovely. All right. And so if people are interested in checking you out online, where can they find you?

I have WordPress in the works, and so I have nicolelhunt.WordPress.com okay.

We'll include that in the show notes.

Awesome.

And any other social media.

I have something else I'm working on that I think is going to be more for fiction, whereas the Nicole L. Hunt will be my creative nonfiction.

Okay.

I'm doing inkandelmlit.WordPress.com okay, awesome.

We'll be sure to include both those in the show notes.

Great.

Thanks a lot for coming in.

Thank you for having me.

Thanks for stopping by the audio town square of the Washington Square Review. Until next time, this has been the Washington Square on air from Lansing Community College. To find out more more about a writer's community and literary journal, visit lcc.edu.wsr. writing is messy, but do it anyway.